Negotiating Mandates on Meat Safety Bill & Tourism Amendment Bill

Meeting report

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This Report is a Contact Natural Resource Information Service
Taking Parliament to People, and People to Parliament
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LAND & ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS SELECT COMMITTEE
12 September 2000
NEGOTIATING MANDATES FOR THE MEAT SAFETY BILL and TOURISM AMENDMENT BILL

Documents handed out:
Negotiating Mandates for the Meat Safety Bill (submitted from all provinces)
Negotiating Mandates for the Tourism Amendment Bill (submitted from all provinces)

Speakers:
Ms Ronel van Zyl - Senior Legal Officer to the Department of Agriculture
Mr M Matola of the South African Tourism Board (SATOUR)

SUMMARY
The committee presented negotiating mandates from the provinces and reviewed recommendations for revision to the proposed Meat Safety Bill. The representative from the Department heard the recommendations and responded to further questions from the committee. The committee then turned discussion towards recommendations from the provinces regarding the Tourism Amendment Bill.

MINUTES
Meat Safety Bill
The Senior Legal Officer to the Department of Agriculture, Ms Ronel van Zyl, began by following up on some of the concerns presented by the provinces at the previous Meat Safety Bill meeting on 29 August. In response to the concern from the committee regarding the confidentiality Clause 17, the words "the business or affairs of" has been omitted from the clause. The clause now reads "No person may disclose any information which relates to any person and which was acquired by him or her in the performance of his or her functions in terms of this Act…". The committee expressed satisfaction with this amendment. This was the only amendment put forth by the Department.

All the provinces expressed support for the principle goals set within the bill, however there were some concerns about certain details. One member reiterated that there is a need for more input from the general public, and observed that hearings are continuing to this end. KwaZulu Natal representatives encouraged the committee to seek further input from the public, although they recognized that this would postpone the passing of the bill. Dr Conroy (Gauteng) suggested that public hearings would not change the fundamental concepts of the bill. KwaZulu Natal province was also concerned about how the bill will be "phased in" in order to reduce economically damaging effects to bush-slaughter operations. There was a suggestion that Clause 7, which relates to the prohibition of slaughter of animals at places other than abattoirs, be relaxed to include less stringent stipulations regards slaughter outside of abattoirs.

The Department responded by saying that the issue of public hearings was the responsibility of the committee. Regarding slaughter outside of abattoirs, it was clarified that only Clause 7 is exempted for the situations of religious slaughtering. Further, although Clause 12 relates to slaughter for the purposes of own consumption, some clauses are not valid when related to own consumption. If a person is operating under the guise of slaughtering for own consumption but uses the meat for the purpose of profit, this person may be held accountable by the government.

To address the committee's concern about Clause 7, Ms van Zyl asserted that although the bill sets essential national standards, these standards may be relaxed for certain areas. Some economically disadvantaged areas may establish abattoirs which operate under different requirements. These different categories of abattoirs will allow the conditions within the proposed Meat Safety Bill to be phased in, and lessen potential damaging effects on established businesses which rely on bush-slaughter.

At this point Mr Mokoena (ANC) expressed support for the bill. He observed that the bill generates specified tasks to be covered by a variety of professionals such as veterinarians, special assignees, public servants, etc who must report directly to the minister. He asked if it might be more efficient for these employees to report directly to the Director General rather than to the minister. He further asked for clarification regarding the distinction between these specified task structures. Lastly, Mr Mokoena wanted clarity as to what will happen regarding the disposal of unwanted meat.

The Department responded to Mr Mokoena's concerns by noting that although the bill refers to the "Minister" as the body responsible for the functions of the special assignees, the minister is provided with the power to delegate these responsibilities to other people in his/her Department. Ms van Zyl then referred the committee to Clause 11 which includes procedures for the disposal of unwanted meat. This clause stipulates that unwanted meat must be buried or burned, and in certain cases may be made into animal food. In accordance with the desire to phase in this legislation, this clause also includes provisions which change from abattoir to abattoir and over time. The bill intentionally does not include a lot of detail regarding abattoir functioning so that flexibility may be applied to specific cases.

At this point Ms Ndzanga (ANC) wanted to know how bush-slaughtering would be handled immediately after the proposed bill is passed. She reasserted the previously mentioned concerns about Clause 7 and inquired as to how strictly this will be enforced after implementation. Mr Mokoena sought clarity as to the role of the DG. He also requested that a definition of "animal" be given, since this term may include an endless list of species.

The speaker from the Department commented that this bill draft is designed to cover general aims and broad concepts. She referred the committee to Schedule 1 at the end of the bill, which lists those animals covered by the legislation. Further, Clause 1 (2) grants the Minister power to add any type of animal to this list as and when necessary. Currently, the Kruger National Park is the only area where it is illegal to slaughter game. Although the current Abattoir Hygiene Act covers the same general issues, the proposed legislation is restricted to the handling of non-processed fresh meat.

The Northern Cape province posed an inquiry as to why it is necessary to create a system when it can be self-regulatory (as when abattoir owners are responsible for ensuring the safety of their own meat). There also was a concern regarding law enforcement and the functioning of abattoirs.

The speaker responded by saying that it is impractical for abattoir owners to judge the quality of their own product because they are biased and have a stake in the inspection process. The existing Abattoir Hygiene Act already deals with law enforcement issues and the proposed bill is intended primarily to cover loopholes, accommodate different levels of government, and expand the population of authorized inspectors in order to lower costs of insuring safe meat. There must be a balance between public interest and the cost of providing safe meat. The Department pointed out that current legislation already stipulates that no meat may be slaughtered outside of registered abattoirs. The new bill is an attempt at applying this regulation in a phased approach. The Department realizes that results will not be immediate, but emphasizes the need for education and training instead of policing. Abattoirs whose requirements are graded according to different geographical areas will allow for flexibility.

