Hansard: NCOP: Unrevised Hansard
House: National Council of Provinces
Date of Meeting: 17 Mar 2016
Summary
No summary available.
Minutes
UNREVISED HANSARD
THURSDAY, 17 MARCH 2016
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PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
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The Council met at 14:07.
The Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a
moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS – see col 000.
THE GROSS DISORDERLY CONDUCT BY HON L MATHYS
(Ruling)
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: I received a
report from the Deputy Chairperson of the National Council of
Provinces, NCOP, in respect of the events of 9 March 2016. The
report is in terms of Rule 38(2). According to the report, the
conduct of hon Mathys gave grave disorder in the House. Her conduct
bordered on contempt and bridge of privilege of the freedom of
speech and because of the gravity of hon Mathys‟ conduct, the order
to leave the House was inadequate.
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I am required in terms of Rule 38(1) to announce what action is to
be taken against the member in such circumstances. Rule 38(3)(a)
compels the Chairperson to report the offending member to the
Legislature that appointed him or her, in this case, the Gauteng
Provincial Legislature. In terms of Rule 38(3)(b), the Chairperson
has a discretion to suspend the member concerned. Rule 39 (1)
provides that the suspension of a permanent delegate on the first
occasion during the annual session continues for five working days.
Having considered the report by the Deputy Chairperson, I have
decided not to suspend hon Mathys as authorised by Rule 38(3)(a).
Instead, I intend to refer the matter to the standing committee to
be appointed in terms of section 12(2) of the Powers, Privileges and
Immunities of Parliament and Provincial Legislatures Act, because
according to the report, hon Mathys‟ conduct may border on contempt
on the bridge of privilege of freedom of speech in terms of the
Powers, Privileges and Immunities of Parliament and Provincial
Legislatures Act.
I honourably so announce hon members.
THE REMOVAL OF HON J W W JULIUS FROM THE HOUSE
(Ruling)
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The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: The second
matter I wish to speak to is in respect of the removal of hon Julius
from the House on 15 March 2016. The hon House Chair Nyambi wrote a
report. I have also since received correspondence from hon Van
Lingen, requesting that the matter be considered. Hon members, when
the matters of this nature occur, I am guided by a number of factors
including how we as Presiding Officers have ruled in the past on
similar matters in this House.
Having had regard to such precedence, I hereby announce that the
removal of hon Julius for the remainder of the day‟s sitting was
adequate, given the nature of the offence. I trust that this lays
the matter to rest. However, I want to take the opportunity to
caution members to adhere to the rulings and the orders of the
Presiding Officers. It is of utmost importance to maintain the
dignity of the House and that includes recognising the authority of
the Chair. I implore members to treat the Presiding Officers with
the same courtesy and respect that you, hon members, expect from us.
Thank you.
Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Chairperson, on a point of order, according to the
programme there was no Motion scheduled for today.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Chief Whip, would you please stand
and address this particular Point of Order? I was not advised that
there was not going to be any Motions, and therefore I went ahead
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and called for Motions. The hon member of the DA is saying that
there are not scheduled for today‟s programme.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: Chairperson, if there is a breakdown in
communication that would be unfortunate. That would be most
unfortunate. Our Order Paper says Motions and we also have Notices
of Motions.
However, I‟m not aware if they did get in touch with the Chief
Whips‟ office and there were not assisted. I‟m not aware; otherwise
I would not be rising on a Motion myself. Chair, I assumed that
everybody is aware of the normal routine we follow in this House. I
stand advised on this one. I‟m not aware that some members of this
House are not aware of what the routine is going to be today. I
thank you.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon members, hon Van Lingen I really do
not want to have a lengthy discussion on this matter. If hon members
did not agree where they usually agree whether there will be Motions
or no Motions, then I will scrap the Motions for today. I do not
want to have a discussion on this matter. Hon Van Lingen, are you
insisting. [Applause.]
There will be no Motions for today, except the Motion that stands in
the Order Paper. In other words, hon members, for today I will take
this decision that there will be no Notices of Motions and no
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Motions Without Notice. Hon Chief Whip you may proceed to read the
Motion on the Order Paper in your name.
EXTENSION OF DEADLINE BY WHICH THE AD HOC JOINT COMMITTEE ON
APPOINTMENT OF BOARD MEMBERS HAS TO BE REPORTED
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Chairperson, I move the motion
printed in my name on the Order Paper as follows:
That the Council, subject to the concurrence of the National
Assembly, extends the deadline by which the Ad Hoc Joint
Committee on the Appointment of Board Members to the National
Youth Development Agency has to report on the 8 April 2016.
Question put: That the motion be agreed to.
IN FAVOUR: Eastern Cape, Free State, Gauteng, KwaZulu-Natal,
Limpopo, Mpumalanga, Northern Cape, North West, Western Cape.
Motion accordingly agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the
Constitution.
WORKING TOGETHER TO ENSURE RESILIENCE TO DROUGHT AND ACHIEVING
SUSTAINABLE ACCESS TO WATER
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(Debate on Human Rights Day)
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Hon Chairperson
of the NCOP and hon members of this august House, let me first admit
to the fact that I was not supposed to address this House today. I
was informed 20 minutes ago. I had to oblige and come. However, the
issue in question is a matter that I am dealing with as it falls
partly on my department. The issue we are dealing with is the
scourge of draught that has not only affected South Africa, but the
whole of the Sothern African Region. It is a phenomenon of below
normal rainfalls informed by El Niño that has affected our country
just towards the end of 2015 as we observed the harvest numbers
having gone down than usual.
What has been more affected has been the livestock as there was no
enough grazing as there were no rains. As a department we met with
our provincial members of executive council, MECs, and agreed that
we reprioritise our allocations to provinces so that we can be able
to buy feed for animal stock and we can be able to drill boreholes and that was done. However, besides that what has been happening,
there have been very low rainfalls such that planting was delayed.
But against maybe the projection that rain will only be falling
around March and April, we did have rains in some of the areas in
January. Therefore, our projection of having to import five to
six million tons of maize changed drastically.
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According to the crop estimates, the country will be able to harvest
7,4 million tons of maize, then we will be short of about 4 million
tons. That will be 1,2 million tons of white maize and 3,8 million
tons of yellow maize. We have made arrangements for the point that in the event we were to import maize – infrastructure will be ready
to carry that maize, we have done the work. More than that, we have
been interacting with all the stakeholders like a green South Africa
are faster and all other participants in agriculture. The view being
to make sure that we are always in par in dealing with this scourge.
We have been informed that El Niño phenomenon strike different areas
of the world in between four to five years. We, therefore, are aware
that the next coming years may have more rain as is the case now.
Six provinces since this drought struck us has applied to be
declared as disaster areas. Those were KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo,
Mpumalanga, North West and Northern Cape. The Western Cape declared
a local state of disaster affecting three municipalities being
Central Karoo, Eden and West Coast. Gauteng is still doing its own
assessment while Eastern Cape is conducting assessment of the
impact, but they have declared as also drought in the Joe Gqabi
District. After these declarations were made, the Cabinet at
national level instituted a Ministerial committee consisting of the
Ministries of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs,
Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries, Rural Development and Land
Reform, Water and Sanitation and the Minister of the Department of
Environmental Affairs. The aim was to make sure that these different
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Ministries were able to come together and see what can be done to
make sure that we alleviate the extent to which this drought is
affecting us.
Our concern more was food security. We were concerned that if people
are loosing their livestock at a rate that was happening at the
point around November and December, we would not be able to
guarantee that people will be able to live normal lives, hence we
made a point that our provinces were allocated funding. I would give
a brief of what happened in each province as the reports were
submitted to us.
Free State had 6 164 farmers affected, the number of farmers
assisted were 2 107. Livestock reported dead were 3 168. The number
of boreholes drilled was 26. KwaZulu-Natal had 156 000 farmers
exposed to this drought, 5 263 were assisted, livestock lost was
35 731, two boreholes were completed with 10 drilled. In Limpopo,
14 128 farmers were affected, 1 392 were assisted, livestock lost
was 5 600, with five boreholes completed and 25 being drilled. In
Mpumalanga, 10 670 farmers were affected, 10 670 farmers were
assisted, 27 122 livestock were lost, no boreholes completed. North
West; 19 430 farmers were affected, 12 945 were assisted, number of
livestock lost has not been reported, 23 boreholes were completed
and 33 are being drilled.
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Northern Cape; 1 851 farmers were exposed, 1 119 were assisted, 45
livestock were reported dead. Gauteng; 1 500 farmers were affected,
469 were assisted, 48 livestock were lost and 18 boreholes were
drilled. Eastern Cape; 39 888 farmers were exposed, 6 689 were
assisted, 113 827 livestock were lost and no report for the number
of boreholes drilled. Western Cape; there was no report on the
number of farmers who were exposed, 860 farmers were assisted, no
number of livestock lost nor were there a number of boreholes
drilled. The total number of farmers affected was 246 631, 42 314
farmers were assisted, 186 340 livestock lost, 56 boreholes
completed.
Therefore, this means that our maize output will be low, this
coupled with the issue of other grains like wheat. In this country
every year, by the way, we only consume 50% of the wheat we produce.
The reason is economical, being that when you buy a loaf of bread at
R11 only R2,38 goes to the farmer. Then, there is no incentive for a
farmer to engage into wheat production.
What we have done then again is that having met with the commercial
farmers, we have been able to engage Industrial Development
Corporation, IDC, and Land Bank, both agreed to assist these farmers
to make sure that they can continue with planting in the coming
season. I can report that the IDC has put aside half a billion rand
to assist commercial farmers with soft loans and Nedbank is also
waiting to do the same. The point we think we need to drive is that,
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unless we look at this drought as a disaster and also as an
opportunity for us to prepare for the coming droughts. I am saying
this because as the report of Conference of the Parties, Cop 21 in
France, we have to do a number of things, among which is to deal
with mitigation, adaptation and to change the way we run our farming
practices.
We should no longer use ploughs and reapers, but we should use the
no-till system as it does not disturb the soil, so that in rainy
years you don‟t have soil erosion affecting you. It has shown
further that when you use your fertiliser, it is so concentrated. We
need to reduce the input cost which is facing farmers as none of
these machinery are produced locally. The tractor you buy is from
Massey Ferguson from America. If it is a Case IH, it is from
Germany. Therefore, the priced that farmers are compelled to pay are
very high. It is less attractive to farmers to be engaged. I am
saying this because most of our soil has been degraded due to many
years of overgrazing. As black people we are confined in 13% of land
with their all animals. Training to them to understand that the
number of animals that you put in a veld should be informed by the
capacity of that veld that can be able to feed.
We need to build more infrastructures in the form of feedlots,
create feed banks, and do more research into new cultivars that will
stand the scourge of heat. As a department, we are proud to announce
that, last year our research council came up with a 20% drought
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resistant seed. What has made it not to be able to be planted is
because of the fact that no farmers wanted to expose themselves
without guarantee that that feed will be bought. Again, the cost of
fertilizer is very high, as there are few fertilizer companies in
this country. It is funny that as a country we produce phosphate in
Limpopo. That very phosphate is sold raw to countries like India. It
comes back sold to us at very high prices. If we are to succeed in
future years, we have to change the way we do things, we must change
the animals that we rare, during drought people should be encouraged
to fatten the animals in feedlots and sell them, keep the money and
buy other animals when things change.
What we have been made aware of again is that the amount of water
that we harvest as a country is too little to support us going
forward. Most of black farmers do not have access to irrigation
water. As we have seen that what white farmers do - when they sell
their farms - they retain the water licensing so that they can rent
it out, exposing black farmers and getting in so that they can win.
Therefore, I will not come up with the ideas of Nongqawuse that
would seem attractive to people, but meaning nothing in the future.
Agriculture is a science, it is not something you can wake up
because of anger and come out with fine ideas that will not take us
anywhere. We need to be sober, engage, do research and work with
other departments so that we can come with better answers.
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I was told that it is not Thanda that makes crops grow, but rain. I
believe that the department with other departments I have mentioned
are much better now in terms of knowledge. I think that another El
Niño that may come within five years will not find us in the same
situation we are in because I believe that we have to work with
everybody. For instance, only last week I had a discussion with the
leadership of Agri South Africa, AgriSA. They are agreeing with us
that we need to put up infrastructure and ensure that we harvest
enough feed for winter so that when winter strikes us – because they
will not have enough grass to grow - we can feed our animals.
My view is that there is nothing called an emerging farmer. An
emerging farmer is a stage of farming when you are still learning to
be in farming. It must not be taken like a title of achievement
every farmer must be assisted to be commercial. To do that, we need
to plead with the Western Cape government to make sure that land is
made available for our small scale farmers. It is difficult in this
province for any black person to dream of being in farming. I have
met and listen to them, even the Western Cape member of the
executive council, MEC, admitted to the fact that black people
constitute only 1% in farming in the Western Cape. Hence in my
report, they don‟t show what they used with the money that was
allocated to them.
My believe is that that money was given to commercial farmers to
make them richer to cushion the scourge, not to black people.
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Further, the debate we must engage in is, we need to encourage our
farmers to take up insurance for their grains, so that when drought
comes they don‟t look at government for assistance. There are those
doomsayers who were saying “declare this a national drought”.
[Interjections.] No, listen to me very well, I have shown you
figures that we will be able to harvest 7,4 million tons of maize.
We harvest and we are only being short of 4 million. Those who were
still telling us to do that are not aware of the fact that banks are
watching at us as they put funding to ensure that they invest in
agriculture. You dare call it that disaster - banks will reduce
their exposure to agriculture.
I do not think that the problem that we are facing more of drought
... what is this? It is the policies that the DA and others are
taking in the provinces they are running. Look, when I was young and
trained, I was told that I must never listen to those who choose to
make noise other than debate [Applause.] I must behave like a
postman who delivers post in a village with dogs following him and
barking, he never stops to bark at them because he knows what his
duty is. I won‟t come here and bark at people. [Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Minister,
please take your seat just a little bit. Hon Faber, are you on a
point of order?
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Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, I would like to know if the hon Minister
that knows so much about drought would take a question.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Minister,
are you willing to take a question?
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Not now, but I
have an office, if he wants to talk to me I would be able to talk to
him, maybe we will have more time in my office than we have here.
Therefore, the point I am driving is that, if we are to succeed ...
[Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Minister,
I am told that there is another point of order of hon Mpambo.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Hon Chair, would the Minister be kind
enough to treat me as a Gupta and ask a question.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Mpambo,
that is not a point of order, please take your seat. Hon Minister,
please continue.
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: I will still
repeat, we are faced with a crisis. There are those who believe that
this is a play field to make jokes and the rest because they don‟t
care about our people. They see our people as a fodder for votes.
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Those people who are hungry and who do not have food ...
[Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Masemola,
please take your seat.
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: ... tomorrow
they are not an important feature to them. They only know them
because they are black. They are black because they vote for them,
but when they face food insecurity – I have said in the Western
Cape, you can go with me you will not see a small holder farmer.
There is no plan for them. There is no land for them. There is no
care for them. Go to Gauteng, Limpopo and Free State there will be a
portion planned for upcoming farmers, not in the Western Cape.
I am telling you, it is the fact and truth, they don‟t exist to you.
They will only exist when votes are coming, but they read a book by
Chinua Achebe, Things Fall Apart. Those who begin converts have an
obligation to deny their roots of background, to cast away their
customs, and to become true man and women so that they can be seen
as the best. It is what I see in the DA ... [Interjections.] ... of
my colour has defend what is not defendable [Interjections.]
[Applause.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Minister.
Hon Julius, you are on your feet, is it a point of order?
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Mr J W W JULIUS: Just to ask maybe the Minister rescinded I‟m dying
for a question, Chairperson.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: I don‟t want
you to die for a question. Minister, will you take a question?
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Chairperson, I
repeat, I will not take a question because my time is really
challenging me. Let me say Julius, I was with you yesterday, you had
a chance with me. There was more time yesterday.
Hy het nie ‟n vraag gevra nie. [He did not ask a question.]
You did not have a question yesterday and you have it today. As I am
saying that as the ANC government we are committed, we have a plan
to ensure that our people get food security so that our people will
be able to go through this. [Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Order! Order!
Hon Minister, there is another point of order.
Mr M CHETTY: Hon Chairperson, I just want to find out ...
[Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Order! Order!
I cannot hear the speaker on the floor. You are on, sir.
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Mr M CHETTY: Madam Chair, I just wanted to find out whether the hon
Minister wanted to tell us that it is that the ANC government or the
Gupta government he is talking on behalf of?
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Is that a
point of order?
Mr M CHETTY: Yes, I just want to get clarity on that - a point of
clarity, Madam Chair.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: No, there is
no point of clarity, please take your seat. Minister, please
continue.
UMPHATHISWA WEZOLIMO, AMAHLATHI NEZOKULOBA: Enkosi, ndiyabulela
Sihlalo, ndifuna ukuyibeka icace into yokuba abantu abangayaziyo
into abayizele kule Ndlu baza kuba nezimbo eziqhwalelayo kwaye
buthandabuzeke ukuzika kweengqondo zabo. Kaloku bona bazele nje
ukudlala kube kufiwa ngabantu apha phandle. Iyindlala nje ebantwini,
kubo yindyebo ecinga ukuba i-ANC iza kugqwaliseka. Ayisokuze
igqwaliseke ngenxa yezimbo neentetho zenu. Sithi,namhlanje, sicela
bonke aboMzantsi Afrika ... (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph
follows.)
