Hansard: NA: Committees
House: National Assembly
Date of Meeting: 19 Sep 2012
Summary
No summary available.
Minutes
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
THURSDAY, 20 SEPTEMBER 2012
PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
_______________
The House met at 14:03.
The Speaker took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation
The SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
START OF DAY
NEW MEMBER
(Announcement)
The SPEAKER: Hon members, I wish to announce that the vacancy which occurred owing to the passing away of Mr M E Mbili has been filled, with effect from 7 September 2012, by the nomination of Ms B J Dlomo. The member was sworn in in my office on Wednesday, 19 September 2012.
Mr M S F DE FREITAS
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
The SPEAKER
Mr M S F DE FREITAS: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DA:
That the House-
debates the current barriers, problems and solutions to lifting visa requirements in the Southern African Development Community, SADC, countries where currently no visa waiver exists; and discusses the impact that this has on our economy and the creation of jobs.Ms L L VAN DER MERWE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mr M S F DE FREITAS
Ms L L VAN DER MERWE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the IFP:
That the House debates the lack of resources in state departments to ensure that the rights of people with disabilities are realised in line with the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.
Ms A Z NDLAZI
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Ms L L VAN DER MERWE
Ms A Z NDLAZI: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:
That the House debates inventions geared at increasing the number of women studying science, particularly those from a disadvantaged rural background.
Dr P J RABIE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Ms A Z NDLAZI
Dr P J RABIE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DA:
That the House-
debates the growth or lack thereof of mining in South Africa over the last 10 years, compared with the growth of the industry in other countries; and comes up with solutions to improve the situation.Ms T D CHILOANE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Dr P J RABIE
Ms T D CHILOANE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:
That the House debates measures to root out corruption in all spheres of our society.
Mrs J D KILIAN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Ms T D CHILOANE
Mrs J D KILIAN: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of Cope:
That this House debates the implications of the lack of effective financial control systems at all state-owned entities, as well as the SA Broadcasting Corporation as public broadcaster.
Mr K S MUBU
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mrs J D KILIAN
Mr K S MUBU: Mr Speaker, you have being ignoring me! [Laughter.]
The SPEAKER: Hon member, I have given you the floor and if you do not want it, I will take it away! [Laughter.] Please proceed.
Mr K S MUBU: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DA:
That the House-
debates government's infrastructure roll-out plans; and finds ways for this to be implemented optimally to create employment opportunities across the country.Mrs N J NGELE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mr K S MUBU
Mrs N J NGELE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:
That the House-
debates the lack of transformation in the mining sector; and discusses its consequent effects on stability in the mining industry.Mr N J J KOORNHOF
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mrs N J NGELE
Mr N J J KOORNHOF: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of Cope:
That the House debates the introduction of a preferential tariff arrangement in all African countries to stimulate exports amongst one other.
Ms A C MASHISHI
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mr N J J KOORNHOF
Ms A C MASHISHI: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:
That the House debates addressing the school zoning problem to allow parents to enrol children at schools of their own choice.
Mr G G BOINAMO
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Ms A C MASHISHI
Mr G G BOINAMO: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DA:
That the House debates measures by which to hold mayors, municipal managers and chief financial officers accountable for adverse or disclaimer municipal audit outcomes.
Mrs J P NGUBENI-MALULEKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mr G G BOINAMO
Mrs J P NGUBENI-MALULEKE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:
That the House debates black economic empowerment as a tool to transform the economy.
Ms L L VAN DER MERWE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mrs J P NGUBENI-MALULEKE
Ms L L VAN DER MERWE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the IFP:
That the House-
debates government's excessive red tape with regard to our child adoption processes, which has resulted in a decrease in adoption rates nationwide; and discusses what measures can be put in place to ensure that our adoption processes become truly beneficial to our country's 3,8 million orphans.Mr G R MORGAN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Ms L L VAN DER MERWE
Mr G R MORGAN: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DA:
That the House-
debates the high number of mines in South Africa without water licences; and comes up with solutions to improve the situation.Mrs C DUDLEY
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mr G R MORGAN
Mrs C DUDLEY: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ACDP:
That the House-
debates the need for funding for assistance centres for essential services to survivors of rape, given that the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Related Matters) Amendment Act, Act 32 of 2007, makes no provision that ensures survivors of rape have access to psychosocial care; and notes that state funding allocations are hugely inadequate to the task of delivering services at the required scale.Mr L S NGONYAMA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mrs C DUDLEY
Mr L S NGONYAMA: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move:
That the House debates the media statement with regard to the deployment of the SA National Defence Force at Marikana, released by the President of South Africa on 14 September 2012, whereas the Constitution requires of him that he inform Parliament within seven days after the deployment.
Mr L RAMATLAKANE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 327
Mr L S NGONYAMA
Mr L RAMATLAKANE: Mr Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of Cope:
That the House debates the slow progress being made by government in dealing with corruption in regard to World Cup tickets in the Free State.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 328
Mr L RAMATLAKANE
MOTION OF CONDOLENCE
(The late Ali Halimeh)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House-
(1) notes with sadness the death of the Palestinian Authority's ambassador to South Africa, Ali Halimeh, on 16 September 2012, of a heart attack;
(2) further notes that he was ambassador to South Africa since 2006, and had earlier served as the late Palestine Liberation Organisation's leader Yasser Arafat's representative in Tanzania and the Palestinian Authority's ambassador in Zimbabwe and Ireland;
(3) acknowledges that he was a Palestinian freedom fighter who dedicated his life to the freedom of the Palestinian people and the liberation of Palestine;
(4) believes that he always attempted to build bridges and defend the necessity and imperatives of the Palestinian struggle; and
(5) extends its heartfelt condolences to his family, friends, colleagues and the people of Palestine.
Agreed to.
Mrs S V KALYAN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 328
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
WAIETA INTRODUCES WORLD-FIRST ETHICAL SEAL
(Draft Resolution)
Mrs S V KALYAN: Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House-
(1) notes that the Wine and Agricultural Industry Ethical Trade Association, Waieta – a South African nonprofit organisation that actively promotes ethical trade in the wine industry amongst stakeholders such as producers, retailers, trade unions and the government – will this month introduce a world-first ethical seal to be placed on qualifying wines in order to acknowledge their commitment to certified fair labour practices;
(2) acknowledges that this new seal will testify that producers have adhered to the organisation's code which is based on the International Labour Convention's Ethical Trading Initiative and South African labour legislation;
(3) recognises that this code not only prohibits the use of child labour, but upholds the fact that workers will have the right to freedom of association and a living wage, and be protected from unfair discrimination whilst securing housing and tenure rights;
(4) further acknowledges that the ultimate, long-term vision of this initiative is to have one seal, issued by the Wine and Spirit Board, that certifies the Wine of Origin information, the environmental sustainability, and the ethical treatment of workers; and
(5) congratulates the Wine and Agricultural Industry Ethical Trade Association on this initiative and their commitment to fair trade practices in the South African labour market.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 328
Mrs S V KALYAN
MOTION OF CONDOLENCE
(The late eight South Africans killed in Kabul suicide bombing)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: I move without notice:
That the House-
(1) notes that on 18 September 2012 a suicide bomber attacked a van in Kabul, Afghanistan, killing 12 people, including eight South Africans;
(2) further notes that all eight South Africans were working for a private company at the airport when this incident occurred;
(3) acknowledges that the bombing, on a highway leading to Kabul international airport, was the second suicide attack in the heavily fortified city in 10 days; and
(4) conveys its heartfelt condolences to the family of the eight South Africans killed in this tragedy.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 328
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
REVIEW OF FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT OF PARLIAMENT ACT
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: I move the motion printed in my name on the Order Paper as follows:
That the House-
(1) notes that the Third Parliament initiated and passed the Financial Management of Parliament Act in 2009, Act 10 of 2009;
(2) further notes that a number of technical challenges became apparent with the implementation of certain provisions of the Act;
(3) instructs the Standing Committee on Finance to review the Financial Management of Parliament Act, with a view to introducing amending legislation if necessary, the committee to-
(a) evaluate the application of the legislation, including those provisions related to the authority of the provinces to enact financial management legislation and the timeframes associated with various reporting mechanisms;
(b) take account of the work done by the Speakers' Forum; and
(c) report to the National Assembly by 22 November 2012.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 328
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
SUSPENSION OF RULE 253(1) ON SECOND READING OF A BILL
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: I move the motion printed in my name on the Order Paper as follows:
That the House suspends Rule 253(1), which provides inter alia that the debate on the Second Reading of a Bill may not commence before at least three working days have elapsed since the committee's report was tabled, for the purposes of conducting the Second Reading debate today on the Further Education and Training Colleges Amendment Bill [B24B-2012].
Agreed to.
Mr S G MMUSI
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 329
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
ANNIVERSARY OF STEVE BIKO'S DEATH
(Member's Statement)
Mr S G MMUSI (ANC): Last week, on 12 September 2012, we commemorated the 35th anniversary of the death of Steve Biko. Biko, the leader of the SA Students' Organisation, Saso, pioneer of the Black Consciousness philosophy and founder of the Black Consciousness Movement in 1969, died in police custody at the age of 30.
His life and writings influenced and empowered many people, and his slogan, "Black is beautiful", became the inspiration for many. Biko worked throughout his life to empower black people and he was one of South Africa's most influential and prominent anti-apartheid activists. Biko saw the struggle to restore African consciousness as having two stages, psychological liberation and physical liberation. His philosophy that political freedom could only be achieved if blacks stopped feeling inferior to whites is considered by many to be the turning point in the demise of apartheid.
Former President Nelson Mandela said of Steve Biko that:
The intervention on the level of consciousness – and consciousness was a key concept in his political approach and vocabulary - was at the essence of Biko's strategic brilliance and understanding.
Long live the memory of Steve Biko! [Applause.]
Dr W G JAMES
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 329
Mr S G MMUSI
DA VICTORY IN MITCHELLS PLAIN
(Member's Statement)
Dr W G JAMES (DA): Mr Speaker, I stand before you as a proud DA constituency MP of Mitchells Plain, which is now entirely blue! [Applause] Yesterday, Mr Speaker, the DA took the last remaining ANC wards in Mitchells Plain, including Philippi, Heinz Park and New Woodlands, with a 52,4% win. This is the very first time that we have won the seat.
The message, Mr Speaker, is clear today to the ANC that its ungovernability campaign in the Western Cape has backfired. [Applause]. The more they promote ungovernability in the Western Cape, the more votes we get. It's a fairly simple calculation.
Also, in Ward 13, Polokwane, the DA grew its share of the vote from 4,93% in the 2011 local government election to 17,31% in yesterday's by-election. This is yet another indication that the people of Limpopo are increasingly dismissing the ANC and its looting of state coffers in that province. Also, in Ward 64, Ekurhuleni, we in the DA grew our share of the vote from 3,29% last year, to 14,92% this year. {Applause].
Members of the ANC across the board, please take note that the people of South Africa want the DA's quality service delivery and good governance, and they do not want the ANC's selfish and corrupt hegemony that caters only for insiders who are part of the Tripartite Alliance. They want "a better life for all", and they do not want a party interested simply in itself. Thank you. [Time expired.]
Mr N J J KOORNHOF
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 329
Dr W G JAMES
HERITAGE DAY CELEBRATIONS AND OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM
(Member's Statement)
Mr N J J KOORNHOF (Cope): Mr Speaker, on Monday South Africans will be celebrating Heritage Day in various ways, emphasising our different cultures. We should all ponder this on the day and try to reach out for those things that are common to us, those things that provide the glue that keeps us together as a nation. We should also try to serve our country better.
So far 2012 has been a dramatic year. We have had the joy of the Summer Olympics and the sadness of the Marikana massacre.
A great reminder of what we have achieved as a nation is hearing or singing our national anthem. It is a link with the true story of reconciliation after a difficult past, as this comes together in one beautiful song. Cosatu's attempt to destroy this little bit of magic in South Africa cannot have come at a worse time. Even to suggest that it is time to remove the English and Afrikaans parts of our anthem is insensitive, and the ANC cannot be silent on this issue.
We South Africans should constantly remind ourselves that reconciliation does not fall from the sky. It involves hard work, constant self-examination by responsible individuals, and a certain collective behaviour. The blatant racism of white against black or visa versa can never be condoned. Let us make a personal effort every day to focus more on our common heritage and work harder towards reconciliation. Thank you.
