Hansard: NA: Mini-plenary 1
House: National Assembly
Date of Meeting: 03 Mar 2022
Summary
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Minutes
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MINI PLENARY - NATIONAL ASSEMBLY (VIRTUAL)
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PROCEEDINGS OF MINI-PLENARY SESSION - NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Watch video here: (Virtual) Mini-plenary 1:
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Members of the mini-plenary session met on the virtual platform at 14:00.
House Chairperson Mr M L D Ntombela took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
ANNOUNCEMENTS
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Hon members, before we proceed, I would like to remind you that the virtual mini- plenary is deemed to be in the precinct of Parliament, and constitutive the meeting of the national Assembly for debating purposes only. In addition to the rules of the virtual sitting, the rules of the National Assembly, including the rules of debate apply. Members enjoy the same powers and privileges that apply in a sitting of the National Assembly. Members should equally note that anything said in the virtual platform is deemed to have been said to House and maybe ruled upon. All members who have logged in, shall be considered to be present and are requested to mute their microphones and only unmute when recognised to speak. This is because the microphones are very sensitive and will pick up noise which might disturb the attention of other members. When recognised to speak, please unmute your microphone and connect your video. Members may make use of the icons on the bar, at the bottom of theirs screens which has an option that allows a member to put up his or her hand to raise points of order. The secretariat will assist in alerting the Chairperson to members requesting to speak. When using the virtual system, members are edged to refrain or desist from unnecessary points
of order or interjections.
Hon members, we shall now proceed to the First Order of this mini-plenary session, which is a subject for discussion in the name of the hon D M Stock: On expanding the comprehensive social security system, in order to not leave anyone behind. I now recognise the hon D M Stock from the virtual platform.
EXPANDING THE COMPREHENSIVE SOCIAL SECURITY SYSTEM IN ORDER NOTTO LEAVE ANYONE BEHIND
(Subject for Discussion)
Mr D M STOCK: Hon House Chairperson, today we are debating the critical aspect which is enshrined in the Constitution and its Bill of Rights. A debate on expanding the comprehensive social security system to leave no one behind. It directly speaks about securing the socioeconomic rights for all South Africans. The democratic dividends for all South Africans can only be brought through the realisation of the promise and commitment of creating a united and prosperous South Africa. It is critical that we premise our debate with the correct conceptual understanding of the comprehensive social security system. It is comprehensive because it responds to the multiple deprivations. The poor experience deprivations from access to basic services such as water and sanitation, shelter, food and lack of income. Those are some of the issues that the debate should be able to deliberate around.
The National Development Plan states that by 2030, South Africa should have a comprehensive system of social protection that includes social security grants, mandatory retirement savings, risk benefits and voluntary retirement savings. It emphasises that part of our approach to social protection is through a social wage which includes no-fee schools, free basic services and subsidised public transport.
In addition to creating more jobs in the private sector, a significant broadening of government’s public employment programmes will also be able to help to ensure that fewer households live above the poverty line. Addressing poverty requires a multiple dimensional approach which a comprehensive social security system responds to. Since the democratic breakthrough, the ANC has placed a social wage at the centre of transforming the lives of ordinary South Africans without leaving no one behind. We have witnessed an increase in social grants for the elderly and also broadened our social protection system to include people with disabilities, child grants and foster care grants which also brings about relief to the vulnerable people throughout our country.
This is a commitment of the ANC to ensure that we eradicate hunger in our nation. South Africa now pays grants to more than 46% of the population. For the current year government has allocated approximately about R44 billion for a 12-month extension of the R350,00 social relief of distress grant. The legacy of apartheid has entrenched inequality and poverty in our country.
In the process of addressing inequality and unemployment through economic development and transformation, our caring ANC government has ensured that the majority of poor are protected and are being taken care of. As the ANC-led government, we went further through the introduction of social relief of distress grant which has demonstrated to bring about much-needed relief for the unemployed, particularly the youth who are not covered by the current grant payments. The grant has provided relief for those with food security challenges. It has enabled the unemployed to search for employment, whilst for others it has alleviated poverty in their households. We do not agree with the notion that we are building a welfare state which creates a dependency syndrome on the state. This
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notion is devoid of the facts and ignores the comprehensive
nature of our social wage. The people of South Africa, black and
white pledged in the Freedom Charter that there shall be houses,
security and comfort. A major area which requires enhancement in
our comprehensive social security system is the integration of
the provision of social services in a systematic manner which
will actually be able to enable a developmental transition of
the poor to the mainstream economy.
This can be done through an integrated system which has
information-sharing capabilities which grants recipients into
educational opportunities, employment opportunities, as well as
other economic opportunities. Our social transformation seeks to
ensure that the development of our people is anchored by the
freedom to realise their potential and for them to be able to be
their own liberators.
A critical policy debate which requires Parliament’s Social
Development’s portfolio committee, in particular, to grapple
with, is to answer a question on the introduction of the basic
income grant. The level of income inequality in our country
contributes to the level of poverty. Asset poverty and landless
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for economic production are also part of the drivers of
inequality in our country. Restoring the dignity of all South
Africans is an imperative of the ANC government, in order to
improve their wellbeing of South Africans through access to
health care, access to education, skills development and a
provision of the safety net. These are democratic gains we
should continue to build on through expanding our system to
cover for the unemployed between the ages of 18 and 59.
We welcome the Expanded Public Works Programme and other
Presidential Employment Stimulus opportunities which will
support over 1 million unemployed South Africans. It will also
be able to bode well for the skills development and creating
economic opportunities, particularly for our youth and our
women. In order to address inequality, we need to all social
partners working government to enable the redistribution of
assets and income through transforming economic sectors and
creating equal opportunities.
The creation of an inclusive economy is also at the heart of
addressing the unequal economic patterns. The ANC remains
committed to advancing social policies which provides the safety
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net for the poor and also to place all South Africans on a
developmental path. I thank you, hon House Chairperson.
Ms B S MASANGO: Chair, the DA is cautiously encouraged to see
this very important matter being debated outside election season
as has been the case many times before. One wonders if the
magnitude and depth of the needs of the very vulnerable in South
African society has really resonated in these hallowed chambers
of the otherwise uncaring ANC government. The fact that we
debate this matter today, exactly 22 years since it was mooted
via a committee led by Prof Vivienne Taylor, proves that the
need has been in our midst and under our very noses for that
long. However, this ANC government has merely looked the other
way, hoping it would simply disappear or magically go away.
Among the sections of our population, the most neglected are
those who desperately stand to benefit from a comprehensive
social security system; those who shoulder the heaviest burden
and responsibility to provide for their families. However, this
is the group that is subjected to the most barbaric carrot-
dangling strategies during election times, primarily by the ANC
Ministers of Social Development, the ANC presidents and at times
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even the ANC Ministers of Finance, not because there were
concrete plans to implement the expanded comprehensive social
security system but because of the ANC’s need to be heard to
appreciate the struggles of millions of South Africa’s poor.
In the year 2000, the ANC government appointed Prof Taylor’s
committee to investigate ways for the state to reform the social
security system to provide comprehensive coverage for all. The
committee called for the introduction of a range of measures,
including a universal basic income grant of at least R100 a
month. The Taylor committee further noted that, as a developing
economy coping with the structural legacies of apartheid, South
Africa was unlikely to be able to create stable and meaningful
employment opportunities for all economically active adults in
the foreseeable future.
Twenty years later we are in no better a position than we were.
In fact, if we look at it empirically, we are substantially
worse off in 2022. With levels of unemployment reaching crisis
proportions due to gross corruption, the mismanagement of the
economy by the ANC government and the recent COVID-19 pandemic,
soundbites regarding a basic income grant abound. Yet, no
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concrete, reasonable plans have come forward. This display of
insensitivity to the plight of millions of South Africans is
concerning at best, and cruel and criminal at worst. Even those
who receive social grants are subjected to random annual
increases that do not begin to match the exorbitant electricity,
petrol, food and transport prices that are increased
exponentially. Households have to make do with a measly R350
grant to put food on the table.
The topic of today’s debate partly says, not leaving anyone
behind. It is a misnomer. It is the policies of the ANC
government that continues to leave millions of poor people in
South Africa behind, stuck in endless poverty with no hope of a
brighter future. These policies exclude those who need them most
to build a better life but are instead exclusive and lack
distributive capacity. They only create opportunities for self-
enrichment for the ANC-aligned elite and well connected. Those
card-carrying cadres are the sole beneficiaries of these
opportunities, while the impoverished majority languish outside
the boundaries.
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The need for a comprehensive social security system in South
Africa is not in dispute. How it is done is what should be of
greater concern. According to a 2004 report of the Basic Income
Grant Financing Reference Group, which was entitled, Breaking
the poverty trap: “Nearly a decade after South Africa’s historic
transition to democracy, pervasive poverty and inequality pose
the greatest threat to human dignity and social cohesion”. This
was in 2004, and the threat posed then has continued to play
itself out in many protests by various sectors of our society.
This is a stark reminder that the ANC government left a huge
section of society behind a long time ago.
Unfortunately, government does not have the luxury of time to
ensure that it walks back to the people it has left behind. It
has no realistic solutions to what remains a real threat to
stability and cohesion in this country. It is curiously
interesting to note from the same report of 2004 that:
To date, government has yet to announce a formal position on
the basic income grant or indeed on any of the Taylor
committee recommendations. Instead, it has repeatedly
deferred a decision at successive Cabinet lekgotlas.
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Given the situation we are confronted with today, it is no
wonder that this debate is not evoking the excitement and hope
it should, as history might just be repeating itself to the
detriment of so many that ought not and must not be left behind
if stability and social cohesion are to be preserved in South
Africa. I thank you, Chairperson.
Ms N N SIHLWAYI: Hon House Chair, restoring dignity of the poor
and the marginalised through the provision of basic services.
Hon Chair, we come from a very painful past where the majority
of South Africans, blacks in general and African people were
denied human rights in their country of birth. The oppressed
majority fought against colonialism and apartheid to establish a
society founded on the democratic values of social justice and
other fundamental human rights to improve the quality of their
lives and of all citizens to unleash their potential.
Hon Chair, ...
IsiXhosa:
... andimazi u-Taylor.
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English:
The Nationalist Party, the Democratic Party ...
IsiXhosa:
... nale ngxubevange yanamhlanje ...
English:
... have caused an unforgettable human destruction in our
motherland. We will never forget. The new democratic South
Africa was founded within the constitutional principles
contained in the Bill of Rights as a cornerstone of our
democracy.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Connection problems.
Hon Sihlwayi, your line of connection is very bad.
Ms N N SIHLWAYI: Can I proceed, Chair?
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Yes, please but your
line is bad.
Ms N N SIHLWAYI: Is it not audible?
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The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Slightly you are but
you keep on breaking but you may continue or move away from that
place.
Ms N N SIHLWAYI: Okay, these rights affirm the democratic ...
[CONNECTION PROBLEMS.]
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): You are now gone hon
Sihlwayi, totally inaudible.
Ms N N SIHLWAYI: Let me change the position.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Hon members, patience
please.
Ms N N SIHLWAYI: Hon Chair, I was to say, the democratic state
therefore must respect, promote and fulfil these rights as
enshrined in the Constitution. In fact, Chair, it is proper to
mention their origin. The Freedom Charter policy statement of
the ANC articulates well a clear vision for our country, by
proclaiming equal rights for all who live in it. The closing
statement in the Freedom Charter reads as follows
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These freedoms we will fight for side by side throughout
our lives until we have won our liberty.
IsiXhosa:
Singangxanyelwa madoda, ama-350 eminyaka asiyondlwane iyanetha.
Siyeza sisendleleni, ningasingxameli.
English:
The social cluster therefore denotes the fundamental values of
the Freedom Charter towards the implementation of government
programme. Chair, just to raise the issues, which are these
rights that we believe are fundamental for our people that
should be protected by other institutions and by the state? The
Right to access to adequate housing, section 26 of the
Constitution. In the early 2000s a community was evicted from a
land which they had occupied under the then Oostenberg
Municipality, now known as Kraaifontein Municipality. The
community sought relief from the courts, and the Cape of Good
Hope found that the community were entitled to adequate shelter
as enshrined in section 21(1)(c) and both national and
provincial government had to intervene to rescue the community
and provide the necessary services.
