Hansard: EPC: Debate on Vote No 6 – Performance Monitoring and Evaluation, including Vote No 13 - Statistics SA

House: National Assembly

Date of Meeting: 21 Jul 2014

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Minutes

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Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 217

MONDAY, 21 JULY 2014

PROCEEDINGS OF THE EXTENDED PUBLIC COMMITTEE – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

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Members of the Extended Public Committee met in the Old Assembly Chamber at 14:00.

The House Chairperson Ms M G Boroto as Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

FIRST ORDER

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UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 217

APPROPRIATION BILL

Debate on Vote No 6 – Performance Monitoring and Evaluation, including Vote No 13 - Statistics SA:

The MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: Chairperson, Chairpersons of the Portfolio Committees on Public Service and Administration and on Finance, Deputy Minister Manamela, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, it is both a privilege and an honour for me to present to this august House the Budget Votes of the newly proclaimed Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, as well as Statistics SA.

The two Budget Votes are a story of the National Development Plan, NDP, and its implementation through Monitoring and Evaluation, supported by a raft of national statistics.

The NDP, Monitoring and Evaluation and statistics will result in an improvement in the capacity of the state to deliver better results faster in order to claim victory over the triple challenges of poverty, inequality and unemployment.

In order to achieve faster and better results, President Jacob Zuma reminded us at the July 2013 Cabinet Lekgotla of a 1977 message written by our former President Nelson Mandela to Adelaide Tambo, and I quote:

Significant progress is always possible if we ourselves plan every detail and allow intervention of fate only on our own terms. Preparing a master plan and applying it are two different things.

At the national conference of the ruling party held in Mangaung in December 2012, the ANC embraced the centrality of the National Development Plan, Vision 2030 as a platform of action for all South Africans from which to address the persistence of the legacy of apartheid colonialism.

To echo the words of our President during his state of the nation address, and I quote:

We have put in place a programme of action based on the ANC Manifesto and the National Development Plan ... The National Development Plan outlines the future we want, a society free of poverty, inequality and unemployment.

Hon members, subsequent to the national elections, the President announced the appointment of the Cabinet as well as some reconfiguration and reorganisation of departments. These changes include the merging of the National Planning Commission Secretariat with the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation to form a brand new Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation.

A process facilitated by the Department of Public Service and Administration is currently under way to give administrative effect to that change. We are hoping that this process will be completed by the end of October, and we hope that after the October adjustment estimates everything will be transferred to this Vote.

The aim of this reorganisation is to give effect to the commitment in the election manifesto of the ANC to institutionalise long-term planning within the state. The intention is to put in place the necessary capacity both to plan on an ongoing basis and to ensure that these plans are being implemented.

The National Planning Commission, NPC, has made an enormous contribution to our country through overseeing the development of the NDP. In 2009, we introduced long-term planning as an important element of our national planning system when we established the NPC.

In 2012, the commission handed the NDP to the President and subsequently Cabinet adopted it as did the structures of the ruling party. It has been embraced by the majority of our people across sectors and party lines. It is this plan to 2030 that provides hope and a prospect for a better future for all South Africans. Some of the commissioners are present here today and I would like to express our gratitude to them on behalf of the country and the previous Minister, Trevor Manuel. [Applause.]

The most important priority for the department in the next five years will be co-ordinating and monitoring the implementation of this plan. The key instrument that we will use to implement the NDP is the 2014 to 2019 Medium-Term Strategic Framework, MTSF. It identifies the important actions that are required to implement the aspects of the NDP for which government is responsible for the next five years.

The Medium-Term Strategic Framework builds on our experience and what we learned between 2009 and 2014 with the delivery agreements for the 12 outcomes. Similar to the delivery agreements, the MTSF clearly identifies roles and responsibilities for implementing the key actions and contains measurable indicators with targets and timeframes to enable systematic and evidence-based monitoring of the implementation of the National Development Plan. The number of outcomes has been increased to 14.

This MTSF reflects the commitment made in the governing party's election manifesto, including the emphasis on the radical economic transformation during the second phase of our democratic transition. The MTSF also emphasises improving service delivery and the performance of the Public Service and improving the efficiency as well as the effectiveness of local government.

In order to address some of the problems with implementation that we have experienced in the past, the MTSF differs from those of previous administrations in a number of ways: Firstly, for the first time the MTSF serves as a 5-year building block towards the achievement of the vision of our country's long-term plan.

Secondly, it is much more detailed than previous MTSFs and incorporates the outcomes-based planning methodology developed during the previous administration.

Thirdly, measures have been put in place to ensure that the 5-year strategic plans and annual plans of all national and provincial departments are aligned to the MTSF, and therefore to the NDP. The Treasury Regulations have been amended so that all departments submit their draft plans to this department in order to enable performance, monitoring and evaluation to review whether the plans incorporate all the targets of the MTSF before plans are submitted to Parliament.

Parliament has a critical oversight role to plat to ensure that departments' plans are aligned to the MTSF and to the NDP. I would like to take this opportunity to commit our department to collaborating with Parliament and all the parliamentary committees by sharing our planning, monitoring and evaluation information with the aim of supporting Parliament to carry out its oversight function.

Once the MTSF has been approved by Cabinet, the President will enter into performance agreements with all the Ministers, based on the roles and responsibilities and targets of the Medium-Term Strategic Framework. Ministers will also ensure that the relevant actions and targets are reflected in the performance agreements that they will sign with their directors-general and senior officials.

The President will also appoint co-ordinating Ministers for each of the 14 outcomes. They will be required to co-ordinate the implementation of the MTSF outcomes and present an evidence-based implementation report to Cabinet at least three times a year.

The injunction of our icon, Madiba, that preparing a master

plan and applying it are two different things rings loud and clear, and in that regard all of these measures that I have described are aimed at ensuring that the aspects of the NDP for which the government is responsible are, indeed, systematically implemented.

I would like also to emphasise this point for the benefit of those who doubt our commitment and capacity to implement the NDP and for those who have raised questions as to how we are going to ensure that the NDP is implemented.

I would like to use this opportunity to challenge leaders in other sectors of our society similarly to move with speed to implement the parts of the plan for which they are responsible. There are a number of initiatives between government and other sectors of society that are already under way which are inspired by the NDP; and I would like to mention a few to highlight our strength in working together.

The first one is the National Education Collaboration Trust, NECT. The NDP proposes a national initiative involving different stakeholders to improve learning outcomes in schools, starting with the worst-performing schools. In response to this call, the Minister of Basic Education has already convened different stakeholders from government, the private sector, unions and civil society to establish a National Education Collaboration Trust, Nect, intended to drive the education improvement agenda as set out in our plan. [Applause.]

The second one is the Mpumalanga Land Reform Project, MLRP. The aim of the MLRP is to develop an accelerated redistribution model for land reform based on Chapter 6 of the National Development Plan. A technical committee to configure the land-financing model has been established and has begun the designing of the implementation guidelines.

The third one is the Harambee project adopted by Business Leadership SA. There have been numerous engagements with the private sector to discuss how they can contribute to the implementation of our plan. In this regard, Business Leadership SA has decided to adopt a project called Harambee as one of its contributions to the NDP. The unique feature of this initiative is that it targets young people who have no links to the labour market and with no one in the family in employment.

The fourth one comprises the strategies to overcome poverty and inequality.

The academic community is also playing a critical role in the implementation of the NDP. In 2012 the University of Cape Town, UCT, convened a conference to explore different strategies to overcome poverty and inequality. And within government, the commission and its secretariat has supported a number of policy and planning processes. These processes include the soon-to-be-completed integrated urban development framework, which will help us respond more effectively to challenges of urbanisation and ensure that our cities and urban spaces provide opportunities for early-childhood development, for example. [Applause.]

South Africans at all levels are as excited as we are about this NDP and have displayed an eagerness to contribute to making it work. We want to reiterate the message that the NDP is a plan for the whole country, not only government. During this current financial year, the National Planning Commission will continue with these various initiatives to further the implementation of the NDP.

The evaluations of government programmes that have been initiated by the department over the past few years have indicated that many programmes are not achieving as much as they were intended to achieve, partly due to weak programme planning and a need for substantial redesign. To address this, the department is developing guidelines to assist government departments to develop improved programme plans. The department is also providing support to national and provincial departments to produce better and higher quality strategies and annual performance plans and reports on the plans.

I also want to highlight a programme that was launched by the President on Saturday in Durban, the Big Fast Results initiative that we now call Operation Phakisa, to ensure that we unleash the economic potential of oceans' economy to drive its contribution from R54 billion to the GDP to about R177 billion by 2020.

If we are to improve government performance, we have to reflect on whether our programmes are achieving what they are intended to achieve; whether we are doing the right things; whether we are being effective, efficient and providing value for money; and how we can do things differently.

Departments are encouraged and supported to also carry out evaluations of their programmes on their own. We are working with the offices of the premiers in the provinces to support them to put in place provincial evaluation plans.

To date, 38 evaluations in the rolling National Evaluation Plan, Nep, are now completed, under way or starting. We have completed 11 evaluations, of which one has been presented to Parliament already. We are aiming for the results of a further 10 evaluations to be presented to the relevant Parliamentary committees during this current financial year.

The NDP notes that weaknesses in how government institutions functions constrain the state's capacity and ability to pursue its developmental objectives. Research done by the department indicates that one of the areas in which skills are generally lacking is in monitoring and evaluation and we are addressing that effectively.

The department is also involved in a number of monitoring initiatives across the three spheres of government, including monitoring of the experience of our citizens when obtaining services from government and monitoring the quality of management practices. My Deputy, Manamela, will describe in more details the initiatives in his speech in the House this afternoon.

During state of the nation address, the President announced that government will implement the undertaking to build houses and other services to revitalise mining towns, as part of the October 2012 agreement between business, government and labour. We are on track in ensuring that this Interministerial Committee does exactly that.

On administration, in the 2012-13 financial year, the department obtained a clean audit opinion. The audits for the 2013-14 financial year are under way and we are very positive that the results will be the same. [Applause.]

The budget allocated to the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation for this financial year is R208,2 million for: administration, R63,8 million; outcomes monitoring and evaluation, R78,2 million; institutional performance monitoring and evaluation, R66,2 million; and the budget for the NPC, R113,4 million.

In regard to Statistics SA, let me start by indicating that statistics, in general, and official statistics, in particular, are about people, places and possibilities. Statistics benefits society because it enables us to predict the future based on the data that we gather.

By being able to predict the future it helps us to be more efficient and effective in actions we take and in the decisions we make. Statistics SA informs us about where and how South Africans live, work and play.

The role of evidence in decision-making as a society becomes more complex and increasingly important. In addition, the more difficult questions that get asked require a raft of continuous evidence. These include questions such as: Do we know and understand the quality of health services and the difficulties that confront our people when they go to public health facilities? Do we know and understand what is happening in our schools, not only the suburban schools, but do we know what the conditions are in our township and informal settlement schools? These are the questions that need to be answered by information derived from accurate and reliable statistical data.

The integrity of any national statistics agency is therefore very important in that those in the production of statistics cannot dabble in the policy terrain to make methods and numbers succumb to any pressure. Instead, those in the practice of official statistics should maintain their independence in providing data that support or challenge policy options.

The environment within which official statistics plays its role in the national policy discourse needs to be strengthened. In this regard, the Statistician-General and the Statistics Council have decided to convene a meeting next week with me in order to ensure that we deal with key national and international players to discuss developments with regard to statistical practices and legislation.

