Hansard: NCOP: Unrevised Hansard

House: National Council of Provinces

Date of Meeting: 23 Oct 2018


No summary available.




The Council met at 14:01.

The House Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon members, order! Hon members, let me apologise upfront. The people working in this building have disturbed the aircon; so they are still working on it. That is why it is hot. We might feel that it’s hot.


Mr C HATTINGH: Hon House Chair, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting of the House I shall move on behalf of the DA:

That the Council -

notes that rating South Africa in its latest municipal financial sustainable index assessing South Africa’s largest municipalities on operating performance, liability management, budget practices and liquidity positions reported that; a large portion of South Africa’s biggest municipalities are in serious financial trouble to an extent that they will need 22,4 billion to become financially stable;

that the South African municipal sector is currently in a bad financial state and that the current leadership in control of most municipalities has demonstrated that over the last five years and more, to not being capable of sound governance; and

that the Council debate the status of municipalities and its impacts on service delivery. I so move.

Moh T J MOKWELE: Modulasetulo, ke ema mo boemong ba EFF ...


That in its next sitting, that the House debates –

The collapse public health system in the country and the way we as the government should improve in terms of that. I so move.

Mr M KHAWULA: Chair, in view of this unbearable situation, can the Chair allow hon Khawula and the hon Minister Zotwana and others; to take our jackets off.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): I wouldn’t mind until we sort it out.

Mr D M MONAKEDI: Chairperson, I hereby give notice that in its next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the Council -

notes with outmost concern the overt looting and plundering of the VBS mutual bank which was the country’s only 100% black owned bank;

further notes that a report compiled by advocate Terry Motau titled, “The Great Bank Heist”, reveals how its architects and accomplices of politicians and their families, as well as politically connected business people and their associates looted almost two billion from VBS accounts of monies of the poor, vulnerable and the elderly;

further notes that amongst 53 people listed as the prime beneficiaries of the VBS Bank looting is the brother of the EFF Deputy President and the party’s Chief Whip, Brian Answer Shivambu who is said to have received 16 million and reportedly transferred 10 million to his brother. [Interjections.] Debates that VBS Mutual Bank report and
... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Order members! Order members! Conclude hon Monakedi. [Interjections.]


Debates that VBS mutual bank report and possible action that must be taken to ensure that all who looted and plundered the bank are made to face the full might of the law and repay their ill gotten gains. I so move.


(Draft Resolution)

Mr M RAYI: House Chairperson, I hereby move without notice on behalf of the ANC:

That the Council -

notes with great appreciation the Supported Employment Enterprises, SEE initiative of the Department of Labour to help create jobs for handicapped people who have borne the brunt of South Africa’s unemployment scourge;

further notes that according to Statistics SA, 4,7 million people live with disabilities in South Africa, of whom 10 to
15 percent are unemployed;

further notes that the SEE initiative current boasts 12 factories that are operating in seven of the country’s nine provinces and employ nearly 1000 people with disabilities; manufacturing some 3000 products for hospitals, schools and the police force, including furniture, textiles, metalwork, leatherwork, canvas work, book-binding and screen printing; and

takes this opportunity to express its appreciation of this project and call on the various government departments, provinces and municipalities to support this initiative.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.


(Draft Resolution)

Ms B A ENGELBRECHT: House Chairperson, I hereby move without notice on behalf of the DA:

That the Council -

congratulate the DA-led coalition of Tshwane for providing running water to 10 000 residents;

notes that despite the Soshanguve bulk pipeline to Stinkwater being initiated in the 2012-13 financial year; but due to an inefficient ANC administration, the townships

subsequently had to endue years of intermittent water supply;

further notes that through making it their mission to see all residence getting access to stable, clean water supply, the DA-led coalition of Tshwane has installed the pipeline supplying 10 000 households in Stinkwater, extension 2 to 8 with water;

notes that it is only under the DA that residents will receive the much needed basic services and clear indication that the DA cares for one South Africa for all. I so move.

The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): Is there an objection?


The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): In light of the object, the motion may not be proceeded with. The motion without notice will now become notice of a motion.


(Draft Resolution)

Ms T K MAMPURU: House Chairperson, I hereby move without notice on behalf of the ANC:

That the Council -

notes with profound sadness the horrific multiple-vehicle crash that occurred on the N1 between Kranskop Toll Plaza and Nyl Plaza in Limpopo on Friday,19 October 2018;

further notes that the collisions happened after a truck had a tyre burst and collided with several vehicles apparently claiming 27 lives including two small children so far;

therefore, takes this opportunity to convey our heartfelt condolences to the bereaved families and friends;

also wishes those who were injured a speedy recovery; and

calls on the law enforcement agencies to institute a thorough investigation on the circumstances that led to

this accident so that measures to prevent the recurrence of similar incidents in future, especially as we move towards the festive season. I so move.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.


(Draft Resolution)

Dr H E MATEME: House Chairperson, I hereby move without notice on behalf of the ANC:

That the Council -

notes that last Sunday, 21 October, marked the centenary of the life of Mama Nontsikelelo Thethiwe Albertina Sisulu, a fearless champion of democracy and a human rights activist who dedicated her entire life to the struggles of our people, the poor, the marginalised and the downtrodden;

further notes that the centenary celebration of Mama Nontsikelelo Thethiwe Albertina Sisulu will run for the

entire year and will be marked by a series of commemorative events under the theme, “A Woman of Fortitude”, in recognition of her courage, discipline, integrity, and love for her country;

lastly, takes this opportunity to recognise and honour the centenary of the life of Mama Nontsikelelo Thethiwe Albertina Sisulu, especially the indelible contribution that she made in the fight for democracy and freedom and her tireless contribution towards creating a better and more equitable South Africa. I so move.

The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): Is there an objection?


The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): In light of the object, the motion may not be proceeded with. The motion without notice will now become notice of a motion.


(Draft Resolution)

Ms L L ZWANE: House Chairperson, I hereby move without notice on behalf of the ANC:

That the Council -

notes that the President of the Republic of South Africa, his Excellency, President Cyril Matamela Ramaphosa has made a decisive undertaking to take the lead in driving a process aimed at improving the quality of health care services and speed up the implementation of the National Health Insurance;

further notes that the summit which was attended by more than 600 delegates from across the health care spectrum including senior executives, the private health care, medical schemes from pharmaceutical companies, trade unions, Members of Parliament, government official and academics, has been hailed as an important milestone in laying the foundation for addressing the challenges facing the health centre in South Africa;

finally, takes this opportunity to congratulate the Presidency in taking the lead in this important sector in our country and look forward to the signing of the Presidential Health Summit compact by all on the
10 December. I so move.

The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): Is there an objection?


The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): In light of the object, the motion may not be proceeded with. The motion without notice will now become notice of a motion.


(Draft Resolution)

Mr J M MTHETHWA: House Chairperson, I hereby move without notice on behalf of the ANC:

That the Council -

notes and welcomes the continued effort by our government in taking the improvement of our economy as a priority;

further notes that these intervention efforts include a job summit that has been conveyed in the beginning of October and followed by the investment summit to be hosted between the 25 and 27 of this month at the Sandton International Convention Centre, were over 800 to 1000 delegates from around the world are expected;

further notes that these efforts were spelled out by President Ramaphosa on his appointment as the President of the Republic earlier this year and the summit is aimed at also forming part of the President’s foreign investment drive to attract 100 billion in foreign investment and is one of the numbers of interventions that is hoped to lift investment and the cluster performance of the South African economy;

therefore, takes this opportunity to welcome the intervention of the government under the vigilant leadership of President Cyril Matamela Ramaphosa to work

tirelessly and with great urgency in ensuring that the economy of South Africa is rejuvenated to address the triple challenges of poverty, inequality and unemployment. I so move.

The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): Is there an objection?


The House Chairperson (Mr A J Nyambi): In light of the object, the motion may not be proceeded with. The motion without notice will now become notice of a motion.


(Draft Resolution)

Mr F ESSACK: Hon Chairperson, I move without notice:

That the Council notes -

the latest Auditor-General report presented by Mr Kimi Makwetu on 17 October points out that seven out of 10

government departments and entities flouted the laws and regulations during the 2017-18 financial year;

irregular expenditure has gone up for yet another year and remains problematic with rules, regulations and legislation continuously being disregarded;

non-compliance with the law and regulations accounted for R50,3 billion in the 2017-18 financial year, occurring mostly in supply chain management and procurement;

that the report further points to the fact that despite a ban on civil servants doing business with the state, contracts worth R255 million were awarded to state employees in the last financial year;

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Mthethwa, you can’t be doing what you are doing. [Interjections.] Order, hon members. [Interjections.] Hon Mthethwa, you can’t be passing a speaker that is on the floor between me and yourself. That is out of order. [Interjections.] Can you continue hon Essack.

Mr F ESSACK: I move that:

The Council notes —

procurement valued at R6,49 billion could not be audited due to missing or incomplete information;

this figure of irregular expenditure now rises to

R94 billion when the financials of SAA, SA Express, Denel and other SOEs are eventually finalised; and

that the Auditor-General made it very clear - there remains a lack of consequence for transgressions and the lack of political and administrative leadership within this current administration.

Thank you.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Is there any objection to the motion? [Interjections.] In light of the objection, the motion may not be proceeded with. The motion without notice will now become notice of a motion. [Interjections.] You want to make a point of order to whom?

Mr F ESSACK: Chairperson, through you, it’s just a point of order.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): To whom?

Mr F ESSACK: I meant, the objection has been raised on facts by the Auditor-General. I don’t understand how somebody objects the facts.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Essack, you are out of order. You are out of order.


(Draft Resolution)

Mr W F FABER: Chair, I move without notice:

That the Council notes that -

the EFF Deputy President Floyd Shivambu, who is already associated in the VBS Mutual Bank scandal, is seemingly involved in another scandal linked to a controversial businessman, Lawrence Mulaudzi, who is being investigated for a R300 000 request for payment to an alleged lover of Public Investment Corporation boss, Dan Matjila;

the Mail and Guardian recently reported that it had seen screenshots of a text messages believed to be a conversation between Shivambu and the businessman, where Shivambu provided Mulaudzi with the account details of his brother, Brian Shivambu;

the account number, registered in the name of Grand Azania, has been linked to the suspicious VBS Mutual Bank payments and now part of an investigation into impropriety at the PIC. We are also still awaiting the outcome of the corrupt R52 million tender investigated by the Hawks on EFF Commander in Chief, Julius Malema; and

this makes it clear that the EFF and the ANC are rotten to the core and corruption seems to be at the order of the day. But now, voters will have the opportunity to register and to vote for a DA government in 2019. We will root out corruption and take people and the economy forward.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Is there any objection to the motion? [Interjections.] In light of the objection, the motion may not be proceeded with. The motion without notice will now become notice of a motion.


(Draft Resolution)

Ms G G OLIPHANT: Chair, I move without notice:

That the Council -

notes with profound sadness and a great sense of loss on the passing of former Member of Parliament and anti-apartheid activist, Mr Eric Stalin Mtshali on Friday, 12 October 2018;

further notes that Mr Mtshali was a member of the SA Communist Party and the ANC who became a renowned unionist who mobilised organised labour protests to wage a concerted battle against the injustices of the apartheid regime where he played a key role in organising the Dock and Harbour Workers Union in 1951 and later the textile workers where he helped established the SA Clothing and Textile Workers Union, SACTWU;

further notes that Mr Mtshali was a founding member of ANC’s military wing, uMkhonto weSizwe, where he served in several

capacities, including as the Chief of Personnel under Moses Kotane and JB Marks and later served as a Member of Parliament; and

takes this opportunity to convey its heartfelt condolences to the Mtshali family, friends and comrades.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.


(Draft Resolution)

Mr O J SEFAKO: Hon Chair, I move without notice:

That the Council -

notes with profound sadness and grief the passing away of ANC stalwart and retired diplomat Moses “Bra Moss” Chikane last Wednesday night at the age of 69 following an illness;

further notes that Moss Chikane made a significant contribution to our struggle for liberations and he served

the people of South Africa through the liberation movement with utmost dedication and immeasurable humility as a political activist, Member of Parliament and an ambassador to Zambia and Germany; and

takes this opportunity to extend its deepest condolences to the entire Chikane family, the ANC and a society at large.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.


(Draft Resolution)

Ms T J MOKWELE: Chair, I move without notice:

That the Council -

notes that over weekend, thousands were displaced by a fire that ripped through Khayelitsha in Cape Town;

further notes that these fires destroyed everything in their path and took the lives of three people. But sadly such

fires are common in the overcrowded townships of South Africa created by the apartheid regime as labour reserves and which lack the most basic services;

further notes that the dispossession of our land is why our people are forced to live on top of each other in cramped unplanned townships without adequate building materials and it is these conditions which makes the fire in our townships so deadly and such a common occurrence;

also notes that many people lost everything in the fire and matrics who today are expected to write exams do so without any documentation, uniform or study material;

calls on this Council to send condolences to the families that lost loved ones and provide as such support as possible to those that have lost everything in the fire.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon members, before we proceed, I would like to take this opportunity to welcome Ministers present here today, Salga representative, our special delegates to

the National Council of Provinces. We now come to the subject for a discussion as printed in the Order Paper. Debate on International Day of Rural Women: The time is now: Improving food security and eradicating rural poverty. Allow me to take this opportunity to invite hon Minister of Women, hon Dlamini. Hon Minister? [Applause.]


The MINISTER OF WOMEN IN THE PRESIDENCY: Chairperson, Ministers, Members of the National Council of Provinces, Chairperson of the Select Committee, all veterans of the struggle for liberation, representatives of civil society and women’s movement and fellow South Africans, I am honoured to participate in this debate on the International Rural Women’s Day. We meet under an international and national theme. The United Nations theme is “sustainable infrastructure, services and social protection for gender equality and the empowerment of rural women and girls”. Similarly, our national theme for this occasion is “Improving Food Security and Eradicating Rural Poverty.”

