Election of Chairperson; DSTI Annual Performance Plan 2024/25; with Minister and Deputy Minister

Meeting report

The Committee Secretary, Ms Shanaaz Isaacs, opened the meeting and welcomed all present. She asked Members to nominate a Chairperson for the Committee.

Ms A Hlongo (ANC) nominated Ms T Shiviti (ANC) for the position of Chairperson, and she was seconded by Mr G Skosana (ANC).

Ms Isaacs asked if Ms Shiviti accepted the nomination.

Ms Shiviti accepted the nomination.

Ms Shiviti was declared Chairperson of the Committee.

Members congratulated Ms Shiviti.

The Chairperson took over the meeting and expressed her appreciation for being afforded the opportunity to become Chairperson.

She handed over to the Department of Science, Technology and Innovation (DSTI).

Mr V Pambo (EFF) interjected and said it should be noted that he was unhappy with how the Committee was operating. He said Parliament could not run its business this way, because the Committee was informed that it would have a debate the following week and that proceedings the following day would be even worse, as the Committee had not wrapped up its business during the previous week, especially as the Committee failed to meet. He emphasised that this could not be the way the Committee conducted its business, as it was problematic and hindered the responsibility of the Committee to hold the Executive accountable. A notice of meeting could not be sent out the evening before a meeting is set to take place, as this was a disservice to the people of South Africa, and the GNU was a disruption. He asked the Chairperson to remember to adopt the agenda the next time. He also said this should be the last time the Committee became a laughingstock of Parliament where it failed to execute its duties.

The Chairperson said that she would oversee that everything was done correctly, so that the business of the Committee would run efficiently. She said that she understood that the agenda was running, and she did not foresee that it needed to be adopted. She then asked Members to move for adoption of agenda.

Dr W Boshoff (FF+) moved for the adoption of the ‘troublesome’ agenda. The motion was seconded by Mr B Madikizela (DA).

The agenda was duly adopted.

Minister’s Remarks
Dr Blade Nzimande, Minister of Science, Technology and Innovation, warmly congratulated the Chairperson on her election and wished her well. He said that he was confident that she would lead the Committee in the manner that it should be led, and he expressed his relief that the Committee was now properly constituted for presentations to be made.

Minister Nzimande made brief introductory remarks. He said that he was privileged to address the Committee. He congratulated all Members on their election and being assigned to the Committee. Minister Nzimande pledged to work with the Committee in a constructive and collegial manner. He said the Committee was critical in ensuring the Executive was held accountable, and it played a critical role in shaping the work done by various Departments and organs of state. He attested that the Department benefited immensely from the feedback of the Committee and that he had a healthy and productive relationship with the Department. This was critical for the work of government and for the duration of the term. He wished to treat his relationship with the Department as a strategic priority and was open to suggestions and recommendations on how to work better while respecting the separation of powers. He said he, along with the Department, was prepared to accept constructive criticism, and he looked forward to robust engagement with the Committee and setting a high standard for thorough engagement in a respectful and collegial manner.

He provided a brief background on the Department’s White Paper and its decadal plan. The Department would continue its broad strategic focus on ensuring that it used Science, Technology and Innovation to address the country's challenges such as poverty, unemployment amongst the youth and the need to develop critical scientific skills and strengthen relations with countries on the African continent and other regions of the world – with a strong focus on south-to-south relations. At the heart of the Department’s agenda was the transformation of the sector on a class and gender basis, so that it increasingly reflected the demographics of South Africa. The priority question of the Science and Innovation system needed to reflect the principal challenges facing the country and the continent. This meant that the Department would continue to build the necessary science infrastructure and continue to support the training and development of young, black, female scientists and researchers. The Department would also continue investing in key development areas such as the modernisation of the economy, and this would include mining, agriculture, manufacturing, health innovation and continued investment in new growth areas such as the secular economy. Investing in the secular economy meant there were so many things it could put back into circulation to grow the economy. He emphasised that the decadal plan was strong on the need to develop a secular economy.