With regard our strategic future intent, in pursuit of the overall goal of government of providing a better life for all through alleviating poverty and reducing inequality, Statistics SA has worked tirelessly to provide statistical information to support the development of the National Development Plan. The statistics produced by Statistics SA will now play a key role in the monitoring and evaluation of the implementation of the NDP.

Looking forward in strengthening the state's capacity to deliver, our government needs a system of evidence that is transparent, accountable, results-based and transformational.

Regarding key priorities for the financial year 2014-15, we will be focusing on the key strategic priorities such as expanding the statistical information base. Statistics SA has stabilised the statistical production base as evident through the suite of economic, social and population statistics.

The organisation, believe it or not, produces more than 171 statistical releases and reports on various aspects of the economy and society every 12 months. [Applause.] In 2014 this organisation sustained this raft of statistical products, whilst exploring new and innovative methods and systems to expand the information base as well as implementing international statistical standards and frameworks.

In regard to leading and co-ordination statistical production, in response to the high demand for statistical production at national, subnational, sectoral and international levels, the Statistics Act mandates Statistics SA to co-ordinate statistical production across organs of the state.

In 2014, Statistics SA will be focusing on creating an enabling regulatory environment for the production of statistics by organs of state. This is an enormous task to be achieved and the implementation will be guided by the policy framework on statistical production systems in South Africa.

When coming to increasing public confidence and trust of users, following census 2011, we now have a complete list of dwellings in South Africa and this frame will be continuously updated. To remain relevant, the strategic intent is to roll out a collaborative mapping approach through co-operation with municipalities.

Furthermore, continued efforts to improve the business frame are based on collaboration with Sars and the CPIC. An important future outcome is the certification of statistics produced by other organs of state such as crime statistics which should be transferred to Statistics SA.

As far as investing in learning and growth of skills, resources and infrastructure is concerned, a key strategic enabler for a sound statistical production system is statistical competence and capability. Statistics SA will continue to invest in learning and growth of statistical skills and our programme now forms part of the recruitment drive to build a statistics system and a statistically literate society that enables our citizens to do things better.

Statistics SA jointly with the University of KwaZulu-Natal is conducting a pilot project in the legacy schools programme, Maths4Stats and to promote statistical literacy at schools by training teachers in statistics modules.

At the tertiary level, Statistics SA created a Centre for Regional and Urban Innovation and Statistical Exploration at the University of Stellenbosch and provides a Masters programme that covers statistics and geography. Statistics SA has also secured the necessary support and resources for a new home as its head office which we will be launching in August this year.

With regard to promoting international collaboration and participation, Statistics SA is currently playing a leading role in international statistical development for a better Africa and the world. It chairs the Africa Symposium on Statistical Development, ASSD, and it also participates in the UN-led 2010 Round of Population and Housing Census, RPHC. Plans are afoot to participate in the 2020 RPHC, which will start in 2015.

The budget allocated to Statistics SA for the 2014-15 financial year is R2,24 billion and is divided up as follows: administration R934,7 million, including the building of the new headquarters; economic statistics, which is at R210,5 million; population and social statistics, which is at R117,9 million; methodology, standards and research at R65,5 million; statistical support and informatics at R245,1 million; statistical collection and outreach, R524,5 million; and survey operations, R144,3 million.

In conclusion, we accept the injunction by our former President and icon Mandela, and I quote:

Significant progress is always possible if we ourselves plan every detail ... and allow the intervention of fate only on our own terms.

Preparing a master plan and applying it are two different things.

We consequently chose evidence-based decision-making and this consists of a national development plan, a national statistics system and a framework for monitoring and evaluation. Through this effort, together as a nation at work, we can do more to move South Africa forward faster and achieve a better life for all.

Our people have the right to expect quality services from their government and to hold leaders to account for their actions. We are of the view that if all of us, Parliament, government, and civil society work together in unison, we will be on course to create the future that we need and that our people deserve for our country as envisioned in the National Development Plan.

Finally, let me thank the President; the Deputy President, who is the Chair of the National Planning Commission, NPC; my Deputy, Buti Manamela; the chairs of portfolio committees; the chairs of the statistical council; commissioners of the NP; the director-general and all officials who are responsible for making our government look good; and last but not least, my family who are here, including my wife and the extended family. Thank you very much. [Applause.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO)

THE MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY

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The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Order! Before I announce the next speaker, let me say to the members of the public that we really appreciate your presence here. We hope you will also observe the decorum of the House and not allow your cell phones to ring. We have had some interruptions. Please let's work together on this.

Ms B P MABE: Hon Chairperson, I feel embarrassed that the Minister was using an iPad ... [Laughter.] ... and I am still carrying papers. Next time I will try to follow suit. [Laughter.]

Minister for Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, the hon Jeff Radebe, Deputy Minister for Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, the hon Buti Manamela, hon members, and ladies and gentlemen, one of the greatest French aristocrats and a pioneering aviator, Antoine Marie Jean-Baptiste Roger, once said, and I quote:

A goal without a plan is just a wish.

Indeed, in South Africa we have recognised that planning is critical for the state to succeed in discharging its mandate and political commitments to its people. We are saying this because we are aware that we come from a divided and atrocious past, where the majority of the people of South Africa were not only neglected but also completely ostracised in the country of their birth.

In 1998, the Presidential Review Commission advised government that co-ordination at the centre of government was not only weak but also fraught with a number of challenges such as a lack in a common agenda and inadequate oversight and governance systems.

It is for this reason that we took a firm decision to enhance the performance of our government and establish all the requisite systems and framework to ensure that we monitor and evaluate the performance of our government.

As we consider Budget Vote 6 of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, we must proceed from the understanding that, as the Medium-Term Strategic Framework, MTSF, correctly points out, we operate in a global environment with too much uncertainty and turbulence. We should also recognise that the challenges that our society faces have deep historical roots in our apartheid past that left us with a fractured and disjointed society characterised by inequality, poverty and underdevelopment.

It is for this reason that the ANC-led government adopted the National Development Plan, NDP, as a critical tool that focuses on the plans of government and defines a common agenda for all spheres of the South African government. As the ANC, we believe that for the NDP plans to be realised, it is critical that we proceed with the utmost urgency and determination to continue on our path in order to enhance the capacity of our state machinery so that it is able to discharge the mandate of a developmental state; and we should work progressively to deal with the challenges of poverty, unemployment and inequality.

In this regard, the ANC continues to initiate and support policy initiatives aimed at enhancing the state's technical capacity and people's skills capacity. It is in this context that we recently supported the public administration management, among many recent interventions, to promote the basic values and principles governing the public administration referred to in section 195(1) of the Constitution, which states that, and I quote:

Public administration must be governed by the democratic values and principles enshrined in the Constitution, including the following principles:

(a) A high standard of professional ethics must be promoted and maintained.

(b) Efficient, economic and effective use of resources must be promoted.

(c) Public administration must be development-oriented.

(d) Services must be provided impartially, fairly, equitably and without bias.

(e) People's needs must be responded to, and the public must be encouraged to participate in policy-making.

(f) Public Administration must be accountable.

Hon Minister, as the ANC and this committee, we have utmost confidence in your leadership to continue driving the department in producing results on performance and governance. We do this because we take great pride that since the inception of this department more has been achieved in monitoring and evaluation of the work of government departments, with the view to addressing structural problems that impede proper services.

We are aware that you are working with greater urgency and decisiveness to ensure that the challenges facing the Public Service are addressed.

The widespread service delivery protests mean we need to strengthen capacity in our monitoring and evaluation in all government departments, but firstly, by ensuring that people who deliver a service have the requisite skills. This is the function that must be carried out by sectors responsible for higher education and training, the sector education and training authorities, Setas, as well as the imminent National School of Government, NSG. This will demonstrate government and the ruling party's commitment to the provision of services and impacting the lives of our citizens.

As part of celebrating 20 years of democracy, government has published a 20-Year Review Strategy as evidence to reflect on the progress made and challenges encountered since 1994. The focus of the fifth administration is to work on the building blocks through monitoring the deliverables concerning the outcomes approach employed by government to track the impact of services rendered. The department has a huge responsibility to undertake through the monitoring and evaluation of the work of all spheres of government and their entities.

The government's delivery agreement and outcomes approach further puts more emphasis on ensuring that indicators of performance are configured and followed through with proper monitoring tools such as the Management Performance Assessment Tool, MPAT, towards changing the lives of the people.

The Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation is charged with the responsibility to monitor the implementation and reviewing of delivery agreements. The committee supports the department in assisting the executive to monitor and evaluate the work of government. The department's establishment and existence is unquestionable and should always remain relevant to assist government in sharpening service delivery tools and methods.

The President highlighted during the state of the nation address debate that the following priorities are to be undertaken in relation to the mandate of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation.

The first priority is the establishment of an Interministerial Committee on the Revitalisation of Distressed Mining Communities - I am proud to announce that that has happened already. The committee would oversee the department as it achieves targets set by the President for the Interministerial Committee on Distressed Mining Communities. We are looking forward to receiving a full briefing and regular updates on the progress made by the Interministerial Committee.

The second priority is to continue to conducting unannounced visits to service delivery sites in order to monitor indicators such as queue management and waiting times, dignified treatment, cleanliness and comfort.

The third is the monitoring of government performance against the five keys priorities of education, health, crime reduction, job creation and the development of rural communities.

We noted the policy shift when the National Treasury requested the department to play a direct role in guiding the strategic and annual performance planning in government. These policy directives will help in aligning the strategic and annual performance plans of the departments with the NDP Vision 2030. This is a smart and well-thought-out strategy championed by the National Treasury.

One can attest to it today that government has delivered many services which have led to the improvement of the lives of our people, but more still needs to be done. It is fairly important to link planning with monitoring and evaluation. The Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation is in the process of revising the delivery agreements for 2014 to 2019, for the 14 service delivery outcomes of government.

The role of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation would be to effectively monitor and evaluate outcomes on a regular basis. The Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation's demands are incremental which determines their relevancy and existence today.

The committee has noted the newly identified indicators in the strategic and annual performance plans such as the Local Government Management Improvement Model, LGMIM, which will help to determine the efficacy and value for money of that sector. Currently, with the state of local government, the establishment of such indicators will accord and the necessary responsibility to our municipalities to deliver a prompt service to our people and exert pressure on them to carry it out.

The scorecards on the local government improvement model are very good initiatives and are very welcome to reflect on municipalities that will need various interventions.

The development indicators provide an indication of the progress in government's programmes, policies and projects rendered by a number of departments. The development indicators also provide government with proper assessment on the ground.

It is, for example, reported that the delivery of basic municipal services accessed by households increased by 95% between 2009 and 2012. The information reported on by the development indicators will be useful to guide different portfolio committees as they carry out their oversight functions.

Despite the state investing in commissioning research and evaluation studies of its programmes, we will never know whether we are doing things the right way, whether there is value for money, effectiveness, sustainability and impact, if the new government does not align its activities with the provision envisaged in the NDP.

The department has already developed the National Evaluation Policy Framework, which serves as a guideline for government departments in commissioning evaluation studies.

The committee concurs with the department in playing a key role in assisting the national and provincial departments to evaluate programmes by establishing the steering committee to approve studies. This initiative will minimise and control duplication in different spheres of government.

