Hansard: NCOP: Committees / Oversight
House: National Council of Provinces
Date of Meeting: 02 Aug 2012
Summary
No summary available.
Minutes
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 143
FRIDAY, 3 AUGUST 2012
PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
__________________________________
The Council met at 09:33.
The Deputy Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): I hope you have been able to log in, but those who have problems logging in should tell us so that they can get help. There are quite a few members who are not able to log in. Could we have people to assist us? In the case of special members, there will be assistance. You might not be able to log in, but you will be told how to proceed. Could we proceed?
ANNOUNCEMENT: The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela)
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 143
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela)
AGREEMENT THAT THERE WILL NOT BE ANY NOTICES OF MOTION
(Announcement)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Order! Let me also announce that we have agreed, together with the Whips, that there will be no notices of motion except for the motion on the Order Paper.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 143
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela)
AD HOC COMMITTEE TO ENQUIRE INTO ALLEGED CONDUCT OF HON D B FELDMAN
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Deputy Chair, I move the draft resolution printed in my name on the Order Paper, as follows:
That the Council establish an ad hoc committee in terms of Rule 160 of the Council to inquire into the alleged conduct of the hon D B Feldman during the parliamentary delegation visit to India, from 7 July to 14 July 2012, the committee to -
consist of the following hon members: Mr B A Mnguni, Ms M G Boroto, Ms N W Magadla, Ms E C van Lingen, Prince M M M Zulu and Mr S H Plaatjie; exercise the powers in Rule 103 that may assist it in carrying out its task; report to the Council upon completion of this task; and Mr B A Mnguni to chair the disciplinary committee that will consider the matter.Question put: That the motion be agreed to.
IN FAVOUR: Eastern Cape, Free State, Gauteng, KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo, Mpumalanga, Northern Cape, North West, Western Cape.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
Mr W F FABER: Madam Chair, may I just ask a question to get clarity on the motion you have put? You referred to this committee as a committee for a disciplinary hearing. My understanding is that it is a committee of inquiry, and not necessarily a committee for a disciplinary hearing. Could you clarify this for us, hon Chairperson?
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Hon Chief Whip, could you clarify again the duties of the people who have been chosen to look into the matter of the hon Feldman?
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Their duty is to consider what happened and follow up with the normal disciplinary processes as is done elsewhere. This is how Parliament works when there is something against a member. You do not just find a person guilty or not guilty. A process has to be followed. So we are following that process. If this matter is to do with the particular members that have been submitted, then what is the question?
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Hon member, could you repeat your question?
Mr W F FABER: Hon Chairperson, you remarked that it was a disciplinary committee. When the motion was put, it was put as if was a committee of inquiry. There is a distinct difference between the two. I just want the process to start in the proper fashion by ensuring that the mandate of the committee is the right one. I do not have a problem with the names that have been submitted. I need clarity on whether it is a commission, or a committee of inquiry, or a disciplinary committee.
Mr D V BLOEM: Deputy Chair, I was consulted in the process of putting this committee together. From Cope's side I know exactly what the mandate of the committee is, and I promise the House that the hon Feldman will co-operate with this committee. Thank you very much. [Interjections.]
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Hon members! [Interjections.] Hon members! Whether this is a disciplinary committee or not, this matter has been explained and a decision has been taken.
FIRST AND SECOND SUBJECTS FOR DISCUSSION / LMM/ARM (Edited) / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 144
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL
OUTCOMES OF THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT WEEK – 31 JULY TO 3 AUGUST 2012: ACCELERATING SERVICE DELIVERY AND ADDRESSING CHALLENGES THROUGH EFFECTIVE CO-OPERATIVE GOVERNANCE
AND
PROVINCIAL WEEK REPORT – 16 APRIL TO 20 APRIL 2012: OPERATION CLEAN AUDIT 2014: ADVANCING OUR COLLECTIVE EFFORTS TO STRENGTHEN OUR MUNICIPALITIES TO DELIVER QUALITY SERVICES TO OUR PEOPLE
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Deputy Chair, hon permanent and special delegates, representatives of the SA Local Government Association, Salga, distinguished guests, thank you for this opportunity to participate in the debate which has been organised to deal specifically with local government matters today.
Let me start by congratulating our team of athletes participating in the 2012 London Olympics, and who have so far collected three gold medals. [Applause.] Surely, there will be more to come, given the fact that the likes of Caster Semenya are still to compete. Remember, gold belongs to South Africa. May God be with our team. We need to exceed our expectations this time around. Also, as we start August, the Women's Month, I wish to salute the women of our country and wish them well. Wathinta'abafazi, wathint'imbokodo! Malibongwe! [You strike a woman, you strike a rock. Let's praise the women.]
The COUNCIL MEMBERS: Igama lamakhosikazi! [Praise to be women.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: The appreciation of the need to focus on local government is not a new development in the history of the National Council of Provinces. In the third Parliament, the National Council of Provinces expressly articulated the need for the oversight work to be biased towards assisting local government. Programme 2009, in particular, if you remember well, was done together with Salga. The document states the following:
It is therefore imperative that the leadership of the National Council of Provinces and Salga should engage each other with a view to clarify further the role that Salga must play in the NCOP and the role that the NCOP must play to assist local government.
While these intentions were good at the time, there was, however, no sufficient impetus to drive these aspirations to a point of a clear programme of action. It is for this reason that I wish to thank the new leadership of Salga for taking advantage of our quest to see the association playing a far more meaningful role in the National Council of Provinces. Just look how wonderful it is: all 10 seats are occupied today. [Applause.] Look at the gallery; they are also there. [Applause.]
The leadership you have shown in this regard suggests that you are in agreement with the fact that the principles of co-operative government are a constitutional covenant. They are binding on all of us and they oblige all spheres of government to work together towards the betterment of the lives of the masses of the people of South Africa.
The formal representation of Salga in the NCOP makes this House the only institution, within our constitutional construct, that brings representatives of the three spheres of government under one roof. This is important, given that our government is constituted as national, provincial and local spheres of government, which are distinctive, interdependent and interrelated.
On our part, we are committed to ensuring that initiatives, such as Local Government Week, become a permanent feature on the annual calendar of the National Council of Provinces. This will help us to collectively monitor the interventions which we make and to see whether they are yielding the desired results.
The idea of a permanent Local Government Week will also help us to process some of the issues we picked up during our oversight work, such as those contained in the Provincial Week Report of 16 April to 20 April 2012 under the theme: Operation Clean Audit 2014 - Advancing our collective effort to strengthen our municipalities to deliver quality services to our people that we are considering today. But, most importantly, our deliberations during Local Government Week will inform the content of our oversight work going forward, because that is important. I think we have now found each other in terms of how to deal with the issues together. The one thing that I normally repeat whenever I participate in a debate in the National Council of Provinces is, as you would remember, that we are not in competition with one another; rather, we complement each other in whatever we are doing: whether you are in government or whether you are in the legislature, the important thing that we should realise is that we complement each other; that we are not competing with each other because we want to be successful as a country.
The importance of promoting co-operatives governance, as we seek to accelerate service delivery, is clearly outlined in the White Paper on Local Government which states the following:
No country today can effectively meet its challenges unless the components of government function as a cohesive whole. This involves, of course, collectively harnessing all public resources behind common goals and within a framework of mutual support; developing a cohesive, multisectoral perspective on the interests of the country as a whole and respecting the discipline of national goals, policies and operating principles; co-ordinating their activities to avoid wasteful competition and costly duplication; utilising human resources effectively; settling disputes constructively without resorting to costly and time-consuming litigation; rationally and clearly dividing between them the roles and responsibilities of government, so as to minimise confusion and maximise effectiveness.
What this simply means is that all spheres of government have a responsibility to act collectively. It is not surprising, therefore, with regard to the above-mentioned imperatives for co-operative government, that this week's engagement has been significant. In particular, if we look at the fact that during the Local Government Week seminar, there was, firstly, there was strong appreciation of the fact that local government needs to be supported and strengthened by the national and provincial governments. However, the question that we still need to ask is whether these two spheres themselves are adequately capacitated to provide that support.
Secondly, it was also clear that there is a need to examine, as legislators, the impact that national legislation has on improving or constraining delivery by municipalities. It seems that some of the laws and regulations do not take into account the differentiated nature of our municipalities and differences in complexities; hence the argument that we cannot have a one-size-fits-all scenario. This matter was raised during the meeting between President Zuma and mayors in Khayelitsha in October 2009.
Thirdly, Local Government Week has assisted the National Council of Provinces tremendously in understanding the real challenges that are facing municipalities broadly, not just from the point of view of interacting with certain municipalities, for example the issues of overregulation and municipal management systems. Fourthly and on the other hand, municipalities have had an opportunity to hear what their counterparts in the National Council of Provinces have been raising with national Ministers as part of their oversight function.
Fifthly, it is also clear that there is a great need to improve communication among the leaders in the different spheres of government and for there to be appreciation of one another's context if we are to promote co-operation in the delivery of services to the people of South Africa.
Sixthly and most importantly, we need to improve the capacity of the state to plan and manage projects, especially in light of our national infrastructure programme. It was said during the seminar, for instance, that water and infrastructure are becoming constraints to development.
The issue of capacity to roll out infrastructure is very important. For example, according to estimates by the National Treasury, R178 billion was spent of a planned R260 billion for infrastructure. In other words, only 68% of that budget was spent for 2010-11. This is due to capacity challenges in planning and the management of capital projects. This needs to improve if we are to realise our future goals, especially if we want to see more South Africans employed. I am not referring to local government only. The total amount I am talking about affects all three spheres of government.
Hon members, as the National Council of Provinces, we must commit ourselves to following up on the issues that have been raised in our interactions with Salga and other leadership formations this week. The hon Tau, the hon Magadla and the presiding officer's committees would remember that we have taken a very clear decision that we will now release two full weeks every quarter for oversight function to make sure that these things are happening on the ground. This is critical. [Applause.] Now, when you count that, we are actually releasing however many weeks. We have four quarters in a year, times that by two, and it gives you eight weeks that we will be on the ground doing oversight work. We invite Salga to join us, and we will plan together with them.
It is important that as we grapple with the challenges we face at this point in our democracy, we remember that we have a vision to achieve by 2030. The means to achieve this vision are contained in the National Development Plan, the NDP, that seeks to:
Build an economy that is more inclusive, more dynamic and in which the fruits of growth are shared equitably. It envisages an economy that serves the needs of all South Africans – rich and poor, black and white, skilled and unskilled, those with capital and those without, urban and rural, women and men.
William Ernest Henley wrote in his poem Invictus:
It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishments the scroll.
I am the master of my fate:
I am the captain of my soul.
Indeed, as this collective, it matters not the challenges we face. We are the custodians of the interests of our people. I commend that the House debate the deliberations of the Salga Week and approve what we discussed. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Cllr T MANYONI /AZM MNGUNI/VM / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 145
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP
Cllr T MANYONI (Salga): Hon Deputy Chairperson, hon Chairperson of the NCOP, hon MPs, hon members of provincial legislatures, hon chair of the provincial house of traditional leaders, the national executive committee of Salga, ladies and gentlemen, let us take this moment to dedicate this little talk to Charlotte Maxeke, because it is August and Women's Month.
Charlotte Maxeke became the first black women to receive a Bachelor of Science degree in South Africa. [Applause.] She became the first black woman to lead an Anti-Pass Campaign. She led that march in the municipality that I inherited, Bloemfontein. Charlotte Maxeke is a woman who is well known as the mother of freedom and democracy in this country.
It is those kinds of people who have laid the foundation, so we cannot fail today. Basically, we must work in a manner that, if they look upon us, they can say, even if it was difficult, that at least they tried their best.
The Local Government Week is a platform that we deemed necessary for progress and development in local government. Salga duly acknowledges and appreciates the partnership we have with the NCOP. As I indicated yesterday, we must thank the NCOP for recognising the need for this initiative and for duly facilitating the process. We welcome the participation of the executive and the quality of the interaction between the legislature and the executive of the three spheres on matters affecting local government.
We debated five key issues that we believe are critical to shift the development path of municipalities for the better. Indeed, the following requires specific attention.
Firstly, regarding sound policy and a legislative framework to accelerate service delivery, we agree that we need to look into legislation and, in particular, the National Treasury's circulars that are sometimes considered as laws. We also need to look into National Treasury's Minimum Competency Regulations that will be effective on 1 January 2013 and their relationship with the Department of Co-operative Governance's conditions of service for senior manager regulations. We also need to look into the Local Government: Municipal Systems Amendment Act, as well as the Monitoring, Support and Intervention Bill that is forthcoming.
