Hansard: NCOP: Unrevised hansard

House: National Council of Provinces

Date of Meeting: 11 May 2016

Summary

No summary available.

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Minutes

UNREVISED HANSARD 
WEDNESDAY, 11 MAY 2016
PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES

 

The Council met at 14:05.

 

The Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

 

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS – see col 000.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon members, I have been informed that the Whippery has agreed that there will not be any Notices of Motions or Motions without Notice.

 

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF SELECT COMMITTEE ON LAND AND MINERAL RESOURCES - INVITATION BY THE MINISTER OF FINANCE TO NOMINATE CANDIDATES TO BE CONSIDERED FOR APPOINTMENT ON THE LAND BANK BOARD

 

Mr O J SEFAKO: Hon Chairperson, hon members, hon Minister and Deputy Ministers, DGs, our distinguished quests present here, happy belated Mother‘s Day to all the mothers and to the Chairperson. The committee reports on the activities of the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources: The invitation by the Minister of Finance to nominate candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank Board, dated March 2016.

 

The select committee received the invitation from the Minister of Finance to nominate candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank Board, but the closing date for submission of candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank Board was the week of 13 to 17 April 2015, the same week all delegates of the NCOP were engaged with the Taking Parliament to the People programme in the Eden District Municipality, Oudtshoorn, Western Cape. In the absence of an extension of the deadline for the committee to deal with the Minister‘s request, the committee was unable to conclude the matter placed before it.

 

Hon Chair, there are two. With your indulgence, can I continue to the second one?

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Yes.

 

Mr O J SEFAKO: The invitation by the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries to nominate candidates to serve on the National Agricultural Marketing Council, dated 15 March 2016.

The select committee, having received the invitation from the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries to nominate candidates to serve as members of the National Agricultural Marketing Council, in accordance with section 4(4)(a) of the Marketing of Agricultural Products Act, received one nomination for the specified position. The nomination was forwarded to the office of the Chairperson of the NCOP.

 

Debate concluded.

 

Question put: That the Report be adopted.

 

IN FAVOUR: Eastern Cape, Free State, Gauteng, KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo, Mpumalanga, Northern Cape, North West, Western Cape.

 

Report accordingly adopted in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

 

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF SELECT COMMITTEE ON LAND AND MINERAL RESOURCES - INVITATION BY THE MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES TO NOMINATE CANDIDATES TO SERVE ON THE NATIONAL AGRICULTURAL MARKETING COUNCIL

 

Declaration of vote:

Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Chair, the Western Cape wants to place before the Council that in the deliberations in the in the previous committee meeting, not this week, the week before that, we referred back the one name that was nominated because we felt that the name did not meet the criteria. After that, we did not deliberate on that specific action or the names that were proposed. So, therefore, the Western Cape would not support that decision. Thank you.

 

Debate concluded.

 

Declaration of vote made on behalf of the Western Cape.

 

Question put: That the Report be adopted.

 

IN FAVOUR: Eastern Cape, Free State, Gauteng, KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo, Mpumalanga, Northern Cape, North West, Western Cape.

 

Report accordingly adopted in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

 

APPROPRIATION BILL

 

(Policy debate)

Vote No 18 - Rural Development and Land Reform South Africa:

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Hon Chair, hon members. Hon Chair, the National Development Plan views agriculture as critical to employment and food security. It is estimated that agriculture would potentially create a million jobs by 2030. Vision 2030 of the National Development Plan calls for an inclusive rural economy wherein; rural communities should have greater opportunities to participate fully in the economic, social and political life of the country. People should have access to high quality basic services that enable them to be well nourished, healthy and increasingly skilled. Rural economies will be supported by agriculture, and where possible, by mining, tourism, agro processing achieved through successful land reform, job creation and poverty alleviation.

 

The Vision 2030 speaks of the inclusivity and integration of rural areas, through successful land reform, job creation and poverty alleviation, and places agriculture as the driving force behind this vision. Agri-Parks have been identified as one of the key drivers in revitalizing the agriculture and agro-processing value chain. During the course of last year, the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform, started planning and coordinating the implementation of this programme in all 44 districts of the country. This is in line with the pronouncements by His Excellency, the President, during his state of the nation address in 2015, when he pronounced on the Nine-Point Plan to ignite growth and create jobs. One of these catalysts was identified as the revitalization of agriculture and agricultural processing chain.

 

In this regard, the President stated that:

Agriculture is a catalyst for growth and food security. We are working with the private sector to develop an Agricultural Policy Action Plan, APAP, which will bring one million hectares of underutilized land into full production over the next three years. Among key interventions this year, we will promote the establishment Agri-Parks or co-operatives and clusters in each of the 27 poorest district municipalities to transform rural economies. An initial funding of R2 billion has been made available for the Agri-Parks initiative.

That is what the President said. Of course, all 44 districts have since been included rather than the 27 priority districts. Hon Chair, in its seminal document, the road to South African freedom in 1962, the SACP had the following to say with regard to rural areas in South Africa, what it refers to as reserves and then became the former Bantustans in South Africa, it says the following:

The African Reserves show the complete lack of industry, communications, and transport and power resources. Non white South Africa is the colony of White South Africa itself. Real power is in the hands of monopolists who own and control the mines, the banks and finance houses, and most of the farms and major industries. These monopolists are the real power in South Africa. The special type of colonialism in South Africa serves in the first place, their interests.

 

This is what it says; it‘s referring to the area we are concerned about. Where generally the 44 district of the country were allocated. It is this colonialism of a special type legacy which must be fundamentally and radically transformed. Part of what we have to do to reverse this situation is to craft a rural socio economic infrastructure master plan around the district Agri-Parks. The strategy is the Rural Economy Transformation Model, this work has begun. Hon Chair, this is a very important programme for both Agriculture and Rural Development. Our view is that, as we have started this programme and we implement it successfully, it has a potential to create jobs and turn around the economy of our country. We have started in essence in this working together with other departments; it‘s not just a departmental programme.

In his previous state of the nation address, in February 2015, His Excellency, President Zuma, introduced a Nine-Point Plan to boost economic growth and create jobs. Due to the transversal nature of rural development, almost all these Nine-Points Plans link up with the work of the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform, particularly, the one on revitalising agriculture and the

agro-processing value chain. Below, we report on progress on the implementation of the President‘s pronouncements, just briefly to say that. With regards to Agri-Parks, 44 district municipalities identified as the Agri-Hubs. Site analyses have been completed; and, governance structures established. 36 district business plans completed, a national Agri-Parks advisory has been chaired by Mr Zakes Tholo with the Deputy Chair as Bridgett Mabandla, and both of them are no strangers in government.

The district Agri-Parks management councils have been established across all 44 district of the country. Construction commenced in seven sites and a project management unit established at national level and in four provinces. Its regulation of land holding as second point with regard to what the President has said about our department, the Bill, which is the regulation of land holding skill, limits the extent of hectors owned by individuals and entities and terminates ownership by foreign nationals. The Bill should be submitted to Parliament during June this year, next month the Bill should come to Parliament. We have received the certification from the Chief

State Law Advisor and the socio economic impact assessment has been completed. The Bill will come to Parliament now; we will foresee that within this coming cycle, kicking in from tomorrow. It will go to Cabinet and for public comment. We hope that hon members will participate in that process.

 

The reopening of land claims; 143 720 claims have been lodged by 31 March 2016 with 27 696 lodged through the mobile offices. With regard to the 50/50 the President mentioned that we will pilot 50 projects with regard to the 50/50 Policy Framework. This is basically strengthening the relative rights of people working in the land. As we speak now, we have 10 transactions done. This is a very important innovative project because in this case, the 50/50 really means that 50% of a new company created by commercial farmers and employees, coming together and constituting creating these new companies that will then take responsibility to run the farm. We buy the land, in some instances we buy 100% of the land and create a new company owned by both of them as equals. So, we have already gone through 10 of those running and we have got more than 30 that have come forward and are being processed at the moment. By the end of this term, there will be more than that 50 that the President had said will buy. We already have 100 of those who have expressed interest in participating in this programme.

Some highlights on departmental performance against the budget policy speech of 2015-16 are included in an appendix. We have provided an appendix because we think it is important for us to account to the House, hon Chair. As far as the challenges are concerned, we have mainly three challenges; firstly it is the institutional challenges, we know CPAs, trusts, lots of conflict out there. The amendment to the CPA act will try to speak to this challenge.

 

 

Secondly, limited strategic capacity in the department, this is really a challenge that we are trying to deal with and it is taking a bit of time, it needs patience on our part. We have audited the skills that we have in the department to see whether they are relocated or deployed where they should be. In some instances, you would have somebody who is skilled in engineering but working in administration. We are looking at all those adjustments and we think that it is going to assist us. At the beginning of last term, Tau from treasury assisted us in developing a model, organogram for the department. We are revisiting that, we think that it will assist us a great deal.

 

Lastly, we have instances of fraud, corruption and maladministration. We have set up a panel of lawyers and they are looking at all those cases that are before them and some of them are already under the disciplinary action by the department. So we were

experiencing those but probably as time goes on we will be reporting to the hon House. As far as programmes that are prioritised are concerned, I think it‘s very important for the hon members to know that we prioritise women, youth, agricultural graduates, military veterans, people with disabilities, farm dwellers and labour tenants. In this regard we have budgeted R140 million for this year and the 50/50 I have already spoken for we have budgeted R500 million for this year.

 

 

But this one creative innovative, One Household, One Hectare, in this instance we think that it‘s going to assist us solve the institutional problems we are referring to but also to use communal and state land that is vacant so that we can place households there so that they can start producing on the land self sufficient and self employed. We have already piloted this; it is a very exciting project. In Mpumalanga, we have already piloted with 41 households on state land and there are working on the land now and producing for themselves. So the Agri-Parks are going to provide a market for them.

 

 

With One Household, One Hectare, I hope that hon members will actually pay closer attention to that. The Agri-Parks programme I have already mentioned the R2 billion again, this is for financial year on that. But in accelerating the pace of land reform we are allocating land to small holder farmers and providing protection to vulnerable

communities. But of course in this programme, we have agreed the hon member of this House who is sitting there, hon Zokwane should

co-ordinate the two departments as far as this is concerned so that we could work together very closely. So he is our Chief at the moment, he is managing us in this regards and we think that we are going to do away with unnecessary overlapping and so on.

 

 

Again, in summary therefore hon Chair, we have distributed the budget speech and we hope that the hon members will find time to assist us in understanding it deeper in terms of the questions they might raise. But of course we have the youth programme, the National Rural Youth Service Corps, Narysec, is still running and with regard to it we have budgeted R337 million and with regard to interns, because we do intern young students, we have budgeted in that regard,

R21, 7 million. In all hon Chair, we submit to this House a budget of R10, 124 billion for this financial year. I thank you. [Applause.]

 

 

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Hon

Chairperson; hon members of the Select Committees on Land Reform and Mineral Resources; Members of the National Council of Provinces, we are tabling this Budget Vote in the month that we celebrate the rights of workers and the second anniversary of the fifth democratically elected administration. This month, we also commemorate Africa Day to mark the unity of the African continent. This department will

engage with different communities as part of the celebrations in this month of May.

 

 

In his 2016 state of the nation address, His Excellency President Jacob Zuma reiterated the centrality of the Nine-Point Plan in fast-tracking economic growth. Prominent in this plan is the revitalisation of the agriculture and agro-processing value chain and growing the oceans economy.

 

This Budget Vote speech will reflect on our mandate and our work over the past year. I will report on the progress made, as outlined in our strategic plan and the annual performance plan of the 2015-16 to 2019-20 Medium-Term Strategic Framework period. Our vision for the agriculture, forestry and fisheries sectors is food security for all, creating 1 million jobs by 2030, and increasing the contribution of these sectors to the GDP.

 

 

I would like to reflect on a few achievements in these areas over the past year. The gross value of the agriculture sector shrank by 12,5% in the third quarter of 2015. However, there have been positive signs on the other indicators within the sector. During the third quarter of 2015, the number of smallholders increased by 743.

Agro-processing sales grew by 8,4%. Jobs in the sector increased by

211 000 in the third quarter of 2015, as compared to the same period in 2014.

 

 

As part of our resolve to bring underutilised land into production, in the 2014-15 financial year, 136 253 ha of land were put under the production of maize, wheat, beans, vegetables and fruits, among others, through the Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme, Casp, and Ilima/Letsema. The drought experienced in 2015-16 has negatively affected crop production, resulting in only 43% of targeted hectares planted.

 

Despite the drought challenges, we can report that in the Frances Baard district, in the Northern Cape, 348 ha of maize were planted under irrigation and 10 tons per hectare are expected during harvesting in May 2016. In Pixley ka Seme, 136 ha of maize were planted, and the expected yield is 12 tons per hectare. These good results were also experienced in the Eastern Cape, in Centani, where the provincial department of agriculture, together with Wiphold, planted 1000 ha and realised approximately 8 tons per hectare under dry land, along the coastal areas.

 

 

It is against this background that we have identified more than

150 000 ha in all nine provinces to be put under the production of maize on 122 000 ha; vegetables on 9 000 ha; beans on 4 400 ha; wheat

on 2 200 ha; sorghum on 5 000 ha; fruits on 3 300 ha; fodder on 3 000 ha; nuts on 1 400 ha; and sugarcane, rooibos, chicory, cotton, canola and sunflowers on 2 300 ha. An amount of R880 million from Casp and Ilima/Letsema is set aside for this purpose. Effective

public-private partnerships are vital in achieving our goal of bringing 1 million hectares of underutilised land into production.

 

 

The programmes being implemented by my department through the provincial departments of agriculture continue to create jobs. In 2014-15, Casp and Ilima/Letsema created 28 000 jobs. In 2016-17,

34 500 jobs will be created, because we plan and do things together.

I invite those who will be in the Eastern Cape on 24 December to join me at our first harvest at Lambasi.

 

I am pleased to announce that, in all these sectors – agriculture, forestry and fisheries - exports value has increased and South Africa remains in a positive trade balance. The value of agriculture, forestry and fisheries exports increased from R135 billion in 2014 to R144 billion in 2015. In the same period, exports into other African countries increased from R59 billion to R62 billion, and into Asia, from R34,5 billion to R37,1 billion. The conclusion of the EU Economic Partnership Agreement has provided increased quota access for a number of existing and new products, such as wine and sugar.

We have continued to open new market opportunities. A notable achievement was the recognition by the Indonesian government of the highest standards of food safety control measures. This comes after a protracted negotiation process between the technical teams of the two countries. This has eventually led to the opening of the Indonesian market to South African exporters.

 

 

The department is the custodian of South Africa‘s forest resources which cover over 40 million hectares of the country‘s land surface. An amount of R945 562 million has been allocated to forestry and natural resources management.

 

 

The total value of Budget Vote No 24 for 2016-17 is R6,3 billion, of which R3,2 billion is ring-fenced for transfers of conditional and parliamentary grants. In terms of conditional grants,

R1,6 billion has been allocated to the Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme. This has been allocated to the provinces as follows. The Eastern Cape will receive R263 million; the Free State, R174 million; Gauteng, R85 million; KwaZulu-Natal, R222 million; Limpopo, R260 million; Mpumalanga, R172 million; the Northern Cape, R128 million; North West, R171 million; and the Western Cape, R164 million.

These allocations are aimed at supporting 19 973 farmers - of which

 

16 000 are smallholders - with infrastructure, production input, training and capacity-building that includes the SA Good Agricultural Practices certification. Included in the Casp allocation is R70,8 million, which will be used to revitalise 10 colleges of agriculture in the Eastern Cape, Free State,

KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo, North West and the Western Cape provinces. A portion of the Casp allocation, amounting to R76 million, will go towards recovery work after the flood disasters of 2012 in Limpopo, Mpumalanga and the Western Cape.

 

Work will continue in revitalising three irrigation schemes, namely the Vaalharts, in the Northern Cape; Ebenezer, in the Western Cape; and Makhathini, in KwaZulu-Natal. In Vaalharts, the department has spent R67 million, since 2007, built 26 irrigation dams and installed 63 km of subsurface internal drainage systems. This opened 675 ha of land for production. We have also installed 14 km of main communal outfall water lines, servicing 924 ha. In Ebenezer, a balancing dam will be constructed, servicing 153 plots. The work planned in Makhathini will result in subsurface drainage pipes being installed, covering 250 ha. In addition, an urgent repair of the main canal will enable irrigation to 2 000 ha of land in the area.

In the North West province, the department will roll out LandCare projects in Bojanala and Ngaka Modiri Molema districts, in 2016-17. These will focus on bush control, conservation, agriculture and Junior LandCare programmes, and 500 jobs will be created.

 

 

The department is pleased to announce that this year‘s LandCare Conference will be hosted by the Northern Cape province, in Kimberley, from 3 to 6 October 2016. The theme for the LandCare conference is Making my LandCare difference towards land degradation neutrality.

 

 

In terms of parliamentary grants, R241,8 million has been allocated to the Marine Living Resources Fund; R813 million to the Agricultural Research Council; and R35 million to the National Agricultural Marketing Council, and R5,9 million to Ncera Farms (Pty) Ltd. I know the story told by another opposition party - that is not true. In addition to that, R788,1 million of the budget has been allocated towards administration.

 

 

My department, together with the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform, is spearheading the development of Agri-parks in each province, along already existing agricultural development corridors. The Agri-parks programme is aimed at addressing the

challenge faced by smallholders, in particular, in accessing markets.

 

 

Last, but not least, aquaculture has become an important growth area within the oceans economy segment of Operation Phakisa. The aquaculture sector offers significant potential for rural development, especially for marginalised communities, and it can create a significant number of jobs. The sector has high growth potential due to the increasing demand for fish products, given their health benefits.

 

The draft Aquaculture Bill, which aims to support the sustainable growth of the sector, is at an advanced stage of development and has been through the public participation process. Furthermore, the department is also promoting aquaculture development in various provinces. Some of these projects include, but are not limited to the China-South Africa Agricultural Demonstration Centre in Gariep, Free State. Had I the time, I am sure I would have gone on to explain many of them. We will continue with the implementation of the Aquaculture Lab outcomes, and various initiatives will be implemented during 2016.

 

 

In closing, I would like to quote David Hume:

Your corn is ripe today; mine will be so tomorrow. ‘Tis profitable for us both, that I should labour with you today, and that you should aid me tomorrow. I have no kindness for you, and know you have as little for me. I will not, therefore, take any pains upon your account; and should I labour with you upon my own account, in expectation of a return, I know I should be disappointed, and that I should in vain depend upon your gratitude. Here then I leave you to labour alone; You treat me in the same manner. The seasons change; and both of us lose our harvests for want of mutual confidence and security.

 

 

That is what happens when we differ and try to fight over something on which we can work together. We have to strengthen our partnership with private companies to grow this sector further. We have to find new technologies and new methods of agriculture to meet the challenges of drought.

 

 

Xa sibambisene singakwazi ukuyilwa size siyahlule le mbalela sijongene nayo. Masingabahoyi abagxeki kuba kaloku bagxeka bengenasizathu, banamabatha xa behamba, banamajengxeba njengeenkukhu kwaye baqhomfiwe kwezengqondo kungoko bengayiboni impumelelo eya phambili. Enkosi. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph follows.)

[If we can cooperate, we can fight and get rid of the drought we are facing. Let us ignore those who criticise because they criticise without a reason, they are not perfect, and cannot think properly that is why they do not see success going forward. Thank you.]

 

 

Mr O SEFAKO: Hon Chairperson, hon Delegates, h o n Ministers and Deputy Ministers, distinguished guests, our viewers and listeners at home, good time of the day.

 

 

Allow me to attest to the House, hon Chair, that the two Departments have presented their Budget Votes and annual performance plans before the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources, for engagement and discussion.

 

 

This budget vote taking place at an epoch which one can characterise as the age of ...

 

 

... nkgankga e ja nkgawana. [... myself, then others.]

 

 

 

We are hardly few days from when the international workers have drawn some inspirations to fight and defend their democratic gains. And the Constitution is also celebrating 20 years of existence.

Hon Chair, the two departments are pillars of our economy, in particular agriculture and they are interrelated and of course, connected, they cannot be divorced from each other.

 

There are natural disasters internationally and domestic that have also had some impact on the growth and the development of these two departments, particularly the disaster, the heat wave and the climate change have had drastic effect on that.

 

 

But as we are dealing with the land questions, I would say the two hon Ministers have indeed elaborated much and I cannot repeat what they have said. I would try by all the means, perhaps to draw from our historical struggle: an economy depends on the land, and if we don‘t have land, running an economy becomes an empty dream.

 

 

Ever since the legend or great revolutionaries, after the immediate war of dispossessions, they fought gallantly for the rights of the Africans. Great leaders such as Pixley ka Seme, John Dube who was the first President, Solomon Plaatjie, Dr Moroka, George Montshiwa, to mention a few. These were learned scholars but indeed after this revolution, the war of dispossession, they decided to take another strategy and tactics of persuasion, deportations and sending delegations to Great Britain and America to pursue the harsh rules

of Apartheid and to change the heart in terms of giving the rights because Africans were denied the right to have access to the land.

 

 

Perhaps I would quote Sol Plaatjie when he said, in his lamentations, The native life in South Africa, ?Awaking on Friday morning, June 20, 1913, the South African native found himself not actually a slave but a pariah in the land of his birth.?

 

 

The mandate of the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform aligns the department's work with Chapter 6 of the National Development Plan, NDP, and Outcome 7, comprehensive rural development and land reform of government's 2014-2019 medium term strategic framework. The priorities of the department can be summarised as follows: Recapitalising and redeveloping redistributed farms; Establishing agri-parks; The One Household, One Hectare programme; Socioeconomic and river valley catalytic programmes; Animal and veld management projects; Extending the lodgement of land claims; the National Rural Youth Service Corps; Security of tenure; the Land Rights Management Facility Act, 2015; Establishing the South African Geomatics Council; and Strengthening the relative rights of people working on the land.

 

As I‘ve indicated, hon Chair, I will not repeat what the Minister has just said. It is important, of course, to ensure that the good

story that the two departments have been telling would reach the masses. As the scientific socialist put it well clear, that ideas become the material force if they are in the hands of the masses.

 

The emerging parties after 1994 are today claiming easy victory. Amílcar Cabral said ?tell no lies and claim no easy victory? and further said ?do not musk the difficulties.?

 

 

The two Ministers indeed have highlighted that despite the challenges that are there - as I‘ve also equally alluded to - that there are other forces phenomenal such as drought which, from the researchers, it has never happened for over 36 years. The Alimo, which has brought some serious waves, and even the climate change is one of the issues that is bringing all members in the global community together, rich or poor. As the phenomena that can wipe up humanity on this earth. But equally so, these climate changes are human made. They were caused by the capitalists, who unfortunately – even acts that were passed by them, enacted by them were not taken responsibly to make sure that the ecological degradations are also making some rehabilitations of our land. That is why today we‘re faced with challenges of drainage which are contaminating our clean subterranean waters and also impacting negatively on our agricultural land.

Hon Chair, on the question of the drought, there are provinces that have been identified as the ones that were highly stricken by this drought, and we applaud the department for being hands-on given the shrinking budgetary constraints, but they managed to help to ameliorate the challenges.

 

When you go to the North West, a programme led by the Premier there called Setsokotsane, was paying visits to different districts and municipalities, creating an awareness and advising the farmers – those that are having more cattle to sell either to and buy some feeds and also appreciating the help of the four bags for those farmers that are emerging and having no capacity to continue feeding their cattle, that is highly appreciated.

 

 

Hon Chair, if you look at the Northern Cape, the Namakwa District, where there‘s the fishery project site. Namakwa is an area that is heavily fitted by these droughts also and there‘s a high rate of unemployment. The project of aquaculture as fishery, can assist but there‘s an embarrassment that occurred there where there was the EPW Project that had agreed on a budget of R748 13, that amount has unfortunately not yet been paid to them. And I have a letter sent from them and I would really appreciate if the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries if he has that letter in his possession, could also pay attention to it.

Hon Chair, in conclusion I would like to say, as the ANC, we request the House to approve and support these two Budget Votes. Thank you very much.

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon Chairperson, hon. Ministers, Deputy Ministers, MECs present, members of the House, members of the public and viewers at home, Good day, Goeie dag, Re a lotšha, Nda, Ndi masiari, Avuxeni, Dumelang, I stand here in front of you debating two very important topics that have turned dry under the governance of a failing ANC. [Interjections.] The budgets are running dry; the solutions to the problems of our nation, their hopes and aspirations are running dry; the trust and care of our government are turning dry and that does not even consider our land and dams.

 

 

Minister Zokwana must be a specialist in crisis management and turning a blind eye to the problems that face our country. I am confident that the ANC government still has no clue of the extent of the waves impact and aftermath that are still to hit us in the near future due to the drought owing to the ANC government‘s poor handling of the crisis and nonexistent proactive planning.

 

 

These waves are and will continue to impact on the cost of food prices, which in turn will impact on inflation and so we go on. According to the latest statistics released, this wave will impact on serious

job losses in agriculture which has already started with about

 

37 000 job losses in agriculture in Limpopo alone. And this is happening while the industry is supposed to create one million new jobs in agriculture in line with the National Development Plan.

 

Approximately 650 000 pieces of livestock has already been lost due to the drought, according to the Red Meat Producers Organisation. Agri SA indicated that the agricultural industry would need about R12 billion as protective measures. How does the ANC government react to this crisis? They allocate a bare Rl billion for drought relief of which the majority of the funds will be going towards drilling of boreholes; and some boreholes cost an amount of Rl million per borehole. I don‘t know if they wanted to reach the earth‘s core at that price, hon Minister. Lip service, if you ask me, hon Minister! Why is your government scared of declaring the drought a national disaster? Is it because you don‘t understand how big of a crisis it is or is it because you cannot afford it?

 

 

The government responded by cutting the budget for agriculture with R181 million and R40,6 million on Programmes 2 and 3 respectively, alone. And you say you are serious about agriculture. Even your Deputy Minister Cele said in the select committee that this government isn‘t taking agriculture seriously due to the budget cuts that are taking place.

Hon Minister, I am sorry to say this but soon you will have to wake up and smell of the coffee as our food security is in serious danger. Now we need to import between four and six million tons of maize – and I am taking this at a very low level. Can we logistically handle these volumes? I am afraid to enlighten you that the answer is no.

 

Another crisis sneaking up on you, hon Minister, is the impact of water pollution by poorly ran ANC municipalities that dump raw sewer into virtually every river system in the country. Soon river water will have to be processed before it can be used for irrigation purposes. That will impact our ability to export our agricultural products to other countries because of E.coli levels in our products. I don‘t even mention the health risk to South African citizens. This is a government that just doesn‘t care.

 

 

It is Deputy Minister Cele who told us about the International Commission for the Conservation of Atlantic Tunas, Iccat, in the waters, a few debates ago. Are you aware of the large number of illegal trawlers that are fishing within our waters now as we are sitting here in the House, today? Are you aware of that? Can we please take fresh water aquaculture seriously hon Minister? It has great potential for rural development, job creation towards the National Development Plan.

Minister Zokwana, it is clear that there are serious problems with Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme, Casp, and Fetsa Tlala fund allocations to the provinces that show very little or no accountability on how they spend those funds. With the exception, of course, of the DA-run Western Cape province. This should be a worrying factor to you, hon Minister, as this funding to provinces make up the majority of your department‘s budget.

 

 

And then we have this new pipe dream called Agri-parks that does not seem to be getting off the ground. My question is, ?Is this an election vote or winning fluff programme or are you serious about growing the agricultural industry as a whole?? Agri-parks was introduced at the cost of other previous initiatives like developing youth in agriculture.

 

Another challenge to the agricultural industry is land insecurity and policy insecurity in this regard. The cause of this crisis is your colleague, Minister Nkwinti, whom you once again turned a blind eye as he is more interested in land capture as part of the ANC‘s state capture strategy than subscribing to the National Development Plan. [Interjections.]

 

 

Minister Nkwinti, the community of ...

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Smit, please take your seat. Hon Mhlanga, you are on your feet.

 

Mr M T MHLANGA: Yes, ma‘am. Chairperson I just want to ask the hon member there a question, whether he is ...

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: You must first find out if he wants to

 

...

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: I don‘t want to take a question.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: He is not willing, morena [sir.] ... [Inaudible.]

 

Mr C F B SMIT: I don‘t have enough time. Don‘t waste my time. [Interjections.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Smit, please continue.

 

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Thank you. Minister Nkwinti, the community of Makgoba are still waiting to take ownership of their land claimed by the Makgoba tribe more than a decade ago. And who are holding the titles as we sit here today? Government - in the form of the Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries.

The ANC-run government claim to want to return the land to the rightful owners but that is a lie. They want the land under their control so that they can use it as a token to threaten the masses to stay in power.

 

 

When do you plan to comply with the Constitution of the Republic in terms of section 25(5) and (6) by implementing land reform in the apartheid-instituted tribal and communal areas? These South Africans are being deprived of individual land ownership and titles to their residential properties that could set them financially free and actively giving them ownership in the economy.

 

 

Hon Minister, how is it possible that your department established a youth hub with a gym in Beaufort West from your rural development budget when we have a Department of Sports and Culture? Why were their budget not used?

 

 

You see, under a DA government we would cut back on cost and bureaucracy by instating a leaner government that will consist of only 15 Ministries. In our government, these two departments will become one effective and coherent department.

 

Ours will be a government that really cares and serve its people by implementing our fairer South African strategy where every South

African has ownership in the economy and become active citizens. It will be a government where farm workers and businesses have ownership in the businesses they work for through incentive programs that reward businesses that create jobs and contribute to real broad-based economic empowerment.

 

It will be a government that nurture a nation of entrepreneurs by making it easier to start small businesses in all sectors including agriculture and agroprocessing; and this by cutting red tape, cost to start a business and lighten legislation burden on small businesses and a government that invest in infrastructure like railway systems that link up agriculture, rural communities, mines, towns and cities so that it is easier to access opportunities and stimulate the rural economy.

 

 

It will be a government that gives entrepreneurs in rural villages an opportunity to set an example to set up in partnership with industry specialists solar farms that feed into the grid and contribute to green energy and break the monopoly of Eskom and at the same time contribute to rural development and a government that cares about its food basket and look after its farmers and support them. It will also be a government that creates an environment in which the agricultural industry is expanded and become inclusive so that all South Africans that want to farm can take part and have

ownership. A South Africa that unites South Africans with our vision of ?One Nation with One Future built on Freedom, Fairness and Opportunity for All.?

 

Tokologo, tekatekano le menyetla ya bohle! [Tšhwahlelo.] Ke nako ya batho kamoka ba Afrika-Borwa. Ka kgwedi ya Agostose, ka di 3, re tla fetola mmušo wa mahodu. Ke nako ya go boutela phetogo ya nnete.

Boutela DA! Ke a leboga. (Translation of Sepedi paragraph follows.)

 

 

[Freedom, equality, and opportunities for all! [Interjections.] Now is the time for all South Africans to exercise their rights. We will conquer the government of criminals on the 3rd of August. It is time to vote for real change. Vote for the DA! I thank you.]

 

 

Thank you.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Smit, please just wait there. Is it a point of order?

 

Mr M T MHLANGA: Yes, I rise on a point of order, hon Chair.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Yes, sir. What is a point of order, sir.

 

 

 

Mr M T MHLANGA: Hon Smit said in ...

... Sepedi gore ke mmušo wa mahodu. Mahodu ... [Sepedi that this is a government of criminals.]

 

 

... are criminals.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: ?Mahodu‘ is actually thieves.

 

 

Mr M T MHLANGA: Thieves. And he is referring to the government of the day as the government of thieves. I am not sure if that is correct. He is making ...

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order, there is member on the floor.

 

 

Mr M T MHLANGA: He is making a sweeping statement that cannot be substantiated by evidence. Can he please withdraw that?

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Smit?

 

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon Chair, I suggest that it be looked at within the context of what I have said. I believe it is a point of debate. [Interjections.]

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order, members. Order! [Interjections.] Order! [Interjections.] Order! I want to take a few minutes and

consider this matter and rule on what this member said before this debate is over. You may step down, sir.

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Thank you, hon Chair. Keep Nkandla in mind.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: The hon Deputy Minister, hon Skwatsha. [Interjections.]

 

 

Mr F ESSACK: Chairperson.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: On what point are you rising, hon Essack?

