Parliament's consideration of treaties: Recommendations adopted, SA / Cuba relations: Department, Cuban Embassy and Focus SA briefings, Oversight report adoption

Meeting report

Chairperson’s opening remarks
The Chairperson welcomed all Members and commended them for a very productive dialogue in Pretoria on matters concerning the Middle East. This dialogue was aimed at assisting Members to gain a better understanding on the various actors in the crisis in Middle East; and how they affected the most volatile parts of the world today. For a long time, the African continent had been the centre of focus for matters relating to conflict, and great strides had been taken to resolve conflict in this continent  although there was still much work to be done. Recently, there had been a shift in focus to the conflict in Egypt, and the failure to achieve peace in the region, which made it important to understand the broader dynamics of the Middle East

The Chairperson also noted that the agenda included a discussion on the elections in Zimbabwe but the Department of International Relations and Cooperation (DIRCO or the Department) had asked that this be delayed for a week. A Southern African Development Community (SADC) summit was currently under way and the Zimbabwean election was likely to be one of the major points of discussion there.

Draft recommendations on the consideration of treaties by Parliament
The Chairperson reminded Members that there had been various discussions as to how ratification and adoption of treaties should be handled by Parliament. Members had requested a legal opinion, and this had been obtained and circulated. The essence of the legal opinion was that the Executive negotiated treaties, and Parliament approved them. The Committee’s main concern was that there was no central point of reference for treaties and they were dealt with haphazardly. There was also no way currently to track progress made on these treaties when they arrived in Parliament. 

The legal opinion said that Parliament was at liberty to set up an institutional arrangement as to how it wished to deal with treaties. A proposal was submitted to Parliament on how treaties could be better handled, and this essentially suggested that there should be a central point in Parliament for all treaties. Currently, different committees dealt with different treaties, on its own, so there was no conferring. One idea was that perhaps a Standing Committee for Treaties should be set up, but another idea was that instead of spending resources on setting up a whole new Committee, the Portfolio Committee on International Relations and Cooperation should be the point of reference for all treaties coming into Parliament, although it would then consult with other relevant portfolio committees.

Discussion
Mr B Elof (DA) said he fully agreed with the proposal and suggested that it be submitted to the Speaker.

Mr M Booi (ANC) seconded Mr Elof’s proposal.

Other Members discussed the matter and the final resolution taken was that the proposal would be forwarded to the Speaker, with the recommendation that rather than establishing a new Standing Committee, the Portfolio Committee on International Relations and Coordination would be the point of reference for all treaties entering Parliament.


Dialogue on South Africa/ Cuba relations: Success and challenges aimed at kick-starting economic progress in Cuba
Chairperson’s introduction
The Chairperson said that without the contribution and sacrifices that Cuba made to the battle of CuitoCuanavale, and the impact that it had on Namibian Independence, and the subsequent effect that Namibian Independence had on the transition to democracy in South Africa, it was possible that South Africa could have battled the demons of apartheid for several more years than it did. South Africa should never forget the sacrifices made by Cuba in helping the country in its transition to democracy.

The Chairperson noted that on 11 May 1994, Cuba and South Africa established full diplomatic relations. The democratic government undertook to foster mutually beneficial trade and economic, cultural and sporting links with Cuba. The governments of both countries shared similar interests in addressing the socio-economic needs and aspirations of their people. A number of bilateral cooperation agreements had been signed with Cuba, in areas of science and technology, arts and culture, sport and recreation, air services, merchant shipping, trade and economic assistance.

The first Cuban doctors began arriving in South Africa in 1996, to fill a skills shortage in state hospitals. They were assigned to work mainly in South Africa’s rural and previously under-serviced areas. They also shared experiences with their academic counterparts from South Africa on the training of medical doctors and delivery of quality healthcare.