[The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Thank you hon
Chairperson, I would like to make it clear that people who do not
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know the reason why they are in this House, will make funny styles
and you will doubt their thinking. They are full of jokes while
people are dying outside.
It is poverty to people out there while
it is wealth to them, thinking that ANC will have a bad repetition.
It will never have bad repetition because of your styles and
utterances. Today we say, we ask all South Africans ...]
... to join us in finding an agenda to deal with drought. Drought
has been with us, and even again tomorrow it will be with us. The
issue of reading newspapers and come out with all these imaginary
issues that you are coming up with, it is not what your people voted
you for. They voted you to come up with answers in their problems. I
repeat ...
... iziqhwala zininzi azisokuze zolulwe ndim, maziye esibhedlele.
Enkosi. [Kwahlekwa.] [Kwaqhwatywa.] [... there are many people who
are disabled I‟m not a physiotherapist, they must go to hospital.
Thank you. [Laughter.] [Applause.]]
Mnr C HATTINGH: Voorsitter, ek moet sê ek kan nie help – bly stil!
Ek kan nie help om te wonder toe hierdie agb Minister hier gepraat
het of hy hier met die mandaat van die Guptas praat nie. Watter een
van die Guptas het hom vandag voorgeskryf om hier te kom sê wat hy
gesê het? [Tussenwerpsels.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph
follows.)
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[Mr C HATTINGH: Chairperson, I have to say I cannot help – be quiet!
I cannot help but wonder whether this hon Minister was mandated by
the Guptas to speak. Which of the Guptas told him to come and say
what he has said here today? [Interjections.]]
The Bill of Rights is described as the cornerstone of our democracy
found in our progressive Constitution. However, it puts an
obligation on the state to respect, protect, promote and to fulfil
the rights entrenched in the Constitution.
Section 27 of the Bill of Rights is explicit ... [Interjection.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Agb lid
Hattingh, daar is ‟n hand op vir ‟n punt van orde. [Hon member
Hattingh, a hand has been raised for a point of order.]
Mr J P PARKIES: Chairperson, on a point of order: The hon member
forgot to tell us his name.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Parkies
that is not a point of order. Hon Hattingh, please continue.
Mr C HATTINGH: ... what was he saying?
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Please
continue.
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Mr C HATTINGH: It‟s just the mumbling. I understand. Section 27 of
the Bill of Rights says, and I quote: “everyone has the right to,
inter alia, sufficient water” whether there is El Niño or not. This
was regarded to be so important that the authors of our Constitution
put an annual constitutional obligation on the organs of state to
provide the South African Human Rights Commission, with relevant
information on the measures that they have taken towards the
realisation of these rights in the Constitution.
Unfortunately, the reality of South Africa‟s water crisis and the
impact on our people is not a good story to tell. This is why the
Minister of Water and Sanitation had to be forced by the DA, who
used the Promotion of Access to Information Act, PAIA, to provide
South Africa with a damning 2014 Blue and Green-Drop Reports, which
she concealed not only from Parliament, but from everyone even from
the public.
Why would a carrying Minister in her capacity as the custodian of
our water resources in a carrying government, as it refers to
itself, conceal vital information about the quality of water to its
people. Let me offer the only credible answer to that. And I think
this may be regarded even as criminal neglect. It is the increasing
inability of the ANC government to provide sufficient volumes of
clean drinkable water to our people.
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With the instruments of local delivery municipalities collapsing
with it, its capacity to manage and maintain water infrastructure,
specifically water purification plants and wastewater treatment
plants; communities are more and more exposed and a basic
constitutional right, the access to clean water is under serious
threat.
The cold facts are that on oversight visit by the DA shadow
Minister, hon Leon Basson, and I think he totally overshadows the
ANC Minister who is absent. It was revealed that only 16% of South
Africa‟s 824 sewerage purification works are 100% operational, only
16%. This causes our water resources, dams, streams, rivers and even
ground water to be contaminated with raw sewerage.
Hon Basson found the following: Umgeni Water in KwaZulu-Natal,
started with water sharing affecting 6,1 million people or
1,68 million households. Sewerage is being pumped into the veld next
to the Boikhutso Township by the non-functioning Lichtenburg
wastewater treatment works, in the North West. Children play there
and people walk and pass through it every day.
In Cradock in the Eastern Cape, untreated sewage is flowing directly
into the Great Fish River.
In Humansdorp also in the Eastern Cape, the Wastewater Treatment
Plant, WWTP, is non-functional with raw sewage still containing
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solids running through an informal settlement into a neighbouring
farmer‟s dam.
At Modimolle in Limpopo, toxic waste goes through the wastewater
treatment plant, system straight into the river. This includes
condoms, toilet paper sanitary towels etc.
At Rooiwal in Pretoria, millions of litres of untreated sewage are
spilling into the Apies River due to the non-functioning of the
sludge plant. Sewage sludge is pumped straight onto an adjacent
farmland that drains into a large wetland.
Chairperson, it‟s happening all over South Africa everyday, every
hour even as we sit here. Four out of every ten South African
children do not have access to piped water in their houses. We
simple cannot afford for any water to go to waste. [Interjections.]
Hon Chair, the discipline of the members is actually incredible.
The highest proportion of consumer units that benefited from free
basic water at 75,7% according to the department„s own report was
showing to be in the DA governed Western Cape. I think that should
have been applauded.
In contrast to this, the state of wastewater treatment plant in the
ANC run provinces was found to be dire, posing major health and
safety risks, particularly to the poor. The stark reality appears to
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be the only reason why Minister Nomvula Mokonyane concealed the very
revealing Blue and Green Drop Progress Reports and people are ...
[Interjections.]
An HON MEMBER: Nomvula.
Mnr C HATTINGH: ... whatever you want to call her. The hon Nomvula
for you actually! The only solution to South Africa‟s growing water
crisis is to export the Western Cape‟s sound and clean governance
practices, including planning, management and commitment to
maintenance to the other struggling and failing provinces. The DA is
resolute in that commitment.
Like they say everything is there on offer. “You can lead a horse to
water, but you can‟t make it drink”. I thank you, Chair.
Ms L C DLAMINI: Hon Chair, my greetings to the hon Minister, MECs
from different provinces, special delegates and hon members and my
greetings go to the ladies up there. Hon Hattingh has forced me to
change my introduction. I had a very mild introduction to my speech
because we are talking about a very important item here – the human
rights. However, hon Chair, I have been forced to change my
introduction because I‟ve learned that there‟s a lot to do regarding
education. I have to assist the hon member so that he knows the
reasons that caused what he is talking about now. Hon Chair, It
would be politically immature, and historically bankrupt and
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information dwarfism to expect that in just 22 years the ANC would
have done better that this, given the background of human rights
that was violated by the apartheid government in South Africa.
If you take, for example the documents are asserting human rights,
such as Magna Carta of 1215, that‟s how long human rights have been
done in other countries, the English bill of rights of 1689, and the
US constitution and bill of rights of 1781, the French declaration
of the rights of man and citizens of 1789 are the written precursors
to many of today‟s human rights documents, hon Hattingh. Yet, many
of these documents when originally translated to policy, excluded
women, people of colour, that is us, black people, and certain
members of social, religious, economic and political groups. That is
where the origins of isolation of the majority of the country
started in South Africa, hon Hattingh. If you have ears ...
... utongiva kutsi ngitsini kuloku lengikushoko. [... you will
understand what I am saying.]
I do want to say, Chair, that it takes a person who is right
upstairs to compare what the ANC-led government in just 22 years has
done. As compared to countries ...
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP Hon Dlamini, please take your seat. Hon
Faber. Are you ... Please take your seat, ma‟am. Are you on a point
of order, sir?
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Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, just on a point of clarity a person that
is right upstairs [Laughter.] ... I would like to know what the hon
member is referring to.
I do not know such people in the ANC if she
can just perhaps, clarify that to me.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Faber, you also know that there is
no point of clarity and that is not a point of order. Please
continue, hon Dlamini.
Ms L C DLAMINI:
Hon Chair, to compare the ANC in just 22 years with
countries that had the bill of rights for 804 years if you take the
Magna Carta of 1215 for example. Three hundred and twenty seven
years if you take the English bill of rights of which most of you
associate with. To compare that with 22 years, it means that
something is not right upstairs.
Hon Chair and the House, the belief that everyone by virtue of her
or his humanity is entitled to certain human rights is fairly new.
In South Africa, for example, it started with the ANC-led government
in 1994. Your apartheid government violated all human rights of the
majority of this country. We should be grateful ...
Mr W F FABER: Hon Chair, with due respect, the hon member is talking
about “your apartheid government” now I don‟t see hon De Beer here
and I would like to know whom is she referring to.
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The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, sir. Hon Dlamini, proceed.
The reference to “your” I suspect includes all of us in the House
including the hon member herself because there was no particular
name assigned to the word “your”. Proceed.
Ms L C DLAMINI: Hon Chair, as South Africans, we should be grateful
that we got the government that puts the interest of the people
first and the country first. It could have been something else, if
it was another party that took over. I can imagine - underline I can
imagine - if it was the DA that took over, it could have been
something else. Never mind the name DA because anyway, they have
been changing their name. Their history started back in 1959. They
must go and read their history. They were part of the apartheid
government and did nothing until 1994 when the ANC took over.
Chairperson, I would personally like to focus on water trying to
answer some of the issues that were raised by hon Hattingh. Hon
Chair, the apartheid government violated all human rights of the
majority of our people, especially people of colour, especially when
it comes to service delivery.
After taking political power in 1994, our government, the ANC-led
democratically elected government ... [Laughter.] ... inherited
overwhelming municipal service backlogs that were found largely in
rural, black, poor, regions of South Africa. Under the apartheid
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regime service delivery for the villages or the so-called townships
and rural poor was nonexistent. If it existed the services ...
Ms T J MOKWELE: Mmusakgotla, ke ne ke botsa gore a mme o
ikemiseditse go ka tsaya potso. [Speaker, is the hon member prepared
to take a question.]
Nk L C DLAMINI: Ebhasini Sihlalo. [In a bus Hon Chairperson.]
Hon Chair, for example in 1997, the Department of Public Works
reported that only 27% of African household had running clean-tap
water inside their residences and only 34% had access to flushing
toilets. Of the 15 million people without access to safe water
supply in 1994, 12 million were located in rural areas – meaning
that the 3 million people were from the urban areas. Now, hon
Hattingh cannot complain about the ANC. This is where the problems
are coming from. He was there as a Democratic Party, DP, that time.
The condition, according to the 1996 Census conducted by the
Statistics SA ...
Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Madam Chair, just a point of clarity, I just want
to confirm: Is this what the ANC achieved after 22 years?
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Engelbrecht, we don‟t have points
of clarity.
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Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Okay.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you very much, ma‟am.
[Interjections.] Hon Dlamini. Order, members!
Ms L C DLAMINI: Solo awukafundzi namanje kepha kudzala wefika lapha.
[Luhleko.] [You still have not learned anything yet you have been
here for a long time.]
The service delivery challenge faced by the new democratically
elected government was to reduce the apartheid water and ageing
water infrastructure backlogs whilst concurrently raising the level
of service delivery. The newly-elected South African government, in
1994, undertook various measures to rectify these backlogs by
ensuring that there are equitable services of our people in the
country. Hon Chair, the backlog in water and ageing water
infrastructure was and still uneven in the country. [Interjections.]
In that, these backlogs are more severe in the poor and black
communities, especially in our coloured areas in the Western Cape.
Hon Chair, I don‟t want to agree more with the Minister. We were at
the Eden District Municipality, Minister; small farmers from Western
Cape are not catered for. What is even worse, the places that they
are renting or leasing to do farming - they are exploited or
oppressed by the government of the Western Cape.
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Ngakho-ke angeke bakhulume bathi bayawazi amalungelo abantu. [Then
they cannot say that they know human rights.]
Even though 89% of our people after the ANC has taken over in 1994,
do receive clean water. But we still have the challenges of water
provision in our country. The remaining percentage is shared by all
provinces including Western Cape.
In conclusion, hon Chair, although there has been tremendous
improvement on the provision of water services since 1994, there is
still a room for improvement in this regard. But, the ANC government
acknowledges the water services successes and the challenges. As a
result, the ANC government has outlined solutions to the identified
challenges, for instance the establishment of the interministerial
task team to address water service delivery challenges. The
inclusion of sanitation to the Department of Water is a clear
indication that there is a need to fast-track service delivery on
sanitation and water, such as eradication of bucket system –
“amapotapota” in the Western Cape. Let us work together to save
every drop to ensure a better tomorrow for all. Thank you very much,
hon Chair. [Applause.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Is that a point of order, hon Faber?
Mr W F FABER: Yes, Chairperson.
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The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Her time has expired.
Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, I need to say this, no member may
deliberately make the statement to the Council, which the member
knows is false and the last statement that the member made just
before she walked away was false.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: What was the statement, hon Faber.
Mr W F FABER: The statement on the “amapotapota” of the Western
Cape. [Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order, members! Order, members! I will
look into that matter – is the contention that there is no such a
thing as “amapotapota” or that. I will look into the matter and come
back.
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Motlotlegi Modulasetilo, ke rata go dumedisa
Aforikaborwa ka bophara. [Hon Chairperson, I would like to send my
greetings to all in South Africa.]
On 21 March 2016 the country will be commemorating 55 years since
the tragic killing of 69 black people in Sharpeville by vicious
white regime who viewed black people as subhuman species. On that
tragic day, more than 180 people were also injured. Their cardinal
sin was to respond in large numbers to the call by the President
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of the PAC of Azania, Robert Mangaliso Sobukwe, for all black
people to present themselves for arrest in protest against being
forced by law to carry dompasses in the country of their own birth.
This was a culmination of a century‟s long process of
dehumanisation, wherein white people granted themselves the right
to kill and grant life, the right to call us animals and the right
to dispossess us of our wealth, our land and our humanity. The
colonisation of our country and the plunder of its resources by
the white crusaders did not only set to brutalise and exploit
African people economically, but central to their colonising ...
[Interjections.] It‟s not my mother tongue, I don‟t care. ...
strategy was the drive to reshape African reality such that
Africans would become willing slaves and servants.
By brutally annexing land from Africans, the whites were
purposefully annexing African cultural expression and meaning. They
robbed us of our rights to be human. Without land as both a
symbolic meaning of African being, and land as an expression of
value and a means through which Africans could affirm their
humanity and culture.
The whites appropriated not just African land, but also African
being. By stripping an Africans of their land and their culture,
the murderous and racist whites reduced the African to a subhuman,
a man with no culture, a man whose life has no meaning and a man
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therefore, who could be dispensed at will by those with culture.
[Interjections.]
Ms L C DLAMINI: Chairperson, I‟m standing on a point of order. It‟s
not all whites who are racists.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, Mam. Point in debate. Please
continue!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: This is what Mr Sobukhwe understood very well. His
call was not only for dompasses to fall, but for the reclamation for
all that was violently appropriated by whites. Our struggle for
liberation was for the reclamation of our African personality in
its entirety, for the destruction of all the sick and inhumane
oppressive tendencies that brought by the settler communities. Only
that would guarantee us our human rights.
Now, 22 years after the so-called freedom, the only human rights
the country enjoys are those of the corrupt clique which surrounds
Zuma and his corrupt cartel. The ANC is only concerned with the
freedom of a foreign family, the Gupta‟s, to loot our resources,
to abuse the finest men and women that our struggle for freedom
ever produced. [Interjections.]
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: The President should be addressed as hon
Zuma.
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The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, he is hon Zuma.
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Mr Zuma, hon Zuma of the ANC.
By protecting that dishonorable President that they have, have
their hon His Excellency, Zuma, the ANC is indirectly promoting
the cancer spread by the Gupta‟s to every aspect of South African
life. We are no longer fighting against pass laws now, but against
a very vicious cartel of corruption, with Zuma at the helm,
assisted by his drum majorettes here in Parliament and at Luthuli
House.
Twenty two years after freedom, blacks still have no land, they
don‟t have jobs, they live in filthy shacks competing with rats
for space. Can you imagine?
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi, Mr Zuma is the President
of the Republic of South Africa. We therefore refer to him as the
hon President
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Hon Zuma of the ANC!
Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon Mokgosi refers to Members of Parliament as
drum majorettes. I am not sure if that is parliamentary.
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The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: I will look into ... [Interjections.]
Hon Mokwele, I am presiding. Hon Mthimunye and hon members, I will
look at the list of those words which are considered unparliamentary
and then come back to the House about this matter. As far as I can
remember, it is not on that list, but I undertake to look and come
and report to the House.
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Twenty two years after freedom, black women are
still forced to wash the underwear‟s of cold-hearted white women
as maids, getting paid peanuts in return; twenty two years after
freedom, black mineworkers are killed at the instruction of one
Cyril Ramaphosa, who now wants to be the President, while his
hands are dripping with the blood of ours brothers killed in
Marikana; twenty two years after freedom, black people still have
no human rights.
A sick black person who goes to Cecilia Makiwane hospital ...
[Interjections.]
Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: Hon Chair, hon Mokgosi is making incriminating
allegations against a sitting Deputy President of the country. I‟m
not sure if that can be acceptable in this House.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon members, can i be allowed to look
at exactly what hon Mokgosi has said. Hon Mokgosi, please reflect on
the topic of today. You do have your rights covered for freedom of
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speech covered in the House, it is not unlimited. But ensure that
you do not put aspersions or impugn on the dignity of Members of
Parliament unless you can back it up. For now I would really beg you
to concentrate on the topic of today. Continue, Mam!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: A sick black person ... [Interjections.]
Ms G M MANOPOLE: Hon Chair, I‟m rising on a point of order Rule
46(a).
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Rule 46(a)? What about it?
Ms G M MANOPOLE: Hon Mokgosi referred to hon Deputy President, Cyril
Ramaphosa, by his name and she keeps on referring to both the
President and the Deputy President with their names.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Okay. Hon Mokgosi, please continue!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: A sick black person who goes to Cecilia Makiwane
Hospital goes there to die, because black people do not have
access to good quality healthcare. Twenty two years after freedom,
black students work as gardeners in the homes of white people,
because the ANC has refused to provide them with free quality
education. Black people have no human rights in this country, the
only right that matters are those of Gupta and the corrupt clique
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that surrounds Zuma and his family. The cosmetic notion of a
rainbow nation is a biggest lie ever... [Interjections.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon Mokgosi! Hon Mokgosi, behave!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Hon Zuma of the ANC!
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order! Order, members! Hon Mokgosi!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Hon Chair!
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: The ANC does not have hon members;
Parliament has hon members. He is called honourable because he
powered by the Rules of Parliament, that makes him honourable. So,
he is hon Zuma within the compound of this Parliament. Please do
that!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: Noted, Chairperson.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Proceed!
Ms N P MOKGOSI: The cosmetic notion of a rainbow nation is a
biggest lie ever sold to us. A truly democratic, non-racial and
non-sexist South Africa depends on our ability to reshape our
existence, and not in continuing with the path created for us by
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apartheid and colonialism. Only the EFF can guarantee real human
rights.
Le fa o ka tswelela o ntse o e tima metsi o tla e bona e nwele, o
ntse o sa itse gore a tswa kae. Ngwana yo o tlhogotona o sira
rragwe. Ke feditse! [Legofi.] (Translation of Setswana paragraph
follows.)
[Even if you not give it water it will drink nonetheless, without a
clue of where it is coming from. A child with a big head obscure his
father‟s view.] I am done! [Applause.]
Cllr M NTINGANE: Hon Chairperson and Deputy Chairperson of the
NCOP, the Minister, MPs and MPLs, Chief Whip, distinguished guests,
ladies and gentlemen, the recently published SA Local Government
Association, Salga and the Water Research Commission perception
study indicated that only 57% of urban municipalities are able to
deal with drought. The findings of the study provide us with an
opportunity to reflect and test our local government plans and
strategies for effectively dealing with drought and its impact on
the dignity and rights of our people.
On human rights, dignity and drought, over the last fifteen years,
local government has made a huge contribution to ensuring that the
human rights and dignity of our people are advanced. Access to safe,
sufficient, and reliable water for daily human need is the human
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right of each and every citizen and is enshrined in our
Constitution. The drought situation in some provinces has become
gravely serious as the Minister indicated. Local government is
contributing to advancing the gains we have made in the right of
access to water and food security. It is indeed of great concern
that we are now talking of water shedding, shortly after we escaped
the pervasive clutches of load shedding in terms of electricity.
Today we face a situation of growing urgency with widespread lack of
access to water; food security threatened and price hikes for basic
food that will inevitably impact on the most vulnerable and further
deepen our socio-economic challenges.
On draught and local government, drought is a natural hazard. It
occurs now and again and varies in magnitude and frequency. The last
severe drought was in 1990-91 which mainly affected the agricultural
sector. However, the current drought presents us with two major
perspectives. Firstly, a threat and risk in our inability to supply
water services. The severity of the threat may vary from province to
province, municipality to municipality and system to system but in
the main it affects livestock farmers, the agricultural sector and
vulnerable communities. Secondly, it tests the response and
robustness of our disaster management systems and processes to
adequately deal with drought.
At municipal level we are affected by two types of droughts: One,
hydrological drought this is described as surface and subsurface
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waters that are below normal and includes aquifers for irrigation of
crops, wells for consumption of water, and groundwater table,
streams, rivers, and reservoirs; secondly, sociological drought such
as water shortages that directly affect communities and has the
potential of creating panic migration.
On water restrictions we have experienced climatic changeability
which has severe impact on water use. The reality is that current
water use patterns at a municipal level must change if we are to
navigate through this challenge. The bulk of our potable water is
used for gardening, flushing, bathing, showering and cooking. We
need a rethink if we are to sustainably use limited allocations.
Excessive water demands is a potential candidate for water
restrictions, particularly in drought stricken provinces such as
those that the Minister indicated earlier.
On our readiness to respond and immediate priorities, drought
management plans and the water reconciliation strategies at
municipal level are evidently becoming critical. Core to these plans
is defining and illustrating the municipality‟s institutional
management and capability to respond to drought. In this regard
constant modelling in predicting drought and climate change is key.
We also need the urgent support of our researchers to help us
enhance our understanding of drought and its impact including
defining the risks and mitigating factors.
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Partnership with communities is of vital importance. We must strive
to intensify our water loss programme and explore alternative
sources of water within the affected areas. Critically, we must
ensure constant communication with communities on water conservation
and demand. A paradigm shift from drought crisis management to risk
management, prevention and reduction of the impacts of drought can
be a positive outcome of this crisis. We must improve our
preparedness and work together to come up with drought policies and
programmes that are proactive and minimise the social, economic and
environmental impact of drought. Effective emergency response
programmes to reduce the very serious impacts of drought that are
impacting on communities and municipalities need to be urgently
devised.
On long-term solutions for co-operation and collaboration, we say
that the Constitution in sections 26(2) and 27(2) states that:
The state must take reasonable legislative and other measures,
within its available resources, to achieve the progressive
realisation of each of human rights.
We urgently need a new positive strategy to bring together those
that are working in the water and environment sectors, and those
addressing human rights to build co-operation, to prevent negative
impacts on the poorest and to improve our food security and access
to water. Bringing together the strengths of our human rights, water
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and environmental institutions will help us to better protect people
whose lives and livelihoods are threatened by the drought.
We need to undertake measures to reduce social vulnerability to
drought lest its impact on human rights worsens. We call on the
water sector including the Department of Water and Sanitation, the
Water Research Commission, the Council of Scientific and Industrial
Research, CSIR, water boards, research institutions and all relevant
water related entities to work together to ensure a shift from
drought crisis management to risk management, prevention and
reduction of the impacts of drought.
Let us improve our preparedness and work together to devise
appropriate drought policies and programmes that are proactive and
minimise the social, economic and environmental impact of drought.
We recently witnessed worst case scenarios where our people are
without drinking water and are vulnerable to water borne diseases,
where livestock are dying and crops being lost. While we are all
doing good work, we also need to put more effective emergency
response programmes in place and ensure widespread knowledge and
publicity about them.
In conclusion, Chairperson of the NCOP, let us ensure joint action
to guarantee the right to life, the right to an adequate standard of
living, and the right to food and water. We cannot allow the drought
to erode the gains we have made in restoring the dignity of our
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people. We therefore call on the Department of Water and Sanitation
to support municipalities as we seek to deal with this challenge so
that municipalities can actively participate in monitoring efforts
and risk management, and ensure that our citizens continue to have
access to clean and reliable water services. Our people‟s human
dignity depend on us, we cannot let them down. I thank you.
[Applause.]
Mr M KHAWULA: Hon Chairperson and hon Minister, as the world moves
towards the Easter weekend celebrated by Christians worldwide, I am
reminded of an incident where Jesus tells Peter that “You will deny
knowing me three times before the cock crows.” When the cock
suddenly crows on the day when Peter had already denied knowing
Jesus three times, he was deeply saddened and embarrassed. One day
someone will deny having knowledge of serving with you in this
Parliament, and that will be embarrassing.
Human rights in South Africa are a constitutional obligation
embedded in the Constitution of the country. These include: The
right to water, health care, food and social security; the right to
adequate housing, education, to human dignity, to life, and the
right to access to information and many other rights. The
Constitution says: “Everyone has the right to have access to
sufficient food and water.” It further states that:
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The state must take reasonable legislative and other measures,
within its available resources, to achieve the progressive
realisation of each of these rights.
In other words, besides what nature is doing to South Africa in the
form of drought, but water is a right. Therefore, for as long as
there is a river that has got a drop of water, for as long as there
is a dam or a reservoir, that has a drop of water in the country,
this right must be fulfilled for all citizens of South Africa, urban
and rural, of course within reasonable means. The question here is
what is within reasonable means alongside available resources?
Is it reasonable, for example, for the district municipality of
uMkhanyakude to purchase water pipes in millions of rands and store
them for more than four years without making means to give water to
the people of Jozini, Hlabisa, Mtubatuba and Umhlabuyalinagana? Is
it reasonable for the water boards to be allocated money, and for
them not to spend, in other words underspend, when people are
expecting to be supplied with clean water in Engcobo, in Nongoma, in
Malamulele, in Bushbuckridge and other destitute villages of our
country? It is the right thing to do for the people of Marikana to
be massacred, without any convincing recourse as a consequence by
government to wrongdoers? These are some of the questions which make
a mockery of our human rights course as a developing democracy.
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In other words, when I am unemployed and I do not have the means to
provide myself with shelter the Constitution permits one to approach
government and put pressure for the fulfilment of this right. If the
right is not fulfilled, one can approach the courts, the Public
Protector and any other relevant institutions, to ask them to help
him or her for government to fulfil the right to shelter. Negative
effects like corruption, wasteful and fruitless expenditure, rob the
citizens of our country the resources which could have been used to
make social grants better, to improve housing, health care, water
delivery and education.
When government provides communities with water, education health
care, pensions, child support grant, house, food, etc; it is not a
gift from government. It is not a gift from a political party. But,
it is fulfilment of a constitutional obligation. It is a right.
Here we are not just talking about food parcels that government use
as a bribe towards and during election time, we are talking
sustainability. When nature brings drought to our country, livestock
die and crops suffer. Food prices go up as a result. This result in
scarcity of food and in South Africa, food is a right. Therefore,
government must find ways and means of circumventing the situation
of terrible hunger in households, reasonably within available
resources. I thank you.
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Mr S A DUMA: Hon Chairperson, indeed and honour and privilege to
partake in this fundamental debate. We feel in this august House
this debate is a little bit polarised because we do not feel like to
be taking the essence of what it means on the issue of human rights.
It would be dull and monotonous world if we would all think alike,
imagine waking up in bed with your partner doing the same thing
everyday. So the issue of contradictions on the issue of minds it is
acceptable, those contradictions from time to time must be
acceptable as well in the normal day to day issues. Hon Minister,
your speech was audible to a progressive mind and very antagonistic
towards apartheid remnants ears and minds because they are still
there, and their concentration is the world which must not be
changed but be preserved for those significant minority which must
always have that hegemony and all those things. Our aim is to change
and transform the entirety of the society.
It will take three things to believe the myth that South Africa has
not transform or nothing has changed since 1994. Selective amnesia,
you believe that you know something but it does not exist in your
brain set then you just shift that thing. Naivety, you choose to be
naive and recognise nothing else what is yours. Short term memory,
to think 342 years of damage – as hon Dlamini has mentioned - can
just be resolved in 22 years it is impossible, in fact, it will be
abnormal human experience, there is something that has taken so much
time will just be resolved, even scientific, there is no scientific
everything that would prove that. Go everywhere in the world changes
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would take some time. The role played by our government in
particular on emerging farmers has not gone unnoticed as most of
them wouldn‟t have survived the day. Feed for livestock in
particular Zululand, uMkhanyakude and uMzinyathi districts was not
adequate since these were the most effected areas.
You have already mentioned that you still have to address all these
imbalances because we are dealing with those who were in the past
were not participating in the issue of economic mainstream. Please
from time to time if it means that you must be bold enough to
address the issue of financial mainstream, just do that. This House
is designed for that, you are voted by our people to do all those
issues. Thank you so much hon Minister for highlighting the issue of
water licences because one of our strongest points – that is where
we have problems, we have those people who defined as „haves‟ when
they are no longer in the system they will still confine the system
of our government which will affect the emerging farmers. At some
point in time, let us debate this issue in detail so that we nicely
analyse and address it same time.
There is issue of reverse osmosis or desalination process which must
be tested in most areas in particular along the coastal streams. Let
us invest, and be bold enough to invest money, and do a lot of these
priorities in these areas and pilot studies so that we can also try
this process as we are facing drought. The issue of cloud harvesting
currently practiced in Northern Cape seem to be useful and
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available. Researchers have proven that this can also be utilised.
The historical imperatives of our country proved among the men that
not so long ago South Africa was a country of two nations, black and
white, we must also stipulate that within this august House, so that
when we debate we address all the issues and the imbalances. White
had already access to a developed economic, physical, educational,
communication and other infrastructures. The blacks on the other
verge which is the larger nation was poor and lived in abject
terrible conditions and women in particular suffered triple
challenges.
When we deal with the issue of human rights we have to trace that as
early as 1955, ANC converged. The trust and principle was to ensure
that – at some point and time – the visionary milestone of this
country must embrace everyone who participates in terms of
population. At that time, it was a million who converged in Kliptown
who had to let us address all these issues. It is realising that
amongst those today who claim to be so heroic, they did not
participate. You won‟t find any member on the issue of DA or EFF who
will then say that, let us get all these privileges, we don‟t want
this education and we don‟t want to get this wages. They were
enjoying all those privileges.
Today they are so heroic and saying aluta, it is not correct. We
have to mention that lies is lies, whenever it is told on Monday,
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Tuesday and Wednesday it must remain the same and it is constant, it
will never change. Lies are lies.
The report produced by Goldman Sachs through Colin Coleman shows the
journey as taken by new dispensation after 1994, and furnish
tangible statistics detail analysis two decades synopsis. Brief
about Coleman head of Investment Banking Division for Sub Saharan
Africa, he has served for Consultative Business Movement prior 1994.
We highlight these things because they only recognise something
produced by them. Coleman happens to be coming from their side as
well.
Households with electricity increased from 77% in 2002 to 85% in
2012; 91% of households have access to piped or tap water in the
dwelling off site or on-site versus 56% in 2002; 94% of households
have access to either landlines or cellular phones in 2012; ANC
government has just provided that. 41% of households had at least
one member who used the internet either at home, work, place of
study, or internet cafes; and between 2002 and 2012, the percentage
of individuals who experienced hunger decreased from 24% to 11%. We
are not saying that this is fundamental such that we will not do
anything, we are saying that we have done our introspection as ANC
and its government that a lot still have to happen but we must also
be mindful that we are dealing with a back crop of 15 million
population in South Africa if you go in the past, services were only
reserved for those significant minority. Not in our days, we must be
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mindful that we accommodate everyone. It is our task, we are morally
obligated to those at the same time.
The Statistics SA General Household Survey provides a picture of
broad improvements for poor communities. One example to highlight is
health, - which some members were referring – where 70% of
households made use of public clinics today versus 57% in 2002. That
is another improvement, and another 80% recorded being satisfied or
very satisfied with the service delivery. This stands counter to
prevailing public perception on the state of public health
facilities and, whilst not evenly performing on aggregate the data
reflects that public health services is deemed by its client users
to have improved in our country.
Martin Luther once said that those who are in front will always
remain in front or the man at the back must run faster than the man
in front. This is the task ahead the ANC government. This is what we
envisage that all South Africans who like this noble country and
this developmental state must just participate and ensure that we
change life. For us to come at this stage and say that you have not
done this and that, without proving any tangible solution, for us it
is a futile exercise. Come up with practical solutions because we
are the government which listen to people. We are proven to have
done that.
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We thank you Chairperson, for affording us this opportunity because
the issue of drought is natural but it has been polarised as if it
is something that has been created by this government. This
government will never create such I dare think. We must fight it,
but everyone must participate, in particular Western Cape farmers
are still suffering. It is a well known truth in our country. Please
good people try by all means to ensure that everyone participate
within the context of farming industry. Thank you so much.
[Applause.]
Ms F B P MAKATONG: Hon Chairperson of the NCOP, hon Minister, hon
members of the council and members from the provincial legislatures,
good afternoon. It is indeed an honour for me hon Chairperson, to
participate in this debate organised under the theme, “working
together to ensure resilience to drought and achieving sustainable
access to water”.
We are indeed celebrating and commemorating Human Rights Month and
Day during a difficult time, when as a country we are experiencing
one of the worst and devastating droughts in the history of this
country, which is seriously threatening our food security and water
supply.
As this theme suggests, as the ANC led government and as a time
tested movement, we are not shying away from the challenges that are
facing us. We have introduced a number of critical interventions and
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special mechanisms to ensure that all South African have daily
access to food and clean water irrespective of the trying times.
It will not be enough for us to just sit back and reflect on the
importance of human rights. It will also not simple be enough to
reaffirm our support to the principles contained in the Freedom
Charter and the Declaration of Human Rights. We need to recommit
ourselves to human rights in a meaningful way and a practical way.
We need to get back to the basics of teaching moral values and
tolerance of one another.