 

 

 

Mr F ESSACK I just wanted to point out whilst you are pondering over your ruling, the other thieves will be kleptomaniacs. Thank you.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you very much but it is a very different word which was not used in this House. So, I will be concentrating on the translation and interpretation of ?mahodu.‘ Thank you very much.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Hon Chair,

 

hon ministers, hon deputy ministers, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, distinguished guests.

Our people were robbed of their birthright, dignity, traditions, wealth, freedom and everything they had. After more than 350 years of protracted struggle, through courage, strength, determination and resilience, with outstanding leadership, the robbers agreed to surrender.

 

After our victory 22 years ago, we began to right the wrongs, to bring justice to our divided land. We have not done to those who robbed us of our land, what they did to us. Instead, in the moment of our victory, we acknowledged their rights as well.

 

 

20 years ago we passed a Constitution which applies to all.

 

 

 

In section 25, this Constitution says, and I quote:

 

 

 

The public interest includes the nation's commitment to land reform, and to reforms to bring about equitable access to all South Africa's natural resources; and the state must take reasonable legislative and other measures, within its available resources, to foster conditions which enable citizens to gain access to land on an equitable basis.

 

 

In the 22 years we have been building this new home for our people. One brick at a time, the foundations and walls are being put together

of this home we are building called, free South Africa.

 

 

We have not built a complete house yet, but we are now having these years of experience, which have shown us which of our tools work, and which don't work at all. The road that lies ahead is much longer.

 

 

Only when the dignity of all who were forced off their land and separated from the graves of their ancestors has been restored, will we be able to rest. Restoring the fabric of a nation, that had its soul ripped apart by 350 years of conquest and oppression, will take generations. We are in this for a long haul.

 

 

We are not Johnny-come-late populist politicians, promising instant pudding and destroying our institutions, facilities and national integrity.

 

 

Nor are we colonial apologists who seek to use the Constitution only to the extent that it protects the apartheid status quo we inherited in 1994. Listening to the hon member before me, looking at his surname, I had a difficulty and a restrained in thinking that I am actually listening to some Prime Minister North of the Limpopo in the ages. Only an h is left for this surname to be his. It‘s very easy to be an opposition. There is no appreciation in the fact that we are mopping up a mess created by people who have some relation

in one way or another to the previous speaker.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Please Sir, take your seat. Hon Labuschagne?

 

 

Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Hon Chair, on a point of order, I would like know if the hon Deputy Minister refer to the previous speaker as racist?

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order. Hon Deputy Minister, did you refer to the previous speaker as a racist?

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: No,

 

Chairperson, I specifically read. I can re-read that particular sentence.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you. Please continue.

 

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: It‘s very

easy to be in opposition. People do not even have an appreciation that we mopping up a mess created by people related in one way or another to the previous speaker who spoke before me. As we speak here, hon Chairperson, we that we are in government as I stand here.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: hon Deputy Minister, please, take your

seat again. Hon Engelbrecht?

 

 

Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Chair, I just want to check, whether is parliamentary for the hon member, to be derogatory about the previous speaker‘s surname and adding additional syllables into his surname with the derogatory reference, if that is parliamentary?

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order members. Order! Hon Engelbrecht, the hon member, said that the previous speaker‘s surname reminded him of a particular Prime Minister, North of Limpopo. He then said that only the letter h is missing. In another words, he did not add the letter h to the previous speaker. Please. There is then an issue of interpretation whether by referring to the member who spoke before him, and saying that a member surname reminded him of a member from a country beyond. Whether there is anything derogatory there?

 

 

So it is a matter of interpretation. Is the member asking me to rule on inference and if you are, I think the member will have to wait, because just on the surface of it, there is nothing which is unparliamentary which the Deputy Minster has said. There is relevance to somebody who decided on a country beyond the Limpopo. There is an indication that the surnames are only different, because the other one has an h and the other one does not have an h. I do not know what the hon member is rising on right now. You have a second point of

order I presume.

 

 

Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Chair, yes. It‘s relevant with regard to implication, by implication of the previous regime that he put in the extra syllable into the surname, so is inference. If I can have ruling on that, please, Chair?

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Please, take your seat. My ruling is this. South Africa does have members of different language groups whose surnames have hs and whose surnames do not have hs and those members were not necessarily members of either this regime or that regime. So, on that basis your second point will also fall away. Deputy Minister, please continue.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: As I say

Chair ...

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Just a little bit. As a matter of fact unrelated to those who have a surname with an h and they are coloureds and they are not racist and they do not belong to the regime. That is why I can argue on this and say, sometimes, yes the reference might have. You know it is difficult when you are chairing to preside and rule on Innuendo-Ounces and I think that is the hon member says I must do. On the face of it, unfortunately we have to let this one

go. Deputy Minister?

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: ... as I

 

stand here, a clinic is being built by this government. A land claim is being finalised. Agriculture is giving maize to people to plant. It is difficult to trust the DA. In the Western Cape we only know of pota pota. At least the Makgopa community, the hon member is referring to, is waiting for a claim to be attended to.

 

In sharpening our tools, we have now decided to get rid of willing buyer, willing seller. Instead of the buyer and the market determining the price alone, because of our experience, the price is now determined by what is fair and equitable, as required by the Constitution. This is why as we said we would; we have established the Office of the Valuer-General.

 

 

Strengthening the relative rights of the people working the land is an instrument that we also use, as the Minister has indicated.

 

 

This policy framework seeks direct redress for farm workers whose sweat and toil built a powerful agricultural sector in our country. Redress for those who have never profited from their labour, and whose welfare has never been considered. Government is buying them a share as co-owners and managers in the farms they have helped to build,

through an equity injection into these enterprises. This is the most lasting solution to farm evictions. Ten proposals have been finalised and being implemented, with about 540 beneficiaries on 7 642 hectares of land.

 

 

The following is an allocation to provinces. In the 2016-17 financial year, we will be appropriating 10,12 billion of this 22% is allocated to activities at the national office. The provinces will be allocated the following percentages of the Budget: Eastern Cape 9%, Free State 6%, Gauteng 5%, KwaZulu-Natal 15%, Limpopo 11%‘ Mpumalanga 11%, Northern Cape 6%, North West 8%, and Western Cape 7%.

 

 

The President of course, we salute him for reopening the issue of land claims, which will be again reconsidered as 30 June 2019 arrives. We are moving and we are moving with speed. The commission prioritises claims lodged before 31 December 1998, to investigate those claims and to resolve them through negotiations and mediation.

 

In this year 2016, which marks the 50th anniversary of the declaration by the National Party regime that District Six would be for whites only area, leading to the forced removals of more than 60 000 residents, it is our democratic government which has brought hope to the people of District Six. As I speak here development is taking place in District Six.

But even once all those claims have been settled, we must acknowledge that many of our compatriots lost their land in the period of colonial conquest prior to the enactment of the 1913 Natives Land Act

 

The role of District Land Reform Committees is to drive accelerated and successful land reform. In the Budget Speech last year, we announced that we would be establishing District Land Reform Committees in all 44 districts. We are happy to announce as we did in the National Assembly, that we have completed doing so and the training program run by the Minister has also taken place.

 

 

All the Beneficiary Selection Committees have been established. They will select and screen suitable candidates for land allocation. The District Land Reform Committees, DLRCs, have also established panels of experts for the assessment and evaluation of business plans for the Recapitalization and Development applications.

 

 

We have also finalised the categories of beneficiaries to be targeted for land allocation. These will be chosen by the Beneficiary Selection Committees. Specific groups to be targeted for land allocation and to receive strategic support, this includes also military veterans. Beneficiary selection will be a public and transparent process.

Support to farm workers facing eviction, we remain concerned about evictions of farm workers from farms, including in particular year in the Western Cape. In many cases farm workers are visited, because they do not know their rights under the Extension of Security of Tenure Act, ESTA, or the procedures to be followed to get assistance when they are evicted. There are many problems in assisting farm workers evictions.

 

 

I want to encourage farm dwellers and their organisations to participate in the coming weeks, in the public hearings the Portfolio Committee is currently busy with on the ESTA Amendment Bill.

 

I ask members of this August House to also publicise the anti-Evictions toll-free number 0800007095 which allows farm

dwellers to access free legal assistance and mediation services through our Land Rights Management Facility.

 

 

The Land Audit Phase 2 project is complete. The report is being reviewed internally. The next step is to present the report to top management of the department. It will then be submitted to the Minister before it is tabled to Cabinet.

 

The department has since 2008 been offering bursaries to aspirant students to obtain qualifications in Surveying. During the previous

financial year, the department sponsored 473 students pursuing their studies in Surveying and which 157 were females and 316, were males.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Deputy Minister?

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: In

conclusion ...

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Your time has expired.

 

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: In

conclusion, while you are sitting and comfortable in your bright and wealthy homes, just give one thought to the hundreds of native families, man and woman, even at this moment.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Your time has expired, Deputy Minister.

 

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: That was

a quote from, John Langalibalele Dube.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you.

 

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Thank you

 

very much.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, Sir.

 

 

Ms E PRINS: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, hon Zokwana; hon Minister of Rural Development and Land Reform, hon Nkwinti; hon Deputy Ministers; hon members; special delegates; ladies and gentlemen; the pre-amble of the Freedom Charter states that our people have been robbed of their birth right to land, liberty and peace by a form of government founded on injustice and inequality; and it goes on to say, and we pledge ourselves to strive together, sparing neither strength nor courage, until the democratic changes here set out have been won.

 

 

Hon Chairperson, after 22 years of winning that democratic changes and finding our freedom, we find that many of those inequalities that are described under the 10 headings in the body of the Freedom Charter have not been erased, because it was so deep rooted.

 

 

The two departments under the capable leadership of the Ministers of Rural Development and Land Reform, Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries and their Deputies are grappling with the enormous task of rectifying the deep rooted wrongs and injustices of the many years of deprivation and inequality.

 

I want to commend the Ministers and their departments for the sterling

work that they do, in these two key departments, that has a direct bearing on the quality of life of those people who were ill-treated under the previous regime.

 

Your task is one of balancing and dealing with two worlds, on the one hand making sure that those injustices are dealt with and on the other hand, making sure that the process of land reform does not interfere with the important aspect of food sustainability and food security.

 

 

Nobody could have expressed this better than the father of our nation, when he addressed the opening of the Congress of the SA Agricultural Union, SAAU, on 18 October 1994 and it is still appropriate today,

22 years later. He said; and I quote:

 

 

 

The success of the Reconstruction and Development Programme requires a partnership among all social structures. Few other sectors can be as crucial in this as the agricultural industry: for it is on your shoulders that the food security of the nation rests. It is on your efforts that a great part of the manufacturing industry relies for its raw materials.

 

 

On its part, the ANC government is committed to create conditions in which the agricultural industry can prosper. Of course, there are

characteristics that we cannot change the climatic conditions and the natural disasters that sometimes befall us. But in partnership, we can minimise the effects of this and optimise the positive elements that our country possesses in abundance.

 

 

Such partnership should bring restructuring of the agricultural industry, improved productivity and training of employees, an opening of farming opportunities for those who have been excluded, and measures to correct past injustices.

 

 

Our government is firmly committed to a process of land reform. The need of corrective measures to deal with the consequences of past injustices is overwhelming.

 

 

But it is equally important that new injustices are not created or production capacity disrupted. Our land policy acknowledges the property rights of existing landowners. It also recognises the legitimate demand of justice from those who have been dispossessed or excluded.

 

 

As much as we acknowledge that modernisation and new technology is necessary for sustainability, the effect of this is a threat to job security, to farm workers and a deepening of poverty in the rural areas.

The advances in many of our communities, especially in agricultural based areas and communities clearly more focus approach on small scale farmers is paying dividends.

 

Through the programmes of the Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries and Minister of Rural Development, there has been an increase in the number of smallholders of 743 in the third quarter of 2015 alone and the agro-processing sales grew by 8,4%. There was an increase in jobs of 211 000 in the third quarter of 2015 as compared to the same period in 2014.

 

 

Hundred and thirty six thousand two hundred and fifty three hectares of land were under production of maize, wheat, beans, vegetables and fruits. This happened through Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme, Casp, and llima-Letsema. The Minister also referred to that.

 

 

We want to say to the Minister that as the ANC, we are looking forward to the next 150 hectares that are targeted for production through Casp and llima-Letsema in 2016-17, through the R880 million that is set aside for this purpose.

 

The hon member Smit is boosting with the spending of the department of the Western Cape, but the implementation agencies – he is not

saying that. And I think the hon Deputy Minister knows. I want was a Chairperson of Agriculture in the Western Cape. I always spoke about that incident, taking agencies to dump the funds there.

 

And I want to request the Minister that this department must have a closer look at the spending of Caps in provinces in order to ensure that we get maximum benefit for our money as I am aware that in the Western Cape, these funds are not fully utilised to the full benefit of the beneficiaries. The use of implementing agencies instead of the department itself, takes a big chunk out of the allocated Caps funds.

 

 

It is encouraging to see that the department has the wellbeing of our youth at heart through the spending of more than R30 million over two years, to assist young people to equip themselves in the field of agriculture. The good news goes further than that. The spending of more than R36 million last year and this year on internships is an indication of the government's efforts to expose and accommodate young people in the agriculture sector.

 

 

Female farmers are feeding 80% of the African continent, despite the many challenges they face and in South Africa woman are playing a bigger role in agriculture every day.

In 2008, government partnered with Old Mutual to set up the

 

R100 million lsivande Women's Fund. The fund was motivated by the realisation that rural women in South Africa not only face higher poverty rates, they also often have little to no resources available to them; with access to water, irrigation tools and seedlings being a constant challenge

 

The Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries stated at the fifth annual female entrepreneur awards that women's contribution to the economic subsistence of their families in providing them with shelter, producing food, acting as primary caregivers, preparing meals, and walking long distances to fetch firewood and water, amongst others.

 

 

It is a given fact that the Department of Agriculture Forestry and Fisheries and the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform are closely linked in the government's efforts to undo the injustices of the past. In this joint effort of the two departments, the vital role of the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform is to ensure that the land shall be shared amongst those who work it.

 

 

The government is firmly set on its path to remove restrictions of land ownership on a racial basis and we are making sure that the land is re-divided amongst those who work it and who have slaved for many

years to enrich the minority.

 

 

It is the objective of the department to banish famine and land hunger through its land reform programmes and we are succeeding with our programmes. The proof of the successes can be seen in the fact that

240 940 hectares of land were acquired and allocated to beneficiaries, 46 district land reform committees were established and are working, 57 farms were acquired in support of the Agri-Parks Programme, 408 farms benefitted under the Recapitalisation and Development Programme, with 2 266 new jobs that were created in land reform projects through the Recapitalisation, Recap, Programme.

 

 

Provinces are responsible for the implementation and execution of the programmes of the department. What is disturbing however is the commitment or I should rather say, non-commitment of those who want to sabotage the progress what we are making in our land reform programmes.

 

 

This can be seen in comparative figures in the performance plan of the department. It is clear that the Western Cape is not buying into our programme of land reform.

 

The figures speak for it. I will name a few.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Prins ...

 

 

... die tyd is om. [... your time has expired.]

 

 

 

Ms E PRINS: Oh, thank you.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Baie dankie. [Thank you very much.]

 

 

 

Ms E PRINS: I thank you. [Applause.]

 

 

Mr R T MTHEMBU (KZN CHAIRPERSON - AGRICULTURE): Hon Chairperson and

hon members of the NCOP, the hon Ministers, hon Nkwinti, hon Zokwana and the Deputy Ministers, hon Skwatsha and hon Cele.

 

I will start with the rural development. In the introduction to the Budget speech by hon Minister, Nkwinti, reminds us that the National Development Plan, NDP, places agriculture as the driving force behind the vision for rural development in the country. That is why so much of what the hon Minister had to say related to agriculture. There is a global recognition that agriculture is a catalyst for rural development and the essence of this was captured in the United Nations Rural Poverty Report and I quote; ?Many countries have experienced significant growth over the past decade or two but has not always been accompanied commensurate poverty reduction especially where

growth has been driven by sectors other than agriculture. Growth in the agriculture usually generates the greatest improvements that we would like to see amongst our people. To the hon Minister, Nkwinti, we would like to assure that all the activities of the KwaZulu-Natal Department of Agriculture and Rural Development, under our strategy for agrarian transformation is aimed in one direction only, and that is towards growing an integrated and an inclusive rural economy. We welcome the initiative to conduct commodity and value chain analysis and mapping exercise to establish the growth and job creation potential of the value adding commodity. One of the challenges we face is to change mindsets and get people to move beyond the traditional commodities that we farm. We are interested to hear from Ministers, Minister Zokwana and Minister Nkwinti, about the potential for job creation and expansion in the fruit and nut industry.

 

 

In the agricultural sector, we are finding a unity of purpose. KZN, like the other provinces, is forging partnerships with community organisations, academic and research institutions, business and finance institutions, organised agriculture and nongovernmental organisations, NGOs. All of these with a singular aim of ensuring that agriculture become a catalyst for socioeconomic transformation in our rural areas.

We thank hon Minister Nkwinti, on reminding us about the responsibility we have to transform the lives of our people, who were striped of their land and condemned to live in the barren soulless reserves. The only value was the source of cheap labour to white monopoly capital.

 

We always tell people that the aim of the KZN Department of Agriculture and Rural Development is to be able to reach a situation where there is no difference in the environment when driving from a commercial to a communal area, both must look equally lush, dotted with infrastructure with healthy crops and livestocks. In this regard, we are working with the Ministers on exciting projects to uplift the KZN livestock industry. The plan is to assist communal farmers to commercialise their cattle, goats, pigs and sheep so that they can participate fully in the mainstream economy. So, this involves making available a package on intervention from fencing to improving the genetics of the stock, better nutrition and most importantly focusing on the caring capacity of the veld and ensuring the well resourced grazing. We must also thank the Minister of Rural Development and Land Reform for setting aside R100 million for the one household and one hectare food security and poverty eradication. If you travel across KZN, you will see the difference that these unheralded initiatives are making into the lives of the people.

Hon Chairperson, far from information highways of the urban centres with little fanfare, small agricultural projects are beginning to change the lives of the rural communities. Jobs and income are being generated; similarly as we outlined earlier, particularly land reforms farms that are lying fallow, we are seeing them back in production. We are doing these by creating jobs for the unemployed graduates as we have already started a scheme for the unemployed.

 

 

Just to zoom into the Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, the hon Minister Senzeni Zokwana has delivered a Budget speech of hope. We have seen the number of household farmers have increased, agro-processing sales have grown and jobs in the sector increased by 211 000 in the third quarter of 2015 as compared to the same period the previous year. According to the Quarterly Labour Force Survey released by Statistics SA on Monday, all sectors experienced job losses in the first three months of this year except for community and social services as well as agriculture, where jobs grew by 1600. These are some of the positive steps forward in agriculture and they occurred when the country was in the grips of a devastating drought. Yes, the gross value of the agricultural sector has shrunk, but the good news is that exports have increased.

 

Hon Chairperson we can focus on the negatives, whoever wants or we can choose to build on the positives. As the famous author Helen

Keller would tell us; ?Optimism is the faith that leads to achievement. Nothing can be done without hope and confidence.?

 

 

The Minister of agriculture, hon Zokwana, has given us both hope and confidence that the agriculture sector is moving forward and becoming a catalyst for economic growth in the country. This was not just reflected in the successes outlined. The Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries is leading the way for provinces to follow and is decisively tackling challenges in the sector.

 

 

Minister Zokwana, in KZN we are determined to play our part in growing the agricultural export basket. Last week, the provincial government announced plans to export cut flowers and vegetables that are grown around the Dube Trade Port to the Gulf States. This is as a result of the Qatar Airlines flying directly to Durban.

 

 

Thank you for the leadership of the Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries in growing the aquaculture sector as well. KZN‘s Department of Agriculture and Rural Development has established an aquaculture post to drive the agricultural programme in the province. After having struggled with the through the ravages of food and mouth disease as a province, we applaud the commitment of the national department to seek additional funds for the construction new FMD facility at the ARC. As the province, we also

applaud that the department has established a food price monitoring committee at the National Agricultural Marketing Council to check and report on the food prices.

 

Statistics SA has revealed that food price inflation increased by 9,8% by March this year with bread and cereals rising by 13,3% and vegetables by over 18%. In KwaZulu- Natal we have doubled our efforts to ensure food security. At the heart of everything that we do is upliftment of the poor. The department is set to establish 1370 household food gardens, 170 community gardens, 190 institutional gardens, and 198 food tunnels. The idea is not to dish out seeds in the hope that people will establish gardens. We are offering a starter pack including seeds, broiler chickens and goats, if desired as well as skills training and support. The objective is for households to get a kick-start and encouragement to grow their enterprises.

 

 

So, the Budget speech for agriculture certainly gave us hope and the incentive to continue in our drive to revitalise agriculture and agro-processing value chain as it has been reflected in the Budget speech in KZN legislature, that as a department we had learnt from the resilience of farmers, who are struggling through the ravages of drought, but who remain committed and passionate about their connection to the land. I said that like the farmers we serve, the KZN Department of Agriculture and Rural Development is committed to

growing the agriculture sector by transcending adversity and facing the future with optimism. To reiterate Keller‘s words — optimism is the faith that leads to achievement. With those words we support both Budget Votes for the two departments. I thank you.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES:

Chairperson, Ministers who are here both Zokwana and Nkwintithe, Deputy Ministers who are all here, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, friends and foes, my humble and agriculture centred revolutionary greetings to members. I greet this august House in the name of agriculture because our very existence in this planet earth is dependent on the agricultural sector. Human beings need only three things to exist, namely, oxygen, water and food.

 

 

This is one sector that requires people from all walks of life, regardless of their political affiliate and skin colour to unanimously take a firm position to support and defend the agricultural sector. This, we earnestly owe to the generation of Chief Luthuli, to the current generation, to the generation of the next 100 years and to the almighty God Himself.

 

 

The commemoration of 20 years of our Constitution can no longer be on paper, but it must be seen, felt, heard and held in high esteem by fellow South Africans. The fulfilment of hope for a better life

and the answer to the triple challenges of poverty, hunger and unemployment lies in the heartbeat of service delivery at provincial and local levels. This informs our founding representation in this Parliament.

 

 

Provincial grants take the highest percentage of our national budget, hence the call for increased service delivery performance and high level of efficiency and effectiveness in government programmes which are aimed at growing the agricultural sector, whilst responding to the fundamental mandate of food security, job creation and economic growth.

 

 

This Budget Vote has a common denominator which is mainly caused by the effects of drought. We are calling on ourselves to make sure that the young people are party of growth of this industry. It is on the score that quite several young people have been invited and placed after they have finished their degrees in different universities in South Africa. We have several Doctors of Philosophy, PhDs, and several masters degrees that are working and are placed in the Department of Agriculture to make sure that we grow.

 

 

The Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme, Casp, impact study conducted in 2014-15 indicated that only 14% of supported farmers were youth. We need to do better here in terms of youth and women.

We have since increased our focus in prioritising youth participation in agriculture and the department has initiated a number of programmes in this regard. The 230 unemployed graduates will be recruited, 177 are already placed in the department, 55 will be placed at the Perishable Products Export Control Board as export technologists and 30 will be deployed to various Agricultural Policy Action Plan aligned farming enterprises.

 

 

Thanks to the leadership of Minister Zokwana, especially while facing drought and trying to deal with this matter. The problem with Mr Smith minus H is that ... [Interjections.]

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Deputy

Minister, the surname is Smit.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: The

 

problem is that from ... [Interjections.] I withdraw.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Smit,

 

please I heard you ...

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: I

withdraw.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: He has

 

withdrawn.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Deputy

Minister, please take your seat.

 

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon Chair, thank you for the withdrawal, but I just want to remind the hon the Deputy Minister that we are hon members and not Mr and Ms.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: And I

am Cele, and not chele. That should really start next time when you come and make your presentation. The problem is that Zille cannot differentiate between the Syrians who are refugees in Germany and Africans who are in South Africa and in Cape Town. She regards them as refugees. That is the kind of thinking that you always establish here. We are not refugees, but we are South Africans here.

 

 

The crux of the matter is that the money that is sent to the Western Cape to assist small farmers is used for other things. It is only 1% of the small farmers who have been assisted here. I invited the MEC to Pennsburg to visit and see the drought victims. He refused. He wrote three letters refusing. When I reached there I really see why he was refusing. He was refusing because he could not stand the

things that were said by people about the DA government and him in this province. People are removed and are not given land. I invited him and he refused, then I knew why he was refusing to get there.

 

MR O S TERBLANCHE: Chairperson, I just want to ask the hon the Deputy Minister if he could take a question.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: If the

 

question is smart enough, but at the end.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: He is not taking

your question.

 

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: The DA

 

members believe that they rule the world. There is a Chair who must tell me to seat, but this hon member really believes that he is more than anybody else here. I am simply saying to the DA, please, accept African as part of the Western Cape, and not as refugees.

 

 

We invite you. Definitely I am quoting Zille who called Africans refugees in the Western Cape. Yes, everybody knows that we were called refugees. I am simply repeating her words. I am saying that please remind Madam Zille that we are not refugees, but we are South Africans even in this corner of the world - please do so.

Next time invite us, we invite you. Go and work as we work with South African issues, and not the Western Cape. Draught is for all of us. Let us work together in this one and make sure that we find answers and all South Africans will get our assistance. I end here, hon Chairperson. I repeat, we are not refugees. [Applause.]

 

Mr N D MASEMOLA (LIMPOPO- CHAIRPERSON FOR TRANSPORT, SAFETY, SECURITY

 

AND LIASON): Hon. Chairperson, Ministers present here, Minister Zokwana and Minister Nkwinti, and all Deputy Ministers present here this afternoon, hon. members of the House, distinguished Guests, ladies and gentlemen, this Budget debate takes place during the month of May, which has been adopted by our democratic government and the beloved continent as Africa month. This is done to continuously highlight continental efforts to enhance good governance, infrastructure development, and in essence ensure that he New Partnership for Africa's Development, NEPAD, does find resonance and expression in the development plans of countries on the continent. Therefore our fight against menaces of chronic hunger and food insecurity is part of ensuring that we herald this new beginning of Africa, that is free of devastating pandemics which have been characteristic of socio-economic conditions of societies on the continent.

 

 

Indeed reversing the colonial legacy of land dispossession through

a comprehensive process of land restitution and post settlement support, is both a necessary and complementary facet of this important drive to see our country and continent restoring its glory.

 

As we continue to rewrite our history, it is profound to bear in mind these pearls of wisdom by the greatest son of Africa, Patrice Lumumba when he said:

 

 

The day will come when history will speak. But it will not be the history which will be taught in Brussels, Paris, Washington or the United Nations. It will be the history that will be taught, in the countries which would have won freedom from colonisation and its puppets. Africa will write its own history and in both north and south, it will be the history of glory and dignity.

 

The sustainable development of the agricultural sector and an inclusive rural economy, is our contribution towards this benign mission of African ?renewal‘ and efforts to reverse the pernicious effects of colonial plunder and pillage. It is through the responsible use of our lush forestry and shoals of fisheries, both for the sustenance of our livelihoods and preservation for the benefits of posterity, that will advance the rebirth of our continent.

It is imperative to point-out that, despite our country being subjected to a devastating drought by climate change, we have interventions aimed at bringing relieves and further have plans to create vibrant and productive communities. We all know that we are a water-stressed country, worse being the less annual rainfall of 450 millilitres compared to a global average of 860 millilitres per year according to the Action-aid report.

 

 

Transformative policies and legislations have been put in place to advance land revolution and ensure access and redistribution. This has to be done to address historical challenges, ensure food security and broad participation of communities on productive efforts of the sector. As such, the Limpopo Department of Agriculture and Rural Development has recorded several achievements. With regard to the revitalisation of small holder irrigation schemes, it has completed in the past financial year, repairs on the Mapela and Phetwane Irrigation Schemes. It has set aside R23,5 million in the current budget to complete infrastructure work at Mogalatjane, Matsika, Hereford and Krokodilheuwel irrigation Schemes.

 

Since the declaration of the Province as a disaster area given the devastating drought, the department had initially set aside

R3 million for the provision of feed to assist the affected famers; and subsequently reprioritised R51 million in order to meet the

rising demand for fodder and livestock water, required by both small scale and subsistence farmers.

 

 

As at the end of March, an estimated 175 000 bags of fodder costing almost R36 million, have been delivered to 22 000 farmers in all the five districts of the province. Further than that, more than 3 600 tons of concentrated feeds, have been delivered to close to 9 000 farmers in the province.

 

With regard to livestock water assistance, various types of interventions are being provided including drilling and equipping of boreholes, supply of water tanks and mobile drinking troughs. This current financial year, R54 million will be allocated to address the requests that have been already processed by the officials in the department. In this regard, from the estimated cost is R174 million required these efforts will take the province forward and indeed responding to the needs that have been demonstrated by the farmers in the province. Indubitably therefore, this will go a long way in enabling the department to be of assistance to the needy famers and this happens because of the national assistance of both the Departments of Agriculture and Rural Development and the Ministers in particular.

 

 

The world, the country, provinces, local municipalities, famers and

the rest of us, have learned valuable lessons about how to navigate the challenges occasioned by dry and arid seasons. We need not despair, although the test is too tough. We have become more wiser and better equipped in dealing with situations of this magnitude.

 

 

As President Nelson Mandela once said ?Disasters will always come and go, leaving their victims either completely broken or steeled, seasoned and better able to face the next crop of challenges than they may occur?

 

 

Agri-Parks are networked innovation and system of agro-production, of processing; logistics and marketing; training and extension services located in municipalities, to enable market driven combination and integration of various agricultural activities.

These facilities are in sync with the National Development Plan's, NDP, approach of targeting high-value-commodities most of which are labour intensive, to stimulate growth, promote sustainable production and improve institutional support system.

 

 

In pursuing this objectives, consultative sessions were held in the province on viability and modalities of the proposed sites and the envisaged produce, the proposals are as follows regarding the anchor produce per district, the Capricorn region has been identified as anchor for potato belt; Mopani area for fruits and vegetables;

Sekhukhune area for maize production; Vhembe area for fruits and vegetables; Waterberg area for both vegetables as well as red meat cluster.

 

Through extended Public Works Programme, the department has created

 

3 554 job opportunities using labour intensive methods which benefited both women and youth. With enough money being allocated, hopefully from these budgets that are been adopted today here, clearly the numbers will increase in this current financial year.

 

 

Furthermore, through food security interventions and Fetsa Tlala Programme, 3 342 households were supported through seeds and seedling packages, goats and eggs production schemes were also given to our people in the province. However, some efforts were affected as a result of drought which has been experienced by a larger part of the country. Through livestock improvement programme, 507 breeding stocks have been distributed, and further 200 will be distributed from the farmers who will be repaying their loans to many other beneficiaries who have already been identified for actual benefit. This project has benefitted 804 beneficiaries from 72 projects.

 

The department will be launching in the current financial year the following projects by June this year: Sekhukhune Animal Clinic and

Veterinary Compulsory Community Programme in Strydkraal Village in Fetakgomo Municipality; Lebopo Project in Ballon Village producing avocados and vegetables in Maruleng Municipality; MD Letebele producing vegetables in Willows Village in Maruleng Municipality; Sisimuka Piggery in Broederstroom area in Tzaneen Municipality; Vhuawelo farming producing cucumber, peppers and other vegetables in Modimolle Municipality; Mapela Livestock Farmers in Mogalakwena Municipality and JJ Farming Project producing vegetables and red meat in Mogalakwena Municipality of the Waterberg District.

 

 

The legacy of colonialism and apartheid perpetuated inequalities and less access to land, thus constraining communities to produce their own food. And as such, the democratic government had to effect a radical departure from colonial legacy of deprivation, and advance an agenda of land reform and land redistribution. Through this programme, many communities have benefited from this process and post-settlements support interventions. However, we still need to do more, given the centrality of land as our valuable asset, to ensure that in future this country does not experience a possible land revolution. Ke a leboga. [Thank you.] [Time expired.]

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Ke a leboga, Modulasetilo. Ke dumedise Aforikaborwa ka bophara. Ke boe gape ke re ... [Chairperson, I greet South Africa at large, and ...]