The evaluation steering committee should ensure synergy in the three spheres of government. Value added on the results of evaluation of studies requires government departments together with Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation to work together on the improvement plans of evaluated programmes.

Another priority of the department is improving the management of government departments, drawing lessons from Canada's best practices. The development and implementation of the management performance assessment tool brings about an effective tool for government to reflect on government departments by assessing the quality of management practices.

We applaud the department for the development of such a tool. However, there is a need to strengthen it. As we are aware, municipalities are at the core of the provision of service delivery. Therefore, these new assessment tools will go a long way in assisting government to determine whether or not it is making any progress in making a dent in structural challenges.

Following these observations, the committee feels that the department should speed up the process of piloting the municipal assessment tool to cover all the municipalities. The committee welcomes the expansion of the assessment tool across all spheres of government.

In September 2009, the President introduced a Presidential Hotline as a tool to contribute to a more accessible and responsive government. Since the inception of the hotline, a number of cases were received and resolved such as those at Ngobi village, which was visited by the President in Hammanskraal under the Moretele Local Municipality in the North West province, where they had problems. More than 190 000 complaints were logged and received the fnecessary attention through the Presidential Hotline.

Indeed, there are many good stories to tell regarding the successes of the Presidential Hotline. Most of the referrals from the hotline to government departments have been attended to on time. [Applause.] Improvement is what everyone aspires to achieve at all times. The development of systems that categorise the cases in terms of clusters and provinces will provide the government with clear indications of which departments need interventions.

We want a functional Public Service that prioritises service delivery to the people. The initiative of the department on the citizen-based support programme will intensify the manner in which government departments and local municipalities should provide quality services.

To my fellow members of the portfolio committee and parliamentary support staff, thank you very much for your commitment in ensuring that the committee fulfils its constitutional mandate. Together we are moving South Africa forward. We support the Budget Vote. Thank you. [Applause]

The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Again, let me caution the members of the public seated in the gallery: You are not allowed to clap hands. I know the debates are nice, but those are the Rules. I'm sorry.

Mr S C MOTAU

Ms B P MABE

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Mr S C MOTAU: Hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister and hon Chairperson, during the state of the nation debate on 18 June 2014, the hon Minister Radebe ended his speech with the following encouragement, and I quote:

Parliament therefore has a critical oversight role to ensure departments' plans and action move us towards a vision of the National Development Plan. I would like to commit the Presidency to collaborating with Parliament in this regard by sharing our planning, monitoring and evaluation information.

In conclusion, the National Development Plan is not just a plan for government but for the whole country. It is a people's plan, which has been adopted by the majority of our people and stakeholders. We are therefore calling on all South Africans to rally behind the implementation of the plan, including labour, business and civil society.

These are indeed commendable sentiments, and you will have noticed the Minister repeated them today, which makes my case that much stronger.

Disappointingly, just a few weeks later, Minister Radebe failed to live up to his commitment. The hon Minister squandered a vital opportunity to empower members of the Portfolio Committees on Public Service and Administration and Performance, Monitoring and Evaluation with information about his department in their critical parliamentary oversight role.

The Minister failed to meet the portfolio committee on 2 July 2014, during a scheduled briefing of the committee by his department on the Annual Performance Plan, APP, and 2014-15 budget proposal. Also absent from the briefing was the Deputy Minister, Buti Manamela, and the department's Director-General, Dr Sean Phillips.

The meeting was nearly scuttled as committee members expressed their displeasure at the absence of the Minister. The committee compromised after a letter of apology from Dr Phillips was read.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms G M BOROTO): Hon Motau, please take your seat. Is that a point of order?

Ms B P MABE: Hon Chair, I just want to know if the member is able to take a question. [Interjections.]

An HON MEMBER: No, you're wasting time!

Ms B P MABE: I'm not speaking to you!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon Motau, are you ready to take a question?

Mr S C MOTAU: If you give me 15 minutes, I would be.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Thank you. Sit down, hon member. Continue, hon Motau.

Mr S C MOTAU: The meeting was nearly scuttled as committee members expressed their displeasure at the absence of the Minister. [Interjections.] The committee compromised after a letter of apology ...

Ms B P MABE: Hon Chair, I have a problem. [Interjections.] The member is misleading the House.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon member, is that a point of order?

Ms B P MABE: It is a point of order. [Interjections.]

HON MEMBERS: That's not a point of order!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon members, please allow me to drive this vehicle. Hon Motau, please sit down.

Ms B P MABE: Hon Chair ...

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon Motau, please sit down. Hon member.

Ms B P MABE: Hon Chair, I want to check again if the member will take a question. [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon member, please sit down. Thank you.

Ms B P MABE: Stop distorting information, wena!

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Let us allow the member to speak. [Interjections.] Your minutes are restored. [Interjections.] Order!

Mr S C MOTAU: The meeting was nearly scuttled as committee members expressed their displeasure at the absence of the Minister. The committee compromised after a letter of apology from Dr Phillips was read. The briefing was done by Deputy Director-General Nolwazi Gasa. This, hon Minister, was a very important briefing. It was the first meeting of the new portfolio committee, and your no-show was a very serious let down for the other members and I.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms G M BOROTO): Hon members! Let us respect this House; let us not howl. Thank you.

Mr S C MOTAU: This is certainly not the way to collaborate with Parliament in order to share important information to ensure the implementation of the NDP.

This is a heartfelt plea to the hon Minister and his deputy to take the portfolio committee seriously going forward. If they do so they will find the DA very willing and able collaborators on the implementation of the National Development Plan, NDP. [Interjections.]

What rankled most and made most of us feel even more snubbed was that earlier both Minister Collins Chabane and Deputy Minister Ayanda Dlodlo had been in the meeting to brief the committee on the Department of Public Service and Administrations' Annual Performance Plan and budget proposals and to take questions from the members.

The DA sincerely trusts that such dereliction of responsibility will not be repeated. Given what transpired at this meeting, the DA hopes that the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation will not become a Cinderella department, always playing second fiddle to the Department of Public Service and Administration with regard to portfolio committee and oversight work.

The Department of Public Service and Administration has proposed the budget allocation of R875,2 million for their 2014-15 financial year, while the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation - as you heard the Minister say earlier on - has asked for R208,2 million. Since committees tend to follow the big money, it needs to guard against the department with the bigger budget hogging their attention.

The DA does not believe that the single portfolio committee will do effective oversight over the two departments. We would like to know from the hon Minister what the rationale was for the establishment of the hybrid portfolio committee. Was an impact assessment done to determine how this decision would affect the oversight role of Parliament in regard to the performance of the Departments of Public Service and Administration and Planning Monitoring and Evaluation?

We do not know how the members of the other parties on the committee have approached this situation. However, on the DA side, we have two representatives on the committee for each department. However the committee only recognises two as full members and the other two as alternates. The DA finds this situation untenable as, among other constraints, it creates unnecessary problems for the internal performance management mechanisms for Members of Parliament.

The DA is also concerned about the budgetary and other implications of two programmes having been added to Budget Vote 16, namely the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, from Budget Vote 1, which is the Presidency. These are the National Planning Commission with a proposed budget of R113,4 million - as you have heard the Minister say - for the financial year 2014-15 and the National Youth Development Agency, NYDA, with a budget of R408,2 million for the year.

My colleague hon Michael Cardo will say more about the NYDA later on.

To compound the situation, Minister Radebe has been appointed by the President to lead the Interministerial Committee on Revitalising Distressed Mining Communities, with the department taking responsibility for the secretariat services of the committee. How will this crucial assignment impact on the Minister's work as head of Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, and how will this impact on the department's budget?

Does this mean that the work of the Interministerial Committee, important as we believe it is, will take precedence over the priorities of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation for this and the following financial years?

We need clarity on the terms of reference of the Interministerial Committee. What is the lifespan of the committee? What will its definition victory be? [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Order, hon members!

Mr S C MOTAU: These are critical questions, which we believe must have profound budgetary and other implications for the Minister and the work of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation. They need to be answered urgently.

Furthermore, as chair of the Interministerial Committee, Minister Radebe, will lead a committee comprised of the Ministers of Mineral Resources, Water and Sanitation, Trade and Industry, Social Development, Labour, Human Settlements, Health, Economic Development and Finance.

However, as head of his Ministry, he has prioritised the review and revision of performance and delivery agreements that the President has to sign with these Ministers and the others in the Cabinet. His department then has to ensure that the terms of these agreements are met by the Ministers.

AN HON MEMBER: Who wrote your speech? [Laughter.] [Interjections.]

Mr S C MOTAU: How viable is this situation for the Minister of the department? [Interjections.][Laughter.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Order!

AN HON MEMBER: He went to school!

Mr S C MOTAU: Performance agreements signed by Ministers with the President cannot just be for show as a public relation exercise. They must be honoured and be seen to be honoured. They need to be monitored and evaluated to improve performance and service delivery.

Also, even more important, there should be serious consequences for poor performance. We all know that where there are no consequences for poor work or nonperformance, mediocrity and failure become the norm. [Interjections.]

In this regard, Parliament and the nation keenly await the outcomes of the earlier performance agreements signed by the Ministers with the President. The Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation has to ensure that these reasonable expectations of the nation are met, otherwise expectations of improved performance and enhanced service delivery will remain just that - unfulfilled expectations.

The National Development Commission has identified five focus areas for this financial year. One of these is to mobilise support for the implementation of the National Development Plan. We believe this is a very important focus area and the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation should ensure that the appropriate budget is employed effectively in this regard.

In regard to successful implementation of the National Development Plan, the people's plan, as so aptly put by Minister Radebe, should enjoy priority status in the work of the Ministry of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation if South Africa is to achieve the envisaged economic growth, employment, reduction of poverty and a thriving open opportunity society for all our people. Thank you. [Applause]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon members, the Rules of this extended public debate should be observed, and one of those is Rule 46, which says you can converse, but not loudly. The second one is about the interruptions. My chair is strategically situated and I can see everybody. If you want to say something, just rise, stand, and I will recognise you. Thank you.

Nks N V NQWENISO

Mr S C MOTAU

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 220

IsiXhosa:

Nks N V NQWENISO: Sihlalo, ndiyabulisa eNdlwini.

English:

The EFF rejects this budget proposal based on the following observations. From the beginning of this Parliament, both the hon Minister in the Presidency, ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Hon Breytenbach, please don't do that again. Continue, hon member.

Ms N V NQWENISO: ... hon Jeff Radebe and hon Deputy Minister Buti Manamela have not come to address the portfolio committee on their plans and instead sent officials who could not answer some of the questions we wanted answered at the portfolio committee level.

The monitoring and performance of both the Minister and Deputy Minister in this department requires to be looked at because it is not satisfactory. At all times the executive should be available for Parliament oversight even when they currently hold the parliamentary majority.

The core function of this department is to monitor performance of individuals and national, provincial and municipal government. However, the output is not satisfactory. Provincial and municipal governments are not carrying out their duties accordingly. Procurement processes in these two spheres are either outrageous or just a method of securing tenders for certain individuals whose output is not inspected.

Roads are left unfinished, subjecting the lives of our poor people to more difficulties.

IsiXhosa:

Umzekelo wale nto ndiyithethayo ziindlela zelali zakuCofimvaba apho abantu basathwalwa ngeeleli ukusiwa ezibhedlele nasemangcwabeni.