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Government of the Republic of South Africa and Others vs
Grootboom and Others showed that government had an obligation to
act positively in ameliorating the plight of hundreds of
thousands of peoples living in deplorable conditions throughout
their living. The court stressed with no certain terms that all
rights in the Bill of Rights are interrelated and mutually
supporting and the state must ensure that those rights are
progressively realised within the available resources. Typical
example hon Chair, that the Minister of Human Settlements is
unblocking the blocked projects because those people that have
blocked projects do not have adequate housing and therefore
government has got to see how best can it address the plight of
their people. This would ensure that no one who deserves
adequate housing is left behind.
The second right is the Right to Human Dignity, everyone has an
inherent dignity and the right to have their dignity respected
and protected. Chair, gender-based violence is a curse in our
country which needs to be addressed not tomorrow but today. In
2001 for example, two Ministers of the Safety and Security and
Justice and Constitutional Development were sued by a
complainant who was attacked and abused by someone who was
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released by courts charged with attempted rape. The woman
claimed that the two departments were negligent in releasing the
accused and that she had her dignity violated. It is a duty of
the state, therefore to protect women from all sexual violence
that they face.
The court considered a potential liability for both police and
prosecutor for releasing the criminal with such activities and
gave bail that this could amount to wrongful conduct. How could
the police and the courts release an accused who attempted rape,
without having proper measures in place to protect the
complainant? The conduct by the police and court officials
constitute negligence and should result in consequences. Now,
because of negligence of some officials, the government is now
liable for wrongful conduct. We must ensure that our police and
the courts protect those that are vulnerable and marginalized,
in particular women and children. No one should be excluded from
the basic services.
We salute the ANC-led government that in this coming financial
year, has prioritised the implementation of the national
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strategic plan of gender-based violence and femicide to further
promote and empower women in our society.
Three new pieces of legislation have been enacted and signed
into law by President Ramaphosa to strengthen the criminal
justice system and by putting in place measures to assist the
survivors of gender-based violence and femicide. We commend that
no one should be left behind, should be excluded and no one
should be erased from benefiting in basic services. Thank you
very much.
IsiXhosa:
Bendibuza ukuba imizuzu le yam ibilahlekile iphelele phi?
English:
Thank you very much.
IsiXhosa:
USIHLALO WENDLU (Mnu M L D Ntombela): Hayi khange ilahleke mama
ibikhona.
English:
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Thank you very much.
Ms P MARAIS: Hon Chairperson, allow me this opportunity to wish
my Commander-in-Chief and President, Julius Sello Malema a happy
revolutionary birthday. You are loved by South Africans because
you care for all. I also wish to greet the officials of the EFF
under the capable leadership of the President and Commander-in-
Chief who is appearing before the East London Magistrate Court
for a frivolous case by AfriForum, a racist organisation. We
will not surrender the EFF to racists because the EFF is the
only weapon in the hands of poor people. The EFF is the only
organisation fighting for the increase of social grants.
We must increase social grants for older persons from R1 890 to
R3 780 per month. We must increase social grants for people
living with disability from R1 890 to R3 820 per month. We must
increase social grants for our War veterans from R1 890 to
R3 820 per month. We must increase child support grants from
R460 to R920 per month, and we must double all other social
grants.
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We cannot talk about expanding the comprehensive social security
system when the current system continues to subject many poor
people to perpetual poverty. All 12 million beneficiaries in the
SA Social Security Agency system must afford decent food and not
be visited by hunger now and again, as is the case today. To be
hungry is to live side by side with death. Black people will
continue to be death-bound subjects unless we double their
social grants.
While we continue to fight for an increase in social grants,
social grants in themselves are not the solution. Grants are
supposed to be a means to an end. While we appreciate and
acknowledge the big difference that social grants make in the
lives of our people, it is not the solution. Our people want
decent housing. Our people need food security. Our people need
to live closer to work, school, places of worship, and
recreational facilities.
We will not give our people a decent standard of living and pull
them out of poverty through social grants. The only way to
alleviate poverty is to be a country that produces what it
consumes and exports anything that we produce, a surplus.
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Therefore, all Sassa beneficiaries on social grants must be
active members of the economy and must be able to earn a living
and not rely on social grants, except children, orphans, war
veterans and foster care families.
There is a clear relationship between a productive economy, a
growing economy, an economy that employs people, and poverty.
But we know that the ruling party does not have a practical or
believable plan that combines social security and economic
policy. Currently, SA Social Security System is merely a payment
system. There is no long-term plan to lift people out of
poverty. To simply add more unemployed and struggling people
into the Sassa database will not solve our problems.
While we continue to advocate for some form of grants for all
who are struggling, including unemployed people who spend a lot
of money to look for work without any assistance. As the EFF, we
maintain that a practical and sustainable solution is economic
redistribution, economic growth and industrialisation of South
Africa as a whole. We should not trust the Treasury that
continues to cut social grants budget and come here every year
to mock our people with R20, R30 and R90 increases. The sooner
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we remove the parasitic, incompetent and corrupt ruling party
from power, the better. Thank you Chair.
Ms L L VAN DER MERWE: Thank you very much Chairperson, I’ll
leave my video off, I’ve got connection issues. Hon House
chairperson, our country is on its knees under the stewardship
of the current government South Africa has been crippled by
unethical leadership, illegal migration, the disintegration of
the rule of law and other ills.
When the leaders of our country fought for freedom, they dreamt
of just that. A country free of poverty, free of fear, free of
despair and free of injustice. Sadly 28 years after the dawn of
democracy, we are far from free. Our people are trapped in
poverty, almost half of South Africa’s population counts on some
type of grant alone as their only form of income. They walk the
narrow road between hunger and starvation daily.
Our youth have relegated to the unemployment lines; they have
been relegated to the R350 Sassa pay out lines while millions
more are now discouraged job seekers.
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In the phase of this devastation Chairperson, the ruling party
tables a debate on expanding the comprehensive social security
system today. Yet despite what the hon Stock said, South Africa
is already a welfare state.
Where is the ruling party’s much needed solutions? Expanding the
social welfare system is only a plaster on a gaping wound. How
are we going to lift our people out of poverty and despair and
restore their dignity? Chairperson, that is what we should be
debating today.
Let me state this as I’ve done that the IFP supports the basic
income grant yet it is very clear that government keeps dangling
the carrot that they cannot afford. South Africa’s current debt
burden is at R4,35 trillion. South Africa’s debt over the next
year or two will be projected to be R5,4 trillion, debt
servicing fees will be at R268 billion per annum alone thus
economic recovery and big might just be a distant dream.
This week a number of Ministers were implicated in corruption
and the third Zondo Commission Report. If our Ministers
alongside criminals didn’t devoir the money in our state coffers
through corruption, there would be more than enough basic income
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grants. We need as a matter of urgency to recoup money from all
those even our Ministers that stole from the state and by
extension stole from the poor.
Chairperson, expanding the social welfare system should first
and foremost focus on the child support grant with whatever
increased cost of food, caregivers are often forced to skip
meals because they cannot afford sufficient food.
It is against this background that IFP calls for an increase of
the child support grant which currently stands at R480.00 per
month well below the food poverty line of R624 per person per
month.
Expanding the social also comes with strengthening the Sassa
system. For far too long, millions have been side lined from
Sassa by criminals both within and outside government.
If we could remind ourselves that today to date, not a single
government official has paid back a single cent stolen when they
collected a R350 grant and other grants unlawfully.
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Chair, finally, our immigration system has collapsed due to the
failures of the Department of Home Affairs. Far too many non-
citizens have taken employment without being legally permitted
to do so.
The IFP has proposed changes to the employment services
Amendment Bill through Private Members Bill. We would like to
see South Africans, especially young prioritised in the low
skilled market. We are happy that government has heard our
please and the Department of Labour is piloting similar
legislation which looks to get South Africans to work.
Let us change our thinking from wealth estate to a state that
considers the welfare of its people and puts them first. Thank
you Chairperson.
Ms T BREEDT: Thank you Chairperson. Chairperson, the
continuation of the R350 SRD grant will cost South Africa
R44,4 billion in the coming financial year. It means that in all
spending of social grants for 2022/23 will increase to an
unprecedented R364,4 billion.
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In other words, 3,9% of our GDP or 48% of this coming year’s
budget will be spent on social wages. The Minister of Finance
was very clear last week that the R350 SRD grant will only be
extended for the next 12 months even when taking Cat into
account, it is still estimated that over the next three years,
the social wage will take up 59,4%, that’s almost 60% of the
government’s entire non interest spending.
Then the hon Stock wants to expand the comprehensive social
security system to where, with what money, how, where will we
get the money from? We currently have to borrow money to be able
to afford our current needs.
The question of today’s discussion of is in essence incorrect
and is a testament to what is wrong in South Africa today and
the government style of the ANC. The focus should not be having
more people dependant on social security but less.
The topic of today’s discussion should have been; what reforms
are made necessary to not leave anyone behind but ensure self -
sustainability.
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The Minister of Finance preaches pension reform but we should be
careful when as Parliament we consider this. We do not want to
create a situation where more and more people will be reliant on
government in their old age because they spent their pension
funds during these current tough times. This will create a
vicious cycle. As is currently the case with our current old age
recipients do not even receive the minimum wage and can
therefore not even afford the most basic of needs. If they do
not have family or children to support them, they are as good as
dead.
What will then happen to our parents and our grandparents if we
do pension reforms that the Minister preaches if we allow this
to happen.
And to to add to the gloom Chair, it has recently been announced
that the teacher retention rate in basic education is worsening.
That means the student, teacher ratios will be greater in
future. Further meaning a greater percentage of unemployed
teachers but also the greater number of students not receiving
the necessary attention in schools to ensure proper employment
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in future. This of course means more people reliant on
government and of course you understand the rest of that cycle.
The hon Stock in his comments will most probably not see
anything wrong with this because that would mean an increase in
the welfare estate which they think is good.
Chairperson, the focus should be that of education, empowerment,
self-sustainability and a conducive environment for the private
sector to create jobs. We should move away from thinking that
welfare is the only option to our citizens in the current
devastating position. We should start thinking of prosperity,
wellbeing and success. It is then and only then when we will
realise what needs to happen that our focus needs to shift, that
laws need to be created to encourage job creation and
entrepreneurship and not to start entrepreneurship economic
growth and
I will conclude with age old saying, give a man fish and he eats
for day but teach a man how to fish and he eats every day.
Chairperson, I thank you.
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Ms M E SUKERS: Thank you hon Chair. I wish to state that the
ACDP supports temporary relief for those in need. We cannot
however make it permanent state that disables individual agency
and human development of the young, healthy and able body. It is
important to refer back to the report of the high level panel on
the assessment of key legislation and the acceleration of
fundamental change.
One of the key recommendations referred to building human
capabilities to enable economic participation, social cohesion
and engage citizenry. Government must not do what the individual
and community can do for themselves. We have to with urgency
attend to barrier that exist for adults to enter skills
programmes and further learning.
The continued delay in implementing the nation senior
certificate for adults is one such a barrier. There is not one
person in the House that does not agree on the need for an
effective and holistic security safety net for the vulnerable.
However, we face the challenge of an untransformed sluggish
social development system.
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In addressing social security and the expansion thereof, there
is a very important element that must be discussed and it is the
element of goodwill. Government should not and cannot go with it
along in providing an effective plan to address the deepening
crisis of poverty and its devastating impact on the psyche of
our people.
Goodwill has been eroded and it led to the resistance of plain
exhaustion of the taxpayer and serious social development
partners. This is a challenge in creating a comprehensive social
security system that is not only government dependent.
The second challenge is the misuse of capacity programmes aimed
at upliftment, patronage and the ever expanding supply chain
network to repair votes and buy loyalty is bankrupt political
strategy that abuses EPW programmes and NPO funding and here in
the Western Cape to Limpopo right nationwide.
Remove corruption and the perverse political strategy from
funding and social development programmes, transform the civil
service, and this is project that must be embarked upon before
you talk expansion. A corrupt system will deepen the crisis and
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exhaust the badly needed goodwill in order to create temporary
safety nets for the poor and those who need it the most. We have
to break generational cycles of poverty by transforming the
system. Thank you Chair.
Mr B N HERRON: Chairperson, the level of inequality is South
Africa’s greatest existential threat. It is not only unjust,
given the history from which our democratic country emerged, it
is wholly unsustainable. It has created a social tender box that
of deprivation and division, and last July we witnessed the ease
with which this box could be ignited.
Dismantling the deeply entrenched divisions that keep South
Africans apart must be our single overarching priority. The
truth is that our economy is unable to generate enough jobs to
reduce, let alone, eliminate unemployment. This leaves millions
of South Africans without an access to an income. A combination
of unemployment and poverty has led to increased and
indescribable hardship where poor families are starving and
scavenging for food.