The EFF rejects budget Vote 39 on Rural Development and Land Reform. Let us also jus note that outside, we have people from Gwatyu at Cofimvaba in the Eastern Cape who are protesting because the department has refused to listen to their cries for many years.

 

 

The resolution of the land question is central to the political programme of the EFF. And our considered view is that the department has been a spectacular failure in dealing with both the land and agrarian questions in South Africa.

 

 

Just consider the following facts: Firstly, the government has to date managed to transfer only about 8% of the land back to black people costing the state billions of rands. Secondly, the government has still not settled all the land claims submitted before the 1998 deadline for the first phase of land restitution, and has settled most claims through financial compensation, doing nothing to change the structure of landholding as a result. Thirdly, the government has reopened the land claim process, and estimates that over 400 000 new land claims will be lodged, which will cost the state about R180 billion to settle, over a period of about 100 years considering the rate of investment inland reform by the department since 1994 to date.

 

There are two fundamental problems that the ANC refuses to tackle, despite Mr Zuma opportunistically raising them as obstacles to land

reform. Firstly, there is a gross misrepresentation of the origins of the land question ... [Interjections.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, please take your seat. Hon Mthethwa.

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: Madam Chair, on a point of order, the hon member is calling Mr Zuma, His Excellency President J G Zuma, and the President of the Republic of South Africa.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, sir. Hon Mokgosi, the President may not be a Member of Parliament but once he is in Parliament he is referred to because he is covered by all the Rules of Parliament. Please, refer to him accordingly.

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: President Zuma of the ANC.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, President Zuma of the ANC is the President of the Republic of South Africa.

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: President Zuma representing the ANC people.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, President Zuma is the President of the Republic of South Africa. Are you disputing that?

Ms N P MOKGOSI: President Zuma of the ANC, the President of South Africa.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Yes Ma‘am. Please continue.

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Firstly, there is a gross misrepresentation of the origins of the land question in current legislative and policy frameworks, if land reform is intended to redress past land dispossessions, then limiting people to claim for land that they were dispossessed of only from 1913 legitimises pre-1913 land dispossessions, for which there is a compelling amount of historical evidence.

 

 

Secondly, the property clause entrenches in section 25(1)of the Constitution, which compels the state to pay current white land owners for land targeted for land reform purposes cripples any hope for swift land reform and gives white farmers veto power over land reform. Now, consider that ...

 

 

... batho ba rona ba tlhakanela mabitla, batho ba rona le fa ba le mo botshelong ba sa ntse ba sa tshele sentle ka lebaka la lefatshe. Le mo losong la bone ba tlhakanela mabitla. Ka jalo ga re bone seriti sepe gotlhelele. (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)

[... our people share graves. Even while on earth, they cannot enjoy themselves as a result of not having the land. They do not get the dignity they deserve even in their grave.]

 

For the 2016-17 financial year, this department has been allocated R10 124 billion for all its five programmes. More significantly, it has been given just over R2,6 billion for the land restitution programme. This money meant for restitution is basically money to pay off white land owners for the land that government will have to buy back in order to fulfil its constitutional obligation to do land reform.

 

 

There is no land reform programme in this country; rather there is a massive land purchase programme which only benefits the white illegitimate owners of the land. We have heard President Zuma being opportunistic by bemoaning the legislated reality that the democratic government since 1994 has had to pay for land reform. This has been at a cost to government of over R80 billion.

 

 

President Zuma forgets that it is his government that refuses to let the Constitutional Court decide on what is just and equitable compensation for land reform. He has presided over the very laws he now claims are oppressive to black people. He wants people to think

that he is powerless, while he has all the power to introduce policies that will significantly reform land holding in this country.

 

 

The EFF is the only party that stands unequivocally for land expropriation without compensation. The EFF is the only party that supports comprehensive rural development. We urge traditional leaders to refuse to be lied to by President Zuma, the resolution of the land question lies outside of the ANC. [Interjections.]

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, please take your seat.

 

 

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: Chairperson, the hon member is misleading the public and this House by saying there is no land reform in South Africa.

 

Futhi kunabantu abanamapulazi ... [Akuzwakali.] [And there are people who have farms ... [Inaudible.]]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, don‘t do that. Hon Mthethwa, I am going to allow what the hon Mokgosi has said as a point of debate. I think members of this House ... [Inaudible.] if there is a contention in the statement she is making.

 

Dr Y C VAWDA: Thank you, Chair. I am covered because I was going to make the same point that it is a point for debate.

Ms N P MOKGOSI: When the EFF wins over municipalities, we will demonstrate with clarity what ought to happen with the land. We therefore reject this budget vote of the land.

 

We would like to thank members of the public who sent messages expressing their concerns for the dismal state of agriculture, forestry and fisheries in this country. We encourage them to continue doing that, as the EFF is the only party in this Parliament that deeply cares about the state of agriculture, forestry and fisheries, and that is a fact.

 

 

Agriculture in South Africa is in a permanent state of crisis, and there is no overarching vision for agrarian change and reform to position agriculture as the growth sector of our economy.

 

 

South Africa which used to export more food than it imported, became a net importer of food from 2007. The reason for the decline in South African agriculture is twofold: The input costs of farming are rising faster than outputs; and there is a high level of uncertainty around government policies affecting agriculture.

 

 

Agriculture in China contributed to about 34% of the total employment in that country, while only 11,3% of its land is considered arable. Only 9% of the land in Brazil is considered arable, but about 15,1%

of its total employment comes from agriculture. Cuba, a small island in the Caribbean, manages to produce organic food, with the use of bio-fertilisers, ensuring the continuing health of the soil, as well as producing health foods for that nation in a sustainable manner.

 

 

In South Africa, with 12% of the land considered arable, but primary agriculture contributes about 3% to the GDP. Listen very careful hon Wana. With this dynamic in mind, it is horrendous that the department has only set aside R297 million of its budget for trade promotion and market access. This means that the department plan on doing pretty much nothing to promote market access for farmers who are suffocated out of the system by the more farmers.

 

 

The outcome of the fishing quota allocation process has been released as yet, but we do know that less than 20% will be allocated to big business; this, Minister means that more than 80% will be allocated to big businesses where the ANC has a huge stake – that is a fact. With these allocations, small-scale fishers will not be able to share in the high value species such as the west coast rock lobsters, abalone and hake.

 

 

Your department continues to lease out state forests to big white owned companies, at ridiculously low-rates. Most municipalities have no agricultural development plans. The EFF governed municipalities

will make sure that we avail suitable municipal land for agricultural development in support of small-scale farmers. [Interjections] Be patient come 3 august.

 

An EFF-led City of Cape Town – listen DA - will make sure that the Philippi Horticultural area is protected and that housing development will instead take place closer to the city, which is closer to where businesses are. The EFF-led municipalities would make it mandatory to buy, at least, 70% of our food required from

mall-scale farmers.

 

 

 

The EFF-led municipalities will discontinue the marginalisation of farmers, who farm in communal areas, for they are never given support by government because they do not have tittles to the land. Our approach to agricultural development will ensure that all available agricultural land is used for agriculture, maximising employment opportunities and making agriculture a major contributor to our economy. And EFF-led government - listen hon Wana - will heavily subsidise efficient agriculture, to make it globally competitive.

 

 

MODULASETULO WA NCOP: Ke a leboga, nako e fedile.

Mme N P MOKGOSI: Fa o tsamaya o ntse o raya batho o re “shoot to kill? o bo o tla gape ko temothuong, botshelo ga bo ka ke jwa nna botoka. Ke a leboga.

 

MODULASETULO WA NCOP: Nako e fedile. (Translation of Setswana paragraphs follows.)

 

 

[The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: I thank you, time expired.

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: If you go around instructing people to shoot to kill and then talk about agriculture, life will never be better. I thank you.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Time has expired.]

 

 

Mr A S SINGH: Chairperson, hon Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, the Minister of Rural Development and Land Reform, the hon Deputy Ministers present, hon members, the last speaker, who said there is no land reform in South Africa, needs to attend committee meetings so that she will know what is happening.

 

 

Dr Y C VAWDA: Hon Chairperson, I am just wondering: Is it parliamentary for the members sitting on my left to harass the other Members of Parliament here? Thank you, Chair.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Vawda, it is not parliamentary for any member to harass any member. So, please, hold, and keep your harassment to yourselves, hon members. Hon Singh, please continue.

 

Mr A S SINGH: Somebody once said that there are three ways for a nation to acquire wealth. The first is by war, as the Romans did, by plundering and conquering neighbours - that is robbery. The second is by commerce – generally, by cheating. The third is by agriculture

- the only honest way, where a man receives a real increase of the seed thrown into the ground, in a kind of continual miracle brought by the hand of God in his favour, as a reward for his innocent life and virtues. It is with this in mind that we are today debating the very important budgets of the Departments of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, and Rural Development and Land Reform. These allow our people the opportunity to use their labour to till the soil and earn an honest living.

 

 

As one listens to the speeches of the Ministers and their Deputy Ministers, it is evident that both these departments have set themselves on a course that will not only grow the agricultural sector, but will address the challenges to enhance production, create jobs, reduce poverty in the rural areas of this country, and provide the necessary measures to ensure food security through the sustainable use of natural resources in the sector.

One of the most important assets in South Africa is our youth. It is therefore encouraging that the department acknowledges the importance of creating an awareness and love for the soil in our youth. At the same time, there is a critical need to support our young people in disadvantaged, rural areas. The LandCare programme provides for these opportunities, as the Minister has mentioned.

 

 

The youth in South Africa are the most targeted generation, since the future of this country relies on them. LandCare, as a programme, has realised the need for capacitating and involving the youth in their activities, since the future of all our natural resources lies in their capable hands. The programme has initiated subprogrammes, such as Junior LandCare, in and out of school, and also the involvement of young adults in the implementation of projects of rural development in communities. Accredited and nonaccredited training is offered. The main aim of involving young people in these projects is to encourage them to be young agricultural entrepreneurs.

 

 

Through the implementation of the different labour-intensive LandCare projects, such as gabion construction, wetland rehabilitation, fencing construction, alien species removal and the construction of water reticulation points in the provinces, the LandCare Programme has managed to create 2 803 jobs for young South Africans, especially in rural areas. Junior LandCare also managed

to transfer skills to 12 280 young people through different fields of training, such as chainsaw operation, gabion structure construction, project management and financial management. It is therefore encouraging to see that the department is making

R69,3 million available to provinces by way of conditional grants.

 

 

 

The R35 million that has been allocated to the National Agricultural Marketing Council will go a long way to, firstly, increasing market access for all market participants; secondly, promoting the efficiency of the marketing of agricultural products; thirdly, optimising export earnings from agricultural products, as the previous speaker has said; and lastly, enhancing the viability of the agricultural sector. This will achieve much, through research on trade, linking farmers to markets, monitoring food prices and input costs, as well as value chain analysis; development schemes aimed at leveraging the potential of smallholder agriculture through partnerships, as well as technical assistance and training programmes; and industry trusts, bridging the communication gap between industry and the Ministry. These are the important aspects that the Ministry has highlighted.

 

 

The Department of Rural Development and Land Reform faces the task of dealing with the emotive issues of land and the possession of land. Throughout history, this was the cause of many wars that left

indelible scars in many forms. The task of the department is to rectify the injustices of the past by implementing a just and equitable redistribution of land across our country, and potentially, getting our land and its ownership under control. This asks for strong leadership, and the kind of leadership shown by our hon Minister has proved that this Ministry is led by a capable Minister.

 

 

It is very clear that the Minister is committed to ensuring that South Africans in rural areas enjoy the same benefits as those in urban areas regarding the human rights and basic dignity guaranteed by the Constitution. This will be achieved by rolling out the Comprehensive Rural Development programme to all rural municipalities; improving productivity in land-reform projects through effective implementation of the Recapitalisation and Development programme; expediting the finalisation of land claims; improving corporate governance and ensuring enhanced service delivery; implementing proper change management and innovation strategies; democratic and equitable land allocation and use across gender, race and class; and strict production discipline for guaranteed national food security.

 

 

One of the key programmes to alleviate poverty is the establishment of Agri-parks that will contribute to the one-household-one-hectare initiative, which promotes food security and improves rural

livelihoods. I think that my colleague from KwaZulu-Natal has said while we shovel in the province, we see the success. The success of the implementation of this programme can already be seen in the 10 566 smallholder farmers that were identified to benefit through the

69 692 ha of land that has been distributed.

 

 

 

The R2,7 billion in the budget will assist in acquiring much-needed land that is needed to work towards the goal of 1,14 million ha of strategically located land to create an estimated 1 107 productive and profitable farms. During the past two years, the department has acquired 665 994 ha of land, and we have seen the success of that.

 

 

I would like to thank the Minister for the allocation of

R18 788 million to the KwaZulu-Natal Ingonyama Trust Board to manage land for the material benefit and social wellbeing of the individual members of communities. The department has assisted KwaZulu-Natal in various ways, for which we are thankful. I will name a few: 82 infrastructure projects; 12 Agri-parks; 26 agriculture enterprises supported; 118 land claims settled; 9 913 ha acquired; 4 956 ha allocated to smallholder farmers; and 1 078 ha allocated to farm dwellers.

 

 

I need to thank both Ministers and their departments for their commitment to support farmers during this terrible drought situation

that we have experienced. The R381 million that the Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries has made available for programmes to assist farmers is welcomed. As part of the programme,

224 boreholes have been drilled and 320 000 bags of feed have been distributed. So far, both departments have spent over R1 billion in direct or indirect assistance.

 

Rural women in South Africa not only face higher poverty rates, they also have little to no resources available to them. We, in the ANC, support the Budget Vote. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

 

Ms B SCHAFER (WESTERN CAPE: CHAIRPERSON - AGRICULTURE & ECONOMIC

 

DEVELOPMENT COMMITTEE): Chairperson of the NCOP, Ministers, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, let me start by saying that this year is certainly not a year for business as usual. Agriworkers and farmers face one of the worst droughts in recent history, and my thoughts and prayers go out to them as they face their daily struggle.

 

 

A report presented in a joint portfolio committee meeting by the Department of Water and Sanitation recently has reported that almost

34 million South Africans are affected by, ?Moderate to extreme drought?. As such, it is an absolute shame when Ministers in national government stubbornly refuse to declare South Africa‘s drought a national disaster.

Equally so, it‘s a shame that Minister Zokwana mentioned the word drought only three times in his budget speech in the National Assembly. Three times! Is that the importance that the Minister places on a sector that primarily supports some of the poorest rural communities in the country? I say that is a shame!

 

Organisations such as AgriSA have reported that the current drought is of such great intensity that it is beyond the ambit of any farmer to mitigate, despite his or her resource base. Furthermore, it is estimated that it could take at least three years for farmers to recover from this devastating drought.

 

 

But, while the drought threatens farms with bankruptcy; it is estimated that this drought will result in an 11% food price increase before the end of 2016 which negatively affects the consumer. In March, it was reported in the media that already food prices had already increased by 8% - just three months into this calendar year. In particular, the cost of bread and maize is rising. This will hit the poorest of the poor in our country first.

 

 

South Africa is facing a growing crisis. The risk of vulnerable communities not having financial means to access to food is growing. The Western Cape has requested R88 million from national government in drought relief. However, the Western Cape waits patiently for the

national Department of Agriculture to officially gazette the West Coast, Central Karoo, Witzenberg, Prince Albert, Oudtshoorn and two district municipalities as drought disaster areas.

 

While it considers our request, farmers have very real obligations that cannot wait on onerous government resources and processes. The people of this Province cannot wait any longer. Equally so, the people across South Africa affected by the drought cannot wait either.

 

 

While the ANC-led government is dragging its feet, the Western Cape decided to take action. The Western Cape is truly committed to agriculture, Minister Cele, because it is the backbone of the rural economy and employment in our province, and because we understand that agriculture is tightly linked to our food system and our food security.

 

 

Emerging farmers are at great risk. Therefore, the Western Cape Government has thrown a R23 million lifeline to animal farmers as a subsistence allowance. This is in addition to the R11 million emergency relief funding for emerging grain farmers to ensure that they can pay their workers, and do not go out of business due to the losses they suffer. This how a government invests in its people!

 

 

Without the additional assistance from national government however,

we do not have the resources to assist our larger farms which are crucial to job creation, our food security and to keep food prices stable. Previously it took two years before the national government provided emergency drought assistance. If they drag their feet much longer this time around, we will face a full-blown disaster. The drought has certainly highlighted the importance for the Western Cape to promote sustainable Agripractices.

 

 

With the increased scarcity of water, farmers can no longer ignore the need for sound conservation farming. Next week we will see the launch of SmartAgri, a first-time collaborative effort by the Western Cape Departments of Agriculture and Environmental Affairs and Development Planning to develop a climate change response framework and implementation plan. SmartAgri responds to the need for a practical and relevant climate change response plan, specifically for the agricultural sector of the Western Cape province.

 

 

Land reform is one of the biggest failures of our 22 years in democracy. Land reform is essential to redress the injustices of the past, yet most of national government‘s projects are failing. The government seems to be either deliberately stalling reform or it is not capable of doing so.

 

We have two different Ministers here today, both trying to do the

same thing; neither are succeeding. The Department of Agriculture should be doing just that – agri culture! And, the Department of Land Reform should be buying land and giving it to its people; not holding on to it, and not leasing it out. It must give people ownership of land!

 

I asked the Minister: Where is the white paper on the many policy proposals he churns out of his department? My advice is: Instead of creating all this confusion, uncertainty and fear in the sector, stick to a plan and implement a policy that really works. From the Extension of Security of Tenure Act to the Land Reform: Labour Tenants Act, both are weak. Why? Because there is not strategy around long-term tenure security, and actually, it robs women independence of access to land reform!

 

 

The 50:50 gender representation policy creates an incentive to retrench farmworkers within nine years and adds an estimated capital loss of R141 billion to the sector. And now there is a Minister‘s One Household One Hector plan. I don‘t know, but what I do know is that to date land reform is failing dismally.

 

 

National Treasury‘s performance and expenditure review has raised concerns around land reform, stating that 80% of the Land Commission‘s R4,8 billion relates to postsettlement support. Not

enough money, it says, is being spent on settling the 8 700 claims still outstanding. It is estimated that up to R300 billion is needed to settle future and existing claims over the next 20 years. I think you need to get back to the drawing board as next to South Africa‘s nuclear deals, this will become one of the country‘s most expensive exercises to date.

 

 

Although land reform is a national competency, hon Member Prins, we in the DA-run Western Cape have placed land reform as a strategic objective. We have worked closely together with our privately owned farms and found other ways to restore the dignity of people through support programmes, such as our Land Reform Advisory Desk. This service - situated at the Cape Agency for Sustainable Integrated Development in Rural Areas, the Casidra - provides support to emerging and existing farmers in the industry and is on ways to restructure land reform deals. We believe that this desk will assist in taking land reform in the Western Cape to a 70% success rate within five years.

 

 

While you might criticise us over our share equity scheme, the Western Cape is still the only province showing a 62% success rate in shared ownership, and that‘s a fact! In a report commissioned by the International Labour Organisation, ILO, which was discussed during a briefing ... [Interjections.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Schafer,

 

please take your seat. Hon Mthethwa!

 

 

Mr M J MTHETHWA: Hon Chair, the hon member is misleading the public. You are misleading this House, hon member. You keep on praising the Western Cape as if the Western Cape is not governed by the ANC. The ANC is governing the whole country ... [Interjections.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Mthethwa,

that was not a point of order. Hon Schafer, please continue!

 

 

 

MS B SCHAFER: In a report commissioned by the International Labour Organisation, ILO, which was discussed during a briefing at the Portfolio Committee on Rural Development and Land Reform, it also reflects the outcome of the study done on the living conditions of our farmworkers or agriworkers. The report shows that the Western Cape farmers pay their farmworkers ...

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Schafer,

 

there is another. Please take you seat, ma‘m. Hon Wana, your hand is up!

 

Ms T WANA: Chairperson, I rise through you to ask if the speaker on the podium can take a question.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Schafer,

 

are you prepared to take a question? [Interjections.] No, ma‘m! Please continue hon Schafer!

 

Ms B SCHAFER: The report shows that the Western Cape farmers pay their farmworkers 24% more than the second-best province and 51% more than Limpopo. The Western Cape is participating actively in transforming the sector and continues to do so each and every day.

 

 

Finally, there is a real willingness for commercial farms to participate in land reform; yet there is no policy document or incentive to participate. There will be no real progress until they are brought into the fold, and until such time as our national Ministers acknowledge the role that commercial farmers play in South Africa. The number of commercial farms in South Africa is set to drop from 40 000 to about 15 000 over the next 15 years. Without enough viable commercial farms, South Africa‘s food security and agrisector jobs in our rural communities are at serious risk.

 

 

I would just like to say to the hon Member Prins that she is welcome to have coffee with me because I am not in charge of agriculture and I can catch her up on the last five years. We are not in charge of land reform; we only support your mandate in land reform! I thank you, Chairperson. [Applause.]

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon Chairperson, on a point of order, hon Prins is already having the coffee, she is not in the House. [Laughter.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Thank you, Mam

that was not a point of order. Hon Khawula, you are on the podium.

 

 

 

Mnu M KHAWULA: Mhlonishwa Sihlalo, abahlonishwa oNgqongqoshe, abahlonishwa amaPhini oNgqongqoshe, ubuhlakani bukaMhlonishwa Umntwana wakwaPhindangene owabe enguNdunankulu kahulumeni waKwaZulu, kwenza ukuba ngowe-1993 kuthathwe igxathu elibalulekile lokuvikela umhlaba weSilo samabandla, uBhejane odla abakayise.

Uhulumeni waKwaZulu waphasisa umthetho Ingonyama Trust okuyiwo owafaka ngaphansi kwesandla seSilo wonke umhlaba waKwaZulu.

Nangokwenqubo-ke nje, KwaZulu amakhosi aphethe umhlaba egameni leSilo. Izakhamuzi zamakhosi zisebenzisa umhlaba egameni leSilo. Lokhu kakuhluphi muntu ngoba kuyinqubo eyaziwayo.

 

Nakhu okudingwa ngabantu basemakhaya kuleminyango esingayo namuhla. Abantu badinga ukusizwa ngezinsiza zokuthi balime umhlaba ukuze baziphilise. Inkinga ngeyokuthi uhulumeni ubonakala emi le kude nabantu. Imiphakathi idinga usizo lokuba imfuyo emakhaya iphile ingabhuqwa yizifo kepha uhulumeni uqhelile kubantu. Abantu badinga ubuchwepheshe bezisebenzi zikahulumeni, abaluleki bezolimo mayelana

nokucwaninga ukuthi yimuphi umhlabathi ofanele siphi isitshalo. Lokhu bahlonishwa kakwenzeki ngendlela egculisayo.

 

 

Mayelana nabalimi asebesezingeni lokuhweba ngezitshalo zabo kulabo abakade bencishwe amathuba ngaphambilini, nakhona usizo luyadingeka kakhulu. Kufanele sikhumbule ukuthi uhulumeni wengcindezelo uwusebenzise kakhulu umhlabathi ukuthuthukisa abebala elilodwa, besizwa ngoxhaso, nezinye izinsiza ukuba babe ngabalimi abaphumelelayo. Uhlulwa yini lona wethu uhulumeni ukuba anikeze uxhaso olubonakalayo kubalimi abampisholo ukuze nabo basimame ngendlela efanele. Kuyasinda ukusebenza ngomhlaba. Ngaphandle kosizo noxhaso lukahulumeni, abalimi abampisholo angeke bakwazi ukuncintisana nozakwabo bebala ngempumelelo.

 

 

Ezindaweni abahlala kuzona abantu bakithi, bayafisa ukuba uhulumeni asondele nangosizo lokuba babiyelwe izingadi zabo, bakhelwe amadamu emfuyo, nokunye kokuziphilisa. Akuke kuthi ezinhlelweni zoMnyango wezoLimo kube khona ukubhekelela kwayo yonke imikhakha nezinhlangothi. Kunalaba abangabalimi abakhulu, asebesimeme, uhulumeni okufanele ababhekelele ngezinhlelo zokufukula umnotho wezwe. Ebese kuba nabasafufusa abadinga ukufukulwa. Ebese kuba nemiphakathi edinga ukubhekelelwa ngokuba ikwazi ukuziphilisa. Uma izinhlelo zikahulumeni zikekela kuhle kwelanga lasebusika zibheka omacaphunakusale bodwa, iyalimala imiphakathi. Lokhu kwenza ngaso

sonke isikhathi inkece abayitholayo abantu iphelele ezimakethe kube kanti bebengakwazi ukuzenzela okunye kokuziphilisa uma becosha uncedo.

 

Bahlonishwa, mangiyiphinde lenkulumo mhlawumbe kuyoze kuzwele kuzwakale. Umhlaba wamakhosi neSilo uthathwe ngamaqili ezandleni zamakhosi nezizwe zawo. Kuyasilimaza isithunzi samakhosi, isithuzi seSilo kanye nenqubompilo yobukhosi uma kuthi nxa usubuyiswa umhlaba, ebese wakhelwa izicagogwana zamakomidi okuwuphatha ibe ikhona Inkosi; sibe sikhona iSilo. Umhlaba weSilo owaqhwagwa mawubuyiselwe kuso iSilo. Umhlaba wamakhosi owaqhwagwa mawubuyiselwe kuwo amakhosi. Kuyinto enhle ukuba uhulumeni wenza lolu hlelo lokubuyiswa komhlaba futhi kube kuhle ukuba isikhathi silulwe. Sekusele nje yona lendawana yokuthi ubuyiselwa kuphi umhlaba.

 

 

Enye indawana ehluphayo yiyo lena yokuba kufakwe izicelo zokubuyiswa komhlaba. Emuva kwalokho kuthule kuthi du, kuze kuyobuya amakewu uyogeza kungazwakali ukuthi udaba lumi kuphi. Uma nje bahlonishwa ingathi ukuqhutshwa ngegiya elinomfutho lendaba yokubuyiswa komhlaba kungaba ngconywana.

 

Kunabantu abafaka izicelo zokuba kubuyele kubona umhlaba izizukulwane zabo ezingakaze zihlale kuwona. Kube yibo abahamba

phambili ebese kuthi labo abafanele ngempela bona basale ngemuva. Nayo lena iyadinga ukufakelwa izibuko uma senenza ucwaningo lwenu lokuthi wubani ofanelwe yini. Kwezinye izindawo iyaqhatha lento yamaqili afuna ukuqhoqhobala umhlaba angahlanganise lutho nawo.

Kade-ke sasiyikhuluma lena yokuthi basizwa kanjani abantu ukubasimamisa uma sebebuyelwe wumhlaba.

 

 

Olunye udaba oludinga ukulungiswa yileminyango yomibili inkinga ebhekene nabasebenzi basemapulazini. Bayakhala abasebenzi ngokuthi awabo amalungelo mafushane kunaloko okusuke kunqunyiwe. Inkulu ingcindezelo ababhekene nayo abasebenzi emapulazini. Uma kunemiklamo ethile yezinqumo zamaholo abafanele, kubona kufika sekungasafani nalelo nani elisuke linqunyiwe. Kuyofanele uMnyango wezabaSebenzi ngokubambisana naleMinyango yezoLimo nowezoMhlaba balulungise lolu daba.

 

 

Laphaya ogwini oluseningizimu yesifundazwe saKwaZulu-Natali, lapho ngiqhamuka khona nomhlonishwa uCele kunomcebo omningi ohlezi kuloluhwebo olusolwandle lwezinhlanzi, izimbaza nokunye. Kepha lengcebo iya iqhubeka isebenzela laba ababevele benamathuba ngaphambilini. Uhulumeni akukho akwenzayo ukusiza abadobi abampisholo ukuba nabo bazuze kulemboni. Kulemboni, endaweni yaKwaZulu-Natali kalukabibikho ushintsho. Ngiyathokoza kakhulu,

mhlonishwa Sihlalo isikhulumile Inkatha. (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

 

 

[Mr M KHAWULA: Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Ministers, the intelligence of the hon Prince of Phindangene, former Premier of KwaZulu government, was the reason why in 1993 there was an important step that was taken to protect the land that belonged to iSilo Samabandla, uBhejane odla abakayise (Praise names). The KwaZulu government passed the law called Ingonyama Trust which put the jurisdiction of the whole land of KwaZulu under the leadership of iSilo (King Goodwill Zwelithini Zulu.). Procedurally, in KwaZulu, the chiefs rule the land on behalf of the King. The residents under their chieftainship use the land on behalf of the King. That does not worry anyone because it is a known procedure.

 

This is what the people in the rural areas need from the departments we are here for today. People want to be assisted with the resources so that they can cultivate the land in order to earn a living. The problem is that the government is distancing itself from the people. Communities need assistance regarding the livestock so that the livestock do not die from diseases but the government is distant. People need expert public servants, advisors in the agriculture regarding soil analysis so that they can know which soil is good for which crop. This, hon, is not happening in a very satisfactory manner.

Regarding commercial farmers who were previously disadvantaged, they also need help. We must remember that the apartheid government used the land to develop one race, assisted by the subsidies, and other resources to become successful farmers. What is failing this government to give substantial subsidies to black farmers so that they can be sustainable. It is very difficult to work with the soil. Without the help and subsidies from government, black farmers cannot compete with their white counterparts when it comes to being successful.

 

 

In their communities, people wish for the government to assist with fencing of their gardens, building dams for their livestock, and other things in order for their wellbeing. The Department of Agriculture must provide for all sectors and spheres. There are those who are well established farmers, that are stable, government must provide for them programmes to stimulate the economy. And then there are those who are emerging and still need to be stimulated. And then there are communities that need to be provided for so that they can earn a living. If the government programmes are not coming to them and only focusing on the rich, the communities suffer. This is the reason why all the little money they get gets finished in the market whereas they could be able to do something for themselves when they get help.

Hon, let me say this again, maybe it will reach an ear willing to listen. The land of the chiefs and the King was taken by the foxes from the hands of the kings and their nations. This is trampling on the dignity of the chiefs, the dignity of the King and the kingship way of life because when the land is given back, then there are committees established to manage it whereas there are chiefs; and there is also the King. The land that was taken from the King must be brought back to the King. The land that was taken from the chiefs must be brought back to the chiefs. It is a good thing that government has embarked on this land restitution programme and it is a good thing that the time has been extended. The only thing remaining is that who is the land brought back to.

 

 

Another area of concern is the application for land restitution. After that nothing happens, no feedback whatsoever. If this process can be accelerated a bit it will be better. There are people who applied for land restitution but even their generations have not lived in that land. They are in the forefront and those who qualify are left behind. This also need to be looked at when you are conducting your research on who is eligible to get what. In other areas these foxes cause troubles as they want to have the land that does not belong to them. We have been talking about how do we then help the people after they have gotten their land back.

Another area that both these departments must correct is that of farm workers. The workers are complaining that their rights are limited compared to what has been decided on. Farm workers are faced with so much oppression. If there are set rates for the wages that they must receive, when it gets to them it is not the same as the amount that was agreed on. The Department of Labour and the Department of Agriculture and the Department of Land Reform and Rural Development must correct this.

 

 

At the south coast of the KwaZulu-Natal province, where I come from with hon Cele there is so much wealth in the business of fishing, mussels and others. But this wealth continues to work for those who were previously advantaged. Government is not doing anything to help black fishermen so that they can also benefit from this industry. In this industry, in KwaZulu-Natal, there has been no change. Thank you very much, hon Chairperson, the IFP has spoken.]

 

 

Mr L B GAEHLER: Mandibulise Sihlalo, ndibulise kubaPhathiswa bobabini, amaLungu ePalamente kunye nabahlali. Ndiyavuya ukuba nibekhona nobabini namhlanje ukwenzela ukuba omnye angasoli omnye. [Hon Chairperson, both of you hon Ministers, hon Members of parliament and citizens, greetings. I‘m happy for the presence of both of you so that no one can blame the other.]

Hon Minister Nkwinti, earlier years ...

 

 

... wawusithi ukuba uphuma eGauteng, uphulaphule kakuhle nawe ohloniphekileyo Zokwana, wawusithi xa uphuma phaya ubenengxaki nje yokuba kufuneka uthenge umgubo wokuxova isonka, uthenge izinto ezifunwa ngabantu abadala, iiswekile nekofu. Wawusazi ukuba phaya emakhaya kuyalinywa. Uyabona ke sibathanda singabathandi oorhulumente bamaphandle (homelands) banezinto ezintle abazenzileyo. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph follows.)