In 2010, Cabinet approved a R350 million economic assistance package to Cuba, to strengthen bilateral trade and investment and assist in addressing the effects of natural disasters in Cuba. However, there were still challenges towards the ratification and implementation of that agreement. The Committee had therefore requested DIRCO to explain all impediments to the implementation of the agreements in detail.

He added that the Committee was aware of other related factors which posed challenges to the kick-starting of meaning full bilateral economic activity in Cuba. Cuba’s foreign exchange constraints, the serious infrastructure damage during the 2008 hurricane season, and the continued economic embargo placed by the United States of America were highlighted as some of the main concerns to Cuba’s economic development. It was important that both the Cuban and American viewpoints be understood. The Committee had therefore resolved to invite the US representatives in South Africa to contribute to the dialogue and put their own perspective on the embargo on Cuba, but to date no response ha been received. The issue of the Cuban Five was still on the table.

South Africa- Cuba Relations: DIRCO briefing
Ambassador Dries Venter, Chief Director: Latin America and the Caribbean, DIRCO, thanked the Committee for the opportunity to brief the Committee. He welcomed the Ambassador of Cuba to South Africa.

Amb Venter noted that the bilateral, political and multilateral relations between South Africa and Cuba were excellent and were underpinned by historical ties forged in the common struggle against apartheid, colonisation and repression. He said South African / Cuban relations were established long ago, between the then-liberation movement of the African National Congress (ANC) and the government of the Communist Party of Cuba. Prior to 1994, support given to the liberation struggle in South Africa included the education of South African students, international, military, political and material support. Cuba had therefore been a backbone of the South African liberation, despite its own challenges. After 1994, Cuba was one of the first countries to offer material and human resource support as well, and there had been many continuing high level interactions have taken place. President Jacob Zuma’s state visit to Cuba in December 2010 was a major development that served to further enhance the excellent relations between South Africa and Cuba.

Cuba was a key partner to focus on in the enhancing of foreign policy objectives in pursuit of South Africa’s identified domestic priorities; South Africa’s bilateral relations were already aligned to several key strategic priorities, with various bilateral agreements having been set up in the fields of science and technology, health, trade and industry, arts and culture and education.  South Africa was a beneficiary of Cuba’s on-going assistance in the form of scholarships for the youth. Currently, there were close to 1 400 South African students studying medicine at Cuban universities. 323 South African graduates from the Cuban programme worked as medical doctors in various South African hospitals. In 2012, the South Africa / Cuba Extended Cooperation Agreement in the fields of health and medical sciences was signed. This would lead to an increased number of South African medical students studying in Cuba, thereby contributing to the implementation of the National Health Insurance (NHI).

Amb Venter added that in the past few years, authorities of both countries had increased their efforts to enhance bilateral trade and commercial relations to a similar level as political relations between the two countries. In 2010, South Africa announced the cancellation of Cuba’s +R1 billion debt and this paved the way for enhanced trade and commercial relations. It was accepted that the Cuban market had limited logistics, and this limited trade. He concluded that in order for Cuba’s economy to be enhanced, it was of utmost importance that government and business coordinated their efforts to grow trade. The US legislation and foreign policy on Cuba was one of the main hindrances to the growth and expansion of the Cuban economy. A speedy solution to this needed to be found.

Embassy of the Republic of Cuba (Ambassador Carlos Fernandez de Cossio) briefing
Ambassador Carlos Fernandez de Cossio, Cuban Embassy, thanked the Chairperson for extending an invitation to the embassy and said there were not a lot of opportunities available for Cuba to speak about the country’s history and economy. Much of his presentation had already been touched on by the previous speakers, and he would not repeat this.

He stressed that the more that Cuba and South Africa learned about each other, the better would be the chances for these countries to strengthen their bilateral relations. The relationship was based on historical ties, including Cuba’s general solidarity with African countries, and was also based on the role that South Africa played on the international front. Huge resources, time and space had been dedicated by major media players to propaganda against Cuba, so he welcomed any opportunity to speak about Cuba publicly in other countries.

