Hansard: NCOP: Policy debate on Budget Vote 25: Economic Development

House: National Council of Provinces

Date of Meeting: 13 May 2015


No summary available.




Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 15








The Council met at 14:00.


The Deputy Chairperson (Mr R J Tau) took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.












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Mr W F FABER: Hon Deputy Chair, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the Council, I shall move on behalf of the DA:


That the House-


  1. debates the decision the National Energy Regulator of South Africa, Nersa, will make on 29 June this year on whether it will authorise Eskom’s application to hike tariffs by 25,3%;


  1. notes that Nersa said in a statement that it had determined the timelines for processing Eskom’s application for the selective reopening of the third multiyear price determination decision for the 2015-16 to 2017-18 period on Wednesday;


(3) further notes that Eskom already implemented approximately half of the 25% increase for which it’s made an application on 1 April;


        (4) also notes that, last week, Nersa announced that it had received Eskom’s application for the reopening of tariff negotiations for 2015-16;

 (5) also notes that Eskom needs R32,9 billion to supplement its generation capacity with open-cycle gas turbines and for its short-term power-purchasing programme and the impact of the increase in environmental levy, according to the Nersa statement; and


            (6) further notes that from 1 April, direct Eskom customers pay 12,6% more for electricity and Eskom charges municipalities 14,2% more, and

(7) finally notes that as our economy is already under tremendous pressure and companies will find it almost impossible to keep doors open, this House should debate this serious issue.










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Ms B S MASANGO: Hon Deputy Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the Council, I shall move on behalf of the DA:


That the Council-


  1. notes with grave concern the continuing incidents of violence and abuse taking place against children in various parts of the country, as reported by the media;


  1. further notes the possibility that the incidents reported may not be the only ones taking place, given that it is estimated that almost 38% of the South African population is legally classified as children, and only 46 991 crimes against children have been reported by the SA Police Service in the 2013-14 financial year;


  1. also notes that in the same financial year, sexual crimes committed against children constituted 36% of the national total, while the perpetrator was known to the child in 84% of the reported cases; and


  1. debates at its next sitting, with the National Child Protection Week campaign under the auspices of the Minister of Social Development scheduled to take place in the week of 25 to 31 May 2015, the possible disconnect between the legislation intended to protect and safeguard our children against abuse, neglect and exploitation, and its successful implementation through various institutions and stakeholders.


I so move.








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Mr J J LONDT: Hon Deputy Chair, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the Council, I shall move on behalf of the DA:


That the House-


  1. debates the role of the Independent Electoral Commission, IEC, in, and the political parties’ respect for, the democratic processes and outcomes of South Africa’s elections;


  1. notes that yesterday, 12 May 2015, the ANC members in the NCOP voiced their opposition to a motion without notice condemning political parties in general, and in Oudtshoorn in particular, for disrespecting the will of the voters and not respecting the democratic outcomes of elections;


  1. congratulates ...




The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon Londt, I just need to double-check a point because a motion related to Oudtshoorn was dealt with yesterday. There was a decision by the House on that motion, so I don’t know whether it would be procedurally correct to have the same motion read out again.


Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Chairperson, it is not the same motion.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): I haven’t given you a chance, hon Van Lingen.


Ms E C VAN LINGEN: You looked at me, and I thought it was all right. [Laughter.]


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): No, just because I looked at you, it doesn’t mean that I have given you a chance. [Interjections.] Can you take your seat, hon member? I haven’t recognised you.


I will allow the member to present the motion but then double-check it against what was presented yesterday and come back with a ruling on that. Continue, hon member. I just thought that I should bring it to your attention.


Mr J J LONDT: Chair, yesterday, 12 May 2015, the ANC members in the NCOP voiced their opposition to a motion without notice condemning political parties in general, and in Oudtshoorn in particular, for disrespecting the will of the voters and not respecting the democratic outcomes of elections.


I move:


That the Council-

            (3) congratulates all political parties for taking part in this election and mostly respecting the outcome of the results and the subsequent consequences;


(4) proves to South Africa and all of the country’s voters that we are indeed an institution that respects democratic processes and the will of the voters;


(5) condemns the minority coalition in Oudtshoorn for refusing to respect the will of the voters by clinging onto power;


(6) condemns, irrespective of political affiliation, any flouting of the rules; and


(7) calls on all political parties to respect the wishes of the majority of the voters in Oudtshoorn and allow the democratically elected representatives to govern the municipality.


The DA calls for a debate to address the above issues ... [Time expired.]


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon member Londt, your time has expired and your motion will therefore be printed in full. We have hon Essack next.


















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Mr F ESSACK: Hon Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the Council, I shall move on behalf of the DA:


That the House-

  1. notes that municipalities throughout the country have not been adhering to their commitments in terms of their payments to Eskom and various water boards;


  1. further notes that the situation has become a major concern, with Treasury now threatening to withhold payments to municipalities of their municipal grants; and


  1. debates this issue ...




Mr S J MOHAI: Chairperson, I rise on a point of order: The matter was just considered this morning in the committee, and it is due to serve before this House. The report is on the matter that the member is raising as a motion.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): It will be coming to the House?


Mr S J MOHAI: Yes, it will be coming to the House.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Therefore, based on the Rule of anticipation, we may not proceed with that matter if it will be coming before the House.


Mr F ESSACK: Fair enough.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Thank you very much.


Is there any member that I might have left out? Hon Smit.












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Mr C F B SMIT: Hon Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the Council I shall move on behalf of the DA:


That the House notes that-

  1. it is highly disturbing that the Minister is forging ahead with the capping of land and plans to expropriate all land in excess of 5 000 ha;


  1. it is clear that the ANC government did not think this decision through and that no proper study was done to qualify or disqualify this planned action;


  1. it is also clear that the ANC prefers the easy way out by using a one-size-fits-all approach to land that will harm our agricultural, tourism and wildlife trade industries irreparably; and


  1. this will also have a major knock-on effect on our already fragile economy that will be followed by major job losses.


I therefore move for an urgent debate on the caption of land and its implications on the viability of land users and the economy.


























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(Draft Resolution)


Mr E MAKUE: Deputy Chairperson, I move without notice:


That the Council  -

  1. notes that the Deputy President Cyril Ramaphosa was in Tanzania on Tuesday, where he represented President Jacob Zuma at a summit that discussed challenges facing Burundi;
  2. further notes that President Zuma was invited to the Extra-Ordinary Summit of Heads of State of the East African Community because he was previously a mediator in the Burundi peace process;

     (3)also notes that the summit has been convened specifically to deliberate on the current political and security challenges facing the people of Burundi and to chart a way forward; and

     (4)commends the government, as represented by the Deputy President, on the role that South Africa plays in resolving disputes in Africa and the world.


Motion accordingly agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.























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Ms L MATHYS: Deputy Chairperson, I rise on behalf of the EFF to move without notice:


That the House —

  1. notes and welcomes the Western Cape High Court’s judgment that ruled that section 11 of the Powers, Privileges, and Immunities  of Parliaments and Provincial Legislatures Act should not apply to Members of Parliament and therefore it was unlawful for the Speaker to order the police to remove EFF Members of Parliament from Parliament’s Chambers during the state of the nation address;
  2. notes that the court gave Parliament 12 months to amend this section of the Act in order to be consistent with the Constitution. The EFF has always argued that section 11 of the Powers, Privileges and Immunities of Parliaments and Provincial Legislatures Act must be read ...



The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE  NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Is there an objection, hon member?


Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Deputy Chairperson, there was a motion on the matter yesterday already.


Ms L MATHYS: Yes, it is noted.



The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Oh, okay ... [Interjections.]


Ms L MATHYS: My motion is a bit different from the DA motion. I also heard that motion. [Interjections.]


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Thank you very much ... [Interjections.]


Ms L MATHYS: I am sure I am allowed to complete my motion.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): All right. May I apply the same principle that I applied earlier on? I will have to check whether the same motion was passed yesterday; if that is the case, then the motion will fall away. You may proceed. [Interjections.]


Ms L MATHYS: We will.  It will give me a chance to read again.


... notes that the court gave Parliament 12 months to amend this section of the Act in order to be consistent with the Constitution.


The EFF has always argued that section 11 of the Powers, Privileges and Immunities of Parliaments and Provincial Legislatures Act must be read alongside section 58(1)(b) of the Constitution which states that Members of Parliament are not... [Interjections.][Time expired.]



The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon Mathys, your time has expired. Let me remind members that you have one-and-a-half minutes for motions.


Hon member, your time has expired. Your motion will be printed in full on the next Order Paper.

Is there an objection to the motion?  What is the objection? [Interjections.] Okay, so even before I ask the question on whether the motion is agreed to or not ... [Laughter.]


The objection to the motion should take into account the earlier ruling I made in regard to whether or not that motion was already read yesterday in this House. If it wasn’t read in the House yesterday, then the motion is not agreed to, and it will then be regarded as a notice of motion.   

















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(Draft Resolution)


Ms L L ZWANE: Deputy Chairperson, on behalf of the ANC, I move without notice:


That Council —

  1. notes with delight that legendary Italian car maker Maserati has chosen one of the top South African models Ms Genevieve Morton to be the face of its  2015  range, which will be  featured in a worldwide social media campaign;
  2.  also notes that she hails from the East Rand city of Benoni and that she was raised in Scottburgh on the South East Coast of KwaZulu-Natal;
  3.  further notes that the 26-year-old model is the first South African to appear in the renowned Sports Illustrated American swimsuit issue;
  4. also notes that Maserati is using the pictures with Genevieve for the relaunch of its global brochure range and marks the arrival of a new corporate image for its leading client communication products; and
  5.  congratulates Genevieve, and wishes her well in representing the country and her profession internationally.


Motion accordingly agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.





















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(Draft Resolution)



Mr B G NTHEBE: Deputy Chairperson, on behalf of the ANC, I move without notice:


That the Council —

  1. notes that a fresh 7,3 magnitude earthquake rattled Nepal and northern India on Tuesday, 12 May, killing at least 68 people and injuring thousands in the region, as many buildings that were already weakened by last month’s massive tremor were sent tumbling to the ground;
  2. further notes that Tuesday’s quake set off at least a dozen landslides in six districts, raising fears that the death toll could rise;
  3. extends our support to aid organisations, specifically the Gift of the Givers, to continue with the necessary assistance needed at this time; and
  4. wishes to send our condolences to the people of Nepal in these trying times and urges the international community to step up its support to the affected nation.


Motion accordingly agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.























