Hansard: Approppriation Bill: Debate on Vote No 4 — Home Affairs

House: National Assembly

Date of Meeting: 24 Apr 2012

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Minutes

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Takes: 374


APPROPRIATION BILL

Debate on Vote No 4-Home Affairs:

The MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS (Dr N C Dlamini-Zuma): Thank you Chairperson, I know the Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee is not here but I am greeting the committee as a whole, Members of the National Assembly, Ministers and Deputy Ministers present, Deputy Minister of Home Affairs, Fatima Chohan, the Chairperson of the Independent Electoral Commission, Advocate Pansy Tlakula, the representative of the Chairperson of the Films and Publications Board, Thoko Mpumlwana, the CEO of the Government Printing Works, Dr Tony Mbewu, hon guests, Members of the Stakeholder Forums, I greet you all.

I arrived yesterday from Egypt and amongst others things which I did there was to participate in a seminar to celebrate the Centenary of the African National Congress. This centenary was cohosted by the Foreign Ministry of Egypt and the African Society of Egypt. I think we must ask ourselves a question: why is the world interested in celebrating this history? We think it is because of the lessons and values that are embodied in that struggle or centenary

As the Department of Home Affairs, we asked ourselves: how can we be part of this celebration? We decided that the best way of being part of this celebration is to draw the same values and lessons and see how they relate to our day-to-day work. We agreed that through the century, the struggle was conducted with humility, discipline, honesty, integrity, loyalty, unwavering patriotism and unity.

It was also both men and women of all races who participated in the struggle. We had discussions within the management about how we will embody these values in our department. We had a big meeting with about a thousand people of Home Affairs, where we were discussing our strategic plan but we also discussed what values must inform the work of Home Affairs and agreed upon them. We decided to sign a pledge, as Home Affairs, that we will serve our people using those values, in our front offices, in the back offices and in everything that we do. The pledge is there and people can see it afterwards. We think that it is not just a pledge by name or word but by deed as well because, indeed, our frontline offices are working very well at internalising those values but, of course, there is always room for improvement.

We have been talking about getting people to register their babies within 30 days of birth, and when people turn sixteen, they must ensure that they apply for their Identity documents. We are happy to report that, judging from the figures of the past year, 51% of all babies born were registered within 30 days. [Applause.] We should be happy about this although we should remember that 49% of the population has broken the law by not registering their babies within 30 days. We must work at educating people that failing to register a child's birth within 30 days is breaking the law; it is not just a nicety, it is the law. The department is trying to meet people half way; we have more than 250 hospitals that are connected to Home Affairs so that when people deliver their babies they can register them. We also have many of our employees in a number of hospitals assisting with the collections of forms and so on. We have mobile offices, therefore, there is no reason why people should not be registering their babies within 30 days as required by the law.

We also visit schools to ensure that when children turn 16 years of age apply for Identity Documents. A few years ago – those who were part of Home Affairs will recall that - we were complaining that every year, we produce more reissue IDs than new applications. We are happy to report that that trend has been reversed because now we produce more new IDs than reissues. This means that people are beginning to look after their IDs and therefore we would like to thank the public for heeding to that call.

We must remember that one of the most hated and prominent apartheid features was the pass law. In fact, the book that came from the pass law - for us, who are a bit darker - was called a dompas. The theme of my talk today is: from a dompas to a Smart Card. [Applause.]

As part of restoring the dignity and ensuring that we are all united as one nation, one identity, and one citizenship. As we promised, last year, in our strategic plan that we will be piloting the Smart Card, we are doing that - after this, those who have not seen it can go and see the demonstration. The Smart Card that we are piloting has now been produced, you can even see how to read and verify it because it is smart. It is not just about what we see on it but what you do not see. It has a microchip containing one's information and other security features.

When this Smart Card is rolled out, it will have to be rolled out with machines that can read it to ensure that what you see on it is the same as what is written - because we know that those who will try to forge it might be able to forge what is displayed there but they will be unable to forge what is embedded in it. That is very important and that is why it is called a Smart Card. [Applause.]

Outside is a demonstration showing how we read and verify a Smart Card and later we will discuss at length about how it is going to be rolled out but today because you only gave me 20 minutes, I cannot go into that.

We should also remember some of the people who led the struggle against the dompas, starting from the Women's March in 1913 in the Free State [Interjections.] right to the one in Zeerust and all the other places. We want to honour all those women, we will not mention all of them by name but we want to honour them. We want to honour everyone who participated because it was not just the women who were in this struggle, it was everybody because the dompas was used to oppress, control, humiliate, and all sorts of things. Going to those offices to apply for the dompas was equally humiliating. That is why we are going from dompas to Smart Card and from humiliating service to smart and compassionate service.

With this Smart Card, we are changing our systems; some of you will know that we have a population register, a refugees system that is standing on its own and an immigration system also standing on its own. We want to have one system so that, at a go, you can tell the identification and the status of a person. At the moment one cannot tell, in real time, who the person is.

When you look at our population register, it will tell you who the South Africans are; but you have to go to another system to check. People have learnt to beat the system. When you apply to refugee status today, a few months later, you bribe an official and you become a citizen. Because the systems are not together, you cannot tell, in real time, that this person is actually a refugee. That is why we are moving in that direction. This will help us clean our population register and ensure that when we issue the Smart Card, it is not issued to the wrong hands.

We are also aware that we have to skill people because when we produce the Smart Card, we will not use forms or the book, we will be using Information Technology, IT. Everything will be captured live and transmitted electronically for printing. Therefore, we need to upgrade our offices so that they will be able to accept applications online from signatures, fingerprints etc.

We need Sector Education and Training Authority, Seta, to assist us in strengthening our broadband. Due to the increase in the load of information from our offices because of the density of photos and fingerprints transmitted online, therefore that should be strengthened. That is why we have this pilot period so that we can get all those things in place before we do the final roll-out.

I want to acknowledge that, as we said last year, we will concentrate a lot on immigration but also on ensuring that our academy is working. We piloted a project with the Cubans, where we recruited 350 officials from the Defence Force. We trained them as immigration officers - South African trainers working with Cuban trainers. I am happy to say that all those officials are now at the O R Tambo International Airport, doing very well. The pilot has worked and so we will see how we are going to roll it out.

We also said that we will start the programme of reskilling officials at Home Affairs. We have more than 250 of them, currently enrolled for the course and when they finish, they will receive a South African Qualifications Authority Approved, Saqa, certificate. It is a Home Affairs qualification. This means that we will have a well-rounded official who can work in immigration, permitting, front line offices and so on. They will be able to work at any part of Home Affairs and will be conversant with any part; we are very happy that the process is on course. One half of the officials is in class and the other half is doing practical work and they will be graduating at the end of this year.

We want to say that this year, in September, South Africa will be hosting a Conference of African Ministers who deal with civic registration. This will be the second conference of its nature; two years ago we our inaugural conference in Ethiopia. We will be working side by side with Statistics South Africa; this has been approved by Cabinet. If eventually, we have free movement of people in our continent, it is important that each country knows who its citizens are. There is no point in having a visa free country, a visa free agreement with a country that does not know its citizens; it is important that we all work together.

We will be showcasing what we do but we will also be learning from what other countries do. The conference is aimed at encouraging and ensuring that every African country has a complete and secure population register.

We would like to thank the portfolio committee for the support and oversight; they keep us on our toes. We also would like to thank the officials of Home Affairs, from the Director-General, the senior management right up to the front line officers; they make the team that makes Home Affairs what it is. Let me also thank the Stakeholder Forums - some of the members are seated up there in the gallery – they do a day-to-day, on the spot, oversight all the time. They tell us what problems are there, and provide assistance in resolving them; therefore, we are working very well with them. We would like to thank the rest of the Cabinet, the President and the Deputy President for the support. We thank the members of the media, without them, we would be unable to communicate our messages to the public.

I have not covered some topics like, the issue of refugees and so on, but the Deputy Minister will be speaking on them. I am inviting all of you to the demonstration of how to read the Smart Card; you will find it very interesting. I thank you. [Applause.]

Adv A H GAUM / LIM... END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Takes: 375 & 376

The MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS

Adv A H GAUM: Chairperson, in this centenary year of the ANC, it is heart warming to be able to say that this department, once representing segregation and disdain for the majority of our people, has now become a door to opportunity, a protector of human dignity, equality and freedom for all.

