Hansard: Second Reading debate: South African Reserve Bank Amendment Bill / Minister's Response / Member's Statements
House: National Assembly
Date of Meeting: 09 Aug 2010
Summary
No summary available.
Minutes
TUESDAY, 10 AUGUST 2010
PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
_____
The House met at 14:04.
The Deputy Speaker took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
FILLING OF VACANCIES IN NATIONAL ASSEMBLY(Announcement)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon members, order! I wish to announce that the following vacancies, which occurred in the National Assembly owing to the resignation of certain members, have been filled.
The vacancy that occurred owing to the resignation of Mr E Rasool has been filled by the nomination, with effect from 9 July 2010, of the hon Ms C C September. The vacancy that occurred owing to the resignation of Ms M M A Nyama has been filled by the nomination, with effect from 29 July 2010, of Mr F T Maserumule. The vacancies that occurred owing to the resignation of Messrs L N Mkhize and T J Bonhomme have been filled by the nominations, with effect from 21 July 2010, of Messrs M A Cele and E Magubane respectively.
Hon September made and subscribed the oath on 21 July 2010, and hon Magubane, hon Maserumule and hon Cele made and subscribed the solemn oath or affirmation on 3 August in the Speaker's Office. We welcome these members.
I also take this opportunity to welcome all other members back from recess. [Applause.] I hope we are all in one piece and that the vuvuzelas didn't make us deaf.
NOTICES OF MOTION
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
NOTICES OF MOTION
Ms N W A MICHAEL: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House –
(1) debates the role of the Public Protector in our democracy and the obligations of the executive to pronouncements and requests by this Chapter 9 institution; and
(2) comes up with solutions to strengthen the role of the Public Protector and to improve the relationship between this office and the executive.
Thank you.
Mr S ABRAM
Ms N W A MICHAEL
Mr S ABRAM: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House debates agrarian reform, the need for food security and production, and the implications for land tenure.
I thank you.
Ms A STEYN
Mr S ABRAM
Ms A STEYN: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House –
(1) debates the slow pace of rural land restitution and the uncertainty it has created in the agricultural sector; and
(2) comes up with solutions to improve the situation.
Thank you.
Ms L D MAZIBUKO
Ms A STEYN
Ms L D MAZIBUKO: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House debates the arrest of Sunday Times journalist Mzilikazi wa Afrika and its implications for media freedom in South Africa.
Thank you.
Ms J D KILIAN
Ms L D MAZIBUKO
Ms J D KILIAN: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House debates the issue of the irregular appointment of Mr Phil Molefe as head of news, which has again placed the SABC board at the centre of controversy.
Thank you.
Mr G R MORGAN
Ms J D KILIAN
Mr G R MORGAN: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House –
(1) debates the acid mine water that is rising below the City of Johannesburg and is due to overflow into the central business district in early 2012; and
(2) comes up with possible solutions to deal with this imminent environmental disaster.
Thank you.
Mr D A KGANARE
Mr G R MORGAN
Mr D A KGANARE: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House debates the inability of government to manage the health system, in the light of more than 16 years in which hospitals have deliberately been ignored by government, and in the light of the recent incident of a mother at Prince Mshiyeni Memorial Hospital who was left unattended for many hours holding a fetus in her hands, something that must rank as one of the most heartless offences.
Thank you.
Mr R N CEBEKHULU
Mr D A KGANARE
Mr R N CEBEKHULU: Madam Deputy Speaker, on the next sitting day of the House I shall move that this House debates the shocking state of South Africa's roads. Recent studies have indicated that the lack of maintenance of our roads over the past 16 years has led to a complete deterioration and that billions of rand is needed for repairs countrywide. The declining conditions of the roads have led to an increase in accidents, some of which have been fatal, as well as motorists incurring higher vehicle operation costs.
Thank you.
MOTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE
NOTICES OF MOTION
CONGRATULATIONS TO HASHIM AMLA
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: Madam Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House –
(1) notes that on 20 July 2010 Hashim Amla was awarded the prestigious title of SA Cricketer of the Year and SA Test Cricketer of the Year at the South African cricketer awards gala dinner which was held at the Sandton Convention Centre in Gauteng;
(2) further notes that Amla received further accolades for his mammoth match-winning score of 253 runs not out in the first test against India at Nagpur;
(3) acknowledges that over the past 12 months Hashim Amla has set a new national record of scoring more than 400 runs in a five-match series which he achieved during the West Indies tour early this year, and that he has joined the distinguished ranks of players who have scored a century in both innings of a test match;
(4) recognises that Amla is an exceptional competitor and a worthy recipient of the honours that have been bestowed upon him;
(5) extends its congratulations to Hashim Amla and wishes him everything of the best for the forthcoming cricket season.
I thank you.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION
THE OBSERVANCE OF RAMADAN BY MUSLIMS
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House –
(1) notes that 12 August marks the commencement of Muslims worldwide observing the holy month of Ramadan in fasting and prayer;
(2) further notes that Ramadan forms one of the five pillars of Islam on which the entire life of a Muslim is based;
(3) recognises that for Muslims this month is a period of introspection, discipline and abstinence from worldly pleasures; and
(4) wishes all Muslims well over this auspicious period.
Agreed to.
Mr J H VAN DER MERWE
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
CONGRATULATIONS TO ALBIE SACHS
(Draft Resolution)
Mr J H VAN DER MERWE: Madam Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes that retired Constitutional Court judge and activist Albie Sachs's memoir, The Strange Alchemy of Life and Law, won top honours at this year's prestigious Sunday Times Literary Awards;
(2) further notes that it was the former civil rights lawyer's second accolade after winning the 1991 Alan Paton Award for The Soft Vengeance of a Freedom Fighter; and
(3) congratulates Albie Sachs on this great achievement.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
Mr J H VAN DER MERWE
CONGRATULATIONS TO PRESIDENT JACOB ZUMA AND FINLAND'S PRESIDENT TARJA HALONEN
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes that United Nations, UN, Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon has selected President Jacob Zuma to co-chair a high-level panel on global sustainability which will have a specific focus on climate change as a sustainable development challenge;
(2) further notes that Finland's President Tarja Halonen will co-chair and that members include government leaders and environmental stakeholders from around the globe; that the main aim of the panel is to reflect on and formulate a new vision for sustainable growth and prosperity, and to come up with mechanisms to achieve it; that the panel will focus specifically on three pillars: economic, social and environmental; and that a final report is expected from it in December 2011; and
(3) congratulates President Zuma and President Halonen on their appointment as co-chairs of this important panel.
[Applause.]
Agreed to.
Ms S V KALYAN
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
CONGRATULATIONS TO TYGERBERG CHILDREN'S CHOIR AND STELLENBOSCH UNIVERSITY CHOIR
(Draft Resolution)
Ms S V KALYAN: Madam Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes that on 19 July 2010 the Tygerberg Children's Choir and Stellenbosch University Choir were crowned world champions at the 6th World Choir Games, hosted in Shaoxing, China;
(2) further notes that both choirs won a further two medals in two divisions respectively; that the children's choir gained top honours in the "religions" and "folklore" section of the competition and the Stellenbosch choir secured the top spot in the mixed choirs and musica contemporanea section of the competition, which is the world's largest and most prestigious choral competition, and that 472 choirs from 83 nations competed for the coveted title of world champions;
(3) acknowledges the exceptional nature of this achievement at a competition that has been dubbed the "Olympic Games of Choir Competitions";
(4) recognises that both choirs have made their country and its people proud; and
(5) extends its congratulations to both choirs on their exceptional achievements.
[Applause.]
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
Ms S V KALYAN
THE TRAGEDY AT PIETER WESSELS OLD AGE HOME
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes with grave sadness the death of 18 elderly people in Nigel, who were killed when a fire broke out at the Pieter Wessels old-age home on 1 August 2010, and that five more elderly persons subsequently perished in hospital;
(2) further notes that the paramedics managed to save 84 people from the burning old-age home;
(3) thanks the paramedics who saved many lives, as well as the churches who took in many of the elderly who have been left destitute; and
(4) conveys our heartfelt condolences to the families who have lost their loved ones in this horrific fire.
Thank you.
Agreed to.
Ms H N MAKHUBA
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
FLOODS DISASTER IN CHINA
(Draft Resolution)
Ms H N MAKHUBA: Madam Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes that three quarters of China's provinces have been hit by flooding with record-high water levels, and that flooding has destroyed houses, killed and displaced hundreds of people and caused billions of rands' damage;
(2) further notes that with the flooding season far from over, this year is shaping up to be one of the most devastating since 1998, which had been the worst in 50 years;
(3) expresses our sincerest condolences and deepest sympathy to the government and people of China; and
(4) urges all nations to assist the people of China in rebuilding their lives.
I thank you.
Agreed to.
Prof B TUROK
Ms H N MAKHUBA
THE NEW ECONOMIC GROWTH PATH
(Draft Resolution)
Prof B TUROK: Hon Deputy Speaker, I move:
That the House –
(1) debates at its next sitting the new economic growth path that is on the table.
I thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon Turok, that will come tomorrow. That's a notice of a motion that we have passed already.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
CONGRATULATIONS TO DR CHRISTINE STEENKAMP
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(2) notes that the international conference of the Organisation for Women in Science for the Developing World, formerly the Third World Organisation for Women in Science, took place in June 2010 under the theme "Women Scientists in a Changing World";
(3) further notes that a South African laser physicist, Dr Christine Steenkamp, was one of three African women scientists who received international recognition for excellence in research;
(4) believes that their win will inspire and motivate young women in Africa and particularly in South Africa to take science and mathematics, fields in which we have little female participation; and
(5) congratulates Dr Steenkamp on winning the mathematics-physics prize for Africa and for her excellent contribution to science, particularly her pioneering work in the field of vacuum ultraviolet laser spectroscopy.
Thank you.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
CONGRATULATIONS TO LOUIS OOSTHUIZEN
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: Madam Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes that on Sunday, 18 July 2010, South African Louis Oosthuizen won the British Open Championship with a seven-stroke victory over Lee Westwood;
(2) further notes that clinching this win was the 27-year-old Oosthuizen's maiden major title win and that it was achieved in the 139th edition of the esteemed British Open championship held at St Andrews in Scotland;
(3) recognises that this accomplishment ranks Oosthuizen among great golfing legends like Tiger Woods, Nick Faldo, Ernie Els and Retief Goosen;
(4) acknowledges that Oosthuizen has become the fourth South African to lift the sought-after Claret Jug;
(5) congratulates Louis Oosthuizen on his outstanding performance and his remarkable accomplishment; and
(6) wishes Oosthuizen all the best in his future career.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION
WELCOMING THE FLY THE FLAG INITIATIVE
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) welcomes the Fly the Flag initiative that replaced the Football Friday campaign, launched by the International Marketing Council of South Africa;
(2) notes that the Football Friday campaign was successful and mobilised all South Africans, black and white, to proudly wear the national colours every Friday;
(3) believes that, with the same patriotism and enthusiasm, South Africans from all walks of life will actively embrace and continue with the spirit that has been created during the African World Cup; and
(4) calls on all South Africans to continue with the mood of celebration by wearing the colours of the flag, to keep the flags flying on and in their vehicles, offices and homes.
I thank you.
Agreed to.
Ms S V KALYAN
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
COMMEMORATION OF THE NATIONAL WOMEN'S DAY
(Draft Resolution)
Ms S V KALYAN: Madam Deputy Speaker, I move without notice:
That the House -
(1) notes that 9 August 2010 is National Women's Day;
(2) recognises that this day commemorates the courage of the group of 20 000 women who, on 9 August 1956, marched to the Union Buildings in protest against the pass laws imposed upon persons deemed to be nonwhites by the apartheid government;
(3) further recognises that the fight for racial and gender equality constituted the cornerstone of the struggle against apartheid;
(4) acknowledges that today in a democratic South Africa equality is now enshrined in our Constitution and that many positive steps have been taken in the last 16 years to redress the injustices of the past in order to realise the principle of equality within our society, but that even more still needs to be done to fully realise this constitutional right; and
(5) calls upon all the leaders of our country, including the government, civil society, labour and business, to redouble their efforts to address issues that further enhance gender equality and the creation of opportunities for women.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY
Ms S V KALYAN
THE PASSING AWAY OF MR MZIKAYISE SYDNEY MBANGULA, MANAGER OF THE CORPORATE SERVICES DIVISION OF PARLIAMENT
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Deputy Speaker, we move: That the House -
(1) notes with profound sadness the passing away, on Friday 18 June 2010, of the Manager of the Corporate Services Division of Parliament, Mr Mzikayise Sydney Mbangula;
(2)
(2) further notes that "Bra Mzi", as he was affectionately known, was a loyal servant of Parliament from 1 June 2002 until his death and leaves behind his wife, Thembeka, three children, his mother, Nomzikayise, two brothers and four sisters;
(3) recognises his invaluable contribution to the activities of Parliament as a whole and the Corporate Services Division in particular; and
(4) expresses its sincere condolences to his family, friends and loved ones.
Agreed to.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: Madam Deputy Speaker, we obviously have no objections to that, but the matter I want to raise is that the photograph that was pictured on the screen was highly inappropriate because it had the ANC flag on it. Mr Mbangula was an official of Parliament first and foremost, and nothing else. Political affiliation should be completely irrelevant and I object to that. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: But are you not objecting to the motion?
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: Not at all.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Okay, thank you very much.
MEMBERS' STATEMENTS
PROGRAMME TO CREATE 10 000 JOBS FOR RURAL YOUTH
(Member's Statement)
Ms P P XABA (ANC): Hon Deputy Speaker, the ANC-led government views rural development as a central pillar of our struggle against unemployment, poverty and inequality. Hence the ANC supports the initiative to create an estimated 10 000 jobs for unemployed rural youth through a programme recently launched by the Department of Rural Development and Land Reform on 19 July 2010.
The National Rural Youth Service Corps, NARYSC, will be targeting youth from deep rural areas, including those living with disabilities, between the ages of 18 to 35 and who have passed Grade 12. The National Rural Youth Service Corps is a two-year programme aimed at empowering rural youth from each of the 30 rural wards across the country. [Time expired.] Thank you, Speaker. [Applause.]
Ms L D MAZIBUKO (DA)
Ms P P XABA (ANC)
THE ARREST AND DETENTION OF SUNDAY TIMES JOURNALIST MZILIKAZI WA AFRIKA
(Member's Statement)
Ms L D MAZIBUKO (DA): Madam Deputy Speaker, the arrest and detention of Sunday Times journalist Mzilikazi wa Afrika in Rosebank last week bore all the hallmarks of apartheid-era police action and detention without trial.
Certainly, the nature of the arrest and what seems to be the deliberate spectacle surrounding it are cause for serious concern to the DA. Wa Afrika was publicly accosted outside the Sunday Times offices. He was bundled into an unmarked car and driven four hours from Johannesburg to Nelspruit in Mpumalanga to explain why he was in possession of a fax. Why?
The arrest involved six Hawks vehicles and almost a dozen armed officers and came just a day after National Police Commissioner Bheki Cele referred to wa Afrika as a "shady journalist" on national television - and just three days after the Sunday Times published a story about Commissioner Cele flouting tender procedures.
Was this intended as a message to the free press? Will we now see a return to the cloak-and-dagger-arrest of journalists who dare to speak out against the state, as was the norm under apartheid?
Among the questions wa Afrika was asked during interrogation, the police wanted to know "Are you destroying the image and integrity of the ANC in Mpumalanga?" Police resources and intimidation tactics are now being deployed in defence of the ANC and its factions. [Interjections.]
The DEPUTY CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Deputy Speaker!
Ms L D MAZIBUKO: Given the mounting evidence that the motive behind wa Afrika's arrest was purely political, it is incumbent upon the Police Commissioner and the Minister of Police to explain this action to Parliament and the public. [Interjections.]
The DEPUTY CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Deputy Speaker, I would like to rise on a point of order.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon member, there is a point of order.
The DEPUTY CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Deputy Speaker, this was raised as a motion without notice.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Okay. Cope is next.
Ms S P RWEXANA (Cope): Madam Deputy Speaker, women in South Africa are facing the same challenges, whatever their political affiliation . . . [Interjections.]
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. The previous speaker, my colleague, was unable to finish her statement and I would like you to ask her to finish her statement. Thank you.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, no, no, her time had expired when I took the point of order. Cope is next.
Ms S P RWEXANA (Cope)
The DEPUTY SPEAKER
WOMEN'S DAY – SOLIDARITY OF WOMEN
(Member's Statement)
Ms S P RWEXANA (Cope): Madam Deputy Speaker, women in South Africa face the same challenges, whatever their political affiliation.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: Madam Deputy Speaker, on a point of order, the previous speaker, my colleague, wasn't able to finish her statement...
MADAM DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, she did.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE OPPOSITION: No, she didn't finish her statement and I would like her to ask you to finish it. Thank you.
MADAM DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, her time had already expired when I said there was a point of order.
Ms S P RWEXANA (Cope): Women in South Africa face the same challenges, whatever their political affiliation. They suffer physical abuse, they are under constant threat of being raped, they experience prejudice in the workplace, and they are subjected to cultural practices that are pertinently discriminatory. For women it is a huge uphill. The struggle has to be intensified. The struggle has to be kept alive.
In the past, women stood up against racial discrimination and unjust laws in our country. Thousands of women left the country for various destinations in Africa and Europe to wage war against racial oppression. Every woman wants to be accorded respect and be treated with dignity. Every woman wants to enjoy equality with men. Every woman is therefore first and foremost a woman. The women of South Africa may have different views on many issues but they are united in their resolve to stand together and be counted as one.
By showing solidarity with one another we will create a future for our children in which girl children and women will be accorded the respect they rightfully deserve. Yesterday marked the 53rd Anniversary of Women's Day. Instead of it being celebrated for its universality, it was disheartening to find the ANC Women's League trying to monopolise the event that commemorated the march of our mothers that ended up in the Union Buildings in Pretoria on 9 August 1956 against the imposition of the past laws. We commemorate the struggle of all women from all persuasions.