Our strategic approach to this theme is guided by the 2018 state of the nation address, in which the President asserted that:


Radical economic transformation requires that we fundamentally improve the position of black, more particularly African women and communities in the economy, ensuring that they are owners, managers, producers and financiers.

We are also guided by the resolutions of the ruling party, the ANC and government to review section 25 of the Constitution. Our position as the women of South Africa is that expropriation of land, without compensation, must focus on women. Our task towards this goal is to highlight opportunities for building sustainable infrastructure, and to strategise on best possible ways to accelerate services and social protection for gender equality and the empowerment of women and girls living in rural areas.


Sihlalo kumele sazi sonke kuthi amalungelo abantu besifazane basemakhaya alingana nse namalungelo abantu besifazane abahlala emadolobheni.


Yesterday the Department of Women, led government, provincial government, Commission for Gender Equality, CGE, traditional leaders, civil society organisations, the private sector, academics,


the faith-based sector and feminists of this country as well as the Commission on Religious and Linguistic Cultural Affairs - to the trial of Omotoso. We want to congratulate Cheryl Zondi for her bravery and hope other young girls will follow her footsteps of uncompromising spirit. We will be planning towards public hearings that will address gender-based human rights violations in the guise of religion and faith. Maybe we will bring back the issues of women like Crotoa who was an interpreter for the Dutch and the Khoi and San people, who had three kids at the age of 15. We must know who the perpetrator of that was. At the same time we must congratulate her for trying to mix two languages and we ended up having Afrikaans. That is not spoken about because it was done by a woman. As we do so, we must ask about the land that the Omotoso church occupies. How is it possible that the lands of our ancestors are used to commit such heinous crimes? We must therefore consider an audit of such lands by faith-based organisations.

Religions and customs like Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Judaism, and African customary laws have historically failed to include women on the issue of land. Land is about our pride. It is about our independence as women. It is part for these reasons and other perversions on private land that we are advocating for the state to


own all the land. We think no land must be sold to foreigners. Those who want to participate in our land must lease it.

Chairperson, it is common amongst South Africans to refer to our geographic landscapes according to colonial constructs, particularly the South African Act of 1909 and the Native Lands Act, Act 27 of 1913.


Yonke le mithetho eyayisishaywa ngowe-1913 yayigcizelela ama- treaties nezinye izinqumo ezasezithathiwe. Ngakho ke uma ngabe umuntu ethi qala kusukela ngowe-1913 ukwenza isilima ngoba bayazi ukuthi nangaphambilini konyaka we-1913 basebenze ama-treaty ukuthi wena uzohlalaphi, wena uzohlalaphi, wena uzohlalaphi. Babelapho.


Since then, the urban areas have remained collective spaces that represent development, modernity, sophistication and wealth. The rural areas, in our collective mind, preserve the backwardness associated with African customs by colonial authorities.



Kodwa futhi okumnandi ukuthi noma abantu abahlala emakhaya bangabukelwa phansi kepha yibona ababhekana nobunzima bokulwa namadlagusha ayeqonde ukuzosiqeda. Ukubala la bangena khona ngithanda ukubala Inkosi Hintsa, uNdlambe, Ngqintsha. Ngiphinde futhi ngisho ukuthi kwamanye amazwe sinawo amakhosi abantu besifazane alwela umhlaba njengeNdlovukazi Nzinga wase-Angola.


Globally, less than 13% of agricultural landholders are women. Rural women are 38% less likely to give birth with a healthy care worker than an urban woman in low-income countries. Women are the majority of the population with the least access to basic services and needs, such as water, electricity, waste disposal and so on. The Department of Women leads and co-ordinates the country’s transformation agenda on women’s political and socioeconomic empowerment. Towards fulfilling this mandate, our strategic areas of focus include driving gender-responsive policy, planning, budgeting, monitoring and evaluation – auditing.


Sekufanele manje ukuthi yonke iMinyango uma ngabe yenza isabiwomali isho ukuthi lamaphesenti ayi-30 okuthiwa azoya emakhosikazini azoya kanjani futhi asiyekwe ukwenziwa izinombolo singabantu besifazane.


Abantu abayeke ukuthi bajahe ukwenza noma ukufika kulamaphesenti abawashilo. Abasihlukanise asifani singamakhosikazi. Kukhona amakhosikazi aphezulu kubekhona amakhosikhazi aphakathi nendawo kubekhona amakhosikazi aphansi ekuyiwona ahlupheka kakhulu ...


... who are at the bottom of the ladder of development.


Njengoba singamaphesenti angama-51 asiyekwe uku-‘ghetto wise’ izinto zethu azenzeke zibe semthethweni zibe ngendlela efanelekile.
Singajabuli ukuthi kuthiwe amaphesenti angama-30 bese sihamba sikhuluma sithi 30, 30 kodwa sibe singamaphesenti angama-51.


Okay, we must start somewhere.


Nezinto esinikwa zona azibe nemali ezozenza ukuthi zisebenzele amakhosikazi.



Mainstreaming the socioeconomic empowerment of women and building partnerships with key stakeholders, raising awareness, and conducting outreach programmes in advancing the struggle for gender equality. In addition, the department has completed the report on women’s access to credit, land and property rights. The report is currently available for discussion with key stakeholders.

Beyond providing women with the rights to ownership and access to land, we need to provide them with infrastructure. It is not enough for women to have raw materials without having the machinery and infrastructure for processing into consumable goods that will be competitive in the ever growing global political economy. The key to achieving this is changing patrilineage system to either matrilineage or bilineal systems.

We must also address pseudo cultural norms and values that perpetuate criminal acts and present them as a culture.


Akulona isiko lethu ukuthwala, Abantu abathwalayo abakuchaza ngako benza enye nje into engeyona ukuthwala. Ukushada izingane ezincane akulona isiko lethu. Ukubulala abantu besifazane abagqoke ibhulukwe akulona isiko lethu. Empleleni thina sonke la sasifaka izinto


okuyiziketi ezivulekile. Ibhulukwe lifike nezihambi kodwa kuyaxakwa sekusuka abantu nje bathi bayabulala abantu besifazane ngoba bafaka amabhulukwe.


At the same time, rural girls are twice as likely to get married as children than their urban counterparts, due to patriarchal customs that we have said are not part of our culture. At the same time, more than half of all poor rural women lack basic literacy skills. But also we have refused blatantly to use indigenous knowledge systems that rural women developed over time. The report on the status of women in the South African economy published by the Department of Women in 2015 found multiple challenges which continue to position the status of rural women behind the developmental strides of their urban counterparts. The report made clear recommendations to all social partners to work collaboratively to redress developmental injustices. The report calls on us to pay focused attention to the uniqueness of the experiences of rural women.

Primary to this development agenda is access to land. For rural women in South Africa and many developing countries, access to land and secure land tenure remain a source of security against poverty.


It is rural women who till the land and ensure food security for their families. It is rural women who strengthen rural and urban economies.


Ukuba abekho imindeni ngabe isala yodwa. Laba abahambayo beyosebenza eGoli ngento eyaqalwa ngokuthi abantu bakithi kumele bakhokhe ukhandampondwe into eyabulalelwa uBhambatha kaMancinza. Yinto eyenza imindeni yethu iqale ihlakazeke yangaphinda yaqina njengoba yayiqinile kuqala.


When it comes to owning land, accessing agricultural inputs, financing and technologies for climate resilience, women are left far behind their male counterparts. The consequences of these socioeconomic inequalities are a lack of schooling, health services, electricity, housing, and infrastructure. Fellow South Africans, our success depends on an effective project of mainstreaming a gender perspective in decision-making processes and in the management of natural resources.

We must also strengthen our planning relating to rural infrastructure and services, transportation and energy. Women and


girls fully and equally participate in the design, implementation, follow up and evaluation of policies and activities that affect their livelihoods, wellbeing and resilience. We need to support increased rural employment and decent work, and to promote the participation of women at all levels and sectors of the rural economy, including sustainable agricultural and fisheries production.


Lento yokuthi sasuswa eduze kwasolwandle into yokuthi nje KwaZulu- Natal inhlanzi isinandaba nayo kwenziwa ukuthi bazibeka bona eduze kolwandle khona bezodoba babengcono bathole amavithamini ne-Omega kangcono kunathi. [Uhleko.]


In light of the negative impacts of climate change on women’s livelihoods, the government is working to equip local producers with adequate tools to respond to these challenges. Our aim is to work with women farmers to modernise their techniques, to enable their access to technology and information on the latest global advances in agriculture, and to increase the value of their products by improving their methods of conservation.



Okunye kufanele sikwazi uma sikhuluma ngomhlaba, asiyeke nje ukuthi abantu besifazane bafuna umhlaba wokuhlala kuphela. Sifuna impahla esizokwazi ukuyisebenzisa, sifuna ukulima ngokufanelekileyo. Sifuna ukungena ebhizinisini ye-food processing emva kwalokho usungasitshela ngetayitela. Emadolobheni sifuna ukuhlala eduze kwalapho sisebenza khona ukuze singeke simose imali ngokugibela amabhasi. [Ihlombe.]


The realities of the struggle for the return of stolen land are that those who previously occupied such lands left with the instruments and implements of the tillage of land. This not only makes it difficult to till the land, but the colonial perceptions regarding African as irresponsible owners of land perpetuates. We must collectively end these attitudes by working together to support new farmers, smallholder farmers with the necessary tools of trade. Such discussion, however, cannot begin or end outside the framework of our Constitution. It is for this reason that we support the President’s call to accelerate the review of the property clause.

We have to ask ourselves whether we have created the necessary policy and environmental contexts that will further assist poor


women to lay claim to their Constitutional rights. We have to also acknowledge that when we started, we thought that the land issue would be solved easily because we are good people. We forgive easily.


Singazi ukuthi sizohlangana nezimbila zithutha ezingafuni ukuzwa lutho. Ezifuna ukuhlala nezimpande zazo emhlabeni wethu.


Our National Development Plan, NDP, recognises that women make up a large percentage of the poor, particularly in rural areas. The plan takes gender along with race and geographic location into account and proposes a strategy to address poverty and its impacts by broadening access to employment, strengthening the social wage, improving public transport and raising rural incomes. I thank you. [Applause.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Thank you. Order, members! Those who arrived late I have already apologised earlier on that the contractor has disturbed our air conditioner. That is why we have this situation. I have just received a note accusing me that I have ruled t support Khawula to say hon male members must take off their


jackets. Then I am perpetuating the stereotype to undermine – what about hon women comrades. In solidarity with them, I will have my jacket.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Order, members! To those that arrive late, I have already apologised upfront that the contractor has disturbed our air-conditioning. That is why we have this situation. But I just received a note to even accuse me that I have ruled to support Khawula to say that the hon male members must take off their jackets – then I’m perpetuating the stereotype to undermine ... What about hon women comrades? So, in solidarity with them, I’ll have my jacket.

Ms L L ZWANE: Chairperson, hon Minister Dlamini ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Order, members!

Ms L L ZWANE: ... hon Minister Zokwana, hon Minister Nkoana- Mashabane, hon members of this august House, let me take this opportunity to thank the NCOP for affording me this opportunity to take part in this very important debate on agriculture and how it can be used to develop our women to greater heights. We shall work to rekindle Mama Sisulu and Nelson Mandela’s vision of a democratic


society in which all citizens have equal opportunity to determine their own destiny. We shall achieve this not only through strengthening the instruments of representative and participatory democracy, but also by ensuring that people have economic opportunities and the ability to make choices about their own lives.

Mama Sisulu, coming from a rural province, was able to rise to the greatest heights. She did not allow anything to deter her and she is one of those who are recognised today as a woman who fought selflessly for the emancipation of women, and that was a noble cause that benefits all of us today.

The 2014 election manifesto of the ANC outlined the five pillars of the programme that seeks to address some issues in agriculture. It said that the ANC-led government will increase investment in agriculture infrastructure in support of smallholder farmer development in rural areas. It also said, amongst other things, that the ANC-led government will finalise the implementation of the Agricultural Policy Action Plan, strengthen agricultural production and agro-industries, and promote food security.

The manifesto also said that the ANC would roll out and expand projects that sought to enhance and promote access to high-protein


food, and that it would strengthen and educate women in particular on skills along the lines of agriculture.

Having said that, we are proud to note that the ANC-led government has done has done reasonably well to achieve the prescripts of those five pillars. Nonetheless, we do acknowledge that as a government we do have challenges. Some of the challenges that we are experiencing include that women are still given small portions of land that they can use for agricultural purposes. Naturally ...


... abantu besifazane abantu abathandayo ukusebenzisa umhlabathi. Ezindaweni nje zasemakhaya ...


... we can cite families ...


... uma ngingacaphuna mhlawumbe odabeni laKwaZulu-Natal ...


... I remember the Mbokoto family out in Harding where two brothers were studying towards BSc degrees at Fort Hare University. They went


for this qualification because their father was involved in cattle farming and their mother was involved in crop farming. They used to sell their products to be able to generate school fees for them to go to school.


Ezolimo umthetho wazo ...


... has great potential to raise the standard of life of any family if you pay attention to it.


Laphaya KwaZulu-Natal futhi, ngaphansi kwenkosi yakaNzimakwe ...


... there are women there ...


... abatshala lokhu okuthiwa amadumbe.


They’ve got vast tracts of land ...


... la betshala khona amadumbe. Uma bewatshala amadumbe vele kusuke sekukhona izinkampani ezithi, “Lensimi ...


... I am going to buy it. When you harvest I will be here with my trucks ... ”


... ukuzothatha amadumbe enu ...


... because these madumbez [taros] are used to generate chips ...


... lawa esiwathenga ezitolo.


In other words, this shows that if the Minister of Agriculture does pay attention to these women and ensures that they get all the support they need to further increase their production and get more into the market of these chain shops and other shops that want to purchase their products, we will do well as rural women.


U-Ntshantsha Majombozi waseGoli ...


... is using, not a food product per se but ...


... impepho, impepho ...