 

 

[... when you leave Gauteng, listen carefully hon Zokwana, your only problem would be that you just need to buy bread flour, sugar and coffee which is what elderly people need. You knew that they plough in the villages. Whether we like homeland governments or not, they have done good things.]

 

 

Let us be factual.

 

 

 

Khe sithethe le nto kuthiwa yinyani. Namhlanje sinabantu abangalimiyo kodwa banamasimi neegadi. Indawoni ingxaki? Ingxaki ilapha kuni. Abantu basezilalini bafuna imbewu nokubiyelelwa amasimi namadlelo. Into nje elula. Siyanibona ukuba niyanceda kwezinye iindawo. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph follows.)

[Let us speak what is called the truth. Today we have people who do not plough but have fields and gardens. Where is the problem? The problem is in you. People in the villages need seed to plough and fencing in the fields and grasslands. Something very easy. We see that you help in other areas.]

 

It is factual but the truth of the matter is, if we want to wean people from the grant dependency and from government, hon Cele, ...

 

 

... abantu rhoqo ngenyanga bemana besiya kupeya izibonelelo. Loo nto ide yenze nokuba abantwana abancinci bazale abantwana ngantlanu kuba bafuna esi sibonelelo. Makhe sincedise apha kwezolimo.

Bendikubhalele kwiiveki ezimbini ezigqithileyo, ndikuxelela iingxaki zabantu baseMzantsi Afrika. UnguSekela Mphathiswa waseMzantsi Afrika hayi uSekela Mphathiswa we-ANC. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph follows.)

 

 

[... people keep on getting grants every month. That makes young children to bear five children because they need this grant. Let us assist in agriculture. I wrote to you in the last two weeks, telling you about the problems of the people of South Africa. You are the Deputy Minister of South Africa not Deputy Minister of the ANC.]

You are also a Minister of South Africa through our tax. [Interjections.] I am not fighting but talking.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: You are

protected hon member, proceed.

 

 

 

Awusazi IsiXhosa wena khawuthule. [Kwahlekwa.] Abaphathiswa bangaphambili bathembisa abantu ukuba baza kubanceda kwiinkomo zabo ezingenanyama ngokubanika iinkunzi ezintle nasezigusheni. Nayiyeka loo nto leyo. [You do not understand isiXhosa, shut up. [Laughter.] Previous ministers promised to help people with their poorly fed cattle by giving them oxen and sheep. You stopped that.]

 

 

I pleaded with you Minister several times ...

 

 

 

... ngomcimbi weenkunzi zegusha kunanamhlanje akukhonto yenzekayo. [... about the issue or rams, even today nothing has happened.]

 

 

Worst of all, ...

 

 

 

... aba bantu kuthiwa ngabalimi bancedisa abantu awusokuze ubabone ebantwini. Iinkomo neegusha zabantu ziyafa. Khanikhe niguquke ngoku nijonge kwaba bantu bakuni. Abantu aba banincedayo kwinkululeko.

Khaniguquke nijonge kubantu aba bahluphekileyo kuba ukuba usa ezolimo ezilalini, ... (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph follows.)

 

 

[... those people called farmers who are supposed to help people, you will never see them among people. People‘s cattle and sheep die. You must look back at your people. People who helped you to get freedom. You must look back at people who are in poverty because if you bring agriculture in rural areas, ...]

 

... there will be less dependency from government.

 

 

 

Khanitshintsheni. [You must change.]

 

 

 

Hon Zokwana, you know very well, you are my homeboy and you know the problem that we have.

 

 

Xa sijonge elwandle kuxhaswa amalwandle aseNtshona Koloni naseMntla Kapa kuphela. Ukuba uvela ngaphaya akukho nto eqhubekayo tu phaya. Kutheni ningancedi aba bantu bahlala kweza ndawo kuba baya kufuna nabo ukuloba. Urhulumente we-ANC, sisi ondijongileyo, akabancedi abantu. Ngoko ke ndiyanicela khe nincede abantu.

Lento yamabango emihlaba kudala iqhubeka kodwa ayide isonjululwe. Kudala uluntu lwabangisana ngemida yemihlaba. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraphs follows.)

 

[When we look at the seas. Only seas in the Western Cape and Northern Cape that are supported. If you are from that side nothing is happening. Why don‘t you help people who stay in those places because they also need to do fishing. The ANC government doesn‘t help people. My sister, the one who is looking at me. So I‘m pleading you to please help people.

 

 

The land claims issue has been a problem but there is no solution. It‘s been a long time people accusing each other about land demarcation.]

 

 

What is the solution to that?

 

 

 

Musa ukusixelela ngoluntu oluxabanayo. Jongani kwaPayne kukho ingxaki, eBhaziya, KwaLindile naseeHighbury kukho ingxaki. [Don‘t tell us about quarrels among people. There is a problem in Payne, Bhaziya, Lindile and Highbury.]

 

Worst of all last year, your officials ...

... athi aza kuhlawula abantu iimali zabo ngeyeDwarha wonyaka ophelileyo, kunanamhlanje abakahlawulwa. Xa usiya kwamanye amaphondo, ohloniphekileyo Zokwana – ndikhe ndiphume neekomiti – uye ufumanise ukuba naba abantu bencedwa ngeenkomo, bencedwa ngezinto ezithile – kutheni, benzani aba bethu abantu? (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph follows.)

 

 

[... said they will pay people their money in October last year, they haven‘t paid even today. When you go to other provinces, hon Zokwana – I sometimes visit with committees – you will find out that people are helped with cattle, and other things – why, what is being done by our people?]

 

Why don‘t you come up with that programme?

 

 

 

Inkqubo eza kunceda abantu bakuthi. Iba mbi into yokuba abantu banikwe iifama bakugqiba bangancediswa. Eyona nto imbi kakhulu kukunika umntu ifama abe engazinto, njengalo sisi uthethayo apho. Akakwazi noko kulima kodwa ufuna ifama. Ufuna nje kuthiwe unefama. Ncedani nikhangele aba bantu bakwaziyo ukulima. Abantu bakuthi bayakwazi ukulima kwaye befuya iinkomo ntonje bafuna ukuncediswa.

 

 

Ndiyanicela baPhathiswa bethu ncedani abantu bakuthi. Bayekeni aba banibangayo, ningabaphathiswa boMzantsi Afrika kwaye nihlawulwa

ngeerhafu zethu. Mayicace leyo into. Ifana nale yaseNtshona Koloni. INtshona Koloni iphantsi koMzantsi Afrika. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraphs follows.)

 

[A programme that will help our people. It is bad for people to be given farms and get no assistance. The worse thing is to give someone a farm without any knowledge, like the lady talking there. She doesn‘t know farming but she needs a farm. She just want to own a farm. Please you must look for people who know farming. Our people know how to plough and to farm with livestock but they need to be assisted.

 

 

Please our hon Ministers, help our people. You must leave those who claim you, you are Ministers of South Africa and your salaries are paid from our tax. That must be clear. It‘s like the Western Cape. Western Cape is under South Africa.]

 

 

That is a bottom line. We do not have a federal state here. [Interjections.]

 

 

IseMzantsi Afrika, iphantsi koMzantsi Afrika. Phathani uMzantsi Afrika kakuhle qha nina. Enkosi. [Kwaqhwatywa.] [It‘s in South Africa, under South Africa. You must just govern South Africa in a good manner. Thank you. [Applause.]]

Cllr P RAMAREMELA (Salga): Thank you very much, Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces. The hon Minister of Rural Development and Land Reform, the hon Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, Deputy Ministers, the Minister of Transport and the Deputy Minister, members of the National Council of Provinces and special delegates, and hon Chairperson, as the SA Local Government Association, Salga, we would want to take this opportunity to thank you very much for allowing us to come and make an input on the NCOP policy debate on the Budget Votes for Rural Development and Land Reform, and Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, Votes 39 and 24 respectively.

 

 

Rural development and land reform underpinned by agriculture is the main economic driver. It‘s one of the key strategic priorities of government for creating a better life for all. Since 1994 the government has embarked on a number of initiatives aimed at positively impacting on the livelihoods of rural people with agriculture. Efforts to create a better life for all, especially those residing in rural areas, cannot be achieved without meaningful agrarian transformation. Various rural development and agricultural initiatives adopted by government thus far have had a varying degree of success largely due to the slow pace of transformation in the agricultural sector and other challenges associated with the establishment of viable institutional arrangements to co-ordinate,

manage and align the initiatives in the rural areas.

 

 

We concur with the Minister that transforming rural economies requires more than access to land. A holistic system that will ensure that transformation of the land tenure system, the development of the necessary social and economic infrastructure such as roads, bridges, dams and information computer technology, ICT, and ensuring that the entire agricultural value chain is adequately developed for farmers of all scales to produce for both local and international markets.

 

 

Being the sphere of government that is closest to the people, active participation of local government in the planning and implementation of all agrarian transformation rural development initiatives is imperative.

 

 

It is Salga‘s view that the initiative by the Ministers of Rural Development and Land Reform, and Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries should be entrenched in municipal integrated development plans, IDPs, and act as a catalyst for municipal local economic development initiatives.

 

We therefore look forward to partnering with the two departments in ensuring that the rural development and agrarian transformation

initiatives form the pillars of local economic development initiatives in the new generation of IDPs for rural municipalities.

 

 

The agri-parks initiative as outlined by the Minister must be seen as a game changer in pursuit of meaningfully changing the livelihoods of marginalised rural communities. The focus of agri-parks on the small scale farmers and the entire agriculture value chain including agroprocessing will not only create much-needed jobs in rural areas and slow down the rates of rural-urban migration but it will enable small scale farmers to process their produce and sell them when there are no price takers.

 

 

The value commodity and value chain analysis ... [Inaudible.] ... an exercise that will precede the establishment of agri-parks, presents an opportunity for territorial and functional regions to local economic development, LED, in municipalities, and therefore fully endorsed by Salga.

 

To date the LED initiative in most municipalities have limited success due to a lack of anchor catalytic programmes with a regional footprint. Not only will agri-parks create much-needed job opportunities but they will contribute to the diversification of rural economics through industrialisation as envisaged in the National Development Plan.

In October 2015 Salga convened a successful inaugural small town regeneration conference in Mangaung Metropolitan Municipality. The conference was correctly themed, Small towns new futures, and dealt with four small town typologies, including agricultural towns. We therefore see agri-parks as an important initiative ... a game changer ... ushering in new futures that will breathe life into small towns; hence our commitment to partner with the two departments in meaningfully improving the lives of our people.

 

 

The announcement by His Excellency the President of the Republic of South Africa during his state of the nation address in 2015 that an initial funding of R2 billion was made available for the agri-park initiative was a clear signal of the seriousness that the government is viewing the need to revitalise small towns in general and agriculture as an economic driver in particular.

 

 

It is important that in the planning of the agri-parks — they identified 44 districts — municipalities be mainstreamed into municipal IDPs. Municipal spatial development frameworks and regional spatial development frameworks, SDFs, ... to ensure that municipal capacities are developed for the sustainable management of the initiatives.

 

 

Salga would like to commend hon Minister Nkwinti for his tireless

efforts in ensuring the promulgation and implementation of the Spatial Planning and Land Use Management Act, Spluma. Not only does the Spatial Planning and Land Use Management Act entrench the role of local government in municipal planning consistent with the Constitution but it also provides a framework for the reversal of the legacy of apartheid spatial planning.

 

 

Furthermore, Salga sees the small town regeneration programme as an ideal platform for collaboration by all spheres of government to implement the Medium-Term Strategic Framework for 2014-15 to 2019 financial years.

 

 

In conclusion, Salga supports the various rural development initiatives being pursued by the department and looks forward to partnering with both the provincial and national spheres of government in the implementation of the various initiatives outlined by the hon Ministers. The need to provide support and build capacity of local government remains the key in ensuring the sustainability of rural development initiatives. Having said that, we want to indicate that Salga supports Budget Votes 24 and 29 respectively. [Applause.]

 

Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Hon Chair, Ministers and members, I have the opportunity to have grown up on a farm. At the early age of six, I

had already realised the profound impact that drought has on people and communities.

 

 

As a child I could already understand, albeit it simply, the way an economy functions. As a child, I was able to articulate the stories of how the drought impacted the lives of the people in my own community, and I am convinced that the children in all communities are still able to communicate these stories.

 

Therefore, it amazes me that the government grapples to understand the impact of the current drought on the so-called pillars — as hon Sefako told us — of our economy.

 

 

The current drought has a disastrous effect on the economy, on job losses and, most importantly, on the lives of the people of our country. Government should acknowledge that, every few years, often a five- or seven-year cycle, South Africa goes through a period of drought. Knowing this, there needs to be a proactive plan to deal with drought on a specific geographical, provincial or national level.

 

 

Drought is not an uncommon phenomenon and no government is at fault. However, drought has a domino effect on our people, which is why South Africans want to know what government is doing to manage it.

The current drought is in its fourth and final stage, the socioeconomic stage, in which adverse weather patterns have started to have effects on socioeconomic phenomena such as food prices, inflation and job losses — as hon Scafer pointed out.

 

 

The people want to know why government has not yet declared the drought a national disaster. The laissez faire manner in which government is handling a national crisis, with no national strategy or strategic plan, is appalling. The irony in this is that government is now in the process of legislating on climate change and its effects, which is good, but it refuses to accept concrete proposals on how to tackle our current crisis – a drought – that is already a result of climate change.

 

 

This is yet another example of the fact that, when it comes to delivery, the ANC-led government is a paper-pushing government, promising South Africans the moon and the sky when, in reality, it don‘t have a comprehensive plan.

 

 

A DA-led government would ensure that the drought is declared a national disaster.

 

The Ilima/Letsema project grant – which is supposed to provide production input to subsistence and smallholder farmers – is not

functioning properly. One of the problems is the establishment of markets. The truth, hon Skwatcha, is that, up till now, the ANC-led government has allowed corruption and the looting of farming assets instead of managing the system.

 

 

Only one of the good examples, hon Prins and Deputy Minister Cele, you will, in the ... [Interjections.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Labuschagne, please take your seat. Hon Deputy Minister?

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Chair,

 

I am tired of my surname being abused. Either they don‘t call it, or they call it properly. I am Cele. Cele! Please don‘t call it, or call it properly. I have been abused for far too long!

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, sir. Honourable ...

 

 

 

Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Thank you, Chair. Hon Deputy Minister, you will find at Ncera farms in the Eastern Cape ... [Interjections.] ... We would like to be enlightened. You must tell us about the abuse and where we can find the R23 million that was squandered there.

 

 

The Agri-Parks system seems in danger of repeating the mistakes of

the Ilima/Letsema projects. The attempt to create markets in this project is a problem. Why would Agri-Parks be any different?

 

 

The department will be allocating R2 billion per year over a 10-year period to develop Agri-Parks in 44 districts in this country. Has the Minister considered whether this R20 billion will include climate-change factors? A DA-led government would ensure that initiatives such as the Ilima/Letsema project have a comprehensive strategy to mitigate climate change and the effects thereof, of which examples are droughts and floods.

 

The National Rural Youth Service Corps sub-programme aims to increase the number of new participants over the medium term to 15 000. While we appreciate this initiative, the Minister must give us feedback on how many of this service corps will be guaranteed jobs in the agricultural sector after training at the new college to be established. An implementation plan would be a good start.

 

 

In terms of the Restitution of Land Rights Amendment Act of 2014, government has extended the lodgement of land claims. One hundred and one thousand, eight hundred and forty three new claims have already been lodged in this new cycle. The Minister yet again promises South Africans the Milky Way, while he knows that in reality, the first cycle of land claims have yet not been finalised. The people

from the first cycle are now part of the backlog due to the second cycle!

 

 

Hon Minister, there was not enough money to complete the first cycle of claims. So, why must be believe that the department is able to handle the second cycle? A DA-led government would have a financial plan to settle the first cycle of claimants before extending to a second cycle.

 

In conclusion, the Ministers have extensive plans, much smaller budgets and, as an ANC government, a questionable reputation for delivering on time, if at all! Only time will tell if this pattern can be corrected by a government more interested in protecting its President than in taking care of good governance and service delivery, especially in rural areas. Thank you.

 

 

Mr V V Z WINDVOEL: Hon Chairperson, the hon Ministers and Deputy Ministers present here, hon members of the NCOP and guests present with us here, I am very much honoured to be part of this debate which has been integrated between the two departments. I think when you were debating sir I did not make any noise. However, I must say hon Chairperson; I am from Mpumalanga especially in the part of the lowveld I am used to noises of mosquitoes. [Laughter.]

What I am saying is that the close relationship should not just end on this debate through words, but it should transcend practically to the local situation where the departments must also be seen working together to help our people especially the subsistence farmers who are toiling to try and make a living beyond just being commercial.

 

As enshrined in the Constitution and the Freedom Charter, the department is mandated to redress the past racial land imbalances in the country. The Freedom Charter in one of its clauses stipulates that the land shall be shared amongst those who work it. It also says restrictions of land ownership on racial basis shall be ended and all land redivided amongst those work it to banish famine and hunger. We have past legislation which amongst other things deals with land restitution, land redistribution and also the legislation dealing with the security of tenure. The Freedom Charter further says that the state shall help the peasants with implement, seed, tractors and dams to save the soil and assist the tillers.

 

 

I must say hon Chairperson that in Mpumalanga we have programmes like Masibuyele eMasimini where the poor are assisted with tractors, and given implements, seeds to plough the land. There is also a programme called Masibuyele Esibayeni where they are given 25 hivers ...

... banikezwe nenkunzi eyodwa yohlobo ukuze bakwazi ukuthi bahambe bayokhiqiza, bafuye bakwazi ukusenga, badle nenyama bathengise bangenise nomnotho endlini. (Translation of isiZulu paragraph follows.)

 

 

[... and one bull breed so that they can produce, and have livestock and be able to milk, eat meat and sell and have an income in the household.]

 

 

The Freedom Charter also says that people shall not be robbed of their cattle. We still have situations where farmers impound illegally and sell people of the farm tenants who are also toiling their very same land through which they make profit. It says forced labour and farm prisons shall be abolished. The day has been long Chairperson and we will not be going into detail in explaining some of the other issues.

 

 

However, I want to quickly say and we were told in this debate – one hon member came – and I think the theme he wanted to concentrate on was drought. However, he confused the theme until he was confused himself to an extent where he made an inference as if the drought came with the ANC. [Interjections.] It cannot be. What I know is that and we cannot say the budget is running dry the issue is that we are

facing a very serious economic outlook not only as the country, but globally.

 

 

These departments are not an exception to that. What I know of is belt tightening and cost-curtailments. [Interjections.]

 

Even the Western Cape gets its budget from the national fiscus and they do not make their own revenue. [Interjections.]

 

 

Of course, you will run dry because you are leaking.

 

 

 

Once you run politically bankrupt you will dry up and then do not blame us that you are running dry. Someone‘s cold car came here and pretended as if you mention the word drought a thousand times it will be a solution to the problem. It cannot be. The issue is that our ANC-led government has come with very tangible intervention measures to deal with the issues at hand. [Applause.] So, making a chorus of drought, drought and drought does not solve the problem. You will shout until you have dry mouth youth yourself.

 

 

Kodwa ngizwe umhlonishwa uSekela Ngqonqoshe uSkwatsha, eyishaya kamnandi, eshaya inja kwakhala umnikazi; ngasho ukuthi cha ngathi uyayibeka kahle lendaba. [But I heard the hon Deputy Minister

Skwatsha, put it nicely, and it hit the right spot; then I said to myself indeed he put this nicely.]

 

 

There is one lady I do not see here ...

 

 

... ugqoke lezi ezasekhishini angazi noma sekuyisikhathi setiye na, kodwa bengifuna ukumtshela ukuthi thina siwuKhongolose hhayi ukuthi sihlulekile ukwenza uguquko kwezomhlaba. Into esiyivumayo ukuthi imigomo ebesiyibekile asikafinyeleli kuyo. Unenhlanhla ngoba usephumile ngoba uyazi umhlonishwa uKhawula ilapho esenza khona izifundo zeziqu i-Masters ukubuyiselwa komhlaba yiyo engisebenza ngayo. Bengizomnikeza isifundo samahhala. Umntwana ngiyambona usesemncane akazi nokuthi uMongameli ubizwa kanjani. Kodwa ngiyabonga ukuthi iNdlu imkhuzile. (Translation of isiZulu paragraph follows.)

 

 

[... she is wearing the domestic worker‘s uniform I don‘t know if it is tea time already, but I wanted to tell her that we as the ANC did not fail on land reform. What we agree on is that we have not reached the goals that we have set for ourselves. She is lucky now that she has left because the hon Khawula knows where we studied for our Masters Degrees so this land restitution is in my field of work. I was going to give her a free lesson. She is still young, she does

not even know how to address the President. But I am happy that the House called her to order.]

 

 

Hon Chairperson, we want to say as we move towards conclusion that in Mpumalanga we do have land which has been provided by the state. If you go to Bushbuckridge there is Champagne Citrus project which is there. It might have its challenges but it is owned by the people, black African people who are there owning the land. Is that a point of order?

 

 

Okay awuthi ngimyeke. Bathi ngimyeke. [Let me leave him, they say I should leave him.] Okay.

 

What we want to say is that in Mpumalanga, we have projects which deal with the youth called Fortune-40 programme. Twenty farms have been identified. Already there is work which is happening in 12 of those farms, so that we also draw in the youth to be part of the agricultural industry. We have programmes where we are assisting livestock farmers to have a place where they can slaughter their cows hygienically and in a manner which is acceptable by markets thus enabling them to make an entrance into the commercial market.

 

 

We also have programmes where households are being assisted to establish food gardens to ensure that there is food security. As we

speak about this drought people should have food to eat and so on. Do not only shout, those are some of the intervention measures which we are making practically.

 

Sihlalo lohloniphekile angigcine ngekutsi tsine singuKhongolose wesifundza saseMpumalanga siyasisekela lesabiwomali kutsi leNdlu isamukele, nekutsi leminyango lemibili ayichubeke ngalesabiwomali leniketwa sona. Abahambe bayosebenta kusiphuke tidzindzi, kubhunye lutfuli, silime, sikhone kuchubeka sondle sive. Ngiyabonga. [Tandla.] (Translation of Siswati paragraph follows.)

 

 

[Hon Speaker, let me conclude by saying that us, as the ANC of the Mpumalanga province we support the Budget Vote and that this House must support it too, and that the two departments must continue with the budget they have been allocated. They must go and work industriously, let the dust go up in the air, let us plough, so that we are able to carry on feeding the nation. Thank you [Applause.]]

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM:

 

Chairperson, hon ministers who are present here, deputy ministers, members of this House, dignitaries and guests and fellow South Africans.

 

We are presenting today our departmental Budget Vote to this august

House on 11 May 2016, which is one day in history after the historical and World watched inauguration of a fellow South African to the Presidency of this country, President and Comrade Rolihlahla Nelson Mandela, a human giant who placed before us and the entire World his life fighting for humanity, justice, equality, and freedom for all, which took place on 10 May 1994. A historic day, that will go down in world history as one of the day that brought hope and freed the indigenous people of South Africa and Africans in general. Fellow compatriots, at his inauguration as he was closing his address to the nation and the world, the former President of South Africa have this to say I quote: ?never, never and never again shall it be that this beautiful land will again experience the oppression of one by another and suffer the indignity of being the skunk of the world?.

 

 

He further said and I quote: ?we must act together as a united people, for national reconciliation, for nation building, for the birth of a new order?.

 

 

In pursuit of all his wishes and commitments of the ANC, we are proud today to say we are on course and we shall overcome all the vestiges of the past and build a country that we all shall be proud of.

 

I must report today that, on the 10 May , the President of the Republic of South Africa, His Excellency Jacob Zuma, actioned the dream of

Nelson Mandela which I have alluded to earlier, by handing over a State of the Art Multi-Purpose Youth Hub to empower the people of Beaufort West.

 

Hon Smit, this we have executed as part of our mandate of developing rural towns and communities of this country. It is on that basis that we say, together with our people, siyaqhuba [we are moving forward].

 

 

Hon Minister Nkwinti, briefly touched on our Agri-Parks programme. This is a positive action, and a logical development in rural development the latest manifestation of our longstanding goal of agrarian transformation, and as such it will both aid and benefit from existing initiatives aimed at the same outcome.

 

The individual Agri-Parks will each evolve around an Agri-hub that forms the centre of the model and from which the activities of a range of services will be coordinated. For example, animal handling facilities, warehousing, silos, processing plants and tanneries, including social and retail services.

 

The farmer production support units will be the immediate link with farmers and will be complemented and strengthened, in various ways, by existing departmental programmes like the Animal and Veld Management Programme; the River Valley Catalytic Programme, and

further aided by the Recapitalisation and Development Programme, involving restitution efforts, initiatives to revitalise rural towns.

 

Some progress has been made in the last financial year, where work has happened in all the districts. In some districts, hon Smit, construction has already commenced on identified Agri-hub sites, for example bulk electricity work in Witzenberg in the Western Cape at the nose of the Madam, construction of an abattoir in Butterworth in the Eastern Cape amongst others. In the new financial year 47 infrastructure projects

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Deputy

Minister, please hold your horses. Would you please take your seat? Hon Julius?

 

 

Mr J W W JULIUS: Chairperson, I just want know. Is it parliamentary to call certain people madam in this House? I think we already ruled on that ones.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Deputy

 

Minister?

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM:

Chairperson.

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: This House has

 

already had to rule on the word and the use of the word, madam and its different meanings. Please desist from referring to madams, because there negative connotations to the word. It is quite proper for you to refer to me as a madam, because I would understand the sense with which you refer to me

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Thank you

 

very much, Chairperson. In the new financial year 47 infrastructure projects will be completed in Agri- hub and farmer production support units across the country. In addition 115 agricultural enterprises will be supported to ensure that there is sustainable production to support agro-processing at the hubs.

 

In this financial year, the department will continue to focus on the roll out of the Agri-Parks in all districts focusing on core infrastructure at the Agri-hub and the farmer production support units. In addition, we will facilitate support to 115 Agricultural Enterprises and 50 new non-agricultural enterprises. We will also be planning to facilitate 10 000 skills development opportunities and six thousand job opportunities in this financial year.

As highlighted in the National Development Plan, NDP, there is a need to expand irrigation agriculture to increase production and transform the rural economy. It is therefore essential that agriculture is supported by expanding irrigated agriculture; by the conversion of under-utilized land; by the elevation of land reform projects into commercial production ventures, by the introduction of product value-chain, by opening up more employment opportunities and by getting more support from better resourced players. In support of the Macadamia industry, the department has completed the construction of 11km bulk-line in the Ncera Macadamia Project in the Eastern Cape. The rising main and pump-station are planned to be completed by the end of this financial year.

 

 

In KwaZulu-Natal, last financial year, we completed the upgrade of the Nsuze irrigation scheme, which extended to 300 hectares, and to 400 farming beneficiaries at a cost of R60 million. In the very same Province, KZN, will improve irrigation schemes: The Mthandeni Irrigation scheme, at a total value of R40 million, will benefit 150 farmers over a total of 310 hectares; and the Mooi River irrigation scheme which is as extensive as 600 hectares aids in more than 500 farmers who will be benefitting from the scheme to the extent of a totaling of R37 million.

 

 

In Mpumalanga, we will be upgrading the Dingledale and New Forest

canals at a value of R16 million and this will benefit 1 000 farmers. And a Bushbuckridge Agri-Park, we will be constructing a Farmer production support unit to the value of R12,3 million, which will benefit 40 farmers involved in the vegetable production.

 

 

Another significant partnership is with the National Woolgrowers Association, where we have been able assist 1 224communities and in their programme called Ram Improvement Programme.

 

 

Revitalization of rural towns and industrial parks in townships, are other important government objectives. One good example of that is the completion of the construction of a runway in the small town of Somerset East in the Eastern Cape. The project will contribute significantly to: employment of youth, job creation, regional economic development, strengthening heritage, developing tourism, and creation of industries. Linked to this project, the department is in partnership with the Eastern Cape Provincial department of Public Works and Roads in upgrading the first 20km of the 113km road project. The project is expected at its height to create 200 jobs and will also unblock the agricultural tourism and potential of the area.

 

 

Similarly, in Limpopo we have completed the construction of a multi- purpose centre which provides access to a library, an amphitheatre

and administrative facilities for the community. The next phase of the project will include creation of facilities and a swimming pool.

 

 

In improving access to Information and Communication Technology, ICT, in rural areas, we continue to play an important role in transforming the lives of rural children and communities at large. In this financial year, we are rolling out iSchoolAfrica Programme to 48 additional schools and we are going to establish eight more digital doorways. This year, in partnership with our iSchoolAfrica, we will be running a rural school music competition using the technology that is being made available to our children.

 

 

As far as deliverables are concerned in the Rural Development, more than 670 projects were implemented in support of Rural Infrastructure Development, Rural Enterprise Development, Animal and Veld Management Programme, River Valley Catalytic Programme. These projects have transformed lives of more than 17 000 beneficiaries. Further, our Skills Development Programmes have provided opportunities to 3 066 National Rural Youth Service Corps, NARYSEC, youth, 200 disabled persons and 500 to women in Arts and Crafts including 198 Agricultural Graduates that were deployed in Rural Projects. Siyaqhuba. [We are moving forward.]

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: And the time

is up. Thank you very much, Deputy Minister.

 

 

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Thank you

 

very much, Chairperson.

 

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Hon Chair, there

are two parties that I want to respond to. Thank you very much to the rest of the parties for your contributions; they are noted.

 

 

For the DA and the EFF. The DA has a strategy which is very dangerous: the strategy of evicting farmworkers and dwellers in the Western Cape to create conflict between farmworkers and the ANC government. That is why there was that implosion in 2012. It is a dangerous strategy. Do you remember that De Doorns happened here, in Western Cape, because of a strategy that backfired? Now we had to solve the problem. That‘s them, the DA.

 

 

The second one is that there is a good programme, the share equity scheme, which is very badly managed by the DA. The DA being the commercial farmers. These are the commercial farmers who are members and supporters of the DA. That is what I am talking about here and they know it. [Interjections.]

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon Chairperson, on a point of order: The Minister is putting the blame of De Doorns on the DA, whereas it was the Minister of Agriculture at the time, Tina Joemat-Pettersson, who funded R10 million for that riot.[Interjections.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Labuschagne, I am sorry, ma‘am, in your absence. Hon Van Lingen, the Minister says the DA. No, I cannot judge whether it is wrong or not. It is a debate and he refers to the provincial government. If you want me to go and come back after verifying whether it was the national Minister or the provincial Minister, I‘d be happy to do so. Minister, lets continue.

 

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Hon Chair, there

are members of the ...

 

 

 

Mr J W W JULIUS: Hon Chairperson, on a point of order: It is the same point on which we rose yesterday. The Minister said these commercial farmers in the Western Cape are all members of the DA and he knows it. [Interjections.] It doesn‘t prove to be factually correct. In the first place, the Minister is actually misleading the House. I call upon the Minister to provide proof of the fact that all the commercial farmers in the Western Cape are DA members. We would love to have all the members in the DA because he just gave away all the

members that might even be ANC. But proof must be given. We cannot just say anything here. [Interjections.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, hon Julius, your point is taken. I will come back to the House on the matter. Hon Minister ...

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Hon Chair, I am

 

happy it hurts. The second part is the EFF. The EFF ... the other day when they were saying, the national anthem said we can‘t sing the Afrikaans part of it. Yet, they are quick to say we will meet at the Constitutional Court. Today they also say that we don‘t recognise the property clause in the Constitution. This is the people who run to the Constitutional Court. You see, this is the problem with these two parties. One is ultra-left anarchist and the other one is ultra-right super conservative, yet they come together somewhere. It is a strange combination. [Applause.] [Interjections.] That is what is happening in the country.

 

 

Mme N P MOKGOSI: Modulasetilo, ke kopa gore o botse motl Tona gore o raya bomang fa re kebotlhogokgolo. Gape, ke botsa gore a lefoko leo le letleletswe mo Palamenteng mme fa le sa letlelelwa, ke kopa gore a le gogele morago. (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)

[Ms N P MOKGOSI: Chairperson, can you please ask the Minister who he is referring to when he talks of the anarchists? I also want to know if that word is parliamentary, if not, can he withdraw.]