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(Draft Resolution)



Mr V E MTILENI: Deputy Chairperson, I rise on behalf of the EFF to move without notice:


That the Council —

  1. notes and condemns platinum mine Lonmin’s decision to cut capital expenditure by retrenching at least 3 500 employees;
  2. further notes that, last week, Anglo-American Platinum decided to retrench 474 workers as part of its plans to cut about 60 000 jobs by 2017;
  3. further considers this act a serious undermining of the Labour Relations Act, Act 66 of 1995, and a human rights violation issue that needs urgent attention;
  4. calls upon the Minister to make it clear to the mining companies that South Africa has labour laws which all companies must adhere to; and
  5. further notes that since the massacre of 34 mineworkers  whose crime was to demand a living wage at the hands of the ANC-led government police, mineworkers remain overworked and underpaid while big mining companies get away with profit shifting, tax evasion and transfer pricing;
  6. (6)notes that the government refuses to expose those involved in the cold-hearted massacre of 34 men as they are high-class ANC officials who sacrificed our people’s lives to protect the interests of white monopoly capital.
  7. further note that almost three years later ...

[Time expired.]


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon member, your time has expired. Your motion will be printed in full on the next Order Paper. Thank you very much. [Interjections.]


I shall put the question on the motion as read out by hon Mtileni before his time expired. Are there any objections? [Interjections.] In the light of the objections, the motion will then become notice of a motion.





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Mr H B GROENEWALD: Deputy Chairperson, on behalf of the DA I move without notice:


That the Council —

  1. congratulates the department of health in the Western Cape after the announcement by the MEC for health  that they are putting aside R59 million to improve the working conditions and skills of the nurses as part of their plans to stop the exodus of health professionals;
  2. notes that MEC Mbombo acknowledged the challenges facing the department, lecturers, nurses and students, and underlined that caregivers deliver a better service when looked after; and
  3. further notes that the MEC wants to provide better working conditions for all the nurses across the province.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Are there any objections to the motion? [Interjections.] In the light of the objection, the motion shall be treated as a notice of a motion. [Interjections.]


Mr W F FABER: Hon Deputy Chairperson, I am rising on a point of order as I need to get clarity - and if you can just guide me, please - on the previous motion. If a member did not finish reading his motion, is it correct for this House not to accept it if the full motion was not heard. I cannot understand that one can reject a motion if that motion was not read in full. I just want clarity on that, because I am really not sure. Thank you.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): It would have been good if the objection had been raised before I even allowed the motion to proceed. I take it that the motion has been dealt with. If there is anything else, we shall deal with it outside this process.









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(Draft Resolution)


Ms T G MPAMBO-SIBHUKWANA: Deputy Chairperson, on behalf of the DA, I move without notice:


That the Council —

  1. notes with outrage the untimely and sudden death of a mother who was killed as she was fetching her children at Khula-Nolwazi school in Gauteng;
  2.  further notes that the continuing violent and heinous crimes meted out against women are unacceptable; and
  3. sends its sincere and profound condolences to her family and loved ones during this difficult time.


Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.






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(Draft Resolution)


Ms G M MANOPOLE: Deputy Chairperson, on behalf of the ANC, I move without notice:


That the Council -

  1. notes that a man was arrested on Tuesday, 12 May 2015, in connection with the killing of a pregnant woman during a car hijacking outside her daughter’s school in Braam Fischer phase 4;
  2. further notes that the woman was with her 7-year-old son and was picking up her 12-year-old daughter from a Soweto school on 20 April 2015 when the incident happened;
  3. also notes that the man was detained in Dobsonville and was expected to appear in the Roodepoort Magistrate’s Court on Thursday, 14 May 2015; and
  4. condemns the brutality and violence perpetrated against women and children, and urges the police and the National Prosecuting Authority to do everything in their power to make sure that the perpetrators of this violent crime face the full might of the law.


Motion accordingly agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): The last hand up for motions without notice was that of hon Singh.

Mr A S SINGH: Thank you, Deputy Chairperson. I withdraw.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): You withdraw? Thank you very much.














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(Policy debate)


Vote No 25 - Economic Development


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Before we proceed, I take this opportunity to welcome the Minister of Economic Development, special delegates and representatives of the SA Local Government, Salga, as well.


The MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: Hon Chairperson of the NCOP, special delegates and members of the SA Local Government Association, Salga, and hon members, yesterday I set out the broad vision of economic development and of the department at the debate on the Budget Vote in the National Assembly. I tabled a budget of R886 million. At the sitting of this august House today, I wish to highlight five of the key announcements made and point to the relevance for provinces.


The first point is on industrial funding. The Industrial Development Corporation, IDC, will make available R100 billion over the next five years for industrial funding. Of this, R23 billion will be set aside for viable projects for black industrialists. [Applause.] The IDC will offer a discount of 150 basis points on the normal finance costs that would apply. So, if the cost of one particular project is 10%, a qualifying black industrialist will obtain funding at 8,5%. They can qualify for additional discounts over and above this if they meet our jobs and localisation targets too.


To qualify, an entrepreneur must be an industrialist. That means they must own and control the enterprise. That enterprise must be in the productive sector of the economy. It covers sectors such as manufacturing, mining and beneficiation, agriculture and agro-processing, the green economy and tourism. This programme is not about buying 5% or 10% shares in a company, sitting back and waiting for the dividends to flow in. We want to back black South Africans who roll up their sleeves to build the economy, to create decent work opportunities and increase our factory, mining and agricultural base.


The IDC will ensure that within its funding envelope R4,5 billion is made available for women’s empowerment and R4,5 billion for youth empowerment in the productive sectors. [Applause.] Through this, we have addressed one key hurdle, namely, where the funding will come from, but that is not sufficient. We now need to ensure that the other hurdles are addressed. For example, for a project to be viable and to qualify for funding it needs markets and it needs a productive enterprise.


To assist with market access, both the public and private sector need to set aside opportunities for black industrialists. The private sector companies can incorporate black South Africans in their supply chains, in the making of components, in the making of finished goods that companies buy and the state can do so in its procurement programme. We will do so. To ensure productive enterprises, the entrepreneurs must bring viable projects, hard work, energy, innovation, enterprise and partnerships with labour.


How can provinces assist? They can do so by helping to publicise this important announcement, by aligning provincial development agencies’ visions to this that government has set nationally, and developing the partnerships between those provincial agencies and the IDC and, finally, by assisting entrepreneurs to develop good business ideas into viable projects.


The second point is about competition policy. The Competition Commission will be launching a market inquiry into parts of the retail sector. In our visits across the country going to communities and meeting South Africans, we have heard complaints that black South Africans have limited access to retail opportunities in townships and in shopping malls as well as the perception of a growing concentration of ownership and turn over, particularly in grocery retailing. Community members have asked us where the opportunity is for them to enter.


Through the Competition Act of 1998, a market enquiry allows us to bring all the facts and put them all on the table, enable the competition authorities to be better informed, and government to take the necessary action that may be warranted. So, if we are going to be serious about creating space for black South Africans to enter retail, we are going to put the spotlight on what is happening in the sector.


Provinces can assist us with this market enquiry by providing evidence and information to the commission on retail structures in townships, in the different provinces and about concerns with access to shopping malls in their areas.


The third point is on African integration. Our trade and economic links with the rest of the continent are critical to our own prosperity. To cite a few examples, our exports to the rest of the continent are worth R300 billion and this has grown much faster than the gross domestic product, GDP. So, in fact, what we sell to the rest of the continent is stimulating the South African economy. There are now 244 000 direct jobs in South Africa that are supported by our export of manufactured, agricultural and mining products to the rest of Africa.


The biggest export market for South African-made plastic products is Zimbabwe; for televisions that we make here, it is Zambia. For clothing that we sell, the biggest export market is Mozambique. Every second glass of water that you drink in Gauteng or that you use in mining, manufacturing or agriculture in Gauteng comes from Lesotho through a major water pipeline. The gas that powers Sasol - our biggest industrial company - in the Free State comes from Mozambique. This points out how connected we are as African economies.


On Africa Day, 25 May, the department will convene a symposium with the University of Johannesburg to look at the economic links with the rest of Africa, bringing together community representatives, investors, trade unionists, intellectuals and public officials. It’s about making the argument concretely against xenophobia. This Africa, this continent of ours, is also the basis of our own long-term prosperity.


Provinces can play a role in two ways. The NCOP members are invited to attend and shape the discussions, and we will be doing a road show to other provinces and we need provincial partners to root the discussion in communities.


The fourth point is on trade areas. Government offers significant support and protection for local industries through import tariffs and antidumping measures. Last year, for example, we increased tariffs on 13 products, including paper, batteries, barbed wire and chickens. Tariffs can provide the necessary relief and support to companies. However, if we do not improve the performance of South African companies through modernising our industrial base, we won’t be competitive. We will be reliant on protection and when that’s lifted, industries collapse.


I will therefore require the International Trade Administration Commission, Itac, through a trade directive that I will issue, to ensure companies that receive tariff protection through Itac must invest more in their companies, must focus on growing employment, product innovation and productivity improvements. Provinces can assist by working with companies in their industrial areas to upgrade their manufacturing base. There are a number of provincial initiatives in industrial clusters. The lessons that KwaZulu-Natal is learning from its sector clusters need to be shared with Mpumalanga so that we, in fact, build South Africa and the South African manufacturing base. Some of this we will co-ordinate now through the Minmec, where MECs and three Ministers meet together.

The fifth area covers infrastructure. One of the key challenges we face with infrastructure is the theft of cables and metal from the public infrastructure. This leads to serious problems with disruption of trains, water supply, energy and households. Last year in December, President Zuma convened a meeting of the Presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Commission, PICC, council and we had there the premiers of the provinces and the mayors of the different metros and Salga leadership. They backed us in developing a set of measures - a package of measures - to crack down on this theft of cable and metal.


These include amendments to various pieces of legislation to toughen conditions on bail, to provide for minimum sentencing and to require those who are caught in possession of copper cables to explain where they obtained it. I’m pleased to report that the Minister of Justice and Constitutional Development, working with the PICC, is finalising a set of draft amendments to the relevant laws.


Provinces can assist by compiling dossiers of information on the disruptions caused by cable and metal theft, and by supporting our actions to restrict the trade in scrap metal. We are now working with the provinces on these areas.