Mr D D VAN ROOYEN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 329
Mr N J J KOORNHOF
NEW BANKNOTES HONOURING NELSON MANDELA
(Member's Statement)
Mr D D VAN ROOYEN (ANC): Hon Speaker, the SA Reserve Bank has unveiled South Africa's new series of banknotes which features the image of Isithwalandwe Nelson Mandela. In the centenary year of the ANC, it is a fitting tribute to Tata Nelson Mandela as an ANC President who became a symbol of our country's struggle for freedom, human rights and democracy.
This development signifies the deep gratitude of the South African people for his life spent in service to the country and for the course of humanity worldwide. It honours an outstanding leader and a patriot. Banknotes are a window on the country as a whole, its people, heritage and culture.
Equipped with a unique combination of security features, the new series of banknotes is amongst the best in the world, with enhanced features for the visually impaired, including raised print on both sides. The new banknotes will be the tender of choice in the Southern African Customs Union. Of course, this will help us as South Africa to enhance prospects of robust regional economic integration. I thank you.
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 330
Mr D D VAN ROOYEN
TIBETAN "FLAME OF TRUTH" DISPLAYED IN HOUSE
(Member's Statement)
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI (IFP): Mr Speaker, it gives me great pleasure to display in the House this Flame of Truth that the hon Trollip, the hon Hlengwa, other hon Members of Parliament and I received from people outside Parliament an hour ago. This Flame of Truth has toured the country. It has been in Johannesburg and Durban, and it has now reached Cape Town. From here it will go to all the parliaments around the world.
It's a symbolic flame. As you can see, there is no real flame to pose a threat. It is a symbol of the quest of the people of Tibet to bring to others the truth about and knowledge of the sufferings of all those who do not enjoy the rights and liberties which are so freely enjoyed in this country and in other countries.
We are very proud to have made our contribution by showing this Flame of Truth in this august Chamber, because we know that in spite of the heckling and the lack of depth of some of the remarks that are being made, most of the people of this House are indeed committed to the protection of human rights ...
The SPEAKER: Order, hon members! Order!
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI: Thank you, Mr Speaker. They are indeed committed to the protection of human rights beyond the boundaries of our own country. Thank you, Mr Speaker. [Applause.]
Mr P J GROENEWALD
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 330
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI
HIGH LEVELS OF CRIME IN SOUTH AFRICA
(Member's Statement)
Afrikaans:
Mnr P J GROENEWALD (VF Plus): Geagte Speaker, vanoggend is die misdaadstatistiek vir die periode 1 April 2011 tot einde Maart 2012 deur die Minister van Polisie bekend gemaak. Daar is oor die algemeen 'n redelike afname in veral geweldsmisdade in persentasies. Die VF Plus will vir daardie lede van die Polisie wat hard werk om misdaad in Suid-Afrika te bekamp bedank en hulle ook gelukwens.
Maar, as ek dit sê, dan moet ons ook die werklikheid in die oë staar, waarvan die eerste is dat daar steeds 15 609 mense is wat in Suid-Afrika gedurende daardie tydperk vermoor. Dit beteken daar word elke uur twee mense in Suid-Afrika vermoor. As 'n mens kyk na die statistiek oor die afgelope tien jaar, dan was daar 182 935 mense in Suid-Afrika vermoor. Dit is gelykstaande aan 'n stad soos Klerksdorp in Noordwes, wie se inwoners oor 'n tydperk van tien jaar uitgemoor is.
As ons gaan kyk na seksuele misdrywe, was daar 64 514 slagsoffers van seksuele misdrywe in Suid-Afrika in een jaar. Dit beteken dat daar elke agt minute 'n slagoffer van seksuele misdrywe in Suid Afrika is.
Ten spyte van hierdie afnames, moet ons onsself nie laat mislei nie: Suid-Afrika bly 'n geweldadige land waar misdaadvlakke te hoog is. Daar moet harder gewerk word om misdadigers te straf, sodat hulle baie duidelik die boodskap kan kry dat misdaad nie in Suid-Afrika betaal nie. Dankie.
Ms D E DLAKUDE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 330
Mr P J GROENEWALD
POOR CONDITIONS FOR PENSIONERS AT SASSA PAYPOINT IN PIET RETIEF AREA
(Member's Statement)
Ms D E DLAKUDE (ANC): Speaker, the ANC believes that the provision of social security grants remains a key strategy of addressing the plight of the poor.
It is thus extremely worrying when applicants for social security grants in the Piet Retief area are expected to queue outside the South African Social Security Agency, Sassa, offices on a busy side road in the sun and in the rain. Those applying for grants are expected to stand outside and receive services through a small window in all weather conditions. In addition, a shortage of staff often results in those applicants who have queued an entire day being turned away without being attended to.
An incident also reported was the sad case of an old woman being knocked down by a speeding car while standing in the queue. It is unfortunate that our people have to face such challenges in order to receive necessary services.
It is hoped that new offices will be sourced which can accommodate those who require Sassa services, so that they can be attended to with dignity and in safe surroundings. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr L M MPHAHLELE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 330
Ms D E DLAKUDE
MARIKANA DISASTER
(Member's Statement)
Mr L M MPHAHLELE (PAC): Hon Speaker, Ms Pauline Masutle has become the 46th casualty of the Marikana disaster.
Beyond the praiseworthy wage agreement, a sad story of Marikana is continuing to unfold. It is the story of power at war with powerlessness. It is the story of need competing with greed. It is the story of poverty existing side by side with prosperity. It is the story of a bourgeois democracy confessing its sins and failures. It is the story of political heavyweights that are simultaneously economic mosquito weights. It is the story of buffaloes weighing more than human beings in the scales of African compradors.
Professor Muxe Nkondo aptly sums up the Marikana disaster, and I quote:
The mining poor in South Africa lack support for the fundamental functions of a human being. They are less well nourished than their mine-owning counterparts, less healthy, more vulnerable to physical violence and abuse. In a real sense, the mining poor are not full equals under the law. They do not have access to property as their counterparts do, the same capacity to make a contract, the same freedom of association, movement and choice.
Those who fail to create escape routes out of poverty make violent revolution inevitable. I thank you.
Mr R A P TROLLIP
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 330
Mr L M MPHAHLELE
DASO SRC WIN AT NELSON MANDELA METROPOLITAN UNIVERSITY
(Member's Statement)
Mr R A P TROLLIP (DA): Hon Speaker, the DA notes the spectacular Democratic Alliance Students Organisation, Daso, electoral victory in the SRC election at the Nelson Mandela Metropolitan University.
After a year of good student governance under Daso, and the fulfilment of a realistic and coherent electoral manifesto, Daso went into yesterday's election quietly confident that they would be given a renewed mandate to govern the Nelson Mandela Metropolitan University SRC. What happened, in fact, was an unprecedented, record "landslide" electoral victory for Daso, which took 16 of the 21 SRC seats. [Applause.]
This historic victory confirms and reinforces the fact that all voters, including students, yearn for good governance and governability. This is, in fact, also an important rejection of the poor governance and characteristic "ungovernability" of the ANC-aligned South African Students Congress, Sasco.
What is of grave concern, however, is the undemocratic and thuggish behaviour of Sasco-aligned students who, when they came to learn of their imminent crushing defeat, resorted to switching off the electricity, and invading a voting station and stealing a ballot box, of which the ballots had fortunately already been counted. This behaviour is an ominous portent of things to come in future elections, where the ANC will come under more and more pressure, as shown by the DA's by-election results yesterday.
This election result is not only a resounding endorsement of the incumbent Daso-led SRC leadership at this university, but also a significant momentum shift for Daso campaigns on all the other tertiary institution campuses across the country.
In this regard, we also note the biased and spurious reasons for the nonrecognition and nonregistration of Daso on some campuses, such as the University of Fort Hare.
IsiXhosa:
NaseFort Hare siza kuphatha phaya. Enkosi.
Mr G J SELAU
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 331
Mr R A P TROLLIP
NESTLE INVESTMENT PROJECTS IN BABELEGI
(Member's Statement)
Mr G J SELAU (ANC): Hon Speaker, the ANC welcomes the recent launch by Nestlé of investment projects in Babelegi, Hammanskraal to the value of R500 million. These projects include, amongst other things, the construction of a 16 000 m² factory for the manufacturing of cereals. Moreover, the Babelegi investment alone has created over 130 permanent jobs and 300 indirect jobs over a 20-month period during the construction phase. The two new Nestlé production sites in Babelegi will be for the manufacturing of the company's breakfast cereals and, in addition, new production lines.
This undertaking reflects the ANC-led government's resolve to deepen and strengthen the presence of agro-processing in South Africa. This investment thus represents one of the few investment opportunities taken recently in South Africa by a global multinational company in the agro-processing area.
The ANC applauds the Nestlé Group for their show of confidence in the South African economy and for their continuous investment in South Africa. In line with their long-term commitment to business sustainability, growth and economic development, this will add more value and play a significant role in food security in South Africa and the rest of the world. Thank you.
Mr M HLENGWA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 331
Mr G J SELAU
VOTER FRAUD IN NONGOMA BY-ELECTION
(Member's Statement)
Mr M HLENGWA (IFP): Hon Speaker, the IFP uncovered massive fraud in the run-up to the hotly contested by-election in Ward 12, Nongoma, KwaZulu-Natal. Our urgent application to have 525 fraudulently registered voters scrapped from the voters' roll was accepted and effected. It appears that students from a nearby FET college were registered and bribed to vote for our opponents, even though some of them lived hundreds of kilometres away in Pongola!
The Independent Electoral Commission, IEC, has announced that it will launch an internal investigation into the matter. The IFP welcomes the IEC investigation because, quite frankly, we as the IFP are sick and tired of voter fraud.
With the ANC and National Freedom Party relationship now at a dead end, and with the IFP winning almost all its by-elections in the province, including those wards that were formerly controlled by this alliance, the IFP's opposition are running scared. Desperate to cling to power, they have resorted to fraudulently registering voters in a desperate bid to win the by-election in Nongoma.
The IEC ruling, and its intent to investigate this matter, vindicate the IFP's concerns over massive voter fraud that is part and parcel of the ANC-NFP political alliance in KwaZulu-Natal. The IFP is committed to free and fair elections, and where we find instances of voter fraud and corruption we will definitely bring them to the attention of the IEC.
Even in the face of all these actions, the IFP was the clear winner in the by-election yesterday. Our political opponents need to be reminded that a political victory can only be obtained democratically through the ballot box and not through underhanded shenanigans. It is clear that this ... [Time expired.] Thank you.
Mr L RAMATLAKANE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 331
Mr M HLENGWA
POLICE VIOLATION OF CONSTITUTION PROVISIONS
(Member's Statement)
Mr L RAMATLAKANE (Cope): Hon Speaker, as members of this House we have all sworn allegiance to the Constitution, that we will uphold the Constitution with all its provisions. We as Cope are worried that the events of last Monday suggest that the Constitution is being blatantly abused by the police. They are offending against the Constitution, while we all watch and say nothing!
About eight provisions of the Constitution have been violated. For example, the Bill of Rights has been violated by the police by their refusing to allow citizens of this country to participate or act in, or attend any gathering that is legal.
We say that if this House is silent about this flagrant abuse of power by the police – the simple words of the police, refusing to allow a person to participate in any activities – we are, in fact, beginning to go down a slippery path. We are indeed beginning to go down the path of the Mugabe syndrome.
We therefore, as this House, condemn this behaviour and want to know what the executive is doing about this.
Mrs F F MUSHWANA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 332
Mr L RAMATLAKANE
EZEMVELO PROGRAMME SUPPORT FOR SMALL FARMERS
(Member's Statement)
Mrs F F MUSHWANA (ANC): The ANC is committed to supporting the growth of rural market institutions by empowering small farmers to access markets and build links with formal sector value chains.
Thus the ANC welcomes the recent official launch of Ezemvelo, a Massmart Direct Farm Programme in Tzaneen and Maruleng, with the aim of identifying, developing and supporting small farmers in order for them to supply Massmart with fresh produce on an ongoing basis.
This programme represents an investment of more than R15 million, and it includes training, mentoring, technical assistance and establishing essential links to both finance and retail markets.
Moreover, Massmart has signed a three-year supplier development agreement with NGO TechnoServe SA, which will ultimately link small farmers directly to Massmart stores. This initiative will assist in job creation, whilst also contributing to the economic empowerment of participating farmers.