Mr A J WILLIAMS
Ms S P RWEXANA
RURAL HEALTH-CARE ACCESS
(Member's Statement)
Mr A J WILLIAMS (ANC): Hon Deputy Speaker, the African National Congress believes that health reform involves the mobilisation of available resources in both the private and public health sectors to ensure improved health outcomes for all South Africans. As a result, a total of 18 new mobile clinics were launched in Mpumalanga to provide health-care access to rural villages and farming areas that have no clinic facilities nearby.
The Member of the Executive Council, MEC, for the Department of Health and Social Development, Dikeledi Mahlangu, launched the mobile clinics at the Leroro Community Hall in Matibidi Township near Sabie on Friday, 02 July 2010. These mobile units will make a difference in the lives of many rural and farming communities who are underserved because of the shortage of mobile clinics. The allocation of these mobile clinics will mean that people living in remote areas will not have to travel long distances to access basic services. This initiative is part and parcel of the ANC-led government resolve to reduce inequalities in our health system and improve quality, care and access to public health-care facilities for our people. Thank you.
Mr A M MPONTSHANE
Mr A J WILLIAMS
NATIONAL EDUCATION SYSTEM
(Member's Statement)
Mr A M MPONTSHANE (IFP): Mhlonishwa Sekela Somlomo, when we look at the results of the national matric supplementary exams held earlier this year, the IFP is extremely disappointed with the failure of our education system. The overall pass rate of 19,1% is shocking, to say the least. Mpumalanga achieved 11,9%, KwaZulu-Natal 19,2%, Free State 10%, Western Cape 26,2% and Gauteng was the top scorer in our country with only 31,5%.
Our education system is quite clearly failing the youth of this country and we therefore urge the Minister of Basic Education to take immediate action in identifying, addressing and rectifying all the factors that have contributed to this most appalling state of affairs. Our failure in this regard robs our children of a better future. I thank you.
Mr A M MPONTSHANE (IFP)
ACID MINE DRAINAGE IN GAUTENG
(Member's Statement)
Mr L W GREYLING (ID): Deputy Speaker, there is an environmental crisis unfolding in Gauteng and decisive action is needed from government to arrest it. The central basin upon which Johannesburg sits is filling up with acid mine water at the rate of almost a metre a day. Unless a decision is taken within the next few weeks we will not have the time to put in place the engineering solution to deal with the impending catastrophe. Already acid mine water is flowing out of the western basin at a rate of 6 million litres a day. The treatment works are proving entirely inadequate, with devastating effects for the surrounding environment.
In the eastern basin, the debacle of Aurora Empowerment Systems' ownership of the Grootvlei mine has led to millions of litres of untreated acid mine water being pumped daily into the surrounding wetland. Serious questions need to be answered as to how a few politically connected individuals could be given the rights to a mine when they did not have the financial resources or experience to take responsibility for its operations. The ID hopes that the impending lawsuits against these directors go ahead and that they are held criminally reliable for their negligence in allowing an environmental and human-rights disaster to occur there.
The ID also calls for action to be taken against the liquidator of the Grootvlei mine, who should never have awarded the purchase to Aurora Empowerment Systems without first conducting a proper due diligence on them. The ID believes that it is now time for the Department of Mineral Resources to force mining companies to properly comply with all of their environmental responsibilities. Thank you.
Mr B Z ZULU (ANC)
Mr L W GREYLING (ID)
UPLIFTMENT PROJECTS FOR POOR HOUSEHOLDS
(Member's Statement)
Mr B Z ZULU (ANC): Chairperson, the ANC-led government is leading a massive public investment programme for growth and employment creation as part of the Expanded Public Works Programme's 2010 allocation. More than R8 billion has been targeted for road development and job creation through the implementation of labour-intensive road projects.
As such, more than 8 000 poor families in North West province are benefitting from a new road maintenance programme. The programme, entitled "Do it yourself", employs people from poor households in an effort to alleviate poverty and create sustainable livelihoods. The programme was rolled out across the province in the month of July 2010, specially targeting households headed by women in the rural areas, which have been identified in the four districts of the province.
Approximately R60 million has been budgeted for the programme and beneficiaries are poised to earn at least R520 a month for working eight days on identified roads. This shows the ANC-led government's commitment in implementing the Expanded Public Works Programme to support poor households. The ANC also believes that more can be achieved if we employ these kinds of programmes throughout the country. Thank you. [Time expired.]
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M B Skosana): Hon members, we are conversing too loudly and I don't think we can hear each other now.
Rev K R J MESHOE (ACDP)
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M B Skosana)
VICTIMISATION OF WHISTLE-BLOWERS
(Member's Statement)
Rev K R J MESHOE (ACDP): Chairperson, the report in today's Cape Times about a whistle-blower whose salary was frozen and his official car taken away raises serious concerns. This action undermines the Protected Disclosures Act, which encourages employees to "disclose information regarding improprieties by his or her colleagues, other stakeholders and employer". According to this Act, government will not tolerate the harassment or victimisation of a whistle-blower and will take action to protect employees when they raise a concern in good faith.
Government has also promised to do its best to protect an individual's identity when he or she raises a concern and does not want his or her identity to be disclosed. The ACDP wants to know why employees who want to expose corruption are suspended and in some cases even expelled from their jobs. If informants are not protected but victimised, then what hope do we have for ever winning the war on corruption? We believe whistle-blowers should be treated as heroes and not villains. Those who are victimising whistle-blowers are condoning corruption and should be investigated.
Earlier this year, a Member of Parliament was lambasted for exposing contents from a leaked document showing how Eskom has been charging, and will continue to charge, some companies such as BHP Billiton discounted electricity tariffs. Had it not been for whistle-blowers this would not have come to light. Government must do more to gain the confidence of members of the public who are aware of corruption. If they are convinced that their identities will be protected, more will come forward in order to expose the corruption that is plaguing our society. Thank you.
Ms Lebenya-Ntanzi (IFP)
Rev K R J MESHOE (ACDP)
STATE INTERVENTION NEEDED ON BASIC HEALTH CARE
(Member's statement)
Ms S P LEBENYA-NTANZI (IFP): Hon Chairperson, the IFP has on numerous occasions expressed its concern that South Africa's ailing public health-care system is facing critical challenges and that it is on the verge of collapse. Recent examples of gross neglect and negligence are proof that the IFP has good reason to be concerned.
Last week, it was reported that a woman who had suffered a miscarriage had been left unattended for hours and told to sit on a bench at the Prince Mshiyeni Hospital in Umlazi, Durban. This followed the discovery of a decomposed body in an air duct at the Addington Hospital in Durban. In addition to that, in Cape Town the bodies of a boy and a girl were recently found dumped at a waste-removal company in Airport Industria. The identity bracelets on the babies identified them as coming from the Retreat Maternity Hospital.
During his state of the nation address in Parliament earlier this year, President Zuma renewed his government's commitment to work harder to improve South Africa's health-care system. It is clear from the examples above that this pledge has remained mere rhetoric and that government has not acted on its promise. The IFP calls on government and in particular on the Department of Health to recommit themselves to solving the many crises that have beset our failing health-care system. It is clear that without urgent interventions the health-care system will continue to fail dismally in providing basic health care to the millions of South Africans who rely on the system for their health-care needs. I thank you. [Applause]
Mr Z LUYENGE (ANC)
Ms P LEBENYA-NTANZI
THE INTRODUCTION OF A NEW PROGRAMME BY SARS
(Member's statement)
Mr Z LUYENGE (ANC): From October the South African Revenue Service, Sars, will begin using a new and modernised programme when dealing with customs. The programme, which will be phased in over a number of years, will enhance both service and security at customs. The programme will assist in enhancing Sars's ability to identify illicit goods and will go far in promoting South Africa as a secure and reliable trading partner.
Part of the programme entails customs operations moving from a partially paper-based environment to a simplified, automated and more cost-efficient environment which will make customs operate faster and more efficiently, because delays can be costly. Some of the initiatives of the modernisation programme include the electronic supporting documents, whereby people will be able to electronically submit any supporting documents required by customs for the finalisation of a transaction. This will reduce the paper load and the burden of a trader having to physically deliver them from Sars.
In addition, the Sars contact centres will be increased to accommodate customs queries through Sars-trained call-centre agents. Sars will also introduce a single solution as opposed to the 37 systems that are currently in place. This is proof that the ANC-led government is committed to making government work faster and smarter. Together we can do more. [Applause.]
Ms D KOHLER-BARNARD
Mr Z LUYENGE
SCORPION'S INVESTIGATION ON SELEBI-AGLIOTTI RELATIONSHIP
(Member's statement)
Ms D KOHLER-BARNARD (DA): Chair, on the 19 November 2006 I asked the then Minister of Safety and Security how it was that everyone in this country was talking about the close relationship between the former police Commissioner, Jackie Selebi, and the Kebble murder suspect Glenn Agliotti and what his response was.
