National Heritage Council 2022/2023 Annual Report; with Minister

Meeting report

The Chairperson thanked all attendees and acknowledged the presence of the Minister of Sport, Arts, and Culture, Mr Zizi Kodwa. She highlighted the rarity of having the Minister present. She then welcomed the Minister back from Russia and conveyed condolences on behalf of the Committee to the family of Hannes Strydom, a member of the 1995 World Cup champion squad. The Chairperson also congratulated Bafana Bafana on their World Cup group stage victory and wished them success in their upcoming match against Rwanda. Additionally, she praised the Mamelodi Sundowns Ladies’ team for securing a second consecutive champion league title, expressing pride in the country's sports achievements and encouraging continued excellence.

She invited the Department of Sport, Arts, and Culture (DSAC) to do a roll call.

Ms Mandisa Tshikwatamba, Deputy Director-General (DDG): Corporate Governance, DSAC, confirmed the presence of the Minister in the meeting and acknowledged the apology given for the Minister's potential absence throughout the meeting. Ms Tshikwatamba also confirmed the acting Director-General’s (DG) apology, reiterating the apologies made for senior and executive members. She further confirmed that DDG Khan and DDG Ndima could not join the meeting, with the latter being unavailable due to travel.

A roll call was done for the Council as well by Mr Edgar Neluvhalani, NHC Board Chairperson,

Opening Remarks

The Chairperson asked the Minister to provide opening remarks. Regrettably, due to network challenges, he was unable to do so. The Chairperson then requested Ms Tshikwatamba to deliver opening remarks on behalf of the Department.

DSAC Overview

Ms Tshikwatamba provided an outline of the presentation, emphasising the need for specificity when reporting to the Committee on areas outlined in the presentation. Mandate-wise, she summarised that the National Heritage Council South Africa (NHC) remains focused on developing, promoting, and protecting national heritage, coordinating and managing it through various authorities, ensuring access to the country's valuable heritage for purposes such as indigenous knowledge, social upliftment, learning, economic activities, and the promotion and protection of culture.

Regarding non-financial performance, Ms Tshikwatamba noted a slight drop in the 2022/23 report, attributing it to project adjustments based on instruction notes, particularly from National Treasury. Financially, she described the NHC's static budget, subject to annual increments or adjustments from budget cuts. The audit outcomes revealed challenges with recurring irregular expenditure and supply chain matters, impacting their pursuit of a clean audit.

Ms Tshikwatamba discussed the Council's composition, highlighting a gender ratio of seven females to nine males. Council and committee meetings were reported to be fairly stagnant, with increased activity in Council committee meetings, likely addressing legal issues and ongoing forensic activities. The NHC was commended for active participation in government engagements and forums.

Addressing the composition of executive management, Ms Tshikwatamba noted a gender imbalance, with two females versus five males. She also touched on the need for improved representation in terms of race, specifically for the coloured community.

The presentation included an update on investigations and legal matters, indicating the NHC's ongoing efforts to resolve internal matters within prescribed timelines, except for those requiring external authorities' involvement. Ms Tshikwatamba assured the Chairperson and the Members that the NHC was making progress in finalising matters within the organisation.

See presentation attached

Minister’s Remarks

Minister Kodwa expressed gratitude for the understanding regarding his earlier connectivity issues. He conveyed thanks to the Committee Members and the leadership of the National Heritage Council (NHC), acknowledging their appearance before the Portfolio Committee. The Minister added to the positive congratulatory message shared by the Chairperson in the introductory remarks of the meeting.

He highlighted the significance of hosting a meeting in Cape Town with the Federation of Professional Footballers worldwide, considering it as a historic event for the development of sports in the country. The Minister mentioned that DSAC would be addressing this forum, emphasising the importance of hosting such a significant gathering of professional footballers globally.

The Minister regretted not being able to receive the Mamelodi Sundowns Ladies later that day, acknowledging their achievements and the importance of recognising women's sports. He noted that the Sundowns Ladies had laid the foundation for professionalising women's sports, particularly in football.