The ANC believes that this initiative is in line with its objective to improve the productivity of existing small-scale and subsistence farmers, and to integrate smallholders into formal value chains and link them with markets.
Mr S C MOTAU
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 332
Mrs F F MUSHWANA
REFUSAL OF MINISTER OF LABOUR TO ENGAGE WITH AMCU
(Member's Statement)
Mr S C MOTAU (DA): Speaker, on Tuesday Minister of Labour, Mildred Oliphant, reiterated her government's refusal to engage with the Association of Mineworkers and Construction Union, Amcu, claiming that the union was not recognised. In reality, this means that the ANC is continuing to avoid engaging with unions not affiliated to its alliance partner, Cosatu.
The Minister is clearly willing to risk another Marikana by defending a majoritarian labour regime. To prevent a repeat of the events of Marikana, we need a fair labour regime that includes all unions, not just those politically connected.
That is why the DA will push very hard for amendments to the Basic Conditions of Employment Act and the Labour Relations Act to bring an end to a virtual monopoly by employers and majoritarian unions.
Cosatu's stranglehold on government must be broken once and for all. We need labour reform that is aligned to present-day realities. Thank you. [Applause.]
Ms M C C PILANE-MAJAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 332
Mr S C MOTAU
VERY VISIBLE SUCCESSES IN SERVICE DELIVERY BY ANC
(Member's Statement)
Ms M C C PILANE-MAJAKE (ANC): Hon Speaker, when President Zuma recently outlined the very visible – that is, to those who do not purposely turn a blind eye - successes in service delivery by the ANC-led government in just 18 years, much criticism was forthcoming from the opposition.
Government has made strides in providing basic services that were historically, during the apartheid era, meant for the few from one race. These services are formal housing, clean water and sanitation, roads, electricity to millions of homes, social protection and creating a safety net for millions of South Africans through social grants – and the list goes on.
This assertion can be backed by solid research, such as that published by the SA Institute of Race Relations between 1996 and 2010, which indicated, for example, that the number of households living in formal houses increased from 5,8 million to 11 million, or by 89,9%. The number of households with access to electricity increased by 127,9% - from 5,2 million to 11,9 million. The number of households with access to piped water increased by 76,6%. Is that not demonstration enough of what the President was alluding to? The ANC will continue to build upon these achievements in order to realise set goals meant to improve the quality of the lives of South Africans.
In deepening democracy we need in a credible manner to understand the role of the opposition – that of monitoring the ruling party to promote accountability. It is also the role of the opposition to provide support with regard to the enhancement of the lives of South Africans. That is instead of engaging in cheap point-scoring and politicking in pursuit of negating the achievements attained by the ANC, enjoyed by ordinary South Africans. I thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]
The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 332
Ms M C C PILANE-MAJAKE
DA VICTORY IN MITCHELLS PLAIN
HIGH LEVELS OF CRIME IN SOUTH AFRICA
POOR CONDITIONS FOR PENSIONERS AT SASSA PAYPOINT IN PIET RETIEF AREA
VERY VISIBLE SUCCESSES IN SERVICE DELIVERY BY ANC
MARIKANA DISASTER
(Minister's Response)
The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Mr Speaker, firstly, let us congratulate the DA on both victories. We are not like them – they always resent the fact we are in the majority in this House, and they don't want to congratulate us! We are in charge of the country – we must thank them.
Secondly, the ANC is building a national democratic society in this country. In any social reconstruction there are setbacks. The ANC is under no illusions in that regard. As in any war, you win some battles and you lose some battles, but we are on course to win the war against the legacy of centuries of colonial rule and apartheid. That is the prize. We are not going to be deterred by losing a battle here and there. We are focused on winning the war, and that we are certain we will do. [Applause.]
Lastly, with regard to Marikana, which keeps coming up, the President has been very clear that we regret all that happened there. However, let me remind you of one thing. When Janusz Walus and Clive Derby-Lewis killed our hero, Chris Hani, our stalwart Walter Sisulu said that the ANC had seen many crises before and had overcome them, and they would even overcome that one. That is what he said, and I repeat today that this is a crisis we regret, but even this we will overcome. Thank you. [Applause.]
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 333
The MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND REFORM
TIBETAN "FLAME OF TRUTH" DISPLAYED IN HOUSE
DASO SRC WIN AT NELSON MANDELA METROPOLITAN UNIVERSITY
VOTER FRAUD IN NONGOMA BY-ELECTION
REFUSAL OF MINISTER OF LABOUR TO ENGAGE WITH AMCU
(Minister's Response)
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING: Hon Speaker, let me indicate that I would like to respond to four motions, but I will try to stick to the two minutes allocated to each.
On the matter raised by hon Oriani-Ambrosini, we want to say to him the ANC policy on Tibet is very clear. There is one China, and Tibet is part of China. Any problem that may relate to any part of China must be left to the Chinese people and their government. [Applause.] We as the ANC refuse to bantustanise China, in the same way that China refused to recognise the apartheid Bantustans here. We also do not support secession anywhere in the world. Hon Oriani-Ambrosini knows that. And he has a track record by the way - in the early 1990s, before 1994, he was one of those calling for an independent Zulu Kingdom! So, he does have this trend of secessionism. That's the ANC's position.
Hon Speaker, I turn now to the hon member of the DA who was talking about the victory of the Democratic Alliance Students Organisation, Daso. I would have expected something different actually. The hon member stands up and tells us about Daso's programme to transform higher education. It is of no use to come here and simply celebrate the victory of an organisation that has no track record in leading the necessary transformation in our higher education system. [Interjections.] As a Minister I recognise the necessity for organisations to contest elections and for those who win to be recognised, but I will at the same time always ask the question, "Where do those organisations stand in relation to transformation?" [Interjections.] Daso does not have that record unfortunately. [Interjections.]
I now turn to the hon member from the IFP, and this is the last but one. I think that as Members of Parliament we have a duty. You stand up here, hon member, and say that there is alleged corruption and you are implying that the ANC is involved in that. At the same time, you say the Independent Electoral Commission, IEC, is still going to investigate the matter. But you are already judgemental – that is not what we expect of a hon Member of Parliament! [Applause.] You must wait for that investigation to take place, because in the end, if there is corruption, and we don't know whether there is corruption, we may not know who is actually involved. It may not be the people you are accusing here of being involved. I think it is important for Members of Parliament to respect due processes.
Mr A M MPONTSHANE: Hon Speaker, I rise on a point of order: may I have the privilege of saying that the Minister probably did not hear the statement made ...
The SPEAKER: What is your point of order, sir? Order, hon members! Order! We want to hear.
Mr A M MPONTSHANE: Hon Speaker, can you invoke one of the Rules here which will allow the member to repeat his statement. I say this because the Minister here seems not to have heard what he said. He did not mention the ANC's name and even quoted the number of names that were struck off by the IEC. Can you allow him perhaps ...
The SPEAKER: That's a point of information, not a point of order, hon member. Conclude, hon Minister. [Laughter.]
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING: Hon Speaker, to conclude this matter, I want to say that the member said that what had happened there was a reflection on the ANC-NFP alliance. Amongst other things, he was actually accusing the ANC amongst others of corruption.
I would like to respond to the last statement, which was delivered by an hon member of the DA, and which is about labour relations and the behaviour of government regarding Marikana. Honestly, our Labour Relations Act prescribes procedures, including recognition agreements with the unions. Whilst we as government are prepared to engage with all sides in instances where there are conflicts, we can't at the same time act as if there are no recognised majority unions. Your problem as the DA is that you are antimajority because of the fact that the ANC is the majority. You don't want the ANC to win an election. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF POLICE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 333
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING
MARIKANA DISASTER
POLICE VIOLATION OF CONSTITUTION PROVISIONS
(Minister's Response)
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF POLICE: Speaker, to the hon member from the PAC, with regard to the Marikana issue, ...
Sesotho:
... seo nka se buang feela ntate ke hore ...
English:
... let us respect the fact that ...
Sesotho:
... re a tseba hore Mopresidente o hlomamisitse Khomishene ya Dipatlisiso ho shebana le maemo ao basebeletsi ba maeneng ba sebetsang ka tlase ho ona.
English:
This is not only about the incident where people were shot at Marikana. This is also about looking at the general conditions of employment when it comes to Marikana mineworkers, and the environment in which they live at the mine and in the neighbouring location. So, I think we should give them time ...
Sesotho:
... hore re bone hore ba tla re tlela le eng na.
English:
To the hon member from Cope, ...
Sesotho:
... hela wena, ke ditshele hobane ha o a bitsa lebitso la motho. Ha ke tsebe le hore o bua ka eng. Ke utlwa feela o re batho ba lwantshana le ditokelo tsa batho. Ha ke tsebe hore ke batho ba feng bao o buang ka bona. Ke a leboha!
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 334
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF POLICE
POOR CONDITIONS FOR PENSIONERS AT SASSA PAYPOINT IN PIET RETIEF AREA
(Minister's Response)
IsiZulu:
IPHINI LIKANGQONGQOSHE WEZOKUTHUTHUKISWA KOMPHAKATHI: Ngiyabonga Sihlalo, kulungu elihloniphekile elibike ngodaba lwase-Piet Retief olumayelana nendawo okuholelwa imali eyisibonelelo sikahulumeni.
English:
I want to thank the hon member for the information that she has given to us. The department will strengthen its oversight over the South African Social Security Agency, Sassa, process of improving pay points.
We are also in the process of improving all the open field pay points. We will definitely take action so that people will have a better quality of life, irrespective of where they are. We are saying that there should be a marquee, chairs, water, and at least a toilet, even if it's in an open field. We will definitely take action as early as tomorrow.
I just want to ask the hon member to give me all the necessary information so that I can forward it to the Minister tomorrow, and we will take action.
IsiZulu:
Siyabonga kakhulu nkosazana. Wenze njalo ngaso sonke isikhathi uma ubona izinto ezingalungile, usitshele ukuthi endaweni ethize kunezinto ezingalungile ukuze sikwazi ukuthatha izinyathelo. Ngiyabonga. [Ihlombe.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF HUMAN SETTLEMENTS
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 334
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT
VERY VISIBLE SUCCESSES IN SERVICE DELIVERY BY ANC
(Minister's Response)
English:
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF HUMAN SETTLEMENTS: Speaker, I just want to thank the member of the ANC for speaking about the increase in basic services to our people. It shows exactly how committed the ANC government is to increasing the provision of basic services to our people. There has been an increase in water, electricity and sanitation to households. This shows that we are committed to our election manifesto and we walk the talk, unlike the DA. [Applause.]
The SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 334
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF HUMAN SETTLEMENTS
UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE
(Rulings)
The SPEAKER: Hon members, before I proceed with the Orders of the Day, I wish to go back to the rulings I indicated I was going to make.
On Tuesday, 12 June 2012, two points of order were put, on which I intended to give my ruling today, which I wanted to do now. However, the relevant members are not in the House today, so I'll have to do so at a later stage.
However, I do wish to rule on two points of order raised on Tuesday, 21 August 2012, during the debate on the Lonmin tragedy. During that debate hon Kohler-Barnard made the following statement in reference to the Minister of Police: "He is nothing but an empty suit." Hon Kubayi rose on a point of order, asserting that this was unparliamentary, and I undertook to study the Hansard. Having now had an opportunity to do so, I wish to rule as follows.
The rules governing unparliamentary language are broadly framed in order to allow as much freedom of speech as possible for hon members. However, one established practice also dictates that any statement or remark that impairs a member's dignity or affronts a member's honour must place a curb on freedom of speech.
In this particular case I find hon Kohler-Barnard's remark does not refer to the personal characteristics of the Minister. Rather, her remark refers to the manner in which the Minister, politically speaking, is perceived to be doing his job as a Minister. As the remark does not constitute an attack on the person of the Minister, it cannot be ruled unparliamentary. [Applause.]
Towards the end of the debate on the Lonmin tragedy hon Kalyan objected to a statement by hon Van Wyk to the effect that the hon Kohler–Barnard was "a bloodhound" and requested the Presiding Officer to rule the remark out of order.
This House has on numerous previous occasions decided that any statement or remark associating a member with an animal or linking animal behaviour or sounds to a member is derogatory, insulting and by its very nature unparliamentary.