... we know it as incense, but she is not using it for burning but to produce beauty products. When you look at her you can actually see that this product is doing an amazing job on her skin and on the skin of all those I happened to meet and saw were were using the product. Now this incense, humble as it is, has the potential to generate business that can take a family to a level where they can supply beauty shops in Johannesburg. This is about agriculture.

Hon Minister of Agriculture, we appreciate the fact that something has been done in terms of training about 39 entrepreneurs in agro- processing. But I want to submit that this is too small a number, because we do want to get into the agro-processing market. It is okay to plant beans, but it is a step forward to ensure that the


beans you plant you can preserve, you can can and you can begin to penetrate the market and even supply markets outside the country.

So, these are the issues in that we must not confine ourselves only to subsistence farming. We need to be capacitated as rural women to rise to a level where we actually practice commercial agriculture, but we need extensive training to be able to reach that level.

We also do appreciate, hon Minister, that 123 co-operatives have been supported through the Farm Together Programme. They have received training to ensure that they exchange expertise and work together, because if we inculcate the habit of assisting women to women together they are going to achieve much more than working in silos.

The Fetsa Tlala programme is appreciated, but perhaps we should not focus only on maize, beans, potatoes, sunflowers. Yes, those are good for food security, but we must venture into other areas where we can encourage women to venture into growing herbs.


Amakhambi asetshenziswa u-Aspen ...



... and other pharmaceuticals, and if we can venture into that sector we can generate an economy that is going to be able to alleviate hunger in the families of many women, because women are the ones that are always worried about what is going to be eaten at home. So, let us empower them. The starter packs ...


... salabo mama abasebenza ezingadini nasemakhaya ...


Hon Minister, my submission regarding that is that in olden times days we used to have agricultural extension officers that used to go the gardens and guide. In olden times there were tractors for these women to ensure that they tilled the lands. There were tractors given to the chiefs in the area, and the use of the tractors by members of the community was regulated. Maybe those are the issues that we need to visit, as umntwana wenkosi is happy about that. [Applause.]

In conclusion, I do want to say that ...



... indaba yokuchelela akungabi yindaba yabelungu kuphela. Izinkasa lezi akungabi yizinkazsa esizibona emasimini abelungu kuphela, nabantu abamnyanma bayadinga ukusizwa ngezinkasa ngoba yizona ezenza ukuthi okuzophuma laphaya phansi kubeyilokho izimakethe ezingakuthenga. Abesifazane uma behambisa ezimakethe kukhona umncintiswano. Izimakethe aziyithathi into noma izidlo ezingakhuliswanga kahle. Ngakho ukuze sikwazi nathi ukuhlomula kulo mncintiswano wezidlo eziya ezimakethe siyacela ukuthi abesifazane balaphaya emakhaya basizakale.


In conclusion, guided by the National Development Plan, NDP, we aim, as the ANC-led government, to restore our focus on building an economy in which all South Africans can flourish, a rural economy which benefits the people as a whole. Thank you, Chairperson. [Applause.]

Ms B A ENGELBRECHT: Chairperson, worldwide, women and young girls face a cycle of challenges, highlighted by the #metoo movement, exposing the sexual assault and harassment experienced by woman.

Finally, it is okay to talk about our debilitating experiences that can destroy, mutilate and disempower us. It is not so simple for


rural women. Facing vastly different challenges, these women live without access to basic infrastructure, healthcare, skills or education. Such challenges are deeply rooted in poverty and hopelessness, and tackling their cycle of poverty, should be our biggest goal.

Extensive research has shown that the main problems of rural women can be divided into four categories: economic, social,
family and personal.

Economic and social problems are directly linked, where unemployment and a lack of income are usually connected with malnutrition, illness and alcoholism.

The inequality between genders in decision making, perpetuates the male dominated decision making culture, where rural women are largely dependent on male partners and social grants, making them vulnerable to social practices like female mutilation and rape. A woman's lack of education and economic independence contributes to her vulnerability, by preventing her from leaving communities and relationships where such practices are bound.

Often young girls, forced to take on the burdens of the household,


opt out of going to school and the cycle of undereducation is perpetuated. Hardworking rural women are limited to unrewarding seasonal wage work, and coupled with the demands of their households, they suffer from "double exploitation" and patriarchy, reinforcing a “vicious cycle of poverty“.

At the family level, rural women have an increased burden, physically working the fields and homes, with less free time than men, without the basics like running water and electricity.

Their daily lives are physically hard and demanding. In most developing nations, rural women remain the poorest of the poor.

Almost 60 per cent of farm worker households routinely experience hunger and food insecurity. For many it coincides with off season unemployment. The lack of access to schooling and healthcare, results in reduced nutritional knowledge, and coupled with living below the poverty line, we found that malnutrition has increased.

Their circle of life is a poverty trap, with low levels of education, lack of income, lack of self reliance, and self esteem. This tends to restrict women's possibilities to become independent and to change the trajectory of their otherwise dismal future. This


is compounded by their limited access to credit, health care and education, further aggravated by the global food and economic crises, and climate change.

Addressing these challenges is not simple. Research has shown that if women farmers had the same access to resources as men, agricultural output in 34 developing countries would rise by four percent. That’s 150 million fewer hungry people. With nearly 10 million South Africans unemployed, and 17 million receiving social grants, there must be an emphasis on developing young female farmers from an early age. This will reduce unemployment and poverty, increase food security and most importantly restore their dignity.

We need to ensure that rural women are given title deeds. Currently, only 23 percent of land redistribution beneficiaries are women.
Without security of tenure, these women won’t be able to access the economy and will remain in their poverty cycle.

Provided with necessary opportunities, women can play a catalytic role towards achieving the transformational economic, environmental and social changes required for sustainable development.

There is also a direct link between the health of our population and


a growing economy as poor health reduces productivity. The DA has shown that where we govern in the Western Cape, it cares for our women, especially with rural health, contributing to their economic empowerment. Due to the vast distances to get to health facilities, we have created Healthnet pick up points with secure waiting areas. In certain remote areas, patients are even picked up directly from their homes.

We also have the Women on Farms project. Through skills development, mentoring, and support, this cooperative program builds farmwomen's capacity, improves their economic independence and empowers them to positively contribute to the economy, ensuring food security on both a macro and micro level. Projects like this are vital in redressing historical imbalances in meaningful and sustainable way.

There is still much that can and must be done. We must break the cycle of poverty and this can only be done by weeding out corruption, changing our economic policies, reducing red tape, reducing tax and the cost of petrol, that we can ensure that all South Africans can be educated, to develop, grow and achieve their dreams


Where the DA governs, the seeds have been sown. By fast tracking title deeds, by educating and training, making use of public and private initiatives, and by providing easy access to healthcare, we will lift these vulnerable women out of poverty.

By empowering women, we will change the future of this nation. By empowering women, we will create a prosperous, One South Africa for all! I thank you


REFORM: Hon House Chairperson, hon Minister Dlamini, hon Minister Zokwana, Hon Minister Nkoana-Mashabane, hon MECs, hon members of the NCOP, distinguished guests and officials present, good afternoon.

Hon House Chair, in contributing to this important debate on the day of rural women under the theme, “The time is now: Improving food security and eradication rural poverty”, I would like to borrow from the words of Thomas Sankara when he said, I quote:

Comrades, there is no true social revolution without the liberation of women. May my eyes never see and my feet never take me to a society where half the people are held in silence. I hear


the roar of women’s silence. I sense the rumble of their storm and feel the fury of their revolt.


Wathinta abafazi ...

An HON MEMBER: Wathinta imbokodo.


REFORM: The Southern history is littered with many examples of how colonialism and apartheid has led to terrible suffering of women in general and rural women in particular. The rural women, as a consequence of this institutionalised oppression, were forced to shoulder families in the difficult conditions in provinces which were condemned into reservoirs of cheap labour by our former oppressors, as the men were forced by the apartheid laws to work in the mines for tax.

It is common knowledge that the triple challenges confronting our country; racialised poverty - because poverty has colour in our country - multidimensional inequality and persistent poverty mostly affect black women and more pronounced in rural areas.


The National Development Plan, NDP, states that, I quote:

Since 1994, the main challenge for rural development has been the need to combat marginalisation of the poor. This, required changes in access of resources - land, water, education and skills - rural infrastructure and other government services. Some progress has been made, with significant shifts in the extent and degree of poverty.

In light of these realities, it is important therefore that we conjoin many of our efforts in achieving the total liberation of women both rural and urban. We should all join hands in improving the food security and eradicating poverty. According to the Statistics SA 2017 General Household Survey, the Eastern Cape has the second highest number of households involved in agricultural activities.

These are part of our contributions in an effort to respond to the concrete realities confronted by the people in the Eastern Cape as one of the rural provinces. As a province, we are working hard to ensure that people in rural areas actively participate in agriculture through a number of programmes that we render as the East Cape province.


We are of the view that the continuing inequality and poverty are a result of the current structure of the economy which has not been tempered with and therefore it is systematic; it reproduces these inequalities. Therefore, this is the basis of the case for radical economic transformation.

Our view is that through these efforts of building primary production and empowering women as part of building capacity for radical economic transformation, it is important that as we work with other partners and not build a second pole. Some of those who join us, particularly those in the mainstream agriculture, join us on these efforts to provide support to us but it would seem as if they want to build a second pole that is left at a survival level and we leave them untransformed in terms of ownership and control patterns.

Therefore, through the efforts we are making, we seek to build capacity so that it can transform mainstream agriculture. We are embarking on agriculture development on emphasis on crop and livestock production, aquaculture, water harvesting technologies and others.


On crop production, our efforts are anchored on improved yield on field production — this is one of the areas in which we provide co- ordinated support to the people of the Eastern Cape as part of the efforts to reinvigorate food security and eradicate rural poverty.

We support deciduous fruits, pineapple and citrus production in the areas with rural women confronting adverse poverty, like Amathole and Sarah Bartmaan regions to mention a few. These efforts are proving to be yielding results and recognition.

Hon House Chairperson, I am delighted to announce that Ms Noluthando Mbilase of Greenwood citrus farm in Amathole Region won the National Top Entrepreneur Export Market award in the recently held Department of Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries National Female Entrepreneur Awards. She exports as far as Vietnam and East Asia.

On improvement of tea production, we have developed a number of strategic two initiatives in ensuring the improvement of the Magwa and Majola tea estates in the Eastern Cape and support the chicory production in the western side of our province. We are also involved in the production of industrial crops – hemp, sugar beet and chicory.


Throughout the Eastern Cape, the efforts and successes of this government, working with various partners on the livestock improvement, are visible for all to see. These include the red meat and dairy production; revamping of aquaculture infrastructure; application of best practices on wool and animal fibre management.

Hon House Chair, the national chairperson and hon members, our efforts in supporting black rural women are recognised and in another recent case, Ms Nosiphiwo Makhaphela of Sobanjwa Zinkwenkwezi project in the Chris Hani region, won the Ministerial Award for the Young Female Entrepreneur of the Year, awarded by the hon Minister.

The Eastern Cape is engaged in human capacity development with emphasis on staff development, farmer training and exchange programmes. In order to ensure that our farmers get the latest and relevant skills and advice, we are committed to continuous development of our extension advisory services and veterinary services.

We have recently renewed our memorandum of understanding with Lower Saxony of Germany whose focus is research, because we believe that in order to find correct and lasting solutions for the challenges


facing women and our people in the province, we have to make research-based decisions and our policies must be informed by research.

Hon House Chair, during the year of the centenary of Ma Sisulu, whose birthday we celebrated a few days ago and the year of Mandela
- remembering many of the people mentioned here; the late veterans, Stalin, Chikane, Comrade Makupula and many others - their work should serve as an instructive reminder to the current generation. They have made many sacrifices and died for the building and the bringing about of democracy. As the remaining generation, we have a choice whether generations to come, whilst acknowledging the weaknesses and limitations of Mandela, Ma Sisulu and others, remain proud of them because of the great country they have left them despite the challenges.

Therefore, it is left to us whether they spit on our graves because we have not been able to stand in helping rural women to ensure that our people are liberated.

We are committed in making all these efforts of building primary production in ensuring that we build capacity for transforming much


agriculture. We want to do this as part of building a women’s movement against poverty and against violence on women and children.

We are of the view that this struggle is of both women and men and that a precondition for a truly free South Africa, at the centre of it, is the liberation of women as they constitute the majority.

Hon House Chair, as a province, we recommit ourselves to continue with these programmes and escalate them to greater heights so that rural women who are farmers are commercialised and not left at the survival stage ...


... ingathi aba sebephumelele bathi siza kunixhasa nina. Musani ukusichatha thina ngotshintsho...


... as if we are building two poles of the economy. Our economy is one economy; a capitalist economy. We therefore want to build this capacity to transform mainstream agriculture for many black farmers, including those that I have mentioned, who have demonstrated how apartheid has denied the capacity of black people such that that which is good and success is associated with being white. These have


demonstrated that black people, particularly women, are capable of being successful farmers. We are committed to doing this work. Thank you. [Applause.]


Mnu M KHAWULA: Sihlalo ohloniphekile, abahlonishwa oNgqongqoshe, impilo yowesifazane wasemakhaya inzima. Kuvamise ukuba emakhaya kube ngobaba abafudukela emadolobheni beyofuna amatoho. Kuyenzeka bawafumane. Kodwa ezikhathini eziningi nawo amatoho awasacoshakali ngenxa yesimo esibi somnotho ontengayo ezweni lakithi. Loku kwenza ubunzima obusele nawo Mama emakhaya kube ngobuphinda-phindiwe.

Nohulumeni wakithi eNingizimu Afrika unalomkhuba owukhondolo owamungenayo. Konke okuyintuthuko eyenzekayo kuqala emadolobheni amakhulu. Uma kwenzekile kwasala izinsalela, bese kuba yima kucatshangwa ngabahlala emakhaya. Ibhajethi kahulumeni isika ingxenye enkulu yesabelo sibhekele izindawo ezingamadolobha nezivele sezithuthukile; ebese imijwacubane esalayo kube yima kubhekelwa ngayo izindawo ezisemakhaya. Lokhuke kwenza ngasosonke isikhathi ukuthuthuka kwezindawo zasemakhaya kusalele ngemuva.