Addressing concerns about the NHC, the Minister acknowledged the existence of issues that have damaged the entity's image. He expressed satisfaction with the advanced stage of dealing with these issues, assuring relevant authorities would address them. The Minister highlighted the stability in the current leadership of the entity, which he believes will contribute to addressing irregularities and wasteful expenditure.

The Minister concluded by expressing appreciation for the opportunity to address the Committee, acknowledging his intermittent presence due to other commitments, including a Cabinet meeting.

As seen on social media, the Chairperson expressed discontent from SA citizens – regarding the absence of a welcome for the cricket players who had performed excellently.

The Chairperson acknowledged that the Minister was not present during that time but highlighted the absence of an invitation from the Committee. Suspecting the need for an apology to Cricket South Africa for not extending a welcome, the Chairperson emphasised that the Committee had supported them. Apologising on behalf of the Department and the Committee for the oversight, the Chairperson explained that they were busy during the registration weekend.

The Chairperson informed the Members that the Minister would be released from the meeting and that he could join them before the session's end.

NHC Annual Report 2022/23

Mr Edgar Neluvhalani, NHC Chairperson, thanked the Chairperson and esteemed Members of the Portfolio Committee for their time. He acknowledged the challenges faced by the National Heritage Council (NHC) during the third year of the Council's term, emphasising the complexity of the issues dealt with during his tenure.

Mr Neluvhalani appreciated the robust engagement and questions from Members, acknowledging the importance of being accountable to the public of South Africa.

He highlighted the positive changes within the NHC, including an established management structure and key personnel appointments. Mr Neluvhalani mentioned the efforts to address court issues resulting from implementing recommendations from a forensic audit. These issues have been referred to relevant law enforcement authorities, with internal efforts made to adhere to recommendations and reinstitute good governance.

Mr Neluvhalani noted the stability and positive changes within the NHC, mentioning the new personnel contributing to the entity's progress. He addressed irregular expenditure, attributing it to carryover issues from previous years and expressing confidence in achieving a clean audit, moving forward.

Mr Neluvhalani emphasised the NHC's celebration of South Africa's 30 years of democracy and its commitment to representing and celebrating the nation's diverse heritage. He expressed appreciation for the presidential stimulus funding, highlighting its positive impact on documenting and celebrating various intangible heritage throughout the country.

Concluding his remarks, Mr Neluvhalani handed over to the CEO to present the annual report, expressing a commitment to addressing challenges and maintaining transparency in the organisation's operations.

Dr Ndivhoniswani Lukhwareni, Chief Financial Officer, NHC, started by discussing the turnaround strategy implemented by the Council, focusing on professionalism, accountability and financial sustainability.

Dr Lukhwareni highlighted the professionalism and accountability reflected in the approved and revised policies of the Council. He emphasised a focus on high impact, legacy and pioneering national initiatives. The NHC has entered into agreements with sister entities, like Boxing SA, to collaborate on various projects, contributing to national cohesion initiatives.

The CFO emphasised the importance of the NHC's role and visibility at key events attended by the Minister. The Council has been working on strengthening its research and development capacity, reducing reliance on external experts. Dr Lukhwareni discussed the Council's mandate, and governance practices guided by the King IV report.

He provided an overview of the Council's Committees, governance structure, and the signing of a shareholder contract with the Minister. Dr Lukhwareni addressed personnel costs, noting an intentional increase in in-house research capacity. He shared staff statistics, including the deliberate inclusion of unemployed graduates.

The CFO discussed staff movements, including resignations, retirements and dismissals. He emphasised the Council's commitment to training and incorporating unemployed graduates into their workforce.

Dr Lukhwareni detailed the Council's governance protocol, showcasing the structure and committees involved. He touched on the Council's flagship initiatives, including the liberation routes, the national inventory, Golden Shield awards, Heritage Education School programmes, Ubuntu on a mission to national building, and public engagements.

The CFO provided an overview of funds dispersed, beneficiaries and jobs created. He discussed the Golden Shield Awards, recognising individuals including former employees, and the Council's efforts to encourage provinces to participate.

