Impact of National Disaster Management regulations on the religious sector, with Deputy Minister

Meeting report

Opening Remarks by the Chairperson

The Chairperson opened the virtual meeting, welcoming the Members, support staff and all the guest delegates from the religious organisations and the Department of Cooperative Governance and Traditional Affairs (COGTA), including its Deputy Minister. She indicated that the Committee had previously scheduled the meeting for 21 April 2021, but as some of the organisations could not submit their written responses on time, the meeting was postponed. Due to the importance of the matter, the Committee then decided to call the meeting during Parliament’s constituency period.

The Committee recognises the importance of the religious sector as a key stakeholder in the management of the state disaster. It also recognises that the sector has played a significant role in spreading government’s message for citizens to take safety precautions. Churches have been at the forefront and have assisted with food distribution and the provision of counselling and social services to those most at need.

The prevailing sentiment within the sector is that government has not taken it seriously, with many religious leaders stating that the Disaster Management Act (DMA) has unfairly targeted the sector. Some of the submissions made to the Committee have shown that religious leaders believe that the DMA should be reviewed. As such, the Committee is also considering a Disaster Management Amendment Bill (DMAB) that will review the Act; the Committee hoped that the religious sector would participate in the process. Parliament will soon publish the DMB for public comment, with the view of facilitating the views of interested parties. Once it is published, the Committee will be able to determine the extent to which amendments to the Act are necessary. As the custodians of the Act, the Committee assured the Department that they are committed in realising a workable piece of legislation, which will respond adequately and justly to national disasters and will not infringe on the rights of the citizens. The input from religious leaders will aid the Committee in doing so.

The Committee has scheduled to have the second part of the meeting on Thursday.

FOR SA submission: the impact of the Disaster Management Act Regulations on the religious sector

The Executive Director of FOR SA, Mr Michael Swain, mentioned that during the pandemic, FOR SA has represented various religious leaders and organisations – which represent between 11 and 18.5 million people – to engage government and make submissions on their behalf. FOR SA has written numerous letters to the President and various Ministers, particularly the Minister of the Department of Cooperative Governance and Traditional Affairs (CoGTA), to obtain clarity with regard to the interpretation and practical working of the various regulations pertaining to religious gatherings, and to put forward the concerns of the religion community. However, all of the letters were left unanswered. Due to the unresponsiveness of government, particularly Minister Dlamini-Zuma, FOR SA instituted litigation against her in Johannesburg High Court. The application was instituted on an urgent basis, specifically with a view to lifting the (then) complete ban on religious gatherings imposed by the regulations of the 29 December 2020. This litigation is currently pending.

FOR SA believes that as long as it is properly justified in terms of scientific data, certain targeted restrictions may be imposed on the religious sector in order to achieve legitimate health goals. Furthermore, the executive should be held to account and should be more responsive to the religious community’s concerns.

SANCF briefing on the impact of the DMA regulations on the religious sector

The Chairperson of the South African National Christian Forum (SANCF), Bishop Marothi Mashashane, mentioned that the SANCF currently represents 240 religious denominations, which can be characterised as small, medium and mega churches. The forum has been affected by the pandemic, like other sectors, but what has concerned them is that government has unfairly discriminated against the religious sector. After several attempts to engage with the Minister of the CoGTA, the forum initiated legal action against her and the Department. Through its court action, the forum sought to set aside the ban against religious gatherings. Both FOR SA and the Muslim Supreme Council of South Africa supported SANCF’s litigation. The President, however, announced relaxations to regulations on the eve of the court case. Whilst religious leaders were pleased with the announcement, they still feel aggrieved by the fact that government has not consulted them for their opinion when making changes to the regulations. Government claims that it has consulted with the sector, but the Minister has failed to provide the minutes that show that it did indeed consult with the sector prior to announcing Lockdown Level 5.

There have been several inconsistencies in the enforcement of the regulations; for instance, when politicians have had gatherings, there has been no enforcement, but when congregants have attended services in Sebokeng and Soweto, they were attacked by the police. Despite this, citizens are able to go to casinos and restaurants any day of the week, whereas worshippers are only able to attend one church service a week. This has led religious leaders to the conclusion that the sector is discriminated against because it does not contribute to the country’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP).

The religious sector has not been provided the same support provided to the sports and entertainment industry. Several pastors are struggling financially and because they have not been registered for the Unemployment Insurance Fund (UIF), they do not have access to relief funds.

During the pandemic, the churches have assisted many citizens who are enduring hardship. Churches play an important role in the country, but this has not been acknowledged by the government. This is an anti-God government.

Rev Ralph Stander, from SA Religious Forum, said that the forum would provide comment in the following meeting. He appreciated the opportunity provided by the Committee for the religious sector to speak on the matter.

