Candidate shortlist

AD HOC COMMITTEE ON FILLING OF VACANCIES IN COMMISSION FOR GENDER EQUALITY
26 February 2001
SHORTLIST OF CANDIDATES AND GUIDELINES FOR INTERVIEWS

Chairperson : Ms Xingwana

Documents handed out:
Shortlist of candidates for the Commission on Gender Equality 2001 (See Appendix)

[Note: The interviews, taking place over the following ten days, will not be minuted by PMG]

SUMMARY
The Committee discussed the shortlisting process. Certain members from the opposition argued that the process to date had been flawed as members were not given the opportunity to make further submissions. The Chair responded that they had received ample opportunities to give written submissions. Members of the opposition stressed that the most qualified candidates should be chosen for the positions and that this should be done irrespective of party affiliations, as gender equity is not a mainstream political issue.

The shortlist is:
1. Beatrice Ngcobo - 3P Dis, KZN
2. Priscilla Everson - R Gauteng
3. Manana Tlake - 4S Free State
4. Teboho Maitse - 1Z Gauteng
5. Gertrude Fester - S Western Cape
6. Siqwana-Ndulo - 4N Eastern Cape
7. Matyumza - 2M Eastern Cape
8. N Mayekiso - 2O Cosatu, Workers, Gauteng
9. P Lembede - 1L Economics, North West
10. Z Mlakalaka - 2X Eastern Cape
11. S de Bruin - M Northern Cape/Gauteng
12. A Kekana - 1G Northern Province
13. C Mavi - 2N Northern Province
14. D Matubatse - 3H Gauteng
15. M Xaba - 4V KZN
16. Jenny Malan - 2B North West
17. Dr Baai - A Eastern Cape
18. H Bhengu - E KZN
19. P Madonsela - 1W Mpumalanga
20. E Rapuleng - 4A Gauteng
21. R Manjoo - 2G Western Cape
22. Themba Kgase - 1H Gauteng
23. Sheila Meintjies -2V Gauteng
24. N Bhengu - F KZN
25. D Holele - 1C Northern Cape

It was agreed that interview questions should be based on the objectives of the Commission as based on its Act. A draft profile of the qualities required for a Commissioner would be compiled by members also serving as a basis for questions.

MINUTES
Finalising the list of candidates
The Chair stated that previous attempts to finalise the shortlist had failed as many members had absented themselves from previous meetings. She asked members if they had received notices of the meetings starting the following day, which had been left in their pigeonholes. The Chair asked members to decide whether they were going to add or subtract names from the list.

She explained that at the previous meeting there had not been consensus about the names to be included. The list was therefore based on the decisions of the majority.

Ms S Camerer (NNP) wished to include Ms R Kadali's name on the list as she felt that Ms Kadali's CV was very impressive and that she was suitably qualified to serve on the Commission. She raised an issue of process saying that the full sub-committee had not met and that the delegation from the Democratic Alliance (D.A) had therefore not been given the opportunity to argue their case. She stated that as the process had not been entirely 'kosher', parties who felt strongly about the inclusion of a particular name should be allowed to make submissions to a full subcommittee. She stated that even the Chair had suggested that the process had been flawed.

The Chair stated that the Committee should not be to long and names should be added or deleted accordingly.

Ms N Hangana (ANC) stated that it was unfortunate that members chose to absent themselves from meetings as it showed lack of consideration for those who attended the meetings. With regard to Ms Kadali, she stated that it had to be borne in mind that she had been appointed to the Human Rights Commission (HRC) which she has since chosen to leave. The Committee which had drafted the shortlist had felt that it was necessary for her to explain her reasons for leaving an organisation in which she could have made such a large contribution to gender issues. She stated that the Committee should return to the question of the length of the list.

Ms Camerer stated that she had no problem with the last proposal. It should however be borne in mind that Ms Kadali has always been active in human development issues with her main area of focus being gender and the position of women. Thus, she understood why Ms Kadali might have left the HRC to focus specifically on gender issues as opposed to the broader issues of human rights. She had no problem with pruning the list, but this should be done after parties have made further suggestions of names they want included on the list. Ms Kadali should be given the opportunity to explain her reasons for leaving in the interview. She argued that the most qualified candidate (on paper) should be given the opportunity to be interviewed. She complained that the process being followed was incorrect.

The Chair stated that the process was not flawed. A representative of the DA at one of the previous meetings had been given a list of 30 names, amongst which Ms Kadali's name had been absent. The representative had however not objected to the list. A number of parties had sacrificed very good candidates in order to leave the DA's list untouched.