English:

Make no mistake, all these roads were at some point ... [Interjections.] ... under construction, but nobody cares about what the money was used for. [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Order, hon members!

Ms N V NQWENISO: The taps have dried up and there is absolutely not a drop of water because the companies that manufactured the pipes did a careless job which could not last even for six months. Hospitals have no adequate tools or resources. Schools have no electricity, no water, no furniture no textbooks and yet, the implementation of corrective measures does not happen. [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (MS M G BOROTO): Hon members, order! Allow her to speak. Hon member, continue.

Ms N V NQWENISO: The centralising of procurement is not a solution because it will just increase the red tape and centralise corruption. The Presidential Hotline management is in such a poor state that no area can vouch for the assistance granted to it due to this hotline.

Turnaround times have to be as quick as possible in response to the outcry of our people that we need to serve everyday. This can only be realised when the budget allocated is used exactly for that purpose and to improve the system.

We are, however, not shocked because this government is only excellent at shifting goal posts and always postponing meetings and their own set targets to distant dates, just as they are saying now that our problems will be solved by 2030. [Interjections.]

The most important thing which this government should prioritise is industrial policy because it is only the development of the productive forces that will decisively deal with the crisis of unemployment and poverty.

As things stand, there are many economic policies and industrial policy departments and instruments which are not centrally co-ordinated. They all exist in silos when there is a National Planning Commission, NPC, which is supposed to co-ordinate all the work done by the various departments.

The National Youth Development Agency, NYDA is a project gone wrong and it has failed the young people of South Africa, especially the core of their constituency. [Interjections.] Even in the current allocation from the NYDA, rural youth receive less than R250 000 allocation in the proposed budget, but individuals are allocated R10 million and the reason for such a share of the allocation is not stipulated.

As has happened before, the NYDA will be praised by the Deputy Minister because it is now led by the Young Communist League, YCL, and its employees have relations. [Interjections.] This department should make sure that the budget funds are allocated to actual youth development programmes especially for the development of rural and township youth instead of for individual beneficiaries and salaries.

This department should strengthen the youth and carry out autonomous monitoring and evaluation of government programmes and activities which will publicly announce whether the government has reached its set objectives in six-monthly intervals.

The department should put in place a mechanism which will punish those who do not perform when it comes to their work, because currently most people who fail in their duties are simply rewarded with senior responsibilities. Until these objectives are achieved, the EFF will reject the budget. [Interjections.]

Going forward, the EFF believes that this department should co-ordinate all efforts that seek to realise the development of the productive forces in South Africa. The planning commission should have the capacity to monitor progress in terms of industrial policy and mainstream youth development in all sectors of government. All government departments and all public institutions should employ a minimum of 40% of their workforce from people between the ages of 18 and 35 years. These departments should make sure that the budgeted funds are allocated accordingly. Thank you.

Mr M HLENGWA

Ms N V NQWENISO

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 220

Mr M HLENGWA: Hon Chair, Bhungane and your team, hon members, it is often said that failing to plan is planning to fail, and since 1994 we have walked a long road of plans. Some of these plans are gathering dust in the archives of government. Hon Minister, it is high time that we put the plans into action.

The National Development Plan, NDP, has been conspicuous in its absence in the utterances of your colleagues in Cabinet during the past few weeks of the presentation of the Budget Votes. We have heard absolutely nothing about it. Instead, hon Chair, ... [Interjections.]

Hon Chair, whilst I'm still on the floor let me say when we are talking about the National Youth Development Agency, NYDA, I would hope that the adults in this House whose children's lives are better off will take the time to listen to what we are saying because there are millions of young people out there who are struggling every day to improve their lives.

This continuous heckling borders on reckless dereliction of duty when it comes to actually looking at the issues which are key and central to the suffering of young people. So could they please behave and conduct themselves like adults for the sake of young people out there who are struggling every single day. [Applause.]

Hon Minister, we want to say to you that, as the IFP, we will continue to support the NDP because it exists as our only salvation now in terms of where this country is going. We can interrogate it at a later stage - whether you are doing what is there or not - but I think the time has come for the NDP to be brought to life in real and practical terms as opposed to this continual bypassing that is there.

While others are going on about the national democratic revolution, NDR, and more emphasis is being put on the Freedom Charter, and this and that, but the NDP must take a centre stage. [Interjections.] [Applause.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Order, hon members!

Mr M HLENGWA: In 2010, the NYDA spent R106 million on what is now known as the "kissing festival", and we have taken it to the Public Protector because we need to investigate that reckless and irregular expenditure which took place then. What is disturbing is that the Public Protector says that she is unable to conclude her report because the NYDA is resisting giving her ... [Interjections.] ... the necessary information she needs to conclude her investigation.

We need to know what happened to the R106 million because if we do not, we will continue a cycle wherein money is being used recklessly and irresponsibly. Hon Deputy Minister, not to pre-empt the meeting that we will have on Saturday, but we must take a serious look as to whether the NYDA is functioning properly or not.

If it is not, radical steps must be taken to either fully capacitate it as it needs to be capacitated or it should be overhauled and be replaced by a fully fledged department of youth affairs and a youth Ministry ... [Interjections.] ... you will hear the hon members whose children are better off because they do not care about the others who are suffering. [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G BOROTO): Order, hon members! Just hold it, hon member. Hon members, I have seen fingers. Hon members, behave yourselves, you know the Rules. You can't do that. Refrain from doing that! Please continue.

Mr M HLENGWA: In conclusion, I want to say that the NYDA continues to fail young people. It is not we who are saying this, but the perception out there - and perceptions count - is that young people are not feeling the NYDA. It is not in the rural areas, it is not where it needs to be. [Interjections.]

Ms R M M LESOMA: On a point of order Chair: The debate is not on the NYDA today. I think it is coming up on Thursday. [Interjections.]

Mr M HLENGWA: Let me assist the Whip. The money for the NYDA comes from Budget Vote 1 and is then taken by Budget Vote 6, and that is why we are here. She says she's the Whip and even that tells you the serious problem that we have in terms of accountability in this House ... [Interjections.][Applause.] ... when the Whip of the committee does not even know what we are talking about.

In all of this, it is young people who continue to be troubled because even their lawmakers are just as confused. I think we must take radical steps, radical in the true sense of the word, and overhaul the NYDA so that at the end of the day young people are better off today than they were yesterday. Thank you very much, Chairperson. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

The DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY

Mr M HLENGWA

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 221

The DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: PERFORMANCE MONITORING AND EVALUATION, AS WELL AS ADMINISTRATION IN THE PRESIDENCY: Hon House Chairperson; Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Public Service and Administration; hon members; Minister in the Presidency, hon Jeff Radebe; distinguished guests; members of the department's management and staff present; members of the media; comrades and friends; ladies and gentlemen; I must first start by indicating that we take the work that the portfolio committee does, both I and the Minister, very seriously. [Applause.]

It was quiet unfortunate that on the day when the department was to present the report - the plan and everything else to the portfolio committee - the Minister and the DG's presence were requested by the President and I was also in school. Now my mother always punished me if I missed school so unfortunately I couldn't attend the meeting of the portfolio committee.

However, it does not mean that we do not take your work seriously. Also, it is quite surprising that members of the portfolio committee who were present accepted our apologies in the portfolio committee meeting, but then come here to grandstand, because there are TVs, screens and all of that.

We are so disappointed that in the prepared speeches it was pre-empted that the National Youth Development Agency, NYDA, budget will be mentioned in the Minister's speech, even if the Minister did not mention the fact that the NYDA's budget has already been transferred from Budget Vote 1 to Budget Vote 6.

So, because you have prepared speeches to object the Budget Vote, you even continue to read that part of the speech and do not align it to developments which have been made. So I think that it says more about who is confused, hon member of the IFP, and unfortunately in this regard, you are the one who is confused.

We have now entered the second phase of our democratic transition. The phase will be characterised by robust implementation of government policies and programmes geared towards the achievement of our long goal of the National Democratic Plan Vision 2030.

Government has purposefully declared its intention to mobilise society in radically transforming the economy to serve the needs, interests and aspirations of our people. This means that the political power and authority that was given to the ANC by the people in the last elections will be used to radically transform our society and alter the ownership and control of the economy.

Our 20 Years Review comprehensively identified the substantial progress that has been made since 1994 as well as the challenges that confront us. Numbers confirm that most of our people have access to houses, electricity, water and sanitation and social assistance programmes. [Applause.]

This reaffirms government's insistence that the quality of life of our people – since the ANC under Nelson Mandela took over – has radically changed for the better, but more still needs to be done to reverse the damage done over three centuries of colonialism and apartheid.

Every year since 1994, our people continue to enjoy a better life for all. We will build on that course to move the country forward.

Hon members, one of the key goals of the NDP is to build a capable developmental state and to forge a disciplined, people-centred and professional Public Service.

Our role as a department is to monitor and evaluate whether our schools have learners who learn and teachers who teach; whether hospitals tend to patients through the capable hands of qualified and committed nurses and doctors; whether municipalities deliver water, electricity and sanitation; whether our people are humanly settled with adequate basic services and recreational facilities for the youth; whether the programme for land restitution and redistribution is adequately implemented in an accelerated fashion; whether women and children feel safe and secure from all sorts of abuse by an adequate policing service and system; whether graduates are of the highest quality to serve our country for the better; and, whether all economic functions and systems of the state are capable of yielding more jobs and ensuring the collective prosperity of our nation.

This is by no means a small task. Minister Radebe has been asked to ensure that government works, and works for the people of our country.

We have to continue with the construction of a capable and professional Public Service characterised by high-quality management and practices free of corruption and dedicated to ensure a better livelihood for all our people.

Since 2011, in partnership with the Offices of the Premier and transversal policy departments, such as National Treasury and the Department of Public Service and Administration, DPSA, our department has been monitoring the quality of management practices in national and provincial governments.

This is done by carrying out annual assessments of the state of management practices in departments against a set of 30 management standards, covering human resource development, financial management and supply chain management, internal governance of the departments, planning, monitoring and evaluation and the management of information.

The process involves self-assessment by the senior management of the department in order for the managers to reflect on their management practices and identify areas where their department is doing well and areas where it needs to improve. This is followed by internal audit validation and external peer moderation by policy experts drawn internally from government.

The assessment results are presented to Cabinet and also to the President's Co-ordinating Council with the provinces. Our department has also been presenting the results to the portfolio committee and to Parliament, when invited to do so.

For the last two financial years, all national and provincial departments have participated in the assessments. There were some improvements in the results over the past two years, and we look forward to further improvements in this year's assessment.

The aim of this monitoring initiative is to drive a process of continuous improvement in the quality of management practices in the departments. Accounting officers are guided through improvement plans to address management weaknesses identified in the assessment.

We have found that for each of the 30 management standards, there are at least some departments that are performing well. The department has, in collaboration with Wits University School of Governance, documented case studies for selected standards where departments have performed very well. To date, we have developed 35 case studies and we hope that our departments will be sharing these cases of good practice amongst one another.

Our department will also continue to monitor a range of indicators of management performance on behalf of the Forum of Directors-Generals. These relate to management areas over which the directors-general have control, and which are of concern to citizens, labour, business and Parliament.

They include reducing waiting times and turnaround times for a range of services; reducing the time taken to finalise disciplinary cases in the Public Service; the filling of funded vacancies; and the payment of suppliers within 30 days of submission of a valid invoice, a commitment that the President has made.