The mission of the Department of Home Affairs is the efficient determination and safeguarding of the identity and status of citizens and the regulation of migration to ensure security, promote development and fulfil our international obligations. The department has three budget programmes through which this mandate is exercised namely administration, citizen affairs and immigration affairs.

I think there is a national consensus and that the opposition will agree that the Minister and her department have made important strides towards achieving this mission. One does get the impression that the Minister has identified the problems that have crippled the department for so long, and that she is addressing these problems one-by-one. No wonder that the DA was calling recently that she should stay in her position rather than move to that of Chairperson of the African Union.

Outcome 12 of the Government's Programme of Action calls for an efficient, effective and development orientated public service. The effectiveness of the department in delivering services can easily be assessed in line with national priorities, in that the Minister has implemented far more specific measureable outcomes for all three of its budget programmes since last year.

Progress that has been noted in its services from 2010 to 2011 include: Firstly, an 18% expansion of presence in health institutions for online birth registration, totalling 235 maternity facilities in 2011 and plans for a further 80 in 2012.

Secondly, an increase to 40 offices with live online passport capture and plans for a further 120 offices with both passports and identity documents, IDs captured electronically by the end of 2012-13.

Lastly, an increase to 100% of all matric learners being issued with IDs from 88% in 2010 and plans to maintain this in the coming years.

The best evidence, however, of whether there is progress in service delivery, comes not from annual performance reports, but from the testimony of members of the public who are at the receiving end, at the coal face, of Home Affairs services. My own experience in this regard is that the department's figures on significant improvement in the processing of IDs and passports and in the registration of births, is that these figures tell no lies, but are substantiated by the experiences of South African citizens. People I come across from all walks of life have witnessed these improvements in the dealings with Home Affairs offices and are impressed with the provision of new offices in areas that were not serviced before, the refurbishment of many of the department's offices and the improvement in the flow of customers as a result of the introduction of electronic queue management in larger offices. People's Home Affairs experiences have become far more pleasant ones.

On the other hand, there are still a number of weaker service delivery areas where, according to the department's own admission, it is still well off target or where targets have not been achieved. The processing of temporary and permanent residence permits, for example, still takes way too long. The average in 2010 was 16 weeks and in 2011 only 70% of permits were issued within 8 weeks.

Permanent residence applications averaged only 70% being finalised in 8 months, up from 6 months formerly. Much of these delays result from the centralisation of finalising these applications at head office to improve security and prevent fraud. The Director-General, DG, in answering questions in this regard recently, indicated that he now gets regular reports on which applications are received and which permits are issued per day, and that backlogs will be cleared by the end of this month, April. This is good news and our committee will continue to monitor the expansion of capacity and improving of service delivery in all areas to ensure that high standards are achieved and significant progress is made to address such weak links. The public deserves no less. [Applause.]

Outcome 5 calls for a skilled and capable workforce to support an inclusive growth path. We want to strongly support the establishment and accreditation of the department's own learning academy where officials are trained and skilled to make sure that they have the ability to meet the demands of the department. This has no doubt been a step in the right direction and we would like to congratulate the Minister for taking this initiative.

One can only have a skilled and capable workforce if funded vacancies are filled. It is a concern that too many funded vacancies in the department and the entities it is responsible for, have not been filled. The portfolio committee has engaged with the leadership of the department, the Film and Publications Board, Government Printing Works and the Electoral Commission and has received reports in this regard. The committee has indicated to the department as well as the entities that we expect an improvement in the current financial year.

A capable workforce is not only an able workforce, but also a willing workforce. For too long mediocrity has been the attitude of too many, particularly in the public service. We need to say loud and clear that we expect our workforce to be motivated, to be enthusiastic, to be friendly towards the public, to be hardworking, to be proud of their work and to have an attitude of selfless service to the people. We are not preaching to the converted and we have seen positive signs of change as well, but to those who remain negative in their approach, we need to say - this is the time to shape-up or ship-out.

Outcome 3 calls for a South Africa where all people are and feel safe. The primary consideration for the department in this regard is ensuring that we have secure and internationally accepted quality identification documents and that migration in and out of the country is regulated to the best possible standard.

We do indeed welcome the announcement of the ID smart card that the Minister has made in this regard today. There have been quite a number of technical difficulties over the past few years and we are really grateful that the process is on course now as has been demonstrated to us earlier as well.

In the 2012 state of the nation address, the President stressed the importance of improved border crossings, port capacity and Information and Communication Technology, ICT, as part of improving regional trade. So, whilst the department moves towards increased risk prevention and security, it should not forget and we are sure it wouldn't, the importance of facilitating the ease of movement of legal travellers for the sake of the country's and the region's development.

It is important for the sovereignty and integrity of every country to have proper control over foreigners that are allowed to enter its borders. We have vast and stretched out borders, including a long coastline. This presents huge challenges. On our oversight visits, the portfolio committee has come across concerning factors that do need much more reflection and considered action. Many illegal border crossings in the North take place relatively close to formal border posts and it seems that we will have to concentrate on the policing of areas in the vicinity of these border posts where there is road access.

Our coastline in effect is virtually unmonitored and unprotected. We simply need some kind of coastguard or further intragovernmental co-operation to alleviate this problem, and look into innovative solutions that had success elsewhere such as informants along the coast as well.

And we also need to improve our management of the status determination of refugees and asylum seekers. We need a dispensation where reception centres are close to the borders as soon as possible as envisaged by the Minister, so that these vulnerable persons are provided for as they arrive, and that this dispensation does not continue to be abused as a loophole in our law for anybody to enter the country. If we have to pass legislation in this regard we will have to do so.

If we have to pass legislation in this regard, we will have do so. These centres should be well equipped with full staff complements and professionally managed. Status determination should take place swiftly, and we will have to work much more co-operatively with our Southern African Development Community, SADC, neighbours in managing the increasing burden of displaced persons in the region.

At the same time, we need to send a strong message and increase public awareness that xenophobia is counterproductive for our development as a country and the continent, and simple has to be overcome. We consider it a despicable crime and will treat it as such.

When visiting Russia recently, portfolio committee discovered that the federal immigration board has the remarkable ability to indicate on an electronic map, the exact status and location of foreigners within the Russian borders. Such a system for South Africa maybe future music, but it is recently a class act to follow. It will help us, without limiting people's freedom of movement, to plan much better.

In our discussion with our Russian counterparts, the idea was mooted to lift visa requirements between our countries, particularly in view of our joint membership of Brics. The Russian seemed remarkably open to this idea, and we want to request the Minister to explore this idea to look into the possibility.

These days it has become quite a hassle for South Africans to travel due to stringent visa requirements from countries such as Britain, the USA, European countries and other countries. To apply for a British visa, for example Minister, now cost more than R1000 00, one has to go for an interview and you have to take along all your personal information, including bank statements for the past six months. They ask one during that interview whether you know anyone in Britain and if you dare answer in the affirmative, you have to provide the British with all sorts of private information of the people you know as well.

Whilst the Americans at least issue one with a 10 year visa, the British only provide a visa for a six month period of stay in Britain. Just imagine if all the money South Africans spend on visas could have been spent in the South African economy. These are matters we really need to look into, Minister, and see how we could assist our citizens in at the very least attempt to convince our foreign friend to relieve some of these requirements. If they feel they have to retain the requirement of a visa, it would for example help if they could reduce the costs or issue a visa for a longer period of time. If the Americans can, for example, issue a visa for 10 years, why can't Britain and the Schengen countries do the same?

Speaking of hassles, it has come to my attention that our marriage officers have to queue every month at the Department Home Affairs offices to register marriages. This, apparently, takes up a lot of their time. It will be of great assistance to them if we could make provision for online registration of marriages as part of our, information and communications technology, ICT, innovation process.

In conclusion, we want to congratulate the Minister and the department and the Deputy Minister for turning the tide towards an unqualified audit opinion. We trust that this trend will continue and that the new aim will become, in good time, the achievement of a clean audit.

A lot has been achieved. The ANC and the people of South Africa recognise that. May you and your department continue to achieve even more during this financial year. In her absence, we would also like to thank our chairperson, hon Maggie Maunye, for her dedication and hard work and wish her a speedy recovery from a recent eye operation.

The ANC supports the budget. Thank you. [Applause.]

