Hansard: NCOP: Questions to the Deputy President, Kgalema Motlanthe ; Statement by the Minister of Sport and Recreation on the 2011 National Sport and Recreation Indaba

House: National Council of Provinces

Date of Meeting: 14 Nov 2011

Summary

No summary available.


Minutes

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TUESDAY, 15 NOVEMBER 2011

PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES

_________________________

The Council met at 14:04 in the Old Assembly Chamber.

The Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS – see col 0000.

NEW MEMBER

(Announcement)

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon members, I wish to announce that the vacancy which occurred in the National Council of Provinces owing to Mr Watty Watson moving to the National Assembly has been filled by the nomination of hon Velly Makasana Manzini, who is now a permanent delegate representing Mpumalanga. Hon member, you are welcomed in the National Council of Provinces. [Applause.]

Just for your information, I'm told that he's been a councillor and a member of the legislature and he is now a permanent delegate in the NCOP.

The hon member has made and subscribed the oath and affirmation today in my office.

QUESTION 13 - THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT

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ANNOUNCEMENT

Question 13:

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Chairperson, hon members, government has begun the process of engaging key stakeholders regarding the proposed youth wage subsidy. This consultation has occurred both through interactions with social partners in Nedlac, a process that began on 10 May 2011, and also within government.

Importantly, the Community Constituency within Nedlac, which represents the interests of community and youth formations, is engaging with the process. There have also been interactions with the National Youth Development Agency.

Discussions and engagements are ongoing and, alongside the public comments received on the discussion paper, they will inform a revised discussion document. In particular, the Community Constituency raised several concerns in a submission made to Nedlac.

The proposed youth employment incentive scheme does not focus on specific sectors or areas and is open to all employers who create additional jobs for young people. This provides administrative simplicity and allows the envisaged subsidy to be implemented on as large a scale as possible.

Given the current design of the youth employment incentive, and the fact that rural wages tend to be lower than urban wages, the incentive will, on average, lower the costs of hiring additional workers in rural areas and could, therefore, stimulate an increase in employment where economic activity takes place.

For administrative and operational simplicity, and to minimise potential abuse, employment subsidies tend to focus on formal and well-regulated sectors of the economy that can be closely monitored. An additional benefit of the youth employment incentive may be that it encourages informal enterprises to formalise in order to take advantage of the incentive. In the medium term, this broadens the country's tax base.

As the hon member is aware, industrial policy in South Africa includes the objective of expanding employment in labour-intensive sectors of the economy. Since the proposed wage subsidy aims to lower the costs for firms hiring additional young, inexperienced and less skilled individuals, the incentive will directly support job creation in labour-intensive industries and sectors of the economy.

The youth employment incentive scheme does not intend to promote the idea of premature exit of youths from the schooling system to seek employment and earn a wage.

Employment creation is the focus of the proposal. The incentive allows the private sector and government to share the costs of creating jobs in the economy. Firms will only be able to access the subsidy if they are creating additional jobs for young and inexperienced South Africans - that is net job creation.

They will be strongly advised against hiring learners who ought to complete secondary and other levels of education and training. Learners will also be encouraged not to sacrifice their studies in any way. The incentive targets a net rise in youth and overall employment and seeks to subsidise net new job creation.

It is our hope that this Nedlac process will indeed reach consensus, so that implementation of this subsidy can be effected. Thank you.

Ms N D NTWANAMBI

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THE DEPTUY PRESIDENT

IsiXhosa:

Nksz N D NTWANAMBI: Sihlalo, ndiyambulela uSekela-mongameli. Umbuzo wam olandelayo uthi: Njengokuba uninzi lwaba bantu batsha ingengobantu banamava, ingaba kule nkqubo baza kukhuthazwa na abaqeshi ukuba bancedise ngokubaqesha ukuze bafumane loo mava?

English:

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Thank you very much, hon member, yes indeed, the main purpose of this incentive scheme is to ensure that young people who have no work experience are able to gain such work experience, as well as job specific training in the sectors in which they may be so employed. Thank you.

Mr M J R DE VILLIERS

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr M J R DE VILLIERS: Chairperson, in connection with the wage subsidy, can the Deputy President tell us what role will be played by the different sector education and training authorities, Setas, in helping the unemployed youth?

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: The Setas are already in existence and they are also meant to assist young people who enter the work market. Of course, their purpose is really to provide the requisite resources for overall training of the workforce. As the hon member knows, productive activity continues to be modernised and new technologies are introduced. That's the purpose of the Setas. However, I do know that some of them actually even approach schools to find learners who are still at school who want to pursue studies in mechanics and related fields. They incentivise them and guide them at school level, so I know that the Setas also play that role. Thank you.