Through this, we believe that we are on course to make government work for its people.

As with the assessment of the management practices of national and provincial departments, we have developed a similar model for application in municipalities. The model is called the Local Government Management Improvement Model, LGMIM, which was developed in collaboration with the Department of Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs, Cogta; National Treasury; the SA Local Government Association, Salga; the Attorney General's Office; provincial departments responsible for local government; and key sector departments such as the Department of Water and Sanitation, and the Department of Energy.

The aim of our municipal assessments is to measure, monitor and support improvement management practices in municipalities for quality service delivery. We are assessing municipalities against six standards that include integrated development and planning, human resource management, financial management, community relations, governance and also the capacity of local government to deliver on water, sanitation, electricity, and refuse removal.

During the last financial year, the model was piloted and tested in 12 municipalities and we are happy with the results. We will be expanding this system to 20 more municipalities and we will be building capacity for provincial governments to expand this model to all the municipalities in the country.

Hon members, one of the aspects of government performance which needs to improve is the quality of service delivery experienced by citizens. In this regard, in 2011 our department started a programme with the Office of the Premier to carry out unannounced monitoring visits to frontline service delivery facilities such as social grant distribution sites, schools, clinics, police stations, courts, drivers' licence centres, municipal customer care centres and Home Affairs offices. And some of the things that we found out have resulted in the improvement in the quality of the delivery of services.

The focus is on assessing aspects of service delivery such as queue management, waiting times, dignified treatment and cleanliness and comfort by using structured monitoring tools implemented by trained monitors from our department and the Offices of the Premier.

The results of the monitoring visits are reported to the management of the responsible department as well as to the Cabinet and the President's Co-ordinating Council with the provinces. The responsible departments are requested to put in place improvement plans to address problems identified during these visits.

The aim of this initiative is to show service delivery departments the potential benefits of monitoring the quality of frontline service delivery and to encourage and support departments to start monitoring the quality of their service delivery themselves.

To date, we have visited and monitored 550 facilities. This initiative has given us valuable insight into the quality of services that our citizens are experiencing.

We also go back to some of the facilities that were found to be performing poorly and 79% of those facilities which were revisited in the last financial year showed greater improvements.

I would like to thank the provincial premiers, the Offices of the Premier, and the relevant Ministers for their support that they have given to our department in this regard.

This financial year we planned to visit 90 new facilities, and we will also revisit 120 more facilities to check if the agreed-upon improvements have been implemented.

We encourage our people to let us know which facilities they wish us to prioritise for surprise visits through the Ministry or the Presidential Hotline.

Hon members, our people have a key role to play in assisting government to improve its performance and the quality of service delivery. The National Development Plan, NDP, calls on our people to be active participants in building a better society.

It states that all spheres of government-

… can enhance citizen's participation through a variety of two-way information gathering and sharing forums and platforms between citizens and also government.

Last August Cabinet demonstrated its commitment to strengthening the voice of our people in the monitoring of service delivery, with the approval of the Framework for Strengthening Citizen-Government Partnerships for Monitoring Frontline Service Delivery.

Since then, the department has been hard at work supporting the institutionalisation of people-based monitoring in government. With the commitment of the senior leadership of the SA Police Service, SAPS, the SA Social Security Agency, Sassa, and the Departments of Health and Social Development over the past year, we have been piloting an approach to people-based monitoring of police stations, clinics, Sassa and the Department of Social Development.

The piloting focused on Tugela Ferry in the Msinga Local Municipality in KwaZulu-Natal and also in Phuthaditjhaba in Maluti, a Phofung Local Municipality in the Free State.

With the support of 80 Community Works Programme staff, more than 5 000 people were interviewed on the performance of Tugela Ferry Police Station, the Church of Scotland Hospital in Msinga, the Phuthaditjhaba Clinic and Police Station as well as the two Sassa service centres and pay points in these areas.

We are now working with the departments and community stakeholders to ensure that the information collected from citizens leads to improvement in the quality of services provided. Before the end of this financial year, we will roll out this initiative in all the provinces in our country.

Another way in which our government is involving our people in the monitoring of service delivery is through the Presidential Hotline, which is managed by our department. The intention of the Hotline, as the hon chair of the portfolio committee indicated, is to contribute to a more accessible and responsive government.

We are as excited as the chair of the committee that more than 190 000 complaints and queries have been logged and that 95% of those complaints have been resolved.

The President has actively participated in the Hotline and, on behalf of the President and Minister Radebe, I want to take this opportunity to thank all the departments which have played a role in this regard. We also want to encourage our people to view the report which we have put together on the experiences that people had with this particular Hotline.

In the current financial year, the department will also continue to provide the President with support for his Siyahlola Monitoring Programme, which involves visits to communities with teams of Ministers in order to assess service delivery challenges and engage with the people, as well as monitor the progress made with addressing these challenges after the visits.

Through these visits, those who are elected or appointed to serve our people should know that the President and government in its entirety will be on the go, keeping them awake and ensuring that we all justify our daily wage by truly working for our people.

In conclusion, hon members, to improve performance and inculcate a culture of excellence in the Public Service, we are looking forward to working with Parliament, and to moving our country forward. Thank you. [Applause.]

Dr M J CARDO

The DEPUTY MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: PERFORMANCE MONITORING AND EVALUATION & STATISTICS SOUTH AFRICA

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 222

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Boroto): Order! The next speaker is hon M J Cardo and it's his maiden speech.

Dr M J CARDO: Hon Chairperson, The National Development Plan, NDP, is our roadmap to the future of a society with more jobs and less poverty. And yet, two years after Parliament, Cabinet and broad sections of civil society endorsed the plan, we seem to be stuck on the side of the road.

We hear about the implementation of the NDP, but we do not see it. Why? The roadmap is not the problem, the problem is that we have no-one behind the steering wheel. Instead, we have backseat drivers in the form of Cosatu and the SACP. They want to steer us on another course – the course of the national democratic revolution, the NDR.

The NDR is the path of more state intervention, economic decay and unemployment.

The NDP is the path of greater freedom, growth and jobs. Last month, in the debate on state of the nation address, hon Minister Radebe said, and I quote:

Capacity is being created in the Presidency to carry out thorough socioeconomic impact assessments of both new and existing legislation and regulations, in order to ensure alignment with the NDP and reduce the risk of unintended consequences.

Two weeks later, the President signed into law the Property Valuation Bill and the Restitution of Land Rights Amendment Bill. Both these laws contradict the NDP. They disregard the roadmap and take us down a dead end.

We know exactly what their consequences will be. Like the new immigration regulations, they will reduce economic growth, increase unemployment, scare off foreign investment and create policy uncertainty.

The Presidency sits at the apex of government. It is responsible for policy coherence. So the hon Minister and Deputy Minister have a very important role to play. They must assert the NDP's supremacy as an overriding policy blueprint. They must stare down opposition to the plan from the ruling party's alliance partners or the NDP will fail, and this budget will go to waste.

Because Budget Vote 6 is so crucial to the realisation of the National Development Plan, we must prioritise its allocations accordingly.

For 2014-15, the National Youth Development Agency, NYDA, has been allocated R408 million. This is three-and-a-half times more than the allocation to the National Planning Commission Secretariat of R113 million, and is nearly double the allocation of R208 million to the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation.

This makes no sense whatsoever.

The NYDA has a history of fraud, corruption and irregular and wasteful expenditure. It is pathologically profligate and yet every year, we entrust it with more public funds.

The chairperson of the NYDA claims to have embarked on a turnaround strategy. He says the agency's vision is to deliver "as many opportunities as is possible with our available resources to the youth of South Africa."

Yet the NYDA spends R189 million of its R408 million grant on salaries alone. That is almost 50% of its "available resources" spent on feeding a bloated bureaucracy – not on providing opportunities for the youth.

The wage bill at the NYDA is almost as much as the entire allocation for the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation. It outstrips the National Planning Commission Secretariat's whole budget by some margin. Time and again, though, the NYDA has shown that it cannot be trusted with public money.

In 2013, the Auditor-General found that the agency's irregular expenditure amounted to R195 million over two years, and that it was unlikely to recover R212 million in loans.

In 2010, the NYDA wasted over R100 million on a kissing competition dressed up as the World Festival of Youth. The NYDA pays lip service to youth development. We should kiss it goodbye! [Laughter.] [Applause.]

But the hon Deputy Minister wants to amend the National Youth Development Agency Act. He wants to give the agency greater powers to co-ordinate and implement youth development at a provincial level.

Hon Manamela should take a leaf out of the DA-run Western Cape government's Youth Development Strategy, instead. [Interjections.] This strategy is based on the NDP. It prioritises education and training, with an innovative after-school programme and a youth service programme. It promotes economic participation, with a range of employment and internship opportunities for first-time job-seeking youth.

These include the Premier's Advancement of Youth, PAY, Project and the Work and Skills Programme, a variant of the youth wage subsidy. Seventy per cent of participants have been kept on as permanent employees after completing the programme. [Interjections.]

According to the World Economic Forum Global Risk 2014 report, South Africa has the third-highest unemployment rate in the world for youth between the ages of 15 and 24 years, behind Greece and Spain, at 50%.

An HON MEMBER: You see, kissing doesn't help ...

Dr M J CARDO: Yet, in the 2014-15 financial year the NYDA will spend roughly only 10% of its grant on its economic participation programme, and will spend roughly only 10% of its grant on its Education and Skills Development programme.

Meanwhile, hon Manamela is – to quote him on the Employment Incentive Act – "firmly opposed to the youth wage subsidy".

If we are to use the NDP as our roadmap, we should channel the NYDA's budget into the youth wage subsidy, structured youth development programmes and bursaries for educational opportunities. This would be a much better use of resources.

We should pass laws that promote opportunities, growth and jobs. If we don't – if we choose the national democratic revolution – we will be destined for more policy incoherence, more poverty and more unemployment. I thank you. [Applause.]

Ms D G MAHLANGU

M M J CARDO

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 223

Ms D G MAHLANGU: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister Radebe, hon Deputy Minister Manamela, all members of the executive present here, chairperson of the standing committee, the Statistician-General, Mr Pali Lehohla, hon members and comrades, good afternoon.

It is an honour for me to deliver my maiden input to this august House, more important, as we debate the Budget Vote of one of the important institutions of our democratic state also in the month in which we celebrate the life of our own global icon, Tata Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela. [Interjections.]

Let me take this opportunity to wish all Cancerians a happy birth month - that includes me. [Applause.] I am mandated by the ANC to focus on Budget Vote No 13, Statistics SA. This year, on 27 April, we marked the end of the beginning and the end of 20 years of freedom.

This year our democratic government laid a firm foundation for the socioeconomic and political transformation of our country. In the main, our democratic government transformed all state institutions and agencies to be in line with the ethos of our progressive Constitution.

The mandate that Statistics SA carries is to advance the production, dissemination, use and co-ordination of official and other statistics to assist organs of state, businesses, other organisations and the public in planning, monitoring, and decision-making.

The Act also requires that Statistics SA co-ordinates statistical production among organs of state, in line with the purpose of official statistics and statistical principles.

We have since characterised the beginning period as a radical second phase of the transition. To effect this transition, the Presidency, has developed an overarching National Development Plan, NDP, which government and the ANC has adopted. The plan takes a broader view and makes a thorough diagnosis of our challenges and sets in place programmes to mitigate our challenges, thereby gearing our country into a better future, where a better life for all shall indeed be a reality. [Interjections.]