Ms Sono (NNP) referred to the meeting at which the list had been reduced from 30 to 23 names. She stated that she had not been happy about the list, but had accepted it as she had been under the impression that this had not been the final opportunity to make submissions. Ms Camerer added that the subcommittee was supposed to sit afterwards. As this did not happen, she had been unable to submit more names. The only reason she had not done this in the previous meeting was that she had thought that there would be a further opportunity to do so later (as had been stated in the meeting). The Chair stated that she had asked those parties who could not be present to make written submissions.

Ms H Bogopane (ANC) suggested that the two DA members, Ms J Malan and Ms E Rapuleng be removed from the list to make way for Ms Kadali in the interests of saving time. Ms Camerer responded that she found Ms Bogopane's arithmetic problematic. She said that they were not supposed to be looking at proportional representation of parties. Even if this was the case, the DA was still entitled to more representatives than they had at present. She however reiterated that the aim was to get the best candidate elected irrespective of party membership. The person elected would be a multi-party representative. As far as Ms Kadali was concerned, Ms Camerer joked that she probably would not even vote for the DA, but for the ANC.

The Chair stated that she would not like to turn this into a discussion based on party membership. The list however had to be limited as there were budgetary limitations.Ms N Mndende (UDM) stated that she too had a problem with adding new names to the list at this stage.

Ms S Rajbally (Minority Front) stated that the list had been chosen carefully. She stated that it had been agreed that there would be provincial representation of candidates. She had been unhappy that KZN representatives had been omitted but stated that given the financial and time constraints, she had accepted that they had done the best they could.

Gen C Viljoen (Freedom Front) also stated that this Commission was not supposed to be represented according to party membership. He expressed concern that the only reason the candidate had been left off the list was that she had left the HRC. The only way to select candidates for the Commission was in his opinion, based on merit. It was important that Ms Kadali be given the opportunity to explain herself in an interview. He stressed that the question of gender equality is not a mainstream political issue and should therefore not be treated as such.

Ms Rajbally stated that the Committee should not open doors for members to come with further suggestions of names. She said that even she could think of a few names from KZN, which she would like added to the list.

Ms N Mndende (UDM) corrected the General with regard to his assertion that Ms Kadali was excluded on the basis of her having left the HRC alone. Instead, her exclusion had also been because of the fact that there were enough candidates from the Western Cape on the list.

Mr S Dithebe (ANC) stated that provincial representation has taken place as well as possible. It is natural that certain parties would disagree as to who should be on the list. However, in the interests of time he felt it best that the Committee proceeds.

Ms Camerer asked whether the criteria for choosing candidates would be quality or geography. She said that if geography was used as a criterion, it would be necessary to note that the Western Cape is still under-represented. She again explained that the basis of their argument is that the DA delegation had no opportunity to attend further meetings. She stated that this was a study group day and that many members had made special travelling arrangements to be present. The meeting could therefore not be concluded hurriedly without proper discussion and decision making.

The Chair argued that she had given members who had missed meetings the opportunity to submit further names telephonically or in writing. The Chair then stated that she had decided that the list should be pruned. Ms Camerer stated that she was happy to prune the list as long as it was the correct list. The Chair stated that this is the correct view according to the majority view.

Ms Rajbally asked Ms Camerer if the list would become the correct list once that one name had been added. Ms Mndende stated that Ms Camerer's assertion that the list is incorrect undermines the integrity of those who had drafted it. Ms Camerer stated that they knew that this was not what she had meant. The Chair stated that this was indeed what Ms Camerer was implying. Mr Dithebe stated that the view of the majority should decide the issue.

Gen. Viljoen stated that he did not agree that the view of the majority simply overrides everyone else's. If this was the case then he had obviously just wasted his time by attending the meeting. He again stressed that gender equity should not be treated as a political issue. The Chair stated that the issue has to go to a division, as this was the practice in any democracy.

Prof H Ngubane(IFP) stated that there are no IFP candidates on the list as there had been confusion with their CV's. She however stated that this was not an issue because all that mattered was that the positions be filled with candidates most suited to the job. She stated that it would be a pity if this became a party issue. Ms Camerer stated that they did not wish it to become a party issue either. However, although they would pursue the matter no further, they wanted it to be noted that the DA felt strongly that they should have been given a further opportunity to add another name.

The Chair reiterated that she had stated that members who were unable to attend should submit their names to other Committee members who could then present it to the meetings. She stated that she noted the DA's view. The Chair then asked if there were 22 candidates to be interviewed.