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The country cannot afford not to address these people’s plights.
South Africa has a well-established social assistance programme
of cash transfers but the programme excludes millions who are 18
to 59 years old the assumed age of economic activity. Section 28
of our rights based Constitution guarantees every person the
right to sufficient food, water and social security.
It is in this context that the debate about a basic income
guarantee or grant must be understood. When an economy is unable
to provide enough jobs for people to earn an income and take
care of themselves financially, then the state has a duty to
provide some social security. This is not a gift nor a handout;
it is a right.
The social relief grant that has been providing nearly 10
million beneficiaries with some cash transfers is welcome, and
we welcome the extension of it as a first step bur we need to
progress from here and provide a permanent safety net for those
who need it.
The question of the quantum of that safety net is continuously
challenging. The most recent data published by Statistics SA
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shows that the food poverty line is R624 per month per person.
This is the amount of money a person needs to purchase the
minimum daily food required to live. So, the fastest way to
achieve a comprehensive social security system is to start with
a basic income grant at least the food poverty line.
Obviously we must address affordability. Chairperson, if you
start from the premise that no adult can be expected to live
without any income, then you stop asking how we can afford it
and start asking how we can afford not to. We are not unaware of
the current financial constraints — it is a matter of
prioritisation. If the Minister of Finance follows through on
the plan to introduce zero base budgeting and identifying our
absolute priorities, it will free up significant savings. The
introduction of a basic income grant is the only way to directly
address the growing epidemic of deprivation, hunger and
malnutrition. Thank you.
Mr K L JACOBS: Hon Chairperson, in order to create a prosperous
society with a sustainable and equitable economic development
and to improve productivity for growth, the health of the
citizens is the wealth of the nation.
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The aspirations of the 2030 Agenda are based on inclusiveness
and ensuring that no person is left behind which is in line with
the theme of this debate. In the same breath, the vision for the
health sector is to ensure a healthy nation for all South
Africans. This further emphasises the importance of achieving
universal health coverage by ensuring that every South African
has access to health care services regardless of their
socioeconomic status.
At the essence of human development there are three principles
that are directly linked to economic development; to live a long
and healthy life, to acquire knowledge and to have access to
resources needed for a descent standard of living.
South Africa has a comprehensive social security system as a
response to imperatives of human development. Over the
democratic order we have expanded basic services in both the
urban and the rural areas, particularly for the marginalised.
Health and economic development are interdependent, presenting
an important opportunity through the National Development Plan,
NDP, to integrate health within goals of broader socioeconomic
development.
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The NDP goals are aligned to the Sustainable Development Goals
and to the AU Agenda 2063 aimed at millions of South Africans
having improved living conditions in a context where, for
historical reasons, South Africa is amongst the most unequal
societies, but much progress has been made in critical areas
such as the provision of clean water, electricity, sanitation,
education and health.
Despite this progress the poorest and most vulnerable people are
left behind. This means that there remains a need for investing
in the poorest and most marginalised towards universal health
coverage. In 2016 the World Health Assembly, WHA, issued a
ground breaking revolution together with the Rio Political
Declaration on Social Determinants of Health which commits
countries to build momentum or speed for the development of
dedicated national action plans and strategies to deal with
exclusion, in access and social determinants of health in order
to reduce health inequities.
The WHA Rio resolution recognises the fragmentation that offer
resource public health system. It underscores ... [Inaudible.]
... that leaves many people behind, underscores the African
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Charter on Human and People’s Rights, the Declaration of ...
[Inaudible.] ... and the World Health Organisation’s
constitution. All of which call for ... [Inaudible.] ... take
full responsibility for the health of the people.
Hon Chairperson, the universal health coverage then becomes of
paramount importance. It seeks to provide a preventive health
scheme shall be run by the state. Provision of free medical care
and hospitalisation for all with special care for mothers and
young children. This is what guides the ANC on the realisation
of the National Health Insurance. It is in this context that
South Africa is currently in the process of reforming its health
systems through the NHI to achieve the following outcomes. An
improved access to quality health services for all South
Africans, irrespective of whether they are employed or not. Pool
risks so that equity and social solidarity would be achieved
through the creation of a single fund. Procure services on
behalf of the entire population and efficiently mobilise and
control financial resources and to improve health systems
performance and for everyone to experience universal health
coverage.
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South Africa’s ... [Inaudible.] ... the implementation of the
Sustainable Development Goals through the Domestic Developmental
Agenda and Policy. To have a good health is essential to
sustainable development and the 2030 Agenda reflects the
complexity and interconnectedness of the two. It takes into
account widening the economic and social inequalities, effort
urbanisation, threats to the climate and the environment, the
continuing burden of HIV and other infectious diseases and
emerging challenges such as COVID-19 and noncommunicable
diseases.
South Africa has made great progress in developing health
outcomes, for example, increasing the life expectancy of South
Africans such as decrease in the leading causes of death ...
[Inaudible.] ... reducing maternal mortality rate, under-five
mortality rate, neonatal mortality rate ... [Inaudible.] ...
Decrease in new HIV infections and incidents of ... [Inaudible.]
... A lot still needs to be done to realise the number of ...
[Inaudible.]
In conclusion, Chairperson, research has shown that achieving
the SDG targets depends on collaboration between stakeholders,
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government, private sector, civil society, academic research
institutions and international organisations working together
with all stakeholders and partners we can ensure that the goals
that South Africa has already met are sustained and that the
progress made before the pandemic does not roll back. Out health
care system has demonstrated its capacity through the
coronavirus pandemic which is a security health risk to the
nation.
Finally, Chairperson, we call on all people who have not
vaccinated to please be vaccinated. Remember that vaccination
saves lives. Thank you.
Mr M G E HENDRICKS: Al-Jama-ah congratulates the hon Marais on
the revolutionary maiden speech on the birthday of her
commander-in-chief – happy birthday hon Julius Malema.
In his first Sona address, President Ramaphosa announced that
every family will get a warm plate of food and no one will be
left out. After his third Sona, this has been done.
Congratulations, President Ramaphosa. Well done. President
Ramaphosa to expand the social security system, launched the
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Expanded Public Works Programme, EPWP, matriculants helping out
in schools, and Home Affairs using graduates to do scanning.
These are not decent jobs but expanding the social security
system.
To expand the social security jobs, President Ramaphosa must get
call centre jobs in our 10 000 villages. The first step is to
get successful bidders for the spectrum to provide free data to
the villages and the Department of Communications and Digital
Technologies to launch a satellite internet where the towers
cannot reach. The bidders who have satellites must be given
preference in allocating the spectrum.
Village children can work as call centre agents from home to
expand the social security system by this employment scheme so
that no one is left out. No one must be left out from earning a
living, even just to put a loaf of bread on the table. Mpame
village, where I also live, is also ready for a call centre
poverty alleviation scheme. Thank you very much, hon Chair.
Mr A M SHAIK EMAM: Thank you, House Chairperson, I must agree
with Dr James that, in fact, a lot of progress has been made in
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the last 27 or 28 years in the country, but at the same time,
hon House Chairperson, we must admit that with 46% of South
Africans on some form of social assistance, we cannot expect not
to leave anyone behind. When there is 34,9% unemployed and ...
[Inaudible.] ... about 42% unemployed, we cannot expect not to
leave anyone behind. When 70% of our youth in this country are
unemployed, we cannot expect not to leave anyone behind. When
seven million people go hungry to bed, we cannot expect not
leave anyone behind.
What South Africans are not looking for is a handout. What South
Africans are looking for is an opportunity to be part of an
inclusive economy. What South Africans are looking for is a
position to be able to find themselves suitable jobs so that
they do not depend on our handouts.
I have heard people talking about one thing – to increase grants
and some particular amounts of money – the question is: Should
we not be concentrating on how we must reduce the number of
people in this country dependent on social assistance and make
the rest of them, particularly the younger generation, more
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productive? That is basically what we should be concentrating
on.
House Chairperson, 79 cents estimation – and this is an old list
– out of every rand in this country is debt service books and
public sector wage bill, which means 21 cents is spent. Of that
21 cents, 11 cents are on corruption and looting, which means we
spending 10 cents in this country on delivering services to the
people on the ground.
How are you going to have a more inclusive government economy if
you are going to spend only 20 cents out of every rand on
improving the quality of lives of our people? The question is:
Is it sustainable to have ...
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Hon member.
Mr A M SHAIK EMAM: Is it my time?
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): No, you can continue,
hon Emam. Somebody was disturbing us.
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Mr A M SHAIK EMAM: Thank you, House Chairperson. I have been
doing some homework, particularly on some of the major changes
... [Inaudible.] ... particularly from the 20th of the month. If
you look at the exorbitant increases in the price of goods and
every supermarket you go to - I can name a whole lot of them –
you’ll find the prices are the same ... [Inaudible.] ... With
food prices and fuel price rising ... and remember, many of our
people - like the previous speakers have said – rely on public
transport to get to work. If a great percentage of ...
[Inaudible.] ... what have they got to live on? Thank you very
much, House Chairperson, I have run out of time.
Ms N T MKHATSHWA: Good afternoon House Chair. May I just please
kindly have an indication whether or not the ANC has any
remaining minutes from our previous speakers.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): I will check, the
will inform me, for now up to so far I am not very sure. The
staff will indicate then.
Ms N T MKHATSHWA: Thank you very much. Hon House Chair and
members, and most importantly fellow South Africans
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sanibonani(greetings). We are gathered this afternoon to debate
the motion on the expansion of a comprehensive social security
system, and ensuring that no single South African is left
behind. We debate this motion in the month of this young
democracy of ours, commemorating the Human Rights Day on 21 of
March. I find it rather symbolic as at the core of social
security systems, is the protection of citizen’s human rights by
acknowledging the need to uphold the dignity of citizens,
considering the socioeconomic, political disparities and
inequities that confront them.
Looking at the context of South Africa in particular, our
comprehensive social security system exists with an appreciation
of the need to address the structural inequities, deeply rooted
in the apartheid regime, total disregard for the basic human
rights of black people in this country.
The Background Paper on Social Protection issued by the
Presidency reminds us that, government social protection
framework is built on the principle of comprehensiveness and
thus income support social services, social insurance and the
provision of free basic services to vulnerable households
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constitute governmental holistic approach to addressing poverty.
The right to social security must be appreciated within a
broader context of government striving to alleviate immediate
vulnerabilities. However, with the medium to long-term goal for
the realisation of self-sufficient citizens.
Hon members, and I'd like hon Breedt and a number of other hon
members who spoke earlier to listen attentively to what I am
about to say. In advancing a comprehensive social security
system we must appreciate as alluded to in the National
Development Plan, NDP the importance of access to education in
empowering citizens to be active participants of the economy.
The Bill of Rights of Africa states that the right to education,
education which the ANC has resolved remains an apex priority of
government’s ... [Inaudible] ...policies and an essential pillar
of our fight against the triple challenge of poverty, inequality
and unemployment. The ANC further notes that, failure to
accelerate inclusive access to education and training, directly
threatens the achievement of this key objective.
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Hon members, key elements of our comprehensive social security
system must include free education for those who cannot afford
which it does, as education is one of the cornerstones of
development. The acquisition of skills and knowledge through
education enhances citizens’ capabilities in advancing equality,
poverty reduction and economic growth, thus breaking the chain
of poverty across generations.
Inclusive access to education can be realised when free-fee
education in this country, fee waivers in this country,
scholarships, block grants, supported by nutrition feeding
schemes, scholars’ transport, free textbooks and educational
resources, student allowances and stipends to mention but a few.
Appreciating that education as part of the comprehensive social
security system, is an investment to the country’s developmental
state agenda, South Africa has allocated in this year alone, a
significant budget of R441,5 billion towards learning and
culture.
In the basic education sector, government has attempted to
create safety nets through free education, fee waivers, feeding
schemes, scholar transport free textbooks and learning materials
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to mention but a few. A comprehensive social security system
appreciates the school nutrition programme, in the fact that it
assists in ensuring the nutrition of children but also increases
school attendance. This is supported by a budget allocation of
R26,7 billion over the medium term for 19 950 schools.