However, it is my considered opinion that applying such a blanket sanction to all references to animals effectively denudes the English language of its nuances, multi-inferences, and inherent capacity to assign more than one meaning to a word or term, depending on the context in which such a word or term was used.
The term "bloodhound" denotes a specific breed of dog that was exclusively bred to search for its targets by being tenacious and persistent, without ever abandoning the search. [Laughter.] It simply does not understand the concept of giving up. [Laughter.] The argument may be made here, for the purpose of this ruling only, that that is exactly how some members view their role in holding the executive to account: tenacious, persistent and never letting up. [Laughter.]
The use of the term "bloodhound" by hon Van Wyk must be viewed within the context of the debate in question and the hon member to whom it was directed. Furthermore, taking into account the nuances of the English language, it should also specifically be noted that the hon Van Wyk did not refer to the relevant member as a "dog". I would have ruled that out of order without hesitation.
Moreover, regard should also be had to the fact that hon Kohler-Barnard did not raise any objection to the use of the term. In fact, hon Kalyan objected because she originally heard the remark as "black hound" not "bloodhound". Had that been the case, I would have immediately ruled it out of order. [Laughter.]
Having studied the Hansard, and having regard to the context of the debate and the role of certain members as they perceive the role of the term "bloodhound" in this context, I rule that hon Van Wyk's remark may stand, as it is not unparliamentary. [Applause.]
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 335
The SPEAKER
FURTHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING COLLEGES AMENDMENT BILL
(Second Reading debate)
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING: Hon Speaker, hon members and our special guests in the gallery, it is a great pleasure for me to address this House on the Further Education and Training Colleges Amendment Bill.
I want to thank the members of the portfolio committee, led by the chairperson, Mr Malale, for their patience and understanding during the public hearings, and also for allowing space to introduce this amendment during this parliamentary cycle.
Mr Speaker, the Further Education and Training Colleges Amendment Bill is another step towards developing the Higher Education and Training legislative framework into a system that addresses the needs of adult postschool education in a more coherent manner.
The amendment is in line with the perspectives outlined in the Green Paper for Postschool Education and Training, which seeks to confront the many challenges facing youth and adults postschool, and which includes the necessity to expand postschool provision to improve access, strengthen the institutions to improve quality, and set out a vision for a more articulated and co-ordinated postschool education and training system.
Hon Speaker and members, the primary aim of this Bill is to do three main things. Firstly, it is to redefine what has normally been referred to as further education and training colleges as vocational colleges, which underlines the necessity to train for the workplace, as well as to train responsible citizens. It also introduces, over and above these vocational colleges, a new college type which transforms Adult Basic Education and Training centres into community education and training colleges. Both these colleges will offer NQF levels 1 to 4, possibly with the FET colleges – the new vocational colleges – offering up to level 5. This is very important in regard to expanding postschool education and training opportunities for our youth and adults.
This Bill also introduces a very important institute called the South African Institute for Vocational and Continuing Education and Training. The aims of this institute will essentially be, amongst other things, to conduct research, provide support, and facilitate the training of college lecturers. It will also be at the centre of raising quality and the standard of teaching and learning in our FET colleges, now to be known as vocational education and training colleges.
We believe that an institute of this nature is essential and central in addressing the many weaknesses that we have in our colleges at this time. Such an institute will be made up of both stakeholders, including labour, business and others, and experts who have knowledge of vocational and continuing education and training.
We are of the view, therefore, that this measure is a very important component of creating this vibrant postschool education and training system. Ordinarily, we would have expected all the parties and all members to support an intervention of this nature, as it is critical in addressing the many problems that we have inherited from the past, as well as in increasing opportunities, especially for those members of our community who were denied such opportunities in the past. Thank you very much.
Mr M I MALALE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 336
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING
Mr M I MALALE: Hon Deputy Speaker, Ministers and Members of Parliament, the Further Education and Training Colleges Amendment Bill was referred to the committee on 12 June this year. The committee facilitated public hearings and engaged with written submissions by stakeholders, ending that process on 11 September 2012.
The purpose of this Bill is to amend the long title and the short title of the Further Education and Training Colleges Act to Continuing Education and Training Act. This amendment is necessary in order to ensure that the message is received that postschool education focuses on all persons outside schools, not necessarily those that are referred to as adults.
It introduces a new institutional typology of community colleges which encapsulates the function of the current Adult Education and Training, AET, centres. It is significant to state that this Bill seeks to repeal the Adult Basic Education and Training Act, Act 52 of 2000, effectively encapsulating adult education and training in the post-school education terrain. In this context there is the introduction of the new institutional typology of community colleges to be responsible for functions of the Abet centres and also to create possibilities for a differentiated educational qualification mix.
The Bill will introduce or establish – to which the hon Minister alluded – the SA Institute for Vocational and Continuing Education and Training, VCET, which will be responsible, among other things, for advising the Minister on matters of VCET; will enhance and develop curricula design; and will promote human capital development in the VCET landscape.
It further empowers the Minister to intervene in instances of maladministration and financial impropriety by issuing directives for remediation of whatever morass may be occurring in the board. In the case of a recalcitrant board the Minister will be entitled to appoint an administrator who will take over the functions, powers and responsibilities of the board which will cease to exist forthwith.
We have effected amendments to this Bill in regard to the constitution of the board to limit the contours of ministerial discretion and guarantee compositional certainty, without denting the strategic essence of the original Bill as referred.
I would like to extol all 17 stakeholders who made the effort to give profoundly thoughtful contributions to the process during public participation. These stakeholders include, amongst others, SA Women in Co-operatives, SA National Apex Co-operative, Sanaco, Adult Learning Network, ALN, Education SA, National Education, Health and Allied Workers' Union, Nehawu, and SA Democratic Teachers' Union, Sadtu.
It would be remiss of me if I did not highlight the fact that the DA declined to endorse the Bill, or abstained from endorsing it, because of organisational political considerations. However, those considerations did not inhibit the DA members in the committee from meaningfully and constructively taking part in the deliberations leading to the approval of the Bill by the portfolio committee. Among those considerations is the following. The assignment of FET colleges to the national sphere will divest the DA of administrative control of the FET colleges in the People's Republic of the Western Cape, under the leadership of Madam "Refugee" Zille. [Laughter.]
But that does not deter me from congratulating Prof Lotriet for her election as the provincial chairperson of the DA in the Free State, because she is a very profound scholar and loyal member of the portfolio committee. She is about to join us, sworn by her contributions in our committee. Thank you very much.
I must also thank Tata Mpontshane from the IFP and also hon Bhanga from Cope for their support. I know that Comrade Bhanga may want to raise the issue of the administrator, thinking that enabling the Minister to appoint the administrator might tamper with academic freedom, institutional autonomy and scientific research in the institutions. I would like to assure him that that is not possible. Because he is a Member of Parliament, every law which the Minister introduces must be approved by him. So he is a human guarantee of the impossibility of any intrusion into the affairs of the institutions by the Minister or anybody else. He is the final guarantee, because his party seems, more than anybody else, to love the Constitution of South Africa. The Constitution enshrines and protects those fundamental values that he seems to stand for and that we would like to say we will protect at all costs. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Dr A LOTRIET
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 337
Mr M I MALALE
Dr A LOTRIET: Deputy Speaker, the DA strongly supports the idea that further education and training, FET, colleges should be strengthened and improved and, indeed, that all forms and levels of education should be improved. This includes adult education and training.
What this Bill aims to do is to amend the Further Education and Training Colleges Act, FETC Act, in order to provide for the inclusion of a second type of institution within the existing legal framework, and that refers to the community education and training colleges, CET colleges.
The change of FET colleges in terms of this Bill to vocational and continuing education and training colleges, VCET colleges, is an amendment that can be supported, as it does indeed provide more emphasis on the vocational function of these colleges. The change of "further" to "continuing" colleges also makes sense.
The establishment of the SA Institute for Vocational and Continuing Education and Training can also be seen as a positive step, as such an institute would be able, inter alia, to develop curricula and do research in the field of the college sector. This is something that can only assist in improving the quality of the college sector.
However, the Bill becomes problematic in the amendments that seek to convert adult basic education and training centres, AET centres, into community education and training colleges, CET colleges, because in terms of the amendments these CET colleges will operate within the existing provisions of the FETC Act as amended by this Bill, and the Adult Basic Education and Training Act, AET Act, will be repealed.
These AET colleges that have been converted into CET colleges will then be deemed to have been established in terms of the FETC Act. It is also proposed that the governance structures, funding, management and other related functions of AET colleges be regulated in terms of the FETC Act.
This means that in terms of this Bill these AET centres, to become CET colleges, will now be transferred to the national Department of Higher Education and Training. This was the essence of the 2012 Further Education and Training Colleges Amendment Bill, where FET colleges were transferred from provinces to the national level. The DA opposed this Bill.
The present Bill now proposes the same for AET centres by repealing the AET Act. Provinces will thus not be responsible for AET centres in terms of the Bill. Not only will FET colleges, but also AET centres, be controlled by the Minister from Pretoria. This means that all power regarding colleges is being centralised by Minister Nzimande.
The way in which the previous Further Education and Training Colleges Amendment Bill expanded the powers of the Minister regarding staff, strategic plans, funding, councils, languages and so forth will in terms of this Bill be extended to AET centres. This is not the solution to the problems experienced in the sector.
If one has to go by how the department is dealing with the FET colleges now under its control, the prospects do not look very positive. Students have to wait months for the department to release results, and certificates take months and years to be issued. Surely if you take control of institutions in order to improve the situation, then that is what should happen. We should not be receiving complaints on a daily basis.
A question also needs to be asked regarding the AET centres or the proposed CET colleges. To what extent, if at all, will local and provincial government play a role in determining the local and provincial needs in regard to the programme mix and in the governance of these institutions?
A further concern regarding this Bill is the constitutional amendment that is required to Schedule 4 Part A of the Constitution. In terms of Schedule 4, education at all levels, excluding tertiary education, is a concurrent national and provincial competence. This, the 18th Constitutional Amendment, has not yet been passed.
This creates an extremely unsatisfactory situation and a great deal of uncertainty for colleges, as well as for provinces. In fact we have a situation where we are debating an Amendment Bill based on an Act operating without the assumed constitutional amendment having been effected. Therefore, based on the above reasons, the DA cannot support the Bill. [Applause.]
Mr B M BHANGA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 338
Dr A LOTRIET
Mr B M BHANGA: Thank you, Deputy Speaker. Minister, Cope agrees with the principles and objectives of strengthening further education through vocational training, aligning school education with higher education, and building capacity. This is because what we see today is that we have weak further education and training institutions. The elements and the objectives of this Bill attempt to strengthen them. The Green Paper, in particular, elaborates further on the 2030 Vision, in which we want to build a vocational institute that will be able to build that capacity.
However, the danger that we in South Africa are confronted with is that we are redirecting students to further education and training, but the very same students are not employable!
Your intentions are very noble, but, Minister, the problem we are confronted with in this country is the centralising of authority. We must avoid that. We as Cope are concerned that you continuously want to take over control of the running of universities. That was in the first Bill and now it is in this one.
We do not understand what informs that. We have seen your actions in your term of office. It is like giving a child a machine gun to just shoot everybody and kill universities. We fear that if we give you more power to run these universities, as you intend in your interventions as the Minister, you won't be capably running and giving advice and capacity to these institutions. What you will do is to put in administrators who will fail, like those at the Walter Sisulu University for Science and Technology, WSU. You will also do what you're trying to do in the Central University of Technology, CUT, where you were dismissed.
What you know most, and what we even said on Tuesday, is that you will use the authority in this Bill that you are introducing to intervene in the universities and institutions that you seek to intervene in, while all these universities are collapsing under your own administrators! You are unable to intervene and help them.
We believe that this will compromise the academic freedom of the institutions, and in particular as relates to the establishment of this institute. In the powers you want to give yourselves you even say in some sentences that if the institute does not follow the instructions and the guidance, you will just disband the board! We do not want that. We need institutions that are properly guided and institutes that will be able to guide. I therefore agree with the Professor. The Professor has put it like a professor, very nicely, and mentioned the intentions and how we want to see things.
Let me share with you a few stories. In a meeting that hon ... [Time expired.]