That relationship was dominating news headlines at the time, but the ANC National Executive Committee seemingly believed that the problem would just go away if they ignored it for long enough. They missed an ideal opportunity to prove the ANC's commitment to the fight against crime and chose not to discuss the Selebi-Agliotti friendship.
What I said then was that Commissioner Selebi should not remain in office while the investigation into Agliotti and the murder of Brett Kebble continued, and that it was totally improper for him to keep his position until the Scorpion's investigation had been wrapped up. I said that an objective investigation would be extremely difficult while Selebi was still in the driving seat. It was obvious then, as it is now, that the person tasked with leading the fight against crime should be above approach when it comes to the people he or she associates with.
The President and the Minister of Safety and Security ignored me then, as they did the extensive in-depth reports by our free media on the matter. They could not ignore the Scorpions, who, against the greatest odds, have won probably the last great case in court, resulting in Selebi receiving a 15-year jail sentence. Thanks to the ANC, we no longer have a unit that would necessarily have investigated a crooked National Commissioner. The Hawks is the National Police Commissioner's hand puppet and would never, ever, as I said on that dismal day, 30th of January last year, when the ANC shut down the Scorpions, contemplate such an investigation, now would they? [Applause.]
Mr D A KGANARE
Ms D KOHLER-BARNARD (DA)
NATIONAL PUBLIC SECTOR WORKERS' STRIKE
(Member's Statement)
Mr D A KGANARE (Cope): Chairperson, once again our country is about to be crippled by a major public-sector workers' strike beginning today. We regret that negotiations failed to resolve the disputes. We in Cope are fully sympathetic to the unions demanding a higher pay for their members.
For the ANC-led administration, characterised by excessive bling, lavish and ostentatious spending, pervasive corruption and wide-scale futile expenditure, the chickens are coming home to roost. If the public perception is that money is not a factor for Ministers in government, why should it be a factor in addressing the pay demands of the public sector? After all, workers and government members were supposed to be in the same boat after 1994.
Therefore, worker solidarity should have prevailed and the fat of the land should have been spread evenly across all segments, legally deriving benefits from the fiscus. This has not happened, and the income inequality has been exacerbated. Therefore, this strike is not only about the rapidly rising costs of living but about income equalisation as well.
Unfortunately, with the extended school holidays granted this year, a new and further loss of school time through strike actions in schools would be most injurious to the children of working-class families. It would also be iniquitous. We just cannot afford to make innocent children pay for the failures and excesses of government. They have a future to secure and therefore, to help them reach it, no stone should be left unturned.
Cope also recognised that President Zuma and the hon Minister of Higher Education, prior to their coming into government, created certain expectations in 2008. Those who voted for the government in 2009 are now demanding their payback. [Time Expired.] [Applause.]
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr M B Skosana): Hon member, your time has expired.
Mr M GUNGUBELE
Mr D A KGANARE
56 COURTS SETUP DURING THE 2010 FIFA WORLD CUP
(Member's Statement)
Mr M GUNGUBELE (ANC): Chairperson, the ANC-led government's vision to have dedicated courts to handle cases during the World Cup has paid off. The Department of Justice has set up 56 courts across the country, specifically dealing with World Cup-related crimes. According to figures released by the Department of Justice, the courts dealt with 172 cases since they opened on 28 May to 04 July.
The majority of those cases - about 139 in total - have already been finalised. There has been 104 convictions; 33 postponements; 28 cases were withdrawn and 7 people were acquitted. Approximately 45,35% of the cases were in Gauteng; while 25% were in the Western Cape; followed by the Eastern Cape with 12,21%. Of the cases that were heard by the courts, 59 were theft related, with the selling of World Cup tickets; 23 were common robbery; 11 were fraud; and 10 also featured high up on the list.
We commend the Department of Justice's foresight in the opening of these dedicated courts as an integral part of the national security plan intended for the 2010 Fifa World Cup tournament. We have shown the world that together we can do ngcono [better.]
The LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION
Mr M GUNGUBELE
FARM WORKERS SUMMIT IN THE WESTERN CAPE
(Member's Statement)
The LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION (DA): Hon Chairperson, the DA is finding it unacceptable that at the recent so-called Farm Workers Summit in the Western Cape, the ANC misrepresented the DA's plan for equity share schemes, describing them as a confiscation scheme to divide all farms in half and give away 50%.
This is a clear misrepresentation of the DA policy for propaganda purposes. Equity share schemes generally worked well for both farmers and workers in the Western Cape until they were stopped through a moratorium last year. The DA's proposal allows for farm workers to become part owners of farms that are available for sale and to gain access to high-value agricultural land while retaining the involvement and investment of the commercial farmer, a crucial determinant of long-term viability in land reform initiatives.
The current land reform system has failed to empower the intended beneficiaries in any meaningful way and has, in fact, compromised South Africa's agricultural productivity and the rural communities that rely on it. It is certainly not empowering farm workers. Just four months ago, Minister Gugile Nkwinti admitted in Parliament that 90% of the 5,9 million hectares of land bought by the state for emerging farmers was not productive. The DA's equity share scheme venture has been a success in the Western Cape because it spreads ownership, shares risk and reward, brings the expertise and experience of both the farmer and the worker together.
The DA will continue to push for equity share schemes on the basis that they are voluntarily, that state subsidies are made available for farm workers to buy shares and that safeguards exist to protect farm workers from being exploited. These schemes are and must remain a win-win solution for all. [Applause.]
Mr G J SELAU
The LEADER OF THE OPPOSITION
ENERGY EFFICIENCY AGREEMENT WITH THE SWISS CONFEDERATION
(Member's Statement)
Mr G J SELAU (ANC): Chairperson, South Africa and the Swiss Confederation have signed an energy efficiency agreement, which will be a major boost to the government energy programme. The agreement on the Energy Efficiency Monitoring Project entails the Swiss Agency for Development and Co-operation funding a R120 million climate change programme in South Africa.
The agreement is going to assist the ANC-led government in reaching our goals and objectives of realising energy efficiency in our buildings. The aim of the agreement is to provide financial support to the Ministry of Energy in order to contribute to the Energy Efficiency Monitoring and Implementation Project. The programme will run from 2010 to 2014 and will be implemented through collaboration of national and local government, research institutions as well as private sector, among others.
The ANC-led government recognises that climate change is a risk to development and that energy efficiency is one of the most cost-effective mitigation options in South Africa. The ANC welcomes the agreement with the Swiss Agency, as it will assist the Department of Energy in ensuring that new constructions and the retrofitting of existing houses and buildings comply with the building codes.
The municipalities of Sol Plaatje, Rustenburg, Polokwane, Mbombela and King Sabatha Dalinjebo have already been earmarked for capacity-building and the implementation of the phase of this project at local government level. This will be done under the auspices of the South African Local Government Association, Salga, at a cost of R13 million. I thank you. [Applause.]
MINISTERIAL RESPONSES - THE MINISTER OF PUBLIC WORKS
MEMBER'S STATEMENTS – Mr G J SELAU
POOR HOUSEHOLDS: UPLIFTMENT PROJECT
(Ministers' response)
The MINISTER OF PUBLIC WORKS: Hon Chairperson, we thank the hon member for his statement about the 10 000 jobs that will be created in the North West. This is a good-news statement and an indication of how the Expanded Public Works Programme, EPWP, is looking at best practice within the provinces and emulating them.
Do-it-yourself is modelled on the successful programme of Vuk'uzenzele in KwaZulu-Natal, KZN. KwaZulu-Natal and North West are leading in labour-intensive service delivery models. We encourage MPs to engage provincial MECs, local government and us to form partnerships in developing service delivery models that can make an impact on the lives of rural people. Thank you. [Applause.]
The MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: NATIONAL PLANNING COMMISSION
The MINISTER OF PUBLIC WORKS
Acid mine WATER: LAW SUITS AGAINST DIRECTORS
(minister's response)
The MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: NATIONAL PLANNING COMMISSION: Chairperson, I'm not quite sure why but, in respect of a number of issues raised as motions without notice and member's statements, the same issues are arising. Perhaps we need to ask the cross-party Whippery to try and resolve this issue.
Regarding the issue that the hon Greyling raised in respect of acid mine drainage, I just want to make an appeal that we try to be rational, because it does appear that there are all manner of private sector interests driving particular agendas here.
What we need is a rational discussion and debate informed by an empirical basis, because this idea that there will be acid mine drainage running through the streets of Johannesburg next week and that we should all walk around in gumboots is completely ridiculous. But there are private sector interests that we need to guard against, so that we can take rational decisions about these issues.
There are some mines on the east and, for a whole host of reasons, there are also some disused mines. It's a complex set of issues that we need a discussion about without pointing fingers this way and that, because that is unlikely to allow us to resolve this issue in a reasonable period of time.
The hon Meshoe's issue about whistle-blowers directed at the DA is a City of Cape Town issue, but they can't have an executive response here. But I think the origin of it is directed at the DA, hon Meshoe. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT
The MINISTER IN THE PRESIDENCY: NATIONAL PLANNING COMMISSION
WORLD CUP COURTS
(Minister's response)
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Chairperson, in thanking the hon member Gungubele for his statement regarding the success of the dedicated World Cup courts, I'd like to start by indicating that this was a success not only of the Department of Justice and Constitutional Development, but in fact a success of the whole justice and crime prevention security cluster. It demonstrated what we can achieve by working together in a co-ordinated and integrated manner, involving the police, the prosecution, Correctional Services, Home Affairs, state security and Legal Aid SA.