Over the medium term, R6,7 billion is allocated to
infrastructure grants. In the higher education sector,
government has attempted to create safety nets through the state
funded interventions, such as the National Research Foundation,
Funza Lushaka Bursary Scheme and the National Student Financial
Aid Scheme to mention but a few. An estimate of R4,1 billion has
been allocated to Funza Lushaka with the aim of providing more
than 36 000 bursaries over the medium term. One hundred and
forty-three point three billion has been allocated to National
Student Financial Aid Scheme, Nsfas over the medium term,
benefiting an estimate of 2,5 million students over the next
three years.
So, contrary to the notion that the government recklessly aims
to create state dependent citizens, these safety nets within the
border education system aim to empower citizens with skills and
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knowledge to participate in the alleviation of deeply rooted
social conditions, such as widespread poverty, significant
levels of income disparity, vulnerability and exposure to risk.
However, this is not expressed loosely without an appreciation
of a high unemployment rates, including the high graduate
unemployment rates in this country. The Green Paper on
Comprehensive Social Security and Retirement Reform 2021
articulates that, unemployed adults aged 18 to 59 account for
about a quarter of those living in poverty. It further states
that social assistance does not currently address the need for
those who are unemployed without any means of support. The paper
recommends active labour market interventions with allowances
linked to skills development, and the Expanded Public Works
Programme, further education and training and youth unemployment
programmes. The biggest challenge we have is that, whilst the
state attempts to address systemic inequities through the
provision of skills and knowledge, the economy is not receptive
to the increasing numbers of skilled and knowledgeable citizens.
This is concerning as it may exacerbate income and opportunity
inequalities, increase poverty and possibly lead to the false
idea that there is no value add on educational investments.
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This is where we must act as taught by President Cyril Ramaphosa
on ensuring that industry plays its part in job creation, whilst
the state coordinates plans and guide the development of the
economy. This must be supported by a continuous audit of the
skills need of a country’s economy, and complements thereof in
the curricula of both basic and higher education. This must be
appreciated with an understanding that modern social security
system must be designed to support job creation, by eliminating
measures that discourage labour market participation and
establishing mechanisms that promote social integration.
Hon members, President Cyril Ramaphosa reminded us in the state
of the nation address and in his response to the debate thereof
that, we ought to leave no one behind. That is why it is
important for us to see the progressive expansion of our
comprehensive social security system, that will respond to
society’s varying levels of risk. We must also state that in
order for citizens to feel that they are not left behind, we
must ensure that safety nets are easily accessible, and that
there are measures put in place for them not to be abused.
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There must be modern technology, strengthen the master social
security registry and build on the consolidated Social Security
fabric interface. That is why we welcome the collaboration
between SA Social Security Agency, Sassa and Nsfas to ensure
that a student coming out of basic education, who is a Sassa
beneficiary does not have to be subjected to the dignity
stripping exercise or perpetually having to prove their
indigence, but rather the Nsfas system will automatically
identify the application and grant them a real time offer. In
leaving no one behind, we must commit ourselves to improving
access coverage, administrative efficiency, delivery and
transparency and expansion of a comprehensive social security
system.
Hon members of the DA, hon Masango, you say you want your
cautiously encouraged. I want to implore on you to decide
whether or not you are coming or going. I think the President
hon members ... and listening to many members that are
contradicting themselves as well as colleagues from hon Van der
Merwe you speak about it being a plaster but at the same time
you’re advocating for these grants and also advocating for an
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increase in funding allocation, even hon Breedt. Members are
seemingly coming or ...
IsiXhosa:
... andiyazi nokuba niyeza okanye niyahamba ...
English:
... you are coming or going, I don’t know what's going on there.
What I mean to say to you is that, we must be reminded by the
President’s state of the nation address when he said:
There are moments in the life of a nation when old
certainties are unsettled and new possibilities emerge.
The President says: “In these moments, there’s both the prospect
of great progress and the risk of reversal”. Let members be
reminded that, the path we choose now will determine the cause
for future generations.
I want to appreciate the healthy engagements, that hon ...
[Inaudible] ... have articulated. I mean, he clearly state that
social securities are not a gift, they are rights. Therefore,
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anyone who seeks to undermine the importance of social security
and want to loosely allude to them as us as the ANC government,
creating a ...[Inaudible] ... estate in fact ...[Inaudible]...
on the point of, of class privilege. We understand the
importance of these social security systems ... [Interjections]
... that colleagues will in future engage more healthily in
these debates. I thank you House Chair.
Ms A L A ABRAHAMS: Chairperson, this topic of debate is
something of déjà vu. It is a topic debated in this Parliament
before with consensus the social security system must be all
inclusive. The reality for those who live in situations of
excruciating poverty and deprivation is that the values and
rights enshrined in the Bill of Rights and Constitution such as
freedom, equality and human dignity have not yet been fully
realised under the ANC. Far too many destitute South Africans
are still excluded from receiving grants, government services
and unable to fully participate in the country’s economy and
society despite 28 years of democracy.
Millions of South Africans are already left behind such as our
vulnerable children not yet old enough to vote invisible to the
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ANC. An amount of 17,5%, over 1,8 million eligible children
cannot access the child support grant. One in four children, 27%
under the age of five is stunted. It has been like this since
1999. What of these children left behind all while the ANC
donates R50 million to Cuba?
An estimated 3,4 million children aged 0-6 years cannot access
an early childhood development programme, ECD. They too are left
behind by the Department of Social Development, with little hope
the Department of Basic Education will see much improvement. Not
to mention the Department of Social Development’s inability to
pay the R496 million ECD Presidential Stimulus Relief Fund
announced two years ago. An amount of R351 million already
rolled over from last year hangs in the balance as we draw to
the end of the financial year.
The Social Assistance Act was amended two years ago and I was
relieved to hear the Finance Minister make mention of the child
support top-up in his Budget Speech. However, if the measly
increases to grants is anything to measure by, the value of the
top-up may not serve it’s desired purposed. Perhaps Cabinet
should take a stroll down the baby toiletry isle or the
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stationery and school uniform section to get a realistic idea of
the cost of raising a child in South Africa today.
The DA maintains its position that the child support grant must
be in line with the food poverty line. The ANC at the wheel for
28 years has left government institutions incapable of
delivering an all-inclusive, all access social security system
with the ANC themselves the primary obstacle.
Government is fragmented in the delivery of the basket of
services to the destitute. Before one can access the SA Social
Security Agency, Sassa, grant, tertiary education or employment,
a birth certificate or ID is required, a known failure of Home
Affairs. The bankrupt SA Postal Service, further burdens the
poor with increased travelling expenses to the next service
point as more offices close.
We speak of a social security floor, but the only floor many
know is the concrete payment outside of SASSA. The absence of a
central information management system, a one stop shop, sends
South Africans into a maze of nondelivery, leaving people
behind. Social security cannot be looked at in isolation and
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requires a whole of government and society approach. In times of
crisis South Africans open their hearts and donate generously.
Nongovernment organisations, NGOs, in particular are on the
frontline shouldering the burden of government service delivery
failures yet are first on the chopping block when it comes to
budget allocations.
The 2021 Social Security Peer Review shows South Africa is rich
in civil society partners who should play the dominant role is
shaping the policy space for social security. I just hope
Minister Zulu takes the recommendations to heart and it was not
just another annual performance plan, APP, tick box exercise.
South Africa is a signatory to range of international treaties,
declarations and conventions on the issue of social security and
poverty alleviation. The ANC’s own National Development Plan has
a vision for a comprehensive social protection floor by 2030.
But without concrete implementation plan South Africans will
continue to languish in poverty with nondelivery the only
certainty.
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The social contract which the President spoke about in his state
of the nation address, Sona, address, can only be built on the
foundation of trust. The ANC has time and time again broken this
trust. Therefore, the only way to honestly leave no one behind
is through a new government in 2024. The DA once again invites
all to read our offer and solution to addressing inequality in
our economic justice policy. A sustainable development goal
model. A plan for South Africa to beat the past and build the
future. I thank you, Chairperson.
Mr W M MADISHA: Chair, we need a comprehensive social security
system that has the capacity to create a set of benefits that
are guaranteed for larger sections of vulnerable South Africans.
I here refer to millions of the poor and the unemployed. I must
remind you that South Africa is considered to be number one in
the whole world when it comes to unemployment and yet only 1% of
South Africans owns 41% of our country’s wealth.
The presently proposed social security system lags a coherent
inclusive platform for a restructured system that involves
especially millions of vulnerable South Africans. It lags an
inclusive and comprehensive system which is long overdue. It
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lags a clear vision of how a government will counter what
already overflow in the department, namely, maladministration,
corruption, loss of public confidence, individual greed and many
more challenges. It is more interdepartmental and multitier. It
lags the capacity to create a set of benefits that are
guaranteed for larger sections of the vulnerable South Africans.
I must emphasise that the issue of joblessness that you have
sited goes very far beyond what’s purported and something must
be done. The majority of people who are given jobs are non-South
Africans because those who employ them can exploit them very
easily. The employers do not follow the Labour Relations Act and
all those particular laws that are supposed to be followed. One
supposes the objective of implementing the child support grant
and the basic income grant. It is a fact that in the milieu
which we exist South Africans will continue to die unless they
are implemented. But the question that we must ask is, when will
this be done because our people are swimming in a very serious
sea of poverty and death? Thank you very much.
Mr D M STOCK: Thank you very much, hon Chairperson. We have
heard from different debaters of this motion: Expanding the
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comprehensive social security system. We all agree that we need
to improve and transform the conditions of the majority who have
been marginalised by colonialism and the apartheid system, which
ensured that it deprived the blacks and Africans in particular.
All these deprivations are the legacy of apartheid which should
be addressed by the ANC democratic government, to equalise the
inequalities that we find throughout our country.
The ANC from the Reconstruction and Development Programme to the
National Development Plan, NDP, has placed the provision of
social services and expansion of a comprehensive social security
at a high level, which is very consistent. As the ANC, we have
made an imprint in the fibre of the nation, we entrench ubuntu,
by being the caring government. The government has walked with
all the social partners from business, labour, civil society
organisations, traditional leaders and the people of South
Africa in general, to build a society which guarantees a
wellbeing and social protection of all its people.
Hon members and House Chairperson, Dr Kenny Jacobs has actually
clearly outlined the efforts of government in ensuring access to
healthcare for all South Africans and also a National Health
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Insurance, NHI, for all South Africans. This is going to
guarantee access to quality healthcare and various
specialisation for the poor, which will actually be market
driven. There is a progressive policy which the ANC has
committed itself to realise in the near future.
Hon Mkhatshwa has also outlined the intervention in education
and skills development to improve the nation’s human
capabilities in order to build developmental state and inclusive
society. We must never tell untruths to the people of South
Africa, and claim that nothing has not been done to change the
living conditions of the poor. We can also not claim that all
the challenges affecting our people, have been resolved.
But what is a fact and a least reality for many South Africans
is that, we have changed a lot of systemic social and economic
variants which reproduced poverty throughout our people’s lives.
Our programme of social transformation for self-liberation is
indeed on course. We need to ensure that we radically transform
the economy of the country in order to build an inclusive
economy which will address the racial nature of distribution of
assets and income.
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Socio-economic transformation is imperative to guarantee the
socio-economic rights of all South Africans. Economic growth
should be redistributive through growth of labour intensive
industries and high productive centres. The government has
expanded social wage, and the private sector working with
government and labour, can increase job opportunities and
reinvest in the economy for the economic growth to increase our
tax revenues and to further expand the social protection.
The President of South Africa, hon His Excellency Mr Ramaphosa
has called on all social partners to engage on a Base Income
Grant, BIG. Hon Masango from the DA, does not tell the people of
South Africa that the ANC government has ensured that nearly
half of the population currently receives at least one social
grant from the state implementing imperatives in the tailored
report which was commissioned by the ANC government. The
household income of the poor is secured through our
comprehensive social security system.
This hon member from the EFF who has actually participated in
the debate through her maiden speech, has actually made
contributions, but because it’s her maiden speech, I will
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actually not respond to what she has said in the debate. We will
actually be able to attend to those issues in the next debate.
Hon Breedt from the DA, our comprehensive social securities
anchored by education and expanding skills development, is not
limited to grants, ours is empowering the poor for self-
liberation.
We have largely agreed in this debate that we need to provide a
safety net through a Basic Income Grant for the poor, except
from the FF Plus, for obvious reasons, of course. As the
legislative arm of the state, we need to continue engagement and
mobilise social partners in forging a pathway for Basic Income
Grant to transition grant recipient into a labour market in
education and also skills development opportunities. We should
also play our oversight function to ensure that government
programmes achieve their outcomes, because fiscal allocation by
government can bring about a change and also leave no one
behind.