Mr A LEES

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr A LEES: Chair, through you to the hon Deputy President, it's great to hear about the youth subsidy. Is the hon deputy President able to give us a target date for the implementation of this youth subsidy and, if not, when does he think we will be told when the target date will be decided upon?

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Hon member, no, I'm not in a position to give a target date. As I indicated, the matter has been on the agenda of Nedlac for consideration from 10 May, and as we all know that Nedlac operates on the basis of consensus, from indications that we have been receiving, we get a sense that indeed there is progress being made by all four chambers for this matter to be concluded.

We hope it will be soon because all four chambers in Nedlac are aware that this challenge of unemployment is a very serious one. Therefore, there's a sense of urgency with which the deliberations are being conducted. Thank you.

QUESTION 14

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QUESTION 13

Question 14:

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Chairperson, hon members, thank you for this very important question about the extension of the Expanded Public Works Programme, EPWP, in rural areas. As the hon member is aware, both the creation of decent work through initiatives such as the EPWP and rural development are part of the government's five priorities.

We believe that, individually and collectively, these priorities are central to our goal of creating a better life for all, especially in disadvantaged areas. Therefore, any measure that expands opportunities, especially to rural communities, receives our urgent attention.

With regard to the extension or the expansion of the EPWP in rural areas, government is pursuing this goal in the belief that the programme has multiple benefits. One, it offers income opportunities to the people employed in the projects. Two, it helps accelerate the provision of social and economic infrastructure such as roads, schools and clinics.

Thirdly, it opens up markets and opportunities to trade. For example, where roads have been built using labour-intensive methods employed by the EPWP in order to promote labour absorption, it becomes easier for rural communities to access services like clinics.

Furthermore, the movement of goods into and from rural communities is made easier. That is why in some communities agricultural potential is expanding because communal famers can now move their fresh produce to the market. Therefore, whereas the primary objective of the EPWP is to create direct income opportunities for poor people, the programme does a lot to undermine poverty in targeted communities.

We are encouraged by the performance of the programme in KwaZulu-Natal, where the flagship ZibambeleRoad Maintenance Contract System has been recapitalised and expanded. We also see positive developments in provinces like Limpopo, Mpumalanga and the Eastern Cape, where environmental projects like Working for Water are being expanded.

In addition to the EPWP, government is also expanding the Community Work Programme. This is a rurally biased and ward-based initiative led by the Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs.

This programme guarantees two days of work per week to a set number of people per ward where it is implemented. It is unique in that it also promotes collaboration with the community organisations that mobilise people on such projects. This includes refuse removal, restoration of communal property and expansion of community nutrition schemes.

All these initiatives, hon members, give us hope that, eventually, living in rural areas will not equal poverty and despair. We must expand social and economic opportunities for all our people, across the length and breadth of the country. Working together with all social partners and members of this House, constantly keeping a check, we are determined to succeed. Thank you for your attention.

Mr L P M NZIMANDE

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr L P M NZIMANDE: Chairperson, I thank the hon Deputy President for the extensive answer to this question. As you are aware, Deputy President, as the NCOP, we've travelled the length and breadth of the country, particularly in the rural areas. The major concern that we heard from the people during the Provincial Week and Taking Parliament to the People programmes has been the issue of employment in rural areas.

IsiZulu:

Oomama bakhale ngokuthi ...

English:

... their children go to urban areas, leaving the children with them, the grandmothers; men are retrenched from work in the urban centres; and that, for them, employment within the areas where they live is imperative.

Deputy President, you have pointed out that the programme is working, and we have also witnessed that the programme is there in rural areas. However, these extended public works programmes rotate amongst communities and some of these are short-term by their nature.

Deputy President, the question, therefore, is: Given the fact that these programmes are not permanent, how are they linked to sustainable skills development so as to ensure that our people are empowered permanently and do not revert to poverty? I thank you, p Chairperson.

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Hon members, yes, indeed, the Expanded Public Works Programmes do not offer people permanent decent work. However, as I indicated through the example of Zibambele in KwaZulu-Natal, the maintenance of roads is semipermanent.

Furthermore, with regard to workers who are retrenched, if they are retrenched in larger numbers, it is always helpful to ensure that part of the retrenchment package includes a fund for training so that those workers can then be retrained, for example, to establish co-operatives for themselves and, therefore, be in a position to eke out a decent living through their own efforts.

There are a number of initiatives in various government departments. Most of these initiatives are aimed at ensuring that these citizens who reside on the margins of urban areas do not fall through the cracks.