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, ma‘am, take your seat. [Interjections.] Order! The Minister is referring to a party and not to an individual member. Therefore, it is not unparliamentary to make that reference. Minister, continue.

 

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: [Laughter.] No,

 

we can give lectures on this, hon Chair. [Interjections.] The hon members are very young. We appreciate that they wouldn‘t understand.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Minister ...

 

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Sorry, I

 

apologise. I withdraw.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Withdraw your comment on the age of the members.

 

 

The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: On that part ...

[Interjections.] [Laughter.] The hon member knows very well. That is my friend sitting at the back there with hon Mthethwa.

[Interjections.] He would understand what I am saying and he won‘t take offence at all.

 

 

Hon Chair, you can‘t speak warm and hot on the Constitution of the land, you can‘t. We must support ... Property clause is property clause. I am debating the point that they are making that says that we would not use property clause, in other words, we would grab the land. It is unconstitutional. You can‘t grab the land in South Africa, it is simply unconstitutional. So we as the ANC, we are ... remember

... we ... [Interjections.] ... while she was still with us even ... We are the originators of the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa. [Interjections.]

 

Now let me just come back to one small thing here, Chair. You know, the members of the District Land Reform Committees sitting here from the Western Cape, they are sitting there. [Interjections.] Yes, there you are, black and white. [Interjections.] You can imagine what the DA is saying here. If they were given a chance to speak they would certainly repudiate them because the DA is representing a few minorities of people who are rich, who are linked to foreign land owners in South Africa. That is what the DA is about and they are seriously protecting that interest. [Interjections.] No, you know what? The 50/50 ... That is why they object to the 50/50, because it is actually proving to be effective. Some big farmers in the

Western Cape have joined us on the 50/50 to share the land and the produce with their workers. [Interjections.] ... Constituting companies, new companies. [Interjections.] No, there is no ...

 

Nee, daar is nie nou baasskap nie! [No, there is not dominion now!]

 

 

 

It is a new company for both workers and owners. It‘s a new phenomenon; it‘s revolutionary. The DA is confounded by that. That‘s problem with them. Now, they are saying it won‘t work, can you imagine? 50/50 won‘t work. Now there is a farmer in the North West, you know ... [Inaudible.] ... who owns 4 000 hectares of land. We have already bought 50% and now he owns 50%. He is a big farmer on livestock. We bought 50% for the workers and the other 50% for him. They are busy forming a new company now, Westcliff. We are actually going to launch Westcliff. We are going to KwaZulu-Natal. That is where we are going to launch it. We could have taken it here, and we could have launched it in the Western Cape. It‘s running! We are ... Siyaqhuba. Thank you. [Interjections.] [Applause.] [Time expired.]

 

 

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Chairperson,

as the department we would like to pass our condolences to one of our officials, who was diligent, committed, Dr Swangabe. Amongst the programmes he was driving was to make sure that young vets are deployed to rural areas to give services to those people and change

their lives, may his soul rest in peace. Yesterday Chairperson, I quoted Professor Lumumba to say that:

 

 

?The challenges that the Africans are faced with when they deal with difficult issues, is to behave like dwarfs who competes on which one is taller than the other?.

 

And we say that in the behaviour of two opposition parties, as they try to out do each other, using different forms and ways. [Interjections.] [Laughter.] [Applause.] So ...

 

Mme T J MOKWELE: Modulasetilo, mo ntlheng ya kgalemo: Ka tlhompo, ke ne ke botsa gore a Motl Tona o re tshwantsha le di dwafo [Setshego.] Ke kopa gore a itlhalose sentle, ke tle ke kgone go tlhaloganya. Ke a leboga.

 

 

MODULASETULO WA NCOP: Ke tla go araba mma. (Translation of Setswana paragraphs follow.)

 

 

[Ms T J MOKWELE: Chairperson, on a point of order: Is the hon Minister comparing us to dwarfs? [Laughter.] Can he please explain himself so that I can understand? I thank you.

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: I will get back to you, mam.]

The hon Minister, referred to the two opposition parties as dwarfs. He has not referred to individual members of this House. Please continue.

 

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Secondly, I will

 

quote again Dr Paul Joseph Goebbels, who was the Minister of Propaganda in Germany during the Second World War when he said: ?When a big lie is told repeatedly, when no truth is told, that lie may resemble the truth?. It doesn‘t matter how many times the DA comes and tells us they run the best government. If they say so, where do the Durians belong? [Interjections.] It is in the Western Cape.

 

 

Workers in the Western Cape where the DA controls, have no rights. They speak of the care for farmers when we gave them the right to take 20% of the allocation to make sure that they deal with the drought. What did they do? They took R11 million to the most rich farmers to pay their workers. [Interjections.] That is a party that loves its own people. In the DA I can tell you, the only reason they speak of black people, is because they want their votes. But in terms of their policy and actions, black people don‘t count. [Interjections.] And I want to say to Mr Smit, Sir, tell the truth where it is due. [Interjections.] We have made a point that the issue of vassals has been solved. There is no vassal that is not on sea in our department, it is doing its work.

On issues of illegal fishing, we are dealing with it Sir. Yesterday we have finished the appeals. We have cleaned them. No more appeals. [Applause.] So you can try to find everything, for instance, the DA wants to why the Minister is saying they love white farmers? Why did you allocate R11 million only to commercial farmers to pay their workers? As a province you only declared three local municipalities as drought affected. And it is funny now that you are saying, declare the whole country. Economically, if you do that Sir, the banks will begin to be cautious of the funds they make available to agriculture and when this thing is over we will be struggling.

 

 

Secondly, you must tell the truth where is due Sir, you can‘t come here and say we are going to be importing six million tons of maize, its not true Sir. According to the recent crop estimates, we will need only 1, 1 white maize and 3, 9 yellow maize. [Interjections.] [Applause.] Lastly, let me tell you again, it is not thunder that grows crops, it is the rain Sir. You can make noise, you can shout and do everything, and it is what is reasonable. [Applause.]

 

 

DA please don‘t play a game that says the ANC has done nothing. Last week I was in Cofimvaba, to look at ... [Interjections.]

 

An HON MEMBER: Your plaas! [farm]

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Not my plaas

 

[farm] ...

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Don‘t respond

to the Minister.

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: ... to look at

 

the benefit of our government is doing to resuscitate agriculture. Last week I told you to accompany me to Lumbus. You will see what we are doing as the ANC government. You will see what we do to save our people. It is not because we want them to vote for us. But I believe that the leader, the commander once owned a farm. I want to know how much of that farm‘s produce did he share with those he was staying with. I want to say to our people, take note of what chickens do, even if a hawk can walk, chicken will run because they know it is a hawk. [Applause.]

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: Hon Minister, do you also have a farm?

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon member

Mtileni, you do ask permission through.

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: Sorry ma‘am I am tempted to direct the question to him?

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Minister,

 

are you prepared to take a question?

 

 

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: If the question

was reasonable, I would.

 

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Please continue

 

you have a few seconds left.

 

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon Chair, on a point of order: I am requesting that you also please assist the hon Minister with the correct pronouncement of my surname because he also tends to add the H at the end. [Interjections.] [Laughter.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Okay. Hon

Minister please, do not add the H. [Interjections.]

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Apologies Sir,

apologies. I did not mean to demean you. I am really apologising. [Interjections.] Lastly let me say this before I sit down, we will never listen to those who makes noise. They make noise because they have nowhere to go. Thank you. [Interjections.] [Interjections.]

 

 

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Order! Hon

members, earlier today hon Mthimunye rose on a point of order and this point of order related to the closing remarks of the hon Smit, who made a reference to mmuso wa magodu, which loosely translates to, the government of thieves. So I then asked to be allowed to consider this and I have done so and this is my ruling. Although the statement uttered by the hon Smit is harsh, it is not unparliamentary. [Interjections.] Who said, Uh? Hon members, the hon Smit did not refer to any member as a thief, he referred to a government of thieves.

 

 

But I want to caution members of this House, that the freedom of speech is not unlimited and it is dangerous to push it to the limit. Because although what the hon Smit said is not unparliamentary, it is actually very wrong to include government, all government because you did not make a distinction, you said mmuso wa magodi, which means all government. Now government is not just made up of the executive here at national, it cuts across. It actually includes all spheres of government, so I would like to caution members that you are free to say whatever you say, just make sure that it does not come back to bite you hon members.

 

 

Business suspended at 17:53 and resumed at 18:16.

 

 

APPROPRIATION BILL

(Policy debate)

 

 

Vote No 35 — Transport:

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: Thank you hon Chairperson of the House. I want to take this opportunity to recognise the hon Deputy Minister of Transport, the hon Chairperson and members of the Select Committee on Economic and Business Development, hon members of the executive councils from provinces, the acting Director-General of the Department of Transport, chairpersons and chief executive officers, CEOs, from transport entities, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen, and hon Chairperson, as we celebrate 60 years of the historic women‘s march against the pass laws, we are reminded of stalwarts of our struggle from that historic moment. I wish to take the privilege to remember and dedicate my speech from this podium here today to none other than Me Ruth Segomotsi Mompati. Today exactly

12 months ago we were plunged into the dark moment of her passing away. Today is the first anniversary of her death and we are inspired by her life and example — a woman that I and many of my generation have had the rare honour to be reared and guided by in many ways. May her beautiful soul rest in peace, and find eternal peace and rise again in glory.

 

 

The wealth of instruments in the arsenal of our democratic state

renders our work as public representatives with every ounce of energy expended in our course from the Constitution itself as the supreme law of our country to legislation flowing there from and every other policy prescript in our statutes. These are all assisted by the spirit behind each letter in those instruments; the spirit to build a united, caring and cohesive society based on the founding values of equality, nonracialism, nonsexism and prosperity for all.

 

 

We have a mission. Like the generation we must be reminded as we are by Frantz Fanon in, The Wretched of the Earth, when he said, ?Each generation must discover its mission, fulfil it or betray it, in relative opacity.?

 

The constituent parts of your House, the National Council of Provinces, sober us all to the cold reality that our work is about people. It confronts us with the need to juxtapose every law and pronouncement we make with the lived reality of our communities. It does not matter how lofty or how nice sounding what we bring from the other House is. If that does not coincide with the expectations of our people on the ground it will not pass the test. That is why we have in the House here today members of the executive councils from provinces to be able to come — and supported by the SA Local Government Association, Salga, — and make inputs about how transport and roads in particular have an impact in their communities where

our people live.

 

 

So hon members, we are happy to be here today to confirm with your House the correctness of our budget and policy projections for the financial year 2016-17. This we do not only because our Constitution enjoins us to do so but because it also makes sense to be here and to get to understand the fears, the challenges, the mood and the expectations of our people on the ground. We do so because we also believe that we must govern with the consent of the governed.

 

 

Our Constitution defines transport as a responsibility that cuts across spheres of government in particular areas. This situation requires consistent intergovernmental co-operation and

co-ordination. The development of institutional arrangements such as transport authorities to co-ordinate transport planning and implementation at the local, regional and metro levels requires the development, ?of a shared understanding, attitude and customs? that serve to benefit from spatial or localised tensions and not be paralysed by real interest.

 

 

We will be establishing a committee to be able to help us deal with matters that are within our Constitution related to transport authorities‘ functions, and that committee is intended to be a panel that will advise the Minister and the MECs, especially the MECs of

Transport in provinces, on how to deal with intergovernmental relations issues related to the services of transport.

 

 

Chairperson, you would remember that in the Constitution as well as in our legislation, provinces are the contracting authorities and yet their services are rendered at local government level. There are municipalities that are calling on the department to devolve some of the functions to provinces. So, to municipalities it is important that that panel engages with those particular municipalities but also engages with provinces to be able to help us arrive at a point where we could be able to deal with the challenges that actually get displayed with what is happening in Gauteng.

 

We can also remember that, for example in a situation like Gauteng, the three metros are interconnected. They are seamless; yet you‘d find that one metro has got particular transport related functions which the others might not necessarily have, and you‘d find that we have got a big challenge. The people of Gauteng live where they would want to live because it is important that we remember that South Africa belongs to all who live in it, black and white. It is also important to remember that we created the environment for people to live wherever they would want to live, but also to work where they want to and where opportunities are.

So you‘d find a person in Johannesburg actually working in Tshwane or somebody living in Ekurhuleni and working in Johannesburg. So it is important that the province be given the responsibility to be able to deal or actually be the transport authority. It is important that we consult these particular provinces so that we can have informed decisions, not decisions that are informed by what I would want to happen in my municipality.

 

 

From this podium here today I would like to share with this House the good story of where we are and where we are headed to. Our core mandate to provide a cost-effective, regular, safe and secure transport system is expressed in the programmes enunciated below and more. The said mandate is underwritten by the medium to long-term objective to eradicate hunger and poverty, create jobs and attain equality for all. All these add up to the country‘s vision 2030 as captured in the National Development Plan.

 

 

In the passenger rail area under the able stewardship of our Passenger Rail Agency of SA, Prasa, we are all hands on deck to upgrade our stations and signalling systems, and we are also on the go with our Rolling Stock Fleet Renewal Programme.

 

I want to take this opportunity to thank those members who were with us on 4 March when we turned the sod for the building of the factory

in Ekurhuleni, particularly in Nigel, to build the trains that we so much need.

 

 

Our stations‘ upgrade programme has scored tremendous progress in areas like Duffs Road in KwaZulu-Natal where 89% of the work is completed; followed by Phillippi here in the Western Cape with over 76% and Oakmoor Station in Gauteng at over 35%. All over the country there are serious pockets of work in progress in this regard. So far we have earmarked 200 stations for upgrade in the current Medium-Term Expenditure Framework. This is at a cost of R5,9 billion.

 

Last year I pronounced on our rail line extension initiative with the specific focus on Mamelodi and Motherwell, with three components of the Mamelodi project, namely the construction of the Greenview Station, the doubling of the rail line and the upgrade of the Mamelodi and Pienaarspoort stations. We have completed the doubling of the Mamelodi rail line; completed the construction of the Greenview Station; created 325 jobs over the last three years of project construction; appointed a design consultant for the Motherwell rail link; and created the 1000 jobs that are so much needed.

 

 

The replacement and renewal of rail signals is also moving apace. Prasa has invested R13,2 billion in this programme for the replacement of all signalling and interlocking, which until now were

obsolete mechanical and electromechanical systems.

 

 

Currently the programme is underway in Gauteng, the Western Cape and KwaZulu-Natal, but it‘s planned to reach all areas in time. The Gauteng nerve centre which will act as a signalling control hub of Prasa‘s passenger rail network in Gauteng was actually inaugurated on 5 October 2015. Thus far the programme has yielded 760 jobs and another 150 jobs targeting engineers and technicians for maintenance purposes are afoot.

 

 

Our 10 year Rolling Stock Fleet Renewal Programme comes at a cost of about R59 billion. The following are but a few examples where I can share with you the joy that team Transport continues to bring to our economy:

 

Firstly, the construction of the local train manufacturing plant, that I referred to earlier on that has commenced, has thus far created 365 jobs. We intend to create more than 1 500 jobs by the end of this construction period;

 

 

Secondly, the manufacture of 20 sets of trains in Brazil, with three sets already having been delivered. Many of our members might have seen the trains being tested, particularly around the Tshwane area, because we want to make sure that they are tested and are ready for

inauguration in Transport month which is October 2016;

 

 

Thirdly, the manufacturing of 580 sets of trains in South Africa; and

 

 

Fourthly, the construction of testing facilities and tracks has been completed. Trains from Brazil are using it to undergo testing.

 

 

A total of 110 engineers and artisans are already undergoing training in Europe and Brazil for deployment in areas of train manufacturing, design and maintenance.

 

In the interim, further to the above, R4,5 billion over three years is set aside to do general overhaul and refurbishment of old rolling stock. In the past year already, 326 metro coaches were refurbished at a cost of R382 million. These refurbishments created a total of 2004 jobs.

 

 

As we elaborate on the programmes that the department undertakes it would like at some point ... some point this ... I‘m sorry. These are abstracts with ... It would seem that at some point these are abstracts with provincial and local government not emphasised because I think it is important that you realise that members of the executive councils have been invited here to participate so that they

can highlight much of the work that is happening in their provinces.

 

 

This may be so but our common objective as a country is the alleviation of poverty, the creation of jobs and the extension of opportunities to all South Africans who are themselves local residents in different municipal areas. It also augers well for the creation of a united and cohesive society to, at certain times, de-emphasise the narrow definition of localities.

 

 

Turning to matters most local, the department has made tremendous strides is its integrated public transport network programme. In total, R30 billion has already been invested, making four of our major cities fully operational and others registering varying levels of progress towards fully functional levels. In the four cities where this is happening, a total of 125 000 daily passenger trips were generated. This is projected to increase to 300 000 such trips by 2019 when 10 cities will be operational.

 

 

A condensed picture of where and what is happening will show that in the most advanced City of Johannesburg, Rea Vaya already carries

40 000 passengers a day on 220 buses. The city is also expanding its network with the construction of the 1C route to Alexandra and Sandton, which will start operating by the year 2017-18.

The City of Cape Town is also well on track and has achieved the

 

27 kilometer bus lanes for trunk and complementary services and

36 trunk bus stations with a projected increase to 42 stations by June 2016. It also has 583 feeder stops with a projected increase to 605 by June 2016. So far the city has a fleet of 333 buses projected to increase to 368 buses by June 2016. The system carries an average of 67 000 passenger trips on weekdays with a projected increase to about 72 000 average weekday passenger trips by June 2017.

 

 

In Tshwane, the A re Yeng system already carries 4 000 passengers a day and will implement the Wonderboom line in 2016 to increase numbers to 30 000 passenger trips a day. The system will have

114 buses operating in 2016. At this particular moment I need to pause and congratulate Tshwane for linking the Wi-Fi system to the buses. This has been greatly appreciated by the student community in the Tshwane area because the students are able to download their

much-needed assignments and study material. Congratulations Tshwane. [Applause.]

 

 

In George we have achieved 166 kilometers of trunk operations in mixed traffic lanes with a projected increase to 416 kilometers by June 2017. The city has one trunk bus station and 454 feeder stops with a projected increase to 620 by June 2017. The system has a fleet of

91 buses with a projected increase to 123 buses by June 2017. The

patronage is standing at 11 000 average passenger trips with a projected increase to 12 400 average passenger trips by June 2017.

 

 

In Ekurhuleni we have achieved 27 kilometers of dedicated bus ways with a projected increase by 10 kilometers in the current year. The city has completed four stations with a projection of completing five stations, 40 feeder bus stations and shelters by 2016-17. So far the city will have a fleet of eight buses in July and 80 buses by December 2016. The city has projected 114 100 passenger trips per year with an increase to about 272 500 passenger trips in the current year. We would want to work together with Ekurhuleni to make it possible for them to reach this particular target so that they can be able to offload from the challenges that Metrorail is having in this area, especially the challenges with regard to the line from Centurion to Oakmoor where there has been a sinkhole that has created the challenges that our commuters have in this particular area.

 

 

In Rustenburg we are investing over R200 million on infrastructure for the integrated public transport system. To date bus dedicated lanes, bridges and stations are being constructed with mixed traffic feeder routes, six bus stations are being constructed, as well as 210 bus stops or shelters with 191 buses to be purchased. The tender process is already underway to purchase these buses. The system is expected to be launched in the year 2017.

In Polokwane, Durban and Nelspruit, much progress has been made in the construction of infrastructure and we shall continue to accelerate the infrastructure roll-out. For instance, Durban has already spent close to R900 million on infrastructure. We have also started the process of developing integrated public transport network plans in the district municipalities in order to promote integrated public transport systems. The process is aimed at assisting rural communities to connect to the provincial and district networks in order to access social and economic opportunities. We have already identified the following district municipalities for the development of integrated public transport networks: Bojanala Platinum District Municipality in the North West; O R Tambo District Municipality in the Eastern Cape; John Taolo Gaetsewe District Municipality in the Northern Cape; and Thabo Mofutsanyana District Municipality in the Free State.

 

 

Hon members and distinguished guests, the department‘s support to provinces through the public transport operators‘ grant continues to do its best under difficult circumstances. This financial year we will give R5,4 billion to the grant; a slight improvement from R4,9 billion in the 2015-16 financial year. This will to some extent address the accumulated deficit in subsidies. This will also assist in the improvement of the current situation of inequalities between operators in some provinces.

The ever tried and tested taxi industry is still the most popular mode of transport for our communities out there. It still carries 65% of all commuters daily. It is for this reason that we would pursue interventions to boost the industry. Our taxi recapitalisation programme is on track, albeit with challenges. Since its inception the programme has scrapped 64 859 old taxis at a cost of about R3,7 billion and we are busy doing a review of the programme with a view to present integrated solutions to Cabinet for approval. We would want to make sure that this recapitalisation programme is linked to the accelerated turnaround strategy of public transport to make it possible that we can support the industry to grow economically and to benefit from all the total value chain.

 

 

We are also aiming to finalise the rural transport strategy this year. The strategy is intended to provide a balanced approach on rural transport development, improved nodal linkages and development, and achieve sustainable transport systems in rural areas.

 

 

Substantive progress has been made with Cabinet‘s approval of the National Learner Transport Policy. A total of 516 886 learners are in need of this learner transport in the country, with 370 000 already receiving it. Our current budget for learner transport stands at R2,3 billion.

The Shova Kalula bicycle programme provides much support to learners in need of transport in areas where other modes are not accessible. To date over 100 000 bicycles have been distributed. With these bicycles we also assist with helmets, pumps, locks and reflector vests.

 

Secondary spinoffs such as the workshops to repair and maintain these bicycles were started in the past but proved unsustainable. A new effort is underway but will be preceded by a properly motivated plan with necessary training and profitable business model for those who aspire to pursue these opportunities. This will create small business opportunities and provide jobs in this regard. For the 2016-17 financial year an additional 4 000 bicycles will be distributed.

 

 

Road infrastructure drives our country‘s economy in all three spheres; hence our pursuit of a gradual increase in allocations for roads. Our provincial roads maintenance grant stood at R9,9 billion in 2015-16 and over 600 000 jobs across the nine provinces were created in the period of 2015-16. Women, youth and disabled persons derived benefit from this in the form of jobs. This was as a result of work such as the maintenance of secondary roads, resealing and resurfacing of roads and pothole repairs.

 

 

In the 2016-17 financial year, the provincial roads maintenance grant

will be allocated as follows: the Eastern Cape will get R1,2 billion; the Free State will get R1,2 billion; Gauteng will get R486 million; KwaZulu-Natal will get R1,8 billion; Limpopo will get R965 million; Mpumalanga will get R1,6 billion; the Northern Cape will get

R878 million; the North West will get R841 million and the Western Cape will get R806 million. The total allocation to the provincial roads maintenance grant this year is R10,2 billion.

 

 

In 1998 we all know that the SA National Roads Agency, Sanral, started with 7 000 kilometers of road stretch under its management and today over 21 000 kilometers stretch is under its care. This is as a result of provinces giving over or ceding parts of their roads to Sanral because Sanral is in a relatively better position to develop these roads. It is also a way to create jobs for communities and alleviate poverty in those communities. We have moved from talking about the R573 Moloto Road to committing R3,7 billion for its upgrade in the short to medium term. This road has been classified as a national road but remains a nontoll road. I want to say here again that once we are attending to the road we also believe that in the long term a rail solution should be the solution for this particular corridor.

 

 

Other provincial roads that Sanral will have public-private partnership concession programmes and engagements with are the N2 Wild Coast; the N1 N2 Winelands in the Western Cape; the Cape Town

ring toll highway; the N3 De Beers corridor through Harrismith — ensuring that we create an environment for an alternative technology to make it possible that we protect the economy of Harrismith and the surrounding towns; the N1 Ventersburg to Holfontein upgrade and

... [Time expired.] [Applause.]

 

 

 

Mr B G NTHEBE: Hon Minister I wanted to say to the Chair I can donate some of my time to you so that you can continue to tell the good story.

 

 

Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, Deputy Minister, members of the House, special delegates, distinguished guests, our department hon Minister

- your department has a mammoth task ahead, that of providing beyond political rethorics and gimmicks to all South Africans, an affordable, accessible and efficient transport system to all South Africans.

 

 

Global economic pressures and the financial crisis should not deter us from such a noble cause. Hesitant domestic and foreign investor‘s confidence pose a serious challenge to this mandate hon Minister. However, with this budget you presented today, we think we are on course. We are happy that in this budget reprioritisation is quite visible, this auger well with the realities of a constrained fiscal environment.

The 2016 state of the nation and budget review emphasized the need to diversify the economy and raise export competitiveness, but we can't do this hon Minister as you know without appreciating what the National Development Plan, NDP, has said that there‘s a necessity for sound economic infrastructure as a precondition for economic growth.

 

 

We need to capture that space hon Minister, so that we away from being a net importer as a country to become a net exporter, we need to move with speed to grow our export base and capture the global space. This will encourage us to face the social issues such as unemployment and inequalities. In simple terms infrastructural development is an inherently a necessity for economic growth.

 

 

Hon Minister, we are encouraged by partnerships that you continue to build as a department, because social infrastructural investment would complement economic advancement and sustainable development. This is all our responsibility both public and private sector to collaborate. This will further enable infrastructural planning and co-ordination platforms in government to be seamless; to further allow government departments and public entities to augment productive capacity in the economy through delivering essential infrastructure and further support enterprise sector. We think this is very important and your department is doing well in that regard.

Hon Minister, this remains a mammoth task however. Your department has a backlog to clear and further meet the new infrastructure programmes ahead. In the same light your department must meet infrastructural deliveries that are so necessarily needed to respond to government broader social, environmental and economic goals of course encored around fiscal realities that we are mindful of. The backlog as we estimate sits around R149 billion. The department needs to strengthen its ties with municipal infrastructural support agency and the development bank of Southern Africa, DBSA, for smooth implementation of effective transport infrastructure in municipalities.

 

 

We are however ecstatic, that conditions of the national road network managed by The South African National Roads Agency, Sanral, has improved. This is not your report and it is not our report. This is a report by Council for Scientific and Industrial Research, CSIR, University of Stellenbosch and Imperial Logistics after they conducted a study. The challenges however remain how we address conditions of both provincial and local government roads and rail transport network.

 

 

Hon Minister, as a youngster I use to take a night train from park station ...

... kwa Gauteng, e e fitlhang kwa Kimberley ka ura ya borataro mo mosong. [... in Gauteng, it reaches Kimberley at three o‘clock in the morning.]

 

... very efficient, reliable and very safe for passengers. If we can go ... and I am very happy that you are also talking about the Ekurhuleni [Inaudible.] so that we are able to speak about how reliable rail transport has been to our people and how efficient is it and can we make sure that we resuscitate it.

 

 

Hon Minister, we note with concern that the Financial and Fiscal Commission, FFC, which advocates that the current public transport subsidy framework is not aligned with the national transport policy, so that it can promotes an efficient and effective public transport system. We think that you are up to task to deal with that.

 

 

Hon Minister another reality, our South African coastline accounts for 3 000 km stretch which signifies shipping traffic. To date 85% of the country's trade demonstrates movement by sea. Let‘s zoom into that space and allow South African owned carriers to actively participate in the shipment of export and import regionally and globally. We think of issues of transformation also in that space; the 3 000km of the coastline must be able to be transformed, so that our people can also be able to zoom into that space.

Hon Minister, programme 2 of your budget should be able to assist the most rural, and the most peripheral, the most downtrodden members of our communities in achieving quality, accessible and efficient roads network to link them with access to goods and services. Our noble task is free movement of our own people, goods and services. I know you would relate to the rural development part I speak to that a small spaza shop owner in Tshidila-molomo should be able to freely and without hassle trade and have access to services and goods.

 

 

Motho o kwa Tshidila-molomo ga a tshwanela go botsa gore ... [A person from Tshidila-molomo cannot ask that ...]

 

 

... so that I can maintain my consumer confidence. We know that we can relate to this.

 

Hon Minister, the maritime transport space has spend R36,6 million paid to consultants and infrastructure and planning services for oil pollution prevention, which we think it is important. This is most welcomed however; this is the space we want to see being transformed and becoming inclusive as a matter of life and death.

 

 

Hon Minister, we want to applaud you that this budget has explicit correlation with the National Development Plan, NDP, Medium-Term Strategic Framework, MTSF, the Presidential Infrastructure

Co-ordinating Committee, PICC, objective and the state of the nation address. We continue to be happy with the work don by the presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Committee. However, we think we can do more.

 

 

Our public transport network is improving and growing, this however, means that we need to focus on the entire transport network as opposed to individual transportation modes. The NDP further edges us to find ways to become less dependent on transportation by improving spatial planning in cities so that people can live closer to areas of work and you have also touched that dynamics in your Gauteng metro police is different from Taung where I come from. The people there still travel to as far as Kimberly to go to work and they commute everyday. However, if you have a train that used to be there between Mafikeng and Kimberly you can be able to address such issues.

 

 

Conducive and reliable transport infrastructure will serve as a production base for the future generations. Let us continue to improve lives of our own people; build inclusive economy and unlock opportunities. Transport network will improve domestic manufacturing capacity and will quite efficiently increase our intention to grow our agro processing. I am raising this because as a North West rural province Minister, part of our core mandate moving forward is to build in to our agro processing sector, and we will

need bulk transportation. That is where your rail and road transportation comes in.

 

 

In this process we will build sustainable rural livelihood. We acknowledge passenger transport system through development of bus rapid transport system to more cities consistent with what you have said. I am a resident in Rustenburg Minister. If you want to go to Rustenburg today you will get lost because the road infrastructure has changed because of the buses that come there. We know that you are investing in that regard. Our people are however waiting patiently for the implementation. We also think that we are moving in the right direction.

 

Our people‘s quest to find expression in this budget deliveries remain unshaken Minister. There is probably one reality that we must remind other members who are here who do not know that when we took over after the collapse of apartheid this government did not inherit even one ship. Not a single ship. Today South Africa pride itself. We have ships that are flying our South African high. [Applause.] This is a reality that our people must begin to appreciate and those who are telling half stories we will continue to be patient with them and take them along. Because this is not as if the 3 000km coastline cannot be serviced. However, it is how you can make sure that our people ... because you can‘t, yes ... I am a rural person. I do not

know what the coastline ... but, we have our own people who stay right at the edge of the coastline and they must be able to benefit from this process.

 

Excuse me Chair, hon Mokgosi is looking at me like ... – What we want to emphasise hon Minister is that we must begin to further engage that Sanral is doing a good job by trying to reclaim the R760 million that was caused by collusion by companies in the sector. We know that other members who are sitting here are not going to raise because companies that benefited out of that collusion some of them are beneficiaries of those companies.

 

 

Hon Minister we want to thank you and everybody who contributed. We think that we can go far. If a member has a question I can take it Chair.

 

 

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: I want to know if the hon Nthebe would take a question from me. Please.

 

 

Mr B G NTHEBE: I am ready for three questions.

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): He is ready. You can ask your question. [Interjections.] Order members.

Ms L C DLAMINI: ... [Inaudible.]

 

 

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: No, it s derogatory. Can you please ask them to withdraw as a ruling from you presiding officer before I pose my question.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Dlamini, withdraw what you have said.

 

 

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Dlamini and ... [Interjections.]

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, hon Mpambo. I am assisting you. I am making a ruling. Hon Dlamini, can you kindly withdraw what you have said.

 

 

Ms L C DLAMINI: Withdraw?

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Dlamini! Hon Mpambo, take your seat. I am dealing with hon Dlamini. Hon Dlamini can you withdraw?

 

 

Ms L C DLAMINI: I withdraw.

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: I would like to know from hon Nthebe if he is speaking about the ship as in ...

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, let us deal with the question. We will take that after the question.

 

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: With my limited language competence I would like to ask hon Nthebe if he is talking about the sheep as an animal or a ship as in a boat? Please explain to me.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi):Hon Nthebe, [Interjections.] Order members.

 

Mr B G NTHEBE: One of the programmes of the South African Communist Party was to implement adult education. I am a proud product of it. [Laughter.] I am a former mine worker. I worked for 13 years deep in the belly of the earth. I went to Adult Basic Education, Abet. But what I can teach you now will last you a life time. [Interjections.] The ship that I am talking about is the ship that former members who can be traced to a particular political party sitting here are members of. Thank you. [Applause.]