The Minister of Justice and Constitutional Development has indicated that we will be studying and evaluating this experience very thoroughly and identifying those best practices that we can extract from it to apply to the ongoing work of our criminal justice system. We would appeal to all members to join us as we implement the seven-point plan designed to give effect to the recommendations identified by the Criminal Justice Review and in so doing work towards achieving the goal of having a South Africa that is both safe and one in which all citizens and others feel safe. Thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF TRADE AND INDUSTRY
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT
LAND SHARE EQUITY
(Minister's response)
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF TRADE AND INDUSTRY: Hon Chair, I want to respond to the statement made by the leader of the DA. In my opinion you cannot say equitable share is equitable enough if you expect subsidies from government. You are actually reducing ownership and control to a business transaction, because the manner in which this equitable share is viewed for land reform purposes is of government having to play the role of paying at market-value prices for farms that were actually basically obtained through subsidies from government. So the best way is to focus on our policy of land restitution and land reform with the intention of ownership and control by the ordinary citizens of South Africa who do not have equal opportunities of tilling the land they live on and should have the benefit. Government's responsibility is to make sure that people have access to land. If we have to take certain measures to make sure that they have access to land, we can even go to the extent of looking at expropriation to have them accessing land. But equitable share is not just a business transaction by making government pay for your opinions and thinking that you must bring in people and we must pay. Thank you. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF TRADE AND INDUSTRY
RURAL DEVELOPMENT
(Minister's response)
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM: Hon Chairperson, I just want to deal, again, with the issue raised by the hon member from the DA on the share equity scheme. The reason this scheme was temporarily suspended was that we picked up that this scheme was being abused by some of the land owners. The scheme was used as an easy way of accessing public funds for the purpose of upgrading their farms without the workers, who are supposed to be shareholders, benefitting in any way in terms of these schemes. Land owners would hide the profits in the operations of the farm.
Over many years, after government has invested on behalf of the farm workers in these farms, you find that, year after year, no profit is declared. Everything is hidden under the cost for the farm, and the ordinary workers ultimately do not benefit. That was the reason why we had to intervene in making sure that, at the end, we can have proper control over the share equity schemes to make sure that indeed the people for whom this scheme has been invented actually do benefit. So that is the reason why we had to intervene: to make sure that this scheme is not abused.
We would also like to welcome the hon members' support for the South African Rural Youth Corps programme, as already supported by the hon member from the ANC. This scheme is meant to address unemployment in all 3 000 rural wards in the country. As the hon member has indicated, its aim is to create 10 000 jobs, which will also make it possible for the young people in rural areas to acquire soft skills in terms of household surveys and facilitation in organisation, but also hard skills in various programmes which are meant to upgrade rural communities, from construction and plumbing to skills in electricity installation. This is meant to last for two years... [Time Expired.] [Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF BASIC EDUCATION
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF RURAL DEVELOPMENT AND LAND REFORM
NATIONAL EDUCATION SYSTEM
(Minister's response)
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF BASIC EDUCATION: Hon Chairperson, in relation to the results of the supplementary examination, we certainly would like to improve on them. I just want to remind the hon member that consistently in the past, the pass rate in supplementary exams had been less than 18%. As a result of the extended support and advocacy, we had a much larger number of learners who sat for the supplementary examinations. This translated into more that 100 000 learners, which never occurred in the past.
If you were to look at the average passes, which were less than 18%, and compare it to the 30% and more in Gauteng and the 25% in the Western Cape, where the highest numbers of learners enrolled, it would mean that there has been a significant improvement. I'm not suggesting that it's optimal or that it's good, but what it does say to us is that more that 25 000 people have had better opportunities as a result of the effort by the then Department of Education and current Department of Basic Education. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
FIRST ORDER: SA RESERVE BANK AMENDMENT BILL
MINISTER'S RESPONSES
SOUTH AFRICAN RESERVE BANK AMENDMENT BILL(Second Reading debate)
The MINISTER OF FINANCE: Chairperson, Cabinet colleagues and hon members, on 21 April 2010, Cabinet announced the need to amend the South African Reserve Bank Act of 1989 to ensure that it meets its constitutional mandate. These amendments are designed to enhance the governance of the Reserve Bank and to uphold its public interest role.
The "public interest" principle forms the cornerstone of a central bank and particularly that of the South African Reserve Bank. The central bank derives its mandate from the Constitution, read together with the South African Reserve Bank Act of 1989. The Constitution of this country mandates the Reserve Bank to protect the value of the Rand in the interest of balanced and sustainable growth. It must do so without fear, favour or interference.
The Reserve Bank is also responsible for the supervision of commercial banks. As the US financial crisis has reminded us, the supervision of banks is a crucial task. South Africans did not experience the financial crisis partly because of the quality of work of the supervision department of the Reserve Bank.
The Reserve Bank also manages the country's foreign exchange reserves and flows of money between South Africa and the rest of the world. It is also responsible for the national payment system, which enables the transfer of money from one party to another. I am sure that you will agree with me that an institution to which we have delegated such important responsibilities must be stable at all times. There's too much at stake for us as South Africans. The Reserve Bank cannot be distracted from its mission by self-interested shareholders.
As members of this House will be aware, there has been a lot of debate and speculation about the role of private shareholders in the Reserve Bank. Our approach in this matter is driven by practical considerations and by what is in the best interest of South Africa. The nature of ownership of the Reserve Bank does not matter that much, as long as the Bank fulfils its public-interest role. This is borne out in reality by the fact that you have other central banks in the world, including those in Japan, the USA and Switzerland, that have private shareholders.
The Amendment Bill tabled in this House today seeks to strengthen the balance between the interest of the country and the interest of shareholders. This balance is important, since we all need a Reserve Bank that focuses on its constitutional mandate without undue interference by self-interested shareholders. It is for this reason that existing private shareholders should not treat the Reserve Bank as a profit-making institution. Private shareholders must have rights, but limited rights.
From its inception, it has always been the intention that the rights of public shareholders will be secondary to the public-interest role of the Reserve Bank. Even the current South African Reserve Bank Act of 1989 provides for and limits ownership of shares by an individual to no more than 10 000. It also restricts the dividend payable to shareholders to a fixed amount. In addition, it restricts the ability of shareholders – irrespective of nationality – who are not ordinarily resident in South Africa, to vote. Finally, it prohibits shareholding by nominees. These restrictions seek to ensure that there is no excessive and negative influence on the operations and management of the Reserve Bank as a public-interest entity.
It has come to light that some shareholders have been trying to get around these restrictions. Their ultimate aim is to derive private gain. These shareholders have, for example, acquired shares above the existing limit of 10 000 by using associates; they have offered payments to fellow shareholders to vote them in as directors; and have also demanded the right to share in the profits of the Bank but without the right to share in the losses of the Bank.
These are not the actions of shareholders who believe in the public-interest role of the Reserve Bank or have the interest of South Africa at heart. However, private shareholders, with limited rights, still have an important role to play in a public-interest entity like the Reserve Bank. In particular, they support and enhance the independence of the Reserve Bank and its governance.
The Amendment Bill tabled in the House today seeks to uphold the nature and importance of the Reserve Bank as a public-interest entity, created by Government for the benefit of all South Africans. The Bill seeks to achieve this by doing the following: First, it stops shareholders from circumventing the current Act's limitation of a maximum of 10 000 shares per shareholder.
[Interjection.]
The MINISTER OF FINANCE: Yes, but even that takes some time to cure, you know.
Second, it allows for the nomination of directors by a broader base of South Africans and the broadening of representation on the Board of the Bank. Third, it provide for the establishment of a panel for the election of directors. Fourth, it defines clear criteria for the disqualification of persons from serving on the Board. Fifth, it provides for the confirmation of Board nominees against fit and proper and fiduciary criteria. Sixth, it clarifies the powers and functions of the Board of the Reserve Bank. Lastly, it provides for the possibility of the Governor and Deputy Governors to be reappointed to serve a term of less than five years
These amendments have won praise from the international community. In its 2010 survey of South Africa, the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development, OECD, described the Reserve Bank Amendment Bill as "a sensible response to the problem of rogue shareholders seeking to undermine the independence of the SA Reserve Bank".
In concluding I would like to touch upon another important principle regarding the Reserve Bank. The role of the Board of the Reserve Bank should never be confused with the role of the Monetary Policy Committee. The MPC, which is constituted by the executive directors, that is, the Governor and the three Deputy Governors, as well as professional members of the Reserve Bank, implements the monetary policy framework of the country. The Board of the Reserve Bank is purely a governance and management board, and not a policy board. In this regard, the independence of the Reserve Bank in meeting its constitutional mandate remains very intact, despite the current amendments.