It is against this background that I wish to formally introduce the policy debate on Economic Development. I look forward to the ideas and the guidance of the NCOP. Development takes place ultimately at a local area. Nationally we come up with ideas, plans and mobilise resources, but where that money hits the ground is in a province, in a municipality where our people live. That’s why partnership is so important. Thank you. [Applause.]
























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Mr E MAKUE: Hon Deputy Chairperson, on behalf of the Select Committee on Economic and Business Development, we want to welcome to this House Minister Patel and Deputy Minister Masuku. We are indeed proud to be able to present to this House the budget and plans of the Department of Economic Development. Hon members, as we are here to discuss the budget of the Department of Economic Development, I wish to reflect on the mandate and functions of the department. We often tend to focus on one aspect or the other. It is, however, also important to consider the whole picture.


The Department of Economic Development’s core mandate is to promote the alignment of state activities around inclusive growth and, in particular, around job creation. That is in line with the ANC’s strong focus on job creation and economic equality for our people. Cabinet adopted the New Growth Path in 2010 and subsequently reaffirmed it as the operational plan for the economy of the National Development Plan. The New Growth Path set a target of five million new jobs by the end of the decade and laid out strategies to achieve this ambitious goal. It identified the main job drivers, the sectors and activities that can generate employment on a large scale. A key to a job driver of the New Growth Path is infrastructure. The department has a central role to play in this regard as the main source of technical support for the Presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Commission. In this role, the Department of Economic Development monitors progress on projects included in the National Infrastructure Plan, addresses blockages as they arise and develops guidelines and models to improve the implementation and developmental impact of our national build programme.


An important area of work for the Department of Economic Development is also the promotion of alignment between economic policies of the three spheres of the state: municipal, provincial and national. The state, with the Department of Economic Development, convenes the Economic Development Ministers and Members of Executive Councils Meeting, Minmec, which is an important forum for achieving this end. In the address by hon Minister Patel, the importance of local government and provinces has been aptly underlined. In addition, the National Infrastructure Plan under the Presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Commission provides an important stimulus for more integrated regional development within the Southern African region and also on the African continent.


For instance, various strategic integrated projects, Sips, aim to establish development corridors in the North West, the south eastern coast, the Northern Cape and the line from Durban, Free State and Gauteng, amongst others. In addition, the Sips include the improvement of infrastructure in our poorest rural areas; the densification of our cities and the rollout of broadband across our country. These initiatives should go far to reversing the discriminatory and divisive spatial allocation of resources that we inherited from apartheid.


The Department of Economic Development also has a central role to play in promoting industrialisation. To start with, the department has been given responsibility for supervising and guiding key agencies for industrialisation: the competition and trade regulatory agencies and the Industrial Development Corporation, IDC. The Department of Economic Development’s engagement with the competition authorities has led to more focused and strategic interventions as well as a welcome increase in the scale of enforcement.


Government is uncovering major cartels and abuse of dominance from bread to construction, from basic chemicals to fertilisers. That in itself points to the urgent need for reform in our economy to ensure a more open and competitive environment as the basis for sustained growth and greater equality. Establishing the IDC has provided an important basis for future growth.


Finally, the promotion of social dialogue has been a centrepiece of the Department of Economic Development’s work over the past few years. Engagement with stakeholders is critical for the transformation of the economy. Our development effort requires the collaboration, hard work and sacrifice of all our people. Social dialogue provides an important mechanism for mobilising our nation around our development aims.


Honourable members, this short overview of some of the key work of the Department of Economic Development demonstrates that this department is worthy of our support. It continues to play an important role in supporting job creation, investment and sustainable growth in our country. We expect the department to deploy its resources in the coming year to continue to support the programme of radical economic transformation. Thank you. [Applause.]













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Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Hon Chairperson, this debate is about economic growth and jobs, and whether this department is delivering on its mandate or if it is just a smokescreen to employ more cronies connected to President Zuma. If this department is to justify its existence, it has to create an environment for investment and economic development that will contribute to real economic growth and job creation.


Since the inception of this department in 2009, the growth rate has decreased to 1,4% in 2014. According to the National Development Plan, NDP, we need a GDP of at least 5% to save the economy and to create jobs. The International Labour Organisation, ILO, states that South Africa has the 8th highest unemployment rate in the world, and it is expected to increase to the 6th highest by 2019. This indicates that the unemployment rate is on a horror path upwards. It is a ticking time bomb.


The broader unemployment rate is 34%, of which 66% represents our youth. What planning is being done to accommodate the current group of 20 to 24-year-olds who total 5,2 million people? What provision is being made for them to become economically active and educated – or are we just talking poverty, inequality and unemployment?


Yesterday, and in the House now, the Minister announced R23 billion to support black industrialists. The DA supports investment in business, but what about investing in hundreds of small businesses as a key driver of economic growth? Investing in our SMMEs will give the outsider – the majority of South Africans – access to the economy, as opposed to continuing our President’s legacy of developing an elite, closed, crony society.


The next group of young people, aged 15 to 19, also number 5,2 million. At least 1 million people will enter the job market annually over the next five years. How ready is South Africa to cope with this? Has the Minister’s department analysed the exponential growth in unemployment numbers in the country under the current growth rate and, if so, what forward planning has been done to rectify this? Are there any incentives planned for the private sector to create jobs and, at the same time, alleviate the huge stress on the public purse of over R400 billion in terms of the excessive number of jobs created in government?


The Minister must take note of the hard realities. The growth rate in sub-Saharan Africa is 4,5%. The number of unemployed people in this country has increased by 1,4 million since 2009. The reality is that this department has to create economic growth of at least 5% to turn around investor confidence and create the much-needed jobs.


The budget for this department, as the Minister so rightly said, was almost R900 million, which is an increase of about 27%. So, we are looking at that very carefully.


When the Secretariat of the Presidential Infrastructure Co-ordinating Commission, PICC, was placed under this department, Parliament was told that this department would cope. At present, the organogram reflecting the needs of the PICC has not been completed. The increase in the budget is partly for more technical people to be appointed to the PICC, growing the staff complement from 117 to 149. Can the Minister explain how, by bloating the staff component and increasing the budget, will the PICC better serve its mandate?


Actually, this function belongs in the Presidency. I don’t know why it is here. Minister, I beg you; do not follow in the footsteps of a questionable President. By leading your department from the front, you might be able to achieve positive results.


Since the Infrastructure Development Act came into being in 2014 and the spin-doctor marketing around the Strategic Infrastructure Projects, Sips, very little has materialised. The Minister argued that the Act would empower the department to fast-track SIPs projects by ``co-ordinating the blockages amongst various departments and entities operating in silos’’. However, the delays at Medupi and Kusile are rather blamed on the private sector – but the ANC urged Eskom in December to pull finger and fast-track construction to alleviate the strain on the electricity supply. The striking workers blame Eskom. So, Minister, I think this fast-tracking is your job and in your department, since you happen to be the chairperson of the PICC.


In the report published by the Portfolio Committee on Economic Development this week, it is clear that the quarterly reporting is also not materialising. We don’t know what state programmes and projects for job creation are available.


Has any report been published on the monitoring, progress and co-ordination of the infrastructure projects, especially those identified in the state of the nation addresses over the past couple of years? When will South Africa know what this department is doing and what progress has been made on the 18 Sips projects? When has this department reported on the progress of national energy projects or, for that matter, on the co-ordination of hydropower energy and gas projects in sub-Saharan Africa?


We are forever told that the reports are before Cabinet. When will the unemployed masses hear what programmes have been successfully implemented for job creation?


Economic development is a key priority all over South Africa, and the Minister has just agreed that the funding must go down to local government level. We entirely agree with that.


In order for South Africans to have economic freedom, government must breathe life into education and job-creation opportunities. We cannot just pay lip service to inequality. We must do something about it.


We must offer the people of South Africa something better. A commitment to economic growth and getting past the lip service is most important. We must offer the people of South Africa freedom in the economy, fairness in quality education and opportunity in the job market. I thank you, Chairperson. [Applause.]











Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 19









Mr M KHAWULA: Hon Deputy Chairperson, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, Economic Development is one of the few departments whose Minister and Deputy Minister are both always readily available for meetings and briefings of the select committee. That is appreciated of the Minister and his team.


The economy of our country is in distress. The growth rate of the country’s economy in 2014 was 1,5%, much lower than expectations and lower than the global economic growth of 3,3%. The International Monetary Fund, IMF, forecast for South Africa’s economic growth in 2015 is at 2%. Their forecast for our 2016 growth is at 2,1%. Yet, by March 2015, South Africa’s inflation rate was at about 4%. This is not a very good picture for our economy.


Coupled with these grim pictures, Eskom, with its electricity shortages, is struggling to meet the industrial and consumer demands of our country. This factor alone has a huge negative impact upon the sluggish economic growth of South Africa. Unemployment, especially among the youth of our country, is relatively high and remains one of the highest social challenges facing South Africa.


Poor labour relations, resulting in occasional industrial strikes, have led to some companies relocating to other African countries, like Botswana and Lesotho, to name but a few. For example, Johnson Controls, a global leader in automotive seating, overhead systems, floor consoles, door panels and instrument panels, relocated part of its operations in South Africa to Lesotho because of its ``need to achieve a more competitive manufacturing footprint’’. Last year, the Automotive Leather Company relocated from Rosslyn, Pretoria, to Lesotho. The wiring harness producer, Kromberg and Schubert, relocated to Botswana.


Other big corporates, like the mining sector, are either cutting down on staff in huge numbers or are closing down; and the country has thus far failed to deal with the structural problem of the huge, widening gap between the rich and the poor.


These are only a few of the many challenges facing economic development in our country. These challenges are not entirely of the making of your department, hon Minister, but are just what your department is faced with. Your department is a victim of circumstances in this case.


One other such circumstance is the fact that when government got bloated in this current administration – God knows why – with too many departments being created in the economic cluster. The result of that is enormous, unnecessary duplications and lack of co-ordination of efforts in the cluster.


The announcements of big spending to assist industrial development here today is good news indeed. However, one cannot help but view these probable gains against the backdrop of how much the country has lost and is continuing to lose. We need to look at ways of closing the exit valve and leaving open only the incoming valve. Government must get its house in order to enable economic development to shape up. I thank you.
















Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 20

"National Council of Provinces Main",Unrevised Hansard,29 Jun 2015,"[Take-20] [National Council of Provinces Main].doc"








The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Deputy Chairperson, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, it was on this date in 1940 that the then newly elected Prime Minister of the United Kingdom of England, Sir Winston Churchill, delivered his blood, toil, tears and sweat speech to the United Kingdom’s parliament. In his speech he said, and I quote:


We are in the preliminary stage of one of the greatest battles in history ... we are in action at many points ... we have to be prepared ... the air battle is continuous, and many preparations have to be made here at home.