He said that some people of his generation may remember that they used to collect old bottles and sell them to recyclers for recirculation and production of new products. The Department was focused on achieving the country’s objectives and positioning it as a leader in Science, Technology and Innovation. Underpinning the Department’s work was to create an interest in Science amongst the broader society so that the role of Science was understood by all. To this extent, the Department would promote Science Journalism which was seriously weak in the country, and this would make Science and its outputs accessible to all in the country. He stressed that Science literacy was very important. There was also a commitment to address a fear of Science, which was widely prevalent amongst black youth. This was partly derived from the negative influence of Hendrik Verwoerd and the racism of denying scientific education to black students after Apartheid. The Department would develop strong scientific programmes in communities and schools. He referred to himself as an example and said that he took Mathematics and Science as subjects in school but feared them. There were many notions that Science was difficult and preserved for a select few, but this was not true.

The Department would build on the success in the areas of achievement during the sixth Administration, and these successes would be used to enhance the performance of the National System of Innovation to become more agile and responsive. The Department was open to accepting oversight visits from the Committee during the process of its work and throughout the term to witness its excellent science infrastructure and as part of the Committee’s own outreach programmes. He briefly outlined the topics of the presentation and handed over to the Acting Director-General (DG) of the DSTI, Mr Daan Du Toit.

The Acting DG (ADG) congratulated the Chairperson and the Committee on their appointments.

Briefing by the Department of Science, Technology and Innovation (DSTI) on the 2024/24 Annual Performance Plan
Mr Du Toit presented to the Committee on the DSTI’s mandate, its vision and mission, values, the nature of the Department’s work, its programmes, the policy context of the DSTI’s operations, performance and selected flagship initiatives of the Department, the medium-term expenditure allocation, amongst other focuses.

The Chief Financial Officer (CFO) presented to the Committee on the DSTI’s Budget.

He said that the Department’s budget was previously R10.563 billion in the 2023/24 financial year, which declined to R9.468 billion in the 2024/25 financial year. There were significant financial budget cuts and R300 million was cut from the budget. About R3 billion was cut from the MTEF, and over R1 billion was cut from the current financial year. The current allocated budget is R359 million and R375 million for the next financial year.

[Refer to presentation for details]

Discussion
Mr L Mkutu (ANC) welcomed the Department’s presentation and said that he had full confidence in the Department’s capabilities to steer things in a productive direction. He asked for clarity on the Department’s coordination as he felt the Department had an overarching role that cut across many Departments such as the Department of Basic Education.

He said that innovation was a key driver of economic growth and development and issues related to the Economic Cluster. He also said he heard discussions on disciplining macro-economic policy around industrial policy. Industrial policy should drive public spending. On the one hand, the National Treasury speaks about fiscal consolidation, austerity measures and reducing public spending. He said he got the sense that plans were around ensuring innovation and that this was taken to the grassroots. But if this work was not backed up by the finances, what was actually being done? He was battling to understand the extent of continuation in relation to education, particularly basic education.

He said the sector remained highly racialised and lacked transformation, because of the level of infrastructure and the legacy of Apartheid’s special planning which still persists in the country. He invited the Department to visit the Eastern Cape and look at the infrastructure of schools.

He asked what the link was with what the Department was trying to do to transform the sector and give it a much more democratic demographic as well as with Basic and Higher Education. There were still funding challenges with Masters and PhD students which could be attributed to racialised academia. He asked where the coordination was in the Departments inputs to achieve particular outputs.

He wanted to acclimatise with the decadal plan which was a 10-year plan and the White Paper in general. A discussion needed to be had on patents, because this was where transformation and innovation could take place. He asked about the legal framework of having royalties in patents? The government could not continue to finance big ideas, but at the level of reward, the risks were socialised and the rewards privatised. How could we finance innovation and socialise the rewards to spread the rewards for greater development in society? He asked about research and development, as he could not imagine that a developing economy which was integrated into the global economy could be run without investment in research and development. In attempting to innovate, how is this linked with the industrial strategy and policy of government? He stressed that he did not get the sense that there was any coordination within the Department. “We need to accept at a practical level that there needs to be a paradigm shift into our commitment to transformation and practically understanding how our society is organised, as well as the historical inheritance which we have in this country and this must be put into practice”, he added.