The National Development Plan aims to contribute to the developmental and transformational processes to overcome social and economic challenges such as inequality, poverty and unemployment.

Statistics SA works with all relevant stakeholders, provides accurate and quality statistical information on economic, demographic, social and environmental factors, which direct and assist the facilitation and implementation of the NDP.

The National Development Plan 2030 findings on growth, incomes, levels of competition for goods and services, the number of work seekers and savings and skills profiles have all been available as a direct result of information supplied by Statistics SA.

This analysis provided by Statistics SA in the crafting of the National Development Plan informs sectors in the economy on how to create a deeper understanding not only of their own sector, but also of the broader economy, its structure and composition in order to bring about economic development and transformation of the economy.

Any development plan, and in particular, a long-term development plan, must be based on the balance of evidence that guides analysis, generates knowledge, facilitates understanding and supports business and political decisions that have to be taken. [Interjections.]

An HON MEMBER: Free education!

Ms D G MAHLANGU: The then Minister Manuel, who headed the National Planning Commission, NPC, had this to say about the relationship between Statistics SA and the NDP, and I quote:

I can confirm with confidence that Statistics SA has graduated into the fact finder of the nation as prescribed in the Statistics Act. Over the last five years especially, the organisation has built intellectual leadership that holds its own in the country and globally, and should, going forward, be in a position to implement the Statistics Act fully ... The organisation not only holds its own, but has become a hub of competence from which other agencies draw important lessons ... In the next five years, Statistics SA will become more central to evidence-based policy-making by elevating its statistics and products to the threshold of policy-making, monitoring and evaluation, as prescribed in the Statistics Act.

Statistics SA is one institution that lies at the heart of the success of our new trajectory. Over the past 20 years, we are proud that this important institution has grown in leaps and bounds, and is today one of the revered entities, continuously providing reliable data, which is essential for our micro and macro planning across all spheres of society. [Applause.]

We are pleased that the organisation itself has not rested on its laurels, but continually seeks new and better ways to enhance efficiency and respond accurately to the new demands of society, government and the broader state. [Interjections.]

Afrikaans:

'n AGB LID: Hoor, hoor!

English:

Ms D G MAHLANGU: We are pleased that Statistics SA has begun the building frame that informs the cornerstone of the statistics system. We are further pleased that Statistics SA has established a geographic spatial information frame which gives account of all dwellings in our country. Through the integrated fieldwork strategy, Statistics SA has expanded its fieldwork force, thus ensuring a more extensive data collection footprint in provinces and districts.

Of paramount importance is the commitment by Statistics SA to improve its governance frameworks and financial management processes. This institution has, in this regard, also demonstrated exemplary leadership by heeding the call by Treasury to cut down on nonessential items, thus realising internal savings of R35 million, an amount which has since been reprioritised. [Interjections.]

We have noted that Statistics SA has introduced a talent management programme in order to align the disparate capacity-building initiatives.

An important aspect of this initiative is the establishment of the Maths4stats programme that seeks to promote statistical literacy at school level by training educators in related modules. This initiative is very important and I thought members would respond as such. [Interjections.] [Applause.]

Afrikaans:

'n AGB LID: Hoor, hoor! Hoor, hoor! Hoor, hoor!

Sepedi:

LELOKO LE LE HLOMPHEGAGO: Ba botše! Ba botše!

English:

Ms D G MAHLANGU: This initiative is very important, especially as the National Development Plan enjoins us to ensure that skilled, technical, professional and managerial posts better reflect the country's racial, gender and disability make-up.

Hon Chair and hon members, we urge all government institutions and agencies to use statistics to improve service delivery and that it should inform policy-making. [Applause.] Failure to use this evidential knowledge results in a situation such as the one in Gauteng where findings reveal that transport infrastructure is not aligned to the spatial distribution of the population, a situation that we have noted with grave concern. [Interjections.]

We have noted the importance of Programme 5: Statistical Support and Informatics, which enables service delivery programmes through the use of technology in the production or the use of official statistics. We commend the steps that Statistics SA is taking to ensure an uninterrupted network availability for users at all times and a commitment to maintain 500 000 dwelling points across 45 municipalities. [Interjections.]

Sepedi:

LELOKO LE LE HLOMPHEGAGO: Ke nnete, ngwana!

English:

Ms D G MAHLANGU: Our country has a vision. We have set ourselves high goals because we believe in the resilience of our people, who, even in the most difficult and testing period in our life as a nation, never chose failure as an option. The determination that resulted in our freedom and democracy that we all enjoy today is the same determination required to move our country forward.

As the ANC, in honour of our Seaparankwe-Isithwalandwe, we call all and sundry in this House to support Budget Vote No 13, including the hon members of the EFF, because we firmly believe that Statistics SA can indeed contribute to the building of a capable and developmental state and actually ... [Interjections.]

An HON MEMBER: Listen!

Ms D G MAHLANGU: ... and actually lies at the centre of many efforts being made to reverse the triple challenges of our time, that is, unemployment, inequality and poverty.

IsiNdebele:

UZimu anitjhudubaze. Ngiyathokoza. [Iwahlo.]

Ms D CARTER

Ms D G MAHLANGU

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 224

Ms D CARTER: Hon Chairperson, the aim of improving government service delivery through performance monitoring and evaluation is in principle a good idea. The problem though is the secrecy that accompanies the monitoring. In terms of the Constitution, the National Assembly must hold the executive accountable. Both parties must show commitment to improving government service delivery.

Chair, if the Minister agrees to report at regular intervals to this House, he will also have doubled his advantages for enhancing delivery. Firstly, the Minister can report to the President, as he has been done for the last five years, and thereafter meet with the Minister who is being monitored and determine what action is needed - if action is needed.

Finally, the Minister can make available to the House the report on the weaknesses for which remedy is required from the department concerned.

If the department has done well, a favourable report to the House will also improve motivation. Acknowledgment will spur on performance. By shielding a Minister who is not performing well we will only retard delivery, and that is a loss to the nation.

Over the last five years, Ministers have been reshuffled or fired, but it would have been much better if we had been proactive. There can be no compromise when it comes to service delivery, no matter what the members on that side of the House think. We need a buy-in in the National Development Plan, NDP.

Hon Minister, we have a situation where, especially on that side of the House, they are denying that there is a National Development Plan. We also need a buy-in from all the Ministers and the hon members on that side of the House to start working according to the NDP and not just introduce legislation like Minister Nkwinti and Minister Gigaba have done recently.

More recently it has also become clear, especially if we hear that there is a need for a workshop on the Constitution because, especially from that side of the House, it seems as if they do not know the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa.

The departments like to operate in silos or to defend their turf. Where there are cross-cutting priorities, the department has a role to play in getting full co-operation. The performance of government in all its three spheres is crucial. We have had too many deficits and this can no longer go on.

The government's debt is piling up and the debt service cost is the heftiest item on the budget line. Consequently, fiscal space continues to narrow and this makes it imperative for government to become cost efficient and effective.

The department should not only rely on its own monitoring or on the Presidential Hotline. It should also monitor the answering of written questions by Ministers. Sometimes Ministers who are serial offenders take too long to reply and others do not reply or others try not to reply. Then there are the Ministers who skirt the issues and avoid accountability. Please, start monitoring through that process too. The replies by Ministers need thorough scrutiny.

I wish to address the question of blockages in delivery. Blockages sometimes result, as we have seen in the past, in violent protests. Here too, the Minister, after detecting blockages, should request the Speaker to draw the attention of the relevant portfolio committee to the problem so that the relevant department is subjected to oversight.

When media attention arises from government action, it is much less damaging. [Interjections.]

I think that the hon members on that side are sleeping. They are sleeping through it because it is not the same speech. I thank you. [Time expired.]

Mr M L D NTOMBELA

Ms D CARTER

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 225

Mr M L D NTOMBELA: Hon Chairperson; Minister of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, the hon Jeff Radebe; Deputy Minister of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation, the hon Manamela; Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Public Service and Administration, as well as Monitoring and Evaluation, Mme Mabe; hon members; and ladies and gentlemen, I am tempted to respond to two things before I start with my speech.

The hon Cardo is a product of a much-discredited system of government which produced the DA. No wonder he is pathological in his attack on government! Little does he realise that he has said a lot in his ill-informed attack which meant absolutely nothing.

Ms D CARTER: Chair, just on a point of clarity ...

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Borotho): Is it a point of order?

Ms D CARTER: Is it Carter or "Cardo" because we need to know?

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Borotho): Take your seat, hon member. Continue, hon member.

Mr M L D NTOMBELA: The choice is yours, ma'am. [Laughter.]

Chairperson, I think Hon Motau suffers from selective amnesia because he can recall that the Deputy Minister and the Minister were not in the meeting, but he decides to forget that there was an official apology, which was unanimously accepted, and the meeting was never under any threat.

What he is saying is nothing but wishful thinking, but I forgive him because it is Monday today. [laughter.]

Hon Chair, allow me today to contribute to the debate on Budget Vote 6 of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation. The journey of the department continues with moving South Africa forward in ensuring accountable and transparent government regarding the performance of the state. The committee had engaged with strategic and annual performance plans as part of opening ongoing discussions of continuous improvement in Public Service.

South Africa is a developing state, we are all finding ourselves placing a greater emphasis on results by looking back through monitoring, evaluation and evidence of impact on justifying our effectiveness and responding to a growing demand for accountability. The establishment of the Department of Planning, Monitoring and Evaluation is an integral part to the developmental state in ensuring that there is feedback within the government policy cycle.

Chairperson, the existence of the department assisted government in outlining measures to improve the performances of government.

Many departments have acknowledged the new approach of focusing on measurable results and impacts; and the entire government is achieving a number of targets which it has set. South Africans are looking forward to the services of the department to ensure effective monitoring and evaluation of government departments.

Yes, the President cited a number of directives and it is true that in his state of the nation debate he said that, and I quote:

An Interministerial Committee on the revitalisation of distressed mining communities has been established ... government will continue to conduct announced and unannounced visits to service delivery sites ... monitoring government performance against five key priorities of education, health, reducing crime, job creation and the development of rural communities.

This has already been alluded to by formers speakers.

The ANC manifesto further states that the party will establish institutional mechanisms and build up capacity in the state to undertake long-term planning. It will draw, where necessary, on the expertise that exists in wider society. The National Development Plan, NDP, which is a culmination of the vision of the Freedom Charter, provides a common, national vision for development. This long-term planning of the country cuts across all sectors of society and it identifies the critical trade-offs and challenges to be addressed by our country over the next 20 years and beyond.

Chairperson, as it has happened with the fourth administration, the vision culminated in the development of the delivery agreements. Regular monitoring on the delivery agreements will enhance the performance of the government. The reviewing and refining of se delivery agreements is one of the functions of the Department of Performance, Monitoring and Evaluation.

This empowers the department to be in position to monitor and evaluate government outcomes. The ANC manifesto states that the national and provincial government will oversee the performance of municipalities and ensure that communities are empowered to hold public representatives and public servants accountable. The Department of Performance, Monitoring and Evaluation's programmes are intended to address the need to hold public representatives accountable.