Kungalesizathu, Mhlonishwa Sihlalo, ubona abantu bephela emakhaya befudukela ezindaweni ezisemadolobheni ngoba bethi bayozizamela


amathuba angcono nempilo engcono. Kuyihlazo nje ukusho ukuthi nabo abahlonishwa, amalungu ePhalamende kanye nawo oNgqongqoshe bangena ePhalamende bekade behlala emakhaya. Abantu bavote ngesasasa bethi bazomelwa abantu abahlala nabo, kanti lutho olubaziwe. Athi angangena umuntu, shwi nomuntekhala, kude kude eyothenga umuzi edolobheni ukuze aphile ntofontofo nakhu phela usenguMhlonishwa.

Kuyihlazo ukusho ukuthi kunamaKhansela amele amawadi asezindaweni zasemakhaya kodwa asafuduka athenga imizi emadolobheni, ahlala khona eshiya abantu ababavotelayo emakhaya. Kuyihlazo ukusho ukuthi kunawoMeya bemiKhandlu yasemakhaya asebashiya imizi emakhaya bathenga imizi emadolobheni. Abanye babo imizi yabo ingaphandle nakwemingcele yomasipala ababaphetheyo.

Izwekazi iAfrika uMvelinqangi walibusisa ngomcebo wezimbiwa ezinhlobonhlobo. Kepha ishwa wukuthi nangemuva kokunqotshwa kwenqubo yobukoloni eyayiqonela abase Afrika umnotho nomcebo wabo, sekungama Afrika angabaphathi, wona uqobo ahlangana nabokuhamba, kwebiwe kucazelwane ngomnotho namathuba kwizihlobo, nabangani, abantu abangabanikazi nabantulayo bona basale bencela izithupha. Loluhlobo lobusela lwenza impilo yasemakhaya ikakhulukazi komama iqhubeke nokuba ngenzima kakhulu.


Kuyishwa ukuthi ngemuva kweminyaka engamashumi amabili nane izwe lakithi lacosha inkululeko, kepha emakhaya abantu basantula amanzi ahlanzekileyo, abantu basantula ugesi. Izikole ziyavalwa ngoba kuthiwa izingane zinciphile. Imigwaqo iyimisele. Imisebenzi kayikho. Izindlu abahlala kuzo kazamukelekile. Izinsiza zokulima ukuze abantu baziphilise ziyantuleka. Izingane ziphasa umatikuletsheni ebese kubanzima ukuqhubeka nemfundo ukuze zibenemfundo ephakeme nezitifiketi zemisebenzi. Amabanga ahanjwayo ukuze kufinyelelwe eMtholampi1o made ngokungemukelekile. Izimoto eziya emadolobheni ziyantuleka, namanani akhokhwa kuzona amba eqolo. Lena-ke yimpilo yowesifazane wasemakhaya.

Ukuze kudle izingane kumele athwale igoqo lezinkuni ekhanda. Usuka nalo ehlathini elikude lapho ekade elithoza khona evika izimamba, namabululu, nofezela, nabadlwenguli. Ubuya lapho athwale umgqomo wamanzi ekhanda. Umelwe yindima yensimu emlindile ukuba ayilime, ayihlakule. Kumele zithi zibuya izingane ezikoleni libe livuthiwe ibhodwe eziko ukuze zingalambi. Yibo bonke lobu bunzima obubhekene nowesifazane wasemakhaya ohlala Afrika. Kuyishwa ukuthi ohulumeni base Afrika behlulekile ukumtakula lona wesifazane kulolu sizi.
Kunalokho baluqhubezela phambili ngokuthatha lokhu okukhona obekuzomsiza lomama, bahamba nakho nabangani babo, nezingane zabo, baya eDubai, e-India, e-Switzer1and, bayozitholela nhakho bona


amathuba angcono. Leli yihlazo lempilo elibhekene nomama wase Afrika.

Ngifisa sengathi ngelinye ilanga izwe lakithi lingaba naye ompisholo ozocabangela abantu abaholayo. Ngifisa sengathi ngelinye ilanga izwe lakithi lingaba naye ophethe omesabayo uJehova, olesabayo futhi ihlazo. Ngifisa sengathi ngelinye ilanga izwe lakithi lingabanaye ophethe uhulumeni ozikhohlwayo yena nabangani bakhe, nezihlobo zakhe kepha akhumbule abantu abantulayo abamvotelayo. Ngifisa sengathi izwe lakithi ngelinye ilanga lingaba naye ophetheyo kepha engacabangi ukuzinothisa ngenkence kahulumeni yokubhekelela izimpabanga ezintulayo.

Egameni leqembu leNkatha Yenkululeko sihlaba ikhwelo kwabaphethe oMengameli, oNgqongqoshe, oNdunankulu, oMeya sithi bakithi ake nesabe ihlazo. Inkatha ithi akenithuthukise abantu ngokweqiniso. Inkatha ibuza umbuzo ukuthi koze kube nini kanti abantu bekhala, belila benganakiwe ekhona uhulumeni. Mhlawumbe ke ningenzeli ukuthi Inkatha ikhulumile yathi: Salani senenzela uMdali. Nikani abantu izidingo zabo. Lesabeni ihlazo. Mesabeni uJehova. Sengathi ngelinye ilanga izwe lakithi lingake liphathwe ngowesifazane omesabayo uJehova, olesabayo ihlazo. Ngiyathokoza Sihlalo.



Nks P C SAMKA: Mandizibulelele Sihlalo ngokunikwa ithuba yi-ANC ukuba ndithabathe inxaxheba kwingxoxo yanamhlanje. Le ngxoxo ijolise kakhulu koomama ezilalini nokuqinisekisa ukuba ikati ayilali eziko. Ndivumele kwakhona Sihlalo ndithi, ngqanga neentsiba zayo. Uphando oluthe lwenziwa, emva kokuba sifumene inkululeko, lubonakalisa ukuba oomama bakhululekile kumatyathanga angaphambili. Kule mihla siphila kuyo, oomama bayinxalenye yokuphuhliswa koqoqosho kweli lizwe lethu. Bakwayinxalenye kumaphulo okuqinisekisa ukuba oomama bohlukane nokuzibona bengabantu basegoqweni kuphela. Loo nto iqinisekiswa nanguMgaqo-siseko weli lizwe.

I-ANC iyayiphila lento yokuphuhliswa koomama kuba sibona abanye babo bengabaphathiswa abanye bengamagosa olawulo kumanqanaba aphezulu.
Intetha yanamhlanje ithi masigxininise kumama ezilalini, lo nam ndinguye. Ndisuka kwilali yaseLusikisiki eyona ndawo yakhe yahleleleka. Kufuneka sizikhumbuze ngamaxesha apho ootata babesiya eGoli, beshiya oomama noxanduva lokuqinisekisa ukuba abantwana balala betyile. Ngaloo maxesha, iigadi bezihlala zilinyiwe zinamadumbe neebhatata, njengoko ebesele eyichaphazele umama uZwane. Ngelo xesha, umntu ongutata akekho usebenza emigodini.


Umama ebeqinisekisa ukuba akukho nalunye usuku abantwana bakhe abalala bengayifumananga into esiwa phantsi kwempumlo. Imigaqo- nkqubo ebekwe ngulo rhulumente nemithetho elawulayo ukuqinisekisa ukuba oomama namhlanje bakhululekile kwaye bakhona kulawulo, ibonakalisa ukuba indima edlalwe ngurhulumente inkulu kakhulu ingakumbi kwezoqoqosho. Masivume ke kambe ukuba isekhona imiceli- mngeni kwaye ingcinezelo ephindwe kathathu ebesifudula sithetha ngayo isekhona. Imigaqo-nkqubo karhulumente iqinisekisa ukuba oomama, ingakumbi abasezilalini, bayahlukana nentlupheko nokulala kwabantwana bengatyanga. Ezo zinto ziyimbali yayizolo xa kunamhlanje.

Masikhangele phaya kwiphondo laseMpuma Koloni, kuMasipala wesiThili i-O R Tambo apho urhulumente enika oomama izithole zeegadi zabo ukwenzela ukuba ibekhona into abaza kuphila ngayo kulo mhlatyana banawo. Uphindile kwakhona waqinisekisa ukuba iigadi zabo ziyabiywa bencediswa ngurhulumente wephondo. Yenzekile le nto amatyeli amaninzi kwaye ukuba asikayiboni kwezinye iindawo, masithembe ukuba iza kwenzeka.

Namhlanje sithetha ngoomama abaphambili kwezolimo phaya kulaa mmandla wakuNdabakazi. Ndifuna ukukhe ndikhankanye ongasekhoyo umama uMolo, othe wadlala indima enkulu, Mphathiswa Bathabile Dlamini


kwela phulo sasilibiza ngokuba nga-“Amakhosikazi kwezoLimo” – Women in Agriculture. Oomama baphambili ekuqinisekiseni ukuba amasimi ebefudula elele, namhlanje ayalinywa. Andithethi ngeentsomi mna, ndithetha ngezinto endizibonileyo kulo rhulumente esikuye ezama ukuqinisekisa ukuba uphuhliso lwezoqoqosho yinto engapheleli kuphela ngasebuhlanti koko luyafikelela nangasegoqweni.

Mandibuye kwakhona ndigxinisise kulo rhulumente olawula ngentando yesininzi owenza imithetho eqinisekisa ukuba oomama bathabatha inxaxheba ebonakalayo kuphuhliso lwezoqoqosho. Loo nto ayithethi ukuba urhulumente uyabakhongoza koko baba yinxalenye ngokuba bacebise ngezinto abazifunayo. Umgaqo-siseko uyancedisana nathi phaya kwisahluko sama-27 ukuqinisekisa ukuba amalungelo oomama ayaphumelela kwaye ayaphunyezwa. Umbutho we-ANC ukwazile ukutshintsha imeko ebesifudula siphila kuyo kwaye namhlanje sizibona sichebeleza nathi sinelizwi kulo rhulumente.

Ngowe-1994 xa bekuthethwa ngeNkqubo yoKwakha ngokutsha noPhuhliso RDP, oomama baabekwa phambili ukuqinisekisa ukuba ngabona bantu banikwa uxanduva lwesiqinisekiso sokutya okwaneleyo – food security. Lo mbono wawujolise ekubeni ingoomama abantu abaya kuthi baqinisekise ukuba abantwana kunye neentsapho zabo ziyaxhamla.
Sizibona sisisithi okugqithileyo masikulibale, sijonge phambili


ekuqinisekiseni ukuba umntu ongumama ukhululekile kweli lizwe, ingakumbi ophaya ezilalini.

Nabaya oomama phaya e-Easton banefama, Bawo uZokwana. Singabamba ongezantsi Tat’uNqatha, ukuba singakhe siyityelele la fama sibone ukuba kwenziwa ntoni na? Aba mama bazimisele ekubeni la fama ivelise, inike okanye ihambise imveliso eza kwenza ukuba bazingce. Xa sithetha ngomntu ongumama sithetha ngomntu onamandla. Mbone umntu ongumama xa ethe washiywa ngumntu ongutata eshiywa nabantwana. Uya kufika kumzi onomntu ongumama ufudumele. Kodwa xa utata ethe washiywa ngumama uyakufumanisa ukuba uza kuhamba aye kukhangela omnye umama kuba akakwazi ukujongana nemeko leyo. Yiyo le nto i-ANC ikhweba bonke oomama ukuba beze ngaphambili nezinto abaziphakamisayo ukuze urhulumente abone ukuba angabancedisa ngantoni na. Mna ndithetha ngomntu ongumama, ezilalini. [Kwaqhwatywa.]

Mphathiswa wooMama kwi-Ofisi yoboNgameli, ukuba sithe sayenza impazamo sabashiya ngasemva oomama asabanika izakhono namandla okubancedisa kwezi zinto sebe ziqalisile, siya kubenza ukuba baphindele emva kwaFaro kanti ngoku sijonge kwilizwe lobisi nobusi apho siza kufumana konke ebesikade sikufuna. Kufuneka ukhangele ukuba zinto zini ezi sithetha ngazo apha ezinokwenza aba mama phaya ezilalini bazibone beyinxalenye yalo rhulumente. Masiqinisekise


ukuba onke amathuba avelayo awayi kootata kuphela kodwa aqala kumntu ongumama. Yiyeke into yokudalwa komntu ngethuba uYehova edala. Wathi xa wayedala waqala ngotata waze umama wamcaphula kwibambo lika-Adam. Nceda uyilibale ke leyo. Zibuze ukuba ngubani na umntu obasisikhukukazi esiqokelela aba bantwana ade aqokelele nomntwana ongengowakhe. Ndithetha ngomama mna phaya ezilalini, andibazi abasezidolophini kuba zange ndiye. Ndiyibhaqa ngoku idolophu apha eBelhar kuba ndihlala khona.

Ukuba singurhulumente okhokelwe yi-ANC singaqiniseka ukuba sincedisa koku sele benako kule nto bayizamayo, eneneni siya kuthetha ngento yokuba oomama kweli lizwe bakhululekile. Ukuba singakhe sikhuthaze oomama kula maqumrhu sebewaqalisile ndicinga into yokuba yenye yezinto esinokuthi indlala yayizolo yinto esingenakuze siphinde sithethe ngayo. Lo mgaqo-nkqubo kwiSebe lezoLimo, amaHlathi nezokuLoba, urhulumente awubekileyo uqinisekisa ukuba oomama badlala indima ephambili kumashishini amahlathi nawaselwandle.

USIHLALO WENDLU (Mnu A J Nyambi): USihlalo weNdlu uthi ixesha limkile, gqibezela mama.

Nks P C SAMKA: Xa ndiza kuhlala phantsi ndifuna ukuthi kubaPhathiswa abalapha namhlanje nakubaphathiswa bamasebe kumaphondo ukuba


kuthethwe namagosa ezi-ofisini ayeke ukuba ntshingi-ntshingi. Mawahlukane nokukhetha - ukufuma, amagosa mawamamele into ephuma emlonyeni walo mntu ungumama oze kucela ukuncediswa. [Kwaqhwatywa.] La magosa alahle intyileko kwaye antshingi-ntshingi kwezi ofisi.
Enkosi Sihlalo, ndiyabulela. [Kwaqhwatywa.]