Mr Z S MAKHUBELE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 338
Mr B M BHANGA
Nkul Z S MAKHUBELE: Xandla xa Xipikara, Vaholobye na Swandla swa Vaholobye, Swirho swa Palamente, swirho swo xiximeka, munhu a nga ka a nga sunguli hi ku vulavula hi dyondzo yo yisa emahlweni na ndzetelo hi ku hambanyisa leswi languteriweke eka sekitara leyi na mayelana na ku humesa swikili leswi faneleke na vatirhi lava nga na vuswikoti eka tiko ra hina.
Ndzi lava ku tshikelela leswaku tikholichi i mihlangano ya nkoka leyi humesaka swikili swa le hansi na le xikarhi. Ti humesa swikili swo tala swa nkoka no kongoma leswi lavekaka ku kurisa ikhonomi ya hina ni ku tumbuluxa mitirho. Hikokwalaho, swi na nkoka leswaku hi va na nhlangano lowu nga enawini, lowu tiyimiseleke, lowu nga ta landzelerisa ni ku angamela sekithara leyi.
Xinawana xa 1(d) xa Nawumbisi xi lava leswaku Holobye a tumbuluxa nhlangano wa ndzetelo wa mitirho ya mavoko na dyondzo na ndzetelo swo yisa emahlweni eAfrika-Dzonga.
Nhlanagno wa Dyondzo ya mitirho ya movoko na ndzetelo swo yisa emahlweni yi fana yi ri yoxe eAfrika-Dzonga. Germany, tanihi rin'wnan ra matiko lama rhangeke emahlweni eka xiyenge xa dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na xithekiniki, ri na leswi vuriwaka Nhlangano wa Federali wa Dyondzo ya Mitirho ya Mavoko na Ndzetelo leswi sunguriweke hi 1970. Ku humelela ka dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na ndzetelo ya le Germany swi vekiwa eka ndzavisiso wa xiyimo xa le henhla xa mitirho ya mavoko xa nhlangano. Nhlangano wu tirha ku vona mitlhonthlo leyi ya ha taka eka dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko, yi hlohlotela vutumbuluxi eka tisisiteme ta le tikweni na matiko ya misava na ku tumbuluxa switshunxo swintshwa leswi tirhisekaka eka dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na ndzetelo swa masungulo no yisa emahlweni.
Nhlangano wu swi kotile ku lawula ni ku vona swilaveko swa swikili swa mundzuku hi ku hatla va xopaxopa. Hi ku endla tano mihlangano ya dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na ndzetelo ya swi kota ku nyika swikili swo kongoma no laveka emitirhweni.
I ntiyiso leswaku sekithara ya hina ya dyondzo yo yisa emahlweni na ndzetelo[further education and training], FET, yi tsanile hikuva khale a yi nga tekeriwi enhlokweni. Minongonoko ya hina hi xitalo, ngopfungopfu ya National Technical Education, Nated, yi hundzeriwile hi nkarhi. Leyi yi nga kongoma a yi kona, xikombiso swikili eka ikhonomi leyi hlayisaka mbangu na indhasitiri ya timhaka ta swa lwandle hi swin'wana ndzi nga swi boxaka.
Ku na mitlhontlho hi kharikhulamu hikokwalaho ku na ku feyila ni ku vuyelela hi xitalo, xiyimo xa le hansi xa vuleteri, ku fambelana ko tsana exikarhi ka tikholichi na le ntirhweni, ku fambelana ka FET eka tiyunivhesiti na mitlhontlho leyi fambelanaka na vufambisi.
Hi tlhela hi tikeriwa hi mhaka ya nkunguhato wa swikili hikuva a hi si kota ku vona mavangwa ya swikili swa mundzuku, hikokwalaho hi humesa mathwasana lawa ma nga kotiki ku kuma mitirho. Ku lava hi va na nhlangano lowu tiyimiseleke, lowu nga ta kambela nkoka wa ku nyikiwa ka dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na ku nghenelela ka ha ri na nkarhi. Wu fanele wu va nhlangano lowu nga ta langutisisa minongonoko ya dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na xithekiniki na ndzetelo nkarhi na nkarhi ku fikelela swilaveko swa mitirho.
Nhlangano wu ta va wa xiphurofexinali lowu vumbiweke hi swirho leswi nga na vuswikoti eka xiyenge xa dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na ndzetelo. Wu ta va vuxikarhi bya xiyimo xa le henhla eka ndzavisiso na vutumbuluxi eka sekithara ya FET. Nakambe wu ta tlhela wu hluvukisa vuswikoti na ku antswisa swikili swa vadyondzisi eka dyondzo ya mitirho ya mavoko na ndzetelo.
Ku languteriwa leswaku nhlangano wu ta tirhisana na mihlangano leyi nga kona ya ndzavisiso ku sivela ku endla mitirho leyi fanaka. Vaswirhundzu na vamatlhari, hi ndhundhuzela ndzawulo eka goza lerikulu leri yi ri tekeke ku tumbuluxa nhlangano lowu.
English:
What we are saying is that it is not unique for South Africa to have such an institute. I heard hon Bhanga saying that it was like we were giving the Minister all the powers, and that perhaps informed him that he could be against the institute! He must do further research and he'll understand that it is not we alone as a country who are going to be establishing such an institute. Germany, the leading country in issues of vocational education and training, started the same type of institute in 1970.
And it has proved that it works, because there is professional advice in the sector and you are able to ensure that training institutions and the industry co-operate and say what is needed, which happens to be the upgrading of the skills of those who are being trained, skills that are needed by industry. We want to have the same thing done in our own country, so that we don't have graduates who cannot be absorbed because they are still focused on outdated programmes and skills.
I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr A M MPONTSHANE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 339
Mr Z S MAKHUBELE
Mr A M MPONTSHANE: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. Hon Minister, I must hasten to say that there were some constitutional considerations that would have forced us as the IFP to oppose this Bill, but utilitarian factors weighed heavily on our thinking and our caucus reached the conclusion that we must support this piece of legislation. [Applause.]
This is because, in our thinking, firstly, this Bill seeks to streamline and co-ordinate further education and training, FET, colleges, and create a very necessary institutional framework such as community colleges, which will enable a greater outreach into our communities.
Secondly, it is imperative now more than ever that our institutions of higher learning provide students with the necessary and relevant skills required to move from a learning to an employment environment. For this to be happen, their curriculum must be relevant, their teachers must be competent, and their institutions must be easily accessible.
The main questions that remain are: Are these FET colleges performing in terms of their mandates? Are they producing the skills required by the South African economy?
Youth unemployment continues to climb and shows no signs of slowing down. This we submit is a challenge that must be approached from all angles.
In conclusion, our FET colleges must concentrate on accessibility, right skilling, competent teaching staff and the promotion of a culture of entrepreneurship amongst their students.
Additionally, I know, Minister, that you have tried your best when it comes to the Sector Education and Training Authorities, Setas, but we are saying these Setas should be disbanded and the money be given to FET colleges. Thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Ms N GINA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 339
Mr A M MPONTSHANE
Ms N GINA: Madam Deputy Speaker, we as the ANC welcome the proposed amendments to the Bill in totality, especially the repeal of the Adult Basic Education and Training Act of 2000. We also welcome the inclusion of the community education and training colleges. It should be clearly noted that the repeal does not mean that adult education has no role in our country – not at all.
Though the statistics show that there is an improvement in the literacy rate, there are areas where the illiteracy rate is still very high, especially amongst the adults in our country.
In addition, the study published by Cloete in 2009 revealed that in 2007 there were more than 2,8 million people of between the ages of 18 and 24 who were not employed, who were not in some form of education or training, and who were not severely disabled. Of this number, over 500 000 had primary education, over 508 000 had secondary education that was under Grade 10 and almost a million had Grade 8 or more, but less had Grade 12.
So, as a country, what is it that we are learning from this? This tells us that we need to broaden the provision of adult education in order to create educational opportunities for these segments of the population with different needs.
The Adult Basic Education and Training Act, Abet Act, of 2000, as it is in its current form right now, is very limiting and restricting in regard to the provision of Abet education, because it ends at National Qualifications Framework Level 1, which is equivalent to Grade 9. We all know and agree that in our country, when we talk about the Adult Basic Education and Training, Abet, institutions, we realise that they have been found wanting and have been treated almost like stepchildren in our education system. Hence we have these amendments to the Bill to take care of such things. The Abet Act does not cater for those with qualifications above Grade 9, but who have not completed Grade 12, or those who have failed Grade 12 and need to repeat it.
During the public hearings, stakeholders such as the SA Women in Co-operatives and the SA National Co-operatives proposed the inclusion of an academy or an institution in the proposed community college model that would provide skills training to sustain the co-operatives. This was a clear indication that people yearned for a different sector that would provide for nonformal, informal and formal education and training.
We as the ANC believe then that the conversion of the public adult learning centres into community education and training colleges is a good move, which will broaden the scope of the provision of education and training for all the citizens of our country. We hope that this will, among other things, continue towards addressing the new challenges that our country is facing.
Hon members, our country is facing a "youth bulge" phenomenon. Economists have argued that the growing youth population could be an important demographic dividend if they are equipped with the right employable and self-employable skills. However, the demographic dividend will happen only if the economically active people are engaged through education, training and employment.
The National Development Plan: Vision for 2030 acknowledged that South Africa had failed to reap the demographic dividend by harnessing the potential of the proportionately large cohorts of working-age youth. We failed because a large cohort of the young people have a low level of education, that is, below Grade 12, and they are neither employed nor in education and training.
The department has proposed the National Senior Certificate for Adults of the age of 18 and beyond. Research studies show that a significant number of learners are dropping out of the schooling system after Grade 9, which is the last grade of compulsory education. This group of dropouts include those who drop out between Grades 10 and 11, and are not catered for in the current adult education provision. The only alternative for them is the FET colleges. We are saying that that is not enough. We need to open more alternatives for such people; hence, we are supporting such amendments to the Bill.
While the Department of Education has closed down the finishing schools, it has not, however, provided an alternative for those who failed Grade 12 to repeat the grade on a full-time basis, except for writing the supplementary examinations. It is because of the lack of alternatives that South Africa is faced with these challenges.
I need to caution all of us that if these young people are not provided for, they will find themselves on the road to nowhere. And the danger thereof is that the "youth bulge" will become a demographic bomb, because a large number of frustrated youth are likely to become a potential source of social and political instability.
It is against this background that the repeal of the Adult Basic Education and Training Act of 2000 is justifiable, and it will pave the way for the broadening of adult education and training through community education and training colleges, and continuing education and training.
Thus, while we respect the position of the DA, who are rejecting the Bill in its totality and not supporting it, we as the ANC will approve the Bill, because it is a step in the right direction in improving the socioeconomic status of South African citizens.
So, to me it shows clearly that if the DA cannot support such a Bill that is going to create so many ... [Interjections.] I am coming to them, member. So, to me, if we hear the DA claiming that it is taking care of the people out there in our country, but we find it rejecting such a progressive Bill that is going to take care of all those people that are not employed and are lacking skills in our country, it really leaves much to be desired. One asks oneself which people the DA is taking care of!
I think Cope was also a little bit confused, because hon Bhanga came here and talked more about the higher institutions, the universities. We are still coming to that Bill, Mr Bhanga! However, it is fine to be proactive and ahead of things! I understand, as he was not even part of the deliberations on this Bill when it was discussed in the committee, but he will learn some other time. [Applause.]
Hon Mpontshane, thank you very much. We know the way you have been active in the committee. We know the support that you have given, and you have the interests of the people of the country at heart. That is why we have seen in you such a progressive manner of agreeing with and supporting the Bill. Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. [Applause.]
The HON MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 340
Ms N GINA
The MINISTER OF HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING: Deputy Speaker, first of all, let me take this opportunity once more to thank the ANC for working very hard in leading the processing of this Bill, as well as in its support and its proper grasp of what the intention of this Bill is.
IsiZulu:
Ngibonge nakuwe bab'uMpontshane, angazi ibuye ixabanephi thina nawe ngoba uyayibamba lapho kufanele uyibambe khona. Kule ndawana yemfundo, ongathi siyazwana. Engathi kungahlala kunjalo ngoba le nto esiyenzayo siyenzela izingane zethu. Kodwa asigcini futhi ukuyenzela izingane zethu, siyenzela lunga elihloniphekile Trollip, abantu abadala bakithi.