Our recommendation in this regard is that this august House, the NCOP, should assist us through oversight to ensure that national legislation is in harmony and respects the institutional integrity of local government and is consistent with the principles of co-operative government and enables developmental local government.
Secondly, with regard to sustainable human settlements and infrastructure, we recognise that municipalities assumed responsibility for various municipal infrastructure service functions. In some cases, it was already more than 30 years old. The effect of a lack of a policy solution as to how this liability was to be financed is now playing itself out through the increasing collapse of infrastructure in many municipal areas.
We must address these challenges through, among other things, the establishment of a bulk infrastructure fund specifically for maintenance. We need to establish a national geographic information system, GIS, database and national programmes to collect data to manage information on an ongoing basis on the state of municipal infrastructure, starting with priority sectors such as roads, water services and electricity. We can't manage without the right data.
We humbly call upon the NCOP to ensure that, within its mandate, it recommends to the Department of Energy to ensure planning alignment between various electrification projects funding agencies. In this regard, we are requesting that the agency should provide technical support to undercapacitated municipalities, do away with the requirement of 80% occupancy of housing developments before electrification commences, and also to amend the policy to provide the full cost of connections in areas provided by both Eskom and municipalities.
Let us, through oversight, ensure that national government develops an appropriate policy response on sustainable infrastructure development of electricity and water provision at municipal level. In particular, the NCOP should, through oversight, ensure the development of a national approach to enhance co-operation between municipalities and Eskom in order to assist municipalities with revenue collection in areas where Eskom is the electricity provider.
The National Housing Code, as far as it relates to the emergency housing policy, should be amended to remove ambiguities in the policy as far as the roles, powers and functions of municipalities in human settlement developments are concerned.
Thirdly, on sustainable financial management of municipalities, we agree with hon Chairperson Mahlangu that there are many internal issues we can and should resolve as municipalities. However, the following require external support. The perennial issue of unfunded mandates must be resolved. We must also properly cost provision of municipal services, governance and administration functions to inform the review of the Local Government Fiscal Framework, LGFF, including the Local Government Equitable Share, LGES, formula.
There is a need for a comprehensive analysis to be conducted on the nonfinancial performance of conditional grants. We also need to look into appropriate funding arrangements and financing requirements to build the capacity of smaller rural municipalities. There are cases where municipalities, instead of building infrastructure, utilise their funds for salaries. We really need to look into this matter.
We also call upon the NCOP to ensure that, through oversight, local government has an equitable and appropriate fiscal framework in place to deliver on the developmental mandate and accelerate service delivery.
On the role of local government in rural and local economic development, we all accept that municipalities have to play an important role in this regard. In this country, we have just been talking about economic development as municipalities, but we have never properly focused and really dealt with this matter. It is therefore incumbent upon us as municipalities to make the effort and be able to report to this House next time on what we are doing as municipalities when it comes to local economic development and rural development.
Notwithstanding the challenges associated with the planning capacity of some municipalities and the resultant impact on the quality and credibility of some integrated development plans, IDPs, municipal IDPs are still the best tools to co-ordinate and align the various rural development initiatives by both provincial and national spheres of government.
On local economic development, we are recommending that all national policies clarify and acknowledge the role of local government on matters pertaining to local economic development on a differentiated basis. All national economic policies must be accompanied by local government impact assessments. We must assess what impact we have in terms of the Act and the laws that we are putting in place.
We are recommending that National Treasury agree to a local government funding window for the Jobs Fund. We also recommend that the Department of Trade and Industry, DTI, ensure direct consultation with Salga on the Co-operatives Amendment Bill. We are also recommending that National Treasury and DTI address the contradictions in policy that relate to the procurement of local content and targeted procurement. We are also recommending that the Department of Economic Development consider a national policy on informal sector trading. This will obviously be done in consultation with organised local government.
Rural and local economic development policies and strategies must reinforce rather than undermine the potential role of local government. Through consultation and co-operation, we must ensure better co-ordination and engagement with sector departments on developmental policy initiatives. We must ensure that local government is consulted upfront so that it can play a meaningful role in the implementation of effective and innovative development programmes.
Finally, underpinning all these tasks is the need to build the capacity of local government to accelerate service delivery. In this regard, we are saying that where there is political will, administrative performance will follow. As politicians, we must really show interest in our work as leaders at local government level. In that regard, we are also calling upon our sector – which is municipalities – to act in a professional manner when we deliver services. We must also be able to attract and retain professionals to ensure that we deliver quality service. Also, with regard to performance management, an environment of responsiveness, high performance and clear accountability must be created and fostered such that it becomes part of the DNA of local government systems.
The third point is the issue of the culture that is prevailing in municipalities; the culture of a "don't care" attitude that must come to an end. [Interjections.] We need a people-centered culture of service delivery; a customer-comes-first approach to service delivery; a Batho Pele-principled approach to service delivery [Applause.] Some of our workers have no conscience. When they remove rubbish, they leave some along the way and they don't care. Basically, I think we need to start inculcating a culture of service delivery at municipal level.
We further call upon the NCOP to ensure, through oversight, more effective co-ordination of the plethora of capacity-building initiatives through functional intergovernmental relations, IGR, and by insisting on partnerships and stakeholder engagement.
In conclusion, as this week has brought us closer together and we continue to progress, we must demonstrate coherent government by supporting each other in establishing collaborative approaches that will bring us closer to our people. Hearsay is about politics, but governance is about action. And, I think, we must place governance uppermost when it comes to service delivery and hearsay should be last.
The Local Government Week is here and it is here to stay. Through it we must now ensure that the spheres of government support each other and pool resources to maximise our impact. As Salga, we remain committed to continual and more meaningful engagement with the NCOP and provincial legislatures to achieve this.
Looking forward, we must return next year and report positive progress in terms of the challenges we have set ourselves. [Applause.] We firmly believe, now more than ever before, that by working together, service delivery can be accelerated to better the lives of our people. Our foremothers have set the foundation and we cannot fail them. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mrs N W MAGADLA /MS//nvs/// END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 146
Cllr T MANYONI (Salga)
Mrs N W MAGADLA: Hon Deputy Chair of the National Council of Provinces hon T Memela, Chairperson of the NCOP hon M J Mahlangu, MECs present, Salga chairperson Councillor Manyoni and the entire leadership, our Chair of the House of Traditional Leaders present, mayors and councillors from municipalities, members of the provincial legislatures, permanent delegates of the NCOP, special delegates from provinces, ladies and gentlemen, this formal sitting takes place during a significant month in South Africa's political calendar.
Six days from today, on 9 August, we will celebrate the 56th anniversary of National Women's Day. On that day in August 1956, more than 20 000 women from all corners of South Africa marched to the Union Buildings in Pretoria to protest against inequalities in society and discriminatory pass laws.
Even today we are talking about inequalities. The struggles waged by women in the advancement of gender equality and human rights have contributed to what we are witnessing today – women leaders in all spheres of government, organs of state, business and other sectors of society.
One of the great women currently serving in the national sphere of government, and who has made us, the country and the continent proud, is Dr Nkosazana Dlamini-Zuma. [Applause.] [Interjections.] Since the dawn of our democracy in 1994, this daughter of the soil has served our government with distinction in various capacities, and this has resulted in her being voted, on 15 July this year, the first woman ever to become the chairperson of the African Union, AU, since the formation of the AU Commission.
The programmes of the provincial week and that of the inaugural seminar on local government week have provided important opportunities for the NCOP and Salga to focus specifically on issues pertaining to local government, and on the support required by municipalities to discharge their developmental mandate.
The themes of these programmes have become very relevant to the challenges facing the local government sector at this juncture and, coupled with that, both themes have guided deliberations and discussions to be in line with the objectives of our programmes.
By convening these two programmes, particularly the seminar on local government week, we have managed to carry out some of the key strategic resolutions taken at the NCOP Strategic Planning Workshop that was held in January this year – that of enhancing the effective and meaningful participation of Salga in the NCOP, and that of developing a joint strategy with Salga in order to look at issues around the institutional arrangements of municipalities.
We are indeed excited to have brought all the spheres of government and various stakeholders together under one roof through this august seminar in order to address challenges around service delivery and to devise solutions to unblock blockages in service delivery.
One of the major initiatives in the South African transformation landscape over the past 18 years has been the constitutional recognition of local government as a distinct sphere of government, aimed at bringing government closer to the people, and serving as a platform for accelerating improved accessibility of government services.
Other spheres have long been there. It was only local government, which was transformed in 2000. When one comes from local government, one is seen as not being competent enough to do things in other spheres. Local government is the first contact between the citizen and government, making municipalities frontline service institutions.
During these sessions, members raised many critical issues. Some of the key issues raised and discussed ranged from the lack of a co-ordinated approach to support for local government. Co-ordination and support should assist us to better organise the support and capacity-building of municipalities.
Section 88 of the Local Government: Municipal Structures Act, states that a district municipality and a local municipality within the area of that district municipality must co-operate with one another by assisting and supporting each other.
The same section of the Act calls for the MEC for local government to assist a district municipality by providing support for services to a local municipality. A lack of a common vision and of a co-ordinated approach between national and provincial government or departments regarding the supervision of the municipal system, with no clear approach and intervention, are some of the critical factors underlying the state of distress of municipalities.
A good example of co-ordination was best illustrated by the input made by the Tlokwe Municipality during our deliberations. Critical ingredients in the co-ordination chain are: political buy-in by the key stakeholders; involving and keeping the community involved; and constantly supporting and motivating staff that are critical to the process.
It has been reported that many municipalities have indicated that they are experiencing serious challenges with the provision of housing. Although housing is a provincial competence, the impact of the slow provision of housing is experienced at a local level. The Salga chair alluded to that in his speech. There is a need for better alignment between housing and infrastructure conditional grants, in order to facilitate service delivery through an integrated human settlements policy.
The following challenges with housing provision were identified:
poor relations between the traditional leaders and local municipalities which have a negative impact on the delivery of services; and the scarcity of free land for housing delivery in most areas such as rural and urban spaces.
Reported challenges relating to land which were identified include a lack of support for land claims due to poor co-ordination between the Land Claims Commission and municipalities, resulting in the collapse of well-intended initiatives within the province. In addition, the nonavailability of land for township development, especially for evicted farm dwellers, is impacting negatively on service delivery.
Many municipalities cited a lack of development facilitation support from districts to local municipalities in terms of the provision of water and sanitation infrastructure and other sector-based service delivery areas. Clearly, intergovernmental co-ordination is essential for this service to be effective. It again demonstrates that co-ordination cannot be effective without functional clarity and direction as to who is providing and paying for the service, and where it needs to be implemented.
In celebrating 15 years of the NCOP and 100 years of the people's movement, we must redouble our efforts by dedicating our resolve to solving the people's challenges of service delivery in the local sphere of our government. By redoubling our efforts we will be heeding the call made by President Jacob Zuma on 20 August 2009, during his opening address to the presidential meeting with executive mayors and mayors to discuss improving service delivery in municipalities. That was in Khayelitsha, Cape Town, where he demonstrated his commitment to dealing with some of the key challenges that face local government. I thank you, Deputy Chairperson. [Applause.]
Mr J J GUNDA
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 146
Mrs N W MAGADLA
Mr J J GUNDA: Thank you, hon Deputy Chair, hon Chair, hon members, ladies and gentlemen. Indeed, I also thank the chairperson and Salga for initiating this weekend's very important seminar. I hope and trust that it won't be the end and that this forum will take place twice a year.
Local government is the heartbeat of government. It is here where government really meets the needs of the people. One can measure community participation at local government level, no matter how good or bad it is.
Let me also congratulate the Fetakgomo Municipality of Limpopo on a very good presentation, and all municipalities that are trying to do their best under very difficult circumstances, especially the rural and B municipalities.
Afrikaans:
Agb Voorsitter, ons moet nie die belangrike rol van raadslede miskyk nie. Dit is uiters belangrik dat die provinsiale regering, sowel as die nasionale regering, 'n meer doeltreffende rol moet speel in die bystand van munisipaliteite. Dit is baie belangrik dat die provinsiale regering en die nasionale regering ...
English:
Let us assist municipalities by really helping them because it is there where you are going to be judged as a good government.
We need to change the financial legislation with regard to the remuneration of councillors. They need to be treated like public representatives, and be provided with the tools of trade, and benefits like pension and medical aid because, like us, they are also elected and must bear the brunt of the lack of service delivery. [Applause.] We need to change that.