Dr Lukhwareni highlighted agreements with traditional houses, particularly in the Northern Cape, and their impact on program visibility and response to cost funding. He concluded by mentioning the Council's own funding initiatives, including partnerships and contributions from NGOs. Concluding his  part, Dr Lukhwareni requested that the CFO take over for the next section of the presentation.

(See attached for details)

Ms Mbalenhle Manukuza, Chief Financial Officer, NHC, provided an overview of the financial position and performance of the NHC.

Ms Manukuza reported that the NHC performed well in its statement of financial position. The strong asset base was highlighted, with assets amounting to R169 million and liabilities at R127 million, indicating a healthy and liquid financial position. Cash and cash equivalents increased to R105 million due to the Presidential Economic Stimulus Programme, which was utilised to pay invoices. Prepayments of R61 million were made, related to the first tranche payments for the stimulus programme.

The CFO emphasised the healthy balance sheet, the prompt payment of day-to-day suppliers within an average of 15.5 days, and deferred income of R114 million, mainly due to outstanding funds from past projects and the PMO project.

In terms of the statement of financial performance, Ms Manukuza reported that the NHC received a grant of R73 million, with an additional interest of R1.8 million, totalling R74 million. Expenditure increased to R74 million from the previous year's R56 million, attributed to the implementation of heritage projects. The surplus decreased from R18 million to R4.6 million, with a significant portion allocated to purchasing capital assets such as laptops for staff working online.

Ms Manukuza clarified that there was no fruitless expenditure during the year. Regarding irregular expenditure, she categorised it into three types: carryover from previous financial years due to multi-year contracts, irregular expenditure incurred during the cleanup of operations (such as legal and forensic costs), and technical irregularities related to outdated procurement regulations.

She emphasised that the irregular expenditure was not due to new cases but included legacy issues that were being addressed. Disciplinary processes, warnings, and hearings were conducted, and efforts were made to align with current procurement regulations. The CFO stated that the goal is to condone all irregular expenditure by March 2024.

Ms Manukuza highlighted that the NHC maintained an unqualified audit opinion, indicating improvements compared to the previous financial year. There were no findings on misstatements in the annual financial statements or lack of consequence management. The only remaining finding was related to irregular expenditure, which she explained was primarily a carryover from previous years.

The CFO stated that the NHC is actively working to address the irregular expenditure and expects to have a clean audit in the 2023/2024 financial year.

She concluded her presentation, stating that the NHC is committed to ensuring transparency and accountability in its financial management.

(See attached presentation for further details)

Discussion

Mr T Mhlongo (DA) raised concerns about the importance of succession planning within the NHC and questioned the handling of matters that may have transpired under the previous Council. He inquired about the R100 000 contingency liability mentioned in a case study and sought clarification on its utilisation.

Mr Mhlongo emphasised the need for transparency, particularly regarding legal fees incurred during the process of cleaning up operations. He questioned the cost of legal services and the adherence to supply chain management procedures in appointing legal representatives.

The status of the implementation of the Executive Strategic Plan was also brought into focus. Additionally, Mr Mhlongo raised questions about the National Heritage Council (NHC) and its status when members resign.

Concerns were voiced regarding findings from the Commission for Conciliation, Mediation, and Arbitration (CCMA) related to the former CEO. Mr Mhlongo sought information on the recommended repayment of approximately R900 000 and the current status of the matter.

The lack of an open presentation or conversation for the entity to account was highlighted. Mr Mhlongo sought clarity on when the current Council began its term and underscored the importance of addressing current issues without blaming the previous Council. He requested a comprehensive list of recommendations from the Auditor General (AG) and confirmation of their implementation status.

Regarding supply chain management, Mr Mhlongo acknowledged the clarity provided in the presentation but urged the Council not to blame the previous administration. He questioned the qualification status of provinces in the School Heritage Education Programme.

Lastly, Mr Mhlongo sought an explanation for the R4 million irregular expenditure, asking for a breakdown of the expenses and the reasons behind the irregularity.