Mr L P M NZIMANDE: Hon Chair when hon Mtileni express the following threatening words to hon Dlamini by saying that Withdraw or else we will ?moer‘ you.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Who said that hon Ndzimande?

 

 

 

Mr L P M NZIMANDE: Hon Mtileni. He said it twice Chair.

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mtileni, [Interjections.] Order members. I do not need assistance. Hon Mtileni is it true what is being said by hon Nzimande that you said.

 

Mr V E MTILENI: Hon Nzimande is lying. I did not say that. [Interjections.] I did not say that.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mtileni can you take your seat. Hon members let us refrain from all the things that will compromise the decorum of the House.

 

 

Mnr W F FABER: Voorsitter, Minister en lede van die Nationale Raad Van Provinsies, vandag het ek besluit om nie soos my kolleges in die Nasionale Vergadering my tyd op al sewe Programme te spandeer nie. Ek wil eerder konsentreer op ‘n paar kwessies wat my bekommer, aangesien dit lyk asof die regering hulle nie wil regstel nie.

Die begroting onder Program 3 aan die Passenger Rail Agency of South Africa, Prasa, en die Railway Safety Regulator, RSR, het heelwat gestyg.

 

Nou, Prasa ... Prasa ... Prasa ... Wat kan ons sê sonder om te wonder hoe hierdie sirkus bedryf word? Dit het begin met die hoofingenieur van Prasa wat blykbaar sy kwalifikasie in Duitsland verkry het nog vóór die afbreek van die Berlynse Muur! Indien sy ouderdom in ag geneem word, moes hy sy Meestersgraad dus op 10-jarige ouderdom verkry het! Wat ‘n uitsonderlike prestasie!

 

 

Na hierdie kwalifikasie debakel is Prasa se hoofuitvoerende beampte, Mnr Montana, ook onder verdagte omstandighede van sy pos onthef, dit nadat treine met die verkeerde spesifikasies vir Suid-Afrikaanse spoorlyne aangekoop is, terwyl die aankooptender nog ondersoek word.

 

 

Prasa doen nou hul eie ondersoeke, nadat ‘n Openbare Beskermersverslag gesê het dat die Nasionale Tesourie ondersoek moet instel na alle Prasa kontrakte oor R10 miljoen. [Tussenwerpsels.]

 

 

Dit kan u weer sê, agb Essack! Soos u daar sê, agb Essack, dit is ongelooflik dat Prasa hulself ondersoek! [Tussenwerpsels.]

Dertien Afro 4000 lokomotiewe was deur Prasa aangekoop teen R600 miljoen rand by ‘n Spaanse vervaardiger, maar met verkeerde spesifikasies vir die Suid Afrikaanse spoornetwerk. Hierdie

lokomotiewe was deel van ‘n kontrak van 70 lokomotiewe ten bedrae van R3,5 miljard. [Tussenwerpsels.]

 

In Augustus 2015 gebeur dit toe. [Tussenwerpsels.] ‘n Prasa Afro 4000 trein vanaf Johannesburg onderweg na Kaapstad ontspoor op ‘n reguit spoorlyn — daar waar ons is, agb Stock — in die Noord-Kaap naby Modderrivier. Die lokomotief lê nou nog daar, as u hom wil besigtig, hoor! Dit, vanaf Augustus 2015! Ek weet nie hoekom hy nou nog daar lê nie, maar hy is nog steeds daar!

 

 

Verskeie passasiers is vir ligte beserings in die Kimberley hospitaal opgeneem, terwyl die assistent treindrywer ernstig beseer is.

 

 

Prasa se eie ingeneurs het gewaarsku dat dié treine geneig is tot ontsporing wanneer dit verkeerdelik gebruik word. Prasa het onwettig opgetree deur passasiers op daardie nuwe Afro 4000 lokomotief toe te laat en sodoende daardie passasiers se lewens in gevaar gestel het.

Watter stappe tot aanspreeklikheid het intussen in hierdie ondersoek plaasgevind? Julle moet onthou, daar was geen bevoegtheidsertifikaat uitgereik nie.

 

Vyf-honderd-en-tagtig nuwe treine word nou in die Gibela fabriek in Nigel gebou en behoort teen Oktober 2016 klaar gebou te wees. Dit is ‘n reuse belegging vir spoorinfrastruktuur.

 

 

My vraag, Minister — en u kom van die Noord-Kaap — is dit: Waar is die beloofde geleenthede vir groot werkskeppingsprojekte in De Aar in die Noord-Kaap? Was daar ambagsopleidingskursusse aangebied om mense in staat te stel om die poste met die vervaardiging van treinwaens te vul? Vanaf 2012 — toe ons gehoor het die goed is aan die kom — tot nou was meer as genoeg tyd om die gemeenskappe in die De Aar gebied in verskillende ambagte op te lei met geakkrediteerde opleiding.

 

 

U weet, in 2012 was hierdie einste Huis, die NRVP, met ?Taking Parliament to the People? in De Aar. Die vervaardiging van treinwaens is aan die gemeenskap as ‘n reuse-werkskeppingsprojek voorgelê.

 

 

Soos ons vandag sien, was dit weereens ‘n ANC voorverkiesingsveldtog om stemme in die gebied te kry vir die nasionale en provinsiale

regering verkiesings, weens die vrees dat die ANC die Noord-Kaap provinsie kon verloor.

 

 

‘n AGB LID: Skande!

 

 

Mnr W F FABER: Die mense van die De Aar omgewing in die Noord-Kaap was deur die ANC regering vir hul stemme misbruik met hierdie leë beloftes. Hierdie gemeenskappe het gehoop om uit armmoede en werkloosheid verlig te word en werkskepping te sien, maar tevergeefs; dit het nie gebeur nie.

 

 

Kom ons praat oor vandalisme van treine en kabeldiefstal. Metro spoorwegtreine word aan die brand gesteek en kabeldiefstalle vind plaas. Elke week word pendelaars wat betyds by hul werksplekke wil uitkom van stiptelike openbare vervoer gestroop. Veral die arm gemeenskappe word die swaarste getref.

 

 

Dit lyk soos sabotasie wat plaasvind en nie net soos kriminele dade nie. Waarom het Nasionale Intelligensie nog nie hierdie sake begin ondersoek nie? Ek glo dat sekuriteitsmaatreëls na gekyk moet word en drasties opgeskerp moet word om treine, trokke, lyne en veral pendelaars se veiligheid te verseker.

Van uiterste belang is die uitbrei van ons spoorinfrastruktuur om die enorme verkeersdruk op ons nasionale paaie te verlig.

 

 

Kom ons praat gou oor die e-tol, Minister. Ons het gister gehoor toe u in die Nasionale Raad gepraat het, ?e-tol is hier om te bly!?

 

U het ook gepraat van goeie gehalte paaie. Maar u is korrek. Ons het goeie gehalte paaie nodig. Indien daar goeie alternatiewe roetes rondom e-tolpaaie beskikbaar sou wees, kon motoriste ‘n keuse uitoefen om óf die tolpad, of dan die alternatief te gebruik. Dan sou dit ‘n ander storie gewees het. Dan sou ek saam met u gestem het. Maar goeie alternatiewe rondom die tol paaie bestaan nie.

 

 

Meer as 80% van die begroting van Sanral kom uit die staatskas. Alternatiewe roetes se onderhoud is deel van die Departement van Vervoer se verantwoordelikheid, Minister. Ek stel voor dat u hieraan aandag skenk. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

 

 

[Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, Minister and members of the National Council of Provinces, today I have decided not to spend my allocated time on all seven Programmes as all my colleagues have done. I would rather focus on a couple of personal matters of concern as it seems that Government is not willing to rectify these.

The budget under Programme 3 relating to the Passenger Rail Agency of South Africa, Prasa, and the Railway Safety Regulator, RSR, has been drastically increased.

 

Now then, Prasa ... Prasa ... Prasa ... What else can we say without wondering how this circus is being operated? It starts with the senior engineer of Prasa who apparently had obtained his qualifications in Germany before the Fall of the Berlin Wall! Should his age then be taken into consideration, he would‘ve obtained his Masters at the age of 10! What an exceptional achievement indeed!

 

 

After this debacle surrounding qualifications, Prasa‘s chief executive officer, Mr Montana, was also relieved of his post and indeed after trains were purchased using the incorrect specifications required for South African railways, and indeed while the purchase tender was still under investigation.

 

 

Prasa is now conducting its own investigations, after it was commissioned in the Report of the Public Protector that National Treasury has to conduct investigations into all Prasa‘s contracts valued at over R10 million. [Interjections.]

You can say that again, hon Essack! As you are saying, it is unbelievable that Prasa is conducting investigations into itself! [Interjections.]

 

Thirteen Afro 4000 locomotives were purchased by Prasa from a Spanish manufacturer at a cost of R600 million, yet the incorrect specifications for the South African railway network were given. These locomotives were part of a contract concerning 70 locomotives at a cost of R3,5 billion. [Interjections.]

 

 

Then it happened in August 2015. [Interjections.] A Prasa Afro 4000 train on its way from Johannesburg to Cape Town derailed on a straight railway line — where we live, hon Stock — in the Northern Cape, near Modderrivier. This locomotive is still lying there, should you wish to view it, ok? And indeed since August 2015! I don‘t know why it is still lying there at the moment, but it is still there!

Several passengers were treated for slight injuries in the Kimberley Hospital while the assistant conductor was seriously injured.

 

 

Prasa‘s own engineers have warned that these trains are prone to derailment when they are utilised incorrectly. Prasa had acted unlawfully by admitting passengers on that new Afro 4000 locomotive and in that way had put the lives of those passengers at risk.

What steps with regard to accountability for this investigation had been undertaken in the meantime? You must remember that no competency certificate was ever issued.

 

Five hundred and eighty new trains are currently being built in the Gabela Factory in Nigel and these should be completed by October 2016. It is a huge investment for railway infrastructure.

 

 

My question, Minister — and you hail from the Northern Cape — is this: Where are those large scale opportunities for employment creation projects that had been promised in De Aar in the Northern Cape? Were vocational training courses offered so that people could be in a position to fill posts for the manufacturing of train wagons? From 2012 — when we heard that these things were on their way here — up till now more than enough time existed to train with accredited training courses in different trades those communities in the De Aar area.

 

You know, in 2012 this very House, the NCOP, was with its programme

 

?Taking Parliament to the People? in De Aar. The manufacturing of train wagons was presented to the community as an enormous project for employment creation.

As we are seeing here today, this was yet another pre-election ploy of the ANC to gain votes for the national and provincial government elections, because of the fear that the ANC could lose the Northern Cape Province.

 

 

An HON MEMBER: Disgraceful!

 

 

 

Mr W F FABER: With these empty promises the people from the De Aar area in the Northern Cape were abused by the ANC for their votes. These communities had hoped that poverty and unemployment would be alleviated and that job creation would be realised; yet to no avail. This did not happen.

 

Let us talk about the vandalism of trains and cable theft. Metro railway trains are being set alight and instances of cable theft take place. Those commuters who wish to get to work on time are being robbed every week of public transport which should be running on time.

Especially the poor communities are being hit the hardest.

 

 

 

It looks as if sabotage is taking place and not like criminal deeds. Why has National Intelligence not yet started an investigation into these matters? I believe that the focus should be on security measures that should be drastically improved in order to ensure the safety of trains, trucks, lines and especially the commuters.

Of extreme importance is the improvement of our railway infrastructure to relieve the enormously heavy traffic on our national roads.

 

Let us quickly talk about e-tolling, Minister. We have heard you yesterday when you stated in the National Assembly that ?the

e-tolling is here to stay!?

 

 

 

You have also touched on good quality roads. And so you are correct. We do need good quality roads. Should there however be good alternative routes available surrounding these e-toll roads, then motorists could have a choice in taking either the e-toll road or this alternative route. Then it would have been a different story altogether. Then I would‘ve agreed with you. But such good alternative routes surrounding these e-toll roads do not exist.

 

More than 80% of Sanral‘s budget is derived from the state coffers. Alternative routes are part of the Department of Transport‘s responsibilities, Minister. I propose that you address this.]

 

In a DA-led national government, as part of our 15 Ministries policy, we would incorporate the mandate of the Department of Public Enterprises for the management of Transnet, SA Express, as well as

for South African Airways, SAA, from National Treasury into the Transport Ministry.

 

 

The management of Transnet, SAA and SA Express would be transferred from National Treasury and the Department of Public Enterprises to the Department of Transport, which would remain a separate government department under the Ministry of Economic Infrastructure.

 

 

The DA‘s commitment to refocus resources on improving transport infrastructure from major industrial hubs to ports, for instance, will have a positive influence on the investment patterns of private businesses.

 

In conclusion, I want speak about road safety and law enforcement. The Road Traffic Management Corporation‘s annual report for the year 2014 shows that more than 4 500 people died on South African roads. Driving under the influence remains one of the main contributing factors to crashes.

 

 

Drastic steps need to be taken to stop the carnage on the roads. The DA suggests that we deal with driving under the influence with much harsher penalties. Testing for alcohol by withdrawing blood sometimes takes time, and the processing time to get an outcome may take months or even years.

We should perhaps look at accurate mobile alcohol testing kits that can process accurate results at blockades by immediately processing the test samples. This will create a more streamlined process that will enable authorities to act against those who are guilty of driving under the influence, as well as not putting those who are innocent through unnecessary trauma. I thank you.

 

 

Mr L B GAEHLER: Hon Chairperson, rural roads are the basic infrastructure requirement. They play a vital role in the socioeconomic upliftment of rural communities. They contribute significantly in rural development by creating opportunities to access goods and services located in the villages and major town markets.

 

 

Accordingly, their connectivity is a key component of integrated, comprehensive rural and coastal development. They will promote access to economic and social services and generate increased agricultural productivity.

 

 

They also increase non-agricultural employment as well as

non-agricultural productivity which, in turn, expands rural growth opportunities and real income through which poverty can be reduced. Increased investment in rural roads directly impacts on poverty reduction through its effect on improved agricultural ...

A new, all-weather rural road will bring various benefits to villagers. As producers, they will enjoy higher net prices for their markets ...

 

If there is a school in a village, children who are attending school in another village will spend less time travelling if the roads are fine.

 

 

Chairperson, first of all, Minister, let me compliment you on the reduction of accidents during this Easter period and also for the roaming traffic that has been visible throughout the Easter Cape.

 

However, Minister, we are concerned about the congestion of the N2 road from East London to Durban. The non-visibility of our traffic officers, 24 hours a day ... there are a lot of lives being lost through that.

 

 

One would like you to speak to your counterparts because we are losing life. It is better to pay overtime and save lives ...

 

Secondly, we also worry about the roaming animals in these areas ... on this N2 road. It would be good it you can speak to the department concerned so that there is fencing around those areas.

Also the congestion on the N2 ... I have spoken to you about bypasses and I hope that it can be a reality, that we would have bypasses.

 

 

Another major problem is unroadworhty vehicles. There are testing stations all over these towns but we never see any vehicles being stopped and tested. So one would like you to have a look at that.

 

The last and very important thing is ... there are heavy trucks on our roads. Is it possible for the government to construct a rail road from East London to Durban? That will save our roads. Is that possible?

 

 

Lastly, our coastal roads are in a bad state. Can something be done about that because we are losing a lot on tourism. I am talking about the roads from Mthatha to Coffee Bay and all the Wild Coast area. One would be happy if you could something about that with your counterparts because we are losing revenue through that. Thank you.

 

 

Ms M MOKABA-PUKWANA (LIMPOPO: MEC-TRANSPORT, SAFETY, SECURITY &

 

LIAISON): Chairperson, we solemnly bow our heads in remembrance of the recent minibus accident in our province, that robbed us of seven young bright minds from University of Wits. May their souls rest in peace. We take solace in the fact that, the survivors are recovering from various hospitals and we wish them a speedy recovery.

One of our great author and anti—apartheid activist, Alan Stewart Paton said:

 

 

Let me not be afraid to defend the weak because of the anger of the strong, nor afraid to defend the poor because of the anger of the rich.

 

Hon Minister, Deputy Minister, members of the executive councils, MECs, present here, Chairperson and members of the portfolio committee, hon Members of Parliament, Director-General and officials, Chairperson and chief executive officers, CEO, of entities, esteemed guests, ladies and gentlemen, good evening.

 

The National Development Plan, NDP, instructs us in the transport sector to establish effective, safe and affordable public transport. As a province, Limpopo, is hard at work ensuring that our roads remain safe for both motorists and pedestrians at all times.

 

 

I fully agree with the Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Transport, that we cannot succeed in investing and building the economy if our people continue to destroy the available transport infrastructure during protests.

We also applaud the progressive initiative by the national Department of Transport for organising provincial Youth Road Safety Summit throughout the country. I am pleased; hon Minister, to report that, Limpopo is the first province to hold a successful youth summit over the weekend.

 

In my closing remarks at that summit under the theme: ?#Being Safe is Cool,? I made a commitment as government that, we are ready to work with every interested party to reduce fatal accidents on our roads. We hope that the involvement of our youth in matters of road safety will have a positive paradigm shift towards accident free public roads. In that summit, young people committed themselves towards making our roads safe indefinitely for both motorists and pedestrians.

 

 

As participant in the United Nations Decade of Action for Road Safety, we are working hard to ensure our provincial targets are met in this regard. Our mantra, ?Don't ignore the road signs? continues to echo in every road user‘s mind and is expected to yield positive results. We are also distributing reflector belts worn by animals for visibility and as a result road crashes involving livestock have since decreased.

According to the recent study report in the Western Journal of Medicine, an increased traffic accident risk appears to be associated with several chronic medical conditions such as alcoholism, cardiovascular disease, epilepsy, diabetes and mental illness.

Further study probably will show that medical handicaps other than alcoholism are a factor in 5% to 10% of traffic accidents. To that effect, we are working in partnership with the Department of Health, Education and other relevant units. During the last joint random road medical checkups, it was found that most of the truck drivers suffered from hypertension and other chronic diseases that they were not aware of.

 

 

We will continue to intensify road traffic education and awareness programmes in all the schools and public gatherings. In the previous financial year, we have conducted 341 roadblocks, 11347 speed operations, 5117 weighing operations and 3201 drunken driving operations among others.

 

As a way of controlling overloading and other road hazards, as the province we have since launched the Operation Malaisha. The programme intensifies our weighbridges by ensuring that vehicles and trucks carry the permissible goods according to authorised vehicle body mass. During the Malaisha Operations, we impounded several vehicles that were not roadworthy. Goods without valid prove of ownership or

purchase were also confiscated to limit the transportation of illegal or stolen goods through our roads and border posts.

 

 

Chair, the procurement of 15 driver training simulators earmarked at strengthening the driver training project in the 2016-17 financial year, at the value of R5 million is underway. As announced by the hon Minister, Dipuo Peters in her Budget debate, the Road Accident Fund, RAF, is about to be phased out and replaced with the more expeditious Road Accident Benefit Scheme, RABS. We can report that through our joint efforts towards improved road accident benefit, we assisted about 30 000 road accident victims on their claims without external agencies.

 

We are working tirelessly with the police and whistle-blowers to eradicate corruption in the operating permits. Internal disciplinary processes against corrupt officials have been fast tracked and many of them are repenting or leaving the public service through disciplinary processes.

 

 

On public transport, the department is implementing the Rural Transport Strategy. Amongst the programmes we are busy implementing, is the Shova Kalula Bicycle Project. During 2015-16 financial year, the department distributed 275 bicycles to various schools

throughout the province. We expect to distribute a further 300 during the 2016-17 financial year.

 

 

The challenge of capacity at Gateway Airport Authority Limited, Gaal, remains disturbing, leading to the recent suspension of the CEO. The role of Airports Company South Africa, ACSA, in restoring the Umtata airport management is been explored for replication at Gaal with other available turnaround strategies initiated. We are also conducting a business study to determine the contribution of Lephalale, Musina, Giyani ...

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon House Chair, as a member of the NCOP from Limpopo, would the hon member take a question related to Waterberg?

 

Ms M MOKABA-PUKWANA: Chairperson, I am not going to take any question. Just listen to what I am saying ...

 

 

Ka Sepedi ba re o kwa ka mmagwe. [In Sepedi they say she/he heard from the mom.]

 

... The challenge of capacity at Gateway Airport ...

 

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Can you protect me Chair? Chairperson, member ...

... leloko mo phodiamong o fetsa go bua lefoko le lengwe le le masisi, a re motho o raya mmaagwe.

 

 

AN HON MEMBER: Ga se letlhapa. Ke mang are ke letlhapa?

 

 

Mme N P MOKGOSI: Ke letlhapa, ke kopa gore o dire katlholo mo go yona ka tsweetswee, gone jaanong Modulasetilo. (Translation of Setswana paragraphs follow.)

 

 

[...a member from the podium just uttered something bad; he said a person must tell that to the person‘s mom.

 

 

AN HON MEMBER: It is not a swear word, who said it is?

 

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: It is a swear word. Can you please make a ruling on that?]

 

 

Ms M MOKABA-PUKWANA: Ka Sepedi ge re kgalemela ngwana a bolela tše di sa swanelang, re re o kwa ka mmagwe. Ke dikoma tša geno; ke Mopedi. [When we reprimand a child for having said things she/he was not supposed to say, in Sepedi we say she/he heard about that from the mother. It‘s a family thing; I am a Mopedi.]

... We are also conducting a business study to determine the contribution of Lephalale, Musina, Giyani and Mphephu airports to aviation in the province and subsahara. The participatory integrated approach on road traffic management advocated by the Road Traffic Management Corporation, RTMC, is showing results. Our battle cry is: Don't ignore the road signs - Road safety is everyone‘s responsibility; it is the driving force.

 

 

Hon Chair, during the 2015-16 financial year, the department subsidised more than 30 million passenger trips at a cost of R650 million per annum through bus companies. Well over 2000 permanent jobs were created, ranging from marshals to inspector. We

have set aside R680 million for the bus subsidy programme for the 2016-17 financial year.

 

We will gear up for the introduction of a value for money systems improvement. In this regard, we will introduce within the next few months, an electronic bus monitoring system that will provide reliable monitoring reports and passenger information.

 

 

On taxi operations, the department has set aside an amount of about R5 million for the Limpopo Provincial Taxi Council, LPTC, in 2016-17. The Limpopo Department of Transport has a total of over 121 taxi associations, consisting of an estimated 13 000 members. The taxi

council has been established as a strategic instrument for the total transformation of the taxi industry to become the main public transport of choice. Along the same trend as the Freedom Charter, the Constitution, the NDP, the Local Development Framework, LDF, and the ANC local government election manifesto 2016, we will continue to forge integrated forms of transport for all South Africans towards socioeconomic development.

 

 

According to African proverb, if you close your eyes to facts, you will learn through accidents ...

 

... Bagešo, a re se ke ra gakantšha maswao a ditsela ... [... Let us not confuse the road signs please ...]

 

... Pad veiligheid is almal se antwoordlikeheid ... [Road safety is the responsibility of all.]

 

 

Thank you very much. [Applause.]

 

 

 

Cllr P RAMAREMELA (Salga): Hon House Chair, hon Minister of Transport, Deputy Minister, hon MECs present here, hon members of the NCOP and special delegates, CEOs and chairpersons of various transport entities and agencies, ladies and gentlemen, good evening. The SA Local Government Association, Salga, would like to express

its appreciation for being part of this year‘s Budget Vote. This platform provides an opportunity to highlight key issues and priorities for local government in terms of roads and transport and to share some of the work Salga has been doing in this regard.

 

 

The SA Local Government Association welcomes the Budget Vote under the dynamic leadership of the hon Minister Peters. The SA Local Government Association has the opportunity to engage in many aspects of how we deliver roads and transport services to all our people. I would like, particularly, to welcome the Minister‘s emphasis on collaboration and working collectively to find solutions to many challenges we face.

 

 

As Salga we appreciate the clarification of the roles across all the three levels of government and the prominence of the Department of Transport and other agencies such as the Road Traffic Management Corporation, RTMC, placed on working closely with local government. Without solid and well maintained infrastructure we cannot improve productivity and growth. Without growth we cannot address unemployment, poverty and service backlogs. The state of our road infrastructure and the quality of our own transport service are a vital part of our national economic performance. We must ensure sufficient investment in road transport infrastructure for both infrastructure and for maintaining our existing infrastructure.

Hon Minister, current spending on municipal roads exceeds the provision for the roads within the Municipal Infrastructure Grant, MIG, formula. This reflects the importance of municipal place on roads investment. However, this investment is not generating economic growth as one would expect which we believe is related to insufficient funding for maintenance.

 

 

A key constrain is that unlike other basic municipal functions, there is no funding for road maintenance in the local government equitable share. Working together with finance, fiscal commission Cooperative Governance and Traditional Affairs, Cogta, National Treasury, Salga has advocated for the MIG funding criteria to be amended so that MIG funds can be used to subsidise municipal road maintenance on behalf of the poor and address roads refurbishment. This recommendation will now be implemented and serve as a key gain for local government, especially local municipalities. However, more work needs to be done to address roads funding in metropolitan municipalities.

 

 

Unproclimed roads primarily in rural areas account for

 

140 kilometres of the 593 000km of gravel roads infrastructure network. The consequence of unproclaimed roads is that the maintenance and upgrading of this vast portfolio of roads infrastructure has been neglected which negatively impacts on the utilisation of roads.

Despite the challenges we would like acknowledge the work of the Department of Transport through its rural road assets management systems grant. We look forward to greater alignment between the data collector through this grant and the proclamation of the roads.

However, this process needs to be completed as soon as possible so that we can clarify road ownership and the role of these municipalities in relation to the roads.

 

 

The SA Local Government Association the focus of government over the next year on upgrading road infrastructure and services. We would like the hon Minister to stimulate a modal shift of freight from road to rail. We urge that the rail process be finalised as soon as police in order to guide future investment in rail for both freight and passenger movements.

 

A policy must not only facilitate the movement of freight from road to rail but also lay a solid foundation for legislation to affect this shift. The longer we leave freight on our roads the greater the financial and maintenance burden on all spheres of government.

 

 

The SA Local Government Association acknowledges the process underway by the Department of Transport to ensure that public transport is provided for across our urban areas. But we also need to provide public transport in rural areas as well. As local

government we would like to see this process accelerated. Lack of access to public transport for many of our communities remains a challenge that needs to be addressed.

 

The Back to Basics programme requires that we get the basics right. Maintenance of our roads infrastructure and ensuring the necessary capacity within the municipalities for the road and transport functions are two areas we have prioritised over the past five years. In this regard we developed a minimum bench mark organogram for roads and transport in municipalities to assist municipalities within their capacity challenges.

 

 

Local government elections on 3 August 2016 will bring many new public representatives to our municipal councils. The Salga is preparing this process to induct councillors from the roads and transport portfolio committees to fully understand the challenges and decisions that need to be addressed for roads and transport.

 

 

We would like to call upon the Department of Transport to work together with Salga on this induction programme to ensure that we properly capacitate our public representatives to lead the roads and transport portfolio committees in municipalities efficiently.

 

 

In conclusion we are confident that our relationship with the

department will continue to prosper and together we can do more towards addressing challenges associated with roads and transport in local government space.

 

Hon Chair, Salga supports the Budget Vote. Thank you. [Applause.]

 

 

 

Nkul V E MTILENI: Mutshamaxitulu, ndza xeweta. Vandla ra EFF a ri yimi na ku pasisiwa ka mpimanyeto wa Ndzawulo ya Timhaka ta Vutleketli. Vandla ra EFF ri xixima xiboho lexi tekiweke hi vaaki va Gauteng xa leswaku va tsan‘wa ?e-tolls? [tiheke to hakeleriwa] leti ti va karhataka siku na siku. Tiheke i e-tolls, tatana, tiva sweswo. Tiheke leti ti endleriwe ku xanisa vaaki na ku va tekela swimadyana switsongo leswi va nga na swona. Vandla ra EFF ri vula tano leswaku ri nyika xilemukiso eka vandla leri fumaka ngopfungopfu eka xifundzankulu xa Gauteng. A va ti voneli eka nhlawulo wa mimfumo ya miganga lowu nga kwala nyongeni hikuva wu ti endla madzingandleve. A wu twisisi leswi vaakitiko va lavaka swona swo herisa ?tollgates? [tiheke to hakeleriwa] [Nkavanyeto.] (Translation of Xitsonga paragraph follows.)

 

 

[Mr V E Mtileni: Chairperson, I greet you. EFF rejects the passing of budget vote of the Department of Transport. EFF respects the decision taken by Gauteng residents to ignore e-tolls [toll gantries] that are a problem every day. The e-toll gantries, Sir, that‘s what

you must know. These gantries are meant to make the citizens to suffer and take from them the little money they have. The EFF wants to send a strong warning particularly to the ruling party in the Gauteng Province. They should be cautious of the Local Government Elections which is around the corner because they are playing deaf. They do not understand what the citizens want with regards to bringing to a halt the toll gates. [Interjections.]]

 

 

Ms T WANA: Chairperson, can the speaker take a question?

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: I am afraid she will be wasting my time. I will take it in the bus on our way to Acacia Park, mam.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, he is not ready to take your question. Continue, hon Mtileni.

 

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: Chairperson, I can‘t hear this hon member.

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Which channel are you looking for?

 

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: Channel 12

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Tune to channel 2.

Mr J M MTHETHWA: I started on Channel 2 up to Channel 12, but I can‘t hear.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, it‘s in Channel 2

 

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: Akakwazi ukukhuluma kanjalo ngingamuzwa [She cannot say that when I do not understand her.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mthethwa, can you take your seat.

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: No.

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): He is entitled to use that language. It is an official language in South Africa. So, go to Chanel

2. Continue, hon Mtileni.

 

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: You are used to speak Zulu, Pedi and Sotho and you think I am insulting you today.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mtileni, don‘t do that. Do not address hon Mthethwa. Can you take your seat.

Mr V E MTILENI: Thank you so much, Chairperson. I will do it with due respect.

 

 

Mr F ESSACK: Chairperson, I am sorry. With due respect, before you allow the hon member to continue can you explain to the House or tell us what was the previous gentlemen saying.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): He was saying he was struggling to hear hon Mtileni, so, I assisted him.

 

 

Nkul V E MTILENI: Tanihi vandla ra EFF hi vula tano leswaku vandla leri fumaka ra ANC eGauteng ri endlile e-tolls ri nga twananangi na vaakitiko. Vaakitiko va kombisa ku vilela. Va vula leswaku ti susiwa kambe vandla leri fumaka ra ala. Eka sweswo mi ti vonela eka nhlawulo wa mfumo wa miganga lowu nga ndleleni. Tanihi vandla ra EFF hi ti yimiserile ku teka Gauteng.

 

 

Ndzi ta hlamusela ndzimana leyi landzelaka hi xilungu leswaku Holobye va ta ndzi twa. (Translation of Xitsonga paragraphs follows.)

 

[Mr V E Mtileni: As the EFF, we are saying that the ANC as the ruling party in Gauteng erected the e-tolls without consulting the citizens. Now the citizens are pretesting and are saying that they must be removed but the ruling party is refusing. To that, we say you must

be careful on the next Local Government Elections which is underway. The EFF is ready to take over Gauteng.

 

 

I will speak in English so that the honourable member can hear what I am saying.]

 

Some weeks back I drove along the two streets of Kimberly where the Minister come from, namely, Transvaal Road and Long Street. Those streets are full of potholes. Those potholes are as deep as Nkandla swimming pool. [Laughter.]

 

 

Ms G M MANOPOLE: I just want to say that the hon Mtileni is misleading the House. We don‘t have Transvaal Road in Kimberly.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): It is not a point of order, continue, hon Mtileni.

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: I still have five minutes.

 

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Chairperson, I permanently stay in Kimberly and I can attest to that, it is true. Hon Mtileni is speaking the truth. There is Long Street and Transvaal Road in Kimberly. I stay in Kimberly and I slept in Kimberly yesterday.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mokgosi, can you take a seat. Hon Faber, I have made a ruling that that was not a point of order. I said hon Mtileni must continue. Hon Faber, why are you standing? Is it a new matter?

 

 

Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, on a point of clarity. I want to know is this hon member really from the Northern Cape?

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, can you take your seat. That is not a point of order. You know that she is from the Northern Cape.