ECL submission on the impact of the DMA regulations on the religious sector

Pastor Sipho Mahlangu, from the Ecumenical Leadership Council (ECL), said that the religious sector needs to be given the liberty to express its religious rights, which are in line with the framework of the Constitution. The Council felt that the DMA needs to be reasonable, rational, justifiable, and proportional in how it is applied, as it is currently targeting the religious sector. The Act has not clearly described the role of the police and the army during a State Disaster. This description was only added by the Minister of the CoGTA in 2020, which seemed arbitrary. The Committee should ensure that the implementation of the Act does not continue to exclude the religious community because as it stands, the Church administration is unable to work, which has affected many worshippers.

The Church has been excluded financially by the government, even though it plays an important role in the country. Like journalists, religious leaders should receive Covid-19 vaccine jabs.

SUCG submission on the impact of the DMA regulations on the religious sector

Mr Faizul Khamker explained that the SUCG (Sunni Ulama Council Gauteng) is a theological association operating in all the inland provinces of the country. The SUCG believes that the DMA is draconian and encroaches on the rights of religious communities to express their faith. Furthermore there has been no scientific evidence to support the claim that religious activities are more dangerous than others.

As part of its recommendations, the SUCG suggested that religious work in a pandemic must be classified as essential work. In addition, religious activity should be treated in the same manner as other activities.

Briefing by the BFC SA on the impact of DMA regulations on the religious sector

Mr Mlingane Poswayo, a representative of the Bahai Faith Community of South Africa (BFC SA), explained that the Bahai Faith seeks to eliminate all forms of prejudice, the unity of all religions, and the equality of men and women. To administer its affairs, it has an elected body of institutions rather than clergyman. This body is elected once a year but the 2020 election process was interrupted by the Level 5 restrictions. Due to the digital divide in the country, the Community was unable to either meet or host an election.

The Community is grateful that the government has allowed for religious gatherings to continue. As a result of this decision, the Community is now regularly meeting. The Community requested that the government continue allowing a certain number of individuals to attend religious gatherings.

Briefing by the HEI on the on the impact of DMA regulations on the religious sector

The Head of the Sociology Department at the HEI (formerly known as Monash University), Dr Alex Asakitikpi, said that all social institutions (economic, religious and family) play an important role in society. Thus, it is important to look at the roles of each institution in order to foster peace and solidarity within society. In addition, all relevant stakeholders should note that there are different interactions within the economic and the religious sector. For instance, it is far easier to regulate interactions within the economic sector, as they are largely superficial, than it is to regulate the behaviour and actions of worshippers.  

Government needs to lead the conversation on how to balance the need for people to worship whilst ensuring that their risk of infection is limited.

Government has been acting in good faith during this crisis and it was not fair to characterise it as being anti-religious.

The Chairperson said that the Committee appreciated hearing an academic perspective on the matter.

Briefing by the CFCC on the impact of DMA regulations on the religious sector

The Chairperson of the CFCC (Council for Charismatic Churches), Pastor Lucas Nkosi, mentioned that the CRL Commission (Commission for the Promotion and Protection of the Rights of Cultural, Religious and Linguistic Communities) has a Constitutional mandate to attend to the issues the religious sector has with the regulations in the DMA. The Council has laid complaints to the Commission on the different acts of brutality faced by religious authorities and worshipers. As they have not received a response, they have had to request Parliament for assistance, as it is the voice of the people. The Council felt that the CRL Commission had failed to fulfil its duties. It advised that the Committee look at the Commission’s Key Performance Indicators (KPIs), to ascertain whether it has fulfilled its objectives and functions. Furthermore, the Commission should indicate how it has helped to foster mutual respect, and to protect the rights of worshippers.

Government has published regulations that are questionable and have not been made with the people in the mind. These regulations are meant to be in the best interests of the citizens, yet the NCCC has failed to mention why there has been a limitation of rights. Neither has it provided scientific evidence to support the claim that churches contribute to the spread of the virus. Religious leaders felt that the Executive has failed to be held to account.

Churches have respected government’s regulations. It was unfair that political parties have been able to exercise their rights whilst worshippers were being targeted.

Rev. Sello Motsiri-Kharoli indicated that he did not represent any organisation.

The religious sector has been mistreated by the government.

He asked three questions: firstly, how safe the vaccine was, as there have been reports of patients dying after taking the jab. Secondly, what security will the religious sector be provided that it will not come under attack by the police? Thirdly, what criteria had been used to place the country into Level 3 Lockdown?  

Government should recognise that the religious sector contributes significantly to the economy.

Briefing by the UFC on the impact of the DMA regulations on the religious sector

Pastor Mukhuba, a representative of the UFC (Unity of Fellowship Churches), mentioned that some church leaders felt that the sector had been discriminated against by government, mainly because different requirements have been placed on church gatherings. This was concerning, as there has not been any scientific information to support the claims that churches are super spreaders.