He noted that many media reports were hugely distorted. He wanted to set the record straight and outline some facts about Cuba. Its current GDP was around 7.1 billion dollars, so Cuba did not have a large economy. It had poor economic performance as a country.

In Cuba, the life expectancy, at birth, of its citizens, was 78 years. Infant mortality in this country was around 4.1 per 1 000 live births, which was better than in the United States and the United Kingdom.
Public health was free and universal. On the education side, he said that education in Cuba was free, and that Cuba had a literacy rate of 92%. It was listed as one of the top countries in the Human Development Index.

Although it had limited economic strength, Cuba’s social achievements had been very great, because of the political will to extend social justice. Economic development was now slowly on the rise. Equity in Cuba was one of the most generalised in the world, with a fair distribution of the country’s wealth. Cuba was satisfied that it had achieved social justice, but it would be a great mistake to rest on its laurels, because the wellbeing of the population needed to be improved, and in order to do this, the concrete limitations to Cuba’s economic development would need to be overcome.

The first limitation to economic development in Cuba was the lack of significant natural resources such as oil, petroleum, coal and natural gas. The natural energy resources of the country were not sustaining the country, and so Cuba was dependent on imports. There were no strategic minerals such as gold and platinum. There was limited fertile land in Cuba, therefore it was difficult to produce crops which would assist in sustaining the country well.

As mentioned, another major obstacle was the United States (US) economic blockage, which had been greatly misunderstood throughout the world. He said the battle between Cuba and the US was one that had lasted over 50 years. It was an economic warfare on a small nation by the biggest economic power in the world, which was adopted as a foreign policy with legitimate mandate from the US government. The US policies barred Cuba from trading bilaterally within the largest economy in the world. Trading limitations meant that Cuba could not buy goods that had more than 10% of US material, origin or technology. This barrier on trade meant that Cuba could not trade its nickel, sugar or any other raw materials to any company which also had the US market as a target. No ship which touched at a Cuban port could touch a US port within six months. Cuba had no access to the capital pool of the US or the financial capital of the international economies because by law they were barred from engaging with Cuba. Cuba was therefore the only developing country in the world which had no access to financial assistance for development.

Cuba also did not have any access to US technology. Ambassador de Cossio cited the example of a partnership between Cuba, Canada and Britain for the development of grass for golf estates in Cuba. However, because the grass seeds were a result of generic technology from the US, the venture could not materialise.

Cuban financial transactions were being prosecuted internationally, together with the international banking system. The aim of the US was to defeat the Cuban revolution completely.

The third limitation to Cuba’s economic development was Cuba’s significant economic inefficiencies. The economic policies were very poor, and this needed to be acknowledged and changed. The uptake of the Cuban Economic Model was a basic economic policy within the country, which had resulted from extensive consultation with the country’s population, calling for contributions, amendments and discussions on the policy. All organisations were free to make an input, and the policy had since been adopted as a legal mandate. The basic elements of this policy were to diversify the economy in Cuba, to promote entrepreneurship and to strengthen Cuba’s economic presence. Brazil, Algeria and Angola, Japan and South Korea were some of Cuba’s new trading partners. Cuba would also be focusing on making structural adjustments in order to achieve its economic development priorities, although the  essence of its social economic policy would remain intact. Another part of the economic model was to maintain Cuba’s social achievements.

The Chairperson thanked the Ambassador for the detailed presentation and said the Committee had no idea how deeply rooted the US foreign policy on Cuba was.
 
Friends of Cuba Society of South Africa (FOCUS-SA)
Mr Christopher Matlhako, Secretary General, FOCUS-SA explained that FOCUS-SA was a volunteer progressive organisation of ordinary South Africans. It recognised that South Africa’s liberation struggle was supported by many countries internationally. FOCUS-SA was founded in 1995. This organisation had, over the years, sought to engage on and enhance a broader unbiased understanding of Cuba and the Cuban Revolution. FOCUS-SA shared the perspectives of sovereignty, freedom and democracy and a non-hegemonic multilateral world order.