Dr Boshoff congratulated the Chairperson on her election, and asked about the transfer of other scientific bodies to the Department which was currently under the Department of Land Reform and Rural Development. He asked about the Hydrogen Project in the Braamvlei area in the Northern Cape. He wanted to know whether the Department was involved in this and if there were any hydrogen projects in the country where the Department had no involvement at all. He observed that the SETAs, which were funded with one percent of the national wage bill, received R16- to R18 billion a year and. He also wanted to know what the funds were used for, given that the DSTI worked for less than R10 billion. If, by some miracle, the budget was doubled, would the Department have the capacity to do significantly more?

Mr B Madikizela (DA) congratulated the Chairperson on her election as Chair and welcomed the Department’s presentation. He asked whether there would be any financial impact on the budget given the separation of the DSTI and the Department of Higher Education. When would the Department start operating separately from the Department of Higher Education?

On the landscape for the 2020-2025 Strategic Plan, Mr Madikizela said that this was a true reflection of the situation, as on one spectrum, there was massive unemployment and on the other, there were massive opportunities for students doing Mathematics and Science, but the opportunities were not being utilised – as there were very few students eligible for this. How do we deal with issues relating to transformation and access to technology, particularly concerning black students in rural areas? In March 2023, a website called Africa.com released a report that stated only 22% of black students had access to computers, such as in the North West and Limpopo. How can we close this gap, because even though there is high level intervention, intervention on a lower level such as from the primary schooling level would be beneficial to encourage students to take Science as a subject and have a massive pool on the upper end? How can we properly engage with the Departments of Basic Education and Higher Education on this? ‘Conflicting interests vs the challenges’ requires innovation. “For example, climate change was a reality and circumstances almost force us to look at innovation to resolve these issues, but we still have to consider those who want us to do things a certain way because of vested interests in how things are”, he added. Was it not advisable for the Department to explore private sector partners as opposed to only focusing on the public purse and what was the scope of this?

Mr Skosana congratulated the Chair on her new position and appreciated the Department's presentation. He said he heard the Minister referring to issues on class, race and gender: while this was important for the Department to consider, he wanted the Department to highlight some of the achievements of the past five years relating to transformation in the sector.

On the NDP focus areas that have been categorised according to Phases, how far has the Department come in terms of achieving the NDP outcomes of Phases One and Two? On outcome five, Knowledge Utilisation for Inclusive Development, which refers to grassroots innovation programmes, mLabs and introducing high-impact interventions which address income opportunities, he asked the Department to elaborate on grassroots innovation programmes and whether there were any positive outcomes. Addressing his question to the CFO, he asked about the audit opinions and governance issues as the presentation only showed figures. He said the Department needed to be supported by the Committee to advocate for a larger budget as it was a very important Department that had a major role to play in the economy and its role affected various Departments such as the Departments of Agriculture, Mining and Health.

Mr Pambo recounted that, in 2019, President Cyril Ramaphosa had announced that he would combine the two Ministries of Higher Education and that of Science, Technology and Innovation to avoid having a bloated Cabinet, but also to cut down on wasteful expenditure. He agreed with a previous Member’s comments that a budget was conceptualised when the two Ministries were together. He wanted to know how this would affect the budget. What are the implications of this?

On budget cuts and austerity measures, when we are subjected to this, the Department must explain the consequences of this. So much has already been cut from the budget, and we cannot expect the same functionality and output from a different budget. A different budget means a bigger or smaller output depending on the amount of the budget. The Committee needed to know about the KPIs, as it was not a budget until the Committee was informed about its achievements. What is the Committee reviewing and assessing? This would assist the Committee in writing to the Minister to increase the Department’s budget. He asked about the vacancies that were not yet filled, which could enhance the Department’s work. How much funds were needed to fill these vacancies, and how would the organogram be reorganised?