People in the community require for their religious leaders not only to preach to them, but to also take care of them, spiritually. Yet, when they do gather at the church for a service, they have been met with heavy-handedness by the police. In one particular incident that took place at the UFC, churchgoers, including women and children, were shot at by the police. After the incident, the Church expected that the CRL Commission would take the matter up, as the police’s actions violated the human rights of the churchgoers. It is important that the legal authorities recognise that all sectors should be treated equally.

Pastor Balcan Mufamadi mentioned that government had fully opened all sectors in the country, except the religious sector. Due to their prolonged closure, churches are unable to pay their bills.

Religious leaders feel that the Church is under attack by the government, yet the Church has contributed considerably to the country during this period. Government should prioritise the religious sector when making regulations.

Rev. Alfred Mogwera mentioned that it was concerning that police took no action against revellers at taverns who did not wear masks and respect social distancing, yet they have acted with brutality towards churchgoers.

The church had been at the forefront of the struggle in the past, and it contributed to the economic collapse of the Apartheid government. As it has played a pivotal role in the country, government should acknowledge this by providing it with better treatment. This would include a review of government’s current stance on church gatherings. The two hours that have been allocated on a Sunday are not enough and this should be increased. Many people are suffering during this crisis and find sanctuary in the Church.

Rev. Bacca Mengezeleli indicated that the churches were concerned by the state’s brutality and how it has been masked as enforcement.  

There have been several complaints that during its consultations with the religious sector, government only communicates with religious leaders that are in their favour. This created the image that government is fuelling division within the religious sector. Government should look to broaden the participation of all leaders.

Mr S Swart (ACDP) said that, in a judgement, the Constitutional Court found that the views of the religious community should be taken seriously, and the community must be treated with respect. Parliament needs to revisit the DMA. It has been disturbing to hear the stories of heavy-handedness shown by the police against churchgoers.

It is disappointing that both the CRL Commission and the South African Human Rights Commission (SAHRC) had not taken up the plight of churches. Government needs to understand the important role of religious leaders in providing people of the community strength, particularly during this difficult period.

He thanked the Committee for arranging the meeting, to allow for religious leaders to share their views and concerns. It is Parliament’s duty to hold the Executive to account.

The Chairperson thanked Mr Swart for his input.

Parliament would be failing its duties were it not to consider these matters. With the allegations levelled against the SAHRC and the CRL Commission, the Committee would require that they appear before it at the meeting on Thursday. In addition, the Committee expects that the Department will respond to the issues raised at the same meeting.

As the custodians of the DMA, the Committee must ensure that legislation should be fair and does not discriminate against certain groups/individuals. Mr P Groenewald (FF+) has submitted a Private Member’s Bill in Parliament, a Bill which focuses on the amendments of the DMA. The Committee agreed that the Bill must be subjected to public scrutiny. As such, Parliament will soon publish the draft Bill. She requested that representatives of the religious sector provide comment on the Bill once it is published.

She opened the floor for discussion.

Discussion

Mr C Brink (DA) said that currently, the law has not made room for South African citizens to make contributions on that DMA that would be considered by both government and Parliament. This is probably because the authors of the Act envisioned that if it were in operation, it would only be for a limited period. The Department should look into how the Act could be improved.

After the allegations levelled by some of the religious leaders during the meeting, Members should request that CRL Commission inform them if it has been representing rights of the religious sector, and if so, how.  

Mr I Groenewald (FF+) said that the Department should clarify why the DMA has handled the religious community differently from the private sector.  

There needs to be greater accountability from the Executive, particularly when it posed with questions concerning its decisions.

The Chairperson said that the Committee is currently reviewing the DMA to ensure that it is fair and does not infringe on citizens’ rights. The Department needs to continually engage with the various stakeholders on this matter.

Closing remarks by the Deputy Minister

The Deputy Minister of CoGTA, Mr Obed Bapela, said that government has consulted the religious sector prior to amending the regulations, but as there are a number of forums and associations, particularly within the Christian denomination, it has been a challenge to bring all stakeholders together. In the previous year, the President, through the Presidential Working Group, consulted religious officials. The engagement played a pivotal role in government’s decision to re-open churches. The National Coronavirus Command Council will always engage with religious leaders on their views and ideas regarding how best to manage the pandemic.  

The Department will look into the Private Member’s Bill submitted to Parliament and also review the DMA to identify any inconsistencies it has.

The Department, with the assistance of officials from the Disaster Management Centre, will respond comprehensively to all issues raised by each representative at the meeting on Thursday. They will also provide the scientific evidence government relied on to make decisions.  

He thanked the religious leaders for their input.

The Chairperson indicated that it would request that the SAHRC (South African Human Rights Commission) attend the meeting on Thursday, 24 June, 2021.

She thanked all the religious leaders for their input.

The meeting was adjourned.