Mr M S F DE FREITAS / AZM MNGUNI & Nb / END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Takes: 376 & 377

Adv A H GAUM

Mr M S F DE FREITAS: Chairperson, allow me to start off by saying that after a relatively short amount of time in this portfolio, my research clearly indicates that the hon Minister is working hard on improving this department. Additionally, she has brought the portfolio committee into her confidence when she was honest and open with the challenges that she still has to face despite the improvements and success that she has achieved

Before discussing the Department of Home Affairs, allow me to comment on the electoral commission. This is an entity which all government entities should seek to emulate as it is devoid of scandals and political intrigue that so many other similar bodies face. It is run professionally and efficiently. It does not allow itself to be bullied by any political party, irrespective of how big or small may be.

As a result, it is respected all round both locally and internationally to such an extent that other countries, with longer and more established democracies than ours, seek the advice of our very own Independent Electoral Commission, IEC. We can only puff our chests out with pride when talking about them. Thank you IEC for making South Africa proud.

When it comes to the Film and Publication board, it is clear that there is no discernible reason why the board should form part of this portfolio. Even the Minister agreed and admitted that she simple inherited this entity when she was appointed Minister of Home Affairs

Accordingly, Cabinet should seriously look at placing its entity under the more logical guardianship of the Department of Justice and Constitutional Development.

The government printing works, its greatest challenge is to ironically publish less printing but to rather produce more environmentally friendly electronic publications. We support this plan.

I'm delivering this speech in a spirit of providing suggestions to some of the challenges that this department confronts. In three shorts months that I have had this portfolio, I've made a number of observations. I urge the hon Minister and Deputy Minister to take note of these observations and solutions that I believe should be considered to improve this department, thus providing citizens and others the dignity and service that they deserve.

The greatest issue is, by far, the battle that applicants have to fight so that they can obtain their desired applications. An example is that of Mr Yenzani Ncube who made a permanent resident application 12 years ago. He continues to wait for his matter to be resolved. It is clear that in some sectors of the department, processes are simply too slow and cumbersome and as a result very unfriendly to the public. I have been unable to help Mr Ncube as I take on his matter.

Almost on a daily basis, I receive heart-wrenching queries from asylum seekers who have suffered in their country of origin only to come back to our country to suffer even more because applications are not being processed speedily enough or handledcorrectly. As a result, we have 1000 of refugees who are technically illegal in South Africa through no fault of their own because of this very department.

I knew numerous examples of people from all over Africa have been in limbo for as long as 18 months. Again, procedures and processes need to be more rapid as many of these people are able to bring in much needed skills that we need in the development of our economy. This is without mentioning the emotional and economic trauma that this causes to these fellow Africans.

Clearly, there is a problem with the issuing of documentation such as unabridged birth certificates and marriage certificates. This simply takes too long. It is obvious to me that much of this documentation has not been computerised and automated. If documents were computerised, applicants would be able to receive their documents through just a click of the mouse.

The hon Minister needs to be congratulated on the marked improvements on the issuing of identity documents. However, there stillappears to be hurdles on such applications. This has a direct impact on people's lives. Without an ID book, people are unable to obtain credits, find employment write an exam and pretty much are unable to exit in South Africa. This has implications for the economy. Some officials and I stress only some, appear oblivious or indifferent on the impact this has on people's lives.

Duplicate IDs continue to plague the system with two or more people have the same ID number and/or name usually because of no fault of their own. However, the treatment that these parties receive from the Department of Home Affairs implies that it is their fault. Clearly, the system is lacking so that duplicates are recurring all the time.

I would like to use the example of a person that approached the DA office in desperation, in June 2011. Ms Justine Paula Robilliard applied last year at the Durban office for a forename, surname and gender change of her details on the population register. In October 2011, the forename was indeed amended and Miss Robilliard was issued a new ID book.

In January 2012, on advice of Home Affairs, she returned her ID book and certificate in order for his surname and gender modification to be amended. She requested the department not to issue her ID book until her details were amended correctly, which is quite correct. In the meantime, as Home Affairs drags its feet, Miss Robilliard has a drivers licence that is about to expire and she cannot renew it. She is unable to travel as she cannot obtain a valid passport and is unable to obtain employment. She is unable to sort out her credit history and so she remains unemployed.

Legislation allows anyone to change their names as many times as they wish. However, officials in the department appear to make up legislation as they go along, by advising Miss Robilliard that she is entitled to a maximum of only 3 names changes every year. No such limitation exists. In addition to the social and emotional trauma this applicant has had to endure, Home Affairs will also not amend her gender, despite her meeting all legislative requirements and criteria. I can't help feeling that certain officials, who may have a personal issue with such applications, are simply refusing to follow the rule of law here.

On Monday, this week, I was pleasantly surprised when I received a call from Miss Robilliard advising me that she had now, indeed, received her ID. However, the subsequent e-mail of that same day reads as follows:

I have just received via a courier service a certificate from the Pretoria Home Affairs, there is a problem with the certificate, the name is incorrect spelt and the ID number is incorrect

This is just one example of how one person's life has been turned upside down and inside out, simply because the department is not doing what it should be doing correctly.

The cases pour into my office, as officials appear to have forgotten that they are there to serve South Africa and its best interest. Take the example of foreign students who have been denied visa extension to fulfil their internships. Officials suddenly introduced new regulations that simply do not exist and are not covered in legislation. Additionally, these same officials demonstrate the naivety and ignorance that their actions have on South Africa, its economic development and the creation of job opportunities and skills development of our people.

The cases I'm working on include how these students are being treated like criminals, despite having done nothing wrong and in fact trying to meet our laws. The advanced skills that they bring in and how we can take advantage of these skills is totally missed by some the Department of Home Affairs officials, DHA.

As a result, skilled students and specialists within the medical, oil and gas industry for example, are not staying in the country, simply because they are required to provide a letter from a South African higher education institution confirming that an agreement exists between that local institution and the applicant's higher education institution abroad.

Besides the fact that there is nothing in legislation compelling us, it also demonstrates the officials' lack of understanding of what internship is in the first place. To make it worse, it appears that different students from different countries are treated differently, with no consistency in many cases. Clearly, a number of top officials are themselves uninformed with regard to legislation. Proper education and training is required so that this type of thing doesn't happen. How is it possible that officials', who should be performing actions in our laws, themselves do not understand?

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M B Skosana): Hon member, you have one minute left.

Mr M S F DE FREITAS: Thank you. Finally, it appears that the lack of response that I generally experienced from the Department of Home Affairs, DHA, on my queries, filters right up to the Minister's office. Of all the questions I have submitted for written reply, I have not had the courtesy of a single reply to any of my questions. Again, just like legislation, and despite parliamentary rules compelling the Minister to respond to questions within a specific time, this is simply ignored.

With respect, hon Minister, hopefully this will also improve. I would like to thank my staff, particularly my secretary, Amanda Beukes and my assistant Gaynor Lucas, for their unbelievably excellent support and dedication in assisting me ... [Interjections.]... with the hundreds of queries that I had received and the many people who approached me.

I dream that we will soon reach the stage where South Africans will receive quick, efficient and effective service from Home Affairs departments and where any experience with this department will be a pleasant one. This is the goal worth working towards ... [Time Expired.] [Interjections.] [Applause.]

Mr G B D MC INTOSH / Nb & Theo/ END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Take: 377

Mr M S F DE FREITAS

Mr G B D MC INTOSH: Thank you, Mr Chairman for the time. I will try to keep to seven minutes. I am sorry that our chairlady is not with us. She is a great leader of our committee which is a really happy committee. We all get on well together and we wish her well.

I do want to say how pleased I was when I glanced at the exhibition to see the pledge because its values which build a society and the values in that pledge are the sort of values that we want for us. I believe that in the department we are seeing those values being applied more and more.

Today in South Africa, at all levels of government, we see areas of excellence but others that are really struggling. Some are recovering and improving. One of those departments that is moving from struggling to excellence is Home Affairs.

The Director General, Mr Mkuseli Apleni and all of his senior staff team are to be congratulated on how they are turning and streamlining the department that was almost dysfunctional. [Applause.] I think that the Minister and Deputy Minister have given good leadership as well.

One of the great things about our democratic society since 1994 is that Members of Parliament, MPs, have opportunities for oversight and inspection that we never had before. I can go, with politeness and courtesy, to any government department or any prison and gain access, as of right as a MP, ask questions and inspect.

The challenge for officials is to accept that an MP who does that, in a polite way, is only doing his or her work. Similarly if he or she uncovers inefficiencies, large or small, and brings them to the attention of the Minister or officials, they must not resent those actions, complain or be angry with the officials who may be below them.