Hon Chairperson, let me thank all the members who have actually
participated to the debate, and who have actually made positive
contributions in the debate. Unfortunately, to those who came to
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the debate to play politics and to just and to just flirt their
party line, I’ve got nothing to say to them, but I just hope
that they will change. Next time, when issues if this magnitude,
issues that are before us which are very important, they must be
able to put their party line aside and be able to build on an
issue at hand. Thank you very much to all those who have made
contributions, and I also thank you very much, hon Chairperson.
Setswana:
Ke a leboga.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Thank you, hon Stock.
Hon members, that concludes the debate. We shall now proceed to
the second session of this mini-plenary session, which is the
subject for discussion in the name of hon K J Milleham, on the
negative impact of the rising costs of electricity and other
forms of energy on the Republic. I now recognise the hon K J
Milleham.
THE NEGATIVE IMPACT OF RISING COSTS OF ELECTRICITY AND OTHER
FORMS OF ENERGY ON THE REPUBLIC
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(Subject for Discussion)
Mr K J MILEHAM: Chairperson, South Africa and her people are
suffering. It’s not just the days and weeks without electricity
that affect us, but also the spiralling costs. We are expected
to pay, and pay, and pay, and pay, for an entity that can only
keep the lights on and its generation plants running 59% of the
time, according to the latest Eskom System Status Report.
Eskom’s tariff has increased by 9,61% over last year’s tariff.
And while that was significantly lower than the 20,5% Eskom had
requested, it is still more than double the country’s official
inflation rate. It was only through the sustained efforts of the
DA, the various municipalities where we govern, and civil
society organisations, that Nersa heard the call to limit
Eskom’s increase.
And yet, given that Eskom and Nersa are once again in court
arguing over the tariff determination methodology, we await the
court’s judgement to hear whether a further R59 billion will
have to be recovered. If so, consumers and businesses will once
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again be expected to foot the bill for ANC mismanagement,
incompetence and corruption over many years.
One only has to look at the mess that are the Medupi and Kusile
coal plants, to see what happens when comrades and cadres are
permitted to loot freely. Let us not forget that much of our
electricity pricing issues arise from Eskom debt incurred to
build these two power plants, and facilitated by the likes of
Chancellor House and Hitachi Power Systems for the benefit of
the corrupt and thieving ANC. And it was done on the watch of
one Samson Gwede Mantashe, our esteemed Minister of Energy, who
at the time was the Secretary-General of the ANC, and intimately
familiar with the dealings of Chancellor House. These two mega
plants which were supposed to end load shedding, have an energy
availability of just 63,3% at Medupi and a shocking 24,5% at
Kusile according to the most recent data available.
Chairperson, the price of 95 Octane petrol has increased by 44%
since January last year. In the same period, diesel has
increased by 13% and illuminating paraffin by 20%. At the time
that the Basic Fuel Pricing model was introduced in 2003, South
Africa was a net exporter of refined petroleum products.
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Over the past two decades, however, that situation has changed
dramatically, and the country is now a net importer, and given
the recent closure of four of South Africa’s refineries in the
past two years, the situation has only worsened. As a result,
the Basic Fuel Price Model is no longer the appropriate
methodology to determine the price of liquid fuels. It is
absolutely unacceptable that a full third of the price we pay
for petrol goes into government coffers, not to secure our
energy future, but rather to pay for general government’s
expenses.
This is not a caring government. It is a government that is
robbing consumers to pay for its own flagrant excesses,
wastefulness and corruption. [Interjections.]
AN HON MEMBER: Where is the robbery?
Mr K J MILEHAM: Sorry, Chair.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Hon member, please
don’t do that.
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Mr K J MILEHAM: Don’t do what, Chair?
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): No, there’s a person
who has just disturbed us. Please go on, hon Mileham.
Mr K J MILEHAM: Thank you, Chair. In this regard, we are pleased
that Minister Mantashe has heeded our request to comprehensively
review both the pricing of liquid fuels and electricity. We
welcome his acknowledgement on Tuesday that high energy prices
are perpetuating energy poverty, and that the formula used by
Nersa to determine the price of electricity is, to quote the
Minister, “backward”. Yesterday on Radio 702, Dr Dale McKinley,
a noted political economist said, speaking of the war of Russian
aggression in Ukraine:
It’s not just at the fuel pump that we are going to feel
this immediately. There is a huge range of knock-on
effects. It goes across the board and it hits the consumer
very hard. It seems we are far away from this political war
in Europe. Economically, it’s a global issue and
particularly for South Africa, it’s going to hit us very
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hard, and it’s going to hit most obviously those who are
least able to afford it.
The reality is that we have not yet begun to see the impact of
the despicable Russian invasion in Ukraine in fuel pricing. That
will only really impact on next month’s prices and one aspect
that has not been considered is the impact that this will have
on electricity pricing. Remember that we use diesel to fuel
Eskom’s peaking plants, many of which now run almost 24/7 at
great expense to keep the lights on and minimise load shedding.
In fact, Chairperson, if we were to allow more competition, ease
the difficulty of doing business, and reduce the heavy-
handedness of government price setting, we would undoubtedly be
in a far better position economically. Instead, government takes
its cut on every litre of fuel and kilowatt of electricity, and
as a result, businesses are closing their doors, citizens are
becoming unemployed and more South Africans are seeking greener
pastures. This government has a lot to answer for.
The rotating door of Ministers of Energy has done little to
resolve the crisis, whether of generation capacity or
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electricity and fuel pricing, because the Ministry is captured
by the same disease that affects everything the ANC touches: a
complete lack of accountability and willingness to accept the
consequences of their actions.
Nearly every entity in the Department of Energy is in the red.
The Auditor-General has repeatedly highlighted supply chain
management issues and irregular expenditure. The department and
its entities fail to meet the most basic of key performance
indicators, and yet somehow, life goes on and no one is held
responsible.
In the meantime, it is ordinary South Africans who continue to
suffer. And so we get to the nub of the matter: What is to be
done? We need to address the affordability of refined fuels and
electricity in a manner that ensures meaningful systemic change,
and does not merely pay lip service to resolving this issue.
When the prices of fuel and electricity increase, every other
product and service becomes more expensive as a result of the
knock-on effect.
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Ordinary South Africans struggle to satisfy their daily needs,
whether that’s transport, heating, cooking, lighting,
manufacturing or countless other activities. The cost of living
in South Africa has become unaffordable, primarily because of
above inflation increases to fuel and electricity prices; costs
which are, if not totally in the control of government, are
certainly far more susceptible to government manipulation and
management than in a deregulated economy.
The DA has been clear and unequivocal in its call on national
government. Unbundle Eskom and create a truly independent grid
operator; open up the grid to competition, and remove the cap on
renewable energy generation in the Integrated Resource Plan;
make it easier, through a concerted red-tape reduction
programme, for municipalities, businesses and consumers to
either generate their own electricity or to procure directly
from independent power producers; and incentivise the
importation and local production of electric vehicles to reduce
the reliance on refined fuels; deregulate the fuel sector and
allow the free market to determine pricing and more
specifically, get rid of the unaffordable taxes and levies that
government use to cover their incompetence and corruption; and
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abandon all plans to purchase Sapref or other refining capacity.
Government has proven over and over again that it cannot run
businesses effectively, and a massive investment would be
required to bring this plant up to the proposed clean fuel
standards.
Chairperson, South Africa cannot afford to wait for another
government talk shop, indaba or task team to address the crisis
of affordability it now faces. If Minister Mantashe is not up to
the task of addressing the problems in our energy sector, he
must go! Thank you, Chair.
Mr T B MUNYAI: Point of order, Chair.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): What is your point of
order, hon member?
Mr T B MUNYAI: Sorry Chair, he has already finished and is
already off the floor. I wanted to clarify this matter, hon
Chair. The price of petrol ...
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The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Hon member, I have
not given you ... [Interjections.]
Mr T B MUNYAI: Oh, no problem!
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): ... to do that.
Mr T B MUNYAI: Thank you, hon Chair.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Thank you very much.
Hon members, may I make you aware that, as I call the hon Magaxa
to the platform, hon Mina Lesoma will be taking over. Are you
ready, hon Mina?
Ms R M M LESOMA: Yes, hon House Chair, Ntombela.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M L D Ntombela): Okay. Hon Magaxa, go
for it.
Mr K E MAGAXA: Hon House Chair, the country’s electricity demand
has grown since 1994. As the ANC-led government, we have
systematically supplied electricity to communities who were
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historically deprived of basic services under apartheid. This
means that the majority of the population suffered from energy
poverty, which deprived people of a dignified, modern and
civilised style of living.
The ANC-led government sort to transform the lives of the
majority by providing basic housing, water and electricity. This
supply of the basic services also extended itself to indigent
and poor households receiving free electricity units and water.
This was part of its campaign of creating a better life for all.
The economic growth and development in the country, since 1994
has also increased the demand for electricity. I think it is
important for the previous speaker to take that into
consideration. The country has an electricity supply shortfall
due to growth in demand and not timeously increasing generation
capacity.
The Sona 2020, addressed this matter of increasing the supply of
electricity through increasing generating electricity through
renewable energy projects.
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Accordingly, regulatory measures for the development of this
project have been promulgated. The expansion of green energy
also created opportunities for industrialisation and job
creation.
The economic thinking of that sort come from the black, green
and gold economic book of the ANC, not from some unutilised and
untested blue book. Based on our energy demands, South Africa
has traditional multiple energy carrier such as renewable, coal,
hydroelectricity and nuclear. This multiple energy carriers also
contribute to security of supply.
The largest supplier of cheap electricity in South Africa has
historically occurred through coal generation. This has served
as the backbone of the developments of mining, agriculture and
industry.
However, with the high global level of carbon emissions and
climate change, the country has international commitments to
reduce its carbon footprints.
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The ANC-led government has declared that this will occur through
a just transition. The rational for just transition is to ensure
that the country is able to effectively supply its electricity
demand to ensure the economic growth and development as well as
ensure ...
[Interjections.]
Mr N M PAULSEN: Where is your tie and your jacket?
Mr K E MAGAXA: More over the government must address energy
poverty if the majority of the people are able to participate in
the Fourth Industrial Revolution. The country has an energy mix
that is contained in the integrated resource plan. Government
seeks to expand all energy resources to ensure that the
country’s electricity demand is met and enabled at an economic
reconstruction and recovery plan which includes beneficiation,
organisation and industrialisation. This is aimed at job
creation and a reduction of triple challenges of poverty,
inequality and unemployment.
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In the case of coal generation, it is imperative that government
continue pursuing clean coal technologies and carbon capture and
storage with other countries such as China, Germany, etc among
others.
Nuclear energy generates cheap electricity without the mission
associated with coal fired plants. Natural gas is another clean
source of energy. The recent finds along the coast of the
country and in neighbouring countries is an energy source which
need to be utilised to power the economies of the region and
creating the standard opportunities for beneficiation.
It is also pleasing to note that the President in Sona 2022
highlighted the development of the KwaZulu-Natal Water Project
which included a hydroelectric plant which is clean source of
energy which will provide cheap electricity.
Expansion also include growing the renewable energy industry to
supply electricity. However, the renewable sector has well-known
limitation which it has not yet overcome. Namely power storage
capacity, power generation and lack of the economy of scale.
Experts have already estimated that only 30% of the country’s
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overall electricity demand can be supplied through renewable
energy. This means that while clean energy is the future it will
not be fully supplied through a renewable energy as the hon
Mileham is obsessed with in his recent article.
The cost of electricity in South Africa is graduated through a
transparent formula and is determined through an arm’s length
process by National Energy Regulator of SA, Nersa. Therefore,
the cost is not determined by the government. Increases are
based on input costs, assets and revenue requirements. The
process is very rigorous as Eskom’s circular recently applied
for a tariff increase of nearly 20% which Nersa declined and
reduced it to 9,61% based on its formula and calculations.
Therefore, Nersa’s approved tariff increase balanced the
interests of all stakeholders, namely government, Eskom,
business and ordinary poor residential communities. The Nersa’s
guidelines also determine municipal tariffs to improve the
current distribution model as all municipalities apply for
tariff approval.
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This is an area of concern as the level of profit which some
municipalities make from electricity and water is a grave cause
of concern especially for the poor and the working class.
This also negatively impacts on the middle strata as it erodes
disposable income and reduce savings.
It is very concerning that in some parts of the country such as
the Western Cape, the cost of electricity and water to the
people is extremely high. In addition to the high electricity
tariff, there is a supplier surcharge and connection fees that
are paid every single month as if there are monthly connections.