Science literacy was a huge issue. For example, half of the people in the room would struggle if they wrote a test on science literacy. These were the challenges of rushing the budget as opposed to quickly going through it for compliance. There is a need to take stock and consider why the Department was failing to achieve certain outcomes. The Department must explain how it will achieve science literacy and what steps have already been taken. If the Department agrees that black people do not have access to science the way white people do, what has the Department done to make it more accessible? He said the Department should be a very pointed Department. He emphasised Department as he did not want to be confused with the GNU. He said that the Department should be pointed in explaining the initiatives it has embarked on. The Department must come up with a standard for science literacy. “Let us not philosophise about this, as it is about formulas. Let us establish a standard way of taking stock of what the Department is doing.” He asked what other challenges the Department was facing so the Committee could fully understand what was happening.

Ms Hlongo congratulated the Chair on her appointment. She emphasised that the Department of Basic Education said the Mathematics and Science schools were rejected by parents in rural areas as they said their children were failing. The previous Committee recommended science engagement and community outreach. How far was the Department in achieving this? She said that this was a serious issue as parents even protested about this. There was a serious need to work closely with the Department of Basic Education on Science. She asked what funding opportunities were available to support women and youth-led initiatives and projects in rural areas. She agreed with Mr Pambo’s comments and said those in the deep rural areas of Bushbuckridge would not understand science as a learner in Cape Town would. She proposed a Committee orientation to see the Department’s entities.
 
Mr I Menyatso (MK) congratulated the Chairperson on her appointment. He thought a national dialogue on Science, Technology and Innovation was necessary. He said that some members of society may not be taking the Department seriously. China is China today because of Departments like Science, Technology and Innovation, and the same applies to America. The USA made a lot of money which was generated from technology, so there was no reason why the budget of such an important Department should be reduced or even left the same. Leaving the budget the same was similar to reducing it, given inflation. He agreed that the Committee should assist the Department to receive more funding. He pointed out that Mpumalanga could be facing serious funding challenges as it was noted that some of the mines should be closed, given the effect of the mines on the environment. He asked about the Sulphur content of the mines and whether the Department was looking into this.

On having a national dialogue, science, technology and innovation needs to be sold to ordinary people. He was aware that some countries had directorates which focused on Marketing, Science, Technology and Innovation with the public. People in the townships should understand science, technology, and innovation and know its importance. Elon Musk’s father was an Engineer, and he saw his father as a mentor and took this seriously. There was a serious challenge with education, as the Department needed to be assisted in opening some of the closed colleges, and perhaps this could focus on Science, Technology and Innovation and some Teachers could be trained and re-trained to go to schools and produce the type of students that would build the economy of the future. “We would like to encourage students to take subjects like Science and Technology, but some schools cannot produce good Science and Technology students. He said that entrepreneurship was also critical, and the Department needed to consider encouraging young people to create employment through technology.

The Chairperson said that it would be ideal to wake up to Technology and Innovation Centre’s that were using the country’s mineral resources to create new technologies. It would also be ideal to wake up to science labs in rural areas where learners would practice science and be assisted in learning effectively. “We run the risk of having competent Science learners without the necessary equipment.”

Responses by the DSTI
ADG Du Toit said that he would reflect on Members' questions with high level responses, and some of the other Departmental officials would also address some questions.

ADG Du Toit said that coordination was at the heart of things. The decadal plan had governance mechanisms to enable coordination. There was now an Inter-ministerial Committee on Science, Technology and Innovation.

He agreed that transformation had to start with the Department of Basic Education. As the work of the Department progressed, it spoke more about the work of the National Intellectual Property Management Office (NIPMO), which formed part of the Department. He said good knowledge was generated in the country, but was sometimes not protected. There were offices at different universities which were designed to exploit the IP generated for the benefit of all South Africans.