Chairperson, the President highlighted important issues that the fifth administration will embark upon to carry out a critical role in fast-tracking delivery on the priorities included in the National Development Plan. Government is embarking on the new approach called Operation Phakisa, as mentioned during the state of the nation address.

The department's role is critical in this regard in monitoring the provision of quality services in all aspect of the projects implemented under this operation. The Committee welcomes the desire of the department to work with the Department of Environmental Affairs in unlocking the economic potential of South Africa's ocean resources as the first project implemented under Operation Phakisa.

The President reiterated further the significance and the impact that Operation Phakisa will have on the economy of the country. This also has been alluded to by former speakers. Programmes under the department are magnificent in measuring accurate results of government. However, the department should build more capacity at the provincial and local government levels.

The Offices of the Premier should follow the model of the department in overseeing provincial government departments by conducting onsite monitoring and ensuring regular reporting through publishing results of their provinces and municipalities.

The department should strengthen its human and financial resources capacity on the Frontline Service Delivery Monitoring programme. These efforts will enable the department to spread its services to all corners of South Africa to unblock the bottlenecks of service delivery, particularly at the local government level.

Hon Chair, the President further mentioned that to improve performance and inculcate a culture of excellence, the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation will continue to conduct unannounced visits to service delivery sites in order to monitor service delivery results.

The initiative is welcomed as it makes all the government officials perform their work diligently and serve customers according to the Batho Pele principles. To this end, a number of success stories have been witnessed and will continue to be witnessed by communities.

Chairperson, let me urge the committee also to adopt this approach and support the department by conducting unannounced and announced visits to service delivery centres such as clinics, police stations and so forth.

The engagements with communities through citizen-based monitoring which focuses on soliciting the knowledge and their perception by interacting with citizens who receive services is crucial and demonstrate how committed government is. This initiative should indeed be applauded.

Experience during the elections and before should have taught us that the performance of government is judged by what happens at local government level. Ordinary citizens are concerned about what happens to their daily lives and this happens only at grass roots. Hence it is important for local government to be brought on board in all planning processes.

This approach is in line with the strategy that has always been applied consistently by the ANC, the Imbizo campaigns where communities are invited to engage politicians and officials on issues relating to them and through the same approach of giving feedback to communities on issues of service delivery.

The department produced a number of reports in the fourth administration and should intensify efforts in conducting monitoring and evaluation activities and go back to the drawing board to inform and improve on the planning cycle. The committee will assist the department by ensuring that government departments actively pursue and forge forward with the service delivery programmes.

The Presidential Hotline keeps on adding value towards impacting on the lives of many South Africans who feel neglected by some strategic and operational officials of government at times. There are success stories and challenges encountered here; the committee will persuade the department to attend and resolve most of the complaints lodged.

The overwhelming response to the hotline is certainly positive. The monitoring of the Presidential Hotline is critical. I come from a municipality where the hotline is used effectively and I have seen how enthusiastic our people are in taking advantage of such a service.

Chairperson, it is essential that government changes its culture of ensuring that it constantly collects evidence of whether or not its policies and programmes are working and use this evidence to inform interventions through proper planning. The National Planning Commission, NPC, should therefore be informed by evidence generated as part of reviewing planning tools of government towards contributing to objectives of the National Plan 2030.

The establishment of the Secretariat in the National Planning Commission will ensure alignment of National Development Plan objectives. Monitoring and evaluation is emerging as a central tool for government and the positive contribution that it makes is very good for government. The ANC's manifesto is explicit about that and in the light of such unwavering commitment by the ANC-led government to clean and good government. We support the Budget Vote of the department. Together we move South Africa forward. Thank you. [Applause.]

Mr M M TSHISHONGA

Mr M L D NTOMBELA

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 226

Mr M M TSHISHONGA: I am in Parliament! [Laughter.]

Hon Chair, hon members and the members of the public, I have a briefing here so you must listen carefully. It has been said that a wise man is not wise every minute, and a foolish man is not foolish every minute. So you need to listen because you will miss a very important point.

Some of us are new in this Parliament, not in court, and we want to learn good things from the ruling party, not howling and insulting, please.

I have only two things to say because I have three minutes and the other one will be given for you to put questions and it will be at quarter-to. Mr Minister, there is one request from Agang SA, corruption and tendering need to be monitored and we must start from the top down. If the story of a fish has anything to go by, I think we must take note of that. You will finish. The fish starts something at the top. Thank you.

Mr D C ROSS

Mr M M TSHISHONGA

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 226

Mr D C ROSS: Madam Chair, may I start by congratulating the Statistician-General, SG, on the very good performance and presentation to the Standing Committee of Finance. It was indeed a very credible presentation.

Thank you for alluding to the importance of statistical information and of that information, especially with regards to planning, monitoring and evaluation and policy development. I hope my colleagues agree with me that it was an excellent presentation.

AN HON MEMBER: Join the ANC!

Mr D C ROSS: There are still many problems in the ANC so I cannot join you unfortunately. [Laughter.]

The principles that we need to adhere to in terms of this statistical information is quite clear. It needs transparency, accountability and it needs to have independence in terms of statistical information.

This is also a prerequisite to policy development and decision-making in government. Now With regard to these principles, it needs always to be independent and this needs to be upheld by Statistics SA and it can really work on valuable information as you presented.

Thank you also for your commitment to the National Development Plan, NDP, and as my colleague hon Michael Cardo so eloquently alluded to here today, the value of the NDP and the immediate implementation of that plan that there should be no debate regarding the importance of that.

It is unfortunate that in the Standing Committee of Finance we are facing grave problems. With regard to the economic reality in South Africa it is quite clear that our growth and our progress – and this is the truth – have stalled and our economy is not moving fast enough to create the necessary jobs that we need to create for the people of South Africa.

Currently, South Africa faces weak economic growth with the economy contracting in the first quarter, and economic growth this year likely to come in at well below 2%. We do not have a figure from the Minister of Finance as I alluded to this morning.

This will only be provided in the Medium-Term Budget Policy Statement, MTBPS. That figure will be very important as we expect it to be even lower than 2%. This is much, much lower than in the rest of Africa where we saw economies blooming and, to a certain extent, on average reaching 5,5%. Those are the issues that we need to address and address them in the way that the DA will suggest. We will offer some proposals in terms of a structural reform.

South Africa faces deficits on the current account and we also face deficits on the budget account – 4,2% I believe. The twin deficits have parachuted South Africa into a very fragile corner. In this downturn of economic growth, sir, this is what triggers demand for quality statistical information to guide us in meeting the objectives of the NDP. I hope that my colleagues take note of this because this is what we need to do -to address the structural reforms.

The results of Statistics SA in regard to a sluggish recovery in our economy, with reference specifically to the mining and manufacturing sectors, should allow parties to read from the same fact sheet. We have the same facts, but we should just agree on when we start implementing the NDP.

In a recent document by the SG, it was revealed that the first quarter of 2014 saw the mining sector shrink to 24,7% as a result of the strike on the platinum belt and the manufacturing sector also shrank by 4,4% in the first quarter. This is worrying, because as we speak, we are currently into the third week of a strike in the manufacturing sector – and I hope that the hon Ollis will agree with me that the strike began in the sector when they were already in negative growth.

If this metal workers' strike continues and spreads to other sectors, as National Union of Metalworkers of South Africa, Numsa, has indicated is its intention, the possibility of even slower growth mounts. That could be very serious for our country. This, together with increasing inflationary pressure, may well drive our economy into stagflation.

The Governor of the SA Reserve Bank is also concerned about the position, and on Friday when she announced the 25 basis points with regard to the repo rate, right now at 5,57%, she also sighted labour disruptions and weakness in the mining and manufacturing sectors, among other conditions, which are of significant concern. This also speaks to your concern.

The Governor also said that we would not experience a second quarter of negative growth, if the current strike in the manufacturing sector is resolved swiftly. I think that is where the focus should be.

The DA, of course, has a profound offer to make. Make sure that the labour laws support job creation by achieving a balance between the protection of workers' rights and the need for labour market flexibility.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Boroto): Hon member, you have one minute left.

Mr D C ROSS: I will now cut my speech short, Madam.

In conclusion, I would say that we are also enlightened by the commentators that suggest that South Africa is heading towards a recession. On 26 August 2014 the statistics confirmed this. Statistics SA will inform South Africa with regards to the gross domestic product, GDP, results.

We hope that we are going to achieve better growth results. This will answer the question of whether we are heading towards a recession or not. The answer holds serious implications for our country and it is clear that South Africa cannot afford any disconnect between policy and action.

With regard to policy direction, it is very clear. The NDP should be implemented. Thank you, Madam. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

MR M S BOOI

Mr D C Ross

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 227

Mr M S BOOI: Hon Chair, let me thank Parliament for the opportunity it has given the hon Minister and the Deputy Minister. As the ANC we support this debate, and we do not support it just because we have any other hiccups.

Clearly, even if you call it the revolution or you don't call it the revolution, we have a responsibility. We also have the responsibility of helping you to understand why we say the National Development Plan, NDP, is the centre of our policy.

Without being opportunistic and without being negative, the opposition should be agreeing that it is we who have evolved this particular policy - nobody else. It is we who have put in the resources of the government. And after we have made a thorough analysis of the progress that we have made after 20 years we have been able to bring the NDP to this government under the administration of President Gedleyihlekisa Jacob Zuma.

So there is progress and there is no way you can doubt that the ANC knows what it is doing. It has made an assessment. As others are struggling to tell us, as Members of Parliament, that they don't understand the relationship between the executive and Parliament, it should be embarrassing. Members of the opposition should be feeling that they don't understand how to take responsibility because Parliament is here.

What the chairperson of our committee did ... [Interjections.] I don't talk about people who do not participate in the committee.

The Chairperson of our committee continued to enquire and made sure that the executive come to the portfolio committee. After she had, through the processes that are quite normal in any process, made sure that there's an understanding that the executive could not make it on that particular day, she presented that to the portfolio committee and the committee accepted it.

Now, what is disingenuous is when you come to Parliament and abuse that honesty and that process which has been followed by this institution to make sure that the executive's absence has been acknowledged. There is no way that the executive has not been able to articulate through the chairperson because not everybody is chairing. There is only one chairperson here and she is the one who has taken cognisance of the fact that it is her responsibility to make sure that she understands what is going on.

The responsibility also lies with Members of Parliament. It is pathetic for Members of Parliament in this institution, new or not new, to show such a lack of understanding of how the processes of Parliament work. We will definitely be able to give you a lecture because that is what is important since you do not understand what you are doing. That is what is embarrassing the institution.

I mean, if you listen to Agang SA, EFF and the DA, there is no understanding of how the institution works. Our membership has been able to present itself quite firmly on the Budget Vote itself. Where is our focus? We have been saying that the Budget Vote that deals with the National Youth Development Agency, NYDA, has been shifted away and we do know, as a matter of fact, that it belongs to the Presidency. Any other development is supposed to be gazetted but with you, it is typical that you do not understand what is going on within the institution.

We should be embarrassed that we went with you to the elections. We campaigned and continued talking to the public, but when you come inside the institution you cannot understand how the system works. You sit here in this particular forum and continue misleading the public on how the institution is working.

That should be embarrassing to our own people. That should be embarrassing to the voters. The manner in which you are conducting yourself should be embarrassing the voters and they must wonder why they voted you in. It is embarrassing. [Interjections.]