I would say to the House as I said to those who have joined this government: I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears and sweat. We have before us an ordeal of the most grievous kind. We have before us many, many long months of struggle and of suffering.


You ask, what is our aim? I can answer in one word: Victory. Victory at all costs - victory in spite of all terror - Victory, however long and hard the road may be, for without victory, there is no survival.


Like the government of the United Kingdom in 1940, the ANC-led government is in the battle of its kind. And this is the battle against hunger, poverty and unemployment. And we are sure, as Churchill was in 1940, that this government will be victorious no matter – to quote Churchill again - ``however long and hard the road may be, for without victory, there is no survival.’’


We are sure about this victory against hunger, poverty and unemployment because this ANC-led government has got a plan. This plan is called the National Development Plan - a vision for South Africa for 20 years, that is, until 2030. And this plan does not evolve from nowhere. So, hon members, let’s have a round of applause for the ANC-led government. [Applause.] Its roots can be traced from the 2009 52nd National Conference in Polokwane, where the ANC took resolutions which, among others, were aimed at transforming our economy.


The resolution on transformation of the economy was based on 15 pillars, many of which talk to economic development issues. These include the following: Creating decent work which is the primary focus of economic policy; accelerating shared economic growth by overcoming obstacles to growth and intervening to promote equity; transforming the structures of production and ownership; developing programmes that directly absorb the unemployed, including Public Works Programmes; investing in priority skills and education; and developing macroeconomic policies that support growth, job creation and poverty eradication on a sustainable basis.


In 2012, in Mangaung, the ANC took another resolution that fortified the one it took in Polokwane to further strengthen our economic transformation. This was the adoption of the National Development Plan, the NDP, that I was talking about. The National Development Plan is a plan that runs for 20 years because governing a country like South Africa is a long-term project that needs a long-term plan. That is why you see even our manifestos not being different from each other. They always improve on one another with regard to objectives and goals that are long-term, and we should not be blamed for that. Most governing parties in our position do exactly the same because, as I said, governing a country is a long-term project.


Our 2014 election manifesto had the slogan ``a good story to tell’’ because, over 21 years, we have been able to make progress in dismantling the legacy of apartheid. Some people are quick to label us as having failed to govern, choosing to forget that apartheid was a well-planned intellectual policy that was implemented for about 50 years. In fact it was applied even before it was formalised, so it spans a period of more than 50 years.


With regard to economic transformation, the 2014 election manifesto of the ANC promised to act boldly and decisively to increase investment in the real economy and infrastructure, to stimulate faster levels of inclusive growth, to speed up social development, to substantially reduce poverty and unemployment and to place the economy on a qualitatively different growth path.


And this promise has already taken root at various levels of government. For example, in my province, Limpopo, the provincial government has developed the Limpopo Development Plan which is informed by the National Development Plan, and calls for an inclusive economic growth path aimed at addressing poverty, inequality and unemployment, while at the same time seeking to build a capable, career-oriented and professional Public Service.


The key targets and pillars underpinning the Limpopo Development Plan include the following: Attaining an economic growth rate of 3%; creating 429 000 jobs; increasing the Geographic Gross Product contribution to the national Gross Domestic Product, GDP, from 7,5% in 2014 to 9% over the Medium-Term Expenditure Framework, MTEF, period; reducing the unemployment rate from 16,9% in 2014 to 14% starting this year, and reducing inequality in terms of the Gini coefficient from 0,61% in 2014 to 0,50%.


In line with this development plan, the provincial government of Limpopo has facilitated the registration of about 13 co-operatives, which government continues to support and help market beyond the borders of the province. These co-operatives have positive spin-offs on investment into the economy of the province and the employment of the rural community.


One initiative running through these co-operatives is the Marula Festival that runs in late February every year, pulling in thousands of guests with concerts and, of course, fresh marula beer. Locals have also been experimenting with other uses for the marula fruit which has nuts that can be ground for cooking and making other products such as jam, soap and body lotion. Marula is really helpful. That is why we have a saying that goes ...



``Phala tša mona marula di a sepela.’’



I will be making a mistake if I leave out moringa, hon members ... [Interjections.]


An HON MEMBER: Moringa. Ja!


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): ... the best important herb in Limpopo. [Applause.] Its medicinal use deals with all types of diseases and hon members in here can testify to that. [Interjections.]




The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): The provincial government of Limpopo is also facilitating the implementation of the growth points programme which focuses on areas such as Lephalale, Musina, Makhado, Polokwane, Greater Tubatse and Phalaborwa. This programme seeks to encourage critical role-players and investors to implement projects in these areas.


So far, the construction of market stalls in the Mopani District has been completed and, in this financial year, market stalls will be constructed in Elias Motsoaledi Local Municipality in the Sekhukhune District and Molemole Local Municipality in the Capricorn District at an estimated value of R2,7 million.


These are but a few examples among many showing that the ANC-led government is making serious and positive moves in improving the lives of the people. [Interjections.]


Mošito o tšwela pele.



Siyaqhuba siya phambili.



The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon member, just hold on. Hon Dikgale, there is a point of order. Can you take a seat?


Mr J W W JULIUS: Chairperson.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Yes. On what point of order are you rising, hon member?


Mr J W W JULIUS: Can the hon member take a question about marula, please? Thank you.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon Dikgale, are you prepared to take a question?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Like Mama Cathy Dlamini used to say, ``outside.’’ She always said that.




The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Outside.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): No. She is not prepared to take a question.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Yes.



Mošito o tšwela pele.



Siyaqhuba siya phambili.



So says our President, Jacob Zuma.


We therefore, as the ANC, support the Budget Vote of the Department of the Economic Development. We do so because we know that for the government to continue with its efforts to make the lives of our people better, it needs money. As the late American political scientist, Aaron Wildavsky, put it, and I quote, ``Little can be done without money, and what will be tried is embedded in the budget’’.

We support this budget because we believe that it will take the Department of Economic Development further in executing the mandate of the governing party to make the lives of our people better. We therefore say to the Minister: Continue this journey that you have started of fighting poverty and unemployment. We know that it is long and hard but, like Churchill, you will survive and be victorious. The hon member Van Lingen will be a witness to that, hon Minister. [Interjections.]



Ka go realo le nna ke re ke swana le tšona phala tšela. Ke monne marula gomme ke a tloga.


E re ke go lotšhe.















Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 21









The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: Deputy Chair, on a point of order of a special kind ...


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): No, there is no such thing.


The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: All right. Deputy Chairperson, on this day, two members of this august House were born – hon Mokoena of the EFF and  ...


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): No, hon member. That’s not a point of order. Hon Chief Whip, can you take your seat? You should have raised it as a motion earlier on. You had an opportunity. However, for those who were born on this day, happy birthday to you. [Applause.]



Ms B A SCHÄFER (Western Cape)




Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 21










Ms B A SCHÄFER (Western Cape): Deputy Chairperson, hon Ministers and hon members, economic development in South Africa is hardly a good story to tell. In fact, it’s a dismal story in which we find ourselves, and government must take ownership of the failure to stimulate the kind of economic growth that South Africa needs. Economic development, in general, relates to economic growth which leads to job creation and, ultimately, poverty alleviation. However, it’s not the job of government to create jobs. It is the job of government to create an enabling environment in which to stimulate the economy through the private sector and, in that way, create the much-needed jobs that this country needs.


In a report titled, South African economy: An overview of key trends since 1994, by the Industrial Development Corporation , IDC, released in 2013, the manufacturing sector - back in 1994 - accounted for 20,9% of South Africa’s GDP. It steadily declined to around 12% in 2014. In fact, South Africa’s contribution to growth in manufacturing is dragging down the growth of the Southern African region. Without us, the growth in the manufacturing sector would have been 6,23% between 2007 and 2012. However, because of South Africa’s dismal performance, the region only grew by 2%. We are failing not only ourselves, but this continent too.


It is clear that our current national government has failed to assist our industries to create jobs and growth. In his Budget Vote speech yesterday, Minister Patel cherry-picked statistics to show how the Ministry is performing thus far. The truth of the matter is that South Africa has missed out by not focusing on growing its manufacturing base for the past 20 years. Countries that, instead, adopted strong industrial policies decades ago now far outstrip South Africa’s growth rates.


Between the fourth quarter of 2008, prior to President Zuma, and the fourth quarter of 2014, the number of unemployed people grew by over 1 million countrywide. The fact is that, under President Zuma’s leadership, broadbased unemployment has grown to 34,6%. [Interjections.] Provinces such as KwaZulu-Natal top the unemployment list at 616 000.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Just hold on, hon member. Take your seat.


Is that a point of order?


Ms T WANA: Deputy Chairperson, can the hon member take a question?


Ms B A SCHÄFER (Western Cape): No!


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): She doesn’t want to take the question.


Ms B A SCHÄFER (Western Cape): In the Western Cape, the number of discouraged workers since 2009 has dropped, and sits at 12% lower than the national rate. What this means is that four out of every five people who join the Western Cape labour force are finding jobs here. In the last quarter, our broad unemployment rate went down by a further percentage point. As our harvest season is now in full swing, we expect this figure to decrease further in the months ahead. As the Western Cape economy continues to improve through the implementation of sound economic development policies, more and more people in the Western Cape will have access to opportunities, benefiting the lives of all who choose to live here.


Growing the economy and creating jobs is not the easiest job at the best of times. With policy uncertainty, unreliable electricity supply and restrictive regulations, it becomes almost impossible. Yet, despite this, in the Western Cape, we are making the impossible possible. In the past five years, we have made great strides in getting our economy to work for the people of the Western Cape. I encourage Minister Patel to look more closely to the Western Cape. At every level, the DA-led Western Cape government is focusing on how to stimulate an environment for job creation.


The Western Cape has taken a whole new approach to delivery. We’re becoming more focused by embarking on the deepest consultation process ever conducted by a provincial government before deciding on its budgets and plans. The Western Cape has taken bold steps to work more cleverly and focus on key sectors with the greatest potential to accelerate growth and job creation. This process is called Project Khulisa, the first economic game changer of the Western Cape government. Under a high-growth scenario and with the full support of government and the private sector, this project can deliver over 200 000 jobs.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Hon member, just hold on. There is a point of order.