Martin Luther King Jr said:
An individual has not started living until he can rise above the narrow confines of his individualistic concerns to the broader concerns of all humanity. Life's most persistent and urgent question is, what are you doing for others?
Mark Clement said:
Leaders who win the respect of others are the ones who deliver more than they promise, not the ones who promise more than they can deliver.
Hon Chair, members and colleagues, we really need – and here I agree with the chairperson of Salga – that political will must not merely be spoken about, but must be implemented now. We must do it from today, in order to treat the people on the street as our equals. When we need them to vote for us, they are our equals, but when we need to provide services to them, we treat them as if they need to beg for services. Yes, there are good and bad councillors, but we need to take our political will and our leadership very seriously in order to get quality services to our people.
Let me close by saying that this government is a people's government. [Interjections.] This government is responsible for the future of this country. I thank you. [Interjections.] [Applause.]
Mr M H MOKGOBI /TH(Eng&Afr)//nvs(Eng&Afr)///END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 147
Mr J J GUNDA
Mr M H MOKGOBI: Hon Chair, let me acknowledge, first, the Chairperson of Salga and the delegation, our MECs present here, members of legislatures, and people in the public gallery, indeed, it is August and the best thing to do to honour our women is to make local government work better. [Interjections.] [Applause.]
We have just emerged from a forum that was unique and very important. The forum was charged with the task of creating an environment in which our municipalities would be viable. The forum is defined in terms of who attended it. That demonstrates how serious the forum was. We would, indeed, like to thank the NCOP and Salga for initiating this, and that we make a commitment to this forum being an annual event – not only a talk shop – but an annual event at which we report progress made thus far.
The outcome of the forum indeed confirms that municipalities must govern the affairs of the communities and deliver services to our communities. In that context, also, the forum recognised that the national and provincial governments must supervise these municipalities in terms of the existing legislation. The supervision is not necessarily about policing, but that it has an element of intervening in cases in which there are technical challenges, infrastructural challenges and are financial challenges. Therefore, the supervision, which is part and parcel of the support, is not necessarily interference.
In the context of the philosophy and practise of co-operative governance, which has been elaborated on, speaker after speaker confirmed that indeed we needed to intensify our interrelatedness. We need to intensify our interdependence, and also recognise that local government is distinct. This implies that it has its own laws that must be respected because the powers of local government are vested in council, which is unique in terms of our provincial and national governments. Therefore recognition of this distinctedness is very important as we supervise and as we oversee.
Again, in many ways, the forum really expressed that national and provincial support must create an enabling environment. There is a cry that local government is overregulated. There is also a commitment that all those legislatures that have specific obstacles will be looked into.
Therefore as the Cogta committee, the Portfolio Committee on Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs, we recommend that Salga and the NCOP must have programmes of action – and not just talk about it. There must be a programme of action that would identify those challenges and begin to deal with them.
We would also want to see our recommendation in the House. As we recommend, we appeal that the national and provincial departments begin to address those recommendations, precisely because some of the recommendations that we bring to the House are recommendations that seek to assist municipalities to deliver services.
The other issue is the question of interventions in municipalities. We have found that in most cases we would place a municipality under Section 139 of the Constitution, and put in an administrator without resources. Therefore, we need to have dedicated funding so that if, indeed, we want to take a municipality out of the quagmire, there are resources that accompany that type of intervention. Otherwise, we will not be able to solve the problems.
Another issue that was raised was how far we were the Local Government: Municipal Systems Amendment Act, and therefore the issues regarding regulation. If we need to professionalise local municipalities – our municipalities – in which skills are a major factor, the Local Government: Municipal Systems Amendment Act must be fast-tracked in terms of implementation, or the regulations which have been mooted really need to be acted on.
We also need to look into how we debate amongst ourselves. How do we engage between the NCOP and Salga, precisely because in terms of history the event proved to be unique and the first of its own to have the entire leadership of Salga in Parliament. This was long overdue. How then do we engage? This is precisely because we find that in some provinces that we are there as the committee alone and Salga is not there. Salga is not able to take forward the recommendations that come from the municipality.
Now we need to say, as committees, this is the communication that we make both politically and administratively. At times you have a problem in terms of which your communication does not reach the relevant leadership. We also appeal as we go to some provinces that Salga not only send officials. The officials must be accompanied by political leadership, so that on the spot we are able to commit each other to resolving the problems of a municipality. That is very important.
In our view, the forum has created a cordial oversight environment. Gone are be those days when the NCOP would be treated as a big brother. Those days are gone, because now, in terms of our legislation and Constitution, we understand what the role of the NCOP is, what the role of the provinces is, what the role of Salga is, and what the functions of the municipalities are. Therefore, it is an obligation in terms of the Constitution that we need to do oversight. As a result, municipalities will also understand that the NCOP can summon a mayor here, and that therefore that should not be seen as being quarrelsome, because it is a constitutional obligation. It is important that as we proceed, these challenges will no longer be heard about. This will reduce the tension and promote that cordial oversight relationship.
The deliberations in the main have come out with the commitment to creating a viable financial situation in municipalities; to create a spending pattern that will be timeous in municipalities; to make sure that municipalities submit annual financial statements on time; to ensure that the core issue – supply-chain management – is applied correctly, because if you read many sources, it appears as if corruption in some municipalities occurs at that level; and to ensure that as Parliament we engage the Ministers to pay the debt to municipalities because the departments, both in the provinces and nationally, are owed a lot. It is ourselves who create poverty in municipalities. Therefore it is important that we intervene and assist them.
In conclusion, we need to assist with the issue of political leadership. They must be able to make their own decisions and exercise control, to appoint skilled people to municipalities, to be accountable, to make sure that they strengthen the impacts in order to oversee and make executive municipalities accountable; and to ensure that performance management contracts and audit committees are in existence. These are some of the key issues that will ensure that indeed our municipalities are working better and faster. Let us all make a commitment and use the tools that the Presidency, Cogta, Treasury, Salga and the provinces have created in order to ensure that municipalities improve. Amen! [Applause.]
Mrs N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO (Eastern Cape) /Mosa/END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 148
Mr M H MOKGOBI
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO (Eastern Cape): Hon Deputy Chair, hon chairperson, hon permanent delegates of the House, hon special delegates of the House, the Chairperson of Salga, the Salga leadership, all executive mayors, speakers and councillors, I greet you in the name of all the women who braved the hard and oppressive government of the dompasses to give us, women living in the 21st century, a past to be proud of and a future of nonsexism, nonracialism and classlessness.
I greet you from the province that prides itself on being rural, and that has in the past 100 years constantly produced national and international leaders of the calibre of Charlotte Maxeke, Mama Ntutu Mabhala, Lillian Diedericks – who were part of the 1956 march - Albertina Sisulu, Victoria Mxenge, and Adelaide Tambo, to mention but a few.
We pay homage to all the men who stood up against and those who are still standing against women abuse, and the men who support gender equality. When there is a rape, these men say: Not in our name as men. We thank you and appreciate you. [Applause.] We salute the visionary leadership of this august House, the NCOP, as well as Salga for breaking the abstract barriers of the Berlin Wall - referred to by the hon Sizani - to focus on services delivered to the people of this country. We take our hats off to the leadership of the hon Mahlangu in the NCOP and to the hon Manyoni in Salga. [Applause.]
One of the core functions of the parliamentary Houses, apart from executive oversight and public participation, is legislating. As co-operative governance is a constitutional imperative, we need to legislate to compel action from the theory.
As the Eastern Cape, we, first and foremost, wish to applaud the Office of the Auditor-General of South Africa, both at the national and provincial levels. The NCOP provincial visits were graced by our business manager – our own Auditor-General – in the province, Mr Singa Ngqwala, who, throughout the process, took the opportunity to empower our municipalities. This will not only ensure clean audits, but quality services to the people of our province.
Secondly, we welcome the co-operative approach envisaged by this august House as evidenced by this week's theme: Accelerating service delivery and addressing challenges through effective co-operative governance. My emphasis is on the latter part of the theme: "co-operative governance".
South Africa is a unitary state. We therefore cannot afford to have three governments in one state. A protest march against a local government is a protest march against the entire government. Hence, from the planning stages, all spheres of government should earnestly co-operate while working on the relevant legislation that will level co-operation between all spheres.
As a country with a Constitution applauded for being among the best in the world, we have to make it work for ordinary South Africans that we all represent. As a rural province, we appreciate the concept of human settlements and understand it in the following ways. Firstly, as there is still a shortage of houses in the context of human settlements, houses still have to be built and all of us should work together and refuse to underspend in light of the shortage of houses. A case in point is the Cacadu District Municipality, which has a shortage of 11 440 houses in the Kouga Local Municipality, 14 026 in Makana, and 10 026 in the Ndlambe Local Municipality. The catchword is quality houses, as stipulated and envisaged in the Freedom Charter.
The second way in which we understand the concept of human settlements is that of land ownership, especially for women. Thirdly, there is the bridging of the gap caused by the separate development of yesteryear, because, as a province, we are of the view that beautiful houses mean very little if they are detached from the centre of industrial and economic activity.
We put forward to this House that it is possible to create comfort for rural people where they are, through integrated human settlements that will ensure access roads to the most remote areas. Quality infrastructure across rural and urban settings must be equal, as must access to quality education, resourced learning centres, and health and safety.
In our province, the MEC convenes a structure that is referred to as the Munimec, which brings together the leadership of all our municipalities. The hon speaker of our legislature also convenes all our local government speakers in a speakers' forum. As a province we are ready to formalise the co-operation.
In conclusion, the past five days have not only been vibrant and fruitful, but has also been a historic landmark for service delivery in our beloved country. I felt like I was not at an ordinary sitting or lekgotla, but at a people's assembly for real people's power. [Applause.] It has also been historic in bringing together local government, provincial and the national Parliament, including government departments at a very high level. The country's victory is certain if we are united. We dare not falter. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr S H PLAATJIE / EKS/LIM CHECKED / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 149
Ms N ABRAHAM-NTANTISO (Eastern Cape)
Mr S H PLAATJIE: Deputy Chairperson, the thrust and sustainability of a democratic system is citizen satisfaction. Our survival as a people and the growth of the country depend on the protection of our constitutional responsibilities and the safeguarding and defending of our constitutional democracy. The essence in the outcome of the local government week and our prior provincial oversight week in April demonstrate three critical issues, which are: the power of collective responsibility to find alternative solutions in local government; the value of proactivism with the intent to bring about real change; and to ensure real implementation and accountability.
Government has the constitutional mandate to deliver essential services congruent with the needs of the people. To realise this mandate, local government legislation places municipalities at the centre of service delivery and community development. However, citizen involvement and active participation will assist municipalities, legislatures and national Parliament to discharge their responsibilities with prudence and in an effective and transparent manner. The value of public participation is not optimally utilised nor is its potential maximised and incorporated into the processes of governance to ensure the desired change. The themes for the debates coincide with Cope's core principle, which is change for the people, with the people and through the people.
Through scanning the environment in municipalities undoubtedly reveals that party-political factionalism and polarisation do, indeed, contribute to the progressive deterioration of municipal functionality. However, the strategic deployment of municipal managers, as political handymen by the MECs in municipalities, works against the attainment of Clean Audit 2014. A case in point is the North West province.
Evidence has been collected to dramatically illustrate how the political and administrative interface have resulted in factionalism on such a scale that, in some areas, it is akin to a battle over access to state resources, personal empowerment and brotherhood protection, rather than an ideological or political persuasion to make a difference in the life of the poor and vulnerable people who need protection.
The lack of values, principles and ethics to improve wellness in current cases, as highlighted by various demonstrations, and now indicated in the results of performance in municipalities, as per the Auditor-General's report, indicate the sorry state of how we manage that which is entrusted to us. In our communities the central message which the person in the street receives, owing to the current state of governance, indicates that all is not well. There are officials and public representatives for whom public service is not a concern, but whose priority is, rather, accruing wealth at the expense of poor communities.
A culture of patronage, nepotism, protecting the indefensible, political silence or inaction regarding corruption, poor ethical behaviour and bad performance are now so widespread in many municipalities that the formal municipal accountability system is compromised. There is now a lack of citizen confidence and trust in the system. The democratisation of the local sphere, so well envisioned in the White Paper on Local Government of 1998, is now fraught with community frustration over the institutionalisation of systems, poor service delivery and lack of performance.