Moh N P KONI: Modulasetilo, ke rata go tsaya tshono eno ke dumedise maAforikaborwa ka bophara mo diporofenseng tse robongwe, le baeng ba rona ba ba dutseng kwa bonno jwa setšhaba mo Palamenteng.


Women are the rock on which society is built. We are providers; we are mothers; we are leaders; we are the nation-builders; and we are farmers. When the Constitutional Review Committee was travelling South Africa the women of this country told members of this Parliament that they want land. They want land to live on; they want land for schools; they want land for clinics; and they want land to farm. Many argue and rightly so that black women in the rural parts of South Africa are the most dispossessed and oppressed people within this country. We are oppressed and rendered landless not only because we are black, but also because we are women. The


dispossession and theft of land owned by black South Africans by white settlers is well-documented.

Black people were kicked off their land by the millions, and the black majority was squeezed into 13% of South Africa, while whites were allocated 87%. In the 13% women had very little if any access to land, as some traditional leaders used outdated practices to exclude women from owning any land. 24 years later little has changed, black South Africans remain dispossessed, and amongst the dispossessed women continue to be sidelined and denied access to land especially in the rural areas. Therefore, central to improving food security and eradicating rural poverty is ensuring women have access to land. However, before we go there the issue of food security must be looked at and more properly.

Technically, South Africa is a food secure country, meaning that enough food is produced for everyone. However, at the same time the country is household food insecure, what this means is that many households struggle to put food on the table. This is why so many of our children are malnourished, and are forced to eat cheap unhealthy food that comes at higher price. It is the women of South Africa who have to experience the pain of not being able to feed their children next to farms and shops full of food. It is them that have to go out


of their way often not eating themselves so that their families can eat. That is why you see the land thieves coming to this podium claiming or trying to advice us how to go on about the issue of land, and they are the same people who put us to situation that we are in today. Therefore, this is why during the Constitutional Review Committee parliamentary hearings women overwhelming called for section 25 of the Constitution to be amended.

The rural women of South Africa want land to be expropriated without compensation and we don’t need any white people to advice us.
However, while expropriating land is the most current and urgent task at hand, and it will happen regardless of what enemies of progress think or try to do to sabotage the process, we are going to take this land. How land is redistributed and allocated is just as important because expropriating land is not an end in and of itself, it is the means to an end - the restoration of dignity, self- determination, and the means of production to the people. That is why the EFF policy states that the state should become the custodian of land and allocate it to people. In this allocation process we are resolute that black women must be prioritised. When black women in this country start receiving land after it has been expropriated then we know that we are on the right path.


When women of South Africa have land to live on; when women of South Africa have land close to jobs, schools and hospitals like hon Dlamini said; when women of South Africa have land for businesses; when women of South Africa have land to farm; that is when we start to defeat not just food insecurity, but household for food security. Mothers will be able to feed their children and the high-level of child malnutrition will drop. The rural areas of South Africa which people once fled because of poverty will become vibrant economically active areas, feeding our country. However, this can only happen if section 25 of the Constitution is amended. That is why if this Parliament is truly committed to empowering rural women and ending household food insecurity, it will support the amendment of section
25 of the Constitution. Let us reduce claiming things that we know we are not ready to do. Let us focus on implementation. Thank you very much.



re thabile kudu go kwa gore le gona mo go Lekgotla la Bosetšhaba la Diprofense, re bolela ka molomo wa lehlabula le ba ...



... United Nations, UN, because the UN 2030 agenda is set by South Africa. When we said that we are adopting Agenda 2030, the international community adopted the Sustainable Development Goals for Agenda 2030.


Re thabile kudu ka gore ka lona letšatši le ke ngwaga wa bolesome re keteka Letšatši la Boditšhabatšhaba la Basadi bao ba dulago Dinagamagaeng. Letšatši le le ketekwa ka di15 tša Oktobere. Bjale, ka di15 tša Oktobere, Mošupologo wa beke ye e fetilego, re be re le Free State, Thabanchu. Re file basadi bao ba dulago metseselegaeng ba kua Thabanchu mangwalobohlatse a bong a dikgwebo a 12. Re šiile gape le mangwalobohlatse a bong a go feta 65 a madulo a morago ga boikagelo, re ba tlogeletše diterekere; re ba tlogeletše dipeu ebile re ba tlogeletše le menontšha. Re rutile sehlopha sa basadi seo se nago le tšhemo ka lekheišeneng kua Thabanchu mabokgoni. Basadi bao
... eya o tla iponela. Ga ke tsebe gore o ka se lle ge o fihla gona naa ka gore basadi bao ba dira dilo tše dibotse. Ge re fihla ba re bontšhitše terata yeo ba e filwego ke kgoro ya goregore.


They were not complaining; they were showing off ...



... bobotse bjo ba bo dirago. Ba be ba rata go bontšha gore ge o re felo ke ga gago, ga go na gore o tšee llifi.


There is a difference between being a farm labourer and being a farm owner.


Mola ba bjala dihlare, digwere, le tše dingwe dimela. Ge o nyaka sepinatšhe goba morogo wa dithaka, ba gona basadi ba ba selelago mola; ba šoma le diyunibesithi le dihlongwa tša dinyakišišo, ba tšwela pele.


We are not working in competition with the Department of Agriculture; we are working to correct the original sin of South Africa. There is restitution; there is redistribution and there is land tenure. There is post-settlement support that is needed.


O ka se fe batho naga, wa re go fetša wa ba tlogela ba le bjalo. Kgatelelo ya gararo ke yona e dirilego gore Mme Ntsikelelo Albertina


Sisulu le Mme Mandela ba eme ka maoto ba lwe. Basadi ba ba goletše dinagamagaeng ka moka. Go swana le Tona ya rena, Bathabile Dlamini


She didn’t read about this. She was born in a village. Minister Zokwane ...


... dilo tše ga ba di bale dikuranteng, gomme ba re ge ba etla mo ra ba reta. [Tsenoganong.] Nna? Le nna ke tšwa dinagamagaeng, bjale ka ge o šetše o boletše, a ke kwe ge ba re.


Hon MECs and Ministers, when we work on these things it’s because change must happen now. We mustn’t be handing over land and turn the other way. We must have post-settlement support for sustainability of the project because agriculture has always been there and the Minister of Agriculture has always been there, but when we do this to correct the sins we did not commit, we need to continue with
post-settlement support.



Ke ka mokgwa wo mohlomongwe bomme, bagolo ba rena le bomakgolokhukhu ba rena ba tla robalang boroko ge ba bona gore re latela mohlala wo wa bona. Mme Lillian Matabane Ngoyi le Mme Charlotte Makgomo Mannya Maxeke, mokgwa re rata go kgaoletša ka dinako tše dingwe. Nna ke nyaka go bitša maina a bona ka botlalo ka gore ke nyaka gore re ba tsebe le go gopola gore ba tšwa kae. Bomme ba, go swana le Mme Mmadinoge, ga se ba ka ba iphelela bona, ba be ba phelela gore ba bone letšatši le lengwe rena re le leetong le re lego mo go lona.
Maabane re be re kopane le batho ba Namibia.


We didn’t invite them; they came on a working visit. Namibia got their liberation first, do you remember?


Ba rile ba na le dilo tše dingwe tšeo ba di dirilego ba potlakile, ga se ba di dire gabotse. Ye nngwe ya tšona ke hlakišo ya naga.
Batho ba swanetše ba tsebe gore naga ya bona e thoma kae le gore go dula mang, gore ba kgone go tšwela pele; ba tsebe gore ba direng, kae, bjang.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Order, hon Mokwele. Order.



some things to learn, we still have a lot to learn from them so that we don’t have to go through what they went through. This year, the UN theme on celebrating rural women says: “Sustainable infrastructure, services, social protection for gender equality and the empowerment of rural women and girls.” We are part of the UN family, Africans or otherwise. [Interjections.] It is our own; that is why we will continue working ...

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Apologies Minister. Hon Mokwele. Hon Mokwele. Hon Mokwele, the hon Minister is protected. Thank you. Continue ... [Interjections.]. No, no, no, hon Mokwele. Continue, hon Minister.


what is championed at the UN. So, that is why the UN has only one statue at the UN headquarters - the statue of our first black President; the only statue on site, which is a promotion of Pan- Africanism in reality. [Interjections.] What we should be focusing on now is the indigenous knowledge systems that rural women possess, which they are born with, but because of climate change we need to


support them as we support young women through reskilling and also enhancing the indigenous knowledge systems ...


...tšeo ba di abetšwego ke bommagobona le botatagobona gore re kgone go tšwela pele.


... and work with these institutions of higher learning and research so that we advance that knowledge that we have inherited from “abokhokho bethu” [our forefathers].

When we talk of rapid land release and find out how we should move on, there was a call made by President Ramaphosa that cropping or planting season has arrived. We spent almost four months working on how we are going to make this year’s cropping season different with the current budget not ...


... yeo e tlago ngwaga wo o tlago goba ngwaga woo o tlago ka morago ga wo o tlago.



From Rural Development and Land Reform, we reworked on R500 million for post-settlement support for our people for restitution. The money must be disbursed before the end of this financial year. Three hundred million for redistribution must also be disbursed for support for redistribution.


Gonabjale, ge dipula tše di ena ...


... we must be complaining about land that is lying fallow because there is no support. We must put it practically, you can go home and say that we have a lot. So, we will focus again on reskilling our young people because we learnt from those women. About three weeks ago, almost a thousand of women from all municipalities, mainly rural, said that they are tired of confirming that they are moving at a pace, in particular, here in South Africa that is different from the pace that everybody at the moment is moving with globally. Even the World Economic Forum says that if we move at this pace, we will take another 200 years. We can’t; we cannot wait. We need to move with speed to provide our people with dignity.


This is the responsibility that we have for this House, the NCOP. In Schedule 4 of our Constitution, there is a mandate that is provided for, for this House. This includes how we can support agriculture, health and healthy population sites. So, we are here to let you know that we are behind you and we will work with you just as those women urged us to move on. We need to also focus on adaptation for climate change. It is real; it is here and it is upon us. It should be that as we said we will rejig the economic structure that has not changed, that is stubbornly wanting to remain what it has always been. It is in our hands that we work together to make sure that things change and change for the better for our people.

It is okay for a person to say that he or she will give one hectare on time to one family and look the other way. I like the fact that one of the hon member said that we should also talk to our officials. It cannot be business as usual when we are all saying that we are in a great hurry. If indeed they know what they are here to work, they should indeed be moving faster. Just as we all spoke in unison ... [Interjections.] ... can we please go back and make sure that as we continue to celebrate the tenacity of women and in particular, a woman of fortitude like MaSisulu and rural women, let us give them support in action because Africans say that if you want


to walk fast, walk alone but if you want to move with people, make sure that you walk together with them.


Bophelo ke leeto. Kopano ke maatla.


We have responsibilities. We have challenges, some of which we have not created – they are referred to as original sins. We must correct them fast and give our people hope that we are working together in action.


A re feng basadi ba rena, kudukudu bale ba ba dulago dinagamagaeng seriti sa mmakgonthe.


Let us get into action; lets’ all go back and work together to achieve results because we don’t have time. Thank you. [Applause.]

Ms N P KONI: Chair, hon Motlashuping cannot do what he is doing, complaining about air conditioners. Some of us are working on the ground here, we don’t need those things of air conditioned rooms.


Work must continue. So, if he feels that he has got hot flushes, he must go out.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): The hon member Koni, you are out of order. Can I now call on the MEC from Western Cape, for Transport and Public Works, hon W Philander. Over to you!

Ms W PHILANDER (Western Cape): Transport and Public Works Committee): Chairperson, just a correction: I am an MPL and a standing member of the committee; not MEC as yet.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms. M C Dikgale): Thanks for the correction!

Ms W PHILANDER (Western Cape: Transport and Public Works Committee): Let us today bring practice to the principle of, “Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime”. By teaching their equal counterparts to farm and feed a village for a lifetime. Rural women account for a third of the world’s population. This position allows the rural women to take ownership and grow much of our domestic agricultural produce.

The mobilisation and advancement of their agency is thus vital for the development of rural communities, addressing the concern of food


security and a step in the right direction in the eradication of poverty. This, being a sustainable practice by nature, has the potential to strengthen the economy from a gender-equal approach.

However, the rural woman’s progress is countered by inherent gender inequalities and discrimination which is felt even worse by these women in particular. Many rural women battle with poor reproductive health and early marriage which escalates barriers to education and employment whilst already playing a crucial yet unrecognised role in crop production, livestock care and provision of food for families. Not to mention, non-existent remuneration for jobs formally undertaken by these rural women.

Despite the density of the agricultural environment in South Africa and location of the rural women that provides access to opportunities for the rural woman, women lack the necessary basic literacy skills to actively engage in the sector and provide quality performance. Learnership opportunities have remained limited towards women, which disables the rural woman to gain quality jobs and promote their well-being.

It is evident that the agricultural sector is dominated by males: Across 104 countries, less than 13% of women are landholders which


hinders opportunities for income towards households or credit grants for agricultural practice. Poor access to ICT technologies in rural areas is a challenge in its own right, limiting alternative economic opportunities. Grants towards infrastructural upgrades in this regard have been too slow.

During community conversations held by community based organisations, CBOs, food security is prevalent in the Western Cape, along with the unique pressure of female headed households. The functioning of community gardens offers tangible platforms for action and mobility. Education on nutrition and workshops to advance this development is crucial. Women’s holistic health and well-being should also be addressed — this is a struggle on its own.

Despite the extensive challenges, the annual report on agriculture in the Western Cape provides that 93 community food security projects, 16 school gardens and 1 080 household gardens have been implemented to support and enhance own food production, and to address the concern of food insecurity.