Mr E MAKUE: Deputy Chairperson, I would have liked to ask the speaker whether she knows we are discussing the national Budget.


Ms B A SCHÄFER (Western Cape): Yes.


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr R J Tau): That’s not a point of order. Continue with the debate. Continue, hon member.


Ms B A SCHÄFER (Western Cape): Project Khulisa means ``to grow’’ and growing the economy is what the DA-led Western Cape is focusing on. Project Khulisa is in line with the broad strategy of the National Development Plan but, for the first time, it takes a targeted view and plan of action to the next level.


This project focuses on growth and creating jobs in agriprocessing, tourism and the oil and gas sectors. The potential for our tourism sector is enormous. We already know that tourism is a major contributor to job creation in the Western Cape, pumping R17 billion into the economy and underpinning 204 000 formal jobs. With Project Khulisa, the DA-led government will add 120 000 more formal jobs to this sector and contribute another R1 billion to our economy. This is what I call real impact and real opportunity.


However, it will be impossible to grow our tourism sector at the rate required if our visa regulations chase visitors away. Until recently, Home Affairs seemed intent on killing South Africa’s new tourism growth market, particularly China, India and Africa, through onerous regulations seemingly designed to make travellers choose destinations other than South Africa. The standing committee report on the impact of these regulations has been quite clear. Visa regulations are killing 21 000 jobs in this sector.


Agriprocessing is, potentially, the most important priority to alleviate unemployment and poverty in the rural areas. This sector contributes R12 billion in goods and services to our economy and accounts for 79 000 formal jobs in the province. This is why it is so important that a DA-led Western Cape has chosen this sector as one of the three priorities, increasing production by 100% to R26 billion and 100 000 formal, direct jobs.


The oil and gas sector, underpinned by the designation of the Saldanha Bay Industrial Development Zone is projected to be a powerful economic catalyst for the region and the country. Through Project Khulisa, we have the inspirational goal of adding 60 000 more formal jobs in this sector and increasing its contribution to R11 billion.


I believe that Project Khulisa is the first bold approach of its kind from a government in South Africa. This must be acknowledged and commended. Once again, the DA Western Cape is taking the lead.


One of the main reasons South Africa is failing at developing the economy is that government is putting red tape in the way of growth. Red tape is being blamed for 70% of South Africa’s new small, medium and micro enterprises, SMMEs, failing in the first two years. It is estimated it can take start-ups up to 90 days or longer to do the regulatory procedures needed to open shop. In 2013, the growth index revealed that SMMEs spend an average of 75 hours a month dealing with red tape – an equivalent of eight working days. It has been estimated that red tape comes at a cost of 6,5% of South Africa’s GDP. Despite this, government wants more entrepreneurs to grow the economy.


Grant Thornton’s latest business report reveals a dismal 9% total optimism compared to that of 39% recorded just back in 2013. The report states that increased bureaucracy and red tape and economic uncertainty are the main causes. The situation in South Africa is so dramatic that we have recently fallen out of the global foreign direct investment rating, from a position of 13 in 2014. That’s just 12 months ago. This is what red tape really does to a country.


The Western Cape’s Red Tape Reduction Unit has a 90% reduction rate to assist business with unnecessary red tape. Government’s red tape is killing South Africa’s economy. We, in the Western Cape, understand the disastrous effects it has on jobs and growth and the impact of legislation on the economy. The Western Cape is committed to implementing regulatory impact assessments on new legislation introduced and creating an enabling environment, removing onerous red tape and blockages that prevent ease of business.

The DA-led Western Cape is already a leader in broadband access. Our initiatives to provide services to 2 000 government sites, including schools, libraries and health facilities, means that, by August 2018, most sites will be connected, with 90% of sites enjoying 100MB/sec speeds and 10% enjoying 1GB/sec speeds. Increasing Internet connectivity to areas where it is lacking is incredibly important. A 1% increase in connectivity is so profitable that we get 10 times the money back on its investment. According to a World Bank study, for every 10% Internet penetration in a developing country, there is a correlating 1,38% GDP growth. This is one of the primary factors driving the adoption and implementation of the Western Cape’s broadband strategy.


The green economy also plays a pivotal role in stimulating economic growth. With the help of national government, we are hoping to implement the designation of the green economy manufacturing zone in Atlantis. This will attract new companies to the area.


There is no doubt the DA-led Western Cape is already on the right path to economic development, promoting economic growth through improving public infrastructure service delivery and positioning the Western Cape for investors and entrepreneurs. This is the kind of government the DA represents in the Western Cape - a supporting government giving opportunities for all. I thank you. [Applause.]





Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 22

"National Council of Provinces Main",Unrevised Hansard,13 May 2015,"[Take-22] [National Council of Provinces Main][90P-5-085b][gs].doc"









The DEPUTY MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: Chair, I appreciate the opportunity that I have been given by the House to come and debate the work that we do in the department. Where do I start? Maybe I should start at the beginning.


Greg Mills once said, in 2010, that the reason why Africa is poor is because of the decisions the leaders of the respective countries have taken in the past. And I asked myself why he was reasoning like that. Just this weekend I realised the reason why.


Somebody went to a congress of the DA and delivered a lecture, and indicated that somebody - Hendrik Verwoerd - was one of the best and smart tacticians that a number of DA members have actually equalled, and advised those leaders who are to come to follow suit. Hendrik Verwoerd made a decision together with his cronies, and that decision was to make sure that the majority of the people of South Africa are poor and do not have qualitative work. Hendrik Verwoerd together with his cronies set up the framework on how the South African economy should work. The framework that they put together ensured that it must service the minority in the country. The majority just had to be tools and work as slaves in order to benefit the minority.


In this South Africa, the decisions taken by those that we followed from 1994 onwards were that we were not going to industrialize, and we were not going to beneficiate our minerals. We were going to send our commodities into the whole world for the commodities to be utilized in those areas. The decision of the leaders at that particular time was that our agricultural sector would never do processing. We would send all the materials to the rest of the world to be able to benefit us.


That is the kind of economy that we have seen growing, hon Schäfer and hon van Lingen. It has been growing because people were buying our commodities raw. But, in 2009, those markets - as you indicated,  hon van Lingen - and those countries suffered a crisis and they could not buy materials from South Africa, which this economy was so dependent on.


What has South Africa done? South Africa, not the Department of Economic Development - not only the government, but the people of South Africa - sat together as business, labour and government and looked at how we should respond and restructure this economy in such a way that it must not continue into a downturn. What is it that we did? We came up with what we called the New Growth Path, NGP, and this New  Growth Path identified all the growth drivers in all the sectors and new ones to come and, based on that, we then decided that these are the things we are going to do to reduce our dependence on the outside. Those are the things that we are actually referring to. [Interjections.]


Now I just hear that members of the DA are becoming more confused in respect of what the NGP is. The people of South Africa again - this government of the ANC - have decided and asked, going forward, what it is that we should do. It actually came to all of us to set up a commission to ask each and every citizen of South Africa what it is that we must do. The people said, ``Here are the things that are supposed to be done. Here is a National Development Plan, NDP, that you must carry forward’’. The National Development Plan says on page 90 - if you are not able to read it -  that  when we deal with the economy, the National Growth Path is an action plan that you must put emphasis on because it is the one that is going to take you into the new trajectory. That is what it says, and that is exactly what we are all about - reversing what Verwoerd has done.


What is it that we are doing? The Minister has already spoken about what it is that is being done at a national level.


We are interacting with various provinces. We reported the previous time that we interacted with Parliament - both the NCOP and the National Assembly - that we are going to interact with provinces to ensure that we accelerate the work that we are doing on the ground. What hon Schäfer was talking about is the result of that work.


It is the result of that work because, in the Western Cape, the issues that were identified when we were sharing what it is that we must do and how to consolidate our work towards the NDP showed there are very good officials in the Western Cape who understand that their role is to make South Africa better.


They indicated that they are going to focus on liquid gas production. They are going to focus on Saldanha Bay which is a national project that has been put there. They are going to build it up and see if they are not going to be able to carry out things at the provincial level. [Applause.] They have said that they are going to look at the blue economy and the areas of small harbours and see how to assist the province to actually move forward and contribute more to what we are supposed to do. Those were the reasons why they were actually doing that.


In Limpopo, the work that has been done thus far has been outlined, because they have started focusing on that. Just go and check on your statistics, hon Schäfer. [Interjections.] Just go and check your statistics. The statistics show Limpopo, because of that growth and because of the input that you have made.


Mr W F FABER:[Inaudible.]


The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF NCOP (Mr R J Tau): Honourable Deputy Minister, just hold on. Hon members, there is nothing wrong with interjecting - and we keep on saying that - but don’t disturb the speaker, please. Can you continue, hon Deputy Minister?


The DEPUTY MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: You have not reflected that Limpopo today - in terms of job creation and the work that we have been doing - is leading the country in terms of the percentage growth because, if you look at the growth of employment, they are growing at 32% as compared to a 17% growth rate between Gauteng and Western Cape. [Applause.] That is the reality of the work that is being done by government, if you want to know what it is that we are supposed to be doing.


The second point that we want to speak to is that when you go to the various provinces and specifically Gauteng, they have identified what they want to do. Industrialization is part of the focus. Agro-processing is part of the focus.  Mineral beneficiation is part of their focus. Go to the North West.


We will tell you because this is an interaction we are having with the provinces and we are working together. We have agreed that, going forward, what we are going to do this year is consolidate those plans and pick those that we want to implement at a national level and, within the Minmec, identify what it is that we must do. By the way, at a national level, that is what it is for those who do not understand what it is. Thank you very much. [Time expired.] [Applause.]





















Wednesday, 13 May 2015                      Take: 23

"National Council of Provinces Main",Unrevised Hansard,13 May 2015,"[Take-23] [National Council of Provinces Main][90P-5-085b][gs].doc"








Dr Y C VAWDA: Chairperson, allow me first and foremost to acknowledge the presence of our supreme forces, irrespective of whatever our perceptions might be. The rest of us, hon presiding officer, remain mere mortals.


That then leaves me with the enviable task of greeting all of you with As-saalamu-alai-kum. [Peace be with you.]


Presiding officer, I am extremely concerned that the two individuals sitting across from you are attempting to develop something that is already developed. Hon Minister and hon Deputy Minister, the next time you are sitting in your offices, take a look at the Cape Town skyline, and you will understand what I mean. The South African economy is already an extremely well-developed economy.


The challenge facing you, your department and the administration is to find ways and channels to ensure that the majority population sidelined in this economy can find access to also participate in the same.