In the last few weeks I made two unannounced visits to Home Affairs offices. In Oudtshoorn I noticed that the offices are well signposted and branded, but they are not near public transport. They are on the outskirts of the town. The manager of the office, Mr Carl Booysen was helpful and seemed efficient. The office made a good impression. It's a long move from the days of kwaNdabazabantu to Home Affairs. [Applause.]

One of Mr Booysen's difficulties is obtaining enough service for checking on illegal immigrants who are moving into the towns of the Little Karoo. Apparently the Port Elizabeth office, where the inspector is based, is understaffed and he is not able to come as often as he would like.

A hero and a champion in the department – and I'm sure that there are many who live out that pledge that I had just been reading – is a lady called Hlengiwe Ngcobo. She is a fine example of a civil servant who works hard, serves the people and does so pleasantly. She is in charge of the Estcourt, KwaZulu-Natal office. The team that she has does its best, and they often work overtime to complete their work.

I discovered quite by chance, that there was no photocopier in the office, but Hlengiwe did not do nothing. She made a plan and had photocopies made at a nearby shop. When I pointed this out to the Minister in October 2011, she said she would attend to it. The photocopier arrived last month and Hlengiwe and her team were hugely excited and grateful. How can a Home Affairs office function without a photocopier?

Furthermore, in the office there is no cleaner so the office staff have to clean their own offices, and that includes cleaning the toilets. When I inspected the baby-changing room, there was only a shelf but no bins. There was a neat little pile of used, disposable nappies lying in the corner and it didn't smell like roses. [Laughter.]

The Minister referred to the excellent job of replacing all the immigration officers at the OR Tambo International Airport. There were problems there and the new recruits from the South African National Defence Force, whom she referred to, were trained in the Northern Cape, moved to OR Tambo International Airport and there was a changeover. I think that's to the credit of the Director-General and his staff.

I want to pose a question to the Minister. She made a political decision to employ people from an island in the Caribbean – where only Spanish is spoken, where there are no land borders and only one quiet international airport – as trainers. Furthermore, the island of Cuba is ruled by a communist regime which denies its people free political activity. The point is that their values are in direct conflict with the values in that beautiful pledge which the Minister has brought to us.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M B Skosana): Hon member, you have one minute left.

Mr G B D MC INTOSH: Okay. I believe that the Minster owes us an explanation as to why she invited Cubans and not English-speaking people from a number of other countries. [Interjections.]

Furthermore, I think the Minister must make clear what her and her fellow communists' attitudes are on countries like Cuba and North Korea. I am thinking particularly of her possible chairmanship of the African Union, AU. I think the AU would like to know where she stands in relation to, and her views on the two or three remaining oppressive communist regimes.

Finally, I think we must compliment the two independent units in the government printing works. I congratulate the Minister on appointing a leader for the printing works, even though she said he's a doctor like herself and a cardiologist. He is going to do a great job there and he has a very good team to lead.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M B Skosana): Hon member, your time is expired.

Ms H N MAKHUBA / TH / END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Take: 378

Mr G B D McINTOSH

Ms H N MAKHUBA: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister. South Africa is not only an attractive opportunity for Foreign Direct Investment, FDI, but also a unique travel destination, a veritable gateway to Africa and protector of human rights on the continent of Africa. Due to this standing, the challenges associated with the movement of people, both into and out of the country are immense, and the task of facilitation of same requiring extraordinary competence, planning, foresight and strategy by the Department of Home Affairs.

The department must be congratulated for the successful implementations of the following programmes and campaigns; the online finger verification with the South African Banking Risk Information Centre , SABRIC, the birth registration within 30days of birth, the documentation of Zimbabwean nationals, and we wish to see this also occur with nationals from other neighbouring countries like Lesotho, Swaziland and Botswana.

This will actually assist the Department of Home Affairs, DHA, to get an accurate idea of how many foreign nationals from neighbouring countries are in our country legally.

The IFP welcomes the key areas of focus by the department where they plan to transform the department by modernising their systems and establishing secure responsive and effective immigration, as this will attend to challenges and problems that still exist and require urgent attention.

The duplication of identity document must not be allowed to occur. Adequate oversight and monitoring mechanisms must be put in place, and duplication through negligence or criminal activities must be brought to an end. The backlog of identity documents applied for but not yet received must be addressed, and the issuance system thoroughly checked, its weak points identified, and measures put in place to ensure timeous execution and delivery of identity documents to our citizen. The impact of such backlog has devastating effects on social grant beneficiaries, who are amongst our most vulnerable.

Adequate human resources must also be placed at various ports of entry and border lines, in order to prevent human trafficking and illegal entry of persons in South Africa. The IFP welcomes the prioritization of the strengthening of port of entry where the R120 million has been made available for upgrades to our sea port infrastructure.

Equal opportunity and employment practices particularly in respect of the disabled must be promoted by the department, and we ask for grater attention to this aspect by the Minister and her human resources staff. Officials found guilty of corrupt activities must be speedily prosecuted and made examples of what is no longer tolerated within the department.

One of the greatest challenges facing refugees in South Africa has been promoting their reintegration into host communities combating the resultant xenophobia, and allowing them space to create new lives for themselves on South African soil. The department has a critical role to play in respect of this reintegration.

The recent closure of the refugee asylum centre in Port Elizabeth, before finding suitable alternative premises, sent the completely wrong message to the refugee populace in that area .We therefore urge the Minister and department to ensure that a situation like that does not occur again. Equal and just administrative action must be extension to all within our borders irrespective of nationality.

In conclusion, a great deal has been put in place and it is working extremely well. The department must keep striving to improve upon its processes and procedures, maintain vigorous oversight thereof and continually set itself higher standards of performance. The IFP supports the Budget vote. Thank you. [Applause.]

Ms N A MNISI / E.K.S

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Takes: 378 & 379

Ms H N MAKHUBA

Ms N A MNISI: Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Minister, the Director General of Home Affairs and officials, guests in the gallery. The birth of our nation in 1994, demonstrated the strength of centripetal and centrifugal forces in shaping a polity and developmental path of any nation. While some for fear of the unknown, hastily rushed out to unknown lands, abandoning the land that had imparted to them a bogus status of Baas and Mrs, and catapulted them to opulence, those in their motherland could only dream of.

Torrents of others for hope of an imminent better life for all rained into our beautiful country. Those who knew and trusted the ANC, knew that a true democracy was on its way, and those who understood our values of Ubuntu, knew that no home would be better than the one ANC of South Africa was building.

In describing the humane spirit of South Africans uBaba u OR Tambo had this to say:

The statement which declares South Africa belongs to all who lives in it, is a drastic concession on the part of the African people, but it is a demonstration of the willingness of the African people to live in South Africa with everybody who wants to live there on the basis of absolute equality – no racism; no racial discrimination; no superior race and no inferior race. On that basis South Africa belongs to all who lives in it.

You need to go through history to understand how this declaration has been abused by some, because they prefer and still continue to prefer only one part of the deal. Comrade Tambo made it clear that the declaration is not unconditional, but is based on absolute equality.

However what we have termed as the ANC, colonialism of a special type, as the colonizer and the colonized share the same geographic space; has caused some to cherry-pick the deal. They continue to claim ownership, whilst disdaining the equality imperative that comes with the package .Shall we again remind them that equality is the basis of this tenuous co-ownership, and if you keep on shunning substantive equality and work hard to deprive the vulnerable of their birthright, the co-ownership is at a serious risk.

Hon Chairperson, the question is not whether people come from South Africa, nor is , who comes through our borders, but it is why people come through our borders. Unfortunately reality has it that, not all who come through our borders have honourable intentions and bona fide motives. Some come into our country to help us build a nation steeped in unity in plurality, join us on our journey to a National Democratic Society. Some, like a thief in the night, come with same purpose of harming our beautiful nation and country.

To those we say, the time has come to turn the tide, we never had criminals in mind when building a Constitutional Supremacy, this land of our fore fathers, as President Makgatho said, shall never under our watch become a hide out for criminals.

The Polokwane National Conference of the ANC, gave us a mandate to revise the Immigration Act to ensure that it promotes development while addressing national and regional security concerns. Hon members, we stand here today proudly because we have executed that mandate and await the effect of the measures and the legitimate purpose they are meant to achieve.

We remain conscious that we cannot abdicate our international obligations and our humanist approach; it is exactly on those grounds we assert that there must be a comfortable balance between international interest and national interest.