In conclusion, blind loyalty to fellow political peers' corruption, poor performance and ill discipline cannot be tolerated any longer, as proved by the workshop that was held this week. Furthermore, the citizens of South Africa will always get the short end of the stick if corruption is allowed to flourish. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr C N VAN ROOYEN (Free State) / LITHA//Mia / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 150
Mr S H PLAATJIE
Mr C J VAN ROOYEN (Free State): Hon Chairperson, members, chairperson of Salga, comrades and friends, I was listening to the hon Plaatjie talking about the people and all that ...
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Hon Sinclair, please! Could you allow the debate to continue?
Mr K A SINCLAIR: Okay, Mama.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Ms T C Memela): Thank you. Continue, Sir.
Mr C J VAN ROOYEN (Free State): Deputy Chairperson, he was talking about all the people, but I don't see their people here. I don't know what people he was talking about. [Laughter.]
One of the most innovative programmes introduced by the NCOP is the biannual provincial week. I am sure that you will not find a similar programme in any other country than here in South Africa. It's indeed a very innovative programme. This programme allows provincial and local government to interact in a practical manner. I am of the opinion that it is one of the most successful programmes implemented by the NCOP over the past couple of years.
However, let me first deal with some concerns regarding the provincial week from a provincial perspective. The first issue I want to raise is the co-ordination between the provincial legislature and the NCOP on developing the provincial week programme. Although this has improved, I'm of the opinion it still needs further improvement so as to ensure that the programme benefits both the NCOP and the legislatures.
In the development of the programme there has to be more direct interaction between the NCOP provincial whip, the provincial chair of chairs and the provincial chief whips. The programme must complement each other's objectives in terms of oversight and monitoring. What I am saying is that there is growing improvement, but there still needs to be further improvement.
The second issue I would like to raise – and this is specifically an issue that came up in the Free State – is that some of the opposition parties use the provincial weeks as media campaigns. They are not listening to the people, but, rather, they are playing to the media. They want to see themselves on TV and in the Volksblad the whole time. They therefore do not add any value to the provincial week. [Interjections.] He is sitting there, hon Chairperson. He is sitting there. [Interjections.]
Having said this, the provincial week does have definite and huge benefits for both the NCOP and the provincial legislatures. One important benefit is the opportunity for interaction; the interaction that is created between members of the provincial legislatures and their counterparts in the NCOP. This is intergovernmental relations in practice. A further important benefit is the oversight impact that the provincial weeks have in the provinces.
The theme of the provincial week "Operation Clean Audit 2014" is a very appropriate theme. The report presented and tabled in the House raised some very important issues and concerns. As provincial legislatures, we take these concerns very seriously and, after the tabling of the report in the House, we will follow up on some of these issues. This is an obligation, which must be jointly accepted by the NCOP and the provincial legislatures.
Some of the issues that I think I need to mention and that were in the report include the issue about the water crisis in some of our municipalities, especially in the Masilonyana district. That needs to be addressed. For the benefit of some of the members in this House, let me also mention that strong action has been taken against those officials that were involved in the "Nala scandal", if I could put it that way. As a matter of fact there was a court case yesterday in Bloemfontein on this.
I'm also pleased to announce that the Free State provincial treasury, for the third time in a row, has received a clean audit. I think there are very few provinces that have had that. In addition, the office of the premier also received a clean audit for a second year. I think we should congratulate them.
In addressing some of the challenges raised during the past few days, the following must be considered, namely addressing the challenges of the ineffective use of financial resources and enhancing financial capacity in municipalities. Financial management grants must be directly allocated to provincial governments, to Co-operative Governance & Traditional Affairs, Gogta. In doing so, the effective use of resources will be increased and service providers' contracts can be managed at the provincial government level until the appropriate capacity levels have been achieved in the municipalities.
Further, National Treasury must consider accrediting financial service providers that provide financial management services to municipalities in order to ensure that there is uniformity, high standards and skills transfers. We find that municipalities use some fly-by-night people or groups as consultants. That is why they will never go forward.
There is also a need to address the lack of execution of basic daily and monthly financial management disciplines, such as the five key control areas suggested by the Auditor-General, which all the municipalities have signed for and agreed to. I think they must be contained in National Treasury regulations – and there should be enforcement of these regulations; they must not be treated as just pieces of paper. Also, municipalities must fill all critical posts with competent people.
Over the past three days we have heard some of the challenges municipalities have experienced, but allow me to boast, once again, here today to illustrate the gains we, the ANC, have made since freedom was obtained in 1994, gains which, in most cases, were spearheaded by the municipalities. As the ANC, we accept that we have not fully achieved the goals of the national democratic revolution, but that we have, on the other hand, made tremendous progress in creating a better life for all our citizens.
Let me highlight some of the fruits of our freedom of which all citizens of this country can be proud. Between 1996 and 2010, the population increased by 23%, that is from 40,6 million to 49,9 million. Over the same period, the number of households supplied with electricity for lighting went from 5,2 million to 11,9 million, a staggering increase of 128%. I think it is very important that the people take note of that, especially the opposition. [Applause.] The use of electricity for cooking went up from 4,3 million households to 10,2 million, a staggering increase of 139%. Hon member, you must listen, because you don't know these things. [Laughter.]
In 2010, electricity was used for heating in 6,5 million households, compared to only 4,3 million households in 1996, an increase of 62%. I can go on and on. These are real gains, and we should be proud of them. As the ANC we should, therefore, congratulate ourselves on being able to record these gains under very tough economic circumstances.
In conclusion, I think it's time for us to consider making the 10 delegates of Salga, that are supposed to sit in this House, permanent members of this House so that they can participate at all levels. Thank you. [Applause.]
Ms E C VAN LINGEN
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 150
Mr C J VAN ROOYEN (Free State)
Ms E C VAN LINGEN: Chairperson, and everybody present, we have a long list of people that graced our company and our premises this week. I think it was very successful. It was a first, and a lot has been said. There were good debates, and great passion for service delivery, but, unfortunately, an insatiable demand for more money.
However, we must look at resolving these issues. Before I get into that, I just want to say to the hon Van Rooyen: You talked about promoting opposition parties inn provincial weeks, but you have been busy with the dance of Mangaung, my friend. [Interjections.]
The main challenge lies in the management of our responsibilities. But the political which so many of you have referred to this morning is what is needed, and it is needed from all spheres of government.
I have a few matters to raise. Clean audits can be achieved and should be achieved before local municipalities can be entrusted with more money. National Treasury told us yesterday that there is sufficient money in the system for local government to do what it has to do. The problem is is how it is applied. More money is not going to stop trends in financial mismanagement and maladministration. We must fix this the correct way.
Then there is the lack of capacity. Thanks to Salga, all our councillors were trained. But the capacity of municipal staff is our responsibility. Firstly, there must be a performance management system in place, and bonuses must not just be paid for any reason. They are not a given; they must be paid when you have outperformed your job description. For our sections 56 and 57 managers, I think that we must say that to them that they cannot get bonuses if there hasn't been a clean audit.
When it comes to political responsibility and integrity, the problem is that we have to go to court to get people to stick to the law. That is a problem. In Kouga, we had to stop unlawful appointments - we had to go to court. In Carolina, we had to go to court for water. The hon van Rooyen was referring to a court case. Bushbuckridge is without water, as are the other Free State villages without water. This is a problem. Why must we go to court for there to compliance and service delivery? We should not let anyone get away with this issue. We must remove those from the system. We must remove them. [Interjections.] Local government should create the environment for local economic development. Thank you. [Time expired.]
Mr E MAGERMAN (Gauteng)/ C.I / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 151
Ms E C VAN LINGEN
Mr E MAGERMAN (Gauteng): Chair, let me indicate that this is the first time I am making a presentation – or are attending – the National Council of Provinces. So it is my maiden speech in a way.
Hon Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces, Deputy Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces, MECs present, members of the provincial legislatures, mayors present, councillors and distinguished guests, it is indeed an honour and privilege to address this august House at the end of a fruitful four-day local government week, with the theme being: "Alleviating service delivery and addressing challenges through effective co-operative governance".
The catchwords for me would be "co-operative governance". I think those words should be highlighted and stressed, because as the ruling party says: "Together we can do more." And this is very appropriate in terms of what we are trying to achieve.
It has also been an informative experience for us as Gauteng as it broadened our knowledge and understanding of successes and challenges faced by national departments, other provinces and a variety of different municipalities, that is metros, districts and local municipalities. This also gave us an opportunity to benchmark our work not to compete, but also to learn and share our experiences for the purposes of creating a better life for all in our communities. It is for this reason that as Gauteng we support the resolutions to be adopted at this first local government week forum made possible by the NCOP.
We also share the view that these resolutions should not be taken for the sake of it, but that we should go back to our different existing spheres of life and work and put shoulder to the wheel by making local government work as local government business is everybody's business. When local government fails, our people see the failure as a failure of government. Hence, we all have to ensure support for local government as enshrined in the Constitution of the Republic of South Africa, bearing in mind the Bill of Rights.
We covered a lot of ground during the past three days, but given the time constraints, I will, on behalf of the Gauteng province, focus on a few issues that we feel are pertinent. When comparing the different presentations, we realise many of the challenges experienced by the different spheres of government, especially local government, are similar, and the achievements presented gave us hope that all is not doom and gloom as municipalities across the board are doing sterling work despite the challenges facing them, including unfunded mandates, insufficient funding, a declining rates base that results from joblessness and a growing indigent population, and a high immigration rate that results in strained infrastructure and service delivery.
All these issues raised do not match the equitable share we receive as a province as we are currently the most densely populated province in the country, with the highest percentage growth in immigration. We are not punting for more seats in the Gauteng province, but we want the Financial and Fiscal Commission, FFC, to look at the equitable share as it stands at this point in time.
We hope the FFC will note and respond to our plea. We also have the challenge of exorbitant land costs, dolomitic land and a shortage of developable land in our province. Hence, we are also looking at the issue of densification because, as mentioned, we have a shortage of land.
We applaud the overall successes accomplished by municipalities and the sentiments expressed, that is service delivery versus clean audits. We take note of that. However, we have a duty - and have made a commitment - to making Operation Clean Audit a reality by 2014, as we believe there should better planning and that leadership will assist in achieving this milestone. Hence, as a province, both the executive and legislature have formed a partnership with the Office of the Auditor-General, and it has resulted in a task team. We encourage other spheres and entities to do the same, as we as a collective should ensure that we deal with issues such as fruitless and wasteful expenditure, noncompliance of the Local Government: Municipal Finance Management Act. Examples are the late submission of annual financial statements by some municipalities, and municipalities delaying updating their asset registers.
We should also ensure as a collective that capacity challenges are addressed in municipal internal audit committees, as raised in the Auditor-General's audit report. In addition, we also urge that municipalities increase accountability and take punitive action against repeat transgressors of the Local Government: Municipal Finance Management Act.
We also want to urge municipalities, given support by the provincial and national departments, to ensure that they implement the municipal revenue enhancement strategy and ensure correct and reliable billing systems, as the absence of these would result in municipalities not being sustainable.
As a provincial legislature, we will be having a revenue enhancement summit to assess, with all relevant stakeholders, our challenges and collectively develop responses to the kinds of action that need to be taken to resolve the identified challenges, and to attempt to achieve the outcome of a responsive, accountable, efficient and effective local government.
We also note the challenges faced by most municipalities, such as the functionality of intergovernmental relations IGR - they should not be complaint sessions but there should be commitment; the capacity to implement the Local Government: Municipal Property Rates Act; bylaw enforcement, noting the unintended consequences of the Prevention of Illegal Eviction from and Unlawful Occupation of Land Act, which was enacted nobly. We urge the NCOP to assist in reviewing this Act as it hampers the implementation of bylaws. We appreciate the interventions by the NCOP to review all legislation that impedes the effective functioning of local government delivery of services.
We also acknowledge that service delivery protests could be mitigated if all of us in government and legislatures could communicate more meaningfully with communities both our successes, and our challenges and failures, and be honest about the situation.
We also support the fact that the local economic development, LED, is a constitutional imperative that seeks to ensure local government ensures that this aspect is key when it implements its mandate. We have also noted the minimal amount of support or no support by national and provincial departments, both in terms of human resource capacity, development and financial support.
We also urge all role-players to ensure a common understanding of what LED is about. If you speak to a municipality in Gauteng in Westonaria and to one of the metros, there is a completely different understanding. I and the chairperson of local government and housing also do not have the same understanding as to local economic development. So, I to urge the Department of Economic Development to perhaps have a similar summit where we could thrash out this issue. We will rely on you as well to assist in this matter.
Targeted procurement should be used to empower local communities as required by the preferential procurement policy. This will also contribute to pushing back the frontiers of poverty, narrowing the gap in inequality and creating jobs where they are most needed. Those are the three challenges that we talk about all the time.