Ngifuna ukuyichaza le nto yemfundo yabadala. Aniyazi ukuthi yini. Okokuqala ukuthi zonke izikhungo zefundo yabadala zisebenza ngendlela ephula imithetho. Ake ngithi nje iningi lazo ngoba ...
English:
... in law, the adult basic education and training centres, as things stand now, are only empowered to offer National Qualification Framework, Level 1, which is far less than Grade 11 or even Grade 10. Grade 7, yes. [Interjections.] Yes. Well, I am Minister of Higher Education and Training, of course! Many of them are actually offering matric programmes and classes. It is illegal, what we are doing, but government has turned a blind eye on this matter because of the need. What this legislation is doing is correcting that so that these centres are able to offer programmes up to the equivalent of matric without any problems. That is the objective of this legislation.
The record of Adult Basic Education and Training since 1994 has also not been a good one. Under provinces it has not been a good one. Hence the President's proclamation that these centres should become a national responsibility. That is together with colleges, by the way. The advantage of doing that is that we are better able to align these institutions with the Setas. We are also better able to ensure that programmes offered in these institutions articulate better with universities for those who want to proceed to university after these initial qualifications, which must be recognised by the universities. So that is the logic of the national government. The logic of the national government is not to centralise power.
Hon member Bhanga, you know, I hate – not you! I hate ex-communists, because they are like ex-smokers! Since when have you abandoned the dictatorship of the proletariat, for instance? [Laughter.] Not so long ago we were arguing the same thing with you. Now you are like an ex-smoker who does not even want to smell a cigarette from somewhere, as if you have never smoked before!
In fact, if you look at the establishment of the SA Institute for Vocational and Continuing Education and Training, we are deliberately saying that we need experts to come and advise the Minister. These are experts to come and design appropriate curricula so that those functions are not just centralised in the departments, but we are able to bring in a whole range of other people from outside the department, who will bring value into the transformation of our college sector. So, where is the centralisation there?
My worry though, with the DA and Cope, and there is increasingly hardly any difference now, ...
IsiZulu:
... siyabona impela ukuthi ingathi lo mshado usondele. [Uhleko.] Bab'uLekota nashiya umshado kwenye indawo ngoba nifuna ukuzogana lana. Siyayibona le ndaba. [Uhleko.] Nifuna Ukuzogana nizoba omakoti bala eNtshonalanga Kapa. [Uhleko.]
English:
The problem is that you are reducing this to a petty, party-political issue, at the expense of the interests of the youth and the adults of our country. That is why we are talking about centralisation, but you are not looking at all the advantages. Also, do not just come and talk here – judge us by our track record!
Hon Deputy Speaker, hon Bhanga was, in fact, out of order. This Bill is not about administration. It is about transforming and changing the face of vocational and continuing education and training in our country.
Also, you cannot, by the way, use the issue of the fact that certificates in FET colleges have been delayed. This is not a new problem – it goes back to 2007. However, since this department was created we have increased the number of certificates that we have released to graduates from the FET colleges. [Applause.] Even with those certificates that we are not releasing, what we have done in the meantime is to provide proof to students that they have actually completed these particular courses so that they can access employment.
That is the work of this department, because our interest is in nothing other than empowering the ordinary workers and the poor of this country, not centralising power in ourselves! So stop playing narrow party-political games and support something that is actually important!
The last thing, hon Deputy Speaker and hon members, is in regard to the adult basic education and training centres that we are changing into community education and training colleges. What we are doing is this. At the moment the Abet centres are focusing only on a, e, i, o, u, and doing matric. We are saying that these centres must be community colleges so that they can offer short programmes in fencing or knitting or baking – skills that are actually needed by ordinary people in the communities. [Applause.] We are changing them in order to empower them.
IsiZulu:
Ngoba into eniyijahe kakhulu ukuthi niphikise yonke into eyenziwa nguhulumeni nize ningaboni nezinto eziyizidingo kubantu bakithi. Yingakho niyohlala njalo ningapha kule Ndlu ngoba yithi kuphela esaziyo ukuthi yini esiyenzayo. Sibonga kakhulu kuwo wonke amalungu asekele lo Mthethosivivinywa esiwuphasisa namhlanje. Sibonga kakhulu. [Ihlombe.]
Debate concluded.
Mr B N BHANGA: Hon Deputy Speaker, the Minister referred to the ex-smokers. I wonder, as the ex-IFP member, whether the Minister still has the same view. [Laughter.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, no, you are out of order.
Bill read a second time (DA, Cope and ID dissenting).
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! The Bill will be sent to the NCOP for concurrence.
Mr S E KHOLWANE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 341
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON COMMUNICATIONS –RECOMMENDATION OF CANDIDATES TO FILL VACANCIES ON COUNCIL OF INDEPENDENT COMMUNICATIONS AUTHORITY OF SOUTH AFRICA, ICASA
Mr S E KHOLWANE: Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Hon members, on 16 May 2012 the committee had referred to it a request to consider the appointment of Council of Independent Communications Authority of South Africa, Icasa, councillors.
We invited nominations from the public and 39 people showed a keen interest in being one of the Icasa councillors. On 5, 6 and 7 September 2012 we interviewed 15 candidates in order to make sure that we got five candidates as per the requirement of the Icasa Act. Because there were three vacancies in Icasa, we had to submit five names to the Minister, so that the Minister can appoint three out of the five, in terms of the relevant Icasa Act, Act No 13 of 2000. As parties we came to the conclusion that we should recommend the following five names to the House to consider, so that they can be recommended to the Minister for the appointment of three.
I must say that as parties on that portfolio committee we all agreed on three names, but I must indicate that we differed on two names. The names we as a committee are recommending to this House for the Minister, of which three must be appointed, are, firstly, Ms Nomvuyiso Batyi, secondly, Mr Khulile Boqwana , thirdly, Ms Nomonde Gongxeka, fourthly, Mr Manyara Rubben Mohlaloga, and lastly, Ms Katharina Gloria Shirley Pillay.
As I have indicated, there was consensus among the committee members on three of the names, but we could not agree on two of the names. However, I present the five names to the House for consideration, for recommendation to the Minister, in order for him to appoint three, as per the requirement of the Act. Thank you very much.
There was no debate.
Question put: That the House recommends to the Minister of Communications that three of the following candidates be appointed to serve on the Council of Independent Communications Authority of South Africa: Ms Nomvuyiso Batyi, Mr Khulile Boqwana, Ms Nomonde Gongxeka, Mr Manyara Rubben Mohlaloga and Ms Katharina Gloria Shirley Pillay.
Mr A C STEYN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 341
Mr S E KHOLWANE
Declarations of vote:
Mr A C STEYN: Deputy Speaker, the Independent Communications Authority of South Africa, Icasa, is frequently criticised for failing to fulfil its mandate of efficiently regulating the telecommunications and broadcasting sectors to ensure affordable, ubiquitous and high-quality communication services to all South Africans.
It lacks sufficient, suitably qualified staff to promptly produce high-calibre, largely technical work. Its council of well-paid full-time councillors is frequently criticised for not adequately providing the regulatory landscape South Africa needs. The council is hindered in its work by not having sufficient councillors with the relevant technical knowledge to properly guide and oversee the work presented to it by an underresourced administration.
Of the five candidates for the Icasa council presented to this House today, the DA is of the opinion that two candidates will contribute little of value to accelerating the roll-out of the necessary regulations and monitoring the delivery of services. If this House perpetually appoints people with inappropriate skills and scant experience in the environment in which Icasa operates, we are all complicit in the entity's perpetual inability to deliver. How can we call these entities to account before the National Assembly if we are responsible for the inappropriate skills complement in the first place?
The candidates the DA opposes are Ms Nomonde Gongxeka and Mr Manyara Mohlaloga, both of whom are currently ANC cadres in government. Ms Gongxeka is with the SABC and Mr Mohlaloga is with the Department of Communications. And we take a dim view of the career trajectory from public servant to oversight body, as it is an indication of ministerial interference in an entity that should be valued for its independence.
We also maintain that neither of these candidates has the required skills and experience for the job. This is particularly so in the case of Mr Mohlaloga whose career trajectory has been from the ANC Youth League to this House as an MP, and now to the Department of Communications, where his lack of leadership skills led to a delay in the submission of tenders by potential set-top box manufacturers.
The ANC's hard-line approach to the inclusion of these two candidates, at the expense of far better qualified individuals, clearly points to the fact that the ANC still favours cadre deployment and jobs for pals over service delivery. I thank you.
Mrs J D KILIAN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 341
Mr A C STEYN
Mrs J D KILIAN: Deputy Speaker, Icasa, as a regulator of the telecommunications industry, is one of the most important drivers for economic growth and job creation in our country.
Unfortunately, the reality is that the institution has not lived up to expectations. It has been criticised for its tardiness with the finalisation of regulations to promote competition in the market and drive cell phone costs down, ensuring access to affordable broadband, and a host of other matters for which the regulator is responsible.
The council has also been dragged into political controversies in the past. We can all remember the Vodacom listing in 2009 which raised a number of questions regarding the independency of Icasa as the sector regulator. That was when Vodacom exercised its licence rights agreement to unbundle its shares without the involvement of Icasa and the Minister of Communications. There was a prior agreement in place, but at the last minute Cosatu was uncomfortable. They approached the courts and Icasa somersaulted. Clearly, that was a seriously flawed decision by the regulator, which has raised serious questions about its independence.
South Africa has lost its competitive edge in information and communications technology on the African continent, let alone the rest of the developing world. We can therefore no longer allow them to regard their work as "business as usual". We need dynamic, trustworthy leadership and an Icasa council that commands respect throughout the industry as an independent body, free from all political and commercial influence, and with the necessary expertise to regulate this sector. An effectively regulated ICT sector could contribute at least 1% to our economic growth.
Good candidates were nominated. Unfortunately, a disconcerting trend of inbred musical chairs has also emerged, and my colleague has referred to that, with friends and colleagues in state-owned entities nominating each other – no doubt with some influence somewhere behind the scenes of ANC MPs, and even the Minister.
Consequently, Cope cannot support all five candidates but only three, who were selected on merit. We cannot support the other two, one of whom is in a senior position in the SABC. We believe she should preferably remain there to ensure that the public broadcaster delivers on its mandate. The other candidate, now a chief director in the Department of Communication and a former ANC MP, could not convince us that he had delivered on his current responsibilities in the department. He was responsible for broadcasting digital migration, local content development, set-top box manufacturing support strategy, etc. [Time expired.] We cannot support that, and we believe that the ANC should stop its interference in Icasa and its appointments. Thank you.
Mr G D SCHNEEMANN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 342
Mrs J D KILIAN
Mr G D SCHNEEMAN: Deputy Speaker, firstly, I would like to state with regard to the Independent Communications Authority of South Africa, Icasa, Council that one of the things that we are aware of is certain skills that are lacking in the council. So, when we conducted the interviews and deliberated on potential names, these were the things that we looked at. There is a lack of skills in the areas of broadcasting, policy and leadership, as well as legal expertise. These five names that have been presented to the House today to approve possessed these skills. In fact, any of these five candidates would add value to the Icasa Council and would also contribute to strengthening the work of Icasa, and I actually said it could be any of these five candidates.
I want to address something that has been raised here now, and it is the issue that was raised by the hon Kilian and the hon Steyn about apparent political affiliation. I want to say something, and make it very clear to this House and to those that are watching. In the past this very portfolio committee actually participated in nominating and recommending candidates for other entities which fall under the Department of Communications. In particular, I want to mention the SABC Board, where opposition members at that time who were in this House were actually nominated. They were actually nominated. [Interjections.] They were opposition members, they were not objected to by the DA, and they took office. I just want to make it clear that it is factually incorrect to say that the two people in question, who they say are political nominees, are being pushed by a certain political party.
It is factually incorrect to come here and say that they have no skills and they would make no contribution whatsoever. In fact, they do possess skills and they would make a contribution. They are not political nominees; they were nominated in their own right and in their own capacity for having the requisite skills to make a contribution to a well-functioning and effective Icasa Council.
I would appeal to the opposition not to use these opportunities to grandstand and try to score political points, but when they come here to actually really give the facts, in this case that all five candidates possess the skills and qualifications. I would appeal to the opposition to change their stance even at this late hour. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Mrs J D KILIAN: Madam Deputy Speaker, on a point of order: Can I ask if anybody can explain the absence of the Minister of Communications and also the Deputy Minister of Communications?