I find it very funny that when is comes to debate, all sorts of reports pop up that stakeholders need to engage to. There is certainly more space for women within the agricultural sector. To


make opportunities a reality, the playing field needs to be levelled by upscaling support services. We urge investment to build capacity in terms of education and training and programming community gardens to ease the burden of food insecurity.

In addition, farmers are encouraged to support and develop female farming towards production assistants and involve women in planning to drive the potential provided above. As the proof is in the soil, an outstanding woman in the Hexvallei, Western Cape, who started out as a general worker and now managing three farms which emerged through the Farmworkers Association programme. True and tangible rural women empowerment! So there are many more examples of rural women upliftment: True life-changing stories!

In its turn, the Western Cape takes pride in winning 12 awards, including four gold medals. Jacky Goliath owner and founder of the only black-owned nursery won gold for Best Woman LandCarer. Minister Winde aims to implement her success story across the Western Cape.
Jacky was also the winner of the 2012 national Female Entrepreneur Award in the commercial category.

Denise Stubbs of Thokozani Wines along with Berene Daniels and Carmen Stevens previous winners of the Female Entrepreneur in


Agriculture has received awards for their wine making in the Western Cape. The Western Cape Government, as part of its Project Khulisa goals, is aiming to double wine exports to China and Angola, and promoting black and women-owned brands on the international market is part of this strategy.

In addition, 4 314 women were reached through the Department of Agriculture’s support of community food gardens between 2010 and 2018. This is what our rural communities and specifically our rural women need. We do not need a Ministry that is cheerleading. We do not need a Ministry that turns a blind eye to the real needs of our women. Our Minister is fast asleep when it comes to the real needs and changing the lives of our rural people. [Applause.]

I wish to urge and stress the fact to the Department of Women to initiate policy and build budgetary capacity to improve the livelihoods of our rural women. Chairperson, dare I ask if the Department of Women is recognising rural woman at all? Except for during election times — like in this time of by-election in De Doorns, Jesse Duarte is out today in full force campaigning - nothing to do with the inequalities and injustices and the true emancipation of our rural women and communities as a whole. That is a shame!


Allow me to challenge the Department of Women to fulfil their mandate and recognise the rural woman’s potential for social and economic development. As the success of rural development lies in the empowerment of women, it is evident that the potential for rural women have unfortunately grossly been neglected and ignored by the relevant Ministries.

What gives us hope is come next year. We will have a DA-led Ministry that will truly see to the need of all women — irrespective of your party political affiliation. No women will be left behind. One South Africa for all! I salute all my sisters in the rural areas across the lengths and breadths of our beautiful country. I wish to ensure that they are an important part of this country’s economy and well- being. We appreciate and value their input and contribution. I thank you. [Applause.]



mandibulise bonke abaPhathiswa abakhoyo namalungu ahloniphekileyo alapha namhlanje.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Minister, my apology. Please, take your seat.



Moh T J MOKWELE: Modulasetilo, batho ba DA fa ba ngangisana ... [Tsenoganong.]


HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mokwele, why are you standing?

Ms T J MOKWELE: Chairperson, on a point of privilege: When the DA people debate, they perform. So, I want to check ...


... gore a go na le dithuto tse ba di bonang tsa gore fa ba ngangisana ba bue ka tsela eo ba buang ka yona?


All of them, they are doing the same thing.

HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mokwele, you know very well that you are out of order. That is not a point of privilege. Take your seat. You are out of order, hon Mokwele. [Interjections.] Take your seat and be quiet.



It is a great honour for me to address the NCOP in a year when South Africa is united in its diversity to celebrate the centenary of this legendary apartheid struggle hero, Nelson Mandela, and Albertina Nontsikelelo Sisulu. All of us South Africans are proud of our heritage.


Xa uqala ukuzithutha usebenzisa imvelaphi yakho uze uzibonge ngeenkosi zakho. Ukhona kodwa umbutho ongakwaziyo ukuzithutha. Ongakwaziyo nokuthutha uPik Botha, uMalan noVerwoerd lo wabenza bagcakamela ilanga sabe thina sityiwa yingqele; bombatha ezishushu iingubo thina sityiwa yindlala; bonwaba, botha ilanga thina sisemigodini sisokola; bengawakhi amanzi, iintloko zabo ziinenwele ezinde kuba abakhuthukanga bona; bevuyela nje ukuba bemhlophe ngebala kwaye besingcikiva besenza izinto ezingapheliyo kweli lizwe.

Xa kunamhlanje abo bantu bazalwe izolo. Bathi ingcinezelo abayazi kwaye babengekho ngethuba layo. Kungoko ke bengakwazi nokuzithutha kuba siyabuza kwi-DA ukuba liphi na ikamva labo. Sihambisa sibuze ukuba ngoobani izinyanya zakho? Unqula bani phambi kokuba uthethe? Ingathi ngabantu aba bazalwe izolo kuba bathi uMadiba ngumntu wabo


kodwa izolo oku bebemfake entolongweni bengamazi. Noxa kunjalo, masivume sithi nguMzantsi Afrika omtsha kwaye sonke masiphefumle.

Ohloniphekileyo ohleli apha ecaleni kwam uthi iDA ayiyazi ingcinezelo.


De Doorns is een van die dorpe in die Wes-Kaap.


The people of De Doorns are poverty-stricken and unemployed. They want to strike this week. If you stand on this podium and claim that there is no racism, ... By the way, you admit that the issue that the Deputy Secretary General, DSG, of the ANC is dealing with is about people who have an injustice. How can there be injustice in an area that is controlled by the DA for many years and you speak as if you are from heaven where no racism exits. You must tell us.

Let me mention just a few issues to show that our nations and tribes were driven away from their land. Batlokwa was led by Sikonye. When he passed on, his mother came to lead as a regent and defended their country so that her people have land. The land that we are living on is not a given. There were nine wars fought in the Eastern Cape.



Imfazwe ephambi kweyokugqibela eyaliwayo yiMfazwe yeZembe. Kuthiwa umntu waba izembe kwaliwa kwaqhuma uthuli. Kuyacaca ukuba kudala sanyanyeka kweli lizwe. La madoda awasincancanga nje kuphela amandla ethu koko axuthe nelizwe aze abelana ngalo alinika iziduko nezibongo. Sisonke namaNama, amaKhoyi namaSan ...


... were together with the Africans, fighting to defend our country. What a shame it is today to have a person who says that there were no racism and apartheid. Where are we now?


Ulwandle balitya balenza elabo, balivukuza kodwa ngethamsanqa uMongameli weli lizwe kule veki iphelileyo ebephaya kula mhlaba kankosi ebethetha kuqala emele i-IFP. Babephethe phaya oonkosi KwaZulu-Natal kodwa zange babanike umhlaba abantu bakwaMkhwanazi kodwa bawunikwe ngumbutho we-ANC ...


... 4 258 hectares of forest land already planted ...



... ubuyiselwe aba bantu batsho banesidima...


... 233 hectares of sugar cane was given so that ...


... nabo bangcamle inkululeko. Ibuhlungu maqabane into yokuba siyilibale inyaniso emilebeni yethu ngenxa yokuba sifuna ukubukeleka kumaqonga okuthetha. Mathol’anyonga’nde ngokuzalana, masiyazi ukuba kweli lizwe bakhona abanye abantu abangcikivekayo khona ukuze abanye babenezisu ezikhulu. Babephila kabuhlungu kuba ubisi lokugqibela lalinikwa abalandela emva kwabo.

Yiyo loo nto sisithi siyi-ANC le ngxoxo ibalulekile kodwa ifuna kukhokeliswe inyaniso ngaphambili. Amadoda anyanzeleka ukuba ayishiye imizi yabo aye kusebenza emigodini ukuze akwazi ukuhlawula irhafu. Le rhafu ifunwa ngumntu ongumfiki elizweni lakho.


We were forced to work in the mines. Do you wonder who remained behind? Women who became producers of food remained behind. [Interjections.] Women made a point of it to ensure that, in every home and village, there is a fire in the evening, there is food for


the children. Those women ensured that their children go to school. Those rural women were courageous. They were not only oppressed. The pass laws were the last straw that they could take as women and they decided to march.


Xa sifika kulo mbandela ndiyacela thina bantu bantsundu bezopolitiko ukuba singayilibali imvelaphi yethu. Sisenokungavani ngezimvo kodwa sovane kwinto enye nje kuphela, sonke singamakhoboka okuhlupheka kucalu-calulo ngokobuhlanga.


You may be a Khoi or a Xhosa-speaking person, you may be a Zulu, but all of us in the face of apartheid were the same.


Iinkosi zethu zangcwatywa zingenantloko. Ukuba loo nto ufuna ukuyazi yiya phaya kulaa mhlaba waseLimpopo, eGroblerskloof.


Her grandfather was buried without his head.



Uye eMpuma Koloni, uHintsa wangcwatywa engenantloko kuba yenziwa into yokudlala e-Europe ngamadoda awathatha ilizwe lethu. Le mbali kufuneka sombele ngayo kwaye siyincome sibulele koomama kuba basenzela isidima. Akufunekanga ukuba sithi oomama ayikho into abayenzileyo. Kwisebe endikulo mna, rhoqo ngeyeThupha siba nomsitho apho oomama babonisa izakhono zabo.


This event is called the Woman Entrepreneur of the Year. Last week I was in...


... izolo elinye, manditsho njalo, bendise-Orlando, e-USA apho amadoda amadala amhlophe anemikhaba ebethengisa imifuno neziqhamo. Bekungekho nomnye umntu ongumama obephakathi kwabo. Bathi oomama basezi-ofisini xa bendibuza ukuba baphi. Bonke banezisu ezikhulu kwaye bamhlophe akukho namnye kubo ontsundu. IMpuma Koloni ibikade inelungelo elilodwa...


... of being the only province that can sell its produce to the USA. That is going to end. They are going to compete with other


provinces. We have changed that. There cannot be seclusion of other people when we deal with food security and markets.


Bathi abanye abantu urhulumente akasebenzi.


What a dream! What a bad dream!


Oomama bakwaSokhulu KwaZulu-Natal banelungelo lokuvuna iimbaza elwandle abalinikwe ngulo rhulumente uphetheyo. Bendiphaya kuMntla Kapa kule nyanga ephelileyo siye kunikezela ngelungelo lokuloba...


... without paying a cent for 15 years.


Siya eMpuma Koloni naKwaZulu-Natal siphinde size apha eKapa, mama




... to do what the DA has not done and that is to give black people the right to access fish and to ensure that they can process and sell it. [Applause.] Whether the DA likes it or not; it is going to happen.

Women have a right ...

Ms T J MOKWELE: Chairperson, on a point of order: We cannot applaud the Minister for doing his work. It is part of his work. We cannot praise a fish for swimming. That is your work. You are supposed to do that. That is why you are the Minister of Agriculture. So, there is nothing unique about the fact that you have given 16 people a licence to fish. There is nothing different. It is your work.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mokwele, you are totally out of order.


LETONA LA TEMO, MERU LE BOTSHWASI: Ke a leboha, mme Mokwele, motswalle wa ka! Re tla bua ka thoko ka tseo; ha re no di bua mona, ke tsa botswalle.



In the department, we have created a credit system or scheme to make sure that women have access to funding so that you are not only competing with people who have money. Agriculture is not about producing; it is about access to markets. Without markets we will not progress.

Fisheries are not about catching a fish. Fishing is so funny. Fish don’t meet to create other fish. They swim in the same area and the female deposits eggs and the male responds by the accretion of its own seeds. Then spawning takes place and fish reproduce.

I am telling you that there is no waste when it comes to fish. The skin is used for belts, the steak is used for meat and the bones are processed into fish meal. The intestines are processed into liquid fertiliser. When you eat fish in the evenings, you will not have a heavy stomach.

So, our people deserve fish. I want to say that under this government, Africans will have access to fish. The DA has done it, but not the other parties. [Applause.]



Siyile eChina, savunyelwa ukuba sithumele umbona safumana nelungelo lokuthumela ama-apile, ukutya kwentlanzi nenyama yeenkomo zethu. [Interjections.]


Not yet milk. Leave that ...


... motswalle, re tla e bua ka ntle.


Baphinda bathi ngoku bafuna ilusini.


If there is no women component of that, we have not achieved. We need to make sure that these markets are accessed by everybody in this country. Women can do everything that men can do. What they need is only the chance given by a government that cares, not because elections are coming but because of the people.

When I am done speaking here, I will be driving to Mossel Bay. There are poverty-stricken people who sleep under trees in a province led by the DA. Tomorrow, we are giving them free food and we are giving


them instruments to work with, to ensure that agriculture is not only for a particular nation.

Forestry will be accessed by our people. You can come here ... [Inaudible.] ... for more than two terms, but you have done nothing. What you have done was to say that blacks cannot swim in white oceans. That is what your forefathers have done. The ANC is saying that you can swim, but you can go beyond that and access fish and business interests. We have changed the world; not you. [Applause.]

Mr M M CHABANGU: Chairperson, on a point of order: The Minister must not scare the hon member of the DA by talking directly to her. That is not parliamentary.

HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Chabangu, I have been listening to the Minister and he is debating. Please, take your seat and listen.



Ek sal dit nie weer doen nie. Ek het mooi gehoor.



I was warned when I was young. When you hunt hares, don’t bother about other animals that can crop up like crocodiles. You have not trained your dogs to chase crocodiles. So, I will not be diverted by anyone who says anything. My point is simple: This is the month that we must remember the role of women, black women in particular, who must wake up early in the morning to fetch water in the rivers or who have to stay behind with kids because their husbands were either in war or in the mines. You should be proud of that.

I will never be disturbed by people who choose to bark when you are debating. We are here having a debate and it does note matter how loud you talk; it does not change the fact that what you are saying is not facts.

In closing, let us fight against violence that is directed at women. Let us fight against violence directed at young girls. Let us make sure that no woman is afraid to walk at night because she can be sexually violated by anybody. Let us make sure that, as parties that represent our constituencies, we are true to them by what we did and what we say. Let us not come here and make as if everything is right in the Western Cape. There are people who sleep under bridges in this province, not only in shacks. You will see them when you walk around.