He agreed that historical narratives were important to consider in transformation and that this reflected reality. Moving bodies from one Department to another was a decision to be made on an Executive level. The Department had a really close relationship with the Agricultural Research Council and would focus on increasing its interface and collaboration with the other science councils. For example, the South African Medical Research Council (SAMRC) has many programmes funded by the Department.

He said he could not say boldly that the Department was involved in every single hydrogen project in the country, but it did play a central role.
 
He said that it was one thing to ask for more money as a Department, but being able to utilise this was a different question, and the Department had the capacity to do much more.

He said it was always one Ministry, but the Department was also separate from the Department of Higher Education. There were always two DGs, two CFOs and two budgets. There were separate legal and financial structures. Irrespective of the fact that the Department now reported to two different Ministers, the collaboration between the Department of Higher Education and the DSTI would continue.

He said the Department hosted a National Science Week and supported science centres. The private sector partnerships were critical for the Department to increase investment. The Department also has an emerging relationship with different business structures and the Black Business Council to focus on enabling partnerships.

He said that a lot had been achieved in transformation, but a lot more needed to be done. There were many successes, but he was aware that a lot more needed to be done. He said the Department held the National Science and Technology Collation Awards Programme the previous week. In future, the Committee would be invited to attend the awards programme.
 
On the NDP focus areas, the hydrogen economy has three phases. In the first phase, it was about building the RND capability. The Department funded research as it had to build a new knowledge workforce within the hydrogen economy space. The second phase considered how to translate this into different sectors of competence such as fuel cell development. The third phase is within the economic deployment phase and through Science, Technology and Innovation, the Department considered how to make South Africa a world-leading exporter of green hydrogen-related products.
 
He acknowledged that the Department should have included in its presentation the effects of the budget cut and how it would affect the delivery of the Department’s work. He said the APP had to be revised as a consequence of the budget cuts. The Department always tries to do the maximum that it can with the budget it has, but if the resources are limited, it cannot do all that it needs to. The Department has a compensation ceiling in its budget which impacts its delivery.

He agreed that the country needed to host a National Dialogue on Science, Technology and Innovation. For example, speaking on the impact of artificial intelligence – it has to be a dialogue between the entire country with organised labour. He said that he would venture to call it National Consensus on Science, Technology and Innovation. He agreed that the progress made in countries like China was due to a concerted effort and focus on certain investment areas. One of the cross-cutting areas of the Department’s work was the Just Transition. For example, the transition in Mpumalanga had to involve the Just Transition Framework. “Green technology must be used, and we have to make an impact on employment and sustainable livelihoods.”
 
He said that mineral resources had to be beneficiated, and this was a key strategic priority of the Department. Platinum is an easy example, but it has crossed the minerals value chain. The Department works with MINTEC and others, such as on how to use gold or gold particles with truck delivery.

The CFO said the Department has had an unqualified audit outcome for the past four years. The audit for the current year was ongoing, and the Department hoped it would remain the same.

Mr Imraan Patel, DDG: Research Development and Support (programme four), said that there were many areas which required a full briefing, and the Department would take the opportunity to present to the Committee on this again in future. Mr Patel provided a high-level response to the Committee. He said that the Department did a lot of work on public awareness, but used terminology called science engagement. There was a well-developed strategy around science engagement. This was a two-way dialogue, and the Department could learn as much about this from communities as communities could from the Department. The National Science Week takes place during the first week of August but will be postponed this year due to calendar issues, and this activity reaches a large number of people. The Department also has Science Centers with a limited budget, and its approach is to accredit site centres and not necessarily establish them as this would create challenges related to opportunities and management. Most of the big science centers such as in Cofimvaba receive science support from the Department. The Department hopes to work with the private sector and other partners. The Department has identified what people are aware of in terms of Science and has done a world-class study under the HSRC to assess people’s understanding of key science issues. The report has been processed, and this would help the Department be targeted around key areas. A few years ago, the Department started a Science Journalism Programme and it hopes to pick up on this again. The big innovation of this programme was the need to support people in doing Science Journalism in different languages in South Africa. This was neglected and did not help with having competent people in different languages.