The present socioeconomic systems in this country are largely biased in favour of an elite few: educated, wealthy, privileged and advantaged – a system that has existed for many decades. While the last 21 years of ANC government has seen the development of a small middle-class, it has sadly brought about little change in the lives of the majority of the people of South Africa.


The present systems are well established and well entrenched, and those who participate successfully in it seek largely to ensure monopoly over the situation. As such, all attempts to develop this economy within the confines of these existing systems, these existing socioeconomic systems, will ensure development that will continue to benefit the same few.


The marginalisation of the many will continue. Those with two motor cars will have three. Two TV sets will become three. Two holidays in a year will become four. And a diet that includes rolls, French loaf and fatted cheese will graduate to include croissants and caviar. Meanwhile, across the proverbial railway tracks, more and more people will go to bed hungry at night.


Working within these systems makes more opportunities available to those who need it least, and fewer opportunities to those who need it most.


The deep-rooted mass unemployment and level of inequalities that are morally unacceptable and which constitute a real threat to the country’s social and economic stability will continue to persist.


Hon Minister, in this, the Year of the Freedom Charter, we in the EFF challenge you to implement the clauses of the Freedom Charter that say that the mineral resources beneath the soil, the banks and monopoly industry shall be transferred to the ownership of the people as a whole. All other industry and trade shall be controlled to assist the wellbeing of the people.


This, hon Minister, will bring about meaningful economic development for the people at grassroots level.


What then is the solution, hon Minister? You will have to think out of the box. I have no doubt that you and the hon Deputy Minister, both committed fighters for economic emancipation, will find no difficulty in this regard. It is convincing your honourable cahoots... colleagues - sorry - that will remain your greatest challenge. [Laughter.]


Hon members, I have no doubt that all of you will agree with the vision that seeks to redress the growing socioeconomic gap in this country. As committed believers in this cause, I therefore make no apologies for repeating a message often times quoted from this podium – as repetition proves beneficial to the believer – and as such we advocate for an increase in salaries, the nationalisation of strategic resources, and the allocation of land to people, amongst others.


Almost 30% of South Africans are employed in the informal sector. Increasing salaries will result in an increase in capital in the economy, and the informal sector will blossom in sympathy.


However, let me hasten to add that a demand for a minimum salary should not be seen in this light alone. It is a demand based primarily on the right of our working people to be remunerated in a manner that will restore dignity to the labour that they make available on a daily basis and which this economy is so hopelessly dependent upon.


Let us consider briefly the efforts of one Thomas Sankara, when, in 1983, as president of Burkina Faso, he nationalised strategic resources, allocated land to the people, and said to the French government’s offer of aid that Burkina Faso did not need handouts, as that would make the country dependent on others, and entrench a beggar mentality in the lives of people.


By 1983, not only had Burkina Faso become self-sufficient in food, but the country had also begun exporting food to its neighbours.


The land policy of willing–buyer, willing-seller was a mere continuation of the status quo. This situation exists all over the world.


Extreme conditions require extreme solutions. This willing buyer – willing seller approach., together with the approach which made large commercial farms available to individuals grossly unprepared for this exercise, leading not only to compromised resources... [Time expired.]



















Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 23








Mr J J LONDT: Hon House Chair, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister and hon members of the NCOP, let me start by responding to hon Deputy Minister Masuku.


I am so sorry that you fell asleep halfway through the televised debate over the weekend because, if you had stayed awake for the entire broadcast, you would have heard the former DA Western Cape Minister, Robin Carlisle, clearly saying that Verwoerd was a racist and a bigot. It is clear that you choose your information selectively.


The leader of the DA, Mmusi Maimane – and also the future leader of South Africa – clearly said that we do not align ourselves with what Verwoerd had said and what he stood for. [Interjections.] So I do not understand why... or I can perhaps understand that you could not pay full attention to the full broadcast but it was good. It was good.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Londt, just hold on, please. Take your seat. Hon Nyambi, why are you on your feet?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon House Chair, I want to check his honesty. Is he ready to take a question about Verwoerd?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Londt, are you ready to take a question?


Mr J J LONDT: Okay.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Oh! He’s ready! [Laughter.] Hon Nyambi?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr A J Nyambi): Hon Londt, can you explain to the House why, when Verwoerd was mentioned as a hero, the name of a single black person, not even your Mandela that you admire, was not mentioned?


Mr J J LONDT: Hon Chair, can I go there?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Yes, thank you. You may.


Mr J J LONDT: Our country has tremendous leaders. Nelson Mandela was one of the best, if not the best leader that our country... [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Order, hon members! Order! Order!


Mr J J LONDT: The DA has gone on record to say that we should all strive to live up to the ideals of hon Nelson Mandela. So, that is a stated point by the DA, and I do not understand how the hon member forgets this when we say it almost at every single debate. But I will repeat it again and again, and maybe the hon member will take it in. [Interjections.]


Okay, let me continue.


Sustained economic growth at levels far above what we currently have is the only way we will address the unemployment rate and the crippling poverty in this country.


South Africa’s narrow unemployment rate is around 23,4%, almost five times higher... [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Please take your seat, hon member. Hon Dlamini, why are you on your feet?

Ms L C DLAMINI: Hon Chair, I just want to check if he will take a follow-up question.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Londt, are you still ready to take another question?


Mr J J LONDT: Hon Chair, let me finish my speech, and then I’ll take questions. Is that fine?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): He is refusing. Continue, hon Londt.


Mr J J LONDT: South Africa’s narrow unemployment rate is around 23,4%, almost five times higher than in the Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa, Brics, countries. With almost two thirds of the youth of our country unemployed, there is a need for the problem to be addressed by government and the private sector. Everybody acknowledges this.


How do we address this? Everybody says we need 6 million jobs. Now the ANC uses the 6 million jobs and they do it through the Expanded Public Works Programme, EPWP, jobs or for...





Stukwerk. Hier in die Weskaap noem ons dit stukwerk. En stukwerk gaan nie vir jou help om ’n loopbaan te bou en vorentoe te gaan nie. Nou dis goed dat die EPWP program vir mense daardie ondervinding gee binne die werksomgewing.



But that is not how we are going to get out of this situation. We need to create entrepreneurs. Government needs to create an environment where we can create 1 million entrepreneurs to provide at least five jobs for every entrepreneur. That is how we will create 6 million sustainable jobs.


So, we in the DA believe that government must create an enabling environment to create these jobs.


If we create this enabling environment, the private sector will come on board. The private sector is not just a small elite sitting in a city or a town somewhere. The private sector is the 1 million entrepreneurs that will come through the ranks throughout South Africa to help break the shackles we find ourselves in.


We come from a tragic past and nobody denies that. There were huge inequalities in South Africa when we started in 1994, and progress has been made in South Africa. Nobody denies that.

But what we should stop doing is comparing ourselves to what we had in 1994, and rather measure ourselves every five years. So, if we set ourselves a target of being at a particular point in 1999, and we end up at a different point, we have failed ourselves. If we have set ourselves a target of being at a particular point in 2004, and we are at a different point, we have failed ourselves. That is why we should measure ourselves where we are at the moment and the progress we are making from there.


The biggest tragedy in South Africa over the past 21 years is how we have failed the children of our country in respect of their education. That is why we are struggling to create entrepreneurs, because we are not providing the education.


Economic development can only accelerate at the rate we want it to accelerate if the children who come out of school system have been given the skills to grasp the opportunities that government has created there. But this government should be ashamed that the majority of black South African children do not get the same quality of education as other South Africans, 21 years into the new South Africa.


And after 21 years, we need to start improving it and seeing the levels of improvement.


I am quickly going to wrap up. We know that it is not just a Western Cape, a Limpopo or an Eastern Cape problem; it is a South African problem. We believe that we are setting a good example in the Western Cape, and we are holding up that example so that other provinces and national government can try and do the same as we are doing in the province.


Sorry, my time is up. I will take the question outside.














Cllr G CAVANAGH (Salga)  







Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 24

"National Council of Provinces Main",Unrevised Hansard,13 May 2015,"[Take-24] [National Council of Provinces Main][90P-5-085b][gs].doc"









Cllr G CAVANAGH (Salga): Hon Chairperson of the NCOP, hon Minister and Deputy Minister, hon members of the House in the NCOP and ladies and gentlemen, good afternoon.


Economic development in South Africa can only be realised with the convergence of multiple actors within the economy and around a common development agenda. This includes the co-ordination and alignment of the whole of government’s programmes towards this agenda. It also means directing capital managed in the hands of the private sector, the commitment of organised labour and the guidance of civil society to bring about the quantum and quality of the economy that is acceptable to South Africa as a society, while operating within environmental limits.


To this end, the mandate of the Economic Development department is critical for the growth, efficiency and inclusivity of the national economy but also that of local economies. The very viability of local governments relies on the health of local economies and the businesses and jobs that are created within municipal boundaries as well as the strategic investments made to ensure that the local economy continues to grow for the ensuing generations. The department’s role in guiding capital investment, whether infrastructure or finance, or through ensuring a competitive economy which in turn creates jobs, is crucial for the sustainability and functionality of local governments across this country.


The SA Local Government Association, Salga, supports the planned strategic interventions geared toward the job drivers identified in the New  Growth Path , namely, agriculture and agro-processing, as well as mining and beneficiation. In many municipalities where these sectors are the predominant economic sector, there has been a concomitant decline in the viability of these sectors for various reasons. This affects the viability of the settlements and that of the municipality.


To this end, Salga has launched the small town regeneration initiative and would welcome the collaboration with the department around the common objective of supporting towns in decline where mining and agriculture have the potential to prop up the economy of the settlement.


For this reason, Salga encourages the department to strengthen these sectors where they are still viable and, moreover, to engage local governments so as to ensure that development is co-ordinated via the integrated development plan, IDP, process which, in the case of mining, should assist the dialogue between mining interests and local government around the social and labour plans, and the sustainability of the economy beyond the lifespan of the mine.


As far as agriculture is concerned, ensuring the continued supply of input factors for agriculture but also discussing the potential agri­processing investments within a municipality is especially pertinent with the promulgation of Spatial Planning and Land Use Management Act but just as important to include in the IDP.


The green economy today can be thought of as what industrialisation was to the economy in the 18th and 19th centuries - a shift in the means of economic production. This is true, perhaps not in scale, but certainly in significance, as it holds the key delinking the economy from carbon, thereby contributing to our sustained collective future.