I say to my friends to open their eyes. They might not like them, but they are the future voters and they might have to go to them in the future.

I enjoyed this debate, hoping that those women who fought gallantly like the mother of Sikonye defending the land of Batlokwa in the Northern province are proud today that the land is still in tact. I want to take the shield and move forward.


Xa ndigqibezela mhlekazi, andihlali dolophini mna, ndihlala ezilalini.


Last week, I felt a pain when I was told that one of my six expecting cows has lost its calf because the calf was too big for it to deliver. When I asked what happened they said the calf was too big. What we need ... [Inaudible.] ... delivery. [Time expired.] So, that is the service needed in your areas. I will take that battle as part of what I am going to do to ensure that extension officers are trained properly and that they are around communities. We will also train para-vets so that no cow should die because there is nobody around. Thank you.


Ms T J MOKWELE: Chairperson, you know, I am worried about the last sentence of the Minister.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms. M C Dikgale): Do you want to ask a question?

Ms T J MOKWELE: I am standing on a point of privilege by the way. No, I am saying to the hon Minister that it was only when he was affected when his calves died that he realised that we need more vets and ...

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms. M C Dikgale): Hon Mokwele, you are debating from the floor.

Ms T J MOKWELE: It can’t be about you hon Minister.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms. M C Dikgale): Hon Mokwele? You are debating from the floor and you can’t do that.

Ms T J MOKWELE:       It must be about the society and the community of South Africa, not you. Thank you.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms. M C Dikgale): You can’t do that hon Mokwele. You can’t debate from the floor. You are totally out of order. Please, don’t repeat that. Hon members, I am going to request for your support. The hon MEC from Limpopo is a new member of the legislature and he is going to have his maiden speech. So, I am requesting the hon members to support him.


Chairperson of the NCOP, hon Ministers, Minister Dlamini, Minister Zokwana, Minister Nkoana-Mashane, hon members of the NCOP, officials and distinguished guests. Good afternoon.

The NCOP debate on the International Day of Rural Women couldn’t have come at the most opportune moment. Today, it is three days since the centenary of the forebears of the struggle for liberation. I am talking here of the woman of fortitude, Mama Nontsikelelo Albertina Sisulu.

The debate and the direction it will point us to, will befitting tribute to Mama Sisulu and her peers, past and present. When Mama Sisulu and other women of substance set off at dawn to talk the truth about the power, it was to end the pain and suffering of women in general and the poverty-stricken rural women in particular.


Poverty is a key factor affecting the underlying determinants of household for food security. Poor households and individuals are unable to achieve food security due to lack of resources. Poor people not only struggle to put sufficient food on the table, but are also prone to food insecurity.

The Constitution of the Republic of South Africa in the Bill of Rights guarantees every citizen and I quote: “the right to have access to sufficient food and water”. The Bill of Rights goes further to say, the state must take reasonable legislative and other measures, within its available resources, to achieve the progressive realisation of each of these rights.

To this end, our government has since 1994 made great strides in the fight against hunger and poverty. These interventions have come through several policies and programmes aimed at combating hunger and its structural causes which continue to perpetuate inequality and the socio-economic exclusion of the majority, which the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry was clarifying in this House.

Such interventions are aimed at more than just creating a food secure country for all South Africans, but also to put an end to


hunger. We will recall that in 2002, the Cabinet adopted the National Integrated Food Security in order to streamline, harmonise and integrate the diverse food security programmes. Some successes have been attained in different priority areas of the strategy.
Therefore, South Africa presently boasts national food sufficiency through a combination of own production and some food imported.
However, food insecurity remains a challenge for all South Africans, especially at household level.

The National Development Plan, NDP, in 2012 set out various methods and targets to eradicate poverty, reduce unemployment and eliminate inequality by 2030. It identifies food and nutrition insecurity as main indicator of poverty and inequality.

The economic slowdown, increased food prices volatility and the impact of climate change has necessitated a review of the National Integrated Food Security and subsequently the development of a comprehensive National Food and Nutrition Security Policy which was approved in 2013.

The National Food and Nutrition Security Policy provides a broad framework for the fulfilment of this constitutional imperative and


should serve as a guide to all role-players across the three spheres of government, as well as business and social partners.

The Statistics SA General Household Survey report of 2018, indicates that the percentage of persons that experienced hunger decreased from 29,3% in 2002 to 12,1% in 2017.The percentage of households that were vulnerable to hunger declined from 24,2% in 2002 to 10,4% in 2017.

According to this report, the household food security access Scale which is aimed at determining households access to food showed that persons that had limited access to food decreased from 23, 6% in 2010 to 21,3% in 2017.

The report further shows that, the percentage of households in South Africa with food access stood at 78,7% in 2017. The lowest percentage was recorded in the North West and Northern Cape provinces, at 64% and 65% respectively, whilst the highest percentage was recorded in the Limpopo Province at 93,6% followed by Gauteng.


The National Development Plan’s target is to reduce the proportion of population living below the lower bound poverty line from 39% in 2009 to 0% in 2030

The agricultural sector remains the epicentre of growth and development in South Africa, Africa and the world. There is a body of research that confirms that women account for more than 60% of smallholder farmers in the developing world.

The rationale behind designing a provincial Rural Development Strategy is to provide the provincial leadership with a coherent rural development roadmap that address the current developmental challenges faced by rural communities in Limpopo. One of the critical success factors for an integrated rural development programme in Limpopo is getting a buy-in and active participation of civil society, rural poor communities and the private sector.

The Limpopo Agro-Processing Strategy acknowledges the role of women in agriculture as quite critical and significant to ensure that efforts are put in place are increasing primary production and agro- processing to contribute to the provincial industrialisation strategy.


The evidence by the support provided to women in the different programmes of the province is as follows: in the Comprehensive Agricultural Support Programme, CASP, we have supported 1108 beneficiaries in the Agriculture in 2017-2018. As a province we prioritised women and out of those 1 108 beneficiaries, 628 are adult women, 36 are young women and two are women with disabilities. About R40 million has been utilised to support women in agriculture in the province.

The female farmers in Illima/Letsema projects were supported to improve their productivity through provision of inputs such as seeds, fertilizers, pesticides, day old chicks, point lay pullets, livestock feed, breeding stock and mechanisation. For the 2017-2018 financial year, 6 414 women were supported with production inputs. The different categories are in the subsistence which we were able to support 5 187, smallholder we were able to support 1 211 and commercial farming we supported sixteen of them. The province plans to support 4 400 women during the 2018-2019 financial year.

When coming to the Female Entrepreneur Awards which were held in 2018, this is a programme to empower women producers in agriculture. The Annual Female Entrepreneur Awards are used to recognise and


reward the efforts and contributions of women producers in the agricultural sector in terms of food security and job creation

I should report here that since I got into the office, I have met even the previous winners to make sure that they should be able to be sustained. We are having sustainable programme, ranging from 2007 all the winners should be put in a programme to sustain them.

The Limpopo Women in Agriculture and Rural Development serves as a mouth piece for women in agriculture and it is structured from district to national. The structure is working closely with the department in the province on matters of women in agriculture and rural development. It also serves in the agricultural advisory council which serves as the springboard for the MEC in matters of agriculture and rural development.

In conclusion, as the country we have acted in line with the 2018 theme of the International Day of Rural Women, as I quote: “The time is now improving food security and eradicating rural poverty”.

As a result of interventions on the part of all spheres of government in the country, there has been a programme to improve the livelihoods and well-being of rural women and girls.


It is befitting that I conclude by quoting the UN Secretary-General, and I quote: “the empowerment of rural women is essential to building a prosperous, equitable and peaceful future for all in a health planet”. I thank you.

Mr F V MLOMBO (Mpumalanga): Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon members of the National Council of Provinces, my colleagues from the different provinces, ladies and gentlemen, it is an honour and privilege for me to stand before this House and participate in this debate on the improvement of the conditions of rural women. This theme - the subject of debate today - says, and I quote: “The Time is Now: Improving food security and eradicating rural poverty”. It is a theme that resonates with the challenges that are confronting our country. It is a theme that resonates with the challenges that are confronting Africa as a continent. It is a theme that resonates with the challenges that are confronting the world in general.

I want to agree with Karl Marx who said in The Communist Manifesto, and I quote: A man’s character is a product, on the one hand, of his inheritance; while, on the other hand, it is also a product of the environment of the individual during his lifetime and especially during his period of development.


Hon Chair, I refer to this quote because I am proud that I am standing before you and able to participate in this debate. I was born and bred in a rural province called Mpumalanga, which is a product of the old KaNgwane government. I was born to a rural, poor, hardworking woman. I was born in a province that prioritises the empowerment of women as its target for development. I am a product of a rural upbringing, as Karl Marx has said. I was moulded, brought up and schooled in a rural environment. My early childhood development took place in a rural village.

It is against that background that I stand here and speak with first-hand experience of the plight of rural people, and especially the plight of rural women.

Let us thank the government, led by the ANC, because rural women are no longer associated with the pain of travelling long distances to collect wood in order to provide warmth and food for their children. Let us thank the ANC-led government, because rural women no longer travel long distances to fetch water in order to provide for their families. Let us thank this government, because previously, in the absence of their husbands, rural women used to build houses to provide shelter for their children. Now, our people get houses for free.


Rural women continue to play a vital role in the productive forces of this country in terms of agricultural produce. They produce not only for themselves and their families, but also for society. I know and have experienced a rural upbringing.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon member, please take your seat. What is your point of order, hon member?

Ms N P KONI: It’s a a point of privilege on the basis that the speaker at the podium said for the record that women no longer fetch water. I want him to withdraw that because women still fetch water in Kuruman. He must not speak for all provinces. He must just refer to Mpumalanga. In the Northern Cape women still fetch water. He said that women don’t fetch water anymore.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Koni, you will get a chance to come to the podium and debate. You cannot debate from where you are now. Continue, hon member. [Interjections.] No, no.

Mr F V MLOMBO (Mpumalanga): Hon Chairperson, I was saying that I know and I have lived the experience of a rural upbringing. I am very positive and I am an optimist. I am optimistic and I believe that it is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness. I


believe that our government can still do more than they have done. I believe that it is possible to improve food security and eradicate rural poverty. I believe that it is possible for our country to introduce a multidisciplinary approach that will integrate rural women into the rural development process and transform them to reach the commanding heights of our economy.

I believe that it is possible to develop a concerted delivery programme in this country that will ensure the economic empowerment of our women. I am an optimist. I believe that such a programme should first target rural girls and empower them with equal education and equal training. I believe that our country should increase the proportion of women in professional positions. I believe that rural women should be afforded access to land for productive purposes. I am an optimist who believes that women will be able to improve food security and eradicate poverty only if we undermine patriarchy and include women in decision-making.

Let us, therefore, use this debate to fast-track the empowerment of women. Let us use this debate to bring about a better life for rural women. Let us use this debate to bring about radical transformation and development of rural areas. Let us use this debate to do away


with patriarchy and the oppression of women. Let us use this debate to undermine any action that violates the rights of women.

As I close, I want to say: Let us use this debate to honour and pay tribute to those women who are like Mama Albertina Sisulu, Mama Winnie Madikizela-Mandela, Mama Lilian Ngoyi, Mama Ruth First and many more. I thank you. [Applause.]

Mr L V MAGWEBU: Hon Chairperson, throughout our nation’s history, a woman’s right and ability to own, inherit and control her own land and property were limited by both the state law and the rules and practices of customary law. While we have seen and experienced progress for black ownership and land rights since the colonialism and apartheid eras, our nation’s government, which is the ANC, has still failed our people and have hampered just reform that our people so desperately need in addressing high levels of poverty and market exclusion, specifically for our hardworking, enduring black women in rural areas.

Hon Chairperson, members and fellow South Africans, while being subjected to customary laws that were heavily influenced by racism and the preservation of patriarchy, the widows, divorced women and unmarried sisters of our troubled history were often evicted from


their homes and excluded from land ownership and trade, in order to benefit their male counterparts. Section 25(6) of the Constitution provides that a person or communities whose tenure of land is legally insecure as a result of past racially discriminatory laws, is entitled to the extent provided by an Act of Parliament, either to tenure which is legally secure or to reasonable redress.

Our Constitution, therefore, generally provides for gender equality and speaks to all policies that relate to land distribution, while noting that as a vulnerable and currently dispossessed group, women should be prioritised in gaining access to land. However, there is a still a lack of clarity and guidance as to how exactly women can be prioritised. But here are the facts, because I always argue that I debate my equals, the rest I teach.

Now, let me give you the quotes backs and teach you. National statistics show that women only constitute 23% of land redistribution beneficiaries ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon member, Makwevu, please take your seat!


Ms T WANA: Chairperson, I humbly requested and I thought you would notify that. I appeal to the hon member not to be close to the mike because he is making noise.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Wana, we appreciate your advice. I’m sure hon member Makwevu is listening to you, but we do not have the Rules that allow us to control the mikes when the members are debating. Hon member, Makwevu, continue!

Mr L V MAGWEBU: Hon Chairperson, women’s land rights are still more insecure to that of men, mostly because the implementing agencies entrusted with securing rights have not adequately confronted these inequalities. This is evident to the statement made by the Land Claims Commission which basically stated that their priority is not deliberately given to marginalised women who lodge claims as they do not consider gender a determining factor in the redistribution of land rights.

So, it is clear, therefore, that we argue for women to be emancipated, they must be given title deeds. Taking this into account, and the fact that that 60-80% of smallholding farmers in developing countries are women, and yet, according to the land audit in South Africa, only 13% of land is directly owned by women,


including 11% owned by heterosexual couples, it is clear that in the context of South Africa, more focus needs to be drawn to gender and to the land tenure that women in rural areas should be given land.