I know this because the Ministry of Higher Education and Training specifically concerns itself with postschool training to ensure that, regardless of whether someone is completely illiterate, they should still be assisted with some form of training and education in order to make them trainable.

Then, of course, other departments, such as the Department of Social Development, also have programmes where some unemployed members of the community are encouraged to collect refuse, be it bottles or plastic, and exchange what they have collected for food parcels. So in that way they keep their immediate environment, where they reside, clean.

This is also a very useful contribution to communities. In that way they also earn something to eat, which ensures that they don't starve or go without food.

However, the point I'm making is that the concern of Higher Education and Training is really to target all adults who are either completely literate, semiliterate or have dropped out of school. They work, in this regard, with some of the major enterprises.

In the automotive industry, for instance, they train about 7 000 people just as mechanics. There are also other similar opportunities. These initiatives are meant precisely to absorb our people who are unemployed and without skills.

One of the reasons why we appreciate very deeply the NCOP going out to communities is that some of our people are left out simply because of ignorance, simply because they don't know where to turn to. They don't know where to turn to even when faced with the challenge of ensuring that the newly born babies have certificates and that those who do not have documents actually get the requisite documents so that they are enabled to access services and support from government.

I'm sure you are aware that the National Planning Commission has just released its report. One of the paradigm shifts in that report alludes precisely to the need for us to empower communities and citizens to participate in the economic development of the country. Thank you.

Mr D V BLOEM

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THE DEPTUY PRESIDENT

Mr D V BLOEM: Thank you very much, Chairperson, and thank you very much, Deputy President. I want to know from the Deputy President where farm dwellers fall in this whole programme. Are they regarded as being urban or rural?

We know that farm dwellers' children are without work and are not being considered. Now, I am asking where the farm dwellers' children fall? Many of them have matric and they can't find jobs. Thank you very much.

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Hon member, the approach really is to ensure that no citizen of South Africa falls through the cracks, regardless. The conditions of farm dwellers remain worrisome in the sense that in the majority of cases these communities of farm dwellers almost end up as people with no fixed abode.

We saw this even when we were encouraging people to register as voters. We found that in some places even their efforts to register themselves as voters were nullified because the electoral officers dismissed them when they provided the same address as they were numerous.

It becomes worse in situations where the ownership of the farm changes hands when new owners of the farm take over. For some reason or the other, because they have different criteria in the selection of workers, some of the dwellers are thrown off the farm and it's a problem that we are grappling with.

We think it should be almost compulsory that the children, the younger people - because our main effort is aimed at ensuring that poverty is not transmitted from one generation to the next - are registered and go to school.

Half the time the conditions are not quite supportive. In fact, if we had a choice, those children would all end up in boarding schools just to ensure that they are guaranteed the supportive environment necessary for them to make progress. Also, the farm workers should have the right to register for RDP houses like other citizens whilst in the employ of a farmer. If they have a sense that they want to settle permanently in a particular district they shouldbe encouraged to register for RDP houses, because their tenancy is linked to employment.

When that employment relationship sours and they are thrown off the farm, they then become homeless, and because it happens too late in their lives, they join the queue for RDP housing very late. That is why you find these anomalies where elderly people – you see them on TV from time to time - of 70 years old are being provided with a house for the first time and they say, "This is my very first house".

That should have happened much, much earlier. I'm really saying that we ought to do everything to ensure that the children of farm dwellers attend school. I think that is a critical intervention. Thank you.

Ms N D NTWANAMBI

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THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT

IsiXhosa:

Umn N D NTWANAMBI: Ndifuna ukuqonda ukuba xa kusenziwa uHlahlo- lwabiwo lwemali, oomasipala bayabonelelwa ukuze kwaziwe ukuba isixa esithile semali sibekelwe bucala inkqubo enje ngale sixoxa ngayo ngoku kunye namasebe- kodwa eyamasebe yona ubusele uyiphendule. Ndibuza kuba besiseMsinga kwezi veki zidlulileyo sayibona indlela entle ngayo le inkqubo kwaZulu-Natal kwaye nabanye oomasipala sibakhuthuwa ukuba benze ngokufanayo.

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes, indeed, particularly in those municipalities that are in the small "dorpies" and rural areas we think the provision of road infrastructure would offer an opportunity for programmes such as the Expanded Public Works Programme, not just to address the need for properly paved roads, but also to create employment opportunities and thereby strengthening the local economies. So it's an approach which truly should be adopted by many of these municipalities in the rural areas. Thank you.