It also holds the potential to create new business, semiskilled and skilled jobs and opportunities to attract foreign direct investment, amongst others. This calls for thoughtful co-ordination with the local government sector in order to ensure that municipalities are ready to respond to inve.stment as well as

to prepare for and stimulate or attract and localise upstream economic responses to the initial investment.


However, in many instances, these shifts in the economy may be viewed as a threat to the viability of municipalities due to their reliance on energy supply as a revenue stream. Implementing green economy initiatives must be done in conjunction with and sequenced in such a way so as to not destabilise the viability of the local government.


Black women and the youth face distinct challenges in participating in the productive sectors of this economy. It is commonly accepted that women bear a disproportionate burden of global poverty, while economies the world over struggle to be inclusive as far as new entrants to the economy are concerned.


In this regard, Salga proposes that the department utilise the Youth Employment Accord and, together with the necessary partners, including Salga, work towards developing a charter for women as well, which should set out an agenda for all societal actors, including local government, to respond towards ensuring the economy is more inclusive for these target groups.


Regarding the spatial, local and provincial initiatives to promote employment, empowerment and development, provinces have a central role to play in contextualising the situation for national government and grounding them within the realities and specificities of each province, thereby providing local government with guidance in terms of aligning economic planning with national economic goals.


For this reason, Salga suggests that, in the alignment and development of the two provincial economic development plans, a framework be formulated to enable other provinces to evaluate their development strategies. This would ensure that provinces review their provincial growth and development strategies against a common framework, evaluating their effectiveness in ensuring that economic planning, infrastructure investment and development spending take place in accordance with the principles set out in the New Growth Path, NGP. This initiative in turn would ensure that local governments nationally would, during the review of their IDPs, respond collectively to the NGP.


The economy is still recovering from the protracted labour disputes in the primary sector in 2014.  Municipalities that are typically dependent on a single economic sector will find that it leads to vulnerabilities in service delivery and their overall sustainability.


For this reason, challenges emanating from labour unrest are a threat for the economy but also for local government. Local government and its association, Salga, must be included in local planning but should also find representation at the bargaining tables, which we all know is a welcome move. Salga welcomes the initiative to take forward the discussions on the outcomes of the Labour Relations Indaba, and sees this as an opportunity for support and collaboration.


The impact of infrastructure investment in the value chain extends to business in local municipalities and, therefore, the co-ordinated involvement of the local government sector is not only essential for economic development reasons but also for the sustainability of the infrastructure maintenance across its lifespan.


With respect to co-ordination, local governments need to be able to ensure that national investment plans can be responded to strategically, so that investment is maximised in local areas. This means that local business and local labour could possibly respond to the economic opportunity.


Moreover, local governments may need to adjust their own infrastructure spend in order to accommodate or, as mentioned, maximise on the investment. The primary tool to be used, again, should be the IDP. Timeous engagements with the political and administrative heads of local government are needed to ensure that investment is leveraged for local economies and local economic actors.


With these words, we applaud the Economic Development department and its Ministry for the work they are currently undertaking but also for the intended plans. Salga supports the department’s efforts but also, as a sector, wishes to engage and collaborate more fully with the department on the issues set out in our submission here today. I thank you. [Applause.]

















"National Council of Provinces Main",Unrevised Hansard,13 May 2015,"[Take-25] [National Council of Provinces Main][90P-5-085b][gs].doc"

Cllr G CAVANAGH (Salga)




Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 25









Mr B G NTHEBE: Chairperson, the councillor used up my time.


Hon Minister, Deputy Minister, guests, leadership of the SA Local Government Association, Salga, members, distinguished guests, and special delegates, let me also pay homage to one of Mzanzi’s finest, a revolutionary who sacrificed one of the most noble tasks in life, the task of raising one’s children, and she did that for the betterment of all of us, including those who are riding on a broken blue train. Mama Ruth taught us that one can be from the most rural part of the country - the periphery of the periphery - but you can become, under extreme difficulties, an international icon. We shall be indebted to your generation, Mama Ruth, for generations to come. Hamba kahle. Robala ka kagiso, mama Ruth.


Hon Minister, Mama Ruth would be so proud to know that, on the day that she sadly passed away, R23 billion was set aside to support black industrialists. She would be so proud to hear that R4,5 billion each was set aside for the development and support of women and youth. [Applause.] She would be so proud to learn that, through your department, the New Growth Path compels us to garner special efforts to generate opportunities for young people to reduce the unemployment rate. You are on course, hon Minister. This Ministry is living true to the ANC commitment of transforming the production and ownership patterns. Continue to diversify ownership patterns and we should make it inclusive, consistent with the Mangaung Resolution. I want to say to the standing chairperson of the Western Cape that the buzz words are the following: you transform, you diversify, and you become inclusive.


Let’s continue to invest in the rail and port infrastructure. The North West Premier, Supra Mahumapelo, announced in his recent state of the province address that rail infrastructure in the province linking the North West to Gauteng will be resuscitated to supplement the economic activities, as outlined by the province, with unshaken support from your department, hon Minister.


The Mangaung 53rd conference also propelled us to support intra-African trade and you have correctly identified and said that R36 billion worth of exports have already been the product of such an intra-African trade partnership. We must also increase market penetration as we deepen the domestic and regional market.


Beneficiation and industrialisation must be at the centre because beneficiation and industrialisation are important pillars of such a noble task. We must continue to expand our export base, because this remains a critical step for us to close the existing economic loopholes. Through your department, hon Minister, 5 million jobs in 2020, as per the dictates of the New Growth Path, should be created as we get there.


We were in the Northern Cape. We have seen the resolutions of the ANC conference being implemented there when the Mangaung resolutions propelled us to open up investment opportunities and stimulate export markets. Economic development is at ... I mean, we have seen that through your renewable energy and your green economy. It’s all over the Northern Cape; it’s a living testimony. The Northern Cape is going to be the capital province of the green economy, with economic spin-offs on the nearby communities. We want to say that you should continue to make sure that there is transfer of skills to our locals as a stepping stone towards empowering our own people.


If you go to Mpumalanga, hon Minister, the people of Mpumalanga are reaping the rewards of the soya bean factory in Mpumalanga. The people of Mpumalanga are reaping the rewards of the mining dump rehabilitation in Middelburg. You have correctly identified that 169 000 out of the 244 000 jobs are in manufacturing, which is part of the export inter-African trade that we have with our African partners.


I just want to say to the hon Vawda that it becomes impractical sometimes to try and understand what you are trying to say, because you are so rhetorical. However, I want to agree with you. Monopolies must be disbanded in South Africa, because monopolies are synonymous with corruption. I agree with that. However, I also want to disagree with you in that not every form of nationalisation is progressive. [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Order, hon members! Order, hon Nthebe! Please take your seat. I just want to check. Hon Julius, why are you rising?


Mr J W W JULIUS: Chairperson, I just wanted to know whether the hon Nthebe is prepared to take a question, just as the hon Londt took a question just now.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Very well. Hon Nthebe, are you prepared to take a question?


Mr B G NTHEBE: Hon Juju is my friend. He knows where we meet. [Laughter.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Julius, he is not prepared to take a question.


Mr B G NTHEBE: ... so we must be explicit in that not every form of nationalisation is progressive. [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Nthebe, please hold on. There is another member standing. Hon Mtileni?


Mr V E MTILENI: Which one is progressive nationalisation ...


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mtileni, why are you standing?


Mr V E MTILENI: ... and which one is not progressive nationalisation?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mtileni! Hon Mtileni, I want to check something with you. Can you please help us to have order in this House. Why are you on your feet?


Mr V E MTILENI: I want to know which one is progressive nationalisation and which one is not.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Just hold on, hon Mtileni. Do you want to ask the hon member a question?


Mr V E MTILENI: Yes, which one is ...


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): No, no no! Can you please allow him ... give him a chance, if he is ready, to take your question.


Mr V E MTILENI: ... but ... [Laughter.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Are you ready, hon Nthebe?


Mr B G NTHEBE: Chair, my answer is very simple: Hon Mtileni must go and read. There are countries that implemented nationalisation which was meant to marginalise the majority of the people in such countries.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Very well. Can I now allow the hon member - not you, hon Julius - Mathys. She has been standing on her feet. Why are you rising, hon member?


Ms L MATHYS: I am rising to ask the hon speaker whether he will take a question.  [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hold it there. Let me ask him. [Interjections.] Please don’t make a statement.


If you ask if an hon member will take a question, then you must wait for their response. Please wait. [Interjections.]


Mr B G NTHEBE: I will give her my card to meet outside this session.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Very well. Please take your seat. He is not ready now.


Mr B G NTHEBE: Hon Minister, we want to ensure the North West’s support for agroprocessing.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Nthebe, please take your seat.


Hon Julius, you were standing on your feet earlier on ...


Mr J W W JULIUS: Chairperson, on a point of order: Hon Nthebe called me ``Juju’’. [Laughter.] Can he please withdraw that? I am hon Julius. Thank you.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Nthebe, did you call him ``hon Juju’’?

Mr B G NTHEBE: No, Chair, I said he’s my friend. But I will withdraw. I know the ``Juju’’ name is contagious.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Very well. Hon Julius, it has been withdrawn.


Hon Vawda, why are you rising? Hon Nthebe, please take your seat.


Mr B G NTHEBE: Chair, they are taking up my speaking time.


Dr Y C VAWDA: Chair, hon Julius should feel honoured to be called hon ``Juju’’. [Laughter.]


But, seriously, on a point of order: I would like to know if it is parliamentary for a member who by his own admission did not understand what I said to then be making those comments?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Very well, take your seat, please. That is a point of discussion. You have had your turn. Continue, hon member.


Mr B G NTHEBE: Hon Minister, we want to assure our greatest supporters in the North West about the agroprocessing processes that we will embark on, with your support, of course, and the value-added processes for the mining products that are going to have a ripple effect on the lives of our people. We also agree with you that we want a system where our own people are going to own and control the enterprises that they have. This is why we support your point that black industrialists in this country need to be given support in totality as we move forward.


But we must be clear about the obsession with the President, like that shown by the hon Van Lingen. She is paying lip service to this process. She can’t even acknowledge the 20 billion tons of value-added manganese from the Port of Ngqura. She was there when we embarked on that process. She knows what the benefits of that are. Yet she comes here and negates everything that she has seen.



