Deputy Ministers and Departments of Public Service and Administration & Higher Education and Training on the Human Resource Plan and Human Resource Development Strategy of the Public Service: briefing
Meeting Summary
In the presence of the Deputy Ministers of Public Service and Administration & Higher Education and Training, the Department of Public Service and Administration defined human resource planning and indicated its importance; human resource planning timelines; preliminary human resource planning experiences in the public service; dates for the submission of the human resource plan and for reporting; compliance, capacity and capability challenges; mechanisms to improve compliance; the human resource plan aggregated model; the human resource planning maturity model; levels of compliance; the First Aggregated Report on Human Resource Plans in the Public Service; the link between human resource planning and human resource development; the Human Resource Development Strategy in the Public Service; and the way forward. The Department referred to its consultations with the Department of Higher Education and Training.
Planning for human resources provided a strategic basis for making human resource decisions on budget requests and staffing requests, and allowed managers to anticipate change rather than merely reacting to it, while specifying the particular tasks and actions necessary for accomplishing missions and objectives.
An Executing Authority must submit a Medium Term Expenditure Framework-aligned approved human resources plan of his or her department to the Minister of Public Service and Administration on or before 30 June of every year. If amended, an adjusted plan must be submitted on or before 30 June of the relevant year. An Executing Authority must submit a six month report on implementation to the Minister on or before 30 September of every year, and thereafter annually report on or before 31 March of every year.
Compliance, capacity and capability challenges included disregard of submission timeframes; reorganisation and restructuring; questionable validity and reliability of submitted planning data; organisational structures in continual flux; the high mobility of personnel responsible for human resource planning; and the unintended consequences of a single focus on other skills development areas.
The First Aggregated Report on Human Resource Plans in the Public Service recommended that it was imperative that Executive Authorities and heads of department ensured the requisite human resource planning capacity and compliance. Planning should be allocated at the senior management level and reflected in the performance agreements.
The Department of Higher Education and Training outlined its close cooperation with the Department of Public Service and Administration. While also being supported and guided by that Department, the Minister had been requested on behalf of the whole of Government to administer and to manage the human resource development strategy for
The National Human Resource Development Strategy under the auspices of the Department of Higher Education and Training addressed the supply of human capital to meet the broader societal and economic needs of
The roles of the South African Qualifications Authority, the Quality Council on Trades and Occupations, and the Sector Education and Training Authorities were indicated. The Governmental Sector Education and Training Authority Forum coordinated work in the public sector.
Members asked when the Department envisaged full compliance with reporting norms and if reports back were implemented, if the Department knew its needs in the short, medium, and long term, if the preference of younger civil servants to work for national departments rather than their provincial counterparts was a demographic issue, what the Department was doing to increase compliance, about the serious complications of the public service strike, about salaries being paid to ghost employees, what turnaround strategies there were, asked what was happening to the Public Service Sector Education and Training Authority while it was still under administration, and stressed the need for collaboration with the Public and Leadership Management Academy. Members also asked about gender representation, about the apparent disjuncture between national policies and provincial policies, and if stress was a problem in the provincial public service alone or at the national level also. A Member hoped that there would be a big effort to reach the target of employing people with disabilities in the public service. Members also said that there surely should be a dynamic interaction between the Department of Public Service and Administration and the Department of Higher Education and Training, wanted to name and shame those departments which had not complied with human resource planning, and said that accurate statistics would assist the Department of Public Service and Administration.
Meeting report
Introduction
Apologies were received from the Hon. Richard Baloyi, Minister of Public Service and Administration and the Hon. Dr Bonginkosi “Blade” Nzimande, Minister of Higher Education and Training, who were attending a Cabinet meeting.
Apologies were also received from Ms M Mohale (ANC) who was attending a meeting of another committee.
The Chairperson welcomed the Hon. Ms Ayanda Dlodo, Deputy Minister of Public Service and Administration, the Hon. Ms Buhle Mkhize, Deputy Minister of Higher Education and Training, Mr L Tsenoli (ANC), Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Cooperative Governance and Traditional Affairs, and delegates from the Departments of Public Service and Administration & Higher Education and Training.
The Chairperson noted the need for collaboration and to avoid working in silos.
Department of Public Service and Administration Presentation
Mr Kenny Govender, Acting Director-General, Department of Public Service and Administration (DPSA), outlined his presentation, which encompassed the definition of human resource (HR) planning; the importance of HR planning; HR planning timelines; preliminary HR planning experiences in the public service; dates for the submission of the human resource plan (HRP) and for reporting; compliance, capacity and capability challenges; mechanisms to improve compliance; the HRP aggregated model; the HR planning maturity model; levels of compliance; the First Aggregated Report on HR Plans in the Public Service; the link between HRP and human resource development (HRD); the Human Resource Development Strategy in the Public Service; and the way forward as the Department envisaged it.
Human Resource Planning
Mr Geeva Pillay, Chief Director: HRPPP, DPSA, said that HR planning was an inclusive and dynamic process that involved the identification of both current and future human resource needs as well as potential challenges in order for the department to consistently achieve its objectives. It was the two-way operational link between high level strategy and action orientated implementation that could be regularly monitored and evaluated. Therefore HR planning aimed to ensure that a department had the right information, at the right time, for the right user or audience, for the right decisions so that an organisation could have the right people, with the right skills, at the right place at the right time, all the time.
Planning for human resources provided a strategic basis for making human resource decisions on budget requests, staffing requests, and strategic plans. It allowed managers to anticipate change rather than merely reacting to short-term needs, and laid out the specific tasks and actions needed to ensure that departments accomplished their missions and objectives.
In 2002 HRP guidelines were developed to be utilised by all departments. In 2006 research was conducted to improve the quality of HR Planning at departmental level. In 2007 there was a review of 2002 HRP guidelines and tool-kit; the DPSA was tasked to review the existing HRP guidelines and the need to develop new guidelines and a tool kit emerged. In 2007-2008 the HR Planning Unit Standards were developed and registered. In 2008 quarterly reports to the Office of the Public Service Commission (OPSC) and compliance auditing by the Auditor-General (AG) commenced. In 2008-2009: the HR Planning Strategic Framework, HR Planning Guidelines and Tool-kit, and HRP Reporting templates were approved and published. In April 2