Ms M Magazi (ANC) stated that there were two Bhengu's on the list and added that one of them had to be eliminated. Ms Mndende felt that the Committee should be given a short history of the two Benghu's. The Chair stated that H. Bhengu had been Chairperson of the Youth Commission for the past five years. She studied at the University of Durban Westville where she had been a student activist involved in political issues.
N. Bhengu is an activist in the area of HIV/AIDS with her primary focus being on educational work in the rural areas. The fact that she is a young woman also counts in her favour.

ANC members agreed that Ms N Bhengu should remain on the list as she had clearly been contributing to an area that was such a grave cause for concern in South Africa.
Prof Ngubane totally disagreed with the principle of using kinship as a basis for excluding candidates. Ms Camerer suggested that the committee should at least look at their CV's so that they could argue on merit and not kinship.

The Chair said that the committee was prepared to interview 24 candidates. She asked whether this list should be cut down further. The Committee agreed that all 24 could be interviewed.

Ms Camerer was pleased that the summary of the candidates' backgrounds indicated when the candidate was male. She jokingly asked why it was specifically mentioned when a member was white and no such thing was stated for black candidates. The Chair answered that it was to show that minorities had been taken into account. It could therefore be taken for granted that if a person on the list was not specified as being white, s/he was obviously black.

Guidelines for interviews
Ms Camerer stated that it should be specified if a member was re-applying for the position. The Committee should also assess how they performed during their term. Ms Hangana stated that this information could be obtained from the Chair of the Commission. In addition, their CV's and references could also be checked. Gen. Viljoen agreed with this approach.

Prof Ngubane stated that it is necessary to have read the Act in order to ask relevant questions.
The Chair agreed that this was important and stressed the following as being particularly relevant:
-The reason for the establishment of the Commission
-The history of the Commission
-What the Commission aimed at achieving.

Prof Ngubane added that knowledge of the Act would make the objectives of the Commission clear. In this way one can examine the performance of the candidates who are re-applying. This would be done by examining the extent to which they carried out these objectives. In addition, serious candidates would have read the Act and this will become evident in the interview.

Gen. Viljoen stated that it was necessary to develop a profile of a Commissioner and what the Committee expects from a Commissioner. The previous Chairperson of the Commissioner could be asked to draw up this profile. In addition, he suggested that members from the ANC, DA and IFP work together to outline the definition of the post and what it entails. This can then be presented to the Committee approximately 30 minutes before the interviews commence.The Chair stated that she would be able to ask the current Chair to draft a profile. She stated that the Committee should meet 30 minutes before the first interview the following day.

Ms Hangana suggested that all candidates be asked standard questions even if the follow-up questions differ according to their field of specialisation or based on their particular CV's.
The Chair stated that standard questions would be asked for the first round of questions.

Ms Camerer asked if members of the Committee were free to sit in on interviews.
The Chair stated that this would be possible. Ms Camerer asked if they could participate.
The Chair responded that this could be done by passing a note to the interviewer. If so many people were allowed to interview the candidate, the interview could be intimidating.

Ms Sono asked which members would be asking questions on behalf of the Committee.
The Chair stated that she did not have the list with her but stated that all the parties were represented. In addition, the Chair stated that members could meet to suggest what questions to prepare. Ms Hangana asked if observers would get a copy of the questions to be asked.
The Chair stated that this would be possible.

Appendix 1:
Shortlist of candidates for Commission on Gender Equality 2001

1. Beatrice Ngcobo - 3P Dis, KZN
2. Priscilla Everson - R Gauteng
3. Manana Tlake - 4S Free State
4. Teboho Maitse - 1Z Gauteng
5. Gertrude Fester - S Western Cape
6. Siqwana-Ndulo - 4N Eastern Cape
7. Matyumza - 2M Eastern Cape
8. N Mayekiso - 2O Cosatu, Workers, Gauteng
9. P Lembede - 1L Economics, North West
10. Z Mlakalaka - 2X Eastern Cape
11. S de Bruin - M Northern Cape/Gauteng
12. A Kekana - 1G Northern Province
13. C Mavi - 2N Northern Province
14. D Matubatse - 3H Gauteng
15. M Xaba - 4V KZN
16. Jenny Malan - 2B North West
17. Dr Baai - A Eastern Cape
18. H Bhengu - E KZN
19. P Madonsela - 1W Mpumalanga
20. E Rapuleng - 4A Gauteng
21. R Manjoo - 2G Western Cape
22. Themba Kgase - 1H Gauteng
23. Sheila Meintjies -2V Gauteng
24. N Bhengu - F KZN
25. D Holele - 1C Northern Cape