National interest is not only about security, but about development. It therefore behoves us who are beset with a troika of challenges, namely, growing unemployment, deepening poverty and widening inequality; that we attract and accommodate skill and foreign direct investment. However the onus of sifting the genuine from the simulated is cast on the department.

The need for economic, cultural and social development of the country that we assert must be balanced against the security needs and the integrity of our state and society. Security must include the security of the country, communities and each one of us including the foreigners and immigrant communities who are part of South Africa.

Hon Chairperson, Article 1A of the 1951 UN Convention on the status of Refugee defines a refugee as any person who is outside their country of origin and unable or unwilling to return there or to avail themselves of protection, on account of well founded fear of persecution for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of particular group or political opinion.

The challenge we face, as South Africans, at this juncture is that large numbers of those seeking asylum are not genuine asylum seekers but, in fact, job seekers. Some of the so-called refugees visit their countries and come back to South Africa, which begs the question of whether there really exists a fear of persecution.

South Africa continues to have a non-encampment policy, and asylum seekers are allowed to earn a living whilst awaiting adjudication of their applications. Commonly, whilst awaiting the outcome of their applications, many applicants attempt to regularise their stay through other means. These include marriages to South Africans, which are often fraudulent, fraudulent registration of birth, and being the biological parents of South African children.

We welcome the fact that under the amended Refugees Act, work and study permits with limitations will have to be applied for with specific conditions set. However, more still needs to be done to curb and circumvent the abuse of the system. One of the strengths we enjoy as a country is that no person can legally enter the Republic of South Africa without being cleared by an immigration officer and by Customs, Health, and other departments where required. It is therefore imperative that our borderlines and ports of entry be secured against a variety of risks and threats. At the same time, there should be facilitation of persons through ports.

The recent amendment to the Immigration Act requires that dual citizenship should only be allowed when both South Africa and the other country involved recognise dual citizenship. The issue arises about being certain of the loyalties of a person with dual citizenship, especially when such a person occupies a position of power. Our feeling is that this matter needs another round of review, because the interests of the country should always come first in all endeavours.

The South African National Defence Force, SANDF, has been mandated to secure the borderline. Home Affairs has an inspectorate that is specifically charged with enforcing the Immigration Act, which works closely with SAPS. The complexities that emerge, as a result, have caused us to urge government to execute the decision establish a border management agency. We believe that it is imperative that all border management functions be led from one centre.

In conclusion, we maintain that South Africa belongs to all whom live in it on condition that they accept absolute equality. Many people come to our country with diverse motives, and it is incumbent upon the department to, amidst all the jostling for South African identity, protect South Africans and secure their identity in collaboration with other departments and ports of entry. We are determined through the developmental state to build social cohesion and fight against any form of exploitation of our identity, whilst protecting those amongst us from undue harm. As the Polokwane resolution said, there must be a balance between developmental needs and security ones. The ANC supports the Budget. I thank you. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS / E.K.S. & Mia / END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Take: 379

Ms N A MNISI

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS: Chairperson, it is always a privilege to participate in a Budget debate, and tonight I am enormously privileged to do. I want to thank all of you for being here this evening, at this late hour, supporting us in your various ways. My task here today is to elaborate on, as the Minister said previously, asylum seeker and refugee management, legal services and films and publications.

Let me begin by saying to hon members that, as a country, we remain committed very firmly to our obligations in terms of the 1951 Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees. We do so because we believe that affording protection to those fleeing from persecution in their countries of origin contributes ultimately to a better, more caring, more peaceful world. Our own country's experience speaks volumes about the wisdom of this position. The Minister and very many of our leaders were, at one time, asylum seekers, and we should not forget that when things normalised and stabilised in this country, they came back as enormous resources to our country to assist us all to develop and become the peaceful democracy we are. This is no small achievement. However, it is correct that South Africa faces serious challenges in adjudicating the claims of asylum seekers and extending assistance to those granted refugee status. In 2010, 180 000 people applied for asylum in South Africa. This unprecedented demand for asylum has overwhelmed the system and opened it to further abuse from economic migrants, as the hon Mnisi said, and, as a consequence, the adjudication of these applicants' applications often takes years to finalise, resulting in backlogs. The hon Mnisi has explored the different challenges in this regard, and I am not going to traverse them again. I am just going to go straight to what our strategy is to deal with some of these challenges.

Firstly, ours is to improve the processes by which the adjudication and review of claims is conducted. Already, we have seen some successes in this strategy. Except for the two refugee centres in Pretoria, I am pleased to report that since September 2011, the turnaround time and quality of adjudication of new applications in the Durban, Musina and Cape Town refugee reception centres have improved drastically and status determinations are now made in these centres within three months. These pertain to the new applications. Of course, there are backlogs, and we will have to then deal with those as well. Our focus is, of course, now to ensure that the Pretoria centres also achieve these standards. Our further challenge is to ensure that those individuals, whose applications for asylum have been rejected, are deported timeously. Measures to address this challenge are being investigated. Amongst others, discussions have been held with the International Organisation for Migration, IOM, on a possible partnership to extend and implement their voluntarily repatriation programmes out of our refugee reception centres. Our second strategy is to address the problem of corruption, by working together with law enforcement and security agencies at national, provincial and local levels. The third strategy being implemented is to engage in bilateral and multilateral co-operation with countries through which asylum seekers transit. In international law, the principle is firmly established that asylum seekers should apply in the first safe country they enter. This principle requires a regional approach to be established and implemented effectively.

The United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees, UNHCR, has declared a Notice of Cessation of Refugee Status of Angolan Refugees which will come into effect on 30 June 2012. We will implement this according to UNHCR guidelines and through a collective regional approach. Coming to our Legal Services Unit, we have made some strides in our contracts units. Most of the contracts that the department engages in are now vetted by the Legal Services Unit, saving the department millions of rand. The Legal Services Unit is also in the process of finalising regulations to a number of amended Acts, including the Refugees Amendment Act, Act 12 of 2011 and the Immigration Amendment Act, Act 13 of 2011.

With regards to civil litigation – people may know that we are one of the most litigated departments – with the exception of cases emanating from Lindela, the department has won 42 out of the 46 cases that were finalised during the 2011-12 financial year. Lindela cases pose a very big challenge to us. Due to a lack of co-operation from certain foreign nationals and lengthy processes to verify the country of origin and status of these individuals, it is not always possible to release or deport these deportees within 120 days, as required by law, simply because they are illegally in our country. New and innovative solutions must be found and are needed to ensure that these processes are accelerated and to enable the department to be in compliance with the legislation. We will certainly put a huge focus on that. With regard to contingent liabilities, the amount of potential claims against the department has been reduced significantly in the last year, from R6,2 billion, which would have been the claims against the department, to R1,3 billion this year.

The Budget of the Department of Home Affairs also includes funding for the Film and Publication Board, FPB, which is tasked with providing society with information that will enable adults to make informed decisions on published material that they choose to view whilst, at the same time, protecting minors from being exposed to adult content. The FPB attaches age restrictions and content warnings to all film, magazines and gaming material distributed in the country. The role of the FPB should be understood in the context of giving concrete expression to our constitutional rights and also for its role in furthering the values of a caring society, a society that celebrates its diversity, as opposed to promoting things like hate speech in the name of freedom to information. This includes the right of children to be protected in their youth. The restrictions placed on gaming material and other content should be regarded as a very serious issue, especially when we consider the mass killing last year in Norway, where the killer of 77 people, Anders Breivik, reported that a computer game which is quite popular amongst young people, called "The Call of Duty: Modern Warfare", assisted him to condition himself for this shooting and bombing rampage. Now, this is an adult. We have to contemplate what these things do to our children who are impressionable. So, age restrictions on games, in particular, should be something that parents all over South Africa – in fact, all over the world – should be worried about and should pay more attention to.

The FPB has in the last financial year implemented outreach programmes across the country on cyber-safety. This crucial work will continue in 2012-13. In this regard, we are very pleased to announce the commencement of the review of the Classification Guidelines used by the FPB, and there is a consultative process which I hope that Members of Parliament, in particular, will take to their constituencies, popularise, and ensure that every single South African contributes to these discussions.

Finally, we want to say that we are very proud to join Independent Electoral Commission, IEC, the FPB, and the Government Printing Works, as the Department of Home Affairs also now has a clean audit. As such, and under the very able and wise leadership our Minister, we look forward to bigger and better things. Thank you very much. [Applause.]