Mr W F FABER

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr W F FABER: Chairperson, hon Deputy President, I just want to know if there is a type of model or system that helps to identify these people who should take part in these Extended Public Works Programmes. For instance, are there lists, and are they being trained by accredited training providers so that when they are finished with these EPWP projects they can actually find a decent job because they now have some training.

Also, once they are trained, are there aftercare systems so that these people can be found and pulled into jobs? For instance, does the Department of Labour have a new database system specifically for the EPWP projects, so that when these people have received training for the project there will still be life after the project for them. Thank you.

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Though there is no common model, the general approach is typified by what happened in Kliptown at Walter Sisulu Square. Every part of that square was produced by groups that were specifically trained from the communities around Kliptown.

I'm sure Parliament held a session in the main hall of that square. The panels in the main hall around the walls were produced by local women, who had specifically been trained to do so. The curbstones and paving were produced by groups from the local community. Therefore those are skills that people were able to gain out of that project.

I would imagine that having worked in groups would help, but unfortunately today it's very difficult for a single artisan to find a contract or even piece work. It always works better when you are in an organised group. This is the correct approach. In many areas, this is the approach which is followed.

I remember even in Limpopo the education department used the allocation for the replacement of mud schools and the construction of new schools to deploy an engineer from the Department of Education. He went out to the communities and got them organised into construction brigades or groups.

As they were building one school and then the next school they were gaining more experience and they were rotating. So they emerged from those projects with skills that have stood them in good stead up to today. Thank you.

QUESTION 15

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QUESTION 14

Question 15:

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Chairperson, 1969 was a long time ago and the SA Customs Union is indeed considering changes. Toward the end of 2010, the SA Customs Union Secretariat contracted an international consultancy to formulate proposals pertaining to the Sacu revenue-sharing formula.

As a result, a restructuring proposal was circulated at the end of February 2011. Negotiations around arriving at a new Sacu revenue-sharing formula are, however, protracted as some Sacu member states will be adversely affected by the new proposals – of course, with the exception of South African and Lesotho.

The consultants' report into the revenue sharing arrangement was discussed at both the commission and council meeting held in June 2011 in Windhoek, Namibia. A Task Team has been established to take the matter forward.

Yes, hon member, changes are in the pipeline pending a detailed and inclusive consultation process by all member states. Our position as South Africa is that whatever the outcome, no country should be severely disadvantaged. South Africa is obliged to support initiatives that promote the growth and prosperity of all countries in our region and beyond. I thank you.

Mr D B FELDMAN

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr D B FELDMAN: Chairperson, the Deputy President mentioned the 1969 agreement. Very recently the 2006 agreement was also formulated and implemented. What I would like to know is: As far as the Walmart-Massmart merger is concerned, how are the other member states

benefiting from of it?

We are carrying most of the duties like rail, shipping, and so on. As you know, we are generating almost the whole GDP for Swaziland and Lesotho through this agreement.

You mentioned that South Africa will be careful not to harm the other countries, but if you look at our own house we need jobs and we need the GDP to grow. Recently, Swaziland was very eloquent concerning the R2,4 billion loan that we intended giving them forgetting that we are granting them the GDP to run their country.

How will we ensure that South Africa derives maximum benefit from the effort that it put in the activation of Walmart and that it will come with efficient outcomes at the maximum of the inflow of our trade.

It is a reality that our manufacturing companies in South Africa are exporting goods, but they don't earn the money that they deserve. It's free trade. Where can we...

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon member, your time has expired and I did not exactly get what your question was about. Perhaps the Deputy President understood you. I honestly did not get the question very clearly. I don't know whether the Deputy President would like to respond to that.

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: I will try, Chairperson. [Laughter.] Well, you know the problems within SADC, particularly as they relate to the Sacu member states, such as Swaziland, Botswana, Namibia, and so on, are no different from the problems affecting the eurozone today with regards to Portugal, Italy, Greece and Spain, the PIGS countries, so to speak.

I think the lessons that we need to draw from these kinds of challenges are also that we should really take into account the fact that there are no natural borders separating South Africa from Botswana, Swaziland and Lesotho, for instance.

Almost on a daily basis people, for instance, from the Mngomezulu tribe, which straddles Swaziland and KwaZulu-Natal, wake up in the morning to go to the closest shop to buy bread. In that process they cross the border, completely unaware that they have actually crossed the border. So they go to and fro as they wish at anytime.

In a long term, it is in our interest to ensure that these countries do develop. If they have any mineral resources or other natural wealth, it is in our interest as South Africa to ensure that we inspire their development because once their economies become stronger and thrive we can only benefit from that as South Africa.