The key programmes of Focus-SA included:
- The “Free the Five” campaign, in line with International Law
- Ending of the blockade against Cuba
- Normalisation of relations between Cuba and USA
- Ending the continued occupation of Guantanamo Bay, which was in violation of all international law

Mr Matlhako said FOCUS-SA had been working with the Health Department of provincial governments with a number of processes, including the selection and preparation of potential students to study in Cuba. The organisation also undertook regular work brigades to Cuba in order to give ordinary South Africans a better understanding and appreciation of the Cuban reality.

Its support to Cuba was based on its acceptance that Cuba had one of the highest literacy rates in the world, offered free, universal and high quality healthcare and education. The legacy of racism was being wiped out, women’s rights were promoted and there was good community spirit. Finally, he noted that Cuba's moves to sustainable 'green' and alternative energy-sources and power grid were exemplary

Discussion
The Chairperson welcomed Ms J Fubbs (ANC), Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Trade and Industry.

Mr Elof asked for the population figure in Cuba and asked how many were unemployed. He also wanted to know what level of corruption there was.

Ambassador de Cossio replied that he did not have an accurate figure for unemployment, because, historically, all those who were not in the State’s employ had been classified as being unemployed. No informal employment was recognised by the state, although this had changed since the 2010/11 government restructuring programme. As yet, accurate statistics were not readily available. It could be estimated that less than 4% of Cuba’s population was unemployed. The population in Cuba was estimated to be around 11.2 million.

In relation to corruption, he noted that in every country in the world, there existed some form of corruption. In Cuba, however, corruption was not too much of a concern, although it was recognised that there was a need for stronger legislation.

Mr Elof noted that the Communist Party was the ruling party, he asked if there had been elections in Cuba and how the outcomes of those were judged.

Ambassador de Cossio said that national and provincial elections were held every five years, while municipal elections were held every two years. There was one party, the Communist Party.

Mr Elof thought that training facilities in South Africa were being underused and questioned why there was a need for South African doctors to be trained in Cuba.

Amb Venter responded that it was important to understand the history of South African / Cuban relations before 1994. He said Cuba offered its continuous support to South Africa even after 1994, because Cuba already had training facilities. The Minister of Health therefore still encouraged these partnerships for the time being, especially in the fields of health and engineering.

Mr Elof enquired what South Africa had done to influence the United States to change its thinking, through forums such as the African Union and BRICS, what the main reasons were why the US was still hostile towards Cuba, and how South Africa could be of assistance.

Ms J Fubbs (ANC) also noted that Cuba seemed to be seeking to develop peace with the United States; but the United States still remained provocative. She wondered what other strategies Cuba might have employed.

The Chairperson also asked that a full account be provided on what the underlying cause of the conflict between Cuba and the United States was.

Ambassador de Cossio explained that the reason for the current US policy towards Cuba could be traced back to around the 1960s, when Cuba was supporting revolutionary movements in Latin America. In the 1970s, Cuba supported the military revolution in Angola, and in the 1980s Cuba supported the Soviet Union and other revolutionary movements in central America. The United States was not impressed and had since taken a very hostile stance towards Cuba. The US did not want to be challenged in its attempts to move towards international dominance.

Amb Venter added that the United States was not eager to sit and discuss matters on Cuba in any forum, therefore talks with the African Union and BRICS would not amount to much.

Ms Fubbs referred to the bilateral agreement recently ratified in the National Assembly for trading with Cuba, and asked why it had not been fully implemented.

The Chairperson asked that DIRCO provide an update on the R1 million solidarity grants, and to give some details on what had been done with the package so far. He also wanted to know what impediments there may be to delivery. He emphasised that coordination between various departments was vital, however it did not always take place. He said there was a need for trade and economic experts to get involved, as the trade component within South Africa was shrinking. Foreign policy contact allowed South Africa to deal with its national challenges.