Mrs T M A GASEBONWE /Mia /END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Take: 380

"Old Assembly Main",Unrevised Hansard,25 Apr 2012,"[Take-333333380] [Old Assembly Main][90P-4-082A][gs].doc"

THE DEPUTY MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS:

Mrs T M A GASEBONWE: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister and Deputy Minister, the Director General of Home Affairs and officials, guests in the gallery and hon members. It is not only critical that citizens are identified, but that our democracy is secured through regular, free and fair elections. It also becomes critical that while the nation receives entertainment, such entertainment should be free from potential and real harm. Pursuant to the mentioned imperatives, the Department of Home Affairs has to facilitate the realisation of its mandate as part of its agencies.

Government Printing Works, GPW, amongst other objectives, aims to provide cost effective, reliable and timeous services to all spheres of government; to provide the public with equitable information; and disseminate government information through technology innovation and service excellence.

Since its conversion to a government component, GPW commenced with operating on regular business principles, having to defray all its expenditures from the revenue generated by services rendered. Its principal clientele are state departments and other organs of state. GPW's chief mandate is to produce South African passports and identification documents.

At page nine of the 2012-13 to 2014-15 GPW strategic plan, a concern needs to be noted that, although GPW can report on increased outputs, service delivery is still negatively affected by human and material resource constraints. The lack of experienced and qualified senior managers, artisans and administrative personnel impacts on service delivery resulting in the GPW being compelled to outsource certain functions. The further development and financing of facilities as well as technology upgrades necessary for the GPW to deliver on its mandate would remain a challenge without any additional funding from the fiscus.

Hon members, we are encouraged and thrilled by the recent appointment of a permanent chief executive officer, CEO, by the GPW and strengthened by the fact that two more management positions will soon be filled as per GPW report. We also note that moving to new premises and installation of new advanced printers indicate growth in the manner of working and that the security of our people's identity remains foremost in our priorities. However, it would be remiss of me to discount what the entity is saying to this Parliament in the extract from its strategic plan.

I make bold to say for efficiency and security of identity, it is imperative that our government review the funding mode of this entity.

The Independent Electoral Commission, IEC, of South Africa is mandated to strengthen our constitutional democracy through delivering free and fair elections in which every voter is able to record his or her choice. This entity is an independent and impartial permanent body created by the Constitution in chapter nine, to promote and strengthen constitutional democracy in South Africa through the delivery of free and fair elections at all levels of government.

The IEC undertakes its work within the republic independently but it is often called upon to assist in South Africa's international relations and to undertake electoral assistance to other countries. Where this happens, the funding and permission is sought and obtained from the government of South Africa.

The IEC facilitates the promotion of the principles of peaceful, free and fair elections. This includes interaction and liaison with organisations, institutions and governments nationally and internationally in order to promote the acceptance and adherence to democratic electoral principles. Included are international bodies such as the International Institute for Democracy and Electoral Assistance, Southern African Development Community, SADC, Electoral Commissions Forum, the African Union, etc.

Hon members, we again compliment the IEC for the sterling work it keeps doing in ensuring that South Africa's democracy is secured. It is under its watch that all political parties get funding proportionately and get proportionate space to canvass votes from the public, indeed it is under the IEC that all votes count equally. I dare say without fear of contradiction that the ballot paper respects no class, sex, race, or any symbol. The IEC ballot paper is the true equaliser that respects the human dignity of all.

Since the establishment of the IEC, our elections have been inclusive and peaceful. As our democracy matures, the number of local government by-elections rises owing to expulsions, death and at times resignation of councillors. Even under such moments of unpredictability, the IEC has never failed to rise to the occasion in ensuring that universal adult franchise, which is one of the core pillars of the society, extends equally to all on the basis of age and geographic location.

Hon members, the Film and Publication Board, FPB, is according to its 2012-13 to 2016-17 strategic plans on page eight, a leading content regulator which informs adults and children in their care on their readership, viewing and gaming choices, thus ensuring informed choices as well as protection of children against exposure to undesirable content and harmful effects of media. The FPB further restricts the consumption and distribution of pornography and prohibits the use of children in the creation, production, distribution and consumption of child pornography and the exposure of children to pornographic content.

The FPB in executing its mandate therefore protects children from undue exposure to undesirable material through classification of content; in alignment with societal norms; empowering the public through robust information sharing and education to make informed viewing, reading and entertainment decisions; and also restricting access to the creation and distribution of pornography in society.

It is frightening to note that according to reliable research findings, 50% of children own smart phones and have access to the internet and other social networks through which they get exposed to what the FPB is meant to protect them from. It seems as if we are fighting a losing battle when it comes to protecting our children against dangerous influences.

Our constitutional democracy was meant to protect the most vulnerable against harm, hence section 36 of the Constitution which demands that rights be observed not at the expense of building a society based on human dignity, equality and freedom. In this regard, it is clear that if drastic measures are not taken, the future of our society is at stake. Without sounding alarmist, let me point to the incidences of child pornography where children have sex and videorise their disgusting conduct and circulate it for others to see. It is clear that these children emulate what they see being done by others over the internet.

We would like to appeal to our government to save our children and criminalise access and circulation of pornographic material by children. Of course we are treading on thin ice as the free for all types will cry censure and raise our face to freedom of expression and the right to access of information. Our Constitution protects the most vulnerable andeither refutably or irrefutably, children are presumed without criminal capacity and should be deemed to be without the necessary strength to resist the force of the insidious and suggestive moral fibre destroyers.

In conclusion, our democracy continues to be secured through the IEC and our identity is secured by the GPW whose funding model however, needs revision, the recent improvements not withstanding. However, the exposure of our children to material remains a risk that can only be mitigated by a statute. The ANC supports the budget. Thank you. [Applause.]

Mr M MNQASELA /KC / END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Take: 381

Mrs T M A GASEBONWE

Mr M MNQASELA: Chairperson, hon Minister of Home Affairs, Dr Dlamini-Zuma, Deputy Minister Chohan, hon Members of Parliament, Mr Apleni and your leadership in the department, the Independent Electoral Commission, IEC, the Film and Publication Board, FBP, Government Printing Works and its leadership, ladies and gentlemen, I salute you.

Chair, I rise on this point but without forgetting that our chairperson is not well. We wish her well in her difficulty. I dedicate my speech to a young girl, an infant that was born two weeks ago, Asenathi Magoda, who went missing in Khayelitsha yesterday in the offices of the Department of Home Affairs.

This year, it is exactly 102 years since the establishment of the Department of Home Affairs on 31 May 1910. The Department of Home Affairs has developed from a department that previously represented a select few to a department that represents all of us here today. Chairperson, it remains a great challenge whether we have convincingly managed to address the disparities confronting our citizenry. The answer to that question is a yes and a no.

It is a yes because under your leadership, hon Minister, the department managed to receive its first unqualified audit opinion since its inception in 1995. You have managed to change the story of the department from the one of horror to a better story. The universal facelift of all the offices of the department is commendable. We now need to do the same for refugee reception offices.

The answer to my question is also a no. It is a no because hospital connectivity for registrations at birth needs to be uniform across the board. We need to reduce the distance that people travel to the Department of Home Affairs offices in order to ensure that there is universal access to the offices. People in the far-flung rural areas take a long time to get to the offices because some have to ride on their horses. If you don't have a horse, you have to walk long distances or get a lift. Sometimes it takes more than 40 km to get to a closer smaller place office. To get to a Department of Home Affairs should not be that difficult.

The administration of the department is also an area that needs urgent attention and, hon Minister, I know that this is something that is possible. The financial management capacity and human resources skills should be improved.

Chairperson, we will never address challenges facing this department if we do not address staff shortages. This department needs to urgently employ 282 immigration officers and 19 officials in the anticorruption unit in order to curb the element of fraud and corruption among public officials. That tendency can only be addressed if we do our work seriously.

If we look at the National Development Plan that we have been workshopped on this week, hon members, this department is the only department that has been used as an example regarding the use of a turnaround strategy as a catalyst for service delivery. We should use that as a lesson that will catapult a culture across the board in immigration services, borders, etc.

Hon Chairperson, we urge the minister to consider increasing the threshold of people with disabilities in the employ of the department. We have far less than the two percent threshold which is a requirement for employing people with disabilities and this needs to be addressed. With regard to gender parity, departments need to work on the 50% measure to ensure that women are represented at all levels where decisions are taken as this is not the case at the moment.

Recently, when the department came to make a presentation, we saw only two women at the director-general level. We have also realised that it takes time to get competent and quality women at the provincial manager level. We must go on headhunting and get people at that level. That can be done.