We acknowledge that this activity is important as it would encourage small, medium and micro enterprise development, the development of co-operatives and human development in general, and in the medium and long term this activity will grow our tax base and increase the rates base of the respective municipalities. As stated earlier in the input, the province of Gauteng has committed itself to all resolutions taken on the occasion of the local government week. We will do continual oversight, judge performance and progress on a quarterly basis to ensure that the issues raised are corrected for the benefit of our people, and we also, once more, state that local government is everyone's business.
Regarding Salga, we welcome the renewed commitment shown and advocate for this organisation to be funded and capacitated adequately to exercise their mandate more efficiently. Specifically, in Gauteng, we have had a good relationship in the past two terms. But, over the past couple of months, yes, there has not been commitment from Salga. So I am going to invite them officially here to say that they are expected to be part of our meetings. We have given you our year programme, and we would appreciate your inputs in those meetings, which could help us in informing the budgets of departments and bringing up the issues of municipalities at our level. On 14 August and 15 August, we are having a retreat and you have been invited. The department will also be there, and we expect you to be part of those meetings.
Hon Chairperson, allow me to raise a few issues we picked up from our provincial week, of which the theme was Operation Clean Audit 2014: Advancing our collective efforts to strengthen our municipalities to deliver quality services to our people. Matters of concern and crosscutting issues emanating from these presentations were the following. Regarding municipal public accounts committees or MPACs, even though municipalities indicated that MPACs are in place, there are concerns regarding the readiness, capacity and functionality of these MPACs. Oversight tools should be applied to ensure effective functioning of the MPACs and there should be a standard programme for all MPACs in the province to work towards attaining clean audits in 2014.
Water and electricity losses are also one of the challenges. Municipalities need to investigate the cause of these losses and determine the extent to which old infrastructure and pipes could be contributing to these losses.
The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr S S Mazosiwe): Hon member, I know its your maiden speech, but your time has expired.
Mr E MAGERMAN (Gauteng): Thank you, Chairperson. May I just say before I sit down ...
The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr S S Mazosiwe): Malibongwe! [Applause.]
Mr C DODOVU (North West) /KC/ END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 152
Mr E MAGERMAN (Gauteng)
Mr C DODOVU (North West): Hon Chairperson of the NCOP, permanent and special delegates, representatives of the SA Local Government Association, Salga, ladies and gentlemen, I indeed count it a privilege to be afforded this opportunity to participate in this debate today. This debate takes place during a significant year in the history of our country, as the ANC marks 100 hundred years of its existence.
Within the above context, this month, Women's Month, we in the North West celebrate this centenary by honouring and paying homage to one of our greatest leaders, a true revolutionary, a patriot indeed, President James Moroka, the seventh President of the ANC, who ushered in the establishment of the ANC Women's League.
I will therefore use this debate to pay tribute to President Moroka for the indelible contribution he made in bringing about freedom in our land. We salute this freedom fighter who led by example and who left us a legacy of the true meaning of courage, sacrifice and determination in pursuit of a noble goal of equality, prosperity and justice for all.
As we walk the path and the solid foundation laid by President Moroka, we should owe a special debt of gratitude to him because he enriched our lives with the magic of his words, the enchantment of his image, the acuity of his insights and the magnitude of his vision. The selfless work of President Moroka must be an example and an inspiration to successive generations of leaders as we continue to tussle with the challenges presented by the current democratic dispensation, particularly in the area of local government.
As was confirmed during the provincial visits to the North West province and throughout the discussions this week, the main lessons arising from the first and second terms of local government have shown that its transformation is one of the most complex projects of state transformation since 1994.
We in the North West are the first to admit that the task of transforming local government has proven to be more complex and protracted than was initially anticipated. As we speak today, the following remain as challenges facing this sphere of government in our province: poor leadership, governance and oversight at municipal councils; a lack of administrative leadership in municipalities; poor service delivery; poor financial controls and persistent negative audit outcomes; and fraud and corrupt practices resulting in noncompliance with the legislation.
The bottom line is that as we deepen our understanding of these challenges, we have committed ourselves to speedily finding solutions to them as some of the municipalities in our province are collapsing in terms of administration which negatively affects service delivery.
We have inevitably committed ourselves to building partnerships and to further mainstreaming our hands-on support to local government over the next few years in order to ameliorate this situation I have pointed out. As we do so, we must be steadfast in our commitment to bettering the lives of the people of the province. In fact, what underpins our conviction should be an unflinching commitment to create a new set of opportunities and challenges for the course of municipal transformation and development.
Through our undiminished vitality and determination, our activities, interests, actions and pronouncements must remain, for millions of our people, a constant source of hope and encouragement. In order to practically address the above challenges, we in the North West government have set ourselves four key areas of performance this year in terms of ensuring that we achieve our intended goals, especially in the following areas: one, municipal financial viability of our municipalities; two, maximising the participation of our public; three, stabilising governance in our municipalities; and, lastly, municipal infrastructure planning and delivery.
In respect of the first priority of municipal financial viability, the government is attending to the following matters: Operation Clean Audit; revenue enhancement programmes; fraud and corruption plans and the setting up of committees; and supply-chain management practices.
On the second priority of maximising public participation, the government is paying attention to the following areas: the capacitating ward committees through training; community mobilisation and awareness campaigns; community development worker effectives; and the resuscitation and facilitation of mayoral and premiers' izimbizo.
With regard to the third priority to stabilise governance in municipalities, we have identified the following areas: regular engagements with municipalities; the strengthening of intergovernmental relations; improving reporting mechanisms and processes; and the appointment of staff, more especially in critical positions.
In terms of the fourth priority of infrastructure planning and development, the government is attending to the following matters: ensuring 100% commitment of projects by all of our municipalities; improving spending of all infrastructure allocations and the close-out report on all the 2011-12 projects; and ensuring public participation through infrastructure planning and delivery.
With these priorities, it is now clear that our prospects have never been brighter than they are for tomorrow. Our priorities have never mattered as much as they do right now. Moving forward, our vision for the future is defined in the four key priority areas we mentioned above. It is true that local government is everybody's business and by that we will not fall back, but rather stand strong - standing strong for prosperity, standing strong for our future because we are strong people, and standing strong for our province and country.
To achieve all of the above objectives, we require strong and effective leadership as President Moroka taught all of us, as we pay tribute through this particular speech. He taught us that as leaders, our strongest commitments will fail if we neglect to maintain avenues for dialogue. Such dialogue thrives in a climate of humility, credibility and trust.
Towards this end, we must pledge to facilitate understanding and collaboration. We must pledge to engage and embrace all constituencies. We must pledge to share our vision that a sustainable future for humankind depends on a caring partnership. We pledge to bequeath our country and its development as a precious heritage to future generations.
As we move forward, we must remember that our country deserves a local government that the nation can be proud of. As a sphere of government closest to the people, the role of our municipalities in securing a peaceful, democratic and equitable civic society is of paramount importance. This role is recognised and enshrined in the Constitution of the Republic.
As President Thabo Mbeki observed in 2005, our actions as local government should be to make an invaluable contribution to the important task of creating a humane society in which our municipalities work selflessly for the betterment of local communities, in which we fully understand that our responsibilities are to the people, and that we are, every step of the way, accountable, sensitive and responsive to the needs of the people.
In the memory of President Moroka, to whom we have dedicated this speech to, we say: You shall forever remain an inspiration to us. You have deposited undiminishing values in our moral banking account, and, therefore, shall strive to emulate your examples as a leader. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Mr T E CHAANE ///NPM .../TM / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 153
Mr C DODOVU (North West)
Mr T E CHAANE: Hon Chairperson, hon MECs present, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, I stand here today humbled by this opportunity to share my thoughts on the number of challenges we all raised during the past three days. My area of focus in this debate, Chair, therefore, will be on issues of support of, or assistance to, municipalities by both national and provincial government as well as issues relating to the breach of, or noncompliance with, the law.
Hon Chairperson, allow me first to congratulate our 13 municipalities that have achieved clean audits three years ahead of the targeted date of 2014. The achievement should be celebrated precisely because it demystified the notion that only DA-run municipalities are capable of achieving clean results. [Applause.] Let us further congratulate the 156 municipalities that have received unqualified results. We should celebrate and remind them that they are just one step closer to being completely clean.
Let us also give more courage to, and commend, those who have moved from disclaimer and adverse positions to reach the qualified level. That is an achievement. Those are the right steps in the right direction, hon members, and we must commend them for that. We should not shy away from telling everybody, including ourselves, that we are on course towards achieving clean audits - it is within reach. All that needs to happen is for us to be more committed and make sure that everything that is supposed to be done, is done and correctly so. Then we will achieve clean audits. That opinion is informed by the fact that over half of our municipalities are already at the unqualified level.
As we celebrate, I must caution, though, that we should not be like soccer lovers who, despite the performance of a club, only look at the score. You see, some of us were worried on Saturday when Chiefs was winning because Pirates was dominating, but thanks to Benni McCarthy ... [Laughter.] [Interjections.] We should also look at quality. [Interjections.]
The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr F Adams): Order! Order! Order! Order, hon members!
Mr D V BLOEM: Chairperson, I take strong exception to the comment that ... [Laughter.]
The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr F Adams): No, no, sit. Take your seat, hon Bloem. [Interjections.] No, no. Take your seat. You may proceed, hon Chaane.
Mr T E CHAANE: Sir, the point I am making is that as we celebrate these positive steps, we must also make sure that we don't lose sight of quality. We must, at all times, push for quality, and whilst we encourage our colleagues to celebrate these positive steps towards obtaining clean audits, we need to caution that, unless drastic action and corrective measures are taken to deal with audit queries, as raised by the Auditor-General, our excitement will be short-lived.
As lawmakers ourselves, we should be more worried and concerned about the reported noncompliance with legislation. As public representatives charged with the responsibility of oversight over the executive, we should be even more worried and concerned about the fact that irregular expenditure rose from R6 billion to R10 billion, and wasteful and fruitless expenditure increased from R250 million to R260 million this past financial year. The fact that the number of those who failed to submit financial statements has increased from nine to 40 should be condemned.
Yesterday we were celebrating a marriage, and it is the norm that after each and every wedding there's a honeymoon. I am told that during that it's during the excitement of the honeymoon that we remind each other of the rules of the game. Now, let me take this opportunity to remind our colleagues at all levels of our government of the following provisions of the Local Government: Municipal Finance Management Act, Act 56 of 2003, as I believe it will go a long way in laying to rest some of the concerns and queries raised by the Auditor-General.
Firstly, section 32 of the Local Government: Municipal Finance Management Act regulates unauthorised, irregular or fruitless and wasteful expenditure. It places liability of such expenses at the doorstep of accounting officers, political office bearers or any official who deliberately or negligently commit any of these offences.
Secondly, section 34 deals with capacity-building – the same capacity that we talked about the whole week. Section 83 deals with competency levels of professional financial officials, so it can't be that we complain that taxi drivers are appointed to be chief financial officers when the law is very clear as to what should happen.
Thirdly, the section 34(31) says the following: the national and provincial government must by agreement assist municipalities in building capacity of municipalities for efficient, effective and transparent financial management. So, it is a matter of "must" that provinces and national departments assist municipalities. We should not be begging for that. It's law, and as legislators, hon members, we must make sure and exert pressure for this to be complied with.
Subsection 2 says that national and provincial government must support the efforts of municipalities to identify and resolve their financial problems. It's a matter of "must", hon MECs, hon Ministers and hon councillors. Section 35 deals with promotion of co-operative governance by national and provincial institutions, and this should be read together with the Intergovernmental Relations Framework Act that requires that intergovernmental forums be established from districts, provinces and up to the presidential level. [Interjections.]
Section 35(a) says national and provincial departments and public entities must promote co-operative governance in accordance with Chapter 3 of the Constitution, and 35(b) says, promptly meet their financial commitments towards municipalities. It can't be that when the law says you must promptly pay your financial commitments to municipalities, that R76 billion is owed to municipalities by national departments and provincial departments. That cannot be, and as lawmakers we do make these laws not for anybody to breach but for them to be complied with. As I said yesterday, Chair, let us begin to comply and complain later.
Section 131 raises issues raised by the Auditor-General in his report, and subsection 1(a) says, "a municipality must address any issues raised by the Auditor-General in an audit report". The mayor must ensure compliance by the municipality with this section. Subsection 2, hon Dodovu, says that the MEC for local government in the province must access all annual financial statements of municipalities in the province, must ensure that the audit reports of such statements and any responses of municipalities have adequately addressed any issues raised by the Auditor-General, and must report to the provincial legislature any omissions by a municipality to adequately address those issues within 60 days. [Interjections.] Section 133 outlines the consequences of noncompliance with certain provisions of this Act.