Therefore, the blue book is based on dubious market economics if
this is the practice. Electricity and water is for the common
good and not of something where municipalities should be seeking
super profit, as it is the case in the City of Cape Town. This
causes structural inflation in the economy and discourage
investment in the economy as basic inputs costs are high.
Take a real life example, of a renewable energy project in the
Western Cape such as Darling Wind Farm which was a project
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located here. It supplied electricity to the City of Cape Town
at 48 cents a kilolitre, while at the time the retail cost of
prepaid electricity was 129 cents per kilolitre, which is
criminal. This indicates a profit margin of over 200% the
breakeven cost for production by the Darling Wind Farm was 68
cents a kilolitre and when the company attempted to negotiate
with the DA-led City of Cape Town to pay the breakeven costs,
the city refused even though it would have still made a 100%
profit.
This real life example forced one of the earliest renewal
project in fact forced that particular company to be liquidated
due to the intransigence of the City of Cape Town.
Those who stay in the glass house must not start violence of
throwing stones. In fact, hon Chairperson, it is important that
an audit must be conducted on the level of profit which
municipalities make from electricity and water as this certainly
require regulation to prevent high earned costs. The DA in the
Western Cape especially the City of Cape Town is still charging
people those charges when there was drought, despite massive
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rains taking place on daily bases. People are still paying
triple.
Services in the Western Cape are supplied to selective parts of
the province not the majority. Increasing costs is the only way
the City of Cape Town engages in selective supply in order to
undermine and press down the poor. For they are obsessed with
inequalities. The City of Cape Town only works on high costs.
That is how they continuously create inequalities and bringing
back the apartheid system. These increases in costs translates
into high tariffs and in turn erode disposable income and places
hardship on the working class, the poor as well as the middle
strata in the city.
This neoapartheid is not a mistake, as it is designed to
increase poverty, inequality and unemployment.
In conclusion Chair, as I am sitting here, in my area, we do not
know when the dustbins were last taken by the City of Cape Town.
While people here in Cape Town are paying almost triple R1 200
per month, but still those people are still suffering the poor
services of the DA-led government. Thank you. [Time expired.]
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Mr M J CUTHBERT: Hon Chairperson, the decision by National
Energy Regulator, Nersa, to hike electricity tariffs by 9,61%,
coupled with a petrol price increase of R1,46 per litre and
diesel price increase of R1,48 per litre is a punch to the gut
which South Africans can ill afford.
Recently, the South African Local Government Association, Salga
has reported in the Citizen Newspaper has electricity prices
have increased by an astronomical 307% since 2009.
If the fact that more than one in three South Africans find
themselves unemployed wasn’t bad enough, those who are fortunate
enough to have a job have seen their income eroded by 5,1% since
December 2019, according to the BankservAfrica Take Home Pay
Index. According to the latest Household Affordability Index, by
the Pietermaritzburg Economic Justice and Dignity Group. Year-
on-year basket prices have increased by 8,9% outstripping
headline inflation. The cost of the average household food
basket increased by R354,52 from R4001,17 in February 2021 to
R4355,70 in February 2022.
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The moral of the story is each time you raise input costs,
businesses pass these costs into the consumer and South Africans
become poorer. There is little doubt that a large proportion of
the input cost passed to consumers are as a result of the
incessant energy hikes meted out to them year after year.
Instead of focusing on bringing more generating capacity on to
the grid, introducing competition into the energy market and
investing in alternative sources of energy government has set on
its hands. All the while both businesses and consumers have been
forced to purchase the electricity through the state-owned
monolith Eskom, that is of course contingent on its ability to
deliver on its commitment to supply you with electricity.
As we know, hon Chairperson, it’s been more a case of lights out
than lights on since 2007. Despite the limited reprieve offered
by government in allowing 100megawatts of self-generation during
2021 and symbolic movement towards splitting up Eskom up Eskom
into three separate entities, energy reform has never been a
priority for this government. That is where the DA enters the
ring, hon Chairperson. Having recently adopted our revitalised
energy policy at the sitting of our federal council this past
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week. We can criticise the government until we are blue in the
face but, if we fail to table alternatives then we are not
serious about the business of government.
Some of the key interventions we aim to implement when we form
part of the governing coalition are as follows. Realising a just
energy transition by investing in the reskilling and retraining
of workers for the green economy, incorporating renewable energy
into the market at a faster pace by removing restrictive caps on
the uptake of renewable energy, containing energy prices and
expanding capacity by removing Eskom from the electricity
generation business and creating a more competitive and
diversified energy market, improving energy efficiency by using
evidence-based interventions such as time-of-use tariffs, load
shifting, solar geysers and mixed forms of generation, setting a
more ambitious emissions reduction target that would more
closely align with the Paris Climate Agreement and, finally,
allowing municipalities to generate, consume and sell their own
electricity.
The fact is South Africans have been left punch-drunk by the
price hikes over the last few years and only the DA has a
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tangible path forward towards realising an energy secure future.
I thank you.
Ms P MADOKWE: Thank you very much, House Chairperson. In the
not-too-distant past, South Africa was one African country that
was repeatedly projected to be a world-class participant with
similar standards to developed countries. However, our beloved
country has sunk into chaos and darkness, both figuratively and
literally during the last decade or so.
With each passing year, it is marked by all of the traits that
characterise underdeveloped countries. Growing unemployment,
exponential job losses, high crime rates, decreasing education
standards, absurd minimum wages, an unrepentantly corrupt
leadership, and so on.
As expected, our government’s recent state of nation address,
sona, and Budget Speech show no hope of rescuing the economy or
creating jobs, as our government has dismally failed to produce
plans for economic recovery or fiscal sustainability, is hell-
bent on auctioning off our state-owned enterprises, SOEs, and is
tying us and future generations to paying debts rather than
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developing our country by raking in debt from the International
Monetary Fund, IMF, the World Bank, and other global loan
sharks. The average South African household is taking in less
money, after numerous job losses. The cost of living, especially
for basic necessities such as electricity, fuel and other forms
of energy generation has become unbearable.
The recent increases in electricity and fuel prices are a cruel
addition to poor people’s agony. Low-income households can
barely make it as is, young people are sinking into depression,
small businesses are still grappling with the consequences of
COVID-19, and the consequent increase in food prices, transport
prices and further limited access to basic goods and services
does not make things easier.
The privatisation of Eskom through the introduction of
Independent Power Producers, IPPs, instead of building internal
capacity, as projected, has had no impact on electricity
generation or access for disadvantaged households. Instead, it
has assured profit maximisation and that access to electricity
is limited to the wealthy, as a result of these price hikes.
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The EFF has long warned against giving a massive and critical
duty like guaranteeing a reliable and inexpensive electricity
supply to a clueless De Ruyter, whose entire strategy has
revolved around sucking Eskom dry and then selling it off for
next to nothing.
The government must implement an elaborate energy strategy based
on a broad energy mix that balances the use of fossil fuels and
renewable energy resources ... [Inaudible.] ...
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms R M M LESOMA): Proceed hon member. You
have muted yourself again.
Ms P MADOKWE ... Apologies for that Chairperson. The government
must implement an elaborate energy strategy based on a broad
energy mix that balances the use of fossil fuels and renewable
energy sources while taking climate change and the country’s
developmental needs into account. South Africa must not allow
itself to be bullied by Western nations which emit the most
carbon and whose development pathway was on the backbone of
fossil fuels.
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The line between environmental imperialism and environmental
protection is razor-thin, and the West’s newly discovered
environmental consciousness of convenience must not dictate how
South Africa should manage its energy generation. Communities,
on the other hand, must not be bullied into surrendering their
homes and livelihoods. The concerns raised by communities about
foreign fuel firms such as Shell, conducting seismic surveys on
our coasts are reasonable and should be taken into account,
rather than the arrogant dismissal that has dominated the
discourse.
The government’s failure to deregulate the fuel price, saying
that South Africa is not market ready for deregulation, has
resulted in repeated and significant fuel price spikes. The
petroleum industry is highly monopolised, with little to no
support for emerging local and black-owned businesses, and the
government has failed miserably to level the playing field
between wholesalers.
Notwithstanding some of the international variables beyond our
control that influence the basic fuel price, the government has
been unable to account for the highly unjustifiable 15% freight
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premium or its failure to engage freight companies on this
ridiculous amount.
If the freight premium was introduced at a time when the
Southern African coast was considered dangerous and plagued by
piracy and that is no longer the case, why has our government
allowed for the extortion of South Africans for so long?
The inclusion of Road Accident Fund, RAF, levies which have been
poorly managed over time, in the basic fuel price makes no
sense, and as a result, all local factors that affect the basic
fuel price should be reviewed, and a more equitable and rational
pricing model should be implemented. There is no justification
for such frequent fuel spikes since inland countries such as
Lesotho and Botswana, which buy fuel from us, can sell cheaper
fuel than us.
The EFF has long warned against the dangerous concoction of the
private sector’s exploitative nature and a government that has
relinquished its basic responsibilities of service delivery and
policymaking to the private sector.
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We should all be concerned about this year’s state of the
nation’s address, sona, over-praise of the private sector and
the dangerous decisions that followed, including price hikes.
Having said that, we applaud the Department of Mineral
Resources, DMR,’s commitment to safeguard PetroSA from private
sector vultures yearning for its demise, and we hope that a
similar amount of effort will be put towards exploiting
challenges faced by refineries and developing existing
facilities into a South African mega refinery through
collaboration by relevant departments. Such measures should
result in lower energy generation costs and thus ensure fairer
and more regulated prices for our people, particularly those
from low-income communities who should always be at the centre
of all government initiatives. Thank you very much, Chair.
Mr S S ZONDO: Hon House Chair, South Africa, in its current
state, has one of the worst energy policies and strategies in
the world. Our energy needs as a country are met with
inconsistent access, poor quality and harmful impacts to our
citizens. However, the lack of attention paid to the energy
crisis in South Africa has a marked impact on all citizens of
this country, especially the poor.
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In late February 2022, the National Energy Regulator of SA,
Nersa, awarded Eskom the right to increase electricity rates by
9,61%, after it had initially requested almost double that.
Already our people are struggling to pay the current electricity
rates, and for what? We regularly see load shedding, so it
cannot be for the reliability of the system. The high rate
increase also cannot be justified by Eskom’s ability to provide
universal access, as many South Africans still cannot access
electricity in their places of residence.
The truth of the matter is that our policies on energy are at
least 10 years behind the rest of the world. Therefore, we are
observing illegal electricity connections in townships and other
informal dwellings, as there is no alternative and electricity
is unaffordable. Ironically, we are meant to be progressing at a
fast rate to a just energy transition, where we start giving
local communities affordable access, stakeholdership and
sustainable power so that they may develop their communities.
In this sense, His Excellency, our President Emeritus, Prince
Mangosuthu Buthelezi’s words ring true, when he voices his
“concern with the political will, and the ability, of the ruling
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party to do everything the President has committed to do in his
state of the nation address”.
In our current situation, electricity is a real obstacle to
employment in South Africa. With the ever-escalating tariffs and
persistent load shedding, small businesses cannot afford to keep
their doors open. Small businesses require constant turnover in
order to survive and pay employees. Eskom must be held directly
accountable for its contribution to the half-million job shed
last year.
The absurdly high cost of energy has a devastating effect on
addressing youth unemployment in South Africa. The struggling
youth find it increasingly difficult to find jobs in an already
declining economy, yet their energy demand remains valid, albeit
unaffordable. Added to this are the numerous fuel price
increases, the most recent attributed to the inhumane Russian
invasion of Ukraine, further preventing the youth to go out and
actively seek jobs.
The reality of the expense when taking a taxi or any other type
of unreliable public transport provides a life-or-death choice
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of whether to seek employment or let their families starve. The
high cost of electricity tariffs also means that staying at home
and doing desktop work is now a luxury.
The increase in the overall energy, electricity and fuel costs,
will further slow down our economy and entrench the ongoing job
losses we have become used to. This will happen as a result of a
slower tourism and transport sector, as people are less inclined
to travel locally and support local businesses.
If we do not address the escalating costs of energy ... [Time
expired.]
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms R M M Lesoma): Hon member, your time
is up! In future, you must learn to time yourself. Thank you.
Afrikaans:
Dr W J BOSHOFF: Agb Huisvoorsitter, ...
English:
... the economic activity is equivalent to the use of energy. It
is not money that makes the world go round, but energy.