You keep on shouting but you have been saying the ANC is shouting. You have been saying the ANC does not understand how Parliament operates. You have been saying the ANC does not understand the Constitution. We definitely understand what the role of the executive is. We definitely understand what Parliament's role is and we have definitely articulated our policies that we have put in front of you.

You don't understand because you keep on complaining about the executive, and you are being given an opportunity. The opportunity during the Budget Vote is for you to listen to the executive during the Budget Votes. It is not to sit, run and come here to complain. We have been trying to ask you to put your policies in front of us so that you don't complain to us.

Seemingly, the only thing you have done is to keep on complaining about the executive. Correctly so, because you think that an African cannot articulate without having written speeches. [Interjections.] I can articulate because I understand how the system operates.

What I am just saying is that the manner in which the opposition is conducting itself is bad. It is bad that it is not able to use the Budget Vote in a manner that could be aimed ... [Interjections.] You see, one of the things we should continuously do in the Rules Committee is to tell you that you should not, as Members of Parliament, come and represent yourself, and continue running around repeating your speeches everywhere you go, given the fact that you have not even been able to win the votes out there. [Interjections.]

You are unable to tell us, because we have been waiting for you to tell us what is wrong with our policies. Nothing is forthcoming and they are pleading with us that we must implement the NDP. That is definitely what we are going to do and that is what monitoring and evaluation is about. The department is about making sure that we implement the NDP because this is what is in our manifesto. This is what we have gone out and called upon the voters to talk to us about.

Now we are ready. When the Minister said that this is how the reconfiguration has been done, you don't understand what reconfiguration has been done. You keep on talking about the NYDA which is not even the responsibility of this particular Ministry and you keep on creating confusion about how the institution is operating. This is embarrassing. You continue saying to us ... [Interjections.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (ms MG BOROTO): Order, hon members!

Mr M S BOOI: The member of Cope goes about showing literally that he does not even understand in which term of Parliament we are. We are in the first term of the Fifth Parliament, ma'am. [Laughter.] You should not be going back to the Fourth Parliament and say that, because that shows a lack understanding of how processes work in Parliament. You keep on saying that there is secrecy. There is no secrecy in these processes.

That is why you do not even know what is going on because you are not part of this Budget Vote. You do not even know what is going on in monitoring and evaluation. You are spending your time running around talking about yourself. We don't talk about ourselves. We talk about the NDP and the reason why you are criticising the NDP is because you don't understand it. You should be an embarrassment to your own voters that they have been voting for you. [Interjections.]

We are sitting here as a majority and prepared, as the ANC, to work with every party. That is why we appreciate the fact that we are all making sure that you participate and become active, and how we make sure that the NDP is being implemented.

That is why you see when hon Cardo goes about talking about the national democratic revolution, NDR, he thinks that we are shy. We are not shy, but hon Cardo does not understand the fact that you cannot overrule what the party has decided regarding the NDR, and the relationship between the state and the party.

Hon Cardo does not understand that the ANC talks about the NDR. We have been able to bring in front of you the NDP and this is what we are saying that the NDP will be implemented through what the Ministry is putting in front of you. This is not a process of policies that are being generated outside the premises of Parliament. We have done it and became successful and under the hon Minister Jeff Radebe, we will able to implement it.

The assessment has been given by the hon Deputy Minister and the hon Deputy Minister has outlined the direction, the areas of focus and where we will go under the leadership of this chairperson of our portfolio committee. We will go to different places where we will listen and make sure that we see where the weaknesses in the system are. This is what we will be doing, which is partly reconfiguration of this particular division.

We understand our responsibilities and we have been able to talk to those responsibilities and that we understand that the Public Service needs a lot of attention. We will do that because we know the weaknesses of the Department of Public Service and Administration. We will tell you that, as a matter of fact, not every manager has been able to declare whatever is in their interest.

We know our responsibility because this chairperson's responsibility has been to make sure that we do know what the department has reported to us and what has been happening within the department. This is what has been done and we know that different managers don't declare. We will make follow-ups of our own on that.

We will be able to tell the EFF when they talk about productive forces that they don't even understand what they are talking about. They are talking about departments running in silos. They don't even understand; they are abusing English. But the reality is that what we are going to ... [Interjections.]

Mr I M OLLIS: Chair, will the hon Booi take a question about the NDP?

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms MG BOROTO): Hon member?

Mr I M OLLIS: Yes, hon Chairperson, I am asking whether the hon Booi will take a question about the NDP.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Boroto): Okay, all right. [Interjections.] No, don't continue.

Mr M S BOOI: No, Chairperson, I understand the hon member. Let him sit down. He can have a discussion with me outside. I have enough time to engage you outside. You know where we meet. I am just saying that these are our policies and there is no way, Cardo, you could say to us - of course hon Cardo - Thank you very much, you are doing a very good job.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Boroto): Hon member, please do not switch that microphone without my permission.

Mr M S BOOI: There is no way, hon Cardo, you could say to us that we are being influenced by the alliance. We are part of the alliance in this country, part of Cosatu and the SACP. We are all working together as a collective. We have been able to make sure that this NDP that they are talking about has been a policy that we have been able to derive and work together on.

There is no way that we are going to shy away from the NDP and there is no way that they could say to this government that they have never been in government or that this alliance is SACP or Cosatu. We have found that the collective of the ANC is able to say that this NDP is part of us.

This is what the hon Minister has been able to do. This is what the hon Minister has been able to say to you, even today, that this is central to our own policies and the work that we are going to be doing together as a collective.

What we are saying as the ANC and whatever he is reflecting upon about the economic strength is that, as South Africans, let us take the responsibility together. Let us make sure that all of us are working together as a collective. Let us we make sure that the NDP is being implemented as a collective. Nowhere does the ANC shy away from it.

Mr M A MNCWANGO: On a point of order, Madam Chair: Is it parliamentary for a member to talk about a political party that does not exist in this House, the SACP? [Laughter.]

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Ms M G Boroto): Hon member, would you please sit down.

Mr M S BOOI: What the ANC said, what it says in its manifesto, and what it will continue to say to the South Africans is that we do feel the responsibility and that governance is not just about only one party. It is about all of us taking full responsibility and making sure that we deliver. That is the responsibility that the ANC has and it is just the only thing that we are continuously saying to Members of Parliament. We caution them that they must not build it on fallacy. Let us build it with honesty. Let us be able to say, as South Africans, just look at each other. I mean we do listen to hon Motau, he is part of our committee and hon MC Glu that we are exchanging views ...

Ms R M M LESOMA: MC Gluwa.

Mr M S BOOI: Sorry - MC Gluwa. [Laughter.] They are all part of that team. They are all part of that team that will make sure that we deliver in South Africa. We are not going to shy away and that is why the hon Minister is calling upon us here to say that, under his leadership, as a collective and as South Africans, we should be able to take responsibility so that the concerns you are expressing about the economy and the responsibility, hon member, are our responsibility.

As members of Parliament we feel it that it is our responsibility. That is why I am concerned that the way we are handling this institution and conducting ourselves, it is in our interest and in the interests of all South Africans that we should be able to show that particular concern that we would like to have a turnaround in the economy.

We would always want to make sure that nobody is critical of the labour relations or the labour laws that have been implemented within South Africa. But there is responsibility from all South Africans that we do engage different partners around the areas of striking and make sure that they come to the party. Also, bosses who are supposed to pay these particular workers must also take full responsibility for how they conduct labour relations. That is part of what the NDP is able to put in front of South Africans.

That responsibility is not something that you shy away from. It is not a responsibility that we feel the hon Minister Jeff Radebe would shy away from. Let's join hands and work together as South Africans and make sure that the NDP is being implemented. We will never shy away from that responsibility.

We are saying let's use effectively the Constitution and all arms of governance. Even Parliament itself as an institution, let it become the responsible institution that is able to deal with the issues that confront South Africa rather than to sit here and start lying to each other. That is not going to be the best way of dealing with South African challenges. Thank you, hon Chairperson. [Applause.]

The MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: PERFORMANCE MONITORING AND EVALUATION, AS WELL AS ADMINISTRATION IN THE PRESIDENCY:

Mr M S BOOI

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Monday, 21 July 2014 Take: 228

The MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: PERFORMANCE MONITORING AND EVALUATION, AS WELL AS ADMINISTRATION IN THE PRESIDENCY: Chairperson, as my time is limited, I am going to make five short points.

I firstly want to thank all the members of the committee for participating in this robust debate this afternoon. I also wish to thank those who supported this Budget Vote. I am looking forward to working with the committee to further the objectives of the National Development Plan, NDP.

Secondly, a lot has been said about our nonattendance on 2 July 2014. I did write a letter of apology to the committee which was accepted. I hereby again apologise for not attending. We could not attend because we had to attend a meeting in Pretoria. It was not our intention to snub Parliament. That has never been our philosophy as a department. It is not mine or that of the Deputy Minister either. I thought I should apologise once more so that you hear it from me. We are not going astray; we had to attend Cabinet meetings in Pretoria. In any event, the chairperson accepted our apology.

Thirdly, the hon Motau talks about the hybrid portfolio committee that deals with performance monitoring and planning. He seems to suggest that this is the responsibility of government. If I had more time, I would have spoken to him about the doctrine of the separation of powers.

This doctrine originated in France - in the work of the philosopher Montesquieu. He wrote Trias politica, a work that promoted this issue, namely the separation of powers between the executive, the legislature and judiciary. This principle has been accepted in our Constitution and the law.

Therefore, how the portfolio committee has become a hybrid one has nothing to do with government, It is you yourselves and the Presiding Officers in their wisdom who decided to do so. So please, check with your colleagues in Parliament. I'm sure they will explain why they came to that conclusion.

Fourthly, I have noticed some scepticism about our commitment, as government and the ruling party, to the NDP. I just want to reiterate once again that the NDP, this plan of development, was initiated by our President in 2009.

He appointed the National Planning Commission as an independent institution, not to provide a plan for government, but to provide a plan for the people of South Africa. I have met the National Planning Commission, NPC, and it consists of high-calibre South Africans who have given us the most dynamic plan in the history of South Africa, namely our 2030 vision. [Applause.]

In 2012, the National Planning Commission presented the NDP to the President, who accepted it. Cabinet also adopted it as its plan. Parliament did the same thing. In December 2012, the ruling party, the ANC, unanimously and wholeheartedly adopted the NDP as the plan it supports.

In May of this year, 2014, the ruling party had its Cabinet lekgotla. Even before that, the election manifesto of the ruling party and its overarching vision was the NDP. It is part of our commitment to the electorate of South Africa. We are committed to implementing this plan. The ruling party, once again in May, reiterated its commitment to the NDP, while Cabinet's lekgotla has, in principle, adopted the Medium-term Strategic Framework, MTSF, which is based on this NDP.

When the President appointed me, he gave me strict instructions that I am the executive authority to implement this plan. So there are no backseat drivers for this plan, the driver is the President. The driver is the Deputy President who is the chairperson of the National Planning Commission. The Minister in the Presidency responsible for planning is me.

We are driving this programme, so I do not understand where this confusion comes from - as if there are other plans. There are no other plans. There is one plan, the NDP, and we want to implement it. [Interjections.]

Lastly, Chair and hon members, you are cordially invited to the Townhouse Hotel for refreshments after this robust debate. Thank you. [Laughter.]

Debate concluded.

The Committee rose at 16:29.


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