If we take a simply selfish inward-looking approach the truth is we will be burdened, as we are already, with the responsibility of having to cater for the influx from those countries without the requisite planning for it or benefiting from the contribution of those countries.

I think that this is how we should approach this matter. If we need to extend rail lines to ensure, although they are landlocked, that they are able to interact and have meaningful trade with South Africa and the rest of the world then we should do so.

I think it will be to our benefit in the long term because to think that we can develop as an island in the midst of these depressed economies and underdevelopment would be an illusion. We would eventually be encircled by those problems. I think South Africa has the experience to plan and think far ahead so we carry that burden and responsibility. That is how I would try to answer the question. Thank you.

Mr D A WORTH

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr D A WORTH: Chairperson, would it not be better in the long term to establish a totally free trade block area of Southern African states and do away with the customs duty, and think of an inventive way to somehow compensate those countries that are dependent on the duties levied. Would that not generate in the longer term more trade between Southern African states?

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes indeed, discussions on the establishment of a free trade area have already commenced, but I was responding to the specific question posed which relates to the customs union. Because by merely establishing a free trade area and therefore curtailing the existence of Sacu it would no doubt squeeze the life out of some of these countries.

In fact, some of them survive because 60% of their budgets come from the Sacu revenue. Therefore if you were to close that facility abruptly you may actually cause more problems. So the options of establishing a free trade area in a phased way may be more prudent and advisable. However, as I said, the discussions have already commenced on the establishment of a free trade area that is within SADC which actually may extend as far as Angola.

That is why a wise man once rated us as South Africans by saying that our problem is that we are for ever trying to boil the sea, and he said perhaps we should try boiling water in buckets rather than trying to boil the whole sea at once. I thank you.

Mr A LEES

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THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr A LEES: Deputy President, I doubt whether there are many people except for hardcore nationalist who would disagree with the view that it is important for South Africa to have strong and stable neighbours. However, given the situation in Swaziland, which is neither strong nor stable - and with the absolutemonarch who uses vast sums of money for his personal use – would it not then be a good thing to do, within the revision of the customs union, to apply financial pressure as the ANC did through the anti-apartheid governments that introduced economic sanctions against South Africa. Would this not be a way of bringing about the very stable and strong country in Swaziland that we all would like to see? [Interjections.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order! Mr Lees, I think you should bring a new question in that regard. That is not a follow-up question.

Mr A LEES: Yes, thank you, Chairperson.

QUESTION 16

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QUESTION 15

Question 16:

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Chairperson and hon members, previously, government's programme to meet its self-imposed commitment to achieve universal access to basic services for all South Africans, set different target dates for different basic services: water for all in 2008, electricity for all in 2012, eradication of household sanitation backlog by 2010, eradication of school sanitation backlog by 2005, replacement of the bucket system by 2007, and the eradication of backlogs in clinics by 2007.

The refuse removal policy was recently approved in October 2010. The different target dates have since been synchronised for all basic services to 2014, in line with the target of Human Settlements and the Millennium Development Goals.

In 2010, government adopted an outcomes-based approach to service delivery and performance management. Improved quality of basic education is our Outcome 1. Outputs related to the achievement of this outcome include improving the quality of teaching and learning, undertaking regular assessment to track progress, improving early childhood development, and ensuring a credible outcomes-focused planning and accountability system.

The eradication of unsafe and inappropriate structures that do not have basic facilities like water and sanitation and the provision of basic facilities to all schools, is a priority over the medium-term.

The Accelerated School Infrastructure Delivery Initiative will be rolled out over the medium period to accelerate the delivery of school infrastructure, including the provision of facilities like school libraries, laboratories, computer centres and nutrition centres. This will serve to improve the general environment within which learning and teaching takes place.

Maintenance of school infrastructure will not be neglected, and, as outlined in the infrastructure policy framework and norms and standards for education infrastructure that were finalised in June 2010, it receives increased attention. The norms will be used to standardise the design and construction of schools and will lead to gains in cost, through economies of scale and efficiency and quicker turnaround times for construction.

An amount of R8,2 billion has been allocated to the school infrastructure backlog to eradicate inappropriate school infrastructure such as mud schools and other unsafe structures, and to ensure that all schools are provided with basic services like water, sanitation and electricity.

These funds will be used to replace 395 mud schools, to provide water to 1 307 schools, sanitation to 536 schools and electricity to 1 434 schools. A total of R711,6 million has been allocated for the technical secondary schools recapitalisation conditional grant to build, refurbish and resource new and existing teaching spaces, that is, technology workshops and classrooms.