We also want to say to hon Van Lingen that if there is going to be a process of acknowledging the energy challenges that we have in the country, there are two things to note: We need to work on our generating capacity as a country so that when we finish with the generation capacity as the basis, we can deal with the infrastructural distribution capacity that we have as a country. For years and years our people were told that they couldn’t access energy for various reasons. Now, today, if you go to the most rural parts of this country, our people have access to energy. We want to make sure that our people have access to that.


Hon Minister, I want to break it down for you. I want to break down the hypocrisy of the broken, blue leaderless train for you. They hate the ANC with a passion, yet they want to celebrate Nelson Mandela who, in his very own words, pronounced for the world to know that, had it not been for the ANC, he would not be known today. Mandela was an ANC member to his revolutionary grave and we must tell the people from the broken blue train.


An HON MEMBER: What train is that?


Mr B G NTHEBE: Like one writer said, the storyline of the broken blue train could perhaps ...


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Nthebe, please hold on. Take your seat.


Mr V E MTILENI: What is a ``broken blue train’’?


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mtileni! [Interjections.] Why are you rising?


Mr V E MTILENI: Chair, I want him to explain what a broken blue train is.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Do you want to ask a question?




The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Then you need to check whether he agrees to take a question or not. Are you willing to take a question, hon Nthebe?


Mr B G NTHEBE: No, I’m not, Chair.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): He is not prepared to take a question. Take your seat, please, hon Mtileni.


Mr B G NTHEBE: As one writer said, the storyline of the broken blue train could perhaps make an excellent movie script. But it is far from reality, hon Minister. It is far from reality. The broken blue train announces their vision will be released in a few weeks, but how do you leave a conference which you celebrate as the most successful one yet, but you don’t even have a policy and programme. You are only going to produce it in a few weeks ... [Interjections.] ... which set out the policy and programmes for a broken blue train. [Interjections.] This clearly means the fourth estate can give them all the publicity in the world, but the reality of the broken blue train is a broken agenda. It’s not clearly defined up until the script is determined, and we are waiting for that script. [Interjections.] One minute, Minister, the broken pastor will support the referendum for the death penalty, just to make an about turn on the matter the next, because the Constitution is very explicit. [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon member, just hold on. Hon Mtileni, why are you on your feet?


Mr V E MTILENI: I realise that my watch is not like that of the ANC, because, you see, he has been speaking for 15 minutes. [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon member, you are out of order. We don’t have an ANC watch in this House. Please take your seat. The hon member is still left with 56 seconds.


Mr B G NTHEBE: The broken pastor also borrowed an ANC term - ``second transition’’, yet they hate the ANC. Broken pastor, broken blue train. To the broken pastor I want to say: Take it easy; you are trying so hard to be the Obama of Soweto while Allister Sparks’ blue wave will ``verwoerd’’ you out of the broken blue train. We want to be clear, Minister and Deputy Minister, that there can be no freedom, fairness or opportunities when the playground is not level. It’s like somebody 15m down the race line telling somebody who is on his marks ``Never mind. We are on the blue train; it’s an open-opportunity society’’. There is nothing like that. Level the playground so that you are able to go forward. This is what the ANC is doing. Thank you. [Applause.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Order, hon members. Hon Mathys, why are you rising? [Interjections.]


Ms L MATHYS: Chair, I am rising because I would like to speak to Rule 50(1) under Explanations:


During a debate in the Council a member may be allowed to explain a previous speech but only when and to the extent that the speech has been misquoted or misunderstood in a material respect.


You did not give our hon member from the EFF, hon Vawda, the opportunity to explain what he meant when our speech was in question. He should be allowed to do that, because it was misquoted.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Thank you. I will consult with the Table staff and come back to you. Please take your seat. I will address that in the next sitting.



"National Council of Provinces Main",Unrevised Hansard,13 May 2015,"[Take-26] [National Council of Provinces Main][90P-5-085b][gs].doc"







Wednesday, 13 May 2015                     Take: 26









The MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: House Chair, I would like to say that we have set out a bold vision for transformation in the Economic Development Budget Vote. I am delighted that a number of members of this honourable House have, in fact, responded to that and given us feedback that is helpful. We will take that forward.


I would like to take a few minutes and respond to the comments particularly by the hon Van Lingen and Schäfer who have shown not only a profound misunderstanding of economics and how economies work - which can be corrected by going to university - but also a failure to understand how government works. [Interjections.]


Hon Schäfer says that she will encourage Minister Patel to look more closely at the Western Cape model. Let’s look at the Western Cape model. Firstly, let’s start with the Quarterly Labour Force Survey, which the DA representatives have quoted. I have the latest copy here, dated 10 February 2015 and I go to page 8. I find the following on page 8: the number of jobs in the economy grew by 143 000 for the year, as a whole - North West did the best with 80 000; Limpopo followed with 67 000; Gauteng followed thereafter with 58 000, then the Free State with 26 000. Who had the lowest job growth? [Interjections.] In fact, it was the Western Cape that lost 65 000 jobs. It is not the economic model that we would want to look at.


Secondly, with regard to small business development, in fact, the Western Cape government shut down the Red Door programme. National government stepped in and helped small businesses. We are pumping enormous sums of money into small business in the Western Cape, through the Small Enterprise Finance Agency. Over the last two years alone, the Industrial Development Corporation, IDC, put R3 billion into the Western Cape, more than the budget of the economic development and tourism department in the Western Cape.


In Atlantis, there are now factories being set up that manufacture the components for wind farms. Those are factories located in the Western Cape, supported by the renewable energy programme of national government that sets a requirement to localise. There is a wind farm in Matzikama that has just been opened up producing 100 megawatts of energy. It is going to boost the Western Cape’s economic growth. It is run, financed and supported by Eskom, a national entity.


There are two electronic companies in Atlantis that opened recently, including Hisense. They are supported by national government incentives. In fact, Hisense got the inspiration when President Zuma visited China and said that they should come and locate here in South Africa.


Regarding the Saldanha Bay Industrial Development Zone, IDZ, the construction has started. We see this as one of a number of important IDZs. It is a national government programme, driven by the Department of Trade and Industry, DTI, supported by national government.


With regard to the Clanwilliam Dam, construction will be starting shortly. It is boosting employment in the Western Cape and it is financed by national government.


Let me also look at the broader picture. The DA took over from the ANC in the Western Cape in 2009. Under DA rule, the unemployment rate in the Western Cape grew from 19,9% to 24,5%. The number of unemployed people in the Western Cape was 525 000 in 2009 and, today, it is 705 000. In other words, 181 000 additional people are unemployed under DA rule.


Let me go to the question of small business. The hon Van Lingen laments ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Order, hon members! [Interjections.]


The MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: I have a copy of the Quarterly Labour Force Survey ...


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon members, we are governed by Rules on veneration. If we check Rule 32, we see that members are not allowed to converse aloud during the debate in the Council. Please, we need life in this House, but we don’t want you to prevent the speaker from being heard.


The MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: House Chair, I think it is because these are unpalatable facts. When you put facts on the table that change the storyline and it is an uncomfortable truth, then you have to shout, heckle and you have to not hear what those facts are.


Let’s put a few more facts on the table. [Interjections.] I want to point to the fact that hon Van Lingen complains about the budget of the department, on the one hand, and she laments the lack of funding for small business, on the other hand. Perhaps I can teach hon Van Lingen how to read the accounts of a department. The budget of the department is R885 million. Of that, R152 million comes to the department and R406 million goes to the Small Enterprise Finance Agency. In other words, almost three times as much of the budget that goes to the department goes to small business.


Hon Van Lingen argues about a bloated bureaucracy – 32 extra people. However, listen to this: she says that it has grown from 117 to 149. What she fails to point out is that I have actually asked that it be reduced from 166 to 149 so that I can release resources that can go into small business development, that can meet the needs of communities and that can actually transform the economy.


Hon Van Lingen says that little has been done since the Infrastructure Development Act, Act 23 of 2014, has been implemented. In fact, 16 water use licenses have been issued on the infrastructure programme, and four environmental impact authorisations have been given. If you look today, 220 000 people are working on our national infrastructure programme - building dams, laying railway lines, building roads, building energy stations, building schools, building clinics, and building hospitals.


Let me wrap up with this. We have an opportunity in Parliament, through the NCOP and the National Assembly, for a real deep debate, or we have an opportunity for point-scoring. What we have seen from the DA today is shallowness of ideas that means that all they can do is have a trenchant critique of everything that government does. This country is wrong and everything is wrong. We are so depressed. That is the storyline from the DA. [Interjections.]


From the ANC’s side, it is a different storyline. Theirs is a storyline of economic growth, job creation and infrastructure development. I think ... [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Minister, your time has expired. Minister, your time has expired. [Interjections.] Order, members! The Minister cannot even hear me because you are making a noise. Please, hon members. Minister, your time has expired.


The MINISTER OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT: Chair, I would like to conclude by saying that what has come out of this is that the ANC has a vision to run a country, and the DA has a critique. That is the difference between a party that won the majority of people’s votes and a party that won a tiny minority of the votes. Thank you very much. [Time expired.] [Applause.]


Debate concluded.


Mr V E MTILENI: Chair, on a point of order: I just want to tell you that when ANC people speak, you don’t check your watch and when people from other parties speak ... [Interjections.] I don’t even want to ...[Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon members, allow hon Mtileni to raise his concerns. Hon members, order! [Interjections.]


Mr V E MTILENI: Chair, I have been watching the Minister now. He spoke for eight minutes undisturbed and when you realised that it was time to tell him to stop, you just grabbed the microphone and kept quiet. I think you are being unfair. [Interjections.] We don’t want to join the ANC. This is a multiparty government. I think you are being unfair.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mtileni, are you done? [Interjections.]


Mr V E MTILENI: Maybe my watch is faulty. I don’t know. [Interjections.]


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M C Dikgale): Hon Mtileni, are you done? Are you done? I want to respond to you. [Interjections.] Order, hon members! Please give me a hearing. Hon members, I don’t want to call you by name.


Hon Mtileni, maybe there is a problem with your watch, but I did caution the Minister that his time had expired and hon members heard me when I said that. Indeed, I told him that his time had expired. [Interjections.] [Inaudible.] Hon Mtileni, you are laughing there. You are not even listening to us. Hon kgoši [king], can I address hon Mtileni.


Maybe you need to know that when there is an interruption and if ever people want to address the Chairperson while the speaker is at the podium, there are people who are managing the time here. So, don’t worry when your time is not exactly the same as ours, because when you interrupt the speaker, you don’t stop your watch.


The Council adjourned at 16:17.






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