I would also like to explain the urgency of the Bill. The Board of the Reserve Bank currently has three vacancies. It is the desire of the Governor and government that these vacant positions be filled with fit and proper persons with the assistance of the panel. This would also mean that the best candidates should be available for election at the Reserve Bank's AGM, due later this year.
Second, both Cabinet and the Governor felt that the potential destabilisation of the Reserve Bank by a few shareholders warranted urgent attention. I would like to take this opportunity to thank the Governor of the Reserve Bank and her legal team for their hard work and assistance in drafting this Bill, Deputy Minister Nene, the National Treasury Director-General Lesetja Kganyago and his team for contributing to the Bill, and the Standing Committee on Finance, under the steady hand of Mr Thabadiawa Mufamadi, for their sterling work with regard to the processing of the Bill.
I hereby request that this House pass the South African Reserve Bank Amendment Bill 2010. Thank you.
Mr T A MUFAMADI
The MINISTER OF FINANCE
Mr T A MUFAMADI: Hon Chairperson, hon members, Ministers present here and Minister of Finance, let me start by reading from Marianne Williamson's A Return to Love which says:
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be?
The above extract from the book, and these words in particular, have become like nylon to us, signaling the change shining through the women who dared to challenge the barricades of social limitations which do not only restrict creativity, freedom and expression, but linger to affect every other area of an individual's wellbeing.
Before I confine myself to the report and recommendations of the Standing Committee on Finance to this House, allow me to salute, with respect, the relentless effort of our democracy in embracing the evident torch of light, achievements and paradigms demonstrated by the women of our nation in all spheres of life. The debate on the South African Reserve Bank Amendment Bill takes place when the entire country is celebrating the success of our efforts to liberate women from years of oppression suffered on the basis of their race, class and gender.
It is during this month that we assess the impact of our government's corrective policies and the positive effects that such policies have had in creating a national democratic society in which the women's role is at the centre of development.
The implementation of such corrective measures should not assume that the consequences of democracy will automatically translate into the eradication of patriarchy, which was and still remains the embodiment of economic, social, religious, cultural and other forms of oppression of women in a democratic society.
As we strive to create the ideal society that Tat'uMandela, Tat'uSisulu, together with many other heroes and heroines of our struggle, sought to create, we must never forget to appreciate the first steps they took to make us feel the need to rise even when we thought and felt that we did not have the means to make our case known beyond our borders. Through their courage and commitment, they made it possible for even the most hesitant to realise the need to challenge the everyday reality of life and struggle.
The demand for progress around this particular issue can be decoded in the loud voices whose echoes have broken the walls of silence in our economic corridors. This is a clear indication that time has come for us to honestly introspect the contributions that the financial sector has made in the feminist fight against poverty evident in the physical marginalisation, psychological abuse and the undermining of the potential of women. We must also assess how the sector has assisted in the redirection or lack of equal opportunities for women in positions of authority and power in the economy.
Most importantly, we must, from our political perch, focus on specifics so as to answer the question: Have the financial institution succeeded in creating unambiguous structures, systems, as well as conducive cultural conditions that embrace the abilities of women so that they flourish and enrich the life of our nation?
The Minister has adequately dealt with the important role of the South African Reserve Bank, particularly in the economy, as well as the relevance of the amendments to the existing Act to address the challenges that the Reserve Bank has encountered in the past few years.
In the processing of this Bill, the committee had an opportunity to interact with various stakeholders, including some of the shareholders, through written and oral submissions. Once again, the committee, in processing this Bill, had to strike a balance between public interest and participation and the challenges that these amendments seek to address within a stipulated period in terms of the Reserve Bank regulations.
Members of the House will be aware of the debate in the public domain regarding the role of the Reserve Bank which has been going on in the recent past and now recently, since the publication of the Bill for public comment. Prior to the publication of the Bill, the debate was whether it is desirable to have private investors as shareholders in the bank or should it not be entirely owned by the state. These questions arose out of the concern that private shareholders could use their shareholding power to influence the bank and monetary policies to the detriment of the nation and its interests.
Proposed amendments, among others, reflect on the composition of the board. Guided by making the minimum interventions in the Bill, the committee confined its work and aimed at ensuring that the substance of the key mandate of the Reserve Bank remains the domain of the Governor and the Deputy Governors of the Reserve Bank.
In this regard, the proposed amendment of the composition of the board gives effect to the separation of responsibilities between the executive and the board. In terms of the current legislation, as it stands, the board delegates the executive authority to the Governor of the Reserve Bank, which is not healthy. The amendments therefore ensure that the board remains focused on governance matters while the functioning and day-to-day activities of the Reserve Bank are the responsibility and the domain of the Reserve Bank Governor.
The Bill also proposes that four directors be appointed by the President in addition to those who will be nominated through the public process. It is our considered view that this will strengthen the board's functionality in observing governance matters in the day-to-day activities of the bank.
It is important to indicate that the Reserve Bank, unlike other commercial banks, is a statutory body that derives its mandate from the Constitution, which guarantees its independence from external influence. Therefore the role of shareholders is very limited and is outlined in the regulations.
It is in this regard that each person is allowed to own a maximum of 10 000 shares, irrespective of the size of their pocket or the institution that seeks to participate in the shareholding scheme of the Reserve Bank. This ensures that ordinary people can have an equal vote as ordinary shareholders in the bank in terms of the decisions that they need to make.
The consequence of the activities of the shareholders may result in narrowing public participation of ordinary citizens in the bank as some of them seek to manipulate share prices. Ordinarily, the issued shares of the Reserve Bank were, at the beginning, between R1,20 and R1,50. At the time of this amendment being presented before the committee, some of the shareholders had actually manipulated share prices to the value of R6 000 per share. That tells all of us that ordinary people are not able to be participants in the affairs of the Reserve Bank. It begins to be the domain of the few, the rich and those who are driven by nothing else but profit motives. [Applause.] Therefore the committee is in support of the establishment of the panel which will ensure that fit and proper persons will serve on the board.
How is this going to happen? The Amendment Bill seeks to establish a panel that will process nominations, and such a panel will be checked by the Reserve Bank Governor. A retired judge, three representatives from the National Economic Development and Labour Council, Nedlac, and one person appointed by the Minister will be part of it. Its responsibility is only confined to processing and interviewing those who will have been nominated to participate or to serve as directors of the Reserve Bank.
With regard to some shareholders who are opposed to the role of the central bank as defined in the Constitution, the ANC strategy and tactics direct us on how we should deal with these matters. They clearly outline that as we surge forward, the key question that should remain uppermost in our minds is: What kind of a society do we seek to create? In other words, what is the character of the national democratic revolution?
It is in this understanding that transformation will encounter resistance from time to time, precisely because colonialisation of a special type contained in itself contradictions which cannot be resolved through reforms.
The changes proposed in this Bill will stand or fall on the basis of whether or not it is able to eliminate the main antagonism of the system we currently have in the administration of the bank. Perhaps the question we need to ask now is whether or not the current form and structure of ownership of the bank, with private ownership of shares, is in fact desirable.
Given our history and our experience, which has now necessitated the amendment of the current legislation, it is significant to note that ours is one of the few - nine - central banks in the world that have this kind of arrangement, where private shareholders participate. Among the nine are Australia, Belgium, Greece, Italy, Japan, Pakistan, Switzerland and the USA.
Even though the committee is aware that there are different types of management models of the Reserve Bank, it did not venture into assessing the operations of different models in the world. To us, it remains work in progress. It is evident that after the financial economic crisis, the majority of governments in the world are beginning to review the role of the central banks in the economy.
In our case, the central bank has a critical role, through its monetary policies, to ensure price stability which, in turn, will ensure low inflation or inflation targeting, as envisaged in our macro-economic policy. However, hon members are aware of the debate about the correctness of this approach.
In conclusion, we note that through a corrective policy mix and choices, the central bank can determine the rate of inflation, which influences the size of consumer baskets. Therefore it is essential that the value of money remains stable, because no modern economy can function well if its currency continuously loses value.
The committee is in support of the establishment of an open process of nomination of directors to the board, because the creation of a legitimate state and public institution can only be derived through the regular and popular participation of ordinary people.
Only through this process can we safeguard the independence of the Reserve Bank by ensuring that those who are nominated to serve will do so with the full understanding that the primary objective of the bank is not to satisfy the whims and aspirations of shareholders whose primary motive is to make super profits at the expense of the poor. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mr D T GEORGE
Mr T MUFAMADI
Mr D T GEORGE: Chairperson, the DA is a patriotic party. We love our country and we cherish its institutions. That is why we work relentlessly to ensure that their functionality is not eroded by the selfish actions of any interest group or any political party.
The SA Reserve Bank was established in 1921. It was modelled on the Bank of England and its primary objectives were to issue banknotes, act as custodian of cash reserves of other banks, lend cash to other banks in the event of shortages of liquidity, clear and settle interbank transfers and act as custodian of the country's gold and foreign-exchange reserves. From the outset shareholding in the bank was intended to be symbolic. Shareholding was limited to ensure that the broader public could participate in ownership of the bank and dividends were limited to restrain the profit motive for share acquisition.