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: No. That's out of order. That's not a point of order, please. [Interjections.] That's not a point of order. [Interjections.]
Question agreed to.
Mr S E KHOLWANE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 342
Mrs J D KILIAN
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON COMMUNICATIONS – RECOMMENDATION OF A CANDIDATE TO FILL A VACANCY ON SABC BOARD
Mr S E KHOLWANE: Madam Deputy Speaker, I will present the report, and the rest I will leave to those who like to argue a great deal!
My duty is to present the report, but I must start by saying that the Minister is in Polokwane addressing the national conference of community broadcasters, and the Deputy Minister is preparing for her wedding this coming weekend. So, clearly, I must account for where they are, because I know where they are.
On 7 May the Portfolio Committee on Communications had referred to it a request to consider the appointment of one board member in the SABC, after Mr Clifford Motsepe had resigned as a result of his appointment as an MEC in Limpopo. We advertised the vacancy and received 38 nominations. As a committee we short-listed six names. [Interjections.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order, hon members! I can hardly hear the speaker.
Mr S E KHOLWANE: We then conducted interviews on 4 September 2012.
After having interviewed all six candidates, we as a committee came to a conclusion on a name this time around, and all parties on the portfolio committee except the DA agreed on this name.
The name that we put before this House to recommend to the President to appoint in the vacancy of Mr Clifford Motsepe, is the name of Ms Noluthando Gosa. We therefore recommend that her name be put before the House so that the President can appoint her in the vacancy which currently exists on the SABC Board. I thank you. [Applause.]
There was no debate.
Question put: That Ms Noluthando Gosa be recommended for appointment to the Board of the South African Broadcasting Corporation.
Ms M R SHINN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 343
Mr S E KHOLWANE
Declarations of vote:
Ms M R SHINN: Deputy Speaker, the SA Broadcasting Corporation, the SABC, is in perpetual crisis. Its board, responsible for rooting out the rot and putting the broadcaster on a recovery path, needs appropriately experienced people of considerable backbone, integrity and ability, and with a commitment to hard work. There is no room for passengers or the workshy who cannot pull their weight when the going gets tough, which is the basic environment at the SABC.
The current board, when viewed as a whole, lacks financial skills. It has an adequate supply of people with media experience, regulatory knowledge and basic business skills, but there is a gap in finance. The DA objects to Ms Gosa's appointment, in part because she was not the most appropriately qualified candidate we interviewed. For example, a forensic auditor was rejected in her favour. Her expertise is in media and property investment, and I am sure she is valued in that environment.
Ms Gosa has served on the SABC board before. She was there from 2003 to 2005. She resigned before her term expired, because, she said, she could not tolerate the corruption and inefficiency of the corporation. Well, what has changed? How do we know that she will last the course this time?
She also told the committee of her close working relationship with the ANC, and wondered aloud whether this could be interpreted as a conflict of interest and bar her from being considered. It seems not. It has proved to be the final stamp of approval by the majority of the committee.
Besides the skill and corruption woes, the SABC is riddled with political infighting. It does not need an ANC heavyweight on the board. It needs independent minds that are totally focused on turning the SABC into a world-class broadcaster serving the needs of all South Africans. It does not need another ANC pal.
Continued deployment of inappropriately skilled ANC cadres condemns these state entities to repeatedly fail to deliver on their mandates. And yet this House, by approving these appointments, supports this insanity. It is time hon colleagues realised that they cannot continue to criticise nonperformance of state entities if they are responsible for choosing inappropriate people to govern them. The DA does not support Ms Gosa's appointment.
Mrs J D KILIAN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 343
Ms M R SHINN
Mrs J D KILIAN: Deputy Speaker, Cope will support the nomination contained in the Report before us today. We believe that the process was fair, transparent and objective, and it conformed to the law.
But, unfortunately the same tendency has emerged in this process, namely that senior state officials in the communications sector, in state-owned entities also, nominated one other and friends to serve on the SABC Board. Another musical chairs exercise.
This is not ideal, Deputy Speaker. Although it is not contravening any law, respectable leaders from all walks of life should be called upon to make a contribution by making themselves available to serve on the SABC Board – people with experience and knowledge of directing institutions so that they achieve service excellence and profitability.
For as long as SABC and Independent Communications Authority of SA, Icasa, nominations are regarded as being for the select few with close connections to the ANC, this will unfortunately not happen. We need to ensure that good governance practice is instilled in the SABC.
However, Cope is satisfied that Ms Gosa will bring quality leadership to the Board, after her experience in the National Planning Commission.
The current reality is unfortunately that the SABC has still not overcome its financial woes, and it is still plagued by very serious challenges, including a lack of effective systems to root out fraud and corruption. Due appointment procedures also still seem to remain a challenge.
An additional and growing concern is political manipulation and interference with the news editorial policy, which leads to the freezing out of opposition parties, in particular Cope. News reporters are indeed complaining about this. This is against the law, and a matter that the board should regard as a high priority.
Irrespective of party preferences of individual board members and the SABC executive, they have a duty to serve the nation as a whole. By law they are compelled to, and I quote – "ensure plurality of news, views and information ... ". This is in section 2 of the Broadcasting Act. It must also service the needs of all South Africans. Its news service must be accurate, fair and impartial –section 6 of the Broadcasting Act.
We trust that Ms Gosa will understand that as a Board member she is compelled to be committed to the above, and also to the principles of openness and accountability.
That brings me to the serious financial woes that are still plaguing the SABC. Deputy Speaker, it is completely unacceptable that there is still no bid adjudication committee functioning, three years after the Auditor-General exposed huge losses and financial corruption. This is a weakness that can create further opportunities for tender manipulation and fraud. This is unacceptable, and she must address that. Thank you, Deputy Speaker. [Time expired.]
Mr G D SCHNEEMANN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 343
Mrs J D KILIAN
Mr G D SCHNEEMANN: Deputy Speaker, there are a couple of things that I would like to raise. Firstly, when we as a committee looked at the current composition of the SABC Board, one of the things that was extremely noticeable was that the current SABC Board is largely male-dominated. So, that is one of the things that we looked at, the issue of gender representivity.
During the interviews we found that out of the five candidates that we interviewed, Ms Noluthando Gosa was one that came across exceptionally well. In fact, when we sat down as parties initially to discuss possible candidates that we would bring to the National Assembly, all parties mentioned the name of Ms Noluthando Gosa. So I thought that I should just make that clear right now.
However, Ms Noluthando Gosa is not being nominated only because she is a woman. She is being nominated – we nominated her and I think most of the parties agree, except for the DA, of course – because we agree that she has the qualities and she has the skills. If we look at her curriculum vitae, she has the necessary degrees in various areas of competency that we are needing in the SABC.
I think she has also proved herself to be a person of principle. The fact that she resigned from the SABC Board – because, as she told us, she could not tolerate and support the levels of corruption – I think shows that she is a person of principle. She was prepared to give up her position. [Interjections.]
Also, if she, in fact, does get to serve on the SABC Board, she will bring with her the experience that she gained from having been a serving SABC Board member. She brings an understanding and a knowledge of some of the things that are required.
Yes, if she is indeed appointed to the board, we would want to encourage her to serve her full term, and to stand by the principles that she has already indicated to us are the reasons why she resigned in the first place.
I want to say that as a Parliament here, if we all unanimously support the name of Ms Noluthando Gosa, we will be sending out a very clear and serious message about our support for gender representivity in our country.
I want to make an appeal ... [Interjections.]. No, no, no. I want to make an appeal to the DA at this late stage – that you change your position, and that you reconsider your opposition to this particular candidate. Thank you very much.
Question agreed to (DA dissenting).
Ms Noluthando Gosa accordingly recommended for appointment to the Board of the South African Broadcasting Corporation.
Mrs Y R BOTHA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 344
Mr G D SCHNEEMANN
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT – RECOMMENDATION OF CANDIDATES TO SERVE ON CENTRAL DRUG AUTHORITY BOARD
Mrs Y R BOTHA: Hon Deputy Speaker, the Central Drug Authority, CDA, is a statutory body established in terms of the Prevention and Treatment of Drug Dependency Act, Act No 20 of 1992, as amended.
Its functions are to give effect to the National Drug Master Plan, NDMP, in accordance with the guidelines set out therein; it can also to advise the Minister on any matter affecting the abuse of drugs referred to the CDA by the Minister for advice; it may advise the Minister on any matter on which the CDA considers it necessary; and it may plan, co-ordinate and promote measures relating to the prevention and combating of the abuse of drugs and the treatment of persons dependent on drugs in accordance with the NDMP.
In terms of section 2(3) of the Act, the parliamentary committees for Social Development in the National Assembly and the National Council of Provinces were tasked to shortlist and interview candidates, and submit recommendations to the Minister of Social Development for the purpose of appointing suitable candidates to serve on the CDA.
I now wish to refer to the members of the subcommittee panel. A subcommittee was formed, and it was constituted of eight members – four representative members each of the Portfolio Committee on Social Development and the Select Committee on Social Services. We interviewed 23 candidates – we had shortlisted 24 candidates, but one candidate withdrew.
As a committee, we are unanimously recommending the following candidates: Mr C P Ucko, Prof D Stein, Ms A M Salter, Mr M M Gama, Dr R Eberlein, Mr D Bayever, Dr L Silva, Mr C Mpyane, Dr M Manyedi, Mr J Kruger, Mrs C Du Toit and Mrs S Ndlovu. [Interjections.]
The portfolio committee recommends that the House, in accordance with the Prevention and Treatment of Drug Dependency Act, agree that these names should be sent to the Minister for approval. Thank you.
There was no debate.
Mr M WATERS
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 344
Mrs Y R BOTHA
Declaration of vote:
Mr M WATERS: Deputy Speaker, the DA supports the nomination of the new Central Drug Authority Board, and wishes them all the best in the forthcoming term. I would also like to thank all members on the committee for their co-operation. We have certainly put political differences aside for the betterment of the country.
The board play an important role in the fight against substance abuse. Apart from advising the Minister on substance abuse matters, they must also ensure that the NDMP is implemented.
One of the frustrations experienced by the previous board was that many departments that are obliged to submit their own mini-drug master plans, such as the Department of Basic Education, failed to do so on time or failed to do so completely. The board were found to be powerless and toothless in this regard. If departments fail to meet basic deadlines, then the fight against substance abuse is undermined from the very start.
In addition, the board have consistently submitted their annual reports to Parliament late, resulting in limited oversight. An example is that the board still have not appeared before the portfolio committee to account for last year's annual report.
The DA has high expectations of the new board and we believe that the mix of academics and activists that have been appointed will take the board and its influence to new heights. Departments that have in the past simply ignored the board will be in for a great wake-up call. We expect the board to be the voice of the voiceless in combating substance abuse, for in failing to do so we will be failing the youth of our country. I thank you very much. [Applause.]
Question agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
Mrs Y R BOTHA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 345
Mr M WATERS
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT – ANNUAL REPORT FOR 2010-11 OF SA SOCIAL SECURITY AGENCY, SASSA
Mrs Y R BOTHA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. The Portfolio Committee on Social Development deliberated on the 2010-11 annual report of the SA Social Security Agency, Sassa. This report presents some of the key achievements, as well as challenges, encountered by Sassa. The report also highlights matters of concern raised by the committee.
In regard to the annual report, there were key priorities that were presented to the committee and these were also reflected in the report. They were: customer care-centred benefits administration and management system; improved organisational capacity; comprehensive and integrated social security administration; and management services.
The agency received an unqualified audit opinion for the year under review, and it had a disclaimer opinion for the 2009-10 financial year. So, there has been a definite improvement.
In regard to the committee's observations, the committee commended Sassa for the unqualified report.
However, it drew attention to the Auditor-General's remarks that a number of grant beneficiary files requested when they did the regulatory audit were not presented. Furthermore, numerous files presented by Sassa did not contain the necessary information that is required to form the basis for a valid grant payment.
The committee further noted with concern the existing dual accountability between the Department of Social Development and Sassa for the flow of funds, which resulted in the department's receiving an unqualified audit report in the previous financial years.
The committee further noted that the department would strengthen its oversight over Sassa by developing an internal audit process and financial inspections. This is critical to ensure that the department strengthens its governance over its entities.