Tourism Amendment Bill
Mr M Matola of the South African Tourism Board (SATOUR) reviewed the proposed Tourism Amendment Bill for the committee and then heard the committee's comments and considerations on the details of the bill. The bill aims to amend the Tourism Act, 1993 (Act No. 72 of 1993) in order to provide for the training and registration of tourist guides; to make provision for a code of conduct and ethics for tourist guides; to regulate the procedure for lodging complaints; to make provision for the endorsement of certain registers in appropriate cases; to provide for disciplinary measures, appeals and reviews; to criminalise certain conduct; to provide for transitional matters; and to provide for matters connected therewith. The bill provides for the establishment of provincial registrars who will set up registers of qualified tourist guides and will maintain, re-register, and update registration every two years. Proof of qualifications will be provided in terms of the National Qualifications Framework. A code of conduct and ethics will be developed, in consultation with stakeholders. The Bill also provides for the lodging and processing of complaints against tourist guides, and for certain sanctions and actions to be taken in the case of misconduct, including the laying of charges with the SA Police Services.

Gauteng
Gauteng representatives expressed appreciation that the tourism industry is key to the development of not only the national economy but also to that of their own provincial economy. She further noted the desire to maintain a balance between standards/norms and efforts to expand the tourism industry. This province tabled concerns regarding the capacity of the SAPS to effectively monitor the tourism industry specifically in the area of unregistered tour guides. It was suggested that the bill include more defined terms accorded to the handling of tourist guides who operate without registration or qualification. She suggested that test requirements differ for different types of tour guides. The Gauteng province also referred to Clause 4 Section 21H, which deals with the carrying capacity of tourist vehicles. In order to avoid the occurrence of a person driving a large bus with only nine passengers and acting as a tourist guide, it was submitted that this clause be amended to read: "No tourist guide may drive a vehicle with a carrying capacity of more than nine persons and at the same time act as a tourist guide" (Gauteng province - Negotiating Mandate 2). Lastly, it was requested that the definition of "tourism" and "indefinite period" be expanded to include all types of tour guides (eg. field guides). At this point the speaker from the Department inserted that the term "tourist guide" is generic and that it is up to the Minister to determine classes and types. He also referred the committee to Paragraph 4.4 of the bill which reviews qualifications regarding tour guides.

North West Province
The North West province supports the essence and principles of the bill. It was submitted that the word "after" be replaced by "in" under 21C(1) of the Code of conduct and ethics clause. The clause would then read "The National Registrar shall in the prescribed manner, after consultation with the Provincial Registrars,.… prepare and publish a code of conduct and ethics with which all registered tourist guides shall comply". Further, it was suggested that the MEC be consulted when a code of conduct and ethic with which all registered tourist guides must comply are prepared and published (Tourism Amendment Bill 8).

Eastern Cape
Ms Gouws (DP) expressed support for the bill.

Western Cape
Ms Versfeld (DP) expressed support for the bill with the following amendments. She requested more clarity regarding transitional funding arrangements for devolving the tourist guide function from national to provinces. At this point the Department expressed a commitment to assisting the provinces with funding the new legislation, based on the needs of different provinces. The speaker also noted that the function of tourism is revenue generating. Ms Versfeld asked for a written promise in regards to funding issues and also suggested that fees for tourist guides licenses be increased. She inquired as to if fees for seasonal guides should be different that that of full-time guides. In response, the Department reiterated that the aim of this bill is to professionalize the guiding industry and to establish continuous improvements of the service.

Free State
Reverend M Chabaku (ANC) expressed support for the bill with the following amendments. Regarding consultation, it was resolved that there is no need to provide any stakeholders with copies of the Bill or to invite for their inputs. The Free State supports the Bill without any amendments.

Northern Province
Mr M L Mokoena (ANC) expressed regret to the committee that his province did not consider the Tourism Bill due to time constraints. The portfolio committee will meet September 18 to discuss amendments to this bill.

Northern Cape
Mr Van Niekerk (NNP) offered support for the bill with the following recommendation: "The Minister have the power to appoint not fewer than (9) persons (with at least one person from each province) who by virtue of their knowledge of, on present, or potential active involvement in the tourism industry fit to serve on the Board" (Negotiating Mandate for the Tourism Amendment Bill - Northern Cape).

KwaZulu Natal Province
Mr MacKenzie (IFP) briefly reviewed some of the broad recommendations made by his province. He recommended that the name of the National and Provincial Registrar be published for public information, and that Clause 2 and 3 be amended to this aim. Under Clause 4, it was recommended that a new subsection be inserted to read as follows: "Subject to compliance with the Insolvency Act,… an insolvent person may be registered as a tourist". This change is motivated by the sentiment that "an insolvent person because of his or her failure to manage finances should not be denied a livelihood, more especially if that person is a qualified tourist guide and is not the owner of a business" (Negotiating Mandate - KwaZulu Natal 3). Further, it was submitted that registration as a tourist guide should be valid for two years and re-registration should take place every two years. In addition to these recommendation, Mr MacKenzie sought clarity as to what types of disputes are envisaged by Clause 21J. It was also suggested that matters of dispute be referred to the National Minister as opposed to the DG. Mr MacKenzie also sought clarity as to the procedures of appeal and arbitration.

At this point the committee closed the meeting.

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