At least R631,6 million of this amount will be used to build 101 new workshops, refurbish 347 workshops, deliver and instal equipment in 435 workshops and train 1 500 technology teachers.

The health sector is responsible for the achievement of a long and healthy life for all South Africans. That is Outcome 2. Thus, the strategic focus of the health sector over the 2011-12, 2013-14 planning cycle will be on implementing the interventions to achieve the four outputs detailed in the Minister's performance agreement and elaborated on in the negotiated service delivery agreement for 2010 to 2014. These are: increasing life expectancy, reducing maternal and child mortality rates, combating HIV and Aids and decreasing the burden of diseases from tuberculosis, and strengthening health system effectiveness.

In order to improve primary health care and public health facilities, a re-engineered primary health care model for South Africa has been developed. The re-engineered primary health care model emphasises a population-oriented service delivery approach, strengthened community-based services, the deployment of multidisciplinary primary health care teams including community health workers across defined geographic areas and greater community involvement in securing and promoting health.

The primary health care approach is vital for improving health outcomes and for achieving the object of implementing national health insurance. District support teams will be established with medical specialists.

In 2010-11, there were over 2 200 individual infrastructure-related projects, valued at R9 billion, recorded in the health sector as part of the hospital revitalisation programme, including 417 projects. For the 2011-12 period, government has started with the planning and designing phase for five flagship private-public partnership projects for the following hospitals: Chris Hani Baragwanath, Garankuwa, King Edward VII, Polokwane and the Eastern Cape Academic Complex.

Hon member, I am giving you this detail in order to contextualise my reply to your specific question about the antipoverty campaign. I do so to highlight the fact that our antipoverty efforts are integrated into the broader social and economic infrastructure delivery agenda, which is.

To address the needs of the poorest households in the country requires speeding up the delivery of water, sanitation, housing, transport, sport and recreation, education and health infrastructure, thus creating conditions for improved wellbeing.

Therefore, even though social infrastructure targets are not necessarily part of the antipoverty campaign, the campaign does take a special interest in and advocates for the acceleration of service delivery and the creation of work opportunities for poor households. I thank you.

Prince M M M ZULU

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The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Prince M M M ZULU: Chairperson and Deputy President, my concern is that ...

IsiZulu:

... ngiyamuzwa uSekela Mongameli uma ebala konke lokhu ...

English:

... does the government have teams to monitor all of these projects in South Africa or not?

IsiZulu:

Bengicela ukusho ukuthi ngiyezwa indlela uMongameli abeka ngayo uma engiphendula umbuzo wami. Inkinga yami ukuthi ngabe kukhona yini abantu abakubhekayo lokhu ezweni lonke ukuthi kuyikho na lokhu akushoyo uSekela Mongameli?

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Yes, indeed ...

IsiZulu:

...lungu elihloniphekile, empeleni uMnyango Wokubheka Ukusebenza kanye Nokukala kanye Nokusebenza Ehhovisi LikaMongameli umsebenzi wawo ukuthi ubheke ukuthi le zinto ziyenzeka ngempela. Kepha okubalulekile kakhulu nokusemqoka ukuthi abantu abangabahlali nabo ngokwabo bayakwazi yini ukuthi bathole lezinsiza esikhuluma ngazo ngoba imisebenzi nokulwa nobompofu kuxhomekeke kuleyo ndaba ukuthi izingane ziye esikoleni. Bese kuthi lezo ezashiya esikole ziyakwazi ukuthi zitholakale bese ziyasizwa ngokuqeqeshwa ngendlela elula yokuba zikwazi ukuziphilisa.

Ngikhumbula ukuthi sasike saya ngapha eMsinga kwathi uma sifika khona sathola ukuthi imigwaqo ayikho esimeni esihle futhi inamatshe amaningi. Kwacaca ukuthi uma kungafika onjiniya babheke ukubukeka kwezwe uma libukwa ngamehlo kahle, uMsinga ungaba yindawo enhle kakhulu. Ezemisebenzi Yomphakathi njengoba sasilaphaya zikwazile ukuthi zithole intsha empeleni abanye bayo benebanga le-12 abanye benebanga le-10 lemfundo. Zathola intsha eyi-110 yaqeqeshwa ukuthi ibhekane nendlela yokondla amanzi ukuthi ahlale ahlanzekile akwazi ukuba aphilise umphakathi walapho. Ngaleyondlela ke bathola lemisebenzi kulokho kuqeqeshwa. Ngiyabonga.