It is reported that 2015 was the driest year since 1904 and also
that the globe is getting warmer every year with some reports saying
that in the last 30 years, every year has been hotter than the
preceding one. The Northern Cape as an arid province has been
hardest hit, threatening our food security and sustainable supply of
water. But I think is also important to note that as a province, we
would like to applaud the hon Minister for the continuous support
that we are receiving from his department.
The Minister, just a week ago made time to interact with the farmers
in the Province and I must say the future looks bright for us in the
Northern Cape. [Applause] Chairperson, it is also said that the
disaster management strategy of the Northern Cape Province is
amongst the best and we could see with what the Minister have just
presented with regard to the numbers as to how the Northern Cape has
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been affected by drought. With the choice of the word “resilient” in
your theme, it is most appropriate because it reflects the
commitment of the ANC led government that cares about the wellbeing
of all South Africans to ensure that interventions and special
mechanisms are put in place to caution against the effects of the
draught so that all South Africans can still have access to food and
clean water irrespective of the challenging situation of the
devastating effects of the drought.
I want to add at the beginning by cautioning the opposition party to
not be disingenuous and malicious in blaming the ANC led government
for circumstances beyond its control, in an attempt to gain cheap
political point-scoring. You may shout as you like. They always say
an empty tin makes the loudest noise, isn‟t it?
Losing jobs as results of the global economic meltdown and serious
drought affecting our farming community
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Hon Makatong,
please take your seat. Hon Julius.
Mr J W W JULIUS: Chairperson, I think we have already ruled in this
House on exactly the same words “empty tin” referring to members,
because of ... Hon member on the podium said “you are” and then she
said empty “we all know empty tins like you”. So it was referred to
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members as making noise like empty tins and there was a ruling in
this House on exact same words last time. Thank you.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES: Thank you Sir.
I will rule in this matter. The Hon Makatong, please take your seat.
He utters two sentences. Firstly, she said, “you may make as much
noise as you want,” and then she says, “empty tin makes the loudest
noise.” Of course you can infer that the second sentence following
quickly after the others refers to the “you”. I think that the
“you”she uses ... I think members, that English is indeed a
difficult language for us, but if we are going to rule each time a
member says; you, your, they, we will never have a debate in the
House. I am going to let this member continue and I am also going to
say it is your maiden, Madam in our House, keep to the debate and
just don‟t reflect on any character of this House. Any member of
this House, but that does not mean you cannot feel free to debate.
Please continue.
Ms F B P MAKATONG: In our province in the Northern Cape, the
Premier, in her state of the province address, referring to the
current drought and our government‟s attempt to mitigate against its
devastating effects, she said and I quote:
Government is currently implementing strategies and programmes to
mitigate the worst economic impacts of the minerals price crush
and drought and that approximately 2 000 small holder farmers
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across the province are benefiting from the drought relief of
about R23 million and we are expecting additional funding to the
tune of R19 million from the national Department of Rural
Development and Land Reform.
We must not be deterred from laying the groundwork for a better
tomorrow. Food security remains one of the key priorities of this
administration and we will continue to do whatever is required to
ensure that our fields produce quality crops. This is once more
evidence and a serious indication that the ANC led government is
indeed a caring one that is committed to ensuring that as the theme
of the debate suggests, “walking together all of us to ensure
resilient to drought and achieving sustainable access to water.”
Let me not dwell much into this. Just to mention that as far as
animal feed is concerned in the province about 90% to 100% has been
delivered in the province, saving a lot of livestock from perishing.
One of the small emerging livestock farmers from one of the district
in Pixley Ka Seme in De Aar, who benefited from the animal feed
programme, had this to say and I quote:
I want to sincerely thank the ANC led government for the support
they are giving us through this difficult time and without this
kind of help our livestock would have perished, which would have
meant a huge loss to us
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This is an indication that the ANC government is a caring one which
has the interest of our people at heart.
The greatest risk of food security in our province and the country
at large is climate change and global warming as indicated earlier.
As an attempt to mitigate against the risk of climate change and
ensuring that the freedom that the Constitution as adopted in 1996,
the most progressive in the world, which includes socio-economic
basic human rights which the state must provides to all citizens
which is happening and we can see it happening.
Access to healthy food and sustainable water supply are fundamental
human rights and enshrined in the Constitution. These human rights
reflects the commitment of the ANC led government in this country to
ensure that no one goes to bed hungry and everyone has access to
clean water, which is an essential ingredient to healthy life.
I sincerely believe that the theme of this debate is most relevant,
given the fact that these rights seemed to be threatened by the
drought and that we need to do more to ensure that people don‟t go
to bed on an empty stomach. We do not have the comfort to allow and
tolerate unnecessary water wastages through leakages and other means
to ensure that we achieve the sustainable access to water.
In concluding, after the Sharpeville massacre, just to remind the
hon members, the United Nations, UN, and the international community
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declare the African National Congress as the sole representative of
the struggling South African masses and their future aspirations.
The ANC has never disappointed the masses of this country. The ANC
will not do that and the ANC will never do that in the future. I
thank you.
Mr N D MASEMOLA: Hon. Chairperson, hon Chief Whip, hon Minister,
members of the executive council from provinces, comrades,
colleagues and fellow South Africans, we are meeting here today to
debate a matter of National importance as the National Council of
Provinces, an issue of basic human rights. I am standing before you
this afternoon illuminated by the heroism of our, forebears, from
the San to the warrior kings of our people, King Sekhukhune, King
Moshoeshoe, King Shaka, King Hintsa, King Makhado and King
Ngungunyane, to their grandchildren the martyrs of our liberation
struggle; whose greatness remains a political landmark of historical
magnitude, in the life of the Nation, for they have earned
themselves a space through their revolutionary commitment to fight
for the people of our country. We are standing here today on the
shoulders of great men and women whose sacrifices in the struggle
for liberation, freedom and democracy remains indelible in the
history of South African Society. These are freedom fighters of
credentials, whose prosaic contributions shall forever remain etched
in our minds and souls. Their lives were cut short and many endured
sufferings in the hands of the brutal system of colonialism and
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apartheid, while fighting for the fundamental human rights which the
people of this country were denied of for so many years.
The ANC had for many decades prior 1994, fought to ensure that the
people of this country irrespective of colour and creed, are able to
live quality lives and enjoy their human rights; and in doing so,
give the actual expression to the multi-class character of our
Nation. Through that journey, the deprivation of the working class
and the poor, of their rights to a decent life in their own land,
brought about many casualties including the Sharpeville massacre on
21 March 1960, which became the highest political point and the
highest point of brutality by the cruel thoughtfulness of a racist
government. That stirred international conscience and anti-apartheid
sentiment gained global acceptance and heightened the struggle of
the people to fight for their own liberation. The 21st of March got
to be known as Sharpeville Day and today is called Human Rights Day.
As we debate this matter today, progress has been made, in restoring
the dignity of the deceased comrades who were killed by the
apartheid government. Reburials have been conducted and work
continues in this area. However, more sadly is the fact that, there
are those whose bodies will probably never be found, because they
have been fed to crocodiles, blown or thrown into the rivers;
painfully meaning that, they shall never be recovered. As we discuss
today‟s human rights in relation to water under these difficult
conditions of drought, may their souls rest in peace. [Applause.]
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Whatever happened to them wherever they are should know that the
struggle continues for the eradication of vestiges of colonialism
and apartheid, the people‟s government of the ANC is at the centre
of the revolution. We are pushing back the frontiers of
underdevelopment; providing basic services which include water under
difficult conditions.
In the history of every country, the society has to face the
imponderable and at times tragic alternatives. These fellow South
Africans perished fighting for a just war, demanding the restoration
of the basic human rights. This debate therefore, should be and I
think is dedicated to the freedom fighters of our revolution, whose
blood and sweat ushered in a democratic dispensation that
concretised the rights of the people by enshrining them in the
country's Constitution.
We salute Chris Hani, Hector Peterson, Solomon Mahlangu, Griffiths
Mxenge, Steve Biko, Nengudza, Dulcie September, Ruth First,
Moroka 3, Salojee Suliman, Bram Fischer and many more, who remain
unsung, unknown and unburied. May their souls rest in peace as we
advance the struggle. [Applause.]
Monopoly capital supported by colonialism and apartheid government
had created a fraction of class in society, to emerge through
capitalist efforts in relation to the productive capacity of our
economy. They took our land to themselves. Today we are debating the
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serious matter of water provision under difficult conditions. Our
people are subjected to small piece of land hence the difficulties
to cope with this scourge of drought that we are grabbling with. It
determined its central occupation, in the socio-economic life of the
nation and relegated the overwhelming majority in this country to
unproductive forms of societal activities. That aggravated their
social conditions hence the triple challenges of inequalities,
poverty and unemployment faced by our society today.
As we debate this matter today we should continue to mobilise them
into activities of social purpose. We should ensure material
transformation of the economic conditions of production, to temper
with the foundation of the immense superstructure the interest of
the working class and the poor. We should guide them as we advance
the more radical second phase of our transition, and create
conditions to bring improvements of substance to their lives.
Therefore, the economic power relations in this country cannot
remain as is; it should reflect the demographic character of the
South African society. It is important for us to do so, because,
social conscience of society is determined and sharpened by their
social well being, strengthened by economic opportunities and
prosperity, as it is a real foundation, which determine the material
living conditions of the people.
The people have a right to shelter; right to water; right to work;
right to land and freedom from hunger. Real redistribution of wealth
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and ownership has not yet happened convincingly and therefore, not
all the rights are enjoyed as we are discussing today. The economic
issues should not and shall never remain an intellectual exercise as
others would want them to be because that would be surrendering the
society to abstract theories. Which would precipitate adventurism
advocated by others and detour us from the mainline and make us lose
focus of the national project.
The National Liberation brought about the historical personality of
us as a people; freed the process of comprehensive development of
the National productive forces; ensured the inalienable rights of
the South African people and equally demand of those forces profound
mutation that would make them compatible with progress. Hence the
ANC had chart a course within the realm of objective possibilities
to essentially position the country for it to respond, overtime to
the real issues affecting society. In this regard our hearts are
warmed by the fact that, systems have been laid to defend the rights
of the people. Institutions of defending democracy and providing
services have proved to be functional and effective. Therefore,
there shall never be a moment in this country where South Africans
will experience once again a form culture that undermines people's
rights.
The perspectives in the social dynamics accentuate noticeable
progress in the transformation of the social structures of
Society, hence the direct influence and impact of policies of the
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ANC on the outlook of the society. That manifests itself into Ubuntu
that was not there during the apartheid government and colonialism.
These contain values from the cosmology of society and laid a firm
foundation for a National identity and culture, long articulated by
the founding fathers and mothers of the struggle for freedom.
The Supremacy of the Constitution and the rule of law have been
guaranteed to all South Africans, that their rights are respected
and any incident of violation is and shall be attended to without
any prejudice. As such we have set the pace which accords with the
objective conditions demonstrated through policy. This include what
the Department of Agriculture, Water Affairs and Rural Development
are grabbling at the moment; moving and traversing the landscape of
our nation to respond to the conditions which our people find
themselves as a consequence of this drought which brought serious
problems of water shortages to human beings, animals as well as the
fauna.
Our theory and techniques of development is all encompassing and
based on an understanding and appreciation, of the multi-class
character of the nation, evidenced by socio-economic infrastructure
and progress made to date to lay a firm foundation for the basic
human rights in our country. This has made it possible that through
policy, legislation programmes and activities enough services are
being given to our people. To give a few examples ... [Time
expired.] Thank you. [Applause.]
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Ms L L ZWANE: Hon Chairperson, hon members, our guests in the
gallery, maybe before I begin with my debate let me just respond to
...
... uMntwana weNkosi, ngeshwa usehambile. [... the Prince,
unfortunately he has left.]
He referred to a very important issue as we approach the Easter
weekend. He made reference to the story of Peter and Jesus. I‟m not
going to get deep into the story but I want to refer to the fact
that Inkosi yamaKhosi, the Lord Jesus Christ, did not hold on to
what Peter had done. Instead he forgot about it completely and told
Peter that he will build his church upon him. [Applause.] That is
what leaders do. [Applause.] [Interjections.] Running a country is
not about hallucinating. [Laughter.] Running a country is not about
political bankruptcy that other people are showing. Running a
country is not verbal diarrhoea ... [Interjections.]
AN HON MEMBER: Yes.
Ms L L ZWANE: ... where people would stand up and say anything they
want to say. Running a country is about planning.
AN HON MEMBER: Under the Guptas.
Ms L L ZWANE: Running the country is about the delivery of services.
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AN HON MEMBER: Under the Guptas. [Interjections.]
Ms L L ZWANE: Running the country is about improving the quality of
life of the people, which is what the ANC is doing. [Applause.]
AN HON MEMBER: For the leadership of the Guptas, yes.
[Interjections.]
Ms L L ZWANE: Chairperson, the mandate of the ANC-led government of
the Republic of South Africa, through the Department of Water and
Sanitation, is to ensure that the country‟s water resources are
protected, managed efficiently, used effectively, developed,
conserved and controlled through regulating and supporting the
delivery of effective water supply and sanitation. This is done in
accordance with the requirements of water-related policies, treaties
and conventions to which South Africa subscribes. The delivery of
water and sanitation is not merely a delivery of basic services but
it is an issue of human rights.
South Africa recognises the fact that citizens have the right of
access to clean water. Citizens have got a right to sufficient food
and citizens have got a right to participate actively in the
transformation of the economy in which water plays a vital role.
Major industrial productions and output requires water. Literally
any thing that gets processed by big industry, at some state or
another, will require the use of water. Agricultural activities,
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from the times of soil preparations, to planting, to harvesting, to
value adding, require the use of water. South Africa in the process
of dealing with water issues is not in isolation, it is a prominent
player in the global village.
To that extent, South Africa subscribes, or is a signatory to very
important protocols in relation to water. It is a signatory in the
Revised Protocol on Shared Watercourses in the Southern African
Development Community, SADC, region. South Africa shares four major
river systems with six neighbouring countries. It shares the Orange
River with Botswana, Namibia, Lesotho; Limpopo system is shared
between South Africa, Zimbabwe and Mozambique; Inkomati system is
shared between South Africa, Swaziland and Mozambique and the
Pongola-Maputo system is shared with Mozambique and Swaziland
because South Africa recognises the importance of interacting and
integrating with other African states in the African continent.
It is also having bilateral agreements with other countries with
other countries within the continent and also outside the continent.
The United Nations Sustainable Development Goals state that – the
one that refers to water issues – it states that by 2030, there
should be universal access to safe and affordable drinking water and
sanitation and as we speak we are proud of the fact that the ANC led
government of South Africa has reached 90% access of water by
households. [Applause.] That is what is meant by improving the lives
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of the people, not verbal diarrhoea, that we hear people talking
about. [Interjections.]
AN HON MEMBER: By the ANC government or the Guptas?
Ms L L ZWANE: We applaud the initiative of the ANC led government,
...
AN HON MEMBER: Under the Guptas.
Ms L L ZWANE: ... nationally with regards to projects that are
rolled out in some of the provinces. ... [Interjections.] Just to
support my statement I want to refer to project out in Kwazulu-Natal
in uMkhanyakude, the Jozini project. That project is going to
service a number of communities that are going to benefit, in fact
some them have already started benefiting.
Amakhosi alapha eMkhanyakude oNkosi uMyeni, oNkosi uNyawo, oNkosi
uGumede, oNkosi uTembe, uGumede kaSqakatha, uGumede kaMashabane.
Onkosi uMathenjwa, oNkosi uJobe, lawo maKhosi wonke ... (Translation
of isiZulu paragraph follows.)
[The Chiefs here at Mkhanyakude: Chief Myeni, Chief Nyawo, Chief
Gumede, Chief Tembe, Gumede the son of Sqakatha, Gumede the son of
Mashabane. Chief Mathenjwa, Chief Jobe (Clan Name.), all those
chiefs ...]
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... are going to benefit from the Jozini Water Scheme, that is the
work of the ANC. [Applause.] That area in uMkhanyakude is also
declared a drought zone and the initiatives of the government of the
Republic has seen to it that there is relief or interventions ...
AN HON MEMBER: The Republic of ... [Interjections.]
Ms L L ZWANE: ... that are made in terms of making provision of
money to secure the water trucks to service the areas, although we
recognise the fact that what has been given is not sufficient but
was has been done is within the limits of the constraints of the
finances that the government has. In Ugu, there is a problem of
drought; a major problem in all the districts in KZN, there is a
problem of drought but let me just quote Ugu because I am closest to
that area. In uMuziwabantu we went there during the Provincial Week,
drought was bad. The dam there in uMuziwabantu in Harding was at the
level of 8%, literally there was no water. And areas that were
affected ...
... ezingaphansi kwamaKhosi aKwaMachi, oFodo, oMbotho, oJali.[...
under the chiefs of KwaMachi, Chiefs Fodo, Mbotho, and Jali.]
Those areas were vitally affected but because the ANC cares, it saw
to it that there is provision of money to secure water tanks to go
and service those areas.
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Ezindaweni zakuMuziwabantu, uMzumbe, Vulamehlo, Ezinqoleni, Umdoni,
... [In the areas at Muziwabantu, Mzumbe, Vulamehlo, Ezinqoleni,
Umdoni, ...]