Ms D Sibiya (ANC) addressed the issue of irregular expenditure mentioned by Mr Mhlongo. She noted that the audit report indicated an unqualified audit for the second year but highlighted irregular expenditure of R4.6 million. She sought clarification on why the entity failed to comply with supply chain management regulations and how it plans to prevent such findings in the current financial year.

Ms Sibiya inquired about the resignations of five staff members, including senior managers, during the 2022/2023 fiscal year. She asked for details on the portfolios of the resigned senior managers, the reasons for their resignations, and the impact on the organisation. Additionally, she sought information on how top management plans to mitigate the impact of these resignations.

Regarding the turnaround strategy, Ms Sibiya raised concerns about the resignations of four senior managers during the reviewed term. She asked about the entity's plan to fill these vacancies and restore the strategy's effectiveness.

Ms Sibiya emphasised the importance of addressing legal matters surrounding insubordination, corruption, theft, and fraud. She urged the National Heritage Council (NHC) to take urgent and assertive measures to expedite the resolution of these investigations and ensure a positive audit outcome. She sought clarification on the entity's plans to guarantee the prompt resolution of these investigations.

Ms V van Dyk (DA) inquired about the consequence management in place for the irregular expenditure caused by non-compliance with supply chain management laws and regulations.

Regarding Slide 15, Ms van Dyk requested the forensic investigation report into allegations against the CEO, which was completed in 2022. She sought information on the status of the investigation referred to the Special Investigating Unit (SIU) and the South African Police Services (SAPS), including the case number.

Ms van Dyk also asked for the status and a copy of the complaint report submitted to the Minister on the conduct of the National Heritage Council.

On Slide 16, regarding funding towards Heritage Education, she sought clarity on whether a normal school teaching a specific language, such as Nama, could apply for funding or support.

Ms van Dyk inquired about the reasons for the departure of the former HR, company secretary, and executive manager, requesting the exit report.

Regarding the individual who left the film and video under a cloud and is now the executive management manager of the National Heritage Council, Ms van Dyk wanted to know how many boards, besides the SABC board, the individual serves on. She questioned the arrangement of being a government employee in one entity and a board member for another, seeking clarification on the attendance and time commitment.

Ms V Malomane (ANC) raised questions related to the use of consultants by the National Heritage Council during the year under review. She inquired about the services provided by the consultants, the amount paid to them, and whether there was an increase compared to the previous year (2021/22), requesting reasons if there was an increase.

Ms Malomane's second set of questions was focused on the progress of the development of the exhibition for the Bisho Massacre Memorial Centre in the Eastern Cape. She sought information on the development status, any challenges faced in implementation, and the amount spent on the exhibition's development.

Mr D Joseph (DA) emphasised the importance of the current leadership taking responsibility for the challenges faced by the NHC. He acknowledged the entity's well-balanced representativity on the Council and praised the new leadership's passion, urgency, and turnaround strategy.

Mr Joseph raised questions regarding three final warnings, seeking clarification on the level in the entity where these warnings occurred – whether in senior management, junior management, or general administrative staff. He also inquired about the long-term plan for the office and its budget, considering the issues raised around the office.

Concerning the R62 million used for 6 035 jobs, he expressed appreciation for job creation but sought further details. He asked about the deferred R14 million, seeking clarification on whether it was in cash and inquiring about the surplus of R4.6 million. Mr Joseph questioned whether computers were bought in the reported or previous financial year. He wanted to understand the reasons behind the surplus. He requested information on the R896 000 legal costs, specifically the breakdown of the R600 000 related to legal services.

He also sought information on any legal disputes around the office. He asked about the entity's participation in talks about the malformation of entities, inquiring about the timeframe and potential impacts on the NHC's mandate.

Mr J Mamabolo (ANC) appreciated the effort made by the National Heritage Council (NHC) in presenting their assets and liabilities. He questioned the NHC's relationship with other provincial heritage structures, specifically mentioning the Limpopo Heritage Council. He inquired about how the NHC interacts with these structures, whether they attend meetings, and the nature of their collaboration.