 

Nkul V E MTILENI: Ndzi ta swi vula hi Xitsonga. Eka mavhiki mambirhi lama nga hundza a ndzi ri eKimberly laha Holobye wa Timhaka ta Vutleketli va humaka kona. A ndzi ri karhi ndzi chayela eka switarata swimbirhi leswi vitaniwaka Transvaal Road na Long Street. Switarata leswi swi ni magoji yo enta ku ringana na ?swimming pool? [xidan‘wana xo hlambela] xa le Nkandla. Mi nga chela mati mi tlhela mi hlambela aka magoji lawa.

 

 

Ndzi tsakela leswaku Holobye va sungula va lunghisa ndhawu liya. Nasweswi ha ha mi byela n‘wina varhangeri va vandla leri fumaka leswaku vaakitiko va kolwe hi yo oxa hi ti e-tolls ... [Nkavanyeto.] (Translation of Xitsonga paragraphs follows.)

[Mr V E Mtileni: I will say it in Xitsonga. In the last two weeks I was in Kimberly where the Minister of Transport is coming from. I drove in two streets names Transvaal Road and Long Street. These street have potholes to the size of the swimming pool in Nkandla. You can pour water and take a bath in these potholes.

 

I will be happy if the minister can begin by fixing that place. We are still telling you the ruling party that people have had enough about the e-tolls ... [Interjections.]]

 

 

Mr J M MTHETHWA: I rise on a point of order, Chair. The hon member is misleading the House. You cannot find a pothole that is as deep as the swimming pool of Nkandla. Where can you find that? He is lying.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mthethwa that is not a point of order. You will have an opportunity to come and debate. Continue, hon Mtileni.

 

 

Mr C HATTING: Hon Chair, no member is allowed to say that another member is lying. That member has accused this person of lying. It is not allowed and he has to withdraw.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mthethwa, withdraw the part of saying the hon member is lying. Hon Mtileni, take your seat.

Mr J M MTHETHWA: I withdraw, but he is not telling the truth.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, take your seat. Continue, hon Mtileni.

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon House Chair, I think now is maybe the tenth or fifteenth time that the hon member has been using the same point of order over and over to say, misleading the House. There was a ruling earlier about that and he continuously does that and keeps on doing the same [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Smit, can you take your seat. Hon Smit, take your seat. I have made a ruling. Continue, hon Mtileni.

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: Holobye, loko vandla ra EFF ri teka timasipalankulu ta Joni, eKurhuleni na Tshwane ri ta herisa ti e-tolls leti mi tsandzekaka ku ti susa; leti mi tlimbeletaka vaakitiko leswaku va ti tirhisa va nga swi rhandzi. Hina loko hi teka timasipala leti tinharhu hi ta ti susa leswaku vaakitiko va ta kota ku chayela kahle va tshunxekile. N‘wina mi endla leswi vaakitiko va nga swi rhandzeki.

 

 

Holobye, ndzi pfumeleleni ndzi vula nakambe leswaku vaakitiko a va rivalanga leswaku tikhamphani leti akeke ti e-tolls ti fambe na mali

ya mamiliyoni yo tala leyi va nga yi yiva. Sweswi mi tsandzeka ku londza mali leyi. Hina, tanihi vandla ra EFF, hi vula leswaku mi fanele mi londza mali leyi nga yiviwa ya ti e-tolls leyi a yi ta tirhela vaakitiko va Afrika-Dzonga.

 

 

Ndzi pfumeleleni ndzi vula nakambe leswaku Holobye a va tirhisi nakambe matimba ya vona yo londza mali leyi nga famba na tikhamphani leti nga aka ti e-tolls tanihi laha va ma tirhisaka ha kona loko va sindzisa vaakitiko ku hakela e-tolls.

 

 

Tsundzukani leswaku hina tinghodzi to tala swinene emagondzweni ya hina hikwalaho ko tsandzeka ka vandla leri fumaka ku pfala magoji emagondzweni ya Afrika-Dzonga hi ku angarhela. Vanhu vo tala va lahlekeriwa hi vutomi. Xikombiso xa leswi i gondzo ra le xikarhi ka Giyani na Malamulele laha vanhu vo tlula dzana lava nga lahlekela hi vutomi ehansi ka tin‘wheti titsongo hikwalaho ka magoji lawa nga egondzweni leri. Mi tsandzeka ku hlayisa gondzo leri mi nga kuma ri akiwile hi mfumo wa khale.

 

 

Sweswi hi byela Holobye leswaku ku tsandzeka ka n‘wina ku endla leswaku hina hi miganda sweswi eka nhlawulo wa mifumo ya miganga leyi taka.

Ndzi pfumeleleni nakambe ndzi vula leswaku Holobye, a swi hi hlamarisi loko mi tama ma ha ri kona eka xitulu xexo. Mi nyikiwile xona hi Phuresidente loyi a nga landzeleleki Vumbiwa bya tiko; Phuresidente loyi a nga xiximiki Vumbiwa bya tiko; Phuresidente loyi a tekaka mali ya vaakitiko a tlhela a kaneta leswaku yena a nga tekangi kutani endzhaku ka nkarhi hina va EFF hi n‘wi sindzisa leswaku famba u ya hakela mali ya vaakitiko leyi a nga yi tirhisa eNkandla. Sweswi i hakela loko hi n‘wi yise ehubyeni ya nawu.

 

 

A hi hlamali Holobye n‘wina mi tshame kwalaho hikuva n‘wina na Phuresidente loyi a nga mi veka exitulwini xexo ma yelana hi mahanyelo ya n‘wina ... [Nkarhi wu herile.] (Translation of Xitsonga paragraphs follows.)

 

 

[Mr V E Mtileni: Minister, when the EFF take over Johannesburg, Ekurhuleni and Tshwane Municipalities it will end the e-tolls which you are failing to remove; which you are forcing the citizens to use while they are not willing to use them. When we take over these three municipalities we will remove the gantries so that people our citizens can drive freely. You are doing what the people do not want.

 

 

Minister, please allow me to state that people have not forgotten that the companies that constricted the e-tolls left with millions that they stole from the people, now you are failing to demand back

this money. We, as the EFF, we are saying you must demand this stolen money for e-tolls that it may be used by people of South Africa.

 

 

Please allow me to say that the Minister must use the powers invested on her to demand the money that went with the companies that built the e-tolls the same powers she is employing to demand from the people to pay these e-tolls.

 

 

Remember that we have lots of accidents in our roads because of failure but the ruling party to seal the potholes in South African roads in general. Many people lose their lives. A good example to this is the road between Giyani and Malamulele where more than hundred people lost their lives within a few months because of the potholes on this road. You are failing to maintain the road which found build by the previous regime.

 

Minister, now your failure gives us an opportunity to throw the first jab in the coming Local Government Elections.

 

 

Minister, please allow me again to say that it does not surprise me why you are still occupying that seat. You have been given the seat by a President who does not follow the Constitution of the country. A President who does not respect the Constitution of the country, a President who takes the money from the people and blatantly denies

that he did take the money until we the EFF insist that he must go and pay back the money he had used in Nkandla. Now he pays back the money after we took him to court.

 

We are not surprised at all that you Minister and the President who put you in that position are the same in your conduct ... [Time expired.]]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon members, let me remind you about the earlier ruling that was made by the Chairperson of the NCOP today. It is not a light issue to say that a member is misleading the House. You can only do that if you have a substantive motion to support what you are saying.

 

I am doing it as a caution to remind you because there was a ruling about that and you remember it very well.

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Hon Chairperson, hon members, hon Minister Peters, hon Deputy Minister Chikunga, distinguished guests, it was 60 years ago when many of our grandmothers, many of our mothers, mothers of this nation, heroines, marched on the Union Buildings in Pretoria to tell Strijdom: ?You‘ve touched a woman, you touched a rock.? They marched there.

In recent months we have seen very many people travelling very comfortably, using the Gautrain, using the toll roads, to get to the Union Buildings. When the hon member of the EFF talks about removing the toll roads, the problem, hon Mtileni, is that the people out there take you seriously and they realise that the chaos that you are causing here you also want to cause on our roads.

 

 

The Constitution of the Republic of South Africa of 1996 ...

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Makue, could you take your seat. Hon Mtileni, why are you standing?

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: I rise on a point of order. I just want to make a correction. I did not say: remove the toll roads. I said the e-tolls.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mtileni ...

 

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: You should have listening skills. He does not have listening skills.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mtileni, you can‘t do that. Hon Mtileni ... Hon Mtileni ...

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: I did not say toll roads. We cannot remove the toll

roads; we can only remove an e-toll gate, because the people are not interested ... [Inaudible.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mtileni, you are not even recognised. Hon Mtileni, I‘m doing this for the last time. When you were here, I protected you. I even referred to people raising frivolous points of order. So don‘t ever raise a point of debate. All members will have an opportunity to debate. Allow him to continue. Continue, hon Makue.

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Thank you, Chairperson. The Constitution of the Republic of South Africa of 1996 identifies the legislative responsibilities of different spheres of government pertaining to airports, road traffic management and public transport. In addition, the 1996 White Paper on Transport defines the different subsectors in the transport sector.

 

 

We would want to ask the members of the opposition parties to familiarise themselves with those documents when they come to this podium to debate. We, members of the ANC, commend the Department of Transport for ensuring that its annual performance plan, its strategic plan and its budget conform to the principles of our grand Constitution both in letter and spirit.

The Department of Transport‘s strategic focus is to improve access to economic opportunities and social space; to advance economic development; to ensure greater mobility of people and goods; to promote regional integration, unlocking the potential of SMMEs, co-operatives, townships and rural enterprises; and, finally, to advance the aspirations of Operation Phakisa through promoting the growth of the oceans economy and continuing to improve rural access, infrastructure and mobility. For those who have ears, let them hear. For those who have eyes, let them read this. It‘s available on the website of the department.

 

 

The key initiatives of the department include the creation of a unit that will ensure implementation of interventions aimed at supporting the objectives of Operation Phakisa – the oceans economy is important. Our chairperson, hon Nthebe, has spoken to that. There is also the submission of the National Airports Development Plan to Cabinet. We don‘t just create airports. This goes through constitutional requisite processes.

 

 

The SA National Roads Agency Limited‘s budget has increased by R1,4 million over the medium term for the Gauteng Freeway Improvement Project and by R1,7 million to strengthen the non-toll-road network. In addition, road infrastructure damaged by disasters will be rehabilitated at a cost of R848 million over the medium term through

an additional allocation to supplement the reprioritisation in the provincial roads maintenance grant. Anybody who is serious about roads in this country – that‘s what it is. Vote for this budget, then we know you are serious.

 

 

Chair, the department is also committing to looking at overall spending on transfers in the road transport programme. These transfers are expected to increase by R30 billion in the period 2018-19. But we know that very many of our people, particularly here in the Western Cape, are reliant on rail infrastructure and services. Rail infrastructure is therefore, in this budget before us, projected to be the fastest growing area of departmental spending, and the Rail Transport Programme is expected to grow at an average annual rate of 5,5%. Transfers to the Passenger Rail Agency of SA or Prasa, hon Faber, are mainly for requiring new trains for Metrorail, the commuter rail operator in major urban areas. The transfers are also for upgrading signalling systems and refurbishing coaches.

 

 

Chairperson, over the medium term, passenger trips will be subsidised through operational subsidies. The significance that hon Faber, through you, needs to know, Chair, is that all the problems that he raised about Prasa are problems that this budget is committed to addressing. If only he read the annual performance plan he would have read what I am presenting to you now.

Chairperson, enhancing public transport is key to economic growth. I‘ve spoken about rail; now let‘s look at public. The department‘s transfers to municipalities for public transport are expected to increase at an average annual rate of 6,6% over the medium term. We are not just saying to people that we will give them jobs. We are also making it possible for people to get from point A to point B so that they can secure employment for themselves. The regulation and enhancement of transport safety and security will save lives.

 

 

In order to reduce inequality and to alleviate poverty, the department‘s targets include developing a transport sector gender empowerment policy. The Minister of Transport will implement a 50% target for women representation on boards of directors of sector entities in the department. We know what the Employment Equity Report is indicating to us – but, still, most of the people in managerial positions in this country are not from the historically disadvantaged communities. This budget before us is not only addressing that, but also looking particularly at the gender requirements of our society to accommodate the majority of the population in this country. It is then looking at targeted recruitment and selection that will prioritise women in line with the following targets.

 

 

Firstly, there is the centralisation of the department‘s database of all women-owned entities. This will be established and a skills

audit will be conducted for all women-owned entities to address skills gaps. We know that this is not being done so that we can have a document, but so that those women can be given the opportunities and the right to participate in programmes of the Department of Transport. As part of monitoring and evaluation, the department will compile a status report on the transport sector‘s socioeconomic empowerment programmes for the designated groups.

 

 

Chairperson, when you stand here it is amazing how time flies.

 

 

I will therefore just refer to three of the programmes. One is Programme 4 which is in line with the National Development Plan or NDP, the Medium-Term Strategic Framework, the Presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Commission or PICC, and the state of the nation address. The department is not just developing programmes but ensuring that these programmes build on existing policies.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Makue, take your seat. Hon Julius?

 

Mr J W W JULIUS: Thank you, House Chair. I just want to know whether the hon Makue will answer a question.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Makue, are you prepared

to answer a question?

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Chairperson, because he is from Gauteng I will take his question.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): He‘s prepared to take your question. Hon Julius, you may ask your question.

 

 

Mr J W W JULIUS: From one Gautenger to another Gautenger: What do you think is the impact of the resistance of the Gauteng province and the insistence of the national department on e-tolls? Thank you.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Thank you. Hon Makue?

 

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Chairperson, I will answer that question with him when we have enough time ... [Laughter.] ... because I know he‘s going to take some time to understand what I am trying to say. [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Order, members!

 

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Chair, let me jump immediately to Programme 7 which deals with public transport. This programme is tasked with providing and regulating safe, secure, reliable, cost-effective and sustainable

public transport services in South Africa through legislation, policies and strategies. This budget has the potential and capacity to ...

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Makue, could you take your seat. Hon Hattingh? Hon Hattingh?

 

 

Mr C HATTINGH: I‘m just waiting for the hon member to take his seat so he doesn‘t get tired. Hon Chair, I didn‘t want to do this just now because I didn‘t want to interrupt the hon Makue.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): No, hon Mpambo.

 

 

 

Mr C HATTINGH: I want to give a point of order. Hon Mthethwa, in conflict in Rule 30(1)(a) when you were addressing the member of the EFF at the back, got up and passed between you and the member. Now, he has just done it again: when the hon Julius was asking a question of this member. This breaks the decorum of this House and it shows disrespect towards you and to all the members here. I would like you to reprimand him and to request him not to do it again please.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): The point of order is sustained. You cannot do that whilst the presiding officer is addressing an issue and pass between us, hon Mthethwa. Continue, hon

Makue.

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Chair, if the intention of transport ...

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Makue, take your seat. Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana?

 

 

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Thank you, Chairperson. The hon Dlamini has just referred to the hon Hattingh as a small boy. [Interjections.]

?There goes a small boy.? She has just said, ?There goes a small boy.? [Interjections.] You said, ?There goes a small boy.? It‘s a derogatory statement and I would refer you, Chair, if she denies it, to go to Hansard. She said ?a small boy? of the hon Hattingh.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Okay, thank you. You have made your point. Order, members! Hon Dlamini, did you refer to the hon Hattingh ... [Interjections.] No, hon Manopole. [Interjections.] Hon Manopole, you are not the hon Dlamini. Hon Dlamini, did you refer to the hon Hattingh as a small boy?

 

 

Ms L C DLAMINI: I did not say so.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana, I will go to Hansard and ascertain what you said, and then I will make a

ruling at a later stage. Hon Makue, continue.

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Chairperson, if the purpose of transport is to move people from one place to another, we cannot only talk about rail and road but have to talk about maritime transport as well. The maritime transport programme co-ordinates the advancement of a safe, reliable and economically viable maritime transport sector through the development of policies and strategies.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Makue, I‘m afraid your time has expired.

 

 

Mr E MAKUE: Chairperson, I will move as we move South Africa forward through transport. [Applause.]

 

Mr L MAX (WESTERN CAPE): Chairperson, hon Minister present, MECs, hon members, transport is livelihood and the lifeblood of any country, and public transport serves as one of the most important tools for economic growth and transformation, bringing workers to job opportunities. It is essential that public transport is reliable and affordable as espoused in the national Development Plan. The Western Cape DA-led government and the City of Cape Town is principled in its efforts in delivering on this.

The MyCiTi bus system in Cape Town is a already a success and the City is busy extending the routes to the City‘s Metro South East, which includes Khayelitsha, Mitchell‘s Plain, and already have routes to Atlantis and Hout Bay. In co-operation with national government the day run George, the Go George Bus, the Rapid Transit system has connected eight poorer outlying communities to central George, giving rural residents better access to jobs and education.

 

 

In addition several roads are under rehabilitation to improve its condition as it is of national importance. We believe that the condition of your roads is the reflection of the type of government your have.

 

Chairperson, the former mayor of Bogota Colombia, Mr Enrique Penalosa, once said: A developed country is not a place where the poor have cars; it‘s where the rich use public transport. It is with this in mind that the Western Cape is duty bound in providing safe, effective and reliable transport to reduce the traffic on our roads in the Metro of Cape Town and elsewhere.

 

 

Hon Minister the roads death is huge problem and a great concern to us all. There is a growing disrespect for traffic rules and law enforcement officers. This is not a massage of happiness in reassurance but it is the truth and a warning. Road safety remains

a crisis. It is countrywide. It is a crisis that strikes at the very heart and soul and spirit of our national will. It is clear and present danger to our people in this country. The threat is real. We must deal with lawlessness in our roads, Minister, on a war footing.

 

 

Minister, the salary levels of our provincial traffic officers is one which is of great concern. They are consumed by municipalities. We are losing experienced provincial departments officers. Minister, I normally hold you in high regard, and would like to have your commitment to this. I personally believe that you will try your best. The withdrawal of traffic fines, very easily by the NPA is equally a concern. It does not matter that you representing government is making strong statement, the employment of many traffic officers and at the end of the day those traffic fines are being withdrawn in a willy-nilly basis.

 

 

You will not find a person who will brag around a braaivleis fire saying that I double-crossed Sars – no but they will brag how they actually fool and withdraw and ignore traffic fines.

 

 

What is not functioning is the national run Metrorail, which serves as the backbone of our economy in the cities and is the single most important mode of getting people to work. In Cape Town alone, Metrorail uses 700 trains per day and transporting 320 000 passengers

per day, which equates 600 000 passenger trips per day.

 

 

However, Metrorail‘s operations is seriously hampered by the strikes and subsequent vandalism, which resulted in 14 train coaches been destroyed by fire, signal equipment in Philippi and Woodstock was set alight and destroyed. Additional to those, Cape Town railway station platforms 11 and 12 suffered severe fire damaged and is still closed. The estimated cost of the damaged to property is more than R80 million.

 

 

Chairperson, the result of this criminality speaks for itself. It causes overcrowding on our trains, risking commuters life‘s and increase opportunities for acts of criminality. Moreover, it has a visible increase of cars on our roads, in contrast with the City‘s attempt to decrease road traffic.

 

 

Chairperson, whilst speaking about passenger safety on our trains, it would befitting to commend the young man Darryn August a

27-year-old, who became a paraplegic since he was stabbed and thrown from a train by robbers after coming to the defence of a pregnant woman

 

Chairperson, these attacks on our transport systems are in my view as retired police general, acts of sabotage against the state. It

is serious and needs to be dealt with the same seriousness. What I do not understand is why our intelligence agencies cannot infiltrate these criminals to ensure that ordinary citizens and state resources are protected against these elements.

 

 

To the contrary according to news reports they wasted time and resources to monitor the Public Protector instead. In fact, they look for spooks in places where there is none.

 

 

Chairperson, in having regard to the aforementioned, it is evident that Prasa‘s treatment of Metrorail in the Western Cape is disastrous. It is for this reason that we call on the Minister and PRASA‘s national office to intervene in the brewing Metrorail labour conflict in the province and deal with any unresolved matters as a matter of extreme urgency. In particular, the potential strike action by members of the South African Transport and Allied Workers Union. Satawu.

 

 

As already mentioned, Metrorail provides an essential service to the people of the Western Cape. We cannot allow for this dispute to bring commuter mobility to a standstill. PRASA must ensure that their agreement with the Satawu national leadership is upheld. The agreement stipulates that no strike action will happen before every alternative avenue to resolve these legitimate issues amicably, has

been exhausted.

 

 

The regional management for Metrorail in the Western Cape, in our view is on the right track to improving on the service delivery of the entity, but the recent conflict and suspicious vandalism is a huge cost for the society.

 

 

Public transport is key and public transport is the future to accessing job opportunities for those most in need, and any unnecessary strikes must be avoided at all costs. Since the regional labour conflict erupted early last month, 160 employees failed to show up for work. These actions have cost our commuters and our local economy dearly.

 

 

The DA in the Western Cape supports Metrorail‘s bid for a permanent interdict barring its employees from striking over issues that are being negotiated at national level. We acknowledge that strike action is an important tool in pursuing workers interests. It is protected by the constitution, but it must not be abused. Satawu in the Western Cape is holding commuters hostage with this illegal strike action.

 

 

We would like to commend the employers who affirmed that late-coming due to train delays will not result in loss of employment. Yet the losses that business will and already suffered as a result of delays

will surely be to the detriment of the workers in the province.

 

 

We must ensure that ours is a democratic and fair society, where everyone can access jobs and education through effective public transport. We cannot allow for an illegal strike to prevent us from making progress in the Western Cape. Working together with our common faith, we cannot fail. I thank you. [Applause.]

 

 

Ms Z B NCITHA: Hon Chair, hon Deputy Minister and Minister Dipuo Peters, MECs present, South African Local Associaation, SALGA, hon members that are present in the House and members of the public at home and at the gallery.

 

This came into my mind that, history never looks like history when you are living through it. Is some total of things that could have been avoided? It is not the burden of the memory, but illumination of the soul.

 

 

South Africa has grown and developed in leaps and bounds in a lot of ways since our dawn of democracy. Today South Africa is part of BRICS and is the most developed economy in Africa. It is the major international trading, financial and logistics centre.

 

 

It goes without saying that an efficient and operational transport

system will provide benefits that have a multiple effect on the economy, such as increased investments, employment and exports. Without an effective transport system South Africa will miss out on critical economic opportunities. Our roads and rail networks form the backbone of the South African economy and are among the country‘s most important assets.

 

 

Transport is of vital importance to economic activities and social life. To cater for the transport demand and to foster the continuous development of South Africa, we need to maintain a sustainable transport system that is safe, reliable, efficient and also affordable. Just recently, under apartheid, our public transport system was designed along the racial lines where the white minority communities lived closer to their workplaces and had the best public transport system and the black majority lived further from the workplaces and had the worst public transport system and spent a fortune utilising the poor transport system. That is the history where we come from and our hon Minister has a responsibility to deal with that mess.

 

 

To reach a destination, for example, a black person rider is often forced to take multiple routes, each with different schedules and transfer stations but without coordination on passenger information. As a result, the rider may have to take long walk to make transfers

and pay multiple fares.

 

 

Our government has been working tirelessly to change this scenario by purchase more trains, and buying busses to commute our people. However, the legacy of apartheid runs deep and thus a lot of money and planning is needed to change this sorry state of affairs of our transport system. This is not one of those things we cannot be idle a bout. We need to urgently change this scenario as transport is the anchor of our economic activities.

 

 

The lack of proper transport leads to school children not being to be at school on time and teaching and learning suffers. It leads to food produce not being able to reach the markets while still fresh and this leads to loss of revenue and etcetera. It is a well-known fact that proper transport system will result in better economic prospects and it will reduce inequality, poverty and deprivation in our society.

 

 

Our people want a connected transport system that puts people first. Our black bus owners want to see transformation in this sector and the equalisation of funding so that they can also play with the big boys in the league. I want to make an example on this one, the funding of the two bus companies in Eastern Cape, your Algoa and as well Mayibuye in East London. None of this can be achieved without state

intervention and political willingness to see the situation changing.

 

 

Our government has a vision to provide a transport system that would benefit the majority of our people. A transport system that runs on time, that is affordable and creating jobs for many of our people. Compatriots, that is possible, if all of us both the Department of Transport ...

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

 

Hon Ncitha? Can you take your seat? Hon van Lingen?

 

 

 

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon Chairperson, we are not compatriots in this House. We are hon members. [Inaudible.]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

 

Hon Ncitha, refer to members of this august House as members. Continue.

 

 

Ms Z B NCITHA: ... government as the whole and all transport stakeholders and investors can work as a team with a common purpose to deliver reliable, affordable, safe and accessible public transport system and as well as developed road and rail network for the efficiency, effective and seamless movement of people and goods.

It is our duty to modernise our transport system as the benefits of the public transport are well known and range from environmental and financial benefits to social and health benefits. We need to continue to encourage our people to utilise public transport and make our people to be less dependent on cars, as more cars on roads cause accidents, and emit smoke that is detrimental to the environment.

 

 

I am a proud supporter of that our people need to use more rail rather than the cars, as this transportation reduces carbon dioxide emissions on our environment and leads to better and cleaner environment. South Africa is having a growing population that requires faster, better and environmentally friendly transport services to meet the demands of the growing public.

 

 

The National Development Plan has been a great catalyst for changing mind-sets and driving investments into more robust and infrastructure for the country, where a number of significant strategic transport networks infrastructure projects are taking place in our country.

 

 

The construction of public roads must be tailored the same way for all South Africans both in rural areas as well in the urban areas. That will bring about a better life for all in South Africa.

But this improvement of our transport system will be hampered if we continue to face roads that are in poor conditions, traffic congestions, lack of safety in trains and in taxis, inadequate and unreliable public transport, as well as taxi violence. This we can do it together, not only government that has a responsibility for transformation. Collectively, as South Africans we need to take part. I therefore fully support the 56 billion Budget of the Department of Transport. I thank you, Chair.

 

 

Mr M KHAWULA: Hon House Chairperson, hon Minister, hon member of the executive council, MECs, and colleagues, I fully agree with the hon Ncitha that we do not need all those shenanigans on our roads. Whilst government is putting efforts to curb the problems but road carnages and lots of lives in South Africans roads still remain a major cause for concern. The department has always maintained that human error is the highest contributor to road accidents in the country. It is indeed the responsibility of all road users to maintain their safety and the safety of others on the roads.

 

 

It equally remains the responsibility of the department to ensure safety of road users on the roads. Hon Minister, stern majors must be taken to deal with behaviour patterns and attitudes of road users. The issue of which powers to devolve to which sphere, like the Minister was saying, must be carefully considered. We do not want

to experience a repeat of implementation of not carefully thought decisions like it happened with the e-tolls. Up to this day, the department and country still reeling from the shock resistance of road users who would not dare pay for the e-tolls because of government failure to plan properly.

 

In the same vein, the danger of conflict of interest must be given firm consideration. Municipalities run and provide transport services in certain cities. At the same time, they have to somehow input the issuing of tax permits on the very same routes where municipal buses operate. The taxi industry is fought with a lot of challenges and difficulties. One fails to understand how it happens that up to now government has failed to prioritise solving problems in the taxi industry.

 

 

The industry employs hundreds of thousands of people. It feeds millions of individuals in the country. It contributes immensely into economic development of our country. Yet, it is not given the proper attention it deserves in order to minimise challenges. In some parts of the country, conflicts arising from contestation of taxi routes between different taxi associations still remain an issue which costs lives. The Minister has spoken about rolling stock to be purchased at the cost of R59 billon. The fact of the matter is that originally, in the 2013-14, this rolling stock was reported to be purchased at

the total cost of R51 billion. As to what happened in between to push up the cost by a whole R8 billion to a total of R59 billon, only Passenger Rail Agency of South Africa, Prasa, can tell.

 

Inkukhu iyawusola umgqakazo laphaya kwa-Prasa Ngqongoshe ohloniphekileyo. [I smell a rat there in Prasa, hon Minister.]

 

 

Something fishy is happening with Prasa management. Prasa operated at the loss of R26 million in 2015, and their operation was at a loss of R19 million in the 2014 financial year. Prasa incurred the irregular expenditure of R550 million in the 2015 financial year. Fruitless and wasteful expenditure in the same financial year was R19 million. Finally, Prasa irregularly awarded a R17,9 billion tender in the same financial year. Of course, offloading some load from our roads to rail is a good initiative. This will contribute to extending life span of our roads and at the same it will help minimise the high level of road carnages that we have, but this should not come at a high cost of mismanagement.

 

 

One would like to know, hon Minster, when so much wrong happens what actions is take by the department to have people taken to task for their wrong doing.

In conclusion, the transport system of our country is a backbone and benefit not just to South Africa but to the whole of Southern African Development Community, SADC. Therefore, improving operations of our country as transport system is at the same time improving the economic development efforts of SADC and Africa. I thank you, Chair.

 

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, Deputy Minister and hon members, a congress was held in Johannesburg on the National Transport Master Plan, NatMap, 2050, with great aplomb. The draft final report dated December 2010, of this project has not been signed off yet. We noticed that the department updated the colloquium just yesterday for further participation before it can be submitted to the Cabinet. This means that the process has taken six years to get this far. How can we move South Africa forward at this rate and create jobs at the same time?

 

 

Operation Phakisa means ?hurry up? in Sesotho. The project has several facets, but where is the ?Phakisa?? We ask the hon Minister why has the SA Maritime Safety Authority, Samsa, done nothing as regulatory body to protect the marine economy and where is the strategic or economic plan? 98% of all our exports through our harbours are made with 12 000 ships visiting our ports. Only three ships, not many - only three, hon Nthebe - were registered under the South African flag under the last 35 years.

Most of these exports are transported with foreign seafarers who are not part of the National Marine Accord and Protocols signed by 113 countries out of 178.

 

These foreign seafarers are using low wage structures. They are allowed to do so by default because there is no legislation to protect our seafarers against those countries exploiting the situation.

These vessels simply register in other countries and allow it without a regulatory framework. We allow it without a regulatory framework. What progress has been made in this regard and by when can we expect the draft legislation?

 

 

The Presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Commission, PICC, is in charge of the special infrastructure programme, Sips, and its projects. The department reports on a quarterly basis to the PICC, but Parliament is not kept abreast on a regular basis. This does not allow for oversight. The department also has Sips projects such as the Moloto Corridor. What progress has been made in this regard linking three provinces?

 

 

Hon Minister, at the time when you were reporting on this, you were running out of time and you were going into rapid machine gun fire. So, I am very sorry that when given the opportunity to finish that, but we would like to know about the Waterberg via Mpumalanga to

Richards Bay progress that you have made on the road to rail shift; and also the Durban-Free State-Gauteng logistics and how we have transferred the load capacity from road to rail. What is the update on the Sips in other projects managed by this department and each of the projects and in each of the provinces so that we - as members of the National Council of Provinces - can do our oversight? Just recently, the runway of the Port Elizabeth International Airport has been extended at considerable cost. I picked up the other day that the Port Elizabeth International Airport is now going to be moved to Ngqura as the international airport and freight. I hooted on the bus on the way to the aeroplane.

 

 

Our economy is bleeding. There are nine million people unemployed in South Africa. The transport network is of utmost importance to grow the economy from 0,9% to at least 5% if we look at the National Development Plan, NDP. Phakisa [hurry up], hon Minister, Phakisa [hurry up]! [Applause.]

 

Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, the speaker‘s list does not reflect hon Khomphela ... [Inaudible.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): ...

no, no, no. Hon Faber, can you take your seat? I can assist you if

you have a wrong speaker‘s list. [Interjections.] Continue, hon Khomphela.

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Hon Chair,

thank you very much. Hon Minister and the Deputy Minister ... Sorry, hon Komphela. Hon Mtileni?

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: On a point of order. I don‘t think you are answering him because as per speaker‘s list, hon Komphela does not appear here. I think you should give the right answer.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): I‘ve

 

done that. I even said that I can assist him so that he can have the right speaker‘s list. Take your seat, hon Mtileni. [Interjections.] Yes, you will get one. Can you take the seat? Take your seat. Continue, hon ... er ... Order, members! Continue , hon Komphela.

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Hon Chair,

hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, hon members of the NCOP, ladies and gentlemen, the President of the Sa National Taxi Council, the CEOs of various entities of our department, the hard working officials of the Department of Transport.