One of the current shareholders who appeared before the committee during the public hearings presented a detailed history of the bank and confirmed that, historically, shareholders played a very limited role in the affairs of the bank and that the bank divulged little, if any information to its shareholders. Over time, the shareholder said, the bank began to exchange more and more information with its shareholders as governance trends changed over the years and shareholders became more vocal about their demands for access to information.
The relationship between the bank and its shareholders appeared to be progressing in the right direction until a few years ago, when a noise emanating from a group of shareholders started to increase significantly. It was not immediately obvious, but this marked the beginning of a specific strategy by one shareholder in particular, who was determined to unlock the so-called value of the investment in the bank and embarked on a programme to encourage other shareholders, and new shareholders, to do the same. Part of this strategy included attempts to circumvent legislated limits on a number of shares any individual or entity could hold in a bank, with a view to mobilising a block of shareholders to appoint directors to the bank who were sympathetic to their cause.
The strategy included plans to increase the limited dividend payable to shareholders, access capital at the bank and share in their annual profits but not in any loses. Anapproach was also made to the ANC to nationalise the bank. Their primary motive was to liquidate the bank and receive a massive windfall.
We will never know how the relationship between the bank and its shareholders would have evolved on its current trajectory, because there is no doubt after the public hearings that a legislative intervention is required to match the expectations of the shareholders with those of the bank.
The proposed amendment limits an individual or entity to ownership of 10 000 shares, including the shares held by their associates. Limited shareholding is not new and strengthening this position will make it more difficult for individuals and entities to yield more influence than the original legislation intended.
Some shareholders claim that the proposed amendment is unconstitutional, is an act of expropriation and contravenes bilateral international agreements on compensation for acts of nationalisation. The basis of their argument is that the bank is a company similar to any other company, is subject to the Companies Act and that they, as its shareholders, are its owners and can do whatever they want with their asset.
The fact is that the bank is a unique policy institution, established in terms of a special Act of Parliament, the Currency and Banking Act 31 of 1920, and its shareholders have always known the limits that are associated with ownership of its shares. The bank's view is that the actions of a group of shareholders are undermining its ability to properly perform its functions. The amendment, they argue, will improve and clarify governance of banks.
It is unfortunate that the expectation mismatch between the bank and its shareholders arose, requiring legislative intervention. We need to accept the reality that the SA Reserve Bank performs a crucial policy function and that it also has private shareholders, many without ulterior motives. Despite the noisy dispute, the actual question is how the SA Reserve Bank should be structured to best serve the interests of all South Africans.
The DA recognises the need for government to intervene when the market fails. The world financial crisis has revealed substantial gaps in classical economic theory, especially the assumption that all the information is available and that markets can always self-correct. In this instance, the failure is the misaligned objectives of the bank and some of its shareholders. This problem is not unique and arose at the Bank of England, prior to its nationalisation in 1947. Hansard records of debates in the House of Commons in 1945 and House of Lords in 1946 reflect the primary reason for the bank's nationalisation. Both sides of the Houses agreed that the bank was a unique policy institution and that shareholders should not be permitted to influence the bank for their own benefit. Although the solution, to nationalise the bank, was not unanimously supported, the British government paid £58 million, in 1947, to buy out the shareholders.
During our parliamentary hearings, some SA Reserve Bank shareholders made clear their opposition to current monetary policy and declared a need for a fundamental change in the operation of our entire banking and financial system. This is well beyond their mandate and reflects broader aspirations to influence key aspects of our economy. Board members are not intended to represent a particular interest group and must act in the best interests of the bank. The amendment sets out the corporate governance functions of the board and introduces a mechanism to consider the suitability of directors who will be nominated by a wider group of stakeholders. The number of directors is increased to 15, seven of whom elected by shareholders. Any shareholder, current director or member of the general public can nominate a director for election.
A panel will confirm that a candidate is suitable for possible election to the board. This process should screen out unsuitable candidates and retain those who are fit and proper and possess the required skills and experience.
During my recent visit to the United Kingdom, I had an opportunity to meet with the governance department at the Bank of England and had a close look at developments in their corporate finance over their long history - since 1694. Their view is that governance is evolving and this is reflected in ongoing amendments of the Bank of England Act.
Similar to the Bank of England, the SA Reserve Bank operation in pursuit of its mandate is independent, but the inflation target is set by government. While the Crown appoints all directors to the Bank of England, the SA Reserve Bank Amendment Bill proposes the election of seven directors, a more transparent and inclusive approach than that of the Bank of England.
Having considered the deliberations before the committee and the role of the SA Reserve Bank in our economy, an amendment to clarify shareholder expectations and improve governance procedures to ensure ongoing stability at the bank is required. The proposed amendment does move in this direction. Governance evolves over time and Parliament must exercise more vigorous oversight over this institution.
It is likely that further amendments will be required over time to strengthen governance and ensure that the most optimal structure is maintained. In this regard, the Bank of England and other central banks, including those that have private shareholders, can provide useful guidelines.
At the peak of the world financial crisis in 2008, a group of 15 leading financial economists met at Squam Lake, New Hampshire, to consider the question of how we can prevent the repeat of the world financial crisis. The resulting Squam Lake report sets out several recommendations, including the need for one organisation in each country to be responsible for overseeing the health and stability of the overall financial system. They argue that the central bank should be charged with this important responsibility. The DA agrees. The role of the SA Reserve Bank is far wider than implementing monetary policy and protecting the value of our currency. It needs to drive macroprudential policy and the necessary microprudential reforms.
The role of Parliament is to hold the bank to account, to provide oversight and to ensure that the bank operates in a stable environment. Although the proposed amendment does improve this stability, it is likely that further amendments will be required in future, especially to enhance transparency and inclusivity. Given that this amendment takes a step in the appropriate direction, the DA will support this Bill. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mr N J J van R KOORNHOF
Dr D T GEORGE
Mr N J J van R KOORNHOF: Thank you, Mr Chairman. The debate around the shareholding, the so-called nationalisation and the independence of the Reserve Bank created quite a stir. The financial columns were full of speculation - why the sudden need for these amendments? However, as far as I can remember in my political life, in the committees I have served on, the amendments published in this Bill went through the committee unchanged. There were no objections from those parties present at the meetings. Full marks go to Governor Marcus and her team, who have so eloquently argued for the adoption of these amendments.
In 1999, S K Apea wrote, "To ensure that the central bank commands the confidence of the financial system, the Governor, in particular, must possess the following qualities: strong academic and professional background, strong personality and ability to influence opinions through persuasive argument." The Governor lived up to this definition during our hearings.
Fabian Amtenbrink wrote for the International Monetary Fund, the IMF, on the three pillars of central bank governance and according to him the first one is independence. There is large consensus worldwide on the need for central bank independence. This independence concerns the relationship that exists between the bank and the government. It is therefore desirable that the bank and its board are not subjected to political orders or pressures. We, as politicians, must always remind ourselves that the very nature of our positions makes it impossible for us to be impartial to the short-term benefits of an expansive monetary policy. The focus must be long-term stability rather than short-term monetary temptations.
The second pillar of governance is accountability. To the extent that central banks are independent, mechanisms of democratic accountability are required in order to legitimise the position of the bank within a given constitutional system. The legislation is silent – quite correctly – on this, and therefore it is important that Parliament and, in particular, the Standing Committee on Finance, should become more active in this role.
The third pillar of governance, according to Amtenbrink, is that the central bank must be transparent. Transparency includes the public's understanding of decisions taken by the bank and the reasoning behind those decisions. In the words of Deane and Pringle, "an open, democratic society has the right to demand a broad degree of understanding of what central banks do and how they do it". We should design our own parliamentary process to assist in a way that does not compromise the independence of the bank nor apply undue political pressure for the wrong reasons.
Cope will support these amendments. And, in closing, were it not for the various international treaties and the possibility of sending a negative signal to international investors, we would have supported an amendment that only South African citizens should be allowed to buy shares in the Reserve Bank.
We are looking forward to a stable era under the governorship of Gill Marcus. Be strong. Defend your independence and do not allow the debate and disagreement on economic policy within the alliance to undermine your independence. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI
Mr N J J van R KOORNHOF
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI: Thank you, Mr Chairman. In a salient showing of the limits of democracy, this Bill does just the opposite of what it proposed to achieve, a fact clearly highlighted in all the public input, but ignored by the media and commentators.
The Bill increases the composition of the Board with people without the required specialised, relevant experience, but takes all the powers of management away from such a bloated board and places them exclusively in the hands of the Governor and the Bank's inner and secretive circle. The Bill does nothing to deal with private profits on the bank's shares – the very reason given for its introduction by the Minister. It does nothing to create transparency, representation and accountability where it matters - in the Monetary Policy Committee, which creates and destroys money at will, without any public official or public representative involved in, or aware of, this process.
Effectively, this Bill is an internal coup d'état to concentrate even more power away from public accountability and transparency. It excludes and silences the individual shareholders, who, warts and all, are the only existing public watchdog within the Bank.
The Bill leaves fundamental issues unaddressed. Who does the Reserve Bank really serve: the country or the banking community? Its constitutionally required independence is threatened more by the incestuous embrace of the banking community than by the ineffective and tenuous liaison with our government.