Additionally, Mr Mamabolo directed a question to the CEO, seeking information on the NHC's international engagement. He wanted to know how the entity promotes liberation heritage abroad and if their activities are limited to Heritage Month or if they actively work with the Department throughout the year to promote heritage. He emphasised the importance of consistent promotion of heritage beyond specific months.

The Chairperson emphasised the importance of addressing compliance issues within the NHC. The Chairperson raised concerns about the NHC's qualification for an unqualified audit opinion with findings on legislation compliance and material misstatements. Despite improvements from the previous year, the NHC has maintained the same audit status. The Chairperson questioned the plans in place to ensure a clean audit with no findings, especially since there is a plan mentioned for March 2024.

Further, the Chairperson highlighted that the entity has been identified with material non-compliance issues related to a lack of monitoring compliance with legislation and effective implementation of consequence management. This non-compliance has resulted in irregular expenditure, a matter that multiple Members have brought up. The Chairperson requested information on the measures the NHC plans to take to prevent such irregularities from occurring in the next financial year.

In conclusion, the Chairperson stressed the importance of the entity presenting its challenges and plans for improvement transparently to the Committee. As a responsible entity, the Chairperson expected that the NHC should identify issues, acknowledge them, and present strategies and plans for correction and improvement.

Responses

Mr Neluvhalani thanked the Members for their questions and assured them that the NHC is open and takes full responsibility for past issues. He clarified that while the presentation could not cover every detail, the NHC is ready to provide more information. He addressed questions from various Members, providing details on irregular expenditure, resignations, and the stability of the entity.

Mr Neluvhalani explained the background of the NHC, stating that the current Council started in 2020, dealing with issues inherited from the previous administration. He addressed concerns about irregular expenditures, including legal fees and rental costs, highlighting that some irregularities were inherited and are being actively addressed. He made an example of a rental agreement contributing to irregular expenditure. He mentioned the current stable structure and ongoing efforts to resolve audit issues.

Regarding resignations, Mr Neluvhalani discussed the dismissals that resulted from a forensic investigation, emphasising the commitment to due processes and the need to take corrective action. He provided assurance that the current leadership is stable and focused on governance.

In response to specific Member questions, Mr Neluvhalani addressed issues related to the company secretary's resignation, appointments, and declarations of interest in other boards. He assured Members that due diligence was conducted in the appointment process. He also discussed the reduction in the use of external consultants and efforts to conduct research in-house.

Mr Neluvhalani concluded by thanking words of encouragement and commendation from Members and reiterated the commitment to transparency and accountability. He then handed over to the CEO and CFO to provide further details on specific questions raised by the Members.

Dr Lukhwareni addressed several points raised by the Members. He mentioned challenges with participation from the Western Cape in the schools’ programme, attributing it to the voluntary nature of the initiative. However, efforts were being made to engage with all provinces, aiming for broader representation in the future.

Regarding succession planning, Dr Lukhwareni explained that replacements had been made on a contract basis for key positions such as strategy, HR, company secretary, and legal. He acknowledged the difficulty in succession planning for a small organisation but emphasised their commitment to acting swiftly when opportunities arise.

He provided information on consequence management, noting 343 cases as a minimum of some form of consequence management. The company secretary would elaborate on the disciplinary process and system issues.

The Bisho Massacre Memorial was discussed, with the core manager set to provide more details. Dr Lukhwareni highlighted recent engagements with provinces on various projects, including the Bisho Massacre Memorial, with a focus on repurposing the project for greater value.

Concerning provincial structures, Dr Lukhwareni clarified that they typically do not have official entities in provinces. Instead, the Minister appointed a council member from each province to serve as a launching pad for engagements.

Dr Lukhwareni emphasised that heritage is an everyday event, not limited to Heritage Month. He mentioned ongoing events throughout the year, aligning with available resources.

Finally, he suggested that the company secretary could add further details on disciplinary matters if the Chairperson agreed.

