Minister Progress Reports: Social Development; Small Business Development

Meeting report

Opening Remarks
The Chairperson said the purpose of the meeting was for the consideration of Progress Reports on Executive Undertakings made by the Minister of Social Development (during Policy Debate on Budget Vote 17: Social Development on 26 May 2015); and Minister of Small Business Development (during Policy Debate on Budget Vote 13: Small Business Development on 26 May 2015); and consideration and adoption of outstanding minutes and reports

Ms B Engelbrecht (Gauteng, DA) said she wanted to put an item on the agenda of the meeting because last time the Chairperson had refused her to put an item on the agenda.

The Chairperson said Ms Engelbrecht could put any item on the agenda but it could only be discussed in the next meeting of the Committee.

Consideration of Progress Reports on Executive Undertakings made by the Minister of Social Development (during Policy Debate on Budget Vote 17: Social Development on 26 May 2015)
Dr M Gondwe, Committee Content Adviser, said the Committee’s mandate is to scrutinise whether the executive undertakings have been implemented or not. On the basis of progress reports received around executive undertakings the Committee has to give recommendations to the House whether those undertakings have been implemented.

Ms Engelbrecht said a while ago she had an issue around the answers the Minister gave and wanted to check that because it is not reflected in the report.

The Chairperson said that report is still coming.

Mr S Mthimunye (Mpumalanga, ANC) moved for the adoption of the report.

Mr M Mthethwa (KwaZulu-Natal, ANC) seconded the move.

The Committee adopted the report.

Minister of Small Business Development (during Policy Debate on Budget Vote 13: Small Business Development on 26 May 2015)
Ms B Engelbrecht said she wanted to check whether there were any challenges with the report and wanted to discuss them in the Committee rather than in the House.

Mr Mthethwa moved for the adoption of the report.

Mr Mthimunye seconded the move.

The Committee adopted the report.

Minutes 18 April 2018
Ms Engelbrecht said these minutes were of the hearing which she had informed the Committee that they did not have a quorum and that is not reflected in the minutes.

Mr Mthethwa moved for the adoption of the minutes.

Ms Engelbrecht said she has a problem with the adoption of the minutes and the Chairperson was ignoring her. The attendance on the minutes is wrong because during the beginning of the hearing there were only four Members and other Members came at the end of the hearings.

Mr Mthimunye seconded the adoption of minutes.

Mr Mthimunye said minutes are not captured partly in a meeting but captured for the entire meeting.

The Chairperson said even if a Member came late in a meeting they were deemed to part of that meeting.

Ms T Mokwele (North West, EFF) said Ms Engelbrecht was saying that when the petition started the Committee was not forming a quorum and whatever the petitioner was saying it was said in an unconstitutional or informal meeting. So, there is no way that the minutes can be the true reflection of what transpired in that hearing.

The Chairperson said a hearing did not need a quorum of the Committee. A quorum is needed to adopt minutes or reports.

Mr Mthethwa said they had already adopted the minutes.

Ms Mokwele said they cannot adopt minutes whilst there is an issue on the table. She was not part of that meeting and did not know what transpired in that meeting and these minutes are not the true reflection of that meeting.

Ms Engelbrecht said the attendance of that meeting is wrongly reflected in the minutes of 18 April 2018.

Mr Mthimunye disagreed with Ms Engelbrecht.

The Chairperson said these minutes are the true reflection of that meeting.

Ms Mokwele said the Chairperson became personal when he dealt with issues.

At this stage there was a commotion between the Chairperson and Members of the opposition parties.

Ms Mokwele said these minutes are disputed and therefore cannot be adopted.

The Chairperson said the minutes are adopted and Members that feel otherwise can challenge the adoption of the minutes.

Ms Engelbrecht said she challenged the adoption of the minutes because it is not reflected that three three DA Members walked out of that meeting. That meeting was invalid and minutes should be sent back.

Ms Mokwele said the Chairperson must not act as if Parliament is his house.

The Chairperson said Ms Mokwele must also not act as if Parliament is her house.

Ms G Oliphant (Northern Cape, ANC) said they need to have a solution so that they can adopt the minutes. They should either adopt the minutes and/or note that some DA Members walked out of the meeting.

Mr Mthethwa argued that the minutes had already been adopted.

Ms Mokwele said the Chairperson must not be political when dealing with this matter and must exercise his un-biasness in decision taking of this Committee. Secondly, the Chairperson must not be emotional when dealing with facts before him. Thirdly, all Members of the Committee are equal. Ms Oliphant came with a progressive point which they should follow. If this was Mr Mthethwa’s Committee so be it, he could run it alone and they could all leave.

The Chairperson said Ms Mokwele said they should not take this personally but it was she who was taking it personally.

At this stage both Ms Mokwele and Ms Engelbrecht walked out of the meeting.

The Committee adopted the minutes without changes. 

Minutes 2 May 2018
Minutes of 2 May 2018 were adopted unamended.

The meeting adjourned.