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Therefore, use of fossil fuels has been central to the
industrial revolution. It extended available labour beyond that
which humans and draught animals can metabolise. In short,
fossil fuels ended slavery and turned animals into pets.
As fossil fuels are concentrated and mostly buried, the cost of
energy became monetised. Pre-industrial existence was built on
evenly distributed energy in the form of food, feed and
firewood, which was free, but scarce. It was replaced by
concentrated and mostly imported energy, which was costly, but
abundant. The net effect for industrialised societies, as well
as those near the sources of energy, was highly beneficial.
South Africa was endowed with abundant coal, quite a bit of
uranium, little gas and no crude oil. Coal is ideal for
stationary applications and we built huge power stations and a
national electricity grid. We even turned coal into liquid
petroleum, which worked surprisingly well, although we never
even approached self-sufficiency. In fact, if it wasn’t for
recurring oil crisis since 1973 with ever increasing crude oil
prices, this project might never have been feasible.
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The ever weakening rand contributed to the same result. Energy
supply was ensured by refining of imported crude oil, which was
done on a scale sufficient for the local economy. The capacity
to store a large oil reserve was created. We even entered the
select club of nuclear powers, in order to become energy self-
sufficient.
In 1994, the prospect of an internationally acceptable political
dispensation held the promise of a great energy and therefore
economical future. Cheap, dependable electricity was generated
domestically, while an end to sanctions meant that crude oil
could be had at market price.
Little did one know that Eskom as well as the rand would implode
due to bad policy, driving up energy prices. In fact, the rand
fell from around R3,50 per dollar in 1994, to the current
R14,50.
Fortunately, technology is not stagnant. While the impact of
fossil fuels on the climate became known, the ability to harness
sun and wind energy at affordable prices developed. Concurrent
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is the development of batteries, as well as green hydrogen, as
storage systems for fluctuating renewable energy.
Transition from one energy dispensation to the next, especially
a just transition, is easier when the old one is in crises. In
other words, if Eskom was in excellent shape and if a strong
rand could buy lots of crude oil, and if South African
refineries did not burn down or were closed, it would have been
difficult to justify transition to an alternative still ridden
by uncertainties.
Currently, South African businesses and consumers implement
renewables not for the sake of some transition, but for
survival. The 25 giga watt of dependable coal generated
electricity left, buys time to solve problems of the transition.
While being a huge dark cloud, rising energy prices might have a
silver lining. In future, international conflict – very hot or
very cold places - and fluctuating currencies may have less
impact on communities in South Africa. Even an ANC government
might not be able to devastate the economy anymore. I thank you.
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Mr B N HERRON: Chairperson, the rising cost of electricity is
certainly stifling economic growth, but I’d like us to focus on
its impact on families and social cohesion. We can debate about
the build quality and the continuing spatial injustice, but the
democratic state has built millions of subsidised homes,
connected millions of people to the electricity grid and
provided millions of people with access to water.
These deliverables should have contributed towards reducing the
level of inequality, but the people living in these homes cannot
afford electricity nor can they afford water. No one should be
denied access to these services because they are unaffordable.
They are essential to our development as human beings and they
are essential building blocks if we are to develop a just and
inclusive society.
If this House is to have an honest debate, we need to discuss
how to achieve complete transparency in the electricity supply
chain, how to reduce the price of bulk supply and how to put an
end to the profit-making by municipalities who are literally
throttling consumers. Many municipalities are now using,
illegally in my view, prepaid electricity meters as a debt-
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collecting tool. I recently met a disabled resident in Mitchells
Plain who hasn’t had water for over a year. Her situation
mirrors that of many across our country. Her water is
disconnected but she is still charged the fixed-pipe levy and
other water charges. The City uses her prepaid electricity
payments to collect, what it says, is an unpaid water account.
And when she is able to scrape R10 together to buy electricity,
she gets 2.6 units. They take R3.10 from her R10 as a repayment
fee.
The hon Mileham and the DA must acknowledge that part of the
unaffordability problem are the huge mark-ups on electricity -
the profit-making by municipalities. While the woman in
Mitchells Plain battles to survive, the DA’s flagship
government, Cape Town, collected R8,2 billion in electricity
revenue in the first half of this financial year, for which it
paid R5,4 billion. That’s a whopping R2,8 billion profit in just
six months.
For the full financial year, the City projects revenue of
R15,7 billion and bulk purchases of R11,2 billion, with a gross
profit of R4,5 billion and a projected net profit of
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R2,6 billion. Imagine R2,6 billion in the hands of a consumer or
a small business? This leads us to the necessity of
transparency. We get to interrogate and oppose Eskom’s tariff
increases, but we cannot say the same for the National Energy
Regulator of SA applications, or Nersa applications, by
municipalities.
When I did a Protection of Personal Information application, or
Popi application, recently for the City of Cape Town tariff
application to Nersa for the current financial year, my request
was refused by the City, with the City claiming that it falls
within commercial activities. Perhaps the hon Mileham and the DA
can explain why a municipal Nersa application is regarded as
confidential and in whose interests this is. Thank you.
Dr M J CARDO: Hon Chairperson, the rising cost of fuel and
electricity is crippling this country; and, as always, it’s the
poor and unemployed who bear the brunt of surging prices.
Petrol has just gone up by R1.46 per litre. Diesel increased by
between R1.44 and R1.48 per litre. Illuminating paraffin shot up
by R1.21 per litre.
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Our economy is hamstrung by high energy costs. What does this
mean for the beleaguered citizens of our nation? Firstly, more
expensive petrol means more expensive food and transport.
For those South Africans lucky enough to have a job and earn an
income, they will spend more money on getting to the workplace.
Their rands and cents will drain away faster. But for the 7,6
million unemployed South Africans actively searching for a job,
the price hike will hit them harder. When the price of petrol
goes up, taxi fares rise. This makes it much more onerous for
workseekers to afford the taxi which takes them into town in
search of a job, and which takes them home at the end of the
day. So they abandon all hope; they stop looking for work; and
they join the ever-growing pool of 3,8 million discouraged
individuals convinced they will never find employment.
Meanwhile, higher transport costs ultimately lead to higher food
costs, which means that more and more people who are poor and
unemployed go hungry.
Secondly, more expensive paraffin means more expensive fuel for
our most vulnerable households.
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Millions of poor South Africans rely on illuminated paraffin as
their primary source of cooking fuel. The costlier it becomes,
the more difficult it is for parents to keep themselves and
their children warm and fed.
Thirdly, more expensive electricity means household budgets get
stretched to breaking point. Whereas a fixed rand value of
electricity used to last the whole month, now it’s gobbled up
within a matter of weeks or even days. Bigger electricity bills
mean there’s less money for everything else, from bare
necessities to small luxuries. Every single line item of
household expenditure has to be cut to the bone. Savings are
depleted faster. In short, sky-high energy prices are placing an
intolerable strain on the most vulnerable South Africans.
The government wrings its hands and comes up with excuses.
“COVID-19 has devastated the economy, and driven up inflation”,
says the ANC. “We are facing global headwinds”, is another well-
worn line. But most of the headwinds started blowing before the
pandemic struck. They were whipped up by the ANC’s own economic
mismanagement, policy incoherence and incompetence.
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Two things are true of the ANC. One, it produces a lot of hot
air. Two, its talk is cheap. Now, if only there was some way of
bringing these two facts into harmony and harnessing their
combined potential, then South Africa would have the largest and
cheapest energy supply in the world.
In the meantime, let’s start with the basics. Let’s break
Eskom’s monopoly and the year-on-year electricity tariff
increases inflicted on South Africans. And let’s review the fuel
pricing model, which benefits the state but punishes the most
vulnerable. If we can do those two things, we will be helping
the poor and unemployed. Thank you.
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF PUBLIC ENTERPRISES: Thank you very much
House Chair, my apologies. May I request that I take off the
video. My network here is not so good. With your permission,
House Chair.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms R M M Lesoma): Please, you may.
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF PUBLIC ENTERPRISES: Thank you very much
House Chair. We are meeting today at a time when the world is
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faced with the challenge of war between Russia and Ukraine. A
war which can end up creating many more economic hardships and
the myriad of other crisis for the entire globe if things are
not managed properly.
House Chair, we must never fear engagements, dialogue and
negotiations. It is for this reason that we must continue
calling for engagements to resolve even the most difficult of
problems facing humanity. The President in his state of the
nation address, highlighted plans in place to put Eskom in a
correct path and a proper pedestal by making the assessment of
progress when all these entities experienced paralysis against
the backdrop of the five-year Medium Term Strategic Framework.
In February 2019, the ministry of Public Enterprises announced
bold initiatives towards fundamentally restructuring Eskom and
the electricity supply industry. Where emphasis was placed on
securing a safe, reliable and affordable entity supply industry
for the country. The department published a roadmap for Eskom in
the reformed electricity supply industry in October 2019.
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This roadmap recognised that South Africa was blessed with an
abundance of energy sources which we wish to drive economic
growth, social development to benefit all its people. It also
identified the importance of electricity supply security and
pricing that is geared towards promoting competitiveness of the
South African economy and to boast our industrialisation.
For purposes of this debate, it is important for one to
underline the following key outcomes that ought to be achieved
in terms of that roadmap. Firstly, transitioning from the
existing dependants on fossil fuels to a mixed of energy sources
as the integrated resource plan of 2019 dictates. Secondly, the
restructuring of Eskom into different subsidiaries, generation,
transmission, as well as distribution. Thirdly, an intensive
focus on radical improving the current operations and
eliminating inefficiencies in generation, and the greater
requirement for transparency in the governance of both the Eskom
holdings, as well as its subsidence.
Of course, also having a rigorous approach to cutting wasteful
costs optimising revenue and resolving the debt burden, as well
as the just transition which will involve all the stakeholders.
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House Chair, Eskom plays a critical role in the South African
economy through the provision of electricity. It is therefore
imperative that its tariffs enable it to find its operations
through the revenues derived from the sales thereof.
Eskom is operating in a regulated environment and their tariffs
are determined by the National Energy Regulator of South Africa,
NERSA, through a multi-year priced termination methodology. The
Electricity Regulation Act requires NERSA to ensure that all
licences, including Eskom, recover the efficient cost of
electricity and the fair return. Cost reflective tariffs are a
prerequisite to enable Eskom to provide the economy with
reliable electricity at affordable prices. Migration towards
cost reflective tariffs as envisaged in the electricity pricing
policy has not yet happened.
The cost of service approach is a common feature of the
regulatory pricing frameworks and is employed by NERSA in other
sectors by other regulators within South Africa and by utility
regulators globally. The recent NERSA decision to approve a
tariff increase of 9,61% - I think I need to explain this
because a lot has been said around this and some of it factually
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inaccurate - for which only 3,49% tariff was against Eskom’s
application of 14,58% for the year 2022-23. The other 6,12%
increase was for the previously approved under recovery from the
regulatory clearing account mechanism. This regulatory clearing
account mechanism deals with previous revenue under over
recoveries.
The implementation of this revenue recovery account was part of
the court order with 2022-23 revenue requirement. So in reality,
the approved 3,49%, excluding the regulatory clearing account is
not only less than Consumer Price Index, CPI, of 5,9% presently,
but also less than the Independent Power Producers Procurement
Programme, IPPPP, cost increase of 5,85% in 2023.
The government appreciates and welcomes the tariffs by NERSA
because they will be balancing customer affordability whilst
supporting Eskom’s sustainability. Eskom’s constrained financial
position is having a negative impact on the entity’s ability to
execute result maintenance on their plans which results in high
unplanned capability loss factor. But in order to caution the
indigent customers and distressed companies, Eskom is
implementing free basic electricity of 50 Kilowatt-Hour subject
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to be reviewed, as well as a negotiated pricing agreement
respectively so as to support those indeed who are in serious
need.
As the ANC, we are a caring government that sympathises with the
plight of our people, and we understand that Eskom is one of the
vital tools of their livelihood. Eskom continues to connect the
previously disadvantaged households to the grid through the
electrification programme funded by the Department of Mineral
Resources and Energy. For the financial year that ended 2021, a
total of 106 669 new connections were completed. This
demonstrates the ANC-led government’s commitment to redress in
correcting the sins of the part.
Contrary to the DA that makes so much for the energy costs
through these tariffs, just visit them in their backyard, the
contrary is true as the cost they subject the poor in those
municipalities that are under their control. In fact, hon Magaxa
as well as hon ... [Inaudible.] ... make real in exposing their
hypocrisy.