The Company Secretary of the NHC responded to several questions:

Regarding the CCMA award of about R980 000 that needed to be paid, the secretary said that the matter was appealed based on the belief that the Commission's conduct was unbecoming. The case is set down for 06 December 2023, in the Labour Court.

He provided information on criminal cases that have been opened, including one for the CEO with case number 312/12/2021, and two others with case numbers 481/10/2022 and 482/10/2022, involving the former CEO as well.

In response to the Chairperson's question about ensuring compliance and preventing irregular expenditures, the Company Secretary mentioned that the Council recently approved a compliance framework, compliance policy, and regulatory universe. The Compliance Monitoring plan has been approved, outlining the regulations to be monitored each quarter. Training on compliance is ongoing, and a quarterly reporting mechanism has been established to address non-compliance issues and report them to the Executive Committee, the audit committee, and the Council.

The Company Secretary suggested allowing the Head of Core Business to provide more details on the Bisho Massacre issue before the CFO takes the floor.

Dr Thabo Manetsi, Executive: Core Business, NHC, reported progress on the Bisho Massacre site. A service provider has been appointed to develop the patient, which is part of the content development for the interpretive centre. The service provider presented a conceptual layout of the exhibition and the narrative that will be presented in the interpretive centre. The Eastern Cape Provincial Department of Sports, Arts, and Culture, along with support from the NHC, is working on the feasibility study and implementation of its recommendations.

The Resistance and Liberation Heritage Route is in the process of being enlisted as a World Heritage Site. The NHC is working closely with the United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO), and the project is progressing well. The evaluation meeting with experts has taken place, and the NHC is hopeful to present the nomination in the next financial year.

The NHC conducts various public participation initiatives every quarter, working with local communities, stakeholders, traditional leadership, and other heritage institutions. These initiatives include intergenerational dialogues, cultural expression initiatives, and more. The goal is to raise awareness about the value of heritage in everyday life and to use heritage to unlock economic opportunities.

Dr Manetsi emphasised that the NHC is active throughout the year, following a calendar of activities and engaging with local communities, especially in impoverished and rural areas where heritage is still intact. The NHC works closely with these communities and traditional leadership to involve them in important heritage initiatives.

Mr Neluvhalani requested the Chief Financial Officer (CFO) finalise the reporting. He acknowledged questions regarding assets, liabilities, and international engagements. Mr Neluvhalani highlighted the involvement with provincial heritage councils, international collaborations with UNESCO and Seychelles, and projects related to the liberation route that extend to other Southern African Development Community (SADEC) countries. He welcomed any additional questions and expressed gratitude for the opportunity to address the Committee.

Ms Manukuza said that Contingent Liability of R100 000 was earmarked for potential legal costs in the CCMA action against a former executive. However, she mentioned a successful cost order of approximately R160 000 against the same official during the current financial year – mitigating the potential impact on the NHC budget.

The management report for the current financial year revealed only one finding related to supply chain management (SCM) irregular expenditure. Steps taken to address this included revising and approving a policy aligned with current legislation, developing standard operating procedures, and initiating disciplinary proceedings against the current SCM manager.

Ms Manukuza provided insights into the composition of the R6 million legal fees reflected in the financial statements. Actual legal costs accounted for R4.4 million, while R2 million was allocated to settlements with former staff. Notably, the legal fees for the current financial year substantially decreased, indicating progress in resolving issues from previous years.

The deferred income, comprising R52 million for the project management office (PMO) and R62 million for the presidential economic stimulus project, represents funds awaiting full disbursement. The explanation offered clarity on the nature and purpose of the deferred income.

Ms Manukuza detailed the allocation of the surplus, highlighting that a portion was utilised for purchasing capital assets, including computers, office equipment, furniture, and fittings. The remaining true surplus of around R2 million reflected prudent financial management.

Emphasis was placed on the unqualified status of the financial statements, with only one finding in the management report related to irregular expenditure. A stark improvement from the previous year, which had over 26 findings, signified a positive trend in their audit outcomes.