The Free State would like to support this budget. We have a responsibility to create a prosperous, nonracial, nonsexist, united and democratic South Africa. I will come later to talk about this infrastructure that we have created so far and are still creating, which is a better infrastructure - better than before 1994. But there are ?Schumachers‘ who are using it and therefore I will talk on how we deal with ?Schumachers‘ that are driving on this road.

 

 

There is an issue of cable theft that was raised by hon members. It is not the duty of the Minister of Transport to look into the cable theft issue in provinces but it is on a concurrence between the responsibility of Roads and Transport or the MECs of Transport and the Police. They must employ people to look after this important entity that is used every day.

 

We still have to look at the province that will break the record by sentencing people 10 years for stealing the cables. I don‘t care who those people are who steal cables, but there is a straight 10-year sentence without any bail application. Anybody who wants to prove this by serving the 10-year record of breaking this law would see that we are not playing games, especially if one put the lives of people at stake. We will go and deal with those kind of people.

On the issue of roads in the Free State, hon Khawula has spoken about it and many other speakers, we know our responsibility. If you overtake on a barrier line, yes, come and see; you will find me. If you overtake on a barrier line there is no law that says you should be given a section 56 notice. There is no such law. We arrest you and open a docket for you. You will meet us on Monday in court but you will spend the weekend in the cells in the Free State. If you drive very fast with your faster car, you can do it in another province. In the Free State, as soon as you drive over 140 per hour

- ask your friends, we open a docket for you and arrest you and charge you with negligence and reckless driving.

 

 

Let me tell you a very interesting story, 27 of your colleagues ...

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Komphela, sorry. Hon Essack.

 

 

 

Mr F ESSACK: Chairperson, I just want to check if the hon speaker would take a question.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

order, members! Hon Komphela, are you ready to take a question?

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): No, I would

 

like to address these issues. I am not taking a question now.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

he is not ready. Take your seat. [Interjections.] Hon Essack, take your seat. Continue, hon Komphela. [Interjections.] No, you can‘t suggest. Take your seat. You can‘t suggest. [Interjections.] Continue, hon Komphela.

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): The other

 

thing, hon Chairperson ...

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Mtileni, I am not going to argue with you, take your seat. Continue, hon Komphela.

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Hon Chair,

 

the other thing that should happen in this important august House is that if there is a problem on the shortcoming of the legislation, this amendment of the legislation correctly states that when members realises that there are shortcomings around issues of legislation that culminates to lawlessness and carnage on the road, the hon members should say to the hon Minister: ?Hon Minister, that this is the legislation we are sponsoring, we should tie up this legislation

because we can see that there is carnage on the road.? Then in this way, hon members will be able to help the hon Minister on how to deal with issues of lawlessness on the road.

 

Hon Chair, we are working very well with the minibus taxi industry in our province. They have Operation Hlokomela which is a clear collaboration between us and the minibus taxi industry. The minibus taxi industry is the largest entity that is offering transport services to people in the country. Sixty five percent of the people use minibus taxis as means of transport and the minibus taxi owners are still willing to find out what is wrong with their transport business so that we can help them to improve on that. They have never said that they are not going to correct mistakes that are in their transport business and therefore we should stop calling their minibus taxis ?moving coffins‘. If the minibus taxis are still operating on the road, they are willing to correct any mistakes so that they are better than the buses and metered taxis.

 

 

MyCiTi bus service and all these other transformative transport services that the Minister is introducing should not be seen by minibus taxi owners as the best means of transport that transport people to cities. They should not see MyCiTi bus passing as if it is transporting people to its own city and not theirs. It must also

be the minibus taxi owners‘ city; they must also have a stake and they must be able to protect this entity.

 

 

The trains commuting people between Khayelitsha and Gugulethu or elsewhere should call minibus taxi operators and ask them, ?What do you think we should do for you to be part or have a share in the profit of these train you see going up and down rather than ...

 

 

... nizijonge nje zidlula ... [... just see them passing and ...]

 

 

... you are not part of it.

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

MEC, sorry. Hon Michalakis?

 

 

Mr G MICHALAKIS: Thank you, hon House Chairperson. Yes, the hon member from the ANC, hon De Beer, is right; he is another Free Stater. Would the MEC be willing to take a question from another Free Stater?

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Yes, I am

prepared.

 

 

 

Mr G MICHALAKIS: Thank you, hon MEC. Hon MEC, you speak about the MyCiTi bus system that‘s in Cape Town. Could you please explain to

this House what alternative do you have in place in the Free State for people commuting from Bloemfontein inner city to Thaba Nchu and Botshabelo and what happened to the millions of rands that the municipality there had to spend on that same system? [Interjections.] Furthermore ... [Interjections.] ... would you be able ...

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

hon Michalakis. [Interjections.] Hon Michalakis. Hon Michalakis, you said you want to ask a question.

 

 

Mr G MICHALAKIS: Indeed!

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Yes,

you have asked a question; let him respond to your question. [Interjections.]

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Chair, we

 

have the Maluti Bus Service in Qwaqwa. The minibus taxi industry does not fold its arms and watch as those buses go in and out, they have 60% of stake in those buses. There is an Interstate Bus Lines in the Free State, the minibus taxi industry is not watching those buses going in and out of Thaba Nchu. I can give you a guarantee. Go to their books, they have 60% of shares in those buses.

Even with the railway line we are going to construct there; they will also have shares. They are not just bystanders who watch the economy failing and have what we call the economic bypass. They are part of that transport business between Thaba Nchu and Botshabelo that we are talking about. Who started it is not my business but my business is to ensure that the minibus taxi industry is part of that. [Applause.] [Interjections.]

 

 

Anything that is raised by hon members ... you see hon members, we must know what we are doing - the work and responsibility given to us in terms of the Constitution. The national Minister of Transport would not come from Cape Town or Pretoria to resolve a dispute of the concurrent power of the MEC in the province and say, ?Let me help you to resolve this problem.? MECs have the responsibility to make an input to the Minister about issues that are bedevilling the provinces because they have the responsibility to do that. Not that the Minister must go to them.

 

Regarding the issue of roads - everybody knows that I am happy that the comrade raised that issue. We have what we call national roads. The Minister is responsible for national roads. The road that is called Transvaal - or any other road which is a provincial road - does not have to be the responsibility of the Minister because we

as MECs have a responsibility to deal with any matters of those roads, including municipalities.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

Sorry, hon MEC. Hon Mokgosi?

 

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Hon Chairperson, for your information, it‘s a province, he is from there. [Interjections.] It‘s a responsibility. [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Mokgosi. Hon Mokgosi, you can‘t do that. Continue, hon MEC.

 

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): The Minister

 

has no responsibility for the provincial roads. I want to put it on record ... [Interjections.] ... the Minister has no responsibility for the provincial roads; he has a responsibility for the national roads. The Minister give us grants to work on the provincial roads maintenance.

 

Hon Van Der Lingen, I would like to invite you to come and see the Harrismith Logistics Hub. When you walk around that centre, the work we did and the fence that we put up will indicate to you that the logistics hub will never be something that we develop and leave to

waste. It is at the infant stage but it will remain in operation and there is still more improvement to be done there.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

MEC. [Interjections.] Hon Mtileni, can you take your seat? I have given you a final warning about what you are doing. Hon van Lingen. Hon Van Lingen, why are you standing?

 

 

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon House Chairperson, will the MEC take a question?

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

MEC, hon Van Lingen is asking whether you can take a question.

 

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): No, I will

 

not take a question.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Can

 

you take your seat? He is not ready to take your question. Continue, hon MEC.

 

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Can you just call me Van Lingen instead of Van Der Lingen?

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): I am not

 

an Afrikaner.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Mtileni. Hon Mtileni. Hon Mtileni, let me address you. You have been consistently standing and you are talking without being recognised. Can you take your seat? Can you take your seat? Can you take your seat? Continue, hon MEC.

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Thank you

 

Chair, the path to this noble objective has never been more than ever before. Various factors and in particular the current economic environment ...

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

Sorry, hon MEC. Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana?

 

 

 

Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: We want a ruling on this. Hon van Lingen asked the hon MEC to pronounce her name as Van Lingen and not Van Der Lingen and his response ... [Interjections.] ... his response was, ?I am not Afrikaner.? You don‘t need to be Afrikaner to pronounce Van Lingen.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Can

 

you take your seat? Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana, take your seat. [Interjections.] Yes, I will make a ruling. Can you take your seat? Can you take your seat? Can you take your seat? I am addressing you. We are addressing members. Hon Van Lingen requested the MEC to take a question and when the MEC said he was not ready to take a question, I then asked him to continue. Can you continue, hon MEC? [Interjections.] Hon Mtileni. Hon Mtileni. Hon Mtileni, you are even casting aspersions on me as a presiding officer. You are saying, ?My member.?

 

Mr V E MTILENI: Thula! [ Keep quite.] He was referring to hon Nkagisang there when he was saying, ?Thula?.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Can

you take your seat? [Interjections.] No, can you take your seat? I want to address you. Hon Mtileni. Hon Mtileni, let me address you. You know that it is against the Rules to cast aspersions to a presiding officer. You are even saying, ?My member.? I am not debating with you, take your seat. Take your seat. Mtileni, take your seat.

 

 

Mr V E MTILENI: ... [Interjections.] [Inaudible.] ... that she pronounce the surname correctly. This is the same thing. [Interjections.] This is what has being asked by hon Van Lingen. That

is why I am saying you are biased. We are asking you to do the same favour ... [Inaudible.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

Mtileni, can you take your seat? Faber, why are you standing?

 

Mr W F FABER: House chairperson, on a point of order. I want to raise exactly the same thing. It happened previously when you were a Chair; we raised it in the Rules Committee. You are taking us back to the Rules Committee. In the meeting you requested me three times to sit down after presuming that you know what I was going to say but you did not know. When a member is asking to be recognised, you cannot assume what he is going to say. We cannot take you to the committee every time because your rulings are unfair. Please, recognise every member with respect, until you hear exactly what he is saying. Thank you, Chair.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): I

 

have done that and I am consistently doing that. Continue, hon MEC.

 

 

 

Mr B KOMPHELA: (FREE STATE MEC FOR SAFETY AND SECURITY): Thank you

Chair, the path to this noble objective has never been more daunting than ever before. Various factors, in particular, the current economic environment, have militated against the early achievements of these objectives and yet our people have not despaired. They

witnessed the resolve and fortitude with which the government of the ANC continue to deliver on the undertakings.

 

 

The success of our efforts will be measured by progress. We have continued to create jobs and a better the life for all our people. In an ongoing progress, in these areas of creating jobs and ending poverty that will bring us to a more equitable society, we are ready to commit ourselves. We could list amazing opportunities we have made available to create a better world and a better life for our people. There is enough food today, roads are improved, medicines are available, deaths from diseases have declined. We used to be plagued by many diseases but today the life spans of our people have gone up.

 

 

We have created a transformation system that can deliver a better life essential to our people. We have improved roads to assist our people and have been able to lift a education to a higher standard The tools to ensure a safe environment in the province, that we have done are the following: Our people in the Free State, stay free and our people in the Free State, feel free. There is nothing that we are not doing [Interjections.] yet we continue to hear from the opposition that they are not feeling safe. We give them the guarantee. I am giving the hon members who live in the Free State an assurance. The record time for us is eight hours to save the people if there

is an attack on the farm because we have a duty and a responsibility to protect our people.

 

 

We welcome the belt-tightening initiatives announced by the President and subsequently by the Minister of Finance on 24 February. To paraphrase the premier‘s view on 26 March 2016 on the state of the province ... [Time expired.] Thank you. [Applause.]

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon House Chair, you know sometimes it becomes shameful on my part that my African is associated with some of the hon members. Many times, Afrikaners speaking people have mispronounced our surnames, sometimes I am called Matimunye and none of the African members of the DA have stood up and corrected that. [Applause.] My African to be associated with that of yours is really shameful.

 

Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Hon Chair, on a point of order: This hon member is not speaking the truth because the Deputy Minister just did exactly the same thing in the previous debate. He corrected me on his surname.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

 

Order! Members, Hon Van Lingen is correct. Earlier on when the Chair was presiding, hon Deputy Minister Cele requested that if people

can‘t pronounce his name correctly, it‘s better to refer to him as the Deputy Minister. There was a ruling about that.

 

 

Mr O S TERBLANCHE: Hon Chair, on a point of order: just to give you the right information, you even got the wrong person now. That is not hon Van Lingen there, it is hon Labuschagne.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

I said hon Labuschagne. [Interjections.] Okay, if I said Van Lingen, I meant hon Labuschagne, therefore it means I made a mistake, continue hon Mthimunye. [Interjections.]

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon members just pause a little bit and close your eyes and meditate, rewind a thousand years back. [Interjections.] Imagine that tomorrow we wake up and the EFF is in charge of government in South Africa. [Interjections.] Just imagine what will happen. [Interjections.] Land grab willy–nilly, birth rate that is uncontrollable and unplanned. [Interjections.] It will even not be apartheid or slavery; it will be barbarism that we will have in this country. [Interjections.] And that is the kind of government some members think we can have in this country, in their dreams, not after so many years of the struggle. [Interjections.]

Mr V E MTILENI: Hon Chair, on a point of order: I wanted to explain that the hon member is casting aspersions; he is just casting aspersions because the government is not there yet, but why is he

... [Inaudible.] [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Mtileni, can the both of you take your seat so that I can make a ruling. [Interjections.] hon Mtileni, can you take your seat? [Interjections.] Hon Dikgale, both of you must take your seat. [Interjections.] Hon Mtileni, hon Mtileni can you withdraw your participation from the House? [Interjections.] Hon Mtileni, can you leave the House? [Interjections.] can you assist us? Hon Mtileni can you leave the House? [Interjections.] Hon Mtileni, can you leave the House? [Interjections.] [Laughter.] Continue hon Mthimunye. [Interjections.]

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon House Chair, after everything is said and done in this debate, a question has to be asked. Did all this good work happen out of an accident of politics? The answer is no, it all happened through the policies of one organisation and that organisation is the ANC. So what is the policy perspective of the ANC in this regard? In 1997 the ANC, 50 years national conference in Mafikeng set out a basic objective of economic policy and the

critical errors that had to be addressed if economic policies are to have an impact on the transformation of society. It stated that:

 

 

The mission of the ANC continues to be the fundamental transformation of the South African economy in order to empower black people, especially Africans, collectively as the communities and as individuals. To eliminate poverty and the extreme inequalities generated by the apartheid system; generate productive employment opportunities for our people at a living wage; and ensure balanced South African economic development.

 

The ANC‘s policy also continues hon Chair in its document of 1992, Ready to Govern. To call for a developmental state that will ...

 

Mr W F FABER: Hon Chair, on a point of order: With due respect, the history of the ANC is not what we came to listen here. [Interjections.] He is on the wrong debate Chairperson. [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

hon Faber, take your seat, that is not a point of order. Continue hon Mthimunye.

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: In it‘s Ready to Govern document, the ANC calls for a development state that will be responsible for responsible for the provision of infrastructure in the form of roads, dams, telecommunication, transport and electrical power stations, as well as for the furnishing of utilities such as water, electricity and waste disposal services, in ways that empower community based organisations. This was consolidated some three years later in the Reconstruction and Development Programme (RDP). The publicly owned transport systems road, rail and air, will be improved to provide safe, convenient and affordable transportation. Privately owned taxis, buses and airlines will be regulated so that they meet the same standards. A campaign to improve road safety will be undertaken.

 

 

Mr C HATTINGH: Hon Chair, on a point of order: I want to ask hon Mthimunye whether the ANC when they dumped ... [Interjections.] at Luthuli House without their shoes, whether they paid E-toll. [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Hattingh, you first have to ascertain whether he is ready to take a question.

 

Mr C HATTINGH: Okay, I want to ask you about ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

no, you can‘t do that.

 

 

Mr C HATTINGH: when they delivered the matter to Luthuli House. [Interjections.]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

Hon Hattingh.

 

 

 

Mr C HATTINGH: Sorry.

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Hattingh, you can‘t do that, you first ascertain whether he is ready to take a question, Hon Mthimunye, are you ready to take a question?

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: No! [Interjections.]

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

Continue he is not ready to take a question. [Interjections.]

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: The transport sector is an essential component of the economy with strong effects on development and the welfare of communities. When transport systems are efficient, they provide socio economic opportunities and benefits that result in positive

multiplier effects such as better accessibility to markets, employment and additional investments.

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: House Chair, on a point of order: My apology, I am now confused in terms of the dressing code. I want to know if it is Parliamentary for the hon member to actually be in the House without a tie because as far as I know ... [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): That

is not a point of oder, continue hon Mthimunye.

 

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: But the sector is plagued by a number of pertinent challenges Hon Chair, slowing what could and should be rapid and continuous growth for increased competitiveness. The country is facing a challenge of increasing infrastructure demands, and infrastructure backlogs of which transport is very much a part of.

 

 

The ANC has ... [Laughter.] [Interjections.] What is this?

 

 

 

Mr F ESSACK: Hon Chairperson, on a point of order: From one Mpumalanga resident to another, through you, being from Mpumalanga also, the three of us together, can I ask the hon Mthimunye a question? [Interjections.] specifically being a Mpumalanga ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

hon Essack, you can‘t ask the question. Let me ascertain whether he is ready to take your question. [Interjections.] He is not ready to take your question. [Interjections.] Take your seat.

 

Mr F ESSACK: Come on Mthimunye man, have the guts man. [Interjections.]

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: The ANC has identified infrastructure as the key job driver and critical to development in at least three ways, it creates favourable conditions for production and consumption; it facilitates economic and diversification; and it provides much needed access for people to services, facilities and opportunities. These impacts are directly relevant to the strategic objectives of the National Democratic Revolution that includes ...

 

Mr J W W JULIUS: Chairperson, on a point of order: I have read that speech somewhere and that is plagiarism. That is just report that the hon member did not write Chairperson, that is plagiarism. [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Essack take your seat. [Interjections.]

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon House Chair, can I place on record that I have survived torture and I cannot be distracted by these frivolous points of orders. [Interjections.] [Laughter.]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Nthebe, take your seat. Hon Julius, let me address your point of order. Even yesterday, plagiarism point of order was raised and there was a ruling about it, so let‘s allow hon Mthimunye to continue. Continue hon Mthimunye. Hon Nthebe ...

 

 

Mr B G NTHEBE: Chair, on a point of order: Please save us from the members of the other political parties here. We want to go home, some of us we stay alone. [Interjections.] they are at liberty to raise points of orders but they cant abuse them. [Interjections.] Please, we must be safe. [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Nthebe, that is not a point of order; take your seat. Continue hon Mthimunye.

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon House Chair, amongst other key objectives of the ANC radical economic transformation is to ensure meaningful black participation in the ownership, control and management of the economy and advance black industrialists.

Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon Chairperson, on a point of order: Can we please have order in this House. We cannot perform like the NA. Can we just get back to a normal sensible House please? [Interjections.]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

 

Order! Members, I sustain the point of order. Let‘s behave members, let‘s maintain the decorum of the House. Continue hon Mthimunye.

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Black empowerment codes for the transport sector, which is one of the biggest contributors for South Africa‘s infrastructure and Gross Domestic Product (GDP), were gazetted in 2009. The targets include increased black ownership of bus commuter services, increasing the number of black pilots, and providing training for the country's taxi drivers. In his state of the nation

...

 

 

Mme N P MOKGOSI: Motl Modulasetilo, mo ntlheng ya kgalemo: Ke kopa go bua ka ntlha e nngwe ka wena. Ke ne ke re motl Nthebe fa a tshwerwe ke boroko, a ye go robala ka gore ke mokgwa wa maANC wa go rata go robala. Ke ne ke re a ye robala, dikgoro ga di a tswalwa. [Tsenoganong.] (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)

[Ms N P MOKGOSI: Hon Chairperson, on a point of order: If hon Nthere feels sleepy, he can go ahead and sleep. No one will deny him that. It is a habit of the ANC members to sleep. [Interjections.]]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

can you take your seat? That is not a point of order. Continue hon Mthimunye.

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: In his state of the nation address in February this year, President Jacob Zuma said:

 

Economic transformation and black economic empowerment remain a key part of all economic programmes of government. One of government‘s new interventions is the black industrialist scheme which has been launched to promote the participation of black entrepreneurs in manufacturing.

 

 

In the beginning of March this year, the Transport Minister Dipuo Peters did a sod turning ceremony for the PRASA train manufacturing factory at Nigel, in the Ekurhuleni Metropolitan Municipality as part of the rolling stock fleet renewal programme. [Applause.] The 72 hectares plant will enable new passenger trains to be manufactured and maintained locally in South Africa, with only the first 20 sets manufactured in Brazil. The plant will create job opportunities and

support SMMEs that will be permanently based at the plant as suppliers for the main manufacturing of new trains. About 1500 people of which 99% will be South Africans, with a target of 85% from historically disadvantaged and 25% will be female.

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon House Chair, on a point of order: Seeing that the hon member doesn‘t want to take the Mpumalanga question, will he take a Limpopo question?

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Okay, can I place this record. I am not taking any questions Chair.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

he is not taking any questions. Continue hon Mthimunye.

 

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: In conclusion Chair, the Sihamba Sonke roads programme was introduced in provinces, and is aimed at achieving the following: 60% of employment and empowerment in road infrastructure to previously disadvantaged communities; 40% to be allocated to the operation of Tselantle programme, which is intended to eradicate potholes; and 50% of the Expanded Public Works Programmes infrastructure and job creation targets. Through this programme, there are currently more than 120 Civil Engineering graduates who are being trained and will later be absorbed into municipalities.

Chairperson may I also in conclusion, in the final analysis, revolutionaries are not produced by noise making. Revolutionaries are not produced out of anarchism. A revolutionary ideology cannot be coined out of mimicking or trying to speak an African language

...

 

 

 

Mme N P MOKGOSI: MOdulasetilo, mo ntlheng ya kgalemo: Fa e le gore hon Mthimunye o lebisetse kwa go nna fa a re tlhogokgolo, ke lebisa polelo ya leloko le le tlotlegang fale, kwa go ena. Ke a leboga. (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)

 

 

[Ms N P MOKGOSI: Chairperson, on a point of order: If hon Mthimunye is referring to me as an anarchist, I am saying back at him. I thank you.]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON: COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

it‘s a point of debate. Continue hon Mthimunye.

 

 

 

Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Revolutionaries hon Chair are produced in the trenches of the struggle. [Interjection.] We cannot claim easy victory hon Chair. South Africa is progressing and on its way to better the lives of our people, it is a fact. Thank you. [Applause.]

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: Hon Chairperson, I think it does indicate that time of day it is and the tendency for people who are on treatments. They usually at this time are supposed to have taken their treatments lest they behave differently. [Applause.] Chairperson, thank you very much. I want to recognise the inputs by all the hon members here including the Chairperson and I want to wish him well in the mammoth task of chairing this committee.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi):

Sorry, hon Minister. Hon Smit.

 

 

 

Mr C F B SMIT: Hon Chair, I just want to tell the hon Minister that I did bring mine with. So, I am prepared. [Laughter.]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Smit, take your seat. Continue hon Minister.

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: Thank you for confirming that it is time for you to take your treatment. I also want to thank the members of the executive council who participated here who were able to give an indication on exactly what they are doing in the different provinces in particular the MECs from Limpopo and the MEC from the Free State.

I am told that everything in the Free State you will feel free and you are going to be free including making it possible that you travel well on the roads in the Free State. However, I would also want to take this opportunity to congratulate the MEC for the Youth Road Safety Summit that they have held over the weekend and I want to say that we are going to be holding within all the provinces these Youth Road Safety Summits.

 

 

This is the recognition that the youth of South Africa, like the youth of the 1976 have taken note of the fact that nothing can happen in South Africa without them and you know that young people if they start showing their activism, we are going to start seeing results. I would believe that our partnership with young people, does show that we are going to make a difference because in terms of the statistics of road crashes and fatalities it shows that the bulk of the people are young people and it is important that we do help our young people to live and also drive responsibly. That is why we support them in this #To be Safe is Cool.

 

 

We also want to encourage members of this House that there are pieces of legislation that are going to be making rounds in this House, in particular the National Land Transport Act as well as the Administrative Adjudication of Road Traffic Offences, Aarto, which will necessarily would need the role of provinces and we are appealing

to the House to make sure that when that piece of legislation is brought to you expedite its processing, because the Aarto is the instrument we are going to use to make it possible that we can make it possible that those who misbehave on our roads can bear the consequences.

 

You know that having a driving licence is a privilege and if you abuse it in terms of misbehaving on the road, then you must lose it. And that is what we are going to do through the demerit system.

 

 

I also want to indicate to the hon member who was saying that there are portholes as big as the swimming in Kimberley. I know that I am from Kimberley there is a Groot Gat in Kimberley and there can never be any other whole that can actually match that one. I want to say that Long Street is also a route going towards the Big Whole, so you might have been confused by seeing the signs of the Big Whole and you thought you are going to meet the Big Whole somewhere on the road. [Applause.]

 

 

I also want to say hon members, as the department we are giving provinces through the, Provincial Road Maintenance Grant, PRMG, and we did give an indication on how the breakdown is worked out for all the provinces and we do support them in terms of making sure that they do carry out their responsibility towards making sure that they

maintain and build the roads in their communities. Forty Percent of that money is used for porthole patching.

 

 

As members of this House, you also know that there is a Municipal Infrastructure Grant, MIG that supports the work of municipalities to be able to make it possible that they address the challenges of portholes and those other matters.

 

 

With the regard to the hon members in particular from the EFF who said that when the govern khohlwa. [Forget.] If they cannot behave as Members of Parliament, just imagine them being in any municipalities being in control of any government that will be the day we actually see ourselves as cursed in this country because there is going to be definitely anarchy.

 

Already just today, the members of the National Assembly were returned to the House after misbehaving last week. Every week there are EFF members who misbehaves. People of South Africa can never trust you with their power.

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Minister, hon Mokgosi.

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Modulasetilo, ke rata go botsa motl Tona, ka tlhompho gotswa Kapa Bokone go fitlha Kapa Bokone, gore a ka rata go tsaya potso? [Can the hon Minister take a question?]

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Minister, are you ready to take a question?

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: Ga ke tse potso ya ga ope! [I will not take a question from anyone.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): The

hon Minister is not ready to take a question. Continue hon Minister.

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: So, I want to say to hon members, one thing that we should actually acknowledge is that the ANC is still going to govern this country; it is going to govern the many of the provinces and it is going to govern our municipalities because our people can never be fooled. [Applause.]

 

 

Yes many, many years ago when the National Party was in government for more than 50 years, they fooled our people into a period of lull. We are not going to allow that to happen. That is why the EFF will never see any governance they will rather end up be in the positions that they are.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Minister, hon Engelbrecht why are you standing?

 

 

Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Hon Chairperson, thank you, the hon Minister is misleading the House once again.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

hon Engelbrecgcht that is not a point of order.

 

 

 

Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Yes, she is. Now give me a chance, hon Chair!

 

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

that is not a point of order. Hon Engelbrecht, take you seat.

 

 

 

Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Yes, she is. Now give me a chance, hon Chair, can I just finish my statement please!

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

take you seat. Conclude hon Minister.

 

 

Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Can I just finish my statement please!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): No,

 

that is not a point of order. No, hon Engelbrecht, take you seat. Conclude hon Minister.

 

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: Thank you, Chairperson. I just want to say to the hon members, those who called on us to come and share with them information with regard to the programmes ... [Interjections.]

 

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

Minister, hon Mokgosi, why are you standing?

 

 

 

Ms N P MOKGOSI: Hon Chair, on a point of order, obvious. My point of order is: I would like to tell the Minister that numbers do not lie and the EFF would take the municipalities come 3 August.

 

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON COMMITTEES AND OVERSIGHT (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon

 

Mokgosi, that is not a point of order. Conclude hon Minister.

 

 

 

The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT: I want to say once more to all the hon members in particular to hon Mthimunye and the hon members who called on us to come and share information. We are available as the Department of Transport at any given time to come and share what we are doing with regard to road to rail as well as the modernisation programme as well as Operation Phakisa and I want to say to those

who were very sceptical – hon Van Lingen – that phakaisa does mean phakisa.

 

 

On 8 April the President called the people of South Africa to Port Elizabeth to go and show them how we have moved in the last two years since Operation Phakisa and I want to say to you there is a movement of manganese terminal from the port of Port Elizabeth to Ngqura not airport. You cannot move an airport to a port. [Laughter.] I mean just thinking ordinarily, it is impossible.

 

 

We are also finalising the freight logistics strategy and we would be able to come to this House to share this particular information with hon members. However, I want to say hon members, road safety is everybody‘s responsibility. [Interjections.] Let us make it possible that we as hon members when ever we do work in our constituencies, we encourage our people to be conscious of always complying and obeying the rules of the road. But also let us make sure that we teach our children from the young age whilst they can still be able to capture and here what we are saying. We should be able to teach them.

 

 

We are happy that we are working together with the Department of Basic Education, to introduce life skills and in fact it is already happening in our schools, so that we teach our children about road

safety. Let it become a culture and a lifestyle and natured into them because once they grow up, they turn to think differently.

 

 

I want to say that as the department we are working together with the Department of Trade and Industry with regard to the Liquor Policy because we believe as the transport sector, we want zerotolerance to alcohol use on the roads. Once you have taken alcohol, why get behind a steering wheel and drive a vehicle? We also want to make sure that we encourage all our freight driver motorists ... [Time expired.] [Applause.]

 

Debate concluded.

 

 

 

The Council adjourned at 21:13.

 

 

 

 

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS

 

 

ANNOUNCEMENTS

 

 

 

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces

 

 

 

The Speaker and the Chairperson

1. Draft Bills submitted in terms of Joint Rule 159

 

 

(1) Liquor Products Amendment Bill, 2016, submitted by the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries.

 

 

Referred to the Portfolio Committee on Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries and the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources.

 

 

(2) National Forests Amendment Bill, 2016, submitted by the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries.

 

 

Referred to the Portfolio Committee on Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries and the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources.

 

 

National Council of Provinces

 

 

 

The Chairperson

 

 

 

1. Referral to Committees of papers tabled

 

 

The following papers are referred to the Select Committee on Security and Justice for consideration and report:

(a) Proclamation No 36, published in the Government Gazette No 39124, dated 21 August 2015: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(b) Proclamation No 37, published in the Government Gazette No 39124, dated 21 August 2015: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(c) Proclamation No 38, published in the Government Gazette No 39124, dated 21 August 2015: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(d) Proclamation No 41, published in the Government Gazette No 39307, dated 21 October 2015: Notification by President in respect

of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(e) Proclamation No 42, published in the Government Gazette No 39332, dated 28 October 2015: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(f) Proclamation No 43, published in the Government Gazette No 39332, dated 28 October 2015: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(g) Proclamation No 45, published in the Government Gazette No 39492, dated 10 December 2015: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional

Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(h) Proclamation No 7, published in the Government Gazette No 39737, dated 26 February 2016: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(i) Proclamation No 8, published in the Government Gazette No 39737, dated 26 February 2016: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

 

 

(j) Proclamation No 13, published in the Government Gazette No 39863, dated 29 March 2016: Notification by President in respect of entities identified by the United Nations Security Council, made in terms of section 25 of the Protection of Constitutional Democracy Against Terrorist and Related Activities, 2004 (Act No 33 of 2004) and tabled in terms of section 26 of the Act.

TABLINGS

 

 

 

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces

 

 

 

1. The Minister of Trade and Industry

 

 

(a) Report of the Industrial Policy Action Plan (IPAP) for 2016/17 – 2018/19 [RP 110 – 2016].

 

 

(b) Government Notice No 506, published in Government Gazette No 39971, dated 6 May 2016: Codes of Good Practice on Broad-Based Black Economic Empowerment: Marketing, Advertising and Communication Sector Code, in terms of section 9(1) of the Broad-Based Black Economic Empowerment Act, 2003 (Act No 53 of 2003).

 

 

National Council of Provinces

 

 

 

1. The Chairperson

 

 

(a) Response on the Resolution of the House taken on an intervention issued in terms of section 139(1)(b) of the Constitution, 1996 to Umkhanyakude District Municipality, KwaZulu-Natal.

COMMITTEE REPORTS

 

 

 

National Council of Provinces

 

 

 

Please see pages 6-72 of the ATCs.

 

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