... are being serviced and there is these projects that we
appreciate were 15 000 artisans are being trained to work on the
water leaks and that is job creation by the ANC because the ANC
cares for the people. It‟s not enough but we are going to get there,
for as long as we are focused and we don‟t listen to all types of
noises. Let me go Cape Town, In Cape Town we‟ve got a major problem,
...laphaya eKhayelitsha. [Ubuwelewele.] [...there in Khayelitsha.
[Interjections.]]
There is a problem there.
Umama walaphaya eKhayelitsha, uNolulama Jarha. [A woman in
Khayelitsha, by the name of Nolulama Jarha.]
Living in Khayelitsha in Nkanini area, in Lindela Road, and she
says:
I don‟t understand how the city keeps on forgetting us. It‟s time
they come to Nkanini for sanitation purposes. We have to travel
quite a distance to get water from a tap, which is in another
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street and we‟ve got only one toilet that is used by 20
households, in Khayelitsha, in Cape Town. [Interjections.]
The budget to address water and sanitation in Cape Town for all
these 204 informal settlements in Cape Town is only R22 million, out
of a budget of R1,6 billion. [Interjections.] Let us not remember
people only when we go to vote, to garner for votes, let us remember
people even when we need to deliver services. You cannot tell me
that you can allocate only R22 million, it‟s an insult to 204
informal settlements and reserve the total sum, close to R2 billion
to service other areas other than these informal settlements.
AN HON MEMBER: Typical ... [Interjections.]
Ms L L ZWANE: Before we make a lot of noise, let us go out and work.
Work, work, and then people will be able to listen to us. In
conclusion, I too want to say that we also do appreciate the effort
of government in terms of addressing drought issues where a billion
rand was actually given to farmers to address to issue relating to
drought and small holder farmers were given about R508 million and
those that are indebted as a result of drought were given about R130
million. That is what the ANC is doing in an attempt to address this
issue of drought and there are people who are going to stand here
and say the ANC is not doing anything for the people. [Time
expired.] Thank you Chairperson. [Applause.]
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Mr R MACKENZIE: WC CHAIRPERSON - TRANSPORT, SAFETY AND LIASON: This
is my maiden speech in this House. I feel welcome to represent the
Western Cape, as one of the best run provinces in the country. Hon
member, let me quickly rectify some of the misleading statements
that you made today here.
Firstly, when you fix water leaks that you have broken is not a
success story. You broken it, now you fixed it, there‟s nothing to
celebrate about it.
Secondly, in Khayelitsha, the ward councillors, couple of them are
ANC ward councillors, and they get what we call ward allocation. The
responsibility of the ward councillor is to spend the money in the
community that they represent. So what you should do is, go to your
ANC elected ward councillor and make noise against that councillor.
We know the constitution is the highest law in this country and it
was adopted in 1996 as the instrument aimed at healing the divisions
of the past and establish the society based on democratic values,
social justice and fundamental human rights. Chapter 2 of the
constitution contains the Bill of Rights, which as South Africans we
live by and seek to protect at any cost.
The Western Cape, like the rest of South Africa, is in the middle of
a drought and is currently a national disaster. The Minister earlier
on indicated that some areas are declared a national disaster but he
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has failed to declare this a national emergency, as it should be
declared Minister. Some of the comments that you made earlier on to
me when you were sitting there, the banks are going to have an issue
with, it is quite a sad comment you made. In fact, if you do declare
it a national disaster, which it is, we are likely to access more
funding because it is a national disaster. So it‟s a pity that you
made such an unfortunate comment.
The actual job losses in the agricultural sector, Minister,
currently are the hardest hit in the country. In fact, AgriWest
report that most farmers will keep their regular employees but the
most vulnerable seasonal employees of which the majority are black
employees, are most likely to find less work.
We don‟t blame the ANC for the drought, but we blame the ANC for the
mismanagement of the drought, which you are the Minister for, and
that‟s what we blame you for. And currently the poor, are going to
be the most that suffer from some of the bad decisions that you‟ve
been making Minister, since you became the Minister.
In fact Minister, let me go to some of the challenges that the
farmers are facing. If I remember correctly Minister, you are a
farmer yourself. In fact, you are the Minister responsible for
paying your farm worker R23 00 a day. You are a disgrace as a
Minister, in fact the average salary Minister is R2216 00 a month,
which amounts to R111 00 a day. But guess what you do hon Minister,
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you say bugger the constitution, bugger the labour laws of this
country, I‟m paying them R23 00 a day and he can live at the back of
my shack, that‟s what you did Minister, that‟s a disgrace hon
Minister.
Mr S G MTHIMUNYE: I rise on a point of Order Chair. The member is
making a statement and I want to believe firmly that is based on
media reports and that does not make it a fact. It is only an
allegation, therefore I think it is unacceptable for a member to
make allegations and present them as facts, based on media reports.
ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (MR S J MOHAI): Thank you very much. Hon
members, can you be in order please. Allow members to express
themselves. We will look into the matter as raised, hon member, as
you suggest.
Mr R MACKENZIE: Hon member, let me repeat. The hon Minister, who is
a member of the communist party, his own party‟s member, hon Cronin
of the other House, came out and asked the hon Minster to stop doing
what he‟s doing and pay his staff members a proper wage, his own
party. So it‟s not hearsay. Before I continue, the hon Duma, they
say if don‟t know how to cut don‟t paste. That speech you made, is
the same one hon Bam-Mugwanya made in the upper House.
Right now we need to put all efforts to help farmers. In fact, the
hon Masemola of Limpopo was the only member who came here and spoke
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sense. We should speak to the Guptas to give you the Minister‟s job.
Hon Masemola hit the nail on the head, the only person who told us
what‟s wrong with the [Inaudible.] in the country. Coming from
Limpopo, which we all know is under administration, perhaps he
should become the Premier, hon member we will send the sms to the
Guptas as well.
We have to put a lot of efforts into helping our farmers and the
workers with emergency assistance to ensure that farmers with the
sustainable future are not forced to cave in. For this we need the
national government, to realise that this is indeed a national
disaster and a national emergency. The livelihood of the thousands
of our people, which is the majority of our poor people, are
currently suffering because of the Minister failing to declare this
a national disaster.
The current record drought in our country, has shown us how
vulnerable the agricultural sector is, an industry [Interjections.]
Ms T WANA: Thank you, Chairperson. Can the speaker take a question?
MR R MACKENZIE: No, thank you. I‟ll take a question from a member
who has something decent to say.
An industry that has been able to transform without government
subsidy is a good thing. But we need a responsive government not a
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reactive government. Minister, you‟ve highlighted some plans, we
suggest a simple google and if you do the honourable thing Minister
you‟ll do a simple google. The same plans that you spoke about,
2014-15, but you‟ve failed to implement those plans Minister.
There‟s nothing wrong with the plans, well there are many wrongs
with the plans, but you‟ve failed to implement it. Stop talking and
start implementing because the current drought, again we don‟t blame
the ANC for the drought, we blame you for the failure to deal with
the drought, that‟s the problem.
Minister, part of the issue is, and again you mentioned the issue
about the tractors that are coming from America, again the
industrialisation of our country post 1994 and the mismanagement and
destructive of our factories, of which your party is solely
responsible for. We should not be importing tractors from America,
for goodness sake. We should be manufacturing tractors, we supply
steel, we‟ve got some of the biggest steels in this country.
Something that is quite shocking about agriculture, and you said
there, we must relook at changing the animals which we breed, and
the hon Masemola from Limpopo has mentioned it in terms of the
ancestors. Our ancestors survived for hundreds of years in our
current situation through many droughts. This is the worst one
certainly, Minister, and I agree with you. But you say we must
change our animals, how do we change the animals? We must change the
ANC because they are the problem and the mismanagement, it‟s a
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shocking statement coming from you Minister and I‟m actually
embarrassed to stand here listen to that.
The problem again, is we don‟t have problem with money in this
country. We‟ve got billions to deal with the challenges and funding
drought in this country. The R4 billion that our president wants to
spend on the new jet is one example of the money we can spend on the
drought. Please, when you go back to the Cabinet, perhaps you must
speak to the Guptas and the president, and tell them let‟s spend
that R4 billion on the drought and not on the jet. Similarly, the
ANC spend millions and millions of rands in defending the war
criminal, al-Bashir. In fact, we smuggled him out of this country
like a thief in the dark. That money, the millions spent on court
cases should have been spent on the drought. So please, Minister, on
Human Rights Day, let‟s respect the human rights and the
constitution of this country and don‟t spend money on war crimes and
criminals and smuggle them out of the country.
MR J M MTHETHWA: I rise on a point of Order. The way you talk, is
like you are fighting, you are fighting who?
Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: I rise on a point of Order. Hon Ximbi has to
withdraw the racist statement that he made, that the hon Ricardo
MacKenzie is a garden boy. I ask him to withdraw it.
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ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Ximbi, can you withdraw the
statement you made. [Interjections.]
Hon member, it wasn‟t easy really to hear what the hon member has
said. But we will refer to Hansard and rule accordingly on the
statement. Thank you. I will rule on the statement that he said, it
is out of order.
Hon members, can we please allow the member to continue with the
debate.
Mr R MACKENZIE: I‟ve got more than enough time, don‟t worry, in
parliament we manage our time very effectively.
Mr J W W JULIUS: There‟s always another option, like we do with the
opposition in this House. We ask the member whether you said so or
not. The member must now say I did not or I did, and then you check
Hansard and see whether he lied in this House and do what is
appropriate.
MR R MACKENZIE: May I just continue? One of the other things that
the Minister also spoke about with regard to infrastructure, again a
simple google search will show that the Minister said the same thing
in 2014, it‟s now 2016 and we are dealing with the same issues we
dealt with in 2014. When are we implementing some of these plans
Minister, when are we starting to deliver to the poorest of the poor
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in this country? That is a [Inaudible], there is just no
implementation taking place in your department Minister, very, very
sadly so.
Let me come to this, I see that I‟ve got two minutes left because I
was continuously interrupted, let me just say that the DA is very
concerned. We are very concerned about the drought affecting the
people because it puts food security at risk. It means our people
won‟t have money on the table and the 9 December 2015 disastrous
decision taken by President Jacob Zuma to fire Minister Nene cost us
R169 billion. So that‟s going to have an impact on food security,
and that is part of what we are talking about when we tell about
some of the mismanagement by the ANC. Because it violates the human
rights of the poorest of the poor and that‟s a challenge Minister.
Ms L L ZWANE: I just want to know if the hon member can take a
question?
MR R MACKENZIE: We are very concerned, national government is
supposed to be assisting our farmers but instead they put red-tape
in place and prevent them from building dams and alleviating the
consequences of the drought. We are concerned with the ANC
government‟s mixed-signals to farmers, the Minister again today gave
mixed-signals and he‟s putting red-tape in place.
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Before I finish off, let me just say, there‟s a speaker coming after
me which is the MEC of the Eastern Cape. It is very important that
we note that, obviously the most corrupt, incompetent and mismanaged
province in country, so I‟m keen to know what is he going to say
with regard to agriculture. Because the reason some of the
challenges, ourselves and Gauteng are facing, is because exactly of
the Eastern Cape, the reason why 20 000 learners are coming to the
Western Cape, 60 000 to Gauteng, is because of this mismanagement of
the Eastern Cape and the reason why many farmers are suffering
including, as we know Minister Zokwana paid his farmer R23 00. So,
we are sitting waiting to hear what kind of advice the most
mismanaged, corrupt, incompetent province‟s MEC is going to give us
today. I thank you.
ACTING CHAIRPERSON (MR S J Mohai): Hon members, please don‟t raise
your voices so that we don‟t drown the speakers. May we invite hon
MEC Qoboshiyane to address the House.
Mr M QHOBOSHIYANE (Eastern Cape - MEC RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND AGRARIAN
REFORM): Thank you very much Chairperson. The major drought was when
this land was brutally and forcefully taken and the majority
squattertly cramped into the untold misery and slavery. We were
thirsty with our perennial rivers flowing because of the colour of
our skin. It is when criminals who denied us land, who denied us
water, who denied us life are still happier to see democracy further
their same privileges without remorse.
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I listened here to some criminals who looted and scavenged the
resources of Limpopo to the ruins and plunder without conscience.
Now they‟ve got the audacity and courage to come and stand here
unashamedly in front of the pained society still flashing their
opulence, lust of money purporting to be serious politicians and I
think we need to be careful. [Applause.]
The tragedy that has created the need for this gathering and made it
seems natural that we must gather in this historic debate, we are
here commemorating the people‟s dreams fulfilled by the ANC; the
triumph of justice over tyranny of the past; the realisation of the
vision enshrined in the UN‟s Charter; and the Universal Declaration
of Human rights.
The UN first discussed the South African question in 1946. It was
discussing the issue of racism. The ANC and democratic forces were
determined to fight this system side by side with UN. I want to
quote the determination of all humanity: “Never again permit racist
theory and practice to dragon the world into deadly clutches of war
and genocide.”
Racist tyranny established itself in our country. Human rights
culture never existed before 1994. We had a state which refused to
treat this matter as a quant historical aberration and this tyranny
has claimed its own conclave of victims. It has established its own
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brutal worth by the number of children it has killed and orphans,
the widows it can claim as its unique creation.
Sanxanwa, safa Sihlalo, sadlakatheliswa, athathw‟ amahlathi, zemk‟
iintlanzi, amatye anempucuko neentaba zeli lizwe. Sanyolwa,
sanyothulw‟ ubuthina ngabagwebi abanolunya nonyhamnyheko
[Kwaqhwatywa]. Abantu bakuthi babukel‟ iinkomo zabo zithathwa,
zithathwa ngabacinezeli. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraph
follows.)
[We died of thirst, treated badly, forests were taken, fish escaped,
precious stones and hills of this country. We were finger pointed,
our personality disrespected by inhumane people [Applause]. Our
people were watching oppressors while they were taking their cattle
from them.]
On our Human Rights Day last year in the province of the Eastern
Cape, we had an honour of welcoming the multitudes of the people of
South Africa to the national celebration of Human Rights Day, in
Uitenhage, under the theme “Celebrating The Freedom Charter,
Enjoying the Equal Human Rights For All.” We celebrated this day
with the rest of the country with the sense of satisfaction that the
democracy we ushered in 1994 is deepening and maturing.
Often it is said that time heals all wounds. Today at this debate,
we remember Sharpeville as it was yesterday and we should therefore
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propose to mark the 20th milestone of our democratic Constitution in
honour of those who perished. We also remember the massacre of
Uitenhage on 21 March 1985 and many more which littered the
landscape of our beautiful land. We are proud too, that although
they perished, their blood continues to nourish the tree of freedom.
As we address this gathering today, a South African delegation,
those who survived is in New York, participating in the 60th session
of the Commission of the Status of Women, CSW, representing a free
South Africa. Perhaps the question begs to be asked regarding the
meaning of these events in the context of what we have to do from
now onwards. Amongst the critical question we must ask ourselves; is
what responsibility is imposed by experiences of Sharpeville and
Langa on us? The generation that survived apartheid oppression, if
as they say, „memory is the struggle of the mind against
forgetting‟, how then do we ensure that we shall never forget?
It is therefore, befitting to come and debate human rights, working
together to ensure resilience to drought and achieving sustainable
access to water.
Bakhona abantu abade baya kumhlalaphantsi bengazange balupasisa
uhlahlo-lwabiwo-mali lwamahlwempu, lokusa amanzi ebantwini
abangenawo. [There are people who took pension without approving
budget of delivering water services to poor people whom water is
scarce for them.]
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Now they can stand here not knowing exactly how many pipes connected
to the majority of citizens of this country. They must shut up.
[Applause.] As government we have sought to answer these questions
by outlying the programme of action of the financial year 2016-17,
which further advances the achievements and the goals of Freedom
Charter as well as the creation of people-centred society. Some are
shocked hon Chairperson...
ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon MEC, may I request you just
to take your seat. Hon Julius you are on your feet.
Mr J W W JULIUS: Hon Chair, on a point of order: Is it parliamentary
for the member to say we, as opposition must shut up and also hon
...
ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay, hon members the question is
directed to the Chair. No, no, no, don‟t point in that way to the
hon member. Can you take your seat? And let us allow, it is a point
of debate, let us allow hon MEC to proceed.
Mr M QHOBOSHIYANE: E C MEC: Some are shocked hon Chairperson to see
water treatment works, household water connection, electricity and
access to infrastructure. Their shock is causing them angry, amazed
of how come in 20 years these people are looking like us. Without
repeating everything we have said in our state of the provincial
address, we continue to advance our quest to improve our health
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outcomes. We are providing and improving more health infrastructure
throughout the province. Another state of art, Cecilia Makiwane
building was added to the original site. We are training more health
care professionals who through the advances made in that facility
will be able to use information and communication technology, ICTbased solution to soften waiting times in hospital queues.
Agri-parks are the way to go and this year under the Operation
Phakisa, our Industrial Development Zones, IDZ have commenced with
the development of Aqua-culture Development Zone and I can report
back here.
ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon MEC, can you just hold on a
second? Hon members the remark was not directed at a specific member
in the House. The hon member made a general remark. It was not
directed at a specific member in the House. I want to warn the hon
members that are persistently continuing with this shut up, that I
will rule against them. Let us allow the debate to flow. Let us
allow the hon MEC to proceed with the debate because we have said
the matter was in general. He made a general point that was not
directed at a member. Can we proceed hon MEC? Okay, before that ...
Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Hon Chair, on a point of order: The first ruling
was that the comments from the members of the ANC of this House were
general. When we as members of the DA just used the word „shut up‟
with any, any name coupled with, and then you will make a ruling. If
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this is not biased, then I have not seen biased ever and I am asking
this and we will write a letter in this command. Thank you.
ACTING CHAIRPERSON (MR S J Mohai): Thank you, hon Member. Can we
allow the hon MEC to proceed with the debate?
MR M QHOBOSHIYANE: The right to health care, food, water and social
security is enshrined in the Constitution. We can report here in
this hon House, that good rains have blessed us and we will continue
to pursue our target of cropping 300 000 hectares of land which we
set in the current term. Last week in East London we hosted Economic
Research Conference with Dti. Our main role in the economy is to
create an enabling environment where business and entrepreneurship
strive. To this end, we are transforming the provincial economy to
create jobs and to encourage more development through partnership
and export linkages. [Interjections.]
Earlier today, in East London, Treasury, through its job fund
working with Mercedes Benz South Africa, MBSA, launched a learning
academy that would provide trained artisans, not only for MBSA, but
for the needs of the entire industry as well. This academy has a
robotic reference cell for the training and will be a feeder of
artisan skills to maintain the plant and hope that the community of
Buffalo City Metropolitan Municipality as well as local industries
will immensely benefit from this venture. Indeed, siyaqhuba. [we are
moving forward]. [Applause.]
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We are determined again in line with the Freedom Charter objectives
to ensure that our people are able to bring up their families in
comfort and security. Accordingly, we are prioritising the fight
against crime and corruption informed by the respect of the right to
life. Last month, we took a campaign of no violence against women to
communities of Qebe on 8 March, on the International Women‟s Day to
bolster the efforts of the criminal justice system, focusing on
rural safety and elimination of substance abuse, illegal taverns and
sheebens in the Province.
After almost 22 years of freedom and democracy, ours is a country in
which our people are free to associate with whomever they wish to
move freely to every corner of the country, hon members, to speak
their minds without fear of state repression, to assemble and
protest at whatever they receive as injustice and to explore their
full potential as citizens in every manner possible within the
ambits of the law.
Through an intensified campaign of public education, all of us must
appreciate that state property is our property and each must play
our part in ensuring that it is protected against wishful
destruction. We must appreciate this point, whereas in Sharpeville
and in Uitenhage, they were engaged in a titanic struggle to get rid
of this albatross of apartheid oppression. Today we have a
responsibility to build our country. It is a responsibility that
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requires not only maximum discipline but constantly we must work
together.
Events such as those looting sprees and xenophobic attacks we saw
over the weekend in East Rand, might muddy our human rights track
record. We hold it as an inviable principle that racism must be
opposed by all means that humanity has at its disposal. Whenever it
occurs, it has a potential to result in a systemic and comprehensive
denial of human rights to those who are discriminated against. This
is because all racism inherently, a challenge of human rights
because it denies the view that every human being is person of equal
worth with any other because it treats entire people as sub-human.
We have a responsibility to expunge this crime through conventional,
legitimate constitutional mechanism. I just want to quote, “the
cannibalism of racism evaporates the steam of freedom and democratic
credentials and it may reduce our good standing in the eyes of the
world.”
In conclusion, President Nelson in 1993 said:
We adopted the Freedom Charter in 1955. This is a document born of
our struggle, rooted in South African conditions, and expressing
the aspirations of the disenfranchised. Because of its content,
the Freedom Charter has met with international acclaim as an
outstanding human rights document. The Freedom Charter provides a
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sound moral basis for law and law making. It poses an inclusive
basis for citizenship.
There can be no better monument to those heroes of Langa,
Sharpeville massacres, than our success in making ideas live in
perpetuity through unstinting work to lift our people from poverty
by making viable their dream of a better life. We must therefore,
strengthen our efforts of ensuring that our human rights to dignity
in our Constitution find expression in many jobs we create and in
many opportunities for training and availing young people for such
as those of Zanolwazi Senior Secondary School in Despatch, where the
premier of the province, working in partnership with state-owned
enterprises, such as SABC and Telkom. Standard Bank had handed over
the ICT lab and laboratory to ensure that ours becomes truly
knowledge-based economy.
Asinakube sizihlupha ke Sihlalo ngamagxwemu, amehlo sinawo.
[Kwaqhwatywa.] [Kwahlekwa.] [Hon Chairperson, we cannot bother
ourselves by people who have bad eyesight, we do have eyes.
[Applause.] [Laughter.]]
Rre O SEFAKO: Modulasetilo, Tona ya tsa Temothuo, Dikgwa le Tshwaro
ya Ditlhapi, batlotlegi botlhe ba ba mo Ntlong eno, ga mmogo le ba
ba tswang di porofenseng, SALGA, baeti ba ba leng fano, babogedi kwa
magaeng, Aforika Borwa le lefatshe ka bophara,
ke a le dumedisa. Ke
lebogele sebaka se o se nneileng go tsaya karolo mo dingangisanong
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tseno, letsatsi pele re keteka letsatsi la segopotso. Ke letsatsi
leo lefatshe, ka ngwaga wa 1948, le kileng la kopana mme la le
tlhopa gore ke nnete le tshwanelwa ke go keteka ditshwanelo tsa
batho. Ka ona ngwaga oo, gone go tsalwa puso ya bonwamadi, e leng
yona puso eo e e ... (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)
[Mr O SEFAKO: House Chairperson, Minister of Agriculture, Forestry
and Fisheries, all the honourable members in this House, delegates
from provinces, SALGA, our guests, viewers at home, South Africa and
the world at large, I greet you. I would like to thank you for the
opportunity you have given to me to take part in this debate, a day
before the celebration. It is the day in which the world, in 1948,
sat together and agreed that it has to celebrate human rights. In
this very same year, the apartheid government was born, the
government which is...]
... characterised as the party of capitalism of a special time, the
apartheid regime.
Aforika Borwa yona e gopola bagaka bao ba neng ba kgaratlhela
kgololosego ka 21 Mopitlwe 1960. Bao ba kileng ba ipetsa difuba
bare, nnyaa ga e le makwaloitshupo one, re tshwanela go a busa
kgotsa go a tshuba. Ba ne gape ba kgaratlhela go tshwarwa makgwakgwa
le kgatelelo ya puso ya sebata. Jalo, ka re ke gopotse
makokokganetso a a eteletsweng pele ke setlhopa se sa DA gore nnete
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ke gore, ga gona sepe se ba ka se dirang. (Translation of Setswana
paragraph follows.)
[South Africa, on the 21ST March 1960, commemorates heroes who
fought; those who were brave enough to say no to dompas identity
documents. They then decided to either return or burn them. They
were also fighting the ill-treatment from the apartheid government.
I would like to inform opposition parties led by the DA that the
truth is, there is nothing they can do.]
They are immune to making mistakes because, indeed, there is nothing
that they are offering and there is nothing that they are doing.
[Interjections.]
Koloi ya ga Paul Kruger e e saleng e nna ka fa tlase ga setlhare, ga
go ntšwa epe e e ka e bogolang, ka e sa tsamaye. Seo dintšwa di ka
se dirang fela ke go e dikologa, di kuke lopara di e rotele. Fa ele
ANC yona e gata e ya pele, iqhubekela phambili. Leuba leo le
phadimotseng naga ... (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)
[As for Paul Kruger‟s car that has been under a tree, no dog barks
at it. Dogs bark only at a moving car. What the dogs do is to go
around the car and pee on it. The ANC is going forward. The drought
the country is experiencing...]
A HON MEMBER: The Gupta saga!
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Mr O SEFAKO: Le tlholwa ke bothata jwa phetogo go boemo jwa bosa.
[You are failing to deal with climate change.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Sefako, please take
your seat. What are you rising on, hon member?
Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Hon Chair, I rise on a point of order: For
falsehoods being said in this Chamber, the hon member must withdraw
the statement that the DA has nothing to show. We have 27
municipalities ... [Interjections.] ... where we proved that where
we govern we govern better than the ANC! [Interjections.] The top 10
...
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Take your seat, hon
member.
Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Can I just finish, hon Chair? Can I just finish?
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Thank you, hon member.
Can you take your seat? That is a point of debate, rather. It is not
a point of order. Can we allow the hon member to continue with the
debate? [Interjections.] Hon Sefako, continue. [Interjections.] Can
you please take your seat, hon member? Allow the speaker to proceed.
[Interjections.] No, what you just said is not a point of order; it
is a point of debate. Let‟s allow the member to proceed.
[Interjections.]
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Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Chair, the point is that he is not telling the
truth. The top 10 municipalities ... the top 9 municipalities are DA
municipalities. [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, can you
take your seat? [Interjections.] Can you please take your seat, hon
member? [Interjections.] Take your seat! Proceed, hon Sefako.
Mr O SEFAKO: Hon Chair, the phenomenon characterised as climate
change has brought all the members of the international communities
together irrespective of...
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Sefako ... Yes, hon
member, on what are you rising?
Mr C HATTINGH: Hon Chair, it is very difficult if you get up and
look at me and you don‟t recognise me. Hon Chair, I would like to
know whether it‟s parliamentary for the hon member to refer to
members making remarks as dogs running around a car and urinating
against the car. [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, that could
be how it is received through the interpretation. I am saying, if
that is the case, I will refer the matter to the Table and they will
advise, and then I will come back to the matter. So, can we proceed?
Can we allow hon ... [Interjections.]
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Rre O SEFAKO: Ke a re fa ele koloi e e tsamayang, [Tsenoganong.] e
bogolwa ke dintšwa, mme e e emeng fela e le sekorokoro se se nkgang,
ao! [Tsenoganong.] ga gona ntšwa e e ka itshwenyang ya e bogola.
[Tsenoganong.] Di a e dikologa, di kuke lepara mme di e kgotlhele ka
moroto. [Tsenoganong.]. (Translation of Setswana paragraph follows.)
[Mr O SEFAKO: Dogs bark at a moving car, [Interjections.] however,
the only thing dogs do to a stationery and scrapped car is to pee on
it! [Interjections.]].
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, I have
advised you to take your seat and I will refer to the Table to
advise. The Table has provided advice. Many of our African languages
are rich in metaphor and the interpretation may not provide the
exact meaning. So, can we allow the member to proceed with the
debate and we will look into any other matter that may cause
dissatisfaction and we will refer. Thanks. [Interjections.]
Mr O SEFAKO: Ke gopotse le batlotlegi gore ... [I must remind the
honourable ...]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, can you now
take your seat if you are rising on the same matter, because I have
already ruled on that matter now.
Mr C HATTINGH: [Inaudible.] Can I just ask a question for clarity?
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): No, no, no!
Mr C HATTINGH: Is it alright that a member can go around urinating
on other members here? [Interjections.]
Mr O SEFAKO: Ke a go leboga ... [Thank you ...]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Can I address you hon
member? Are you referring to any specific member in the House?
Mr C HATTINGH: [Inaudible.] ... to general and that is also
Afrikaans.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay, take your seat.
Can we allow hon Sefako to proceed, please? Let‟s not be
obstructive. Hon Sefako, can you proceed with the debate?
Rre O SEFAKO: A ke tswelele ke re: Maitsholo a e seng one,
Kgarejwana ... [Tsenoganong.] ya marata go lejwa fa e sena maitseo
re a re e tshwana lenyena la gauta mo nkong ya kolobe. E tla re e
kgabile, ya ipitika mo seretseng. [Tsenoganong.] (Translation of
Setswana paragraph follows.)
[Mr O SEFAKO: A beautiful lady displaying unbecoming behaviour is a
disgrace to the community.]
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Sefako, take your
seat. Yes, hon member, on what point are you rising?
Ms B ENGELBRECHT: Hon Chair, I rise on a point of order: The hon
member needs to withdraw that. That is a sexist remark and as a
woman I object to it in strongest terms. [Interjections.] He needs
to withdraw that. Otherwise it must be referred to the Human Rights
Commission. [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, we will
refer to Hansard to make a proper ruling on this matter.
Ms B ENGELBRECHT: No, hon Chair, he knew you heard exactly what he
said! [Interjections.] Then I want this referred to the Rules
Committee and I want it to be referred to the Human Rights
Commission, please. [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): I will refer to
Hansard. I will look into the matter, hon member. Thanks. Hon
member, let‟s allow the hon member to continue with the debate. Hon
Sefako?
Rre O SEFAKO: Fa go na le puso e e kileng ya tokafatsa matshelo a
batho, ke puso eo e e eteletsweng pele ke ANC. Re na le metsi, fa mo
pusong ya maloba, go ne go tsamaiwa sekgala, go rwelwe kgamelo mo
tlhogong. Go ne go gelelwa kwa molapong o o tletseng dikuduntwana.
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Re bona kago tsa dintlo tseo go senang puso e e kileng ya aga dintlo
tseo di tshwanang le tseo di agilweng ke ANC. Mo nakong eno, le bana
ba na le dipalangwa go ya kwa dikolong. Tshotlego ya mo dipolasing,
fao re neng re bona bana ba tsamaya sekgala se seleele e fedile.
Puso e tlisitse dipalangwa. Ke ka fao re reng go ANC, re a go
leboga. Tota re tshwanela go leboga fa bomme ba kgona le go bula
diakhaonto kwa dibankeng. Ke puso ya ANC e e kgonneng go le golola
mo bokgobeng - tota le bona bomme ba basweu.
Ke ka ntlha ya bagaka bao ba kileng ba tsholola madi go lwela
kgololosego. Ke kopa gore e re go ja maungo a kgololosego, re seka
ra kgarakgaratswa ke kgora, mme re nne re gopole gore bagaka ba
latlhegetswe ke matshelo a bona. Bagaka ba tshwana le bo Chris Hani.
Re a re bao ba nnileng le seabe mo losong la gagwe ba tshwanela ke
gore ba bolele kwa dikgolegelong. Ke a leboga. [Legofi.]
(Translation of Setswana paragraphs follows.)
[Mr O SEFAKO: If there is a government that improved people‟s lives,
it is the ANC-led government. We have water, whereas in the
apartheid era, you had to walk a distance in order to get water,
with a water drum on your head, to fetch water from contaminated
rivers. We have houses; no other government has ever built houses
that are the same as the ones built by the ANC. At this moment,
children are transported to schools, even the ones from the farms.
That is the reason we are grateful to the ANC. Women, white women
included, can now open accounts at the banks – thanks to the ANC.
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We have attained freedom at the cost of the lives of our heroes.
Lest we forget the heroes such as Chris Hani. We are saying to those
who killed him: Rot in jail. Thank you. [Applause.]]
Mr N MALOYI (North West): Hon Acting Chairperson, hon Minister, MECs
present here, permanent and special delegates, distinguished guests,
ladies and gentlemen, the Second World War caused trauma amongst
many nations of the world and as a consequence in 1948 the UN
General Assembly adopted the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
It was felt that that was not enough, and it was against that
background that on 10 December the declaration was adopted by all
nations of the world.
In addition to the declaration there were other human rights
instruments such as covenants on civil, political, economic, social
and cultural rights. Hon members, because all of us are South
Africans, we will recall that on 21 March 1960, communities across
the country embarked on protest actions against the pass laws and in
Sharpeville, 69 protesters were massacred by the apartheid regime.
This of course was a serious human rights violation. The country and
the world were shocked.
As a consequence the ANC-led government declared 21 March a Human
Rights Day to commemorate and honour those who fought for our
freedom which we all enjoy today. Our Bill of Rights emphasises the
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following: Equality, human right, human dignity, freedom of
movement, language, culture and the right to life.
There are many achievements for human rights since the attainment of
our democracy. We have enacted human rights laws and put in place
mechanisms such as the Human Rights Commission to monitor and at
times enforce the law.
There are few nations today in the world that can boast a record of
democracy, fair treatment and harmonious blending together of people
of different racial backgrounds than South Africa. Our record of
achievement in integrating our nation into a very harmonious and
united people from all racial groups is something of which all of us
can immensely be proud and something to which all of us have made a
special contribution.
Celebration of achievements is essential, but it cannot be enough.
We must also recognise and acknowledge our challenges. This is part
of knowing our history as a whole, knowing the full truth and not
some selective version of it. Knowing the past is necessary for
knowing the present and planning for the future.
What business can succeed if past performances are not objectively
examined and analysed, weaknesses identified and addressed and
strengths reinforced? If this exercise is not done, the business
will soon be stagnant and then go bankrupt. If we do not subject our
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history to the same critical analysis, we will soon find ourselves
intellectually stagnant and morally bankrupt as a nation.
There have been persistent human rights violations by some amongst
us, based on race, gender, sexual orientation, educational
background etc. Our most significant challenge as a nation seems to
have racial basis.
Racism is a continuing stain that has discredited much of our
history and continues to infect our present. The current racist
episodes have caused great damage to many of our fellow South
Africans. In recent months the number of complaints of racial
discrimination has reached record levels. Black people and Africans
in particular are being abused on social platforms, assaulted on the
streets, illegally evicted from white-owned farms and unfairly
treated in institutions of learning. The justification for these
serious human rights violations is that these individuals are
exercising their freedom of speech. Hon members, a debate on matters
of public importance is acceptable, provided it is fair, truthful,
sensitive and tolerant.