Now, let me address what hon Zokwana said about his cow and the pregnancy of his cow, shame on you that you come here when we are debating matters of national importance, and tell us how worried you are about your cow! You are a Minister, shame on you! Where is he now? He’s gone! Now, Limpopo MEC, Mr Makamu, sir, let me help you!
You’re talking about food access that has increased; I don’t know what you mean by that. But let me tell you something.

Concerning food security in South Africa, about 15,6 South African women live on social grants, mainly in rural women. So, it cannot be correct that there is an increase of food security. Women don’t need to live on social security; they need to own the land, to cultivate it and to use the land as collateral. This will make them to be independent and be self-sustaining. Therefore, you cannot afford to create a world for a society because that is enslaving our people back again and again.

Lastly, hon Zokwana you come to tell us about the awards that you are giving to people. Well, maybe we should appreciate that, but let


me tell you something, our people are not going to eat the awards; our people need land. They need ownership of the land. The only big thing that can liberate our people is to stop the corruption and stop killing our people! Until you do that, you are failing our women. Shame on you again!

Lastly again, I am not here to come and sing for my supper; I am here to speak the truth to power. Don’t just come and defend the undefendable; don’t just come here to say that you have this and that! You must admit that this country is on its knees because the ANC has failed the rural women. All they did was to give them social grants which they do not need.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Makwebu!

Mr L V MAGWEBU: Thank you, Chairperson. [Ndiyabulela!] [Ndiyabonga.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Okay, take your seat sir! Are you done? Are you done, hon Makwebu?

Mr L V MAGWEBU: I thought that my time was up!


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): I want you to take your seat!

Mr L V MAGWEBU: Sure! Sure, bring it on!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Oliphant, why are you standing?

Ms G G OLIPHANT: Chair, I would like to ask the hon member whether he will be prepared to take the question.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Okay, thank you very much, we need to ascertain first. Hon member Makwebu, are you ready to take a question?

Mr L V MAGWEBU: She must learn to listen. I said I debate my equals, the rest I teach. I’m not taking questions from her. She must listen, I’m teaching her!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon member, he is not ready to take a question. Continue! He is not ready hon Oliphant; he is not ready. Hon Oliphant, take your seat. What is the point of order, hon Koni?


Ms N P KONI: A woman can be undermined like that by hon Magwebu to say he teaches, we must learn and all those things. No, he must withdraw, he is undermining her intelligence. We can’t be undermined. Therefore, he must withdraw!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Koni.

Ms N P KONI: What he was supposed to do was to say yes or a no, that’s it. He doesn’t have to gossip.

Ms T J MOKWELE: It is a very sexist remark!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Magwebu, you said you are not ready. Continue wit the debate.

Mr L V MAGWEBU: Thank you, hon House Chairperson, the Constitution has done its part in eradicating old and unjust laws on the land rights of black people and the courts have taken their necessary role of declaring certain oppressive customary law provisions as unconstitutional and therefore, invalid.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Magwebu. Hon Magwebu, take your seat! Hon Mokwele, you are standing up. Take your seat hon Magwebu!

Ms T J MOKWELE: There is a statement that was uttered by hon Magwebu that is very much sexist. Today we are debating issues of women. We cannot allow a man to disrespect and undermine other women, not only woman, but especially an elderly, saying that she must learn. It means he is undermining the integrity of hon Oliphant.

For hon Oliphant not to have that education, is because of the system that he is representing. So, I am humbly requesting you, hon Chair, to rule on that matter. It is very serious; we can’t leave it as such! Thank you very much.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mokwele, I will come back to that ruling. Conclude your speech, hon Magwebu!

Mr L V MAGWEBU: Chairperson, the courts have taken their necessary role of declaring certain oppressive customary law provisions as unconstitutional and therefore, invalid. However, a social prejudice still exists outside of law and politics. Therefore, the question is: Who is failing our women today?


Like I said before, speaking the truth is what the ANC that is in power today is doing, because all what they need to do, is to ensure that women are given the tenure of land, and that is not happening. All they do is to give them some few awards, a little bit of social grant security and to create a welfare state and put a burden in the state. That system doesn’t work; it has failed all over the world. [Enkosi, Sihlalo, ndiyabulela.] Thank you.

Ms T J MOKWELE: He needs a dictionary!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Order! Order! The hon member Parkies? Please take your seat. Hon Mokwele! Order! Hon Magwebu!
Please take your seat.

Mr A J NYAMBI: Chairperson, I rise on a point of privilege to appeal to the hon Magwebu not to leave. His equal will be debating.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Repeat yourself.

Ms T J MOKWELE: Don’t leave!

Mr A J NYAMBI: Chair, I appeal to the hon Magwebu not to leave. His equal is debating. He must not leave the House.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon House Chairperson, you are totally out of order. [Interjections.] The hon member is taking his seat. That is not a point of order. It does not even carry any weight. Let’s continue with the debate, hon Parkies. Hon Magwebu, you are protected. Don’t worry.

Mr J P PARKIES: Chair, we are the sons and daughters of men and women, mothers and fathers, peasants and industrial workers, who are confined and petrified by the engorged, vampire corporate elite and a capitalist system with all its vices of economic compulsion. [Laughter.] [Interjections.]

Allow me to dedicate this speech to one of the great leaders of our continent, a great son of Africa, the president of the poor, a genuine Marxist killed by imperialist forces with their bourgeois puppets, Thomas Sankara. He said:

Our revolution is not simply for spouting slogans that are no more than signals used by manipulators trying to use them as catchwords ... as a foil for their own display. Our revolution is, and should continue to be, the collective effort of revolutionaries to transform reality, to improve the concrete situation of the masses of our country.


Today, the world population is estimated to grow and reach

9,7 billion by 2015. This population growth will necessitate more food and a sustainable environment. It is important to accentuate the importance of agriculture in Africa. It produces feeds and sustains a fast-growing population.

Chair, let me make this request: When I am left with four minutes, please caution me. In 2015, the sector contributed a third of the continent’s GDP, and 70% of Africans are dependent on it for their livelihoods. [Interjections.] Agriculture is not a developmental or environmental question alone but the heartbeat of the continent and is about power, politics, and profit.

For this reason, eradication of rural poverty in Africa and ensuring food security cannot be accomplished without the implacable willpower of those who wield political authority. Diversified financial institutions need to come onboard to deal with the tormenting poverty of our people. It will remain an impractical dream if the control and ownership of the food system are not changed, and the liberal market framework that exploits the poor and the natural resources is not pulverised. A classical example is ... and some Ministers are still here, but unfortunately the hon Zokwana has left.


Mr W F FABER: She won’t be there for long! Don’t worry!

Mr J P PARKIES: A classical example is this: The select committee visited a project in Mossel Bay where gold is being exploited by junkers with no benefit to our people. This point talks to the capacity of small farmers to produce seed and become productive and prosperous, as opposed to six companies that control 60% of the world commercial seed market. The largest grain traders control 90% of the grain trade. Eleven companies control 98% of the world pesticide market. Corporate multinationals continue to capture the market by using their own or combined financial and political power. The transnational corporations control every single step of the food system.

If we are to eradicate tormenting poverty, the food system must change. We need imperious intervention by the state. We need a classical expression of the needs and aspirations of the physically challenged people. They are part of our society, and they remain marginalised. If we are to succeed in building a proper egalitarian society, we need a different form of technology to service the needs of our people – the marginalised and the exploited poor. Food security will not be possible until we stop putting in place useless regulations for the sake of compliance with irrelevant international


agreements that undercut the livelihood of the rural poor and undercut our African and class culture.

In 1961, Europeans convened a convention by the International Union for the Protection of New Varieties of Plants, UPOV, that prevents anyone from producing seed for commercial purposes. For a long time, rural communities learned to cultivate crops and select seeds for their own sustainability, but these kinds of policies and regulations deprecate farmers’ ability to generate their own seed.
The corporate investors and G8 countries displace our people in some parts of the continent under the pretext of transforming the food system. A classical example is Kilombero Plantations Limited, KPL, that operates a 5,8 hectare rice plantation in Tanzania.

Sustainable access to clean water, decent medical care, sanitation, education, and electrification of our rural areas constitutes the core of services that should be accessible to the people. A classical example, and I will raise this issue ...


... ilali yaseQili ...



... in the Eastern Cape that forms part of Matatiele. Our people are without electricity. As long as I am a Member of Parliament, I will keep raising this issue.

Our people and small-scale farmers need access to the market, education, inputs, technology, and land. The involvement of black farmers in the milling industry is nonexistent. The Europeans and others are targeting our own ocean resources, thinking that Africans cannot put proper government structures in place. They are going to devour our ocean resources for their consumption and profit, and we remain desiccated.

The hon Magwebu speaks about the sustainability of creating a welfare state. Go and read and study for your own knowledge and empowerment the policy documents of the ANC. It is not the ANC’s strategic objective to create a welfare state, but we are using the state’s capacity to intervene on behalf of the poor who are being failed by a capitalist system and all its vices in our society. [Interjections.] This is as opposed to market fundamentalism. The welfare state is not in our books. We want to build a developmental state that will assist and caution the poor people who are being exploited in the rural areas, the poor people who are being


marginalised by the economies and the bosses in this country. [Interjections.]

The issue of the chairperson – it is the chairperson of the committee. She says she appreciates the potential, the input and contribution of the rural women. It is because as Africans we don’t only preach humanity; we practise human because it is so ingrained in our African culture. That African culture includes the class culture – in practical terms, this means solidarity and organisation. Our people and the political leadership must continue to educate our people about the importance of solidarity as a principle and way of life in our society.

However, I want to say that, when we see issues of rural development and the poor, we don’t see it as an isolated case from the entire budget of different Ministries in this country. It is the responsibility of each and every Minister and MEC to integrate in the programmes of Ministers, programmes of MECs, initiatives that will effect a quality change in the lives of ordinary people, the marginalised, the poor and the exploited masses of our people who live in rural areas. We are holistic in terms of our approach. The ANC is coherent. We cannot say this is a budget for the rural poor, women and children. No. We are integrated because we understand the


challenges that face this country and the rural poor and women in our society. Thank you. [Applause.]



Mphathisihlalo, siyabonga kakhulu futhi ngemibono eveziwe esikhombisa ukuthi singenza kanjani ukuthi ubengcono umsebenzi wokuthuthukisa amakhosikazi asezindaweni ezisemakhaya namantombazane. Okubalulekile ukuthi kumele sazi ukuthi babili kuphela abantu abaphikisana nezibonelelo, u-Ronald Reagan no- Margaret Thatcher futhi kungenxa yokuthi babengaluqondi udaba lokubambisana komphakathi kodwa futhi babona ukuthi leyonto yenza abantu bethu noma abantu abamnyama bathi ukuthuthuka kancane. [Ubuwelewele.]

Okwesibili, enye into ebalulekile okumele siyazi ukuthi siyiNingizimu Afrika asihlali emkhathini, siyingxenye yomhlaba wonke. Njengamanje, kenendoda nje engasazi ebizwa ngokuthi u-Trump, emane nje yasikhomba ngomunwe yathi, uma nike nathatha umhlaba kubantu abamhlophe nizongibona kahle. Okubalulekile, kumele sazi ukuthi nase-Cuba, ubuyisele abantu base-Cuba emuva. Waphinda wenza yabanzima impilo yabantu base-Bolivia, base-Brazil, base-Venezuela. Ngikusho lokhu ngoba kumele sazi ukuthi ontamolukhuni baya ngokuya


bezithuthukisa umhlaba wonke futhi bakhuluma ulimi elikhulunywa ngabantu abathuthukayo njengoba kwenzeka la eNingizimu Afrika. Selokhu siqale udaba lokubuyisela umhlaba kubanikazi bawo, sisatshiswa singakaqali kuthiwa, hhayi nizofana ne-Zimbabwe.
Sisatshiswa singakaqali kuthiwe, kuzohlushekwa kakhulu. Sisatshiswa singaqali kumakomidi, kuye abantwana abancane, abamhlophe, abakhombisa ukuthi bafakwe umqondo othize kwakhishwa iqiniso eliyilo, ngeke baze benze izinto zibelula ngalokhu.

Ngakho lokhu esikwenzile umzabalazo omkhulu futhi uma ngabe kuwukuthi uvumelana nakho, kumele ube yingxenye yabantu abathuthukayo abaya phambili. Into ye-radical economic transformation yinto enkulu. Bayazi ukuthi njengamanje yibona abalawula izindlela zokukhiqiza. Bayazi ukuthi njengamanje amakhosikazi ase-Paarl asebenza emapulazini bayawagxosha nemindeni yawo. Bayazi ukuthi thina sisondelene kakhulu nomhlaba ngoba kufihlwe abantu bethu, la kufihlwe abantu bethu sifuna ukuhlale sazi. Bona benza izikhumbuzo la kwafihlwa khona abantu babo kodwa bafuna ukulima phezu kwemizimba yokhokho bethu. [Ubuwelewele.] Ngakho lokhu esikwenzile kubalulekile kakhulu. Kufuna abantu abazoyincenga bazi ngaphakathi kwabo. Bazi nangezingqondo zabo ukuthi impi yangempela ima iqala manje. Ngiyabonga Mphathisihlalo. [Ihlombe.]

THE HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms. M C Dikgale): Honourable members, I did promise that I will come back with the ruling raised by the hon member, Mokwele. The hon Magwebu is not here, yes you did raise it. I will have to come back with the ruling when the hon Magwebu is here. Hon members, let me take this opportunity and thank all the Ministers who were present in the house, we really appreciate that. Without your presence we would not have made it today and also to thank the hon members for supporting my MEC form Limpopo, thank you very much, you did show the respect and I believe even tomorrow when he has to come here, he will come running because he knows that we can respect our visitors. The hon members from EFF and those who were heckling aloud including hon Stock and hon Faber, I want to make a request that you respect our rule book on chapter five, rule number 32 even in future. You were heckling aloud and the rules do not allow that, so I request that next you respect our rules.

That concludes the business of the day and I would like to thank the Minister and the Deputy Ministers and also to ask the hon members to remain standing until the procession has left the chamber.

Debate concluded.

The House adjourned at 17:17.