Lastly, Chair, section 134 deals with the annual report to Parliament and it says that the Cabinet member – the Minister – responsible for local government must annually report to Parliament on action taken by MECs for local government to address issues raised by the Auditor-General in audit reports and financial statements of municipalities and municipal entities. All those things that I have quoted are law, hon Bloem. Hon members, we are lawmakers. Let us enforce this law. [Interjections.]
As a finance committee, Chair, and as the Chair of the Select Committee on Appropriations, I am quite aware that we have not, for the past four years, called the Cabinet Minister to precisely report to us in line with the section. We are going to make sure that the hon Baloyi comes and tells us whether the MECs are doing what this section requires of them to do so that we begin to talk and act. I thank you, Chairperson. [Applause.]
Ms A ROSSOUW (Western Cape) GG//Mia / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 154
Mr T E CHAANE
The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr F Adams): Order! I now call upon the hon A Rossouw, the Western Cape chief whip. [Interjections.] Order! Order! Hon Chaane, take your seat.
Ms A ROSSOUW (Western Cape): Hon Chair, it is once again my privilege to participate in today's debate ...
The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr F Adams): Order! Sorry, hon Rossouw. Hon Plaatjie, please respect the House. Thank you. You may proceed, hon Rossouw.
Ms A ROSSOUW (Western Cape): Hon Chair, it is once again my privilege to participate in today's debate, which is focused on the National Council of Provinces' visiting week of April 2012. The areas visited by the NCOP and the Western Cape provincial delegates form part of the Operation Clean Audit for 2014.
South Africa's main strategic objectives should include being the best-run national government in Africa. A well-run government does not only depend on good governance, accountability, openness and transparency, and zero tolerance towards corruption, but also on well-functioning intergovernmental relations. The three spheres of government need to work together to realise South Africa's potential to achieve a stable democracy. Through effective co-operation, set goals will be achieved and service delivery guaranteed. This will ensure that the taxpayers' money is spent wisely and voters' needs are met.
The principles of good co-operation and effective service delivery should not be eroded by cheap politicking. Government has a role to play in ensuring that political differences do not hamper the achievements of goals and delivery of service to the voters. A respectful working relationship between different political parties will ensure that the interests of citizens are placed above all else. The aim of the NCOP visit week should be to combine our collective efforts with which to strengthen our municipalities, in order to deliver quality service to our people and to create situations which can be used to the political advantage of delegates.
The timeframes of the NCOP visit weeks must be carefully planned to allow sufficient time for proper preparation to ensure meaningful visits. The status of procedures to be followed during visit weeks should also be clearly outlined before visits to determine what the role of the public should be and what should be allowed during their participation with the municipalities in this regard.
Most of the municipalities we visited in the Overberg area have sound management. Serious concerns, however, were identified in one of the municipalities. It is a great concern that the principles of good governance were absent and, as a result, service delivery was seriously affected to the extent that the budget process could not be finalised, neither could financial statements be produced timeously. Strong political will and stability are required to enforce strict discipline and controls to make the right political decisions and to be responsible in bringing about necessary changes in municipalities.
Smaller municipalities have to contend with legislation, policy, prescribed financial systems and audit criteria which place ever-increasing demands on them. When municipal officials are in training for two to three days a week, it is understandable that the performance indexes of municipalities are rated under 50%, while managers' leadership abilities are 80% and higher. Unnecessary pressure on officials gives way to a low morale and early retirement.
Visits to the Theewaterskloof, Overstrand and Cape Agulhas municipalities in the Overberg District Municipality area highlighted the facts that efficient administration and goal achievement were present. A visit to the prize-winning housing development at Grabouw, which received the Govan Mbeki Human Settlements Award, raised serious concerns. Closer inspection revealed definite signs of poor workmanship which in the near future will cause serious problems for the residents, the municipality and the building contractor.
A point of serious concern is the effect of unfunded mandates which are forced on municipalities. It has reached the point at which local authorities can no longer comply with the demands and prescriptions. Ratepayers and service consumers cannot be taxed unlimitedly in order to absorb ever-growing demands. At the same time, service delivery protests are costing the country millions. The destruction of infrastructure should be regarded in an extremely serious light, and government should send a strong-worded message to discourage destructive behaviour.
The financial status of district municipalities and small municipalities has to be reassessed. District municipalities, like that of the Overberg, do not have the financial means to function effectively, neither can small municipalities afford appropriately qualified officials required to produce financial statements which are imperative to receiving clean audits. [Time expired.]
Mr M WALTERS (Western Cape) /
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 154
Ms A ROSSOUW (Western Cape)
Mr M WALTERS (Western Cape): Hon Chair, hon colleagues from the NCOP and the SA Local Government Association, Salga, I would like to commence by extending my congratulations and thanks to the NCOP and the hon Mahlangu on the initiative they have shown in convening the Local Government Week. This has been a unique interface between the three spheres of government in South Africa with insightful and expert inputs from the departments, which in terms of their particular mandates interact with local government. The analyses of the factors impacting on effective local government, both historical and current, provided an effective framework for rapid future progress.
The inherent need for ownership of property, which could be leveraged for home improvement and economic development, was brought to the fore. The emphasis placed on the provision of serviced sites was also gratifying, as this is one of the core emphases also within the Western Cape Human Settlements Programme. Leadership deficiencies, unfunded mandates, incompetence, poor planning, poor financial management, training shortfalls, etc, were touched upon.
The Local Government Week therefore touched on a wide range of issues which impact on the lives of ordinary citizens. These were all relevant. I can only touch on a few in the time available. The importance of maintenance and refurbishment of infrastructure in the interests of the wellbeing of our citizens and the provision of a proper basis within which economic development can thrive cannot be contested. In this respect, the optimal use of conditional grants is an area in which radical improvement is essential if that R30,4 billion is to have maximum effect.
The elimination of corruption was highlighted as a primary requisite for effective local government. Corruption is rife, as was indicated on day one already. The solutions for this were comprehensively tabled. It is, however, essential that aspects that were repeatedly mentioned are addressed and eliminated. The lack of consequences for corruption and failure to address contraventions of legal requirements were emphasised. One of our ministerial participants was so explicit in his remonstration against corruption and his call for harsh measures that he made what, in the past, could have been construed as career-limiting statement. The hon Bloem suggested that all should get orange suits. This was not jocular, but said in a serious context. The lack of consequences, the lateral redeployment often to other municipalities, suspension with full pay and the prospect of medical parole are all aspects which need to be addressed.
The addressing of corruption and maladministration at provincial and national level was also highlighted by another delegate. This is absolutely necessary. The old idiom, "'n Vis vrot van die kop af," [A fish rots from the head down] is very true. If people higher up the hierarchical ranking indulge in corrupt practices, how can one expect those lower down to be lily-white in their innocence. Those lower down, if au fait with what is going on higher up, think that they are immune from punishment. One aspect which struck me was how we concentrated on the improvement of the way in which the status quo is handled. The future should always be squarely in our sight.
The economic development of the areas of local government is not only dependent on their own efforts, but also requires the effective development of those natural resources of national importance which lie dormant at present and the development thereof which require massive investment only possible at the national level. Such prospects could revolutionise the lives of ordinary people. Examples at this level include the development of the huge potential of 30% of South Africa's high potential agricultural land that, at present, lies unutilised in the former homelands. Simple amelioration of endemic soil acidity can increase the productivity of such land 16-fold.
The development of the 30% of South Africa's water running down the Mzimvubu to Port St Johns is long overdue after first being mooted in 1979. It was gratifying to be told that the planning of this multibillion rand project is on hand. This project with its hydro-electric and irrigation potential, able to supply water over the entire Eastern Cape, could pose great challenges but also great rewards to local government in the affected areas. This project is still being disrupted by political problems beyond the local government sphere. It must devolve upon the NCOP and provinces to avoid and defuse the political squabbles which have delayed actions on such projects in the past in the interests of some of the poorest communities in our country. Let us do what is needed along the lines sketched by the hon Mahlangu. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr M C MASUKU (Mpumalanga) //Mohau//Mia/ END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 155
Mr M WALTERS (Western Cape)
Mr M C MASUKU (Mpumalanga): Hon Chair, Chairperson of the NCOP, the chairperson of SA Local Government Association, Salga, Mr Manyoni, members of the NCOP, my colleagues MEC Dodovu and Mr Motsepe, let me start by expressing appreciation for this opportunity that I have been given to take part in this debate. It comes after a very fruitful week in which we deliberated on many issues centred on intergovernmental relations. We have shared experiences, exchanged ideas and identified bottlenecks. Moreover, what is good about this is the fact that we did not end there, but looked at how we can chart a way forward.
We have celebrated our successes that we have achieved jointly as we reflected on our journey in the past years of our democratic local government. We have also identified a plethora of challenges that lie ahead. They are so many that sometimes we feel like giving up, because these challenges seem to be bigger than our potential solutions. However, we are coming out of this week very charged, because indeed the solutions we have come up with here have given courage to some of us who are at the forefront of assisting municipalities.
I spent a lot of time in workshops, and that was the first time that I sat in on a meeting and did not speak. Some of my colleagues were surprised because I like contributing. But this was because I looked at the calibre of the people that were here; people were experiencing and interacting with my own councillors and with my own municipalities. I thought that it was the right time to start listening, and checking whether the solutions that I have were actually right. From that kind of sitting, I realised that indeed the light is there. There are many things that we can achieve going forward.
Talking to the issues of this week, I would rather tell a story about things we are doing in Mpumalanga, as part of celebrating what I heard and also as part of showing the kind of energy that I have acquired in the past three days. We are on our way to a better future. We have already started in Mpumalanga.
Operation Clean Audit 2014 was on our doorstep in the previous year when we had three clean audits, and this year we have added one. That means that we have four out of 13 municipalities and makes us second to KwaZulu-Natal, which has five. [Applause.] In percentage terms, out of 21, this means that we are the province that takes the lead. That was what we were celebrating in the past week.
But ours is not about that. It is not about the 52% of municipalities that have received unqualified audits; it is not about the 11 municipalities out of the 21 that received clean audits. It is about having all of the 21 municipalities on the right track. That is what concerns us every day.
For that matter, in Mpumalanga the whole executive together with the municipalities have actually sat down and reflected on this matter from last year until this year. We have identified things that we need to do, and we have set ourselves certain milestones that we have to reach. One of the milestones was to make sure that we assisted municipalities in having the necessary personnel in order for them to meet the challenges they have to get a clean audit. That target we set for ourselves in December 2011. But we couldn't achieve that target because we have also set other goals that delayed the process. Such goals included putting in place measures that will make us work together with municipalities in appointing people to particular posts. This also included putting in place an additional factor that has to do with checking of what we call the competencies of these particular persons as to whether we can rely on them.
We are happy that thus far we have been able, at this point in time, to celebrate the fact that we already have 17 municipalities that have municipal managers. All these managers have been appointed appropriately, and we can assure you that they have the competencies that are needed. We have also indicated to the muncipalities, when we accepted their appointments, the areas that need development.
The contracts of the other two have expired and there are processes in place. As far as the third one is concerned, this municipality has decided to take punitive measures as far as the Clean Audit campaign is concerned because they were aiming for a clean audit last year, and they have one matter of emphasis. They had to take action and ask the municipal manager how he left out the particular matter. The municipal manager is actually on suspension.
The second aspect that we have dealt with as a province is that we have agreed that there are certain milestones that we have to achieve. One of them is the fact that we have agreed that by the 31 July all our municipalities must have drafted financial statements. To that effect, together with Treasury, we have deployed some officials to assist those that have difficulties in dealing with those issues, especially those that have disclaimers because they have a large chunk - about seven municipalities that have disclaimers and three of them have unqualified audits. So they were assisting them in putting these things in place.
Starting from this month, working together with the MEC of finance, we will be blazing a trail. We are going to go to every municipality and listen to each, and ask every municipality that has performed badly if they have presented what they are supposed to be doing. All those milestones are what we want to attain for 2014.
As I speak, MEC Phosa is at the Thaba Chweu Local Municipality trying to interact with them about the challenges that they are facing. Yesterday he was at eMalahleni Local Municipality, and this is part of what we are doing in contributing towards Operation Clean Audit 2014.
The other matter that we are dealing with is that the premier and the executive council have agreed that only four municipalities can be paid bonuses. There are no other municipalities that can tell us about bonuses. That is part of a decision that has been taken by the executive council.