Mr K A SINCLAIR

UNREVISED HANSARD

NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES

Tuesday, 15 November 2011 Take: 476


The DEPUTY PRESIDENT

Mr K A SINCLAIR: Hon Deputy President, you have recently visited the provinces during a War on Poverty drive. You also visited the province that I come from, the Northern Cape, and I am happy to hear that you speak about the dorpies [small towns] which are very prevalent in the Northern Cape.

I assume that you have experienced first-hand the levels of poverty and unemployment in all these small places in the Northern Cape. Deputy President, if you must give advice to the 2,8 million young South Africans, who are not in school, unemployed and without skills, what single piece of advice would you give them?

The DEPUTY PRESIDENT: Well, these 2,8 million young people who are not in any institution of learning and who are unemployed, need information from government and the private sector that would meet their standard of education and enable them to access training opportunities, as well as employment opportunities.

I think that is the main obstacle or hurdle in their way because some of them have university degrees, others dropped out much earlier and others have no education whatsoever. But they don't have access to information which tells to them if they go through it, they should find it.

For instance, if I dropped out in Grade 9, when I go through the information there should be something in there which says if you are in possession of Grade 9 education, these are the opportunities and these are the numbers of institutions that would train you or employers that would give you training and absorb you.

I think that's what we need to do as government. We need to organise information. As I've said, many of the government departments have many programmes. In our discussions with organised business and major corporations, we were informed that they also have in-house training.

They have also committed to offer training to such young people, which would meet their own needs for the supply of skills and labour. So, I think if we must do that and encourage these young people to take advantage of such opportunities.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): No further follow-up questions? Hon members, that concludes the time for questions to the Deputy President. I have received a request that the Minister of Sports and Recreation would like to make a statement on the 2011 National Sports and Recreation Indaba to look at initiatives to take South African sport forward.

THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF SPORTS AND RECREATION


UNREVISED HANSARD

NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES

Tuesday, 15 November 2011 Take: 477


QUESTIONS TO THE DEPUTY PRESIDENT

2011 NATIONAL SPORT AND RECREATION INDABA TO LOOK AT INITIATIVES TO TAKE SOUTH AFRICAN SPORT FORWARD

(Statement)

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF SPORT AND RECREATION: Mr G C Oosthuizen: Chairperson, Deputy President, hon members, thank you for acceding to this request. Allow me to extend the apologies of Minister Mbalula who is making a statement in the National Assembly at the same time. His heart is with us.

The Ministry of Sport and Recreation is hosting a National Sport and Recreation Indaba to reconstruct and revitalise the sport and recreation sector for an active and a winning nation, thereby improving the lives of all South Africans.

In contributing to inclusive citizenship the sport and recreation sector really involves more than just playing. Sport is, in fact, an investment. Firstly, it's an investment in the health, vitality and productivity of one's people. Secondly, it's an investment in the future.

The social benefits include an overall improvement in quality of life and the physical, mental and moral wellbeing of a population. Furthermore, successful athletes serve as role models for the youth of the country as achievers, unofficial ambassadors and as individuals committed to equality and fairness in competition.

Sport's viability can play and has played an enormous part in redressing gender and race inequalities, and discrimination against people with disabilities and the marginalised groups. In the case of South Africa, sport is one of the most important cohesive factors in uniting the entire nation. The Freedom Charter has emphasised that, and I quote:

Government shall discover, develop and encourage national talent for the enhancement of our cultural life.

And our sporting life.

The colour bar in cultural life, in sport and in education shall be abolished.

In the same vein, the Constitution of the Republic guarantees these freedoms. In its preamble the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa recognises the injustices of our past, honours those who suffered for justice and freedom in our land, respects those who have worked to build and develop our country and believes that South Africa belongs to all who live in it, united in our diversity.

It seeks to heal the divisions of the past and establish a society based on democratic values, social justice and fundamental human rights; lay the foundation for a democratic and open society in which government is based on the will of the people and every citizen is equally protected by the law; and to improve the quality of life if all citizens and to free the potential of each individual.

It's almost 15 years after the adoption of the Constitution of the Republic and that Constitution gave our people the developmental state and political mandate to transform all the institutions of the state and other undemocratic institutions and practices, based on the will of the people.

This in essence requires a critical political context which integrates sport with other national goals and priorities.

In content this process of structural transformation of sport and recreation takes into cognisance areas such as education, health, economy, transport, employment and community development. By contrast, the transformation of sport and recreation means redressing the imbalances of the past and isolated grievances.

In the South African context this refers strategically to deracialisation of elite privileges in sport and recreation.

Dr Douglas Booth in his book titled South Africa: Elite Sport is Winning cautioned us that, and I quote:

Sadly, one finds little evidence of structural reform in South African sport.