We expressed our satisfaction with the improvement of Sassa's audit report, from the disclaimer to a qualified audit opinion.
We therefore recommend that the issue of dual accountability between the Department of Social Development and the SA Social Security Agency should be addressed, so as to clarify the problem of accountability for the flow of funds.
The audit committees of the department and Sassa should meet on a regular basis to monitor and review internal control and systems, and recommend improvements with regard to them.
The department and Sassa should also ensure that there is a skills transfer from contractors to Sassa employees, so that there will be sustained effective functioning of Sassa.
We also noted that Sassa had been paying the Special Investigation Unit, SIU, R3 million monthly since its inception to conduct investigations on fraud and corruption with regard to social grants. This is very costly and the committee therefore recommends that the department should fast-track and finalise the establishment of an inspectorate for social assistance that is provided for in the Social Assistance Act, Act 13 of 2004, so that Sassa can conduct its own investigations to save costs.
Mrs M T KUBAYI: Deputy Speaker, I move on behalf of the Chief Whip of the Majority Party:
That the report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
Mrs Y R BOTHA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 345
Mrs M T KUBAYI
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT – ANNUAL REPORT FOR 2010-11 OF NATIONAL DEVELOPMENT AGENCY, NDA
Mrs Y R BOTHA: Thank you, hon Deputy Speaker. The Portfolio Committee on Social Development, having considered and deliberated on the 2010-11 annual report of the National Development Agency, NDA, looked at the report very critically. As we know, the committee, as part of exercising its oversight function, received a briefing from the NDA on its performance.
The NDA is a Schedule 3 Public Entity, established in terms of section 2 of the National Development Agency Act, Act 108 of 1998. Its primary mandate is to contribute to the eradication of poverty and its causes, by granting funds to civil society organisations for the purpose of carrying out projects or programmes aimed at meeting the development of poor communities, and strengthening the institutional capacity of other civil society organisations involved in direct service provision to poor communities.
In regard to the committee's observations, we have noted that there is a need for the NDA to refocus its strategic objectives and align them with the mandate of the Department of Social Development and government priorities. This would change the perception of the NDA as being solely a poverty alleviation entity. The mandate of the NDA should be expanded to include early childhood development programmes, as it had already focused on that in the previous financial year.
It further noted that the budget of the NDA had been reduced to R33 million. It thus advised that the agency should have revised its strategic plan to reflect the changes in the budget, and set new targets to avoid discrepancies in reporting on the initial strategic plan and the achievements.
It also noted that the NDA took a decision to ring-fence the funding for capacity building of projects, as capacity building is important to ensure that projects are sustainable and are also able to source funding.
The committee made the following recommendation: that the NDA should consider awarding funding to projects based on poverty levels, instead of population size, as it had been doing. This would enable projects in provinces where there are high poverty levels to receive funding. Thank you, Deputy Speaker.
Mrs M T KUBAYI: Deputy Speaker, I move on behalf of the Chief Whip of the Majority Party:
That the report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
Mr M R SONTO
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 346
Mrs M T KUBAYI
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ENTERPRISES – OVERSIGHT VISIT TO STATE-OWNED COMPANIES FROM 5 TO 8 JUNE 2012
Mr M R SONTO: Deputy Speaker, in adopting its strategic plan earlier this year, the Portfolio Committee on Public Enterprises identified Eskom's capacity expansion programme as one of the key focus areas for its oversight programme. In June the committee undertook an oversight visit to Eskom's power stations, namely Medupi, Kusile and Duvha. Based on the committee's observation and interaction with Eskom's project management teams in all three power stations, we noted that the main power stations under construction were on track, and both projects were within schedule.
The first unit at Medupi is scheduled to be commissioned in 2013, whilst the last unit is scheduled for commissioning by 2015. On completion, this station will add to the national grid about 4 788 MW of capacity.
The same can be said of the construction of Kusile Power Station. The first unit is planned for commercial operation in 2014 and the last unit will be in commercial operation by 2018. On completion, Kusile Power Station will add about 4 800 MW to the national grid.
The Duvha Power Station was operating at full capacity, except for Unit 4, which was reported to have exploded and been partly decommissioned after it failed an over-speed limit test. The incident took place on 9 February 2011, but the committee was assured that the rebuilding process was under way in order to return the unit to service.
The committee noted the recent protest strike by workers at the construction site in Medupi, but is pleased that the matter was quickly resolved, before it got out of control. We as the committee are happy that order has been restored and that work has resumed.
The committee also met with Transnet's Second Defined Benefit Fund and was happy with the progress made so far.
The committee also met with South African Express, and it was less satisfied with their financial reporting system, following their withdrawal of the entity's 2010-11 financial report after its being tabled in Parliament. We support the action taken by the Minister to dissolve the board.
On behalf of the committee, I table this report for consideration by Parliament. I thank you.
There was no debate.
Mrs M T KUBAYI: Deputy Speaker, I move on behalf of the Chief Whip of the Majority Party:
That the Report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
Mr L T LANDERS
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 346
Mrs M T KUBAYI
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT – WITHHOLDING OF REMUNERATION OF MAGISTRATE M TYULU
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT – SUSPENSION FROM OFFICE OF MAGISTRATE M TYULU
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT – SUSPENSION FROM OFFICE OF MAGISTRATE N E NDAMASE
Mr L T LANDERS: Deputy Speaker, the Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development presents the cases of two magistrates. The portfolio committee recommends to this House that the National Assembly confirms the removal from office as magistrate of Magistrate Mr M Tyulu and Magistrate Ms N E Ndamase and that the salary of Mr Tyulu be withheld.
When magistrates are accused of wrongdoing or unlawful activities, the matter is referred to the Magistrate's Commission where these magistrates are expected to appear and to answer to charges brought against them.
In the case of Mr Tyulu, he was found guilty of the sexual harassment of a female accused in a criminal matter before him. To compound matters, Mr Tyulu already had a previous disciplinary record hanging over him.
In the case of Ms Ndamase, she was found guilty on 11 charges of misconduct, ranging from contraventions of the Code of Conduct for Magistrates, negligence in carrying out her duties and absenteeism, to refusal to execute lawful orders.
The Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development is satisfied that in both these cases due process has been followed; hence our recommendation that these two be removed from office as magistrates. We ask this House's approval and confirmation of this decision. Thank you.
There was no debate.
Question put: That the Report of the Committee be adopted and the withholding of remuneration of Magistrate M Tyulu be approved.
Question agreed to.
Report adopted and withholding of remuneration of Magistrate M Tyulu accordingly approved.
Question put: That the Report of the Committee be adopted and the removal from office of Magistrate M Tyulu be confirmed.
Question agreed to.
Report adopted and removal from office of Magistrate M Tyulu accordingly approved.
Question put: That the Report of the Committee be adopted and the removal from office of Magistrate N E Ndamase be confirmed.
Question agreed to.
Report adopted and removal from office of Magistrate N E Ndamase accordingly approved.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 347
Mr L T LANDERS
Consideration of INTERIM REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON HIGHER EDUCATION AND TRAINING – request for permission in terms of rule 249(3)(b) to inquire into amending other provisions of higher education Act, ACT 101 of 1997
There was no debate.
Question put: That permission be given to the Portfolio Committee on Higher Education and Training to inquire into amending other provisions of Higher Education Act, Act 101 of 1997.
Question agreed to.
Permission accordingly granted to the Portfolio Committee on Higher Education and Training into amending other provisions of Higher Education Act, Act 101 of 1997, in terms of Rule 249(3)(b).
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 347
request for permission in terms of rule 249(3)(b) to inquire into amending other provisions of higher education Act
UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE – MR K B MANAmela's statement
(Ruling)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! Hon members, as I said, that was the last item. Before I conclude, let me say that you will remember that during question time on Wednesday, 15 August 2012 two points of order were put requesting the presiding officer to make a ruling on the use of unparliamentary language by members of this House. The first point of order was put by hon Kalyan. The hon member requested that the presiding officer rule out of order a statement by hon Manamela, who said, according to the Hansard, that:
The second aspect is that the DA has no right to speak about violence during strikes because they are the ones who went to incite violence in front of Cosatu House.
I undertook to study the Hansard. Having had an opportunity to do so, I wish to rule as follows.
Rule 63, which deals with offensive or unparliamentary language, is a broadly framed rule that allows the presiding officer to take into consideration the context and tone of a particular remark or inference. The rule has been elucidated by years of established practice and convention.
Hon Manamela's statement clearly reflected on a political party and not on the character of a particular member of this House. A reflection on a political party, as perceived by a member of another party, is not out of order, as long as the member in question did not cast aspersions on the character of members of this House.
The approach I have taken is consistent with previous rulings by presiding officers of this House, that held that reference to a political party in this manner is not out of order. I therefore rule that the statement by hon Manamela was not unparliamentary. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 347
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE – MR A P Van Der Westhuizen's statement
(Ruling)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon members, the second point of order was put by the Minister of Higher Education and Training, who referred to a statement by hon Van der Westhuizen to the effect that:
We also believe that the government, when dealing with Cosatu, should require Cosatu to discipline its members to stop inciting violence, to respect the laws of this country and to respect human life, even when their majority status as a labour union comes under threat.
The Minister requested that it be declared unparliamentary.
Having studied the Hansard, I wish to rule as follows.
Taking into account my earlier ruling about reflections on political parties not being out of order, and having due regard for the fact that Cosatu is not a political party represented in this House, I find that hon Van Der Westhuizen's remarks did not cast aspersions on the character of any member of this House and can thus not be ruled unparliamentary.
Having said that, I would like to urge members, as other presiding officers have done previously, to refrain from making inflammatory, divisive and unsubstantiated statements in the House.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 347
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE – PHRASE, "SO-CALLED COPE", OF MINISTER OF JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOMENT
(Ruling)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! Hon members, on 22 August 2012, during a reply to a question, the Minister of Justice and Constitutional Development said:
I think the so-called Cope is dancing to the tune of the smear campaign against Adv Nomgcobo Jiba.
Subsequently, hon Kganare rose on a point of order and asked whether it was parliamentary for the hon Minister to refer to Cope, which is a political party elected to this Parliament, as the "so-called" Cope. Having now had an opportunity to study the unrevised Hansard, I wish to rule as follows.
The test of a genuine point of order is whether the Chair can actually rule on it because it relates to the rules and practice of the House. Therefore, in this instance the question is whether the phrase is acceptable parliamentary language, or not. The expression is not unparliamentary as it is a point of debate.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 347
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE – "GANGSTER" STATEMENT BY Deputy Minister of police
(Ruling)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! Hon members, the next point of order was in the same debate and was raised by hon McGluwa. It was whether the Deputy Minister of Police was implying that the DA was friends with gangsters, when she said:
Abona bantu bazaziyo izigebenga ukuba zihlala phi yiDA ngoba uMEC weDA uneengxoxo azibiza ngokuba zii-peace accords apho ahlala khona neenkokeli ze-gangsters, bezama iindlela zokufikelela kwisivumelwano ekulweni le nto. Ngoko ke oyena mntu uzaziyo izigebenga nguDA, makazibuze pha ku-MEC Dan Plato. (Translation of IsiXhosa paragraph follows.)
The DA are the ones who know where the criminals are because their MEC organises meetings, which he calls "peace accords", in which he sits with gangster leaders trying to arrive at a solution to fight gangsterism. Therefore, the DA are the ones who know who the criminals are. Ask the MEC, Mr Dan Plato.
The reference is to the interaction of the DA with gangsters. We have consistently ruled that references to a party are not unparliamentary, even when those same references may have been unparliamentary if they had been directed specifically at a member of this House.
A distinction should therefore be drawn between allusions directed at members and expressions of opinion and belief in relation to political parties. Such views or opinions against political parties are regarded as part of generally acceptable political discourse. The statement is therefore not unparliamentary.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
Thursday, 20 September 2012 Take: 347
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
Lonmin mine – minister of mineral resources
(Ruling)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! Hon members, there is one last ruling that I have to make. That ruling is on the Lonmin debate and the hon Minister of Mineral Resources. My ruling at present is that I must not give this particular ruling now, because I am concerned that the Minister is not here. In most cases, if you want action to be taken, you cannot give a ruling if the person is not present. Therefore, I appeal for the hon Lekota to be patient. I will give that ruling when we come back to the House. Thank you very much.
The House adjourned at 16:42.
Audio
No related
Documents
No related documents