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A financially sustainable Eskom is crucial for recovery of South
Africa’s economy. Further cost reflective tariffs are essential
for the entity to be able to execute its mandate which is the
provision of reliable, operating and affordable electricity. Of
course the operating model is no longer fit for purpose and thus
the turnaround plan to enable the entity to execute its mandate.
Eskom is implementing a turnaround plan which is aimed at
increasing efficiencies within the business.
The restructuring of Eskom is one of levers of the plan which
will improve transparency, agility and promote competition in
the energy sector. In December 2021 Eskom has established a
separate transmission subsidiary. A separation of generation and
distribution is anticipated on 31 December 2022. This we do, not
at the instance of the DA because we have determined so in the
roadmap as I have outlined.
The end state of this restructuring of Eskom is to have an
independent transmission system marketing operator that will be
able to buy electricity from all the producers based on the
least cost and this will increase competition and decrease the
price of electricity. Of course to improve operational
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performance, the entity is implementing a Nine-point plan
focusing on fixing Medupe as well as Kusile defects, fixing full
and partial load losses and long term outrages.
In addition, Eskom is implementing its reliability maintenance
recovery programme. The President did make mention of the need
to procure the 400 Megawatts that will be procured to enable the
entity to create space for its plans to meet the growing demand.
This will be filled by renewables and other energy sources such
as gas and nuclear. There is a need to invest on energy
infrastructure to ensure that the country has adequate supply of
energy at an affordable price.
As I conclude, the entity is recovering from the phenomenon of
state capture and through the implementation of the turnaround
plan and the restructuring process, this will go a long way to
achieve operational efficacy. The department will be monitoring
the recommendations of the commission on Eskom and will work
with various law enforcement agencies to ensure those who are
implicated are brought to justice.
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It is against the above that Eskom must be supported in its
renewal journey. We are beginning to see green suits here and
there and when this process is completed we are sure Eskom is
... [Inaudibled.] ... provide reliable electricity for the
economy. I thank you.
Mr S M JAFTA: Thank you, hon House Chairperson. May I leave my
video off please? Hon House Chairperson, as we schedule this
debate for discussions the National Energy Regulator of South
Africa approved a 9,6% tariffs increase for Eskom. We also know
that Eskom just as we were planning our programme for this
received a guarantee of R21,9 million from the Minister of
Finance in his Budget Speech. To make matters worse we have a
super Minister of Mineral Resources and Energy who is blocking
every effort to diversify our pool of electricity generation. It
was the same Minister who declared in 2015 that, I quote: “The
crisis that Eskom was a positive crisis.” It took much
convincing for this Minister to bring on board embedded
electricity. Despite the White Paper on energy published in
1998, declaring his commitment to promoting a new model of
development and a new paradigm for the development of the energy
sector the fixation on coal by the Minister is the real crisis
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we must confront. Even the central funds ... [Inaudible.] ...
itself in securing a reliable and affordable diversified energy
securing solutions for South African economy by 2030.
Hon House Chairperson, I digress the latest fuel adjustment for
March 2022, exposes the ANC’s dismissal approach to energy
security not only the adjustments set to deepen the plight of
the poor, they equally will have a significant impact on basket
of goods and services that are used to measure inflation. This
adjustment will have an inflammatory effect and will also erode
consumer purchasing power for household food consumption living
many poor South Africans forced to opt for fuel over food items.
Changes for March in petrol prices were very high.
Hon House Chair, these prices are not a fisher of a
developmental state, they are not aimed at social justice and
just order for the poor of masses. In restructuring the entire
regime of energy security we must start with the Minister.
Central energy fund and National Energy Regulator of South
Africa, Nersa, must leave politics behind and focus on their
mandate. It cannot be business as usual. I thank you, hon House
Chair.
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Ms C M PHIRI: Thank you, hon House Chair, Mme Lesoma. Allow me
also to request to switch off my video for a better reception if
you give a permission, may I do so. Thank you, House Chair. Hon
members and fellow South Africans, even this was a DA motion I
nearly brought the speech on sexual harassment in the Western
Cape provincial government by the former Chair of the DA in
Western Cape. This is a motion which needed to be brought to the
House for the debate in the near future.
However, House Chair, allow me to focus on the motion at hand.
This is something not only wrong, but profoundly shaming when a
motion sponsored by the concern of white minority comes to
dominate the national debate 28 years after the ushering in the
democracy. The underlying implication of this debate is that
high electricity tariffs are an aberration in the history of
South Africa because the ANC-led government and that the very
same government has become a milestone around the efficient
energy industry in the country. Ironically, history shows that
between 1976 and 1989 Eskom has involved large investment in
generation capacity expansion that led to large increases in
electricity’s tariffs. Moreover, between 1979 and 1982, the
oppressive apartheid regime experienced a growing electricity
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demand that led to the load shedding even when Eskom was
supplying electricity to a selected few to the exclusion of the
majority of black people.
Therefore, the misreading of experiences in the sponsored debate
does not only throw the infamous baby out of the bathwater, but
also peddles prejudice that makes understanding Eskom strength
and weaknesses particularly difficult. House Chair, we are not
surprised that the motion for this debate was sponsored by hon
Mileham. Few weeks ago he published an article arguing that
renewables energies are the future of this country regardless of
the fact that renewable does not provide a baseload energy
needed to guarantee uninterrupted electricity supply.
House Chair, excuse me for saying this, but hon Mileham’s
argument is probably the most ... [Inaudible.] ... idea in the
world. For example, Eskom mid-term report as of the 30th
September 2021, showed that the installed electricity capacity
was 46 000 megawatts excluding the planned and unplanned
capability loss factors and that coal rather than renewables was
responsible for the lines shares of the generation capacity.
Moreover, the unit cost of using coal to generate electricity
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was cheaper relatives to renewables. This does not however mean
that the cost of renewables has not dropped in the past 10
years. Thus, seen if we were to leave the supply of electricity
solely to the renewables today they will not meet the current
electricity demand on the one hand, and there would be repress
rather than enable access to energy justice for the poverty
stricken households on the other hand.
This indicate that political economy of energy in South Africa
is not something that hon Mileham and the DA with their
technical tool kits that particularly well equipped to comment
on, but I would give them the benefit of the doubt since John
Locke once remarked that human beings are roughly equal in their
mental capabilities.
House Chair, hon Mileham and the DA would argue that the market
must be free to allow renewables to show their full potential
contrary to the popular belief a free market is an illusion.
Markets are proposed by rules that determine who can participate
and regulations including common reporting standard, CRS,
regulations. For example, the Electricity Regulation Act and the
electricity pricing policy have been amended by the ANC-led
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government to allow competitive electricity market to drive
affordability through fair competition.
Secondly, Nersa’s decision to approve Eskom’s tariffs the
increase of 9,6,1% took into account the prevailing
socioeconomic condition when determining electricity tariffs.
For instance, if market forces were left alone to determine
prices amid the growing electricity demand price will be higher
because producers will be taking advantage of economies of scale
in a small market by international standard, but large in Sub-
Saharan African terms. The two examples I’ve just highlighted
indicate that the ANC-led government is neither a demonise nor a
dysfunctional institution in terms of the management of
affordable access to the electricity.
House Chair, breaking away from the DA’s ideological clock that
pretend to be an objectively economic ... [Inaudible.] ... is
the first step towards understanding the complex energy industry
in South Africa. The DA’s ideological clock that advocates for
free market suggests that Eskom’s natural monopoly is not fair,
instead we should have a free market in the energy industry
where different producers compete for customers while the ANC-
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led government supports a competitive market in the energy
industry. It rejects disputes argument that prohibits the
exploitation of coal for electricity generation and exports led
economic growth in the short term.
Coal is one of the biggest contributors to job opportunities and
economic growth and free market economies that the DA has
immersed in self and cannot assure us in advance that the job
losses in coal sector will be compensated by increase in the
renewable sector. Moreover, the country generates electricity
through other energy carriers which it will not abandoned. The
DA’s distorted ideological clock has serious implications as it
will result in the misguided use of South Africans abandoned
natural resources. This is the reason why President Ramaphosa
emphasised in 2022, state of the nation address, the importance
of empowering the aging coal power stations to save more jobs
and utilise coal as it will put a downward pressure on the high
cost of independent power producers, IPPs, in the short term.
This needs to occur on clean coal technologies and carbon
capture sulphur dioxide from flare gas must be captured and the
sulphur extracted and monetise for the manufacture of fertiliser
and dynamites for mining and therefore provide industrialisation
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opportunities and job creation opportunities rather than
pollution. The current technology captures 97% of the sulphur
dioxide.
House Chair, the motion for debate sponsored by hon Mileham
concentrates more than it is necessary on Eskom’s failure to the
neglects of the trial and error nature of the performance even
in the most successful cases. Factors other than operational and
financial performance do not account for success in hon
Mileham’s world view. Consider for the example, the Statistic
South Africa, Stats SA, has revealed that more than 90% of South
African households have access to electricity. Thanks to the
Department of Mineral Resources and Energy integrated national
electrification programme and nongrid connection.
Eskom is responsible for largest component of this connections
and the ANC-led government continues to provide targeted
subsidies of 50 kilowatts per hour electricity per household per
month for the vulnerable households to narrow the gap between
physical access and affordability access to electricity. Without
targeted subsidies the increase of electricity prices is above
the inflation rate over the past decades will increase poverty
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levels and energy poverty to the level of avoidance in the daily
lives of our citizens. Aside from targeted subsidies there are
mechanisms put in place to minimise the burden of electricity
price. For instance, Eskom and IPPs pay taxes that are used by
ANC-led government in areas of public expenditure with procure
incidents like social grant. Social grant in turn offset the
burden of high electricity prices on the poor.
Of course, the DA will argue that social grants are pertinent.
However, it is natural that what is a low wage in the eyes of
the DA is a handsome wage in the eyes of a black poor people due
to the historical injustice of the past. For yet, another
example, municipalities are allowed to procure electricity
directly from Eskom ... [Time expired.]
Mr G K Y CACHALIA: Chair, electricity used to be cheap. However,
over the course of some 13 years, the price of electricity has
increased by 460%. Last year, the electricity price went up by
15%, with another hike of 10% this year.
Now, let’s do what economists do and hold everything constant.
When you do this, you see that a 1% increase in electricity
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prices causes economic growth to drop by 0,036%. Now remember
that the economy is expected to grow by 1,9% this year.
Even the ANC should be able to understand the importance of
finding a balance between low supply and high demand, and that
the only solution is to allow more players into the industry
rather than increasing prices.
And, unless you’re thick as mince, you will realise that price
controls should never be used to rule demand because, even if
managing price causes a decrease in usage, the decrease in
electricity demand results in a decrease in economic activity.
Hon Herron and hon Minister, it’s time to remove price controls
and implement a windfall profits tax on producers to capture a
portion of any electricity price increases above a benchmark and
return the proceeds to consumers through tax reductions that
moderate the impact on the poor, small businesses and other
consumers. That’s how you do it.
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Electricity must be available and affordable. It is currently
neither and the only credible solution is to fix the baseload
issues at Eskom, and open up the playing field to competitors.
While government finally appears to be moving in this direction,
albeit at a snail’s pace, the model has to change.
Hon Phiri, the crisis is now deep into its second decade.
Loadshedding hovers like a dark ANC cloud. It is unlikely that
there would be any reprieve from steeply rising tariffs.
Surely it’s time for sense to prevail and institute the
commission of inquiry that the DA has called for – as was done
in 1983, resulting in major organisational and institutional
changes.
It’s time again, no, isn’t it, hon Phiri, instead of
regurgitating false techno-babble.
The hon Magaxa says that shortage in supply is due to increased
demand.
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Ms J TSHABALALA: No, no, no! It is hon Magaxa, and you must
breathe “Magaxa”. Spell it right!
Mr G K Y CACHALIA: Can I please get this time back?
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms R M M Lesoma): Okay.
Mr G K Y CACHALIA: The hon Magaxa says that the shortage in
supply is due to the increase in demand. [Interjections.] He
should know better. [Interjections.]
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms R M M Lesoma): No, hon members! We
must allow the member to proceed.
Mr G K Y CACHALIA: ... [Inaudible.] ... the economy, and
therefore demand, and the shortage, as we all know, is due to
successive ANC governments’ strangulation of the economy and
energy sector with the dual hands of mismanagement and theft.
Let’s get real here!
Debate concluded.
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The mini-plenary rose at 16:37.
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