Amb Venter explained that in regard to the economic assistance programme, the main challenge to its full implementation was that effective banking systems had to be in place before Cuba could receive money from South Africa. Cuba’s banking system was interrupted by the US embargo. However DIRCO was in collaboration with the Department of Trade and Industry (dti) and the African Renaissance Fund; and the Industrial Development Corporation (IDC)would facilitate the process. He added that R40 million of the grant was intended for the purchase of seeds, and on this aspect, DIRCO was in partnerships with the Department of Agriculture to facilitate the process. However there were still some problems with logistics. He said the levels of dti deployments to DIRCO had decreased, as there was a stronger focus within DIRCO to improve economic diplomacy, although there was still a large percentage of work which needed to be done. Also, there was no structure within Cuba and South Africa for government and the private sectors to partner commercially.

Ms Fubbs asked what measures and policies Cuba had implemented, to accomplish its core sector aims, given that it had such a small economy.

Mr M Booi (ANC) asked why South Africa had not been able to help resolve the economic and political challenges that had hampered Cuba’s economic growth.

Mr Elof asked whether there would ever be another political party in governance in Cuba.

Ambassador de Cossio replied that the Communist Party in Cuba was not an electoral party, and the government had no plans to introduce other political parties.

Mr Elof asked how, in the restructuring process, the majority of resources and skills were redeployed, and to where. He asked which sectors were of main importance for the improvement of the economy.

Amb de Cossio said deployment in pursuance of the restructuring was in all sectors, and this was an attempt to boost commercial activity within the country. Cuba was encouraging entrepreneurship; people were given funds to establish their own businesses. He acknowledged that not everyone would be happy with the new arrangements but people were encouraged to create their own income.

Mr Elof wondered how BRICS might help in resolving the economic crisis in Cuba.

Amb de Cossio said Cuba had good relations with the BRICS countries and was an active member of the United Nations. However US policy on Cuba was isolated as the US was too powerful to feel the heat. Cuba was willing to work with BRICS in any way.

Ms Fubbs asked whether the international payment facilities in place were not in any way adding to the delay in the transfers of funds between Cuba and South Africa. She asked who paid the costs of transfers, and who covered any shortfall. She also asked if there were any other impediments other than the financial transfers.

Ambassador Venter replied that he did not have the figures on the banking costs. He said it was a challenge for banks to facilitate transfers, and this was a main challenge to the implementation of the economic agreement.

The Chairperson asked for clarity on “third markets”, and whether these markets came about because of commodities which could not be sourced within Cuba.

Amb de Cossio explained that the “third markets” were there to secure finance, so that Cuba was less dependent on credit. Cuba was aiming to make direct payments only.

The Chairperson pointed out that Cuba was one of the first countries who had established an embassy in South Africa after 1994, and so the relationship was treasured. It was not simply a political relationship as the two economies complemented each other.

Mr Matlhako said continued mobilization of civil society was vital and thanked the Committee for awarding FOCUS-SA an opportunity to introduce itself to the Committee.

The Chairperson said civil society needed to be engaged on matters concerning national and international importance. Citizens were vital to the process of policy making and Parliament, as an important sphere of policy making, held the responsibility of ensuring and promoting public participation. Cuba was one of South Africa’s most reliable allies, and the political will needed to be put into practise. The Committee still had an oversight responsibility concerning the Cuban economic process and South Africans should never forget that they too benefited from international solidarity.

Committee oversight visit to DIRCO: Consideration and adoption of the draft Committee Report
The Chairperson said the Committee had previously, on a number of occasions, dealt with this report, and had held extensive discussions on it already. It was now with the Committee for final approval.

Members adopted the Report.

Adoption of Minutes
The following minutes of Committee meetings were adopted;
8 May 2013, 22 May 2013
5 June2013, 12 June 2013, 19 June 2013.

The meeting was adjourned