Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill & Deeds Registries Amendment: finalisation

Meeting report

Finalisation of Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill [B14-2021]

Mr Siviwe Njikela, Parliamentary Legal Advisor, said that Mr Lehotlo Mashokoa, Parliamentary Legal Services, would take the Committee through the Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill.

Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill: A-list

Mr Mashokoa took the Committee through the A-list.

The A-list included the amendments that Ms Nokuzola Mgxashe, Committee Content Advisor: Agriculture, had referred to in last week’s meeting.

Clause 15: On page 12, in line 48, to omit “(5)” and substitute “(3)”.

Clause 24(3): On page 14, in line 35, to omit “(2)” and substitute “(2)(a)”.

The Acting Chairperson asked for a mover and a seconder for the adoption of the A-list.

Ms N Mahlo (ANC) moved for the adoption of the A-list, and was seconded by Mr N Capa (ANC).

The A-list of the Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill was adopted.

Mr N Masipa (DA) said that he had been cut off, but had wanted to make a comment in last week’s meeting regarding the powers of the Minister in section 3(1) and (2). He was confused, and not sure whether it was this section.

Ms B Tshwete (ANC) called for a point of order. Mr Masipa had wanted to raise a point that should have been raised in last week’s meeting. She said that last week’s meeting had already been concluded and the matters were resolved. There could not be further amendments in today's meeting when that part of the process had already been concluded. She did not see the relevance of the comment, and it felt a bit mischievous.

The Acting Chairperson said that she was still on the platform to make a decision on the point of order that had been raised. She said that Ms Tshwete was right. The A-list had been presented after the motion of desirability, which gave the Committee the chance to amend clauses. In last week’s meeting, Ms Mgxashe had raised her comments after the Committee had moved on to the Deeds Registries Amendment Bill. The Committee had then gone back, and it had given rise to the two clauses. She said that the Committee Researchers were there, and had been assisting with doing their jobs properly. She said that she could not go back. The Committee had agreed to the clauses. The A-list had to be adopted to move to the B-list. She would not go back to the motion of desirability, to amend clauses. Last week, it had been agreed that the Department would look at those two clauses. She would not go back, and had allowed Mr Masipa to speak only so that Members could call for a point of order. Members had already agreed to the A-list. She asked if the A-list could be adopted again.

Mr Masipa asked if he could make his last point.

The Acting Chairperson said she would not allow Mr Masipa to make his last point. She said that she could not go back -- even the minutes would show what had been discussed in last week’s meeting.

Mr Masipa said that freedom of speech was being denied.

Ms Mahlo called for a point of order. She said that Members could not say that their freedom of speech had been denied even when they made mistakes. What Mr Masipa was doing was not right. She was moving for the adoption of the A-list.

Ms Tshwete said freedom of speech was allowed, but the Member was out of order. The Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill had been deliberated on last week. Mr Masipa had been caught sleeping on the job. The train had passed, and now Mr Masipa wanted to come into the meeting with a different agenda.

Mr Masipa called for a point of order, saying it could not be insinuated that he was sleeping on duty.

The Acting Chairperson said that a ruling had been made that the Committee would not go back.

Ms T Mbabama (DA) wanted to speak, but Ms Tshwete indicated that she had been cut off and had not finished speaking.

Ms Tshwete said that she seconded the motion to adopt the A-list.

Ms Mbabama said that the Committee was being very short-sighted. It was unfair for the Committee not to listen to what Mr Masipa wanted to say. This was about making law. If there was something important that Mr Masipa felt the Committee had missed, he should be given a chance to speak. He might have a very good point. Members were human beings and sometimes things did not come up at the relevant time. Cliches were now being used, like “the train has passed”. This was unfair. This was about law-making and not closing people’s mouths. The Committee should hear what Mr Masipa wanted to say. The Committee was not doing justice to the Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill. The Committee should not do an injustice to the people of South Africa.

The Acting Chairperson said that she had made her ruling. Law-making had processes which had to be followed, which the Committee had done. Last week, the Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill was passed without amendments. However, Ms Mgxashe had raised some editorial concerns. The process now was to adopt these amendments and the A-list.

She said that the motion of desirability had been passed, and she would not open it up again for discussion. The deliberations were concluded, and everyone was given an equal chance. Sometimes, researchers would come after the meeting and state this or that could have been done. These things should be raised during that time or in the meeting. The processes were followed, and the A-list had been adopted. The deliberations would not be opened again. The Committee would now move forward to the B-list.

Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill: B-list

Mr Moshokoa took the Committee through the arrangements of the sections of the Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill.

Ms Tshwete moved for the adoption of the B-list, to which Ms Mahlo agreed.

Report of the Portfolio Committee on Agriculture, Land Reform and Rural Development on the Plant Health (Phytosanitary) Bill [B14 – 2021]

 The Acting Chairperson read through the report.

Ms Mahlo moved for the adoption of the report, which was seconded by Ms Tshwete.

The Committee adopted the report. https://pmg.org.za/tabled-committee-report/5629/

The Acting Chairperson said that the Committee would now go through the B-list of the Deeds Registries Amendment Bill.

Finalisation of Deeds Registries Amendment Bill [B28-2022]

Mr Moshokoa said there were no proposed amendments to the Deeds Registries Amendment Bill.

He took the Committee through the Bill.

Ms Mbabama moved for the adoption of the B-list, which was seconded by Ms Mahlo.

Report of the Portfolio Committee on Agriculture, Land Reform and Rural Development on the Deeds Registries Amendment Bill [B28 – 2022]

 The Acting Chairperson read through the report.

Ms Tshwete moved for the adoption of the report, and Ms Mahlo seconded.

The report was duly adopted. https://pmg.org.za/tabled-committee-report/5627/

Committee matters

The Committee considered and adopted the minutes of 21, 24 and 28 November and 1 December.

Ms Mahlo agreed to the Committee report on its activities for January-December 2023 being tabled and considered in the next term.

Ms Tshwete seconded this proposal.

Concluding remarks

The Acting Chairperson said that this was the last meeting for the year. She wished everyone a joyful festive season, and urged them to take care and remain sound and fit for the next term.

Mr Masipa asked if these reports would be tabled before Parliament's rise. He made mention of the time constraints.

The Acting Chairperson said no, since this was the last week of meetings.

The meeting was adjourned.