The secretive black box within which the operations of the Reserve Bank take place has remained unaffected. The Bank can do as it wishes in creating and destroying fiat money as long as it does so within the broad inflation targets set by government. And, in so doing, it partakes in the broader process through which central banks generate recessions or economic booms at the time they deem best.
Neither the Minister nor this Parliament has the statutory power or the in-house skills base to check on what goes on within the black box, or to answer the allegations we heard during public comments, such as that the gold reserves of South Africa have been moved to England; that the huge losses posted by the Reserve Bank this year are really losses of the banking system transferred to the Reserve Bank by shifting reserve requirements and titular ownership; and that there are preferential tracks for application under the Exchange Control Acts which are said to be applied differently, depending on who the client is. Even the Minister has no power to shine a light into the black box.
The Reserve Bank has been promising to be accountable and transparent, exactly because this Bill does not create any legal obligation for it to do so, and we must rely merely on its promises. The public input we received about this Bill ... [Time expired.] Under these conditions we cannot but oppose this Bill.
Ms P E ADAMS
Mr M G ORIANI-AMBROSINI
Ms P E ADAMS: Hon Speaker, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, given the difficulties that the Reserve Bank has been experiencing in the past, as evidenced by the recent public debate regarding the changes being proposed by this Bill, amendments to clarify the different roles of shareholders, the executive and Parliament are welcomed.
In the main, the role of the shareholders in the context of the Reserve Bank is to safeguard its independence as stipulated in the Constitution of the Republic and to ensure that it fulfils its mandate as set out in the South African Reserve Bank Act. Collectively, the role of the shareholders must be seen as those of the board of directors as a whole. Clauses seven and eight strengthen the public character of the SA Reserve Bank. It will assist in building the credibility of the bank. Shareholders have to act in the interest of the bank and the public.
The Bill identifies roles of the board in terms of its responsibilities, powers and duties. These include corporate governance matters, such as compliance, rules adoption and policy determination, approving the budget, reports, appointment of bank secretaries and assistants, remuneration policy, allocations of funds to the retirement fund; authorising the establishment of branches, making recommendations to the Ministers and performing any function assigned to it in terms of the Act.
Most of the problems affecting public institutions are as a result of unclear mandates between the various stakeholders such as the board of directors, executive management and government. The Bill clearly defines the role of the board as that of governance, authorising and reporting. It provides for clear demarcation of responsibility between the board and operational management, vested with the governor and the deputies. These functions are consistent with best practice and principles of good governance internationally as far as central banks are concerned.
Directors must be fit and proper to act in the interest of the SA Reserve Bank and not of shareholders. The establishment of a panel and its proposed composition is viewed as the most appropriate mechanism to ensure nominees are fit and proper, as the SA Reserve Bank plays a vital role in the South African economy. The amendments of sector allocations are intended to ensure that the board has persons with knowledge of relevant sectors. Presidential appointees will contribute to this knowledge.
The role of the executive management, on the other hand, is a dedicated one from the Governor and the Deputy Governors. Their role is that of implementing policy and management. They do not take decisions that are of governance nature. They account to the board, who in turn accounts to Parliament. Parliament's role is critical in the sense that the bank is also independent of the executive arm of the state. Its role is to seek accountability from the bank through its board of directors. Parliament is entitled to summon the bank to account at any point in time, should it be necessary to do so. I thank you. [Applause.
Mr S N SWART
Ms P E ADAMS
Mr S N SWART: Chairperson, the Reserve Bank, as we know, is a crucial independent institution in South Africa, mandated inter alia with determining monetary policy. Public hearings on this Bill exposed a very high level of mistrust between shareholders and government, as well as confirming concerns that some shareholders seek to influence not only executive management decisions but also operational issues, including monetary policy decisions.
This is clearly beyond the mandate of shareholders, as previous speakers have indicated. This is a situation that is untenable, resulting in these amendments before us. The amendments require that board members – certain board members - must be screened by a panel to determine their suitability, whether they are fit and proper persons with appropriate skills and experience, taking into account the requirements contained in the Banks Act of 1990.
The amendment clarifies that bank directors owe their fiduciary duty and that of care and skill to the bank, and to no one else. The bank must serve the public interests and not a personal shareholder's objective. Directors must therefore avoid any conflict of interest between his or her interests and those of the bank.
The ACDP raised certain questions as to why this panel will only screen the shareholders-nominated directors and not the directors appointed by the President. We accept the explanation that this would impinge upon the President's powers but it did seem slightly odd to us during deliberations.
The President's appointments must in any case satisfy the same requirements of being fit and proper persons to be appointed with appropriate skills and experience. Significantly, the whole policy debate as to whether there should be shareholders at all has been postponed to a later occasion. In view of this and of the concerns surrounding the shareholders, the ACDP will support this Amendment Bill.
As the last issue, relating to what Mr Oriani-Ambrosini said, may I just say that these are valid concerns that we as parliamentarians also need to consider. Clearly, at the end of the day, the Reserve Bank is accountable to Parliament in the final instance. At least in future we should engage and consider some of those concerns that Mr Oriani-Ambrosini raised, particularly to the secrecy box and in the view of the fact that the Reserve Bank is accountable to Parliament. I look forward to engaging with the Reserve Bank in more detail to discuss those concerns. I thank you.
Mr E M MTHETHWA
Mr S N Swart
Mr E M MTHETHWA: Hon Chair, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, the ANC has gone through this Bill. The Minister has alluded to a number of issues, which include governance and some technical aspects. One focus is that of corporate governance leading to the proposed amendment.
The main objective of the Reserve Bank, in terms of the Constitution, is to protect the value of the currency of the Republic in the interest of balanced and sustainable economic growth in the Republic. This places a premium on the importance of good corporate governance in the way the bank is being managed.
Although the reasons for this amendment Bill are not only about corporate governance, as was correctly alluded to by my chairperson, a lot of the issues that led to the amendment are of a governance nature. In recent years, evidence suggesting that the current Act might be open to potential abuse has come to light. This relates to the potential for private shareholders to increase their shares above the prescribed maximum of 10 000 shares per shareholder by purchasing shares through their relatives. These shares could then be used to influence the bank through acquiring the so-called "voting powers". I wonder why some people are asking why the Bill is being challenged now, as some of my colleagues from Cope have been doing.
The main aim of the Bill is to amend the SA Reserve Bank Act, Act 90 of 1989, in order to stop the bank's shareholders from circumventing the prescribed maximum of 10 000 shares per shareholder; broaden public involvement in the nomination of directors and board representation; provide for the establishment of a panel for the election of directors; and clarify the power of the board and those of the governor and the deputy. In so doing, the aim is to improve the bank's governance.
The most important amendment in relation to corporate governance is the stipulation of the limitation on the number of shares that the shareholders may hold in relation to associates and the setting of measures to prevent the circumventing of the limitation on the maximum number of shares a shareholder may hold. The Bill sets the limits for private shareholding by stipulating that "no shareholder shall hold, or hold in aggregate with his, her or its associate, more than 10 000 shares in the bank" and sets the limits for voting rights of private shareholders by stipulating that "no shareholder shall either directly or indirectly exercise any vote as a shareholder in respect of the number of shares in the bank held by him, her or it, either alone or in aggregate with his, her or its associates in excess of 10 000. The same conditions apply to companies with interlocking directorates.
The proposed amendment, as the chairperson also alluded to, will help to ensure that the bank is seen as truly fulfilling its public-interest role and acting independently from private shareholders' narrow interests. It will also assist in strengthening good corporate governance in the bank, thus improving its credibility and public confidence. Currently, this is not the case.
We also had the privilege to listen to shareholders when they presented the history of 1921 on the establishment of the bank. All in all, the ANC supports this Bill on the basis that it will now be open to the public to allow them to participate freely and not just serve the interest of the minorities. I thank you. [Applause.]
The MINISTER OF FINANCE
Mr E M MTHETHWA
The MINISTER OF FINANCE: Chairperson, I thank all the representatives of the various political parties for their contributions. I also thank the various stakeholders who made presentations to the standing committee for their contributions and thoughts, whether we agreed with them or not. That is relevant. Their participation is important.
The majority of the parties shared the view of the government that the Reserve Bank is an institution which is central to our national interests. No individual, shareholder or groups of shareholders should try to interfere with its mandate in any kind of way. Any attempt to do so must require us to act, as we have done in this regard.
The only lone voice out there is that of hon Ambrosini. I must certainly assure him that this is no internal coup d'etat. In response to both him and hon Swart, the Governor of the Reserve Bank and her colleagues do appear before the standing committee. You have adequate opportunity to raise any matter that you wish to raise with them. I am sure that they will account to you as they account to South Africa more generally.
All in all, thank you very much for the support for this Amendment Bill. Once again, I thank the standing committee for processing the Bill so effectively. Thank you. [Applause.]
Afrikaans:
Mnr A M MPONTSHANE: Agb Voorsitter, kan u die IFP se besware op rekord plaas?
Debate concluded.
The House adjourned at 16:06.
END OF TAKE
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