She mentioned an internal committee, overseen by the CEO – as the entity responsible for ensuring good governance within operational structures. Regular meetings of the committee focus on monitoring instances of irregular expenditure, fruitless expenditure, loss control, and allegations of fraud and corruption. The overarching objective is to attain a clean audit report by addressing irregular expenditure, aligning policies with legislation, and addressing people-related issues.

Mr Neluvhalani concluded the responses by acknowledging the completion of the presentation and addressing an apparent omission regarding a question on the amalgamation of the National Heritage Council (NHC) with SARAH (South African Heritage Resources Agency). He explained that the entities within the Department are currently in the process of amalgamating, awaiting a legislative review for the necessary clarity on the case.

Mr Neluvhalani noted that the Department of Arts and Culture is leading this process, and further details would be provided by the Director-General (DG) when appropriate. He expressed the readiness of the team to provide additional responses if any areas were inadvertently left out.

Ms Tshikwatamba emphasised the Department's commitment to governance, particularly addressing the issue of an official who serves on multiple councils or boards. Ms Tshikwatamba explained that they follow the ethics and integrity framework, ensuring that members cannot be paid for their time when serving on other councils during NHC commitments. The official is expected to request leave when necessary.

Ms Tshikwatamba acknowledged that matters related to legal cases are referred to the Minister, and they are working towards their swift resolution, expressing a desire for the matters to be closed as soon as possible, minimising legal costs to the entity.

Touching on the amalgamation process, she confirmed that it has begun and is progressing through different phases. The initial phase involves entities not subject to legislation, with subsequent phases addressing those affected by legislation. Ms Tshikwatamba assured the Committee of a detailed report on the amalgamation process at the appropriate time. She appreciated the thoroughness of the questions and responses the Chairperson and the team provided.

Follow-Ups

Mr Mhlongo sought clarification on the existence of heritage inspectors responsible for inspecting and monitoring all heritage sites. Additionally, he inquired about the monitoring and evaluation mechanisms in place to safeguard these sites. His final question pertained to the number of heritage sites officially recognised by UNESCO.

The Chairperson thanked NHC for the presentation and indicated that there might be an oversight in the engagement with Women Makgoshi Leadership in the Northern Cape. The Committee suggested that a visit to address this issue during the first term quarter would be essential. The emphasis was placed on incorporating training on heritage and collaboration with traditional leaders.

Ms van Dyk mentioned that she would put her requests for reports in writing. She expressed uncertainty about whether her question regarding the number of boards that Ms Palesa Kadi sits on was addressed. Additionally, she inquired if the NHC Chairperson is also a board member of Sun Parks.

Follow-up Response

Mr Neluvhalani confirmed that he sits on the Sun Parks Board. Regarding the number of UNESCO-listed World Heritage Sites, he mentioned sites such as Mapungubwe, Robben Island, Cradle of Humankind, and Drakensberg. He explained that the management of heritage sites, including monitoring legislation and site management, falls under the purview of the South African Heritage Resources Agency (SARAH), which collaborates with local councils and authorities.

Closing Remarks

The Chairperson thanked the DSAC and the invited leaders for providing informative information. Guests were released, and the Committee would proceed with in-house matters.

Consideration and Adoption of Minutes

Minutes Dated 14 November 2023

Ms Malomane moved for the adoption of the minutes.

Ms Sibiya seconded the motion.

The minutes were adopted.

The meeting was adjourned.

 

These messages were shared on the Zoom chat during the meeting:

Mr E Mthethwa (EFF) to everyone 9:23: Can they expand on the type of these findings are (irregular and wasteful expenditures and procurement)

Mr E Mthethwa (EFF): In as much as we can accept that in terms of females vs men on the board, processes give not much power to enforce the balance, but in a case where the board is dominated by males, can the boards push for females dominance or balance to compensate for the lack in the board since that is within the powers and willingness of the board!

Ms Van Dyk 11:15: Thank you for responding to the question. Still needs to know on how many Board she serves