While former anti-apartheid activist used sport to empower local communities, the majority view it as a convenient route to self-enrichment or at least as a symbol of racial reconciliation. Few care about developing sport in disadvantaged communities.

This was said by Dr Booth in November 1995, a year after the first democratic elections in our country and hardly a year before the formal adoption of the democratic Constitution of our country.

As the Ministry of Sport and Recreation, we are combat-ready to join all South Africans in the battle trenches for a nonracial, nonsexist, democratic, accessible, integrated and united sport and recreation system in 2011 and the years to come.

We do this inspired by the urgent task to build a collective case for sport and recreation in our national and global discourse to sharpen our theory, analysis and organisation of sport and recreation in our country. It is of cardinal importance we do so to chart a common vision, common implementation plan and common delivery mechanisms across all spheres of government for sport and recreation development and the total transformation of our sectors.

When the Minister of Sport addressed a joint Sport and Recreation of South Africa and South African Sport Conferderation and Olympic Committee, SASCOC, press conference in March this year, he said:

Sixteen years since apartheid was dislodged from power and replaced by the democratically elected government, South Africa is still beset by inequalities and an uneven development in sport and recreation.

The meeting agreed that we move swiftly by ensuring that we embark on a broad consultative process that will involve the entire nation in a national and robust debate on transformation that will culminate in a conceptual and contextual transformation framework for our country.

The South African Sport Conferderation and Olympic Committee have already produced a transformation charter which we will incorporate in our processes and which we believe will enrich the final product arising from the consultative process.

The aforementioned assertion and policy positions of Sport and Recreation of South Africa provide federations and other stakeholders with the basis to outline forthe nation the purpose of the National Sport and Recreation Indaba.

The first is to retrace the road traversed by the people of our country since apartheid was dislodged from power and replaced by democratic nonracial, nonsexist and free South Africa. We must ask the question, where did we start? We must ask, how far have we come and where to from here?

The second is to review the instruments, policies, strategies and tactics that have been relied upon over the past 16 years for the transformation of sport and recreation. We must ask the question, is there a room for review and refinement?

The third is to align the sport and recreation of South Africa roadmap and the strategic priorities with current and future policies and legislation within the sector. The question is: How do we go about this alignment; what are the problematic and the budgetary implications thereof?

The fourth is to fast-track a transformation charter and delivery mechanisms for all sectors and the role players involved in sport and recreation. We must ask the question: What is transformation? Who are the drivers and the participants in this transformation discoursed? What do we want to achieve out of that? I want to put that question to the Deputy President. We would like to see the starting line being the same for all the children in this country.

The fifth is to set in motion campaigns, projects, strategies and tactics that will leapfrog the sport and recreation sector into realities and possibilities. The question is whether this is a pipe dream or really an achievable objective.

The sixth is to deal with the provision of facilities in disadvantaged communities within the context of the two-economy analysis, whilst ensuring that there is integration, quality, excellence and global competitiveness. We must ask the question, how can this be done?

Our stated and unstated assumptions are placed here in order to canvas public opinion and develop solutions and recommendations to the challenges of our time. In this context there must be no sacred cows and we must leave no stone unturned in our quest to transform South Africa for the better.

Let us embark on genuine and constructive debates conversations aimed at the altar of public discourse, to be rigorously interrogated and subjected to public scrutiny. The debate is open to all, peasants; farmers; rural and urban women; teachers and students; players and coaches; sports administrators and managers; politicians and bureaucrats; and young and old.

Whenever and wherever South Africans meet, sport and recreation must exist and the ideals for a sporting and healthy nation should be our preoccupation and our clarion call. My request is that all of society seize this moment and make meaningful inputs and contributions.

Upon approval of a national sport and recreation plan, our country will for the first time have a sport and recreation plan with unified objectives for all role players and sports transformation will be addressed in a holistic way.

The plan will provide for South Africa to have, among other things, an effective and well co-ordinated sports system. We will have Physical Education and sport practice in all schools resulting in school children broadening the talent pool of our country. We will have sufficient and accessible sport facilities that are well maintained by municipalities and fully used by our communities. Our country will be acknowledged as a leader in world sport and as a choice destination for major events in sport, thereby boosting our sport tourism.

Let us take the 2010 nation building spirit forward. Let us maintain excellence in all major events and let us insist on good corporate governance and let's ensure that it prevails in all sports.

Deputy President, we ask this because this is after all a legacy that we legislators can leave for the generations to come. Thank you. [Applause.]

The Council adjourned at 15:23.


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