He said that the Department had the ability to take on more funding, and in what he was responsible for, some of the big impacts of the budget cuts were related to a change in funding formula and full cost to students. Over time, the performance information showed that the Department was forced to support fewer and fewer students at a Masters and PhD level. There is a pipeline, and this information was shared with the previous Committee, and the Department could absorb double its current funding. The Department has secured funding for the Presidential PhD programme and was looking at various models to raise funding. Another area in which to absorb funding was the Research Infrastructure Portfolio. There was a pipeline of projects to take things forward. He agreed that there were challenges in the Basic Education space. He had told many committees that talks were about chalk and cheese when it came to funding, that the DSI funding was R10 billion, and that the Basic Education budget was closer to R250 billion. The level of deprivation in terms of Science facilities has been so much that the Department has not been able to reach these areas. Provinces became involved in the Basic Education space, so the quality of spending needed to go up in that space. He said that there was a lot more to address on what the Department did in the Basic Education space. This could be presented to the Committee at a later stage.

ADG Du Toit said the Department would keep its responses short in the interest of time, but was at the disposal of the Committee should it need further clarification on issues.

Dr Rakeshnie Ramoutar-Prieschl, Acting DDG: Technology Innovation (Programme two), said that Brandvlei was part of the projects the Department was involved in. It was difficult to coordinate the entire sector, but the Northern Cape, Western Cape and Eastern Cape have signed an MOU supporting the development of green energy solutions which was largely focused on green hydrogen. This was quite a significant stride, and these provinces have formed part of the Department’s delegations to Europe and Japan to share some of their engagements on what has been happening and how things have unfolded, as part of a benchmarking exercise.

Coordinating around the hydrogen society road map was on the cards. In December last year, the Department received approval to establish an inter-ministerial Committee so that each Department is held accountable for leading different aspects of decarbonising the economy. The Department hopes to develop an implementation plan around this in the current year. Hydrogen is highly controversial and requires science literacy and awareness which would be highly prioritised in the implementation plan. Some of this technology has been used at a military hospital in Pretoria, and the Department has deployed this at Masia Village in Limpopo, and a number of others such as the SETAs as well as for training graduates to become part of the green economy.

The Department works with the TIER Innovation fund and recently worked with the World Bank on developing and establishing a pre-seed fund needed to help build business cases and support the business plan, tapping into finances and engaging with different financial institutions as they upscale the technology. On the tech entrepreneurial front, Dr Ramoutar-Prieschl said that the Tech Transfer Office provides support which is in turn supported by NIPMO. Carbon Capture and utilisation technology that the Department is currently capturing and supporting has been done in a cement factory, and some of the flu gas has been captured. This includes carbon monoxide and sulfuric acid, which was captured and repurposed into fertiliser salts which benefits the farmers and community and has a spin-off effect of building a new industry. This also extends the lifespan of the coal-fired power stations. The Department has tested the technology at Calvin power stations and is now engaging in financing a pilot scale initiative at Groenvlei. Expanding this at other sites is also being discussed.

Dr Mmboneni Muofhe, DDG: Socio Economic Innovation Partnerships (Programme five), said that two huge initiatives for coordination were on the go. One of the initiatives related to budget coordination, and the Department was now on the second phase of the decadal plan. The Department was in the process of identifying a few government departments that it found to be central and more involved in the aspects of the DTSI, such as the Departments of Agriculture and Health. The Department has considered the APPs of these Departments to ensure the aspects of innovation and funding have been indicated. The Department will analyse what has been achieved and what sort of investments have been made including during the various budget debates currently taking place. This was ongoing, and there were positive signs. The National Policy Data Observatory was another aspect of coordination. Considering the aspect of building a capable state for government to take evidence-based decisions, there is a need to be able to use the data that is generated. “As we sit here, data is being generated”. On grassroots innovation and the lack of infrastructure, a number of programmes are running and one of them considers how existing infrastructure such as technology stations, which are located in technikons, can be used. The infrastructure ranges from agro-processing, textiles, chemical manufacturing and 3D printing. For example, if one manufactures detergents and needs to test their quality, these stations would be helpful.