We must move away from a paper-based system into an electronic and modernised system as some members have said, and I don't need to emphasise that. The DA supports the IT modernisation plan which has been presented to the committee and we recommend that there be very clear timeframes that are measureable, achievable and results-driven.

In a new major initiative, earlier this year the Ministry of Home Affairs launched two projects worth US$13,7 million and supported by the United Nations Development Programme, UNDP, the United Nations Capital Development Fund, UNCDF, the Swiss Agency for Development and Co-operation and the Republic of Korea. The two projects are meant to be part of the government's programme for Governance and Public Administration Reform during 2011 to 2015. The DA welcomes this initiative and wishes the Minister well in the implementation of the projects.

The department needs to cut down on high litigation expenditure. A lot of money has been spent on lawyers and this can be scaled down. The scaling down of litigation will mean that we do not have to get all the judgements from court and I am happy with the report that indicates that a lot has been done to that effect.

The last issue is the late registration of births. We wish to ask the department to speed up the work around this issue to ensure that ...

IsiXhosa:

... oomakhulu bayifumana kwangethuba inkamnkam kuba uba yingxaki enkulu umba wenkamnkam. Ndikhe ndanceda omnye umakhulu apha eNyanga East. Zange wayifunama inkamnkam kodwa uneminyaka engama-70; oko kusithiwa uneminyaka engama-50. Ude athi, "Oko kusithiwa ndineminyaka engama-50, iminyaka minje, andide ndiwagqibe ama-70 mna." Ngaloo mazwi, siyabulela. [Kwaqhwatywa.]

Mrs S G BOTHMAN


UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Takes: 381 & 382

Mr M MNQASELA

**Sesotho incomplete**

Mrs S G BOTHMAN: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon Deputy Minister, hon chairperson of the committee in absentia, hon Members of Parliament, the director-general and guests in the gallery, at the risk of being dismissed by people in our midst who are in denial and are refusing to let bygones be bygones, I nonetheless shall, with haste, be true to the fact in spite of their stubborn revulsion for revisionism.

Under the apartheid regime with its Bantustan offspring, the main objective of the Department of Home Affairs was to control black people and deny them their citizenship, identity and freedom of movement, among other injustices. Thanks to the ANC and its philosophy of struggle because it sought not to amend the ignoble system that saw African women triple-oppressed. Indeed, the legacy of apartheid lives on like a ghostly spirit haunting its neighbourhood because St Peter refused it entry in heaven because of its nature.

It was during those trying times that we had to choose between bullets and ballots. Thanks to the tripartite alliance in particular the ANC and the SACP for choosing the settlement of the ballot over the bullet for the sake of all of us in the country, black and white. This settlement brought about what we now call the Independent Electoral Commission, IEC.

Whilst we acknowledge the challenges experienced by this institution, we however applaud it for the improved services, transparency and openness in dealing with issues within its organised formation. We expect the institution to further focus on rural areas. Voter education should be an ongoing programme and should further the development of an information technology system which will link the institution to all other services needed and identified for improved outcomes.

Sesotho:

Modulasetulo, ha naha e fumana tokoloho, ke tshwanelo hore setjhaba se keteke. Jwale he, mekgwa ya ho keteka e fapane. E mong o nwa sekipa se ntekane, e mong o ya mabaleng a dipapadi, e mong a tantshe ha e mong a boha ditshwantsho tsa baesekopo, dipapadi, inthanete kapa thelebishene. Ka hona, re ile ra lemoha hore boithabiso bo bong ha bo sa elwe hlooko bo ka senya batho dikelello le maikutlo. Hara tse ding ke qolla ditshwantsho tsa banana le bahlankana ba tsotseng. Tjhe, ha se rona ba ka qobellang batho ho sheba dintho tseo tse tshosang.

Re ile ra hlahloba Molaotheo wa naha mme ra lemoha hore mokgwa o neng o sebediswa kgale wa hore ditshwantsho tse tshosang, tse tsipanyang mmele le ho phallisa madi ka lebelo le hodimo di se dumellwe hohang, o ke ke wa sebetsa nakong ya jwale! Seo re ka se etsang e ka ba ho fa setjhaba boikgethelo ba ho boha kapa ho se bohe dintho tseo ka ho hlophisa ditshwantsho tse jwalo le ho di fa manane, e leng se bitswang classification ka sejatlhapi.

"Old Assembly Main",Unrevised Hansard,25 Apr 2012,"[Take-333333382] [Old Assembly Main][90P-4-082A][gs].doc"

We affirm the important role played by the film and publication board, however we have, through the committee, requested the board to reinforce the port of entry, and relations with SA Revenue Service, Sars, to ensure control of incoming film, games etc. Furthermore, we expect the distribution inspection to be more visible and educate our communities on the role played by the Film and Publication Board, FBP, and also their responsibilities as communities. A working relation between the Department of Education, Department of Communications and the FBP will bear sweet fruits for the nation.

Sesotho:

English: The review of the act and the guidelines will further better the services rendered, hence the need for both human and financial resources to this board.

Sesotho:

English:

We prioritised the issue of securing the identity of South Africans by ensuring that we also become part of the departments which do the printing through Government Printing Works, GPW. Whilst we support the resources given to the GPW, the ANC would like to emphasise the need for focussed training of personnel with this organisation on information technology and secure printing through partnership with the sector education and training authority, Seta, and the education to our communities around their responsibilities, towards the usage and safe keeping of the travel and identity documents in their possession through the Department of Home Affairs; basically to secure the security features of this documents from the ills of this world.

The ANC will continue to embark on an identity campaign as an ongoing programme and would like to commend the department for the improved systems and the roll out of the new information technology infrastructure as a means of accelerated service delivery and information dissemination. We are referring to the short message service, SMS, life capture system and automated finger print identification system. I think this will answer your concern, hon Makhuba. We believe that with more human resources and skilled printing personnel, the institute and the department will attain its objective of rendering effective, efficient service to our people.

We encourage the department to continue working closely with SA Police Service, SAPS, and the Department of Defence on the issues of border patrol and ports of entries to help reduce the number of people who enter the country illegally, as this forms part of the backlog that we have and increased number of people in our country without document. We further request Members of Parliament, through their constituency outreach programmes, to educate communities about the importance of reporting such individuals within their areas, both to the police and home affairs offices. A strategic partnership with the Houses of Traditional Leaders, hon Mnqasela, should be forged throughout the country as it is done in Mpumalanga. Satellite office should be made available, in these areas, for the attainment of the birth registration within 30 days of delivery.

The registration of birth, death and marriages is an initiative that has shown us that the department is indeed bringing services to the doorsteps of the South Africans. The above partnership should further be used to educate the rural communities of the importance of registering births, deaths and marriages, whether traditional or western; and the marriages to South Africans by foreign nationals and the negatives and positives of that. We share your concern, Minister, that the integrity and the security of our national population register continue to be impaired by those who seek to benefit illegally on the rights of citizenship. We agree that late registration of birth open the country up to identity fraud and therefore, welcome the modern National Identity System, NIS, which will include citizens and foreign nationals. This system should also be linked to the schools, hospitals, municipalities and all recruitment agencies so as to ensure holistic capturing of movement of foreign nationals and citizens.

The department is also mandated to regulate and facilitate the movement of persons through legally recognised ports of entry. We support the fact that you have prioritised strengthening current processes and ensuring that immigration officers are patriotic, disciplined and humane. To this end, you have developed a pilot training programmes with assistance from expects from the Republic of Cuba and I think the Cubans are in the gallery, we applaud you for assisting us, as South Africa. We believe that the newly established learning academy is best planned to roll out this programme. You have our full support in building a strong patriot public service cadre in the department and transforming the department into an employer of choice.

We share the view that immigration that is badly or corruptly managed put citizens at risk and allow criminality to take route. However, properly managed immigration is a benefit to the country and all its citizens. We therefore urge the department to strengthen its management of immigration. It goes without saying that the Department of Trade and Industry; Department of Economic Affairs and Department of Labour need to play a pivotal role on this. The above mentioned proves that indeed, the Department of Home Affairs is the backbone of security in this country. The ANC recognises the rights of all workers in South Africa. We further support the notion than that says workers' rights must not be undermined and we also would not allow that to be used as an excuse for no performance.