Let me advice hon members who are making noise. Those of you who
tried to justify their racist behaviour, let me tell you that a
debate requires logic, facts and rational argument. [Applause.] What
we have experienced is not a debate but pure racism from yourselves.
[Interjections.]
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Observing anniversaries, celebrating achievements and acknowledging
our challenges will be meaningless unless accompanied by a
commitment to the future. We all have a responsibility to change the
present and together create a just and peaceful future for our
country.
We must all ensure that our human rights are fully respected,
protected and promoted. We must all enjoy freedom of movement,
equality, human dignity, cultural and linguistic rights and a right
to life as enshrined in our Constitution. [Interjections.]
Let me conclude by quoting Lily Tomlin who said, “The road to
success is always under construction.” Thank you, very much.
[Applause.]
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Hon Acting House Chairperson, I just want
to put it straight that the ANC is the last party to talk about
human rights. You are the last party to talk about human rights.
Today the debate is about human rights; yet you cannot ignore the
fact that the South African government led by the Guptas aided
President Al-Bashir to sneak and escape out of this country. When he
was ruled by the courts for the worst grave atrocities the Gupta
government sneaked him out. That is pathetic. For you, hon Dlamini
and hon Maloyi, human right is completely contrary to what you have
just said. You do not know it. Change must start with you and not
with the other person.
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana,
address hon members through the Chair.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: When you are pointing there the other
fingers are pointing at you. [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana,
address hon members through the Chair.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Yes, thank you Chair.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay proceed, hon
member.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: I just want to set the record straight;
you must read so that you do not live in a pool of pandemonium. Read
the Sowetan dated 28 January 2016, hon Zwane and hon Minister
Zokwana, and you will know that the farmworkers in the Western Cape
are well paid other than in all other provinces. [Applause.]
An HON MALE MEMBER: Not R23,00.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Hon ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON, South
Africans have a constitutional right to an environment that is not
harmful to their health or wellbeing and which supports socially
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justifiable development in addition to their right to access basic
water and sanitation.
At the current state of the drought, the government is not providing
all South Africans assistance to access their rights to water. About
14,1 million of South Africans are currently predisposed to hunger
and malnutrition, with the dam levels dropping from 87% in 2015 to
57% in 2016. The current Stage 4 Drought phase we are facing occurs
when the economic demand for goods exceeds the supply as a result of
a weather-related shortfall in water supply.
Hon Minister Zokwana, agriculture is already feeling the full
effects of the drought. In a total debt average of R117 billion
since November 2015, tree plantations along with animals and sugar
fields are dying due to malnutrition and thirst. The loss of land
and livestock is receiving no assistance or advice on how to deal
with the drought. The Minister needs to put the infrastructure; and
I am sure you have already started maybe with the permission of the
Guptas.
The maize production is decreasing, less than 30% of the maize had
been planted; and the planting season has passed. Maize is a stable
diet to the poor South Africans and the main source of energy for
animal feeds. The smaller harvest will lead to higher prices and the
need to import maize into the country will also increase by 10% in
2016, and that will double the inflation rate.
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The agriculture sector provides 7% of the formal employment and
contributes about 12% of the gross domestic product, GDP. With the
current state of the economy and the weak currency that South Africa
is facing since the Gupta‟s decisions, South Africans do not need
all these job losses.
Basic education is hurt; learners in quintile 1, 2 and 3 schools
cannot focus in the classrooms. Surely the government needs to
provide food and food can only be cooked with water.
On my visit to the Eastern Cape, the communities of Ikhwezi Lokusa
in Lady Frere which is in desperation of water, travel to the
boreholes as no bulk water is being supplied, yet the Minister of
Water and Sanitation, Nomvula Mokonyane, promised bulk water and
keeps on saying that we are not in a crisis. Shame on her!
Overall, the finance Minister, Pravin Gordhan, told us that, and I
quote, “Drought is an absolute priority for us. As Cabinet, we take
this matter very seriously.” While the President was here in
November 2015, an oral question was posed to him about the drought,
and in response he laughed off the matter. This is no laughing stalk
matter, it must be taken seriously. And I am sure the pool in
Nkandla is full of water. [Laughter.] They are not desperate.
Thus in addition to the call by my colleague, hon Beyers Smit, for
this vital debate in the Council today - which highlights an
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imminent food security threat to South Africa - the DA calls on the
Gupta government to declare the drought, in accordance with the
National Disaster Management Act, a national disaster. It is sad
that the ANC ...
... yambethe iimfele zengcuka, yingcuka eyambethe iimfele zegusha.
[... is in a wolf‟s skin, is a wolf in a sheep‟s skin.]
Oh, it is sad.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: Hon Acting House Chairperson, on a point
of order.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, can you
take your seat, there is a ...!
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: ... question?
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Yes, hon Chief Whip,
what is your point of order?
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: Hon Acting House Chairperson, the point
of order is: We must not mislead the people of this country. There
is no Gupta government in this country. [Interjections.]
An HON MALE MEMBER: Ask the Deputy Minister Mcebisi Jonas!
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Thank you, hon Chief
Whip. Proceed, hon Mpambo-Sibhukwana.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Can I say it moved ... I noticed it moved
... [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): You can proceed. That
is the rule of the Chair, you can proceed.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Hon Acting House Chairperson, the Premier
of the Northern Cape used water to cook for people who were in
distress because of the drought and she bought Kentucky Fried
Chicken, KFC, for food relief to replace the water. [Interjections.]
I want to tell the pathetic ANC–led government that you sort your
own house first before you come to tell the people about water. If I
could just remind the ANC that dehydration is a direct after-effect
of drought and that the Gastrointestinal disease is caused by the
shortage of water in the immune system. And the most vulnerable
people suffering so much from this are those who are HIV-positive.
Mr J M MTHETHWA: Hon Acting House Chairperson, on a point of order.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Is there a question?
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member, yes. Can I
hear you, Hon Mthethwa, what is your point of order? On what point
are you rising?
Mr J M MTHETHWA: Hon Chair, I would like to ask the hon member a
question.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Oh, you would like to
ask the hon member a question. Hon Mapambo-Sibhukwana, are you
willing to take a question?
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: I will take a question when the dams are
full of water. [Applause.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay. The hon member is
not willing to take a question. Can you proceed and wrap up hon
member, your speaking time is finished.
Icacile into yokuba ngeli xesha i-ANC ... [It is clear that at this
time the ANC...]
... also needs moral regeneration to be effected together with moral
ethics. I would like to say to the Western Cape representatives of
the ANC, ...
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... inyaniso mayithethwe kuba niyayazi ukuba nisengxakini ooGupta
bayanithathela izigqibo. [... truth must be told because you know
that you are in a problem because Guptas make decisions on your
behalf.]
I would like to say, water is a basic right. It is a basic right,
hon Ximbi. [Applause.]
Mr M RAYI: Hon Acting Chairperson ...
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): I am not willing to
take a point of order because hon Rayi just took the podium now. On
what point hon?
Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, I just want clarity if the member is a
member of the EFF?
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms S J Mohai): Okay, can you ...
Mr W F FABER: I am not sure.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms S J Mohai): Okay, thank you very
much, hon. Hon Rayi?
Mr M RAYI: Hon Minister, hon Chief Whip, hon MECs from our provinces
and a special delegates, leadership of SA Local Government
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Association, Salga, hon members. Quoting Steve Biko referring to the
black collaborators had this to say: “Being black is not a matter of
pigmentation - being black is a reflection of a mental attitude”. He
went on to say, “the most potent weapon in the hands of the
oppressor is the mind of the oppressed.”
Chair, before I go to the speech, I want to deal with some of the
issues that had been raised here. People talk about massacres. They
forget that in their own houses, they have people that massacred our
people. Currently in the DA, you have a councillor called Sam
Pienaar, who was a colonel in the apartheid army, who killed our
people in what was called a Trojan Horse Massacre, which
commemorated its 30th Anniversary in November. [Interjections.]
Ms C LABUSCHAGNE: Chair, on a point of order! [Interjections.] Omar
al-Bashir killed a lot of people and he is part of your party.
The ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Take our seat, hon Rayi!
[Interjections.]
Mr M RAYI: The IFP which is not here, also talks about massacres
here, Marikana Massacres. They forget that they killed students at
Ongoye in 1983. They think that we have forgotten about those
issues. Now, there is this talk about Gupta. Hon Blade Nzimande,
when we had the joint sitting ...
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Rayi, can you take
your seat? On what point are you rising, hon Faber?
Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, would you protect me? This members ...
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): You are protected. Can
you make your point on what? Is it a point of order or?
Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, I can‟t hear myself. Think when these
members are not giving me that; you should protect me when I want to
make a point of order.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member? Hon Ximbi
and hon Terblanche? Yes, please ... Yes, hon?
Mr W F FABER: Chair, I just want to state it again, one of the
speakers is again talking about you the apartheid government. Now,
again I want to say I don‟t see hon Charel de Beer here.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay.
Mr W F FABER: There is none of us here who was part of the National
Party. So, I just want to make that very clear.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Is that a point of
order? Take your seat! Thanks. Proceed, hon Rayi.
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Mr M RAYI: Hon Chair, you know, hon Nzimande, when we had the joint
sitting, he was a sweeper for the ANC. He read a letter from the
then leader of the DA, who is the Premier of the Western Cape,
thanking the Guptas for donating billions to the DA. [Applause.] To
date, the Premier of the Western Cape has not disputed that. That
letter was signed by her, her own signature. To date, that has not
been disputed. So, the members of the DA must go back and ask hon
Helen.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Rayi, just take
your seat. Hon Mackenzie, on what are you rising?
Mr MACKENZIE: Chairperson, I am allowed to address this House
because the member‟s now... I can‟t hear myself?
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): No, no, I can hear you.
Mr MACKENZIE: Can you hear me, Chairperson?
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Yes, I can hear you.
Mr MACKENZIE: The member is misleading the House. Secondly, there is
no state capture in the Western Cape.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): On what point are you
rising?
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Mr MACKENZIE: Unlike in the national Departments.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay, just a general
comment, there is nothing like that. Can you proceed, hon member?
Mr M RAYI: No, may I ask hon Mackenzie to go back to the legislature
and ask this question to her own premier whether this has actually
happened for it is in her own signature. [Applause.] So, we ask you
to ask oral question when you go back to your legislature.
[Interjections.]
Going back to the speech, I wanted just to clarify those issues,
Chair. [Interjections.] Sixty-one years ago, the people of South
Africa gathered in Kliptown to adopt the Freedom Charter - a
document that pronounced that South Africa belongs to all who live
in it, black and white, and that no government can justly claim
authority unless it is based on the will of all the people. I want
to emphasise that South Africa belongs to all who live in it,
including the Western Cape. Nobody is going to tell us that our
children cannot come to the Western Cape, especially people who were
happy when they were called Europeans in South Africa, in Africa,
but they have guts to tell us that our children cannot come and
learn in the Western Cape, which is part of South Africa that
belongs to all who live in it. [Applause.]
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It is important to always remind members of the opposition that the
ANC was at the centre of crafting, inspiring and bringing to
operation the Constitution.
The Constitution contains all the clauses adopted in the ANC
conferences such as ready to govern documents and the constitutional
guidelines.
Before 1994, South Africa never had a Bill of Rights, which
guaranteed the fundamental principle of democracy, nonracialism and
nonsexism. The ANC‟s proposal on the Bill of Rights provides that
South Africa will be a multiparty democracy enjoying fundamental
rights that are universally recognised in a range of international
treaties and documents.
The ANC went on to say that the Bill of Rights would be a victory
for all people of South Africa in that after decades of struggle and
sacrifice, they will have guarantees that will ensure the
elimination of oppression, discrimination, inequality and division.
The Constitution shall prohibit racial, gender and all other forms
of discrimination and shall promote racial and gender equality and
national unity.
Hon Acting Chairperson, the basic objectives of the ANC policy are
fourfold: Firstly, to strive for achievement of the right of all
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South Africans as a whole to political and economic selfdetermination in a united South Africa.
Secondly, to overcome the legacy of inequality and injustice created
by colonialism and apartheid, in a swift, progressive and principled
way.
Thirdly, to develop a sustainable economy and state infrastructure
that will progressively improve the quality of life of all South
Africans.
Finally, to encourage the flourishing of the feeling that South
Africa belongs to all who live in it, to promote a common loyalty
and pride in the country and to create a universal sense of freedom
and security within its borders.
Hon Acting Chairperson, on 21 March 2016, we will be observing the
Human Rights Day commemorating the 1960 Sharpeville Massacre; this
was an incident when unarmed people who were protesting against the
carrying of humiliating and discriminatory passbook, also referred
to as “dompas”. [Interjections.]
This day is now also observed by the United Nations, UN. Chair, I am
being drowned. Can you please protect me?
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The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon members, please
allow hon member ...
Mr M RAYI: These members that we fought this liberation for to
liberate ...
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Rayi, when I speak,
you also must observe, you must listen to the Chair. Hon members,
lets grant an opportunity for the hon member to express himself in
the true nature of this House. Voices must be heard of hon member
debating. Can you proceed, hon Rayi? [Interjections.] No, I am not
taking any point of order. Can you take your seat? Proceed, hon
Rayi. [Interjections.] Proceed, hon Rayi.
Mr M RAYI: This day is now also observed by the UN and has been
declared International Day for the Elimination of Racial
Discrimination. It is for this reason that the ANC urges all South
Africans to commemorate this Human Rights Day actively, by attending
many events around the country, and not just watching TV or go
shopping. This freedom was not free.
Today, we can confirm without any hesitation that the ANC changed
the lives of every South African. It gave us all hope that after
decades of suffering, struggle and sacrifice, our lives could be
transformed.
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We have passed a democratic Constitution. The IFP boycotted
negotiations. Now, the IFP comes here and talk about the
Constitution which negotiation they boycotted. Some of those parties
that participated in the negotiation, all they wanted were minority
rights and cultural rights. That‟s all they were there for. So,
therefore, this Constitution contains all of it, in terms of the
Bill of Rights. If you compare the Bill of Rights with the Ready to
Govern and the Constitutional guidelines of the ANC, just if you
have a chance, members of the DA, you will find that all the clauses
that are in the Constitution come directly from the documents that
were adopted in the conferences of the ANC. [Interjections.]
We have passed a constitution and many laws which protect our
people‟s rights. Millions of people have moved into new homes and
been provided with running water and electricity. They have been
able to see their children receive education and have been given
access to better health care and other basic human rights
This Human Rights Debate whose focus is on water and drought is
taking place during National Water Week, which was launched on 14
March 2016 and will end on 22 March 2016, coinciding with the World
Water Day.
The Mangaung Conference held in 2012 noted the following: Water is a
scarce commodity and that in the near future, we will be faced with
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the challenge of water shortages. This is what the ANC projected
even in 2012.
So, it knew about this challenge. That there have been efforts made
by government to ensure that we preserve water, also produce clean
and quality water. The conference resolved that we must implement
policy by reviewing the current legislation to facilitate the
removal of unused and inequitable allocations from entitlement
holders in order to ensure more equitable distribution of water.
There is a need to deal with the abolishment of water trading and
changing the funding model for the development and maintenance of
infrastructure. The need for further exploration of conservation
initiatives, including restriction on the number of golf courses in
a particular radius as these tend to use up too much water that is
not paid for at a fair price. You know those who use golf courses.
We must continue to develop small dams, especially in rural areas as
part of water conservation. We must urgently provide every household
with quality clean water, which is in the short term, may include
portable purification tanks and water tanks to rain water harvesting
to promote food security. This is what the resolution in Mangaung
says. This resolution became part of our Election Manifesto of
taking South Africa forward.
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 115 of 139
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon member,
unfortunately your speaking time has expired.
Mr M RAYI: Thank you, Chair. [Applause.]
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: House Chair,
during the Second World War, one of the Ministers distinguished
himself in designing theories detailing the ability to tell a big
lie. When you tell a big lie, you have to tell it so often that
people believe that there is no truth. It is like that, but I can
assure you that the burden of defending apartheid and its filth can
only be done by the unwise and frivolous nincompoops who forget
their background and believe that the world begins at the point of
coming to power. [Applause.] They can be proud to shield it because
the people of De Doorns will tell the story that they are paid with
liquor in the Western Cape. I invite you Mr Mackenzie, go there with
me and you will see with your eyes.
People who tell lies will say that I am a farmer. Let me today say
that I own no farm. [Applause.]
Mr O S TERBLANCHE: Chairperson, I rise on a point of order. May I
just allow the hon Minister that the DA was never the apartheid
government and just last week ...
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 116 of 139
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr J S Mohai): You are making a
statement hon member; it is not a point of order. Let us allow the
Minister to proceed.
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: I repeat that,
people who have been trained to tell lies will study google when the
truth is before them. I repeat that I invite the DA members to
travel with me to De Doorns. They will see people who are paid with
liquor by their own employers. Shame on you when you are black and
have been oppressed, today you stand before us and say that the DA
is clean. The DA is not clean; it is a remnant of the past
government. You are like a rat that has eaten [Interjections.] I
want to say that people who are members of the DA have a burden of
defending the untruth. I am saying this because when you come here
in Cape Town, you will see the real farm workers who are paid with
liquor.
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Hon Minister. Yes hon
member, I do recognise you. On what point are you rising? I am not
referring to you hon Mackenzie, this is not how you address the
House seated. You rise and raise your hand to call for a point of
order. Hon Mackenzie, please take your seat.
Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Chairperson, I would like to ask the
Minister a question if there is increment on the [Inaudible] April
for the farm workers since is the beginning of the financial year.
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 117 of 139
THE ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Okay. Minister, are you
willing to respond to the question? Take your seat hon member.
Please understand that the Rules allow you to raise a question. You
are asking the intention to raise a question to the Minister and he
would like to proceed with the statement.
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: I am
embarrassed by a person who claims to know agriculture and yet he
does not understand the different beeste [cattle]. In cattle you‟ve
got two forms sir. You‟ve got the start, which is a first class and
commercial cattle. So, if you don‟t know that you will come and say
here there is no science. Agriculture is science and you must
understand it. I can tell you that my workers are earning R2400. I
can give you my address, I own no farm, and I am a mere commercial
farmer. So, the DA has got nothing to tell this country. They should
be ashamed of themselves to defend what is indefensible. You belong
to a party that claims that you are the best and yet you don‟t see
people who are standing next to you.
I repeat that those people who don‟t know where they come from and
where they are going, they are a shame to this country. I can tell
you sir that the reason you have left Limpopo to be in Western Cape
is because of your behaviour. The reason you are here to be a
refugee in the Western Cape, is because of your behaviour.
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 118 of 139
Mr D L XIMBI: I rise on a point of order that the DA is making a lot
of noise. They are trying to defend. I‟m in a possession of a letter
from Hellen Zille giving money to Guptas. I‟ve got that letter
signed by Zille. [Interjections.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Take your seat. It is
not a point of order.
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: Lastly, I want
to tell the DA to tell their Madam...
MR C HATTINGH: Hon Chair, I rise on a point order that the hon
Minister is misleading the House, accusing me from coming from
Limpopo. [Laughter.]
The MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, FORESTRY AND FISHERIES: I withdraw, you
are from North West, not Limpopo and the reason you are here is
because of reasons well known to you. Lastly, the DA is busy trying
to get the control of the [Interjections.] The truth is that he who
pays the piper calls the tune. The DA in the Western Cape wants to
control sea harbours and I want to say as long as the ANC governs,
you will control no harbours for your white friends. We will not
allow the DA to shield the untruth. We live with you and we know
what you are doing. We destroyed no harbours. In the Western Cape
black people constitute 1% of small-scaled farmers. Those of my
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 119 of 139
colour should be ashamed to be saying what they are saying when
their own people are being a cent.
In closing I would like to say this debate was so good but those who
tried to tell a lie don‟t even believe it themselves because they
know that they are lying. [Applause.]
The ACTING HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr S J Mohai): Thank you very much hon
Minister. I would like to make this announcement. Hon members are
requested to remain behind for a briefing on the follow-up visit to
Oudtshoorn. I would also want to thank and appreciate the Minister
Zokwana, MEC Qoboshiyane and all special and permanent delegates for
valuable contributions to this very important debate on Human
Rights. Also wish all members well during the Easter holidays.
Debate concluded.
The Council adjourned at 17:25.
__________
ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS
WEDNESDAY, 16 MARCH 2016
ANNOUNCEMENTS
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 120 of 139
National Council of Provinces
The Chairperson
1.
Message from National Assembly to National Council of Provinces in respect of Bills
passed by Assembly and transmitted to Council
(1)
Bill passed by National Assembly and transmitted for concurrence on 16 March 2016:
(a)
Division of Revenue Bill [B 2 – 2016] (National Assembly – sec 76).
The Bill has been referred to the Select Committee on Appropriations of the
National Council of Provinces.
TABLINGS
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces
1.
The Minister of Finance
(a)
Strategic Plan of the Office of the Tax Ombud for 2016-2021.
(a)
Strategic Plan of the Independent Regulatory Board for Auditors (IRBA) for 2016/17 –
2018/19
2.
The Minister of Sport and Recreation
17 MARCH 2016
3.
PAGE: 121 of 139
(a)
Strategic Plan of Boxing South Africa for 2015/16 – 2019/2020.
(b)
Annual Performance Plan of Boxing South Africa for 2016/17.
The Minister of Transport
(a)
Strategic Plan of the South African Maritime Safety Authority (SAMSA) for 2015/16 –
2020.
(b)
Annual Performance Plan of the South African Maritime Safety Authority (SAMSA) for
2016/2017.
COMMITTEE REPORTS
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces
Please see pages 30-44 of the ATCs.
National Council of Provinces
1. Report of the Select Committee on Finance on the Revenue Laws Amendment Bill [B4B 2016] (National Assembly- section 77), dated 16 March 2016.
1.
Introduction
17 MARCH 2016
1.1
PAGE: 122 of 139
The Revenue Laws Amendment Bill [B4 - 2016] was introduced by the Minister of Finance on
24 February 2016. The Bill is a money Bill as contemplated in section 77 of the Constitution.
The purpose of the Bill is to postpone certain provisions in respect of the annuitisation of
retirement benefits for provident funds and to correct provisions dealing with the calculation of
deductions in respect of contributions to defined benefit retirement funds.
2.
Public involvement
2.1
The Select Committee on Finance and the Standing Committee on Finance held public hearings
on 3 March 2016. Written submissions were received from the following:
•
Association of Savings and Investment SA (ASISA)
•
Bowman Gilfillan
•
COSATU
•
NUMSA
•
Mr. A Crawford
•
Cashkows.com
•
Business Unity South Africa (BUSA)
2.2
Oral submissions were received from the following:
•
ASISA
•
COSATU
•
NUMSA
3.
Committees’ observations and deliberations
17 MARCH 2016
3.1
PAGE: 123 of 139
The harmonisation of pension funds, retirement annuities and provident funds is necessary to
ensure equal and fair treatment in respect of taxation and access to benefits at retirement. The
concern raised by the labour unions is on the requirement of members of provident funds to
annuitise two-thirds of their retirement benefits. However, this process has to take account of
the lower life expectancy of low income workers compared to other income strata; and that
annuitisation could prevent workers from bequeathing to their beneficiaries effectively. It is
therefore imperative that a holistic approach is taken in respect of retirement funding reform,
including meaningful consultation with all stakeholders.
3.2
The Committee endeavoured to secure a compromise between the concerns from organised
labour who maintain that the piecemeal reform process is detrimental to their members and
wanted a removal of the clauses referring to annuitisation altogether; and National Treasury’s
position that the annuitisation provisions be deferred for 2 years.
The Committee also took into account the needs of the industry for certainty in the reform
process, which impacts on investment in systems to comply with the legislation. The outcome
is a form of “conditional deferment” – the deferment is agreed to but there are conditions
requiring National Treasury to concertedly negotiate with organised labour and other relevant
parties over the next two years to seek a consensus on the contested provisions.
3.3
Furthermore, retirement funding reform must also take into account that the design of
annuitisation by provident funds must not undermine the current accepted (and recommended)
practices in the rest of the retirement industry, particular for pension funds and retirement
annuities. In this regard the scope for the practice of taking advantage of the differences in tax
and annuitisation benefits between pension funds, retirement annuities and provident funds by
transferring funds between these must be reduced.
17 MARCH 2016
3.4
PAGE: 124 of 139
Pursuant to the above, both National Treasury and COSATU agree to further constructive
engagements. National Treasury further commits to engage with other stakeholders who are not
part of Nedlac.
4.
Recommendations
4.1
The Committee therefore recommends that:
a)
The comprehensive social security reforms paper shall be tabled at the National Economic
Development Labour Council (NEDLAC) established in terms of the National Economic
Development and Labour Council Act, 1994 (Act 35 of 1994) for consideration within 3
months of the promulgation of the Bill.
b)
Issues for deliberations in NEDLAC will include:
•
The appropriate package of government social security measures; and
•
Retirement fund reforms.
c)
National Treasury must report on progress on negotiations to the Committee every quarter.
d)
The Minister of Finance must submit written reports every six months to Parliament regarding
the progress on the consultations at NEDLAC. The Minister must submit the first report to
Parliament before 15 December 2016; and, provide a second report by 15 June 2017.
e)
All participants in the process at NEDLAC commit to actively participate in the deliberations.
f)
Should annuitisation be scrapped altogether the tax deductions for provident fund members will
cease.
g)
Notwithstanding the consultations taking place at NEDLAC, the Minister shall provide all
persons the opportunity to make representations on the issues being deliberated at NEDLAC.
17 MARCH 2016
h)
PAGE: 125 of 139
The National Treasury should also engage stakeholders that are not represented at NEDLAC.
The Select Committee on Finance, having considered and examined the Revenue Laws Amendment
Bill [B4B - 2016] (National Assembly- section 77), referred to it, and classified by the JTM as a
section 77 Bill, reports the Bill without amendments.
The Democratic Alliance (DA) reserves its position on this report.
Report to be considered.
THURSDAY, 17 MARCH 2016
ANNOUNCEMENTS
National Assembly
The Speaker
1.
Introduction of Bills
(1)
The Portfolio Committee on Home Affairs
(a)
Immigration Amendment Bill [B 5 – 2016] (National Assembly – proposed sec 75)
[Explanatory summary of Bill and prior notice of its introduction published in
Government Gazette No 39501 of 11 December 2015.]
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 126 of 139
Bill initiated by the Portfolio Committee on Home Affairs of the National
Assembly, and referred to the Joint Tagging Mechanism (JTM) for classification in
terms of Joint Rule 160.
In terms of Joint Rule 154 written views on the classification of the Bill may be
submitted to the JTM. The Bill may only be classified after the expiry of at least
three parliamentary working days since introduction.
TABLINGS
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces
1.
The Minister of Communications
(a)
Strategic Plan for 2016/17 – 2019/20 of the Film and Publication Board and the Annual
Performance Plan for 2016 - 2017.
2.
The Minister of Environmental Affairs
(a)
Government Notice No R 186, published in Government Gazette No 39705, dated 17
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Childs Bank Marine
Protected Area, in terms of sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(b)
General Notice No 2, published in Government Gazette No 39728, dated 25 February
2016: Amendment of Schedule 2 of the Act by replacing the information contained in
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 127 of 139
Schedule 2, in terms of section 20(6)(b) of the National Environmental Management:
Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(c)
General Notice No 2, published in Government Gazette No 39739, dated 26 February
2016: Intention to declare certain land situated in the Eastern Cape Province as part of
Addo Elephant National Park, under section 20(1)(a)(i) read with section 33(1) of the
National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(d)
General Notice No 20, published in Government Gazette No 39620, dated 25 January 2016:
Bioprospecting Permit Application submitted by the University of Pretoria, under
regulation 7 read with regulation 31(2) of the Bioprospecting, Access and Benefit-Sharing
Amendments Regulations, 2015, and Chapter 6 of the National Environmental
Management: Biodiversity Act, 2004 (Act No 10 of 2004).
(e)
Government Notice No R 92, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Port Elizabeth Corals Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(f)
Government Notice No R 93, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Benguela Bank Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
(g)
PAGE: 128 of 139
Government Notice No R 94, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Isimangaliso Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(h)
Government Notice No R 95, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Agulhas Front Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(i)
Government Notice No R 96, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Browns Bank Corals Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(j)
Government Notice No R 97, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Agulhas Front Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(k)
Government Notice No R 98, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Browns Bank Complex Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
(l)
PAGE: 129 of 139
Government Notice No R 99, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Namaqua Fossil Forest
Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(m)
Government Notice No R 100, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Protea Banks Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(n)
Government Notice No R 101, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Port Elizabeth Corals Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(o)
Government Notice No R 102, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Agulhas Bank Complex
Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(p)
Government Notice No R 103, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Uthukela Banks Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
(q)
PAGE: 130 of 139
Government Notice No R 104, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Orange Shelf Edge Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(r)
Government Notice No R 105, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Benguela Bank Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and
86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act,
2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(s)
Government Notice No R 106, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Agulhas Bank Complex Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(t)
Government Notice No R 107, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Aliwal Shoal Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(u)
Government Notice No R 108, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Uthukela Banks Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
(v)
PAGE: 131 of 139
Government Notice No R 109, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Notice declaring the Amathole Offshore Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(w)
Government Notice No R 110, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Aliwal Shoal Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(x)
Government Notice No R 111, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Agulhas Muds Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(y)
Government Notice No R 112, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Agulhas Muds Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(z)
Government Notice No R 113, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Amathole Offshore Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 132 of 139
(aa) Government Notice No R 114, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Addo Elephant Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(bb) Government Notice No R 115, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Browns Bank Corals Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(cc) Government Notice No R 116, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Addo Elephant Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(dd) Government Notice No R 117, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Browns Bank Corals Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(ee) Government Notice No R 118, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the iSimangaliso Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
(ff)
PAGE: 133 of 139
Government Notice No R 119, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Robben Island Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(gg) Government Notice No R 120, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Southwest Indian Seamount Marine Protected
Area, under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act,
2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(hh) Government Notice No R 121, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Southwest Indian Seamount
Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(ii)
Government Notice No R 122, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Robben Island Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(jj)
Government Notice No R 123, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Southeast Atlantic Seamount
Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 134 of 139
(kk) Government Notice No R 124, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Southeast Atlantic Seamount Marine Protected
Area, under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act,
2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(ll)
Government Notice No R 125, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Namaqua National Park
Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(mm) Government Notice No R 126, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Namaqua Fossil Forest Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(nn) Government Notice No R 127, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Namaqua National Park Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(oo) Government Notice No R 128, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Protea Banks Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 135 of 139
(pp) Government Notice No R 129, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Orange Shelf Edge Marine Protected Area,
under section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003
(Act No 57 of 2003).
(qq) Government Notice No R 130, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Benguela Muds Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(rr)
Government Notice No R 131, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Browns Bank Complex
Marine Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(ss)
Government Notice No R 132, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Benguela Muds Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
(tt)
Government Notice No R 133, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Agulhas Front Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 136 of 139
(uu) Government Notice No R 134, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Regulations for the Management of the Cape Canyon Marine
Protected Area, under sections 48A(2) and 86(1)(a), (b), (c) and (d) of the National
Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act No 57 of 2003).
(vv) Government Notice No R 135, published in Government Gazette No 39646, dated 3
February 2016: Draft Notice declaring the Cape Canyon Marine Protected Area, under
section 22A of the National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Act, 2003 (Act
No 57 of 2003).
3.
The Minister of Justice and Correctional Services
(a)
Register of Debt Collectors submitted to Parliament on 17 March 2016, in terms of
section 12(2)(d) of the Debt Collectors Act, 1998 (Act No 114 of 1998).
COMMITTEE REPORTS
National Council of Provinces
1. Report of the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources on the invitation by the
Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries to nominate candidates to serve on the National
Agricultural Marketing Council (NAMC), dated 01 March 2016.
The Select Committee, having received the invitation from the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and
Fisheries to nominate candidates to serve as Members of the National Agricultural Marketing Council
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 137 of 139
in accordance with Section 4 (4) (a) of the Marketing of Agricultural Products Act, (Act No. 47 of
1996) as amended by Acts No. 59 of 1997 and No. 52 of 2001, referred to it on 14 August 2014,
reports as follows:
On 17 September 2014, the Select Committee requested an extension from the Minister of Agriculture,
Forestry and Fisheries to enable the Committee to nominate suitable candidates to serve on the
National Agricultural Marketing Council (NAMC).
The Select Committee, has to date, received no response for the extension to deal with the Ministers
request and therefore reports that the Committee is unable to conclude its deliberations on the matter
referred to it.
Report to be considered
2. Report of the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources on the invitation by the
Minister of Finance to nominate candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank
Board, dated 01 March 2016
The Select Committee, having received the invitation from the Minister of Finance to nominate
candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank Board, in terms of the Land &
Agricultural Development Act, 2002 (Act No 15 of 2002), referred to it on 1 April 2015, reports as
follows:
The closing date for submission of candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank
Board was the week of 13 – 17 April 2015, the same week all delegates of the NCOP were engaged
17 MARCH 2016
PAGE: 138 of 139
with the Taking Parliament to the People programme in the Eden District Municipality, Oudtshoorn,
Western Cape.
The Select Committee on Land & Mineral Resources reports that, in the absence of an extension of the
deadline for the Committee to deal with the Ministers’ request for the nomination of suitable
candidates to be considered for appointment on the Land Bank Board, in terms of the Land and
Agricultural Development Act, 2002 (Act No 15 of 2002), reports that the Committee was unable to
conclude the matter placed before it.
Report to be considered
3. Report of the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources on the invitation by the
Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries to nominate candidates to serve on the National
Agricultural Marketing Council (NAMC), dated 15 March 2016.
The Select Committee, having received the invitation from the Minister of Agriculture, Forestry and
Fisheries to nominate candidates to serve as Members of the National Agricultural Marketing Council
in accordance with Section 4 (4) (a) of the Marketing of Agricultural Products Act, (Act No. 47 of
1996) as amended by Acts No. 59 of 1997 and No. 52 of 2001, referred to it on 2 November 2015,
reports as follows:
On 15 March 2016, the Select Committee on Land and Mineral Resources having considered the
request for nominations, received only one nomination for the specified position.
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PAGE: 139 of 139
Due to insufficient time to deal with the matter, the Committee resolved that the Chairperson of the
Select Committee for Land and Mineral Resources considers the nomination received for submission
to the office of the Chairperson of the NCOP.
Report to be considered
Please see pages 56-196 of the ATCs.
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