On issues around patents and the socialising of risk and privatisation of rewards: the Department started programmes to support grassroots innovation and has asked institutions to open access to their IP portfolios which are generated through state-funded money, so that grassroots innovators can use this to benefit society and create employment. On the impact of climate change, the programme on the circular economy has anchored all the work dealing with aspects of climate change, and this is approached from the nexus point of view. There is food security, water and energy. He said that the mining aspect of climate change also looks at what aspects of modernisation need to be used, and the secular economy looks at how they can ensure there are programmes where the waste coming from the other sector can be used as input. At the start of April, the Department launched another programme in partnership with SAPI, where the waste that comes with the processing of timber was used to manufacture ethanol – a product that can be commercialised. This would have caused problems in rivers. The Department has also received calls from industries wanting to join in on this.

Dr Muofhe explained that mLabs deals with issues related to grassroots innovation, reaches out, and ensures spatial transformation. Mobile application labs are about creating spaces for young people where they can be creative. The Department also provides them with funding, and some have agro-processing programmes. Since the Department has seen the positive impact of this, it has made this available on a mass scale in rural areas and townships. He referred to the iLabs in Mitchells Plain as an example.

The Department had a number of partnerships with the private sector and international organisations. The UNDP has also co-invested in the Department’s programmes. These were just some initiatives the Department embarked on to grow and attract additional funding. He said it was announced in the Budget Vote of 2023/24 that this would continue for the next ten years. The Department was excited about this as it enabled investment from the private sector and allowed for activities to take place on a much bigger scale.
 
The Chairperson said that some of the information on programmes should be sent to the Committee as opposed to the Department taking the Committee through every programme it dealt with.

Ms Gugulethu Zwane, DDG: Institutional Planning and Support, said that the full staff complement of the DSTI staff was 495, but there were 106 vacancies – 57 were critical and 59 unfunded. Currently, the Department could only afford to fill six of the 57 critical vacancies with R6.6 million available. The Department has recently undergone organisational realignment which would address the skills required to deliver on the decadal plan. This was currently with the Department of Public Service and Administration (DPSA) for approval. Once the Department was done with this, it would do a skills match and see how it could fill certain positions.

Ms Nomalungelo Gina, Deputy Minister of Science, Technology and Innovation, said it would be better for the Department to share the programmes it was involved in with the Committee. She agreed with Ms Hlongo’s suggestions to have orientation sessions on the programmes as all this information could not be fit into one session with the Committee. She said that the Department could not exist as a silo and work in isolation, as its work was embedded in other Departments. On transferring scientific research bodies to join the Department, she said that there were so many research bodies that could ideally be housed under one Department, so more could be done. Perhaps this could also address funding challenges, but the Department would continue to have discussions on this with the Committee. She said that the Department held an engagement with the National Science and Technology Forum the previous week, and it was so impressive to see young learners who were funded by the Department who would be going abroad. There were pockets of excellence where the Department tried to ensure that Science was demystified. She assured the Committee that much more would be done.

Minister Nzimande said that colleagues were knowledgeable about the work of the Department and this brought him comfort, as there was a point of departure to engage creatively. He said that the Department was small, but did very big things and the planning by the Committee would be crucial. A book on South African innovations was usually given to people. He suggested that this be shared with the Committee. He said that many people did not know that the creepy crawly that was cleaning swimming pools all around the world was a South African invention, along with a number of other inventions. The Women in Science Awards would take place in August.

The Chairperson thanked all present in the meeting.

The meeting was adjourned.