The development of disciplined and professional officials by the department is highly supported. We further acknowledge the fact that the systems have improved to basically combat crime and corruption. We however, want to see an improved working environment for the work force in terms of office space, office equipment, co-operate clothing and furnisher. A situation in Thaba Nchu home affairs office should be improved to match up to that of Botshabelo in the Free State. Infrastructure roll out in rural areas like Taung and Hluhluwe, Stanger, Lusikisiki and Phuthaditšhaba should be encouraged in all aspects. However, we have made a request for the improvement of the Ganyesa offices in the North West, Soweto in Gauteng, Fleifontein in Venda, Limpopo province and the provision of services through partnership with traditional leaders as indicated previous to accommodate areas like Ophathe in KwaZulu-Natal, Morokwaneng in the North West, Northern Cape rural areas and many more.

In conclusion, we note and pledge to support the progress that the department had made in contributing to ensure that all people in South Africa are, and feel safe. Engendering a skilled and capable work force to support an inclusive growth path and building an efficient, effective and development orientated public service and an empowered, fair and inclusive citizenship. Hon Chairperson, if you look at the annual report, 2011, page 32, it talks more about the issue on the duplication identity documents. It even indicated that we need more than a year to bold out what is happening there and I had thought of hon members were in the committee, when this particular report was presented.

[Interruption.] Minister came to give us a report pertaining to vacancies; even our strategic plan and the third quarter reports were tabled for us know what is happening and what is the plan, hon Mnqasela. I think you are aware of that particular plan. It need not be that when you come to this House, you then say you are not aware. The ANC supports the budget. Thank you. [Applause.].

Minister of Home Affairs/ LMM/ / END OF TAKE

UNREVISED HANSARD

EPC – OLD ASSEMBLY CHAMBER

Wednesday, 25 April 2012 Take: 383

"Old Assembly Main",Unrevised Hansard,25 Apr 2012,"[Take-333333383] [Old Assembly Main][90P-4-082A][gs].doc"

Mrs S G BOTHMAN

The MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS (Dr N C Dlamini-Zuma): Chair, I would firstly like to welcome the Cuban delegation on the gallery, led byDr Enrique Morel. Can you please stand up? [Applause.] Iwill come back to the question from hon Mc Intosh. I also welcome the representatives of the Auditor-Generalin the gallery and I want to thank them for their support and oversight in our department. I would like to thank all of you who participated in the debate and all who are here at this late hour, so that we are not speaking to the chairs.

I will not deal with individuals because I don't have a lot of time. Don't be offended. I just want to thank you for the compliments and we accept them with great humility. I am sure those are the things that keep us going and keep us trying to improve more and more.

In terms of the criticism, we are also happy to receive constructive criticism. When we come to the portfolio committee, we never hide our challenges because we know that the best way of eating an elephant is one bite at a time. If you try and swallow it all, it will never happen. We are able to improve because we take one bite at a time. We accept those criticisms and you can be sure that we are slowly working on everything. We hope we will come here one day and say that we are perfect. We are not perfect but are facing this task.

I just want to say a few things around permitting. I couldn't say everything because I only had a few minutes. We have plans to automate the permitting applications, just as we have plans to automate the IT passport applications and some of them are. We have those plans and the director and acting chief director have also been doing a lot to improve the permitting. I am sure you have heard the briefing about all those plans, so I will not go into them.

The duplicate is a challenge. We have cleared a lot of them, but there are still quite a number of them. There are those that we have actually cleared because we have combedour population register to check if there are duplicates that we can find. Some of them, as was explained in other meetings, came when the different population registers were being put together. We have been able to pick some of them even before the people complained to us. We have a plan to publish some of the names next month so that people can come forward, and so that we can try and resolve them before they even see they have a duplicate. We are trying our best. We know that it is a big problem.

With regard to the maritime, we accept that the maritime borders have not been looked after properly, but we will start to improve Durban and Cape Town. We have a project there. We will train more immigration officers, particularly those specialising in maritime ports of entry. This year, we hope to put at least 76 more properly trained officials at those ports.

We have also identified accommodation in the harbours because we didn't have proper accommodation there. The public enterprises have given us accommodation. We have been working on it and we accept some of your criticisms. Be assured that we are working on them.

On the question of women and disabled persons, we agree that we are not where we should be. That is why we did not fill all the posts of the provincial managers because I was presented with almost seven men. Therefore, I said no, we must go back and look for more women. I am quite aware of it and therefore we have acting managers in some instances. We want to find women so that there is a better balance.

The advice from hon Mnqasela that we should speed this up is accepted. However, I hope he can also give the same advice to his party, especially to the leader, hon Helen Zille, that women in this country can be in positions of leadership, not just herself. [Applause.] We accept it, but please send it back to your own party.

When it comes to FPB, I don't know why everybody is suddenly agitated about the Films and Publication Board, FPB, being in Home Affairs. Yes, I don't know how it came about. I found it there, but we are quite happy to work with the FPB, unless you are saying that we are not doing our work well with FPB. Otherwise, we have no problem.

The Government Printing Works, GPW, will always be under Home Affairs. That is not going anywhere. We have also appointed the CEO. And he is a cardiologist and he gets to the heart of the problem very quickly. [Laughter.]

On a more serious note about the baby, we have not received any enquiries about this baby in our office. We have checked with the SAPS and the SAPS is not sure whether this happened in our office. I think we should first make sure, rather than publicise something. There is a story that this woman was with the social worker and everything. Please, let us not rush into making conclusions.

About the late registration of birth, LRB, we actually want to do away with LRB. We want everybody to have an ID at 16. We are happy ...

IsiZulu:

Uma ningaletha bonke ogogo, sikwazi ukusheshisa sibanike omazisi ukuze ngesikhathi siluvala lolu hlelolokubhalisa ukuzalwa sekudlule isikhathi [late registration of birth, lrb] bonke babe sebebatholile. Ngakho-ke baletheni ngobuningi babo, uma nibathola nibalethe. Kodwa-ke. . .

English:

Your must remember that it was your party, when it was in government, apartheid, that made those makhulus [grandmothers] to be 50 when they are 70. [Applause.] You are the success of the National Party. [Interjections.]

Let me come to the questions that hon Mc Intosh raised.

The TEMPORARY CHAIRPERSON (Mr M MDAKANE): Let us allow the Minister to respond. You are giving her more minutes.

The MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS: Chair, the hon Mc Instosh raised issues and indeed we appreciate it. We have stakeholder forums so that they can tell us what is wrong, because we are not on the ground every minute. We appreciate it when MPs do the same. As you have said, we respond and try and correct the wrongs. As for the rubbish bin, we will talk to the office. They have petty cash; they can buy it.

I want to talk about what you have said concerning the Cubans and North Korea and that I must clarify my stand vis-à-vis North Korea and Cuba. I will not speak about North Korea because I have never been there. I don't know what is going on there. I will speak about Cuba because I know Cuba very well. In fact, I will invite you next time I go to Cuba because when you come back from Cuba, you will not speak like that. [Applause.]

I know Cuba. Before I even went to Cuba, I was very inspired by the Cuban Revolution, by Chekhovara, by Castro and by many people. Just keep quiet, let me tell you. That was my inspiration, but I went to Cuba in 1978, during the World Festival of Youth, as part of the ANC delegation then. I was very impressed with what I saw there. I fell in love with Cuba and I love it. That is my declaration. I don't hideit.

Let me tell you why I love Cuba. Cuba has free education, from primary school to doctorate. [Applause.] In Cuba, more than 60% of the population has a junior degree and we can learn a lot from them. [Applause.] Cuba has the best health system in the world and that is a fact. [Applause.] That is why I love it. There is no malnourished child in Cuba. There is none. You cannot even teach the doctors about malnutrition because they don't see it. That is why I love Cuba.

When they have a policy that they want to implement in Cuba, they do thorough consultations at the street committee level, at the factory floor, in the schools and everywhere. By the time they implement policy, you get into the taxi and the driver will tell you exactly what policy they are following on a particular issue. That is why I love Cuba.

Their airports are not quiet. They have very active airports. They have a lot of tourists because the world loves Cuba. They go there. It is not full of South Africans; it is full of people from the world who go there as tourists.

The coastline of Cuba is well guarded and therefore, they don't have a big problem with drugs, their airports and immigration like we have here. We are making it happen and that is why we are working with them. The Cuban system, communist or not, is people-centred and that is what matters. [Applause.]

On that point, I would like to thank you. [Applause.]

Debate concluded.

The Committee adjourned at 18:49.

JN IsiZulu/src Afr / END OF TAKE


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