All our municipalities have Municipal Public Accounts Committees, and I want to take this moment to thank the SA Local Government Association, Salga, and the provincial legislatures for assisting in capacitating and monitoring the performances of these committees.
I was impressed last week by some of the municipalities: how they can interpret these things that we were talking about yesterday. This is taking us a step forward to where we want to be.
The other area that we have dealt with is the area that members of this House have alerted us to when they were visiting municipalities. This was that we should not respond to them in a similar way. We do agree with the concession in the meeting that we need to look at the issue of the categorisation of municipalities.
In our province, we have identified different kinds of municipalities. There are municipalities that are composed of big cities that we can actually give minimum assistance to for their to be able to move forward. We have also municipalities that are in the homelands, or come from the homelands system. They have no systems; nothing. You cannot even think of collecting tomorrow; you have to work to assist them to actually have that infrastructure to be able to collect. We have a different package in terms of how we are handling them.
We also looked at small municipalities. Among the small municipalities are those that are able to behave like bigger cities and are able to comply. One of them actually got a clean audit. Then these are other ones that are leaning towards those that are from the homelands. It's regarding those that we say we have a different way of dealing with. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mr C MOTSEPE (Limpopo) / MM/ARM / END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 156
Mr M C MASUKU (Mpumalanga)
Mr C MOTSEPE (Limpopo): Hon Chairperson of the NCOP the hon M J Mahlangu, chairperson of the Select Committee on Co-operative Governance and Traditional Affairs, hon members of provincial legislatures, especially those who come from my province, and other provinces, the chairperson of the Salga, and all councillors, the chairperson of the House of Traditional Leaders, my colleagues from other provinces, all protocol being observed.
Let me join my colleagues in expression appreciation for the valuable lessons we have learned during the local government week. The least we could do to honour the legacy of Charlotte Maxeke, Lilian Ngoyi, Albertina Sisulu, Mama Tambo and many others, as we leave here and return to our homes, we should implement the valuable lessons we have learned during the course of the week.
The National Council of Provinces conducted an oversight visit on Operation Clean Audit in Limpopo from 16 April to 20 April. The oversight visit saw members visiting Mookgopong, Belabela, Thabazimbi, Lephalale, Mopani, Ba-Phalaborwa, and the Greater Giyani and Greater Tzaneen Municipalities. Subsequent to the visit, the NCOP released its oversight report. The report contains profound findings and key recommendations related to financial and performance management, service delivery, leadership and governance issues.
The Limpopo provincial government remains indebted and grateful to the stewardship of members of the NCOP. We have committed ourselves, as we still hereby do, to implementing all the recommendations emanating from the report. In the same breath, the Limpopo provincial government takes this opportunity to welcome the official audit outcomes for the 2010-11 financial year recently released by Auditor-General Mr Terence Nombembe.
It gives us solace that beyond the dark clouds, there appears a silver lining. We are delighted by the fact that the Fetakgomo Local Municipality has been joined by the Waterberg District Municipality in achieving a clean audit. [Applause.] The delight is much about the fact that I personally laid the foundation for this clean audit in Waterberg, as I was a municipal manager for two years at this municipality. We congratulate these municipalities and encourage others to emulate them. These municipalities have demonstrated unparalleled leadership, sound financial management and good governance, as outlined in the Auditor-General's report.
At the same time, we are the first to acknowledge the sluggish progress towards Operation Clean Audit in the province. The Auditor-General's report indicates a net loss or regression in the number of unqualified and qualified audit opinions. This is reflected by the decrease in the number of municipalities that have received unqualified audit opinions from 10 to five. We concur with the Auditor-General that the regression is largely due to the lack of leadership, financial and performance management and good governance in some of these municipalities. This state of affairs is not pleasing at all. We view this in a serious light and we have already taken appropriate steps in some of these municipalities.
Hon Chaane, we want to take this opportunity to tell you and the hon members here that we have taken your advice. [Applause.] We have removed mayors and senior managers in response to the Auditor-Generals's findings. To be very specific and to give one example, in the Mogalakwena Municipality we are busy recovering money from councillors in compliance with section 32 and many other sections that you referred to. [Applause.] With these actions we have demonstrated our resolve to confront unwanted behaviour in the public service, including corruption.
Furthermore, all our municipalities have, among other things, adopted audit remedial action plans. Of great importance is the realisation by all in local government about the importance of forward and sustainable planning. To us this is a major step in the right direction. The political leadership of the municipalities under our mayors has undertaken to champion the implementation of these remedial action plans. These plans will form part of the agenda of every council meeting. Properly monitored, it is possible that all the audit queries can be resolved by the end of this financial year.
Members of the NCOP, one of your findings and that of the Auditor-General, which is common in all these municipalities, is the inability to spend the municipal infrastructure grant, the MIG, which results in communities not receiving planned services. I want to report to this House that as from this financial year all our municipalities have adopted a framework of forward planning which will result in projects being packaged and awarded in time for implementation at the beginning of the next financial year.
This will go a long way in ensuring that all our municipalities spend their MIG in the year and for the purpose that the money was appropriated for. To supplement this initiative at provincial level we have established the provincial Intergovernmental Relations, IGR, Forum, which will oversee, monitor and implement Operation Clean Audit. This oversight forum is constituted of MECs of co-operative governance, human settlements, traditional affairs and provincial treasuries, as well as district and local mayors.
We are also pleased to announce that all our 30 municipalities have established Municipal Public Accounts Committees, Mpacs, which are aimed at strengthening oversight of audit issues. To this end, we have already started with capacitating these Mpacs, in conjunction with Salga, the Office of the Auditor-General, provincial treasuries and our provincial legislature.
Once more we have taken the advice of the hon Chaane. We remain committed to recruiting and employing personnel that have the necessary skill, competence, capacity and qualifications. This bodes well with our ambition of laying a firm foundation of a developmental state.
My department which, by the way, has also received a clean audit and the two municipalities of Fetakgomu and Waterberg are living examples that it is possible to have a clean, responsive, accountable, transparent, efficient and effective government. [Applause.]
With all these plans in place, coupled with the will by political leadership at all levels, I have no doubt that the 2011-12 financial year audit outcomes will improve for the better. We are a listening leadership, we shall oblige, and we shall continue to put our people first. Re phelele [long live] Nelson Mandela; Re phelele. [Long live.] Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Mr M J R DE VILLIERS
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 156
Mr C MOTSEPE (Limpopo)
Mr M J R DE VILLIERS: Chairperson, I just want to caution the members that part of my speech will be in Afrikaans. Hon Chairperson of the NCOP, MECs, members and councillors, special delegates and guests in the House, the NCOP has a very important role and duty to play, which is the oversight role over the national, provincial and local government authorities. I can say this with great honesty in that we in the NCOP are on track with this mandate.
Operation Clean Audit 2014 is a goal that each and everyone of us must strive for. The success in this goal will certainly promise our people a quality service delivery. This will also bring a stable and profitable municipality and community to all of us.
The Western Cape legislature and permanent delegates to the NCOP had our oversight during this week in the Overberg area of local government which is Theewaterskloof Local Municipality, Swellendam Municipality, Overberg District Municipality, Overstrand Municipality and Cape Augulhas Municipality.
Before I get to the state of these municipalities I must say that the Khayelitsha Hospital is a delivery of service in the health sector to be proud of. I request everybody to go and visit that hospital to see for yourself what co-operation and good planning can bring to a community.
Ms N D NTWANAMBI: It was not your plan.
Mr M J R DE VILLIERS: It doesn't matter.
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr R J Tau): Order, hon members!
Afrikaans:
Mnr M J R DE VILLIERS: Agb Voorsitter, die stand van munisipaliteite varieer tussen uitstekend, gemiddeld, swak en onstabiel. Hierdie munisipaliteite is almal klein B en C munisipaliteite. Die probleem varieer tussen dienslewering, finansies, administrasie, funksies waarvoor daar geen mandate is nie, fondse betreffende gelykberegtiging en andere.
'n Munisipaliteit wat egter in 'n baie moeilike posisie verkeer, is die distriksmunisipaliteit Overberg. Die rede is omdat hierdie C munisipaliteit 'n baie klein eie inkomstebelastingbasis het.
Munisipalitiet Kaap Agulhas presteer baie goed en die behuisingsprojek is van uitstaande gehalte. 'n Voorbeeld word hier voorgedra vir ander munisipaliteite. Die Overstrand en Theewaterskloof munisipaliteite lewer ook 'n goeie diens van uitstekende gehalte aan die gemeenskappe, maar ervaar ook hul unieke probleme.
Munisipaliteit Swellendam word geteister met verskeie probleme, onder andere, die ongemagtigde spandering van fondse, wanbesteding, vrugtelose uitgawes, hofsake en onstabiele politieke bestuur. Ek het verneem dat die onstabiliteit nou besig is om uit te masel na 'n meer stabiele posisie, indien sekere prosesse deurgevoer word.
My tyd is min en daarom wil ek afsluit deur te sê dat hierdie week se Suid-Afrikaanse Vereniging vir Plaaslike Regerings, Salga, en NRVP bespreking baie goed was, en veral funksioneel doeltreffend was om die munisipalitiete en Salga te ondertsteun en te help.
As 'n munisipaliteit struikel of sukkel, dan is dit ons mense wat seerkry. Daarom moet ons paraat en antisiperend wees met planne, en laastens, baie doeltreffend wees met ons verskillende rolle en funksies.
In afsluiting, wil ek baie dankie sê aan die personeel vir die ondersteuning. Dankie. [Applous.]
Cllr N HERMANS (Salga)/TH (Afr)//nvs(Afr)/ Mandla /Src (Ch Eng)/ END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 157
Mr M J R DE VILLIERS
Cllr N HERMANS (Salga): Hon Chairperson of the NCOP Ntate [Mr] Mahlangu, hon Chairperson of Salga Rre [Mr] Manyoni, hon Members of Parliament and members of provincial legislatures, hon executive mayors, mayors and councillors, ladies and gentlemen, all having been protocol observed. In terms of advancing our collective efforts to strengthen the delivery of services to our people, I want to say that this week permanent delegates to the NCOP met with leaders of various provincial legislatures and other stakeholders, such as local government and the SA Local Government Association, Salga.
The provincial week is a critical platform for permanent delegates to the NCOP and for members of local legislatures, MPLs, to interact and engage with various government departments, municipalities and invited guests. A number of issues have arisen from this most recent interaction, which require our attention.
We must re-emphasise the importance of oversight visits being well planned and co-ordinated to avoid an oversight stampede at local government level. We want to say that municipalities should be involved at the planning stage to ensure that proper engagement takes place at an administrative level and also at a political level - not forgetting the fact that this House does have a right not to announce its visits to municipalities, because it is playing an important role.
As Salga, we also want to say that building on the excellent platform created by the NCOP Local Government Week that took place this week, our partnership, which we call a marriage, must be enforced. The message must be sent that local government and councillors are as important as their counterparts in the provincial and national legislatures. Such an approach will also strengthen the principle of co-operative governance and the institutional integrity of local government. We say that where there are problems, let us assess, identify and address those problems together.
Another key challenge is the understanding of the co-operative governance model and the respective roles of, in particular, provincial and local government. The role of Salga is often not clearly understood. In particular, it must be reconfirmed that Salga has no oversight or executive powers over municipalities. The role of Salga in municipalities is an advisory role in which it gives support and representation.
I think the hon Chair will also agree with me that it is about time that the Organised Local Government Act be reviewed in order to strengthen the role that Salga is supposed to play at the local level.
We must recognise that there has been substantial improvement of audit outcomes over the past seven years. During this period, we have seen unqualified audits increasing from 23% to 45%, while disclaimers and adverse opinions, together with audits not finalised, have decreased from 51% to 35%. This, in itself, is remarkable, given the pace and complexity of financial reforms over the same period.
During this Women's Month, we need to acknowledge that of the 13 municipalities that received clean audits, four are municipalities led by women. [Applause.] To showcase the fact that women are performing at the levels where they are deployed, of the presentations that were made during this week, one was by the mayor of Fetakgomo, who also showcased that women can make a difference where they are.
I would also like to congratulate the hon Minister Nkosazana Dlamini-Zuma, our own cadre from our ranks, a daughter of the soil who is one of us, a woman of substance who is now flying our flag on the African continent. The voices of women were heard, way back, before democracy, before women had organised structures, and they were there to say, "We want to make a difference." They were ravaged by the system of discrimination, but they were always saying: Wathint'abafazi, wathint'imbhokotho. [You strike the women, you strike a rock.]
In 1913, women were there to give advice ... [Time expired.] Thank you. [Applause.]
Ms N D NTWANAMBI
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 157
Cllr N HERMANS (Salga)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE NCOP: Chairperson, hon Mahlangu, hon Manyoni and the entire leadership of Salga, special delegates, MECs, hon members ... hayi mani wonke umntu [everybody], let me start by saying, you know ...
IsiXhosa:
... kukho izinto ezifuzwayo.
English:
I should have warned you that I'm going to speak in isiXhosa.
IsiXhosa:
Kukho izinto ezifuzwayo kweminye imibutho. Abantu bathetha bathethe babaleke bangafuni ukumamela kodwa besibamamele bona.
English:
Let me start by referring to the member from Cope and tell him that ...
IsiXhosa:
... xa ndijonge i-Cope, ndibona abantu abangamasela, ozungul'ichele, abantu abangaqinanga abanamathambo afana no-snoek. Abantu ...
English:
... as a member of Cope ...
IsiXhosa:
... yakhe yatsho ngela xesha kwakusemnandi. Yathi: "Wena mntu ukhomba indlela uphinde ujike, ulutshaba lwenkululeko". Ngela xesha ndandisafundisa, abantu abakopayo ndandibabetha ngenxa yokungakwazi ukuthetha kakuhle into ebithethwe ngomnye umntu. Ndiyafuna ukumkhumbuza umntu ukuba wayekhona ePolokwane kumba worhwaphilizo, kusenokwenzeka ukuba babebaleka ezi zigqibo baqonda ukuba mabayokwenza enye into. Ndiyamsizela ke kakhulu.
Ndiyafuna mhlobo wam ukukhumbuza ukuba thina ke asinawo umona, nenzondo kwaye sisazimisele ukusebenzela abantu. Mandimkhumbuze ohloniphekileyo, umama u-Van Lingen, othi uyakhokela. Thina ngesiXhosa sithi susa umqadi osesweni lakho kuqala ukuze ukwazi ukubona kakuhle, andimazi ukuba ubona njani kuba amehlo akhe omabini agcwele iintongo.
Uthetha ngecandelo lama-56 lobulawuli. Ulibele ukuba apha kwisiThili sase-Eden, eNtshona Koloni, lo mtshato wabo ungaqinanga ubhetyebhetye endingawaziyo nokuba ngowuphina na kwezi ndidi zemitshato, bawenze ngokugxotha abantu bafaka abanye;abo bafakiweyo baba zizigxina ukuze bathi nokuba bangaphuma kule nto batshate nayo basale bengamalungu abo. Ngoku xa ibonwa kwezinye iindawo akayiboni kakuhle. Tshayela endlini yakho ke kuqala.
English:
It is also not true ...
IsiXhosa:
... maLungu ale Ndlu ibekekileyo, kwaye ndifuna niyazi ukuba ...
English:
... I'm saying this without really contradicting myself.
IsiXhosa:
Ndililungu elimele iNtshona Koloni kodwa njengokuba ndimi kule ndawo, ukhe ubone xa ushumayela phaya ecaweni umi epulpitini, kufuneka uthethe inyaniso.
English:
So, I'm trying to do that.
IsiXhosa:
Andibethi bona, ndibetha le nto bangenayo ekuthiwa yinyaniso.
English:
It is not true that we give insufficient time to prepare for provincial weeks. That is not true. We plan with provinces. We don't plan alone. The SA Local Government Association, Salga, is also represented when we do planning, particularly in our programming meetings. Therefore, people must say exactly what we do here.
IsiXhosa:
Kungenjalo batsho xa bengenawo amandla. Kwakhona ...
English:
... in that very Overberg District, if you look at issues of housing, it is housing for a few and, if anything happens in this province, it is to divide the working class people in terms of their race. I then want to conclude by saying if you go to Cape Agulhas, for instance ...
IsiXhosa:
... uyakufumanisa ukuba izindlu zenzelwe abantu bebala kuphela. Abantu bethu basahlala ematyotyombeni kwaye umasipala akanguye owabantu abathile, ngowabantu.
English:
Let me come back to exactly why we are here for today. I also want to start from where Cllr Hermans finished off in that ...
IsiXhosa:
Abantu abangazi nto bacinga ukuba umzabalazo wamakhosikazi waqala ngonyaka we-1956, akunjalo ke kuba ngonyaka we-1913 sasisele sikhona.
English:
As we prepare for next week, the launch of our centenary celebrations next year ... Therefore, here in the ANC, it's always hundreds and hundreds and over hundreds.
To save time I don't want to repeat what has been said, but I want to emphasise what has been raised here.
This workshop raised a united voice of concern about financial challenges facing many municipalities across the country. These are municipalities with disclaimers, adverse financial reports, repeat disclaimers and adverse reports, njalonjalo [etc]; financial management, internal controls, irregular expenditure and underspending; fruitless and wasteful and/or unauthorised expenditure, and number of incomplete projects, as well as noncompliance.
One other thing that was also discovered here was that many municipalities are still weak and ineffective, and really cannot do their work. I want to support the hon MEC from Mpumalanga. One of the things that we tend to forget when we really beat and bash them is the fact that we come from a system which used to have villages. Sometimes we don't count such things and don't count how many municipalities were really municipalities, even then. Our concentration is on those poor municipalities that are not performing. Sometimes it is not their fault, but as ANC members, we will tell our own comrades that ...
IsiXhosa:
... uyabona ke ngoku, uyamosha kwaye siyakususa ngoku. Njengoko i-Limpopo isisitho [as Limpompo says.] Umsebenzi obekelwe wona kukunceda nokukhonza abantu hayi ukuhlohla esakho apha.
English:
We are completely against that.
One of the other challenges that threatens service delivery and good governance is this inability. Of course, we can't leave out the issue of tendering in municipalities.
IsiXhosa:
Ukuba sifuna ukulungisa oomasipala into yokuqala izakuba yileyo. Indlela esithenga ngayo ayilunganga. Kuthenga u-Ouma kuba engumhlobo wam, nam ndingumeya ndixelele ubani ukuba aze ajonge le kaBoroto.
English:
Why do we do those things?
IsiXhosa:
Ndivale ke Mhlalingaphambili ngelithi.
English:
We are truly grateful to all the provincial legislatures and municipalities who continue to work in partnership with the NCOP, those who participate and have participated in our provincial week and provincial weeks that were always there. We make sure that when we go to the provinces, we look at issues of concurrency.
IsiXhosa:
Asikhe sithi siyokufuna izinto zeSebe lezoKhuseleko namaGqala oMkhosi.
English:
That is not our mandate. We do want to tell people that. Before ...
IsiXhosa:
... uthi ixesha lam liphelile Mhlalingaphambili.
English:
I also want to say, from now on, with this new marriage, we have learnt something, that if we plan without Salga and the provinces - but without Salga in particular -
IsiXhosa:
Siza kuyibhuda nathi.
English:
I also want us to further discuss, and where necessary, amend the laws so that Salga can make a meaningful contribution to the governance of our country. I thank you, Chair. [Applause.]
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP / Nb /Robyn – ed Eng/ END OF TAKE
UNREVISED HANSARD
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
Friday, 3 August 2012 Take: 158
Ms N D NTWANAMBI
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Chairperson, I will not be long. The Chief Whip has already touched on the issue of co-ordination for the provincial week, which has been mentioned by Mr van Rooyen and some members. We are trying our best and you know that, at my level, I communicate with the speakers of provinces. At the level of House Chairperson, Mr Tau will co-ordinate with the chairs of chairs; and at the level of Chief Whips, the hon Ntwanambi will co-ordinate with the chief whips of the provinces.
We are really trying our best, but there is always room for improvement. What we have done to improve this now is that for every joint programming committee we will get all the provinces here. Before dealing with the Joint Rules Committee, we will meet the provinces first, we will listen to their complaints and we will then put forward proposals to the Joint Rules Committee so that the framework can accommodate them throughout the year, or throughout the quarter, whatever the case may be. I think that we can still improve on that and we have noted it. Thank you very much.
Successful people are those people who do make mistakes. When they make a mistake, they look at themselves and say, "My goodness, I have made a mistake," and correct that mistake, and get onto the right path in order to succeed. Those are successful people. You can't succeed if you say, "I've made a mistake" and then just leave it at that. When you make a mistake, you should correct it and move on.
There are those people, for example, athletes, who, when they fall in a race, they get up quickly and run. Similarly, when you playing soccer: when you fall, you do not continue to lie down even if you are uninjured. You get up, run after the ball and score. Those are the types of people we need in leadership in order for us to be successful.
We are given the opportunity to do that here: Find the fault, wake up, rectify it, and move on. So, let us not criticise ourselves too much. Let's also say that we have done a very good job but we can improve on the good job we have done. [Applause.]
Some people, including the national chairperson, Mr Manyoni, have raised very important issues. We have noted the issues that you have raised, especially the unfunded mandate issue that eats up the budgets of the municipalities. I think that is the first thing that we need to tackle. Thank you for coming up with quite a number of suggestions in that we will have to sit down and go through the suggestions to see how we can deal with them.
Mr Chaane, you have done your homework very well today. Where is he? Has he left? [Interjections.] You did your homework very well. You did very good research. You have actually responded to almost everything in terms of the legislation that we have, and what we should do to implement the important things. Those systems, structures and laws are there. The question we need to ask is the extent to which we need to implement those things. If we do, what are the gaps in our systems and laws that we have passed; and what are we doing to change that, or amend whatever we are doing in order to see or benefit from the fruits of the legislation that we have passed?
I want to agree with Mr Mokgobi and others: in that in order for us to measure ourselves, we need to set out a programme of action together. I think we should do that. Then next year when we meet, we will be able to say, "These are the things that we have achieved", and "These are the things that we have not achieved" and incorporate them into the new plan. We also need to find reasons why we have not achieved the things we intended to achieve.
Mr Mokgobi also mentions the issue of section 139. I would advise, if I may, that we should listen to each other while considering this. With regard to all the MECs who deal with co-operative governance and traditional affairs, Cogta, section 139, in my view, should actually be a last resort. I think we should try our level best to assist municipalities ... [Applause.] ... against all odds, and get in there with all the capacity we have, with whatever we can do, and assist those municipalities. It is only when we have failed completely ...
IsiZulu:
Sesibagezela izandla manje ...
English:
... then we can apply section 139. That should be used as a last resort.
There are other things we can think of. I am just throwing them in. I am not saying we should take a decision. I am just thinking a lot. Perhaps, we have already in the NCOP - Ms Magadla, and the staff - identified those municipalities that are in the intensive care unit. The thing is: What should we do? From now on we need to take those municipalities out of the ICU and to the wards, doctor them in the wards, and take them home. From there they can come in for checkups once or twice a month until we are sure they have healed. That is a process we have to look at.
Secondly, in order to do that, maybe we should also look at what measures we are going to use to do that – to take them out of the ICU. We may want to propose that we form a small joint committee that will look at those municipalities closely, and report from time to time to one another - as well as to the House - regarding improvements and how we are moving in terms of getting those municipalities out of the ICU.
Lastly, maybe we should come to a point at which we say that one Member of Parliament should adopt one municipality that is in the ICU.
I can tell you that every term of Parliament I adopt no less than two schools. And all the schools I have adopted, I have taken them out of the ICU, and all of them now maintain an above 60% pass rate in matric. [Applause.]
I make sure that I am there, talking to students and the teachers, getting them computers if they need them, getting them everything they need. I communicate with MECs and I communicate with whomever at national level to sort things out. Quietly, we get there and do the work; the work is done, and the results are there.
May I now take this opportunity to thank all those who participated in the debate. I think you were wonderful. This is how we can learn from each other, and this is how we can defend our democracy together. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Debate concluded: Outcomes of the Local Government Week – 31 July to 3 August 2012: Accelerating service delivery and addressing challenges through effective co-operative governance.
Debate concluded: Consideration of Provincial Week Report – 16 April to 20 April 2012: Operation Clean Audit 2014: Advancing our collective efforts to strengthen our municipalities to deliver quality services to our people.
Question put: That the Provincial Week Report – 16 April to 20 April 2012: Operation Clean Audit 2014: Advancing our collective efforts to strengthen our municipalities to deliver quality services to our people be adopted.
IN FAVOUR: Eastern Cape, Free State, Gauteng, KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo, Mpumalanga, Northern Cape, North West, Western Cape.
Report accordingly adopted in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
The Council adjourned at 12:43.
JN Eng/Zulu ///tfm/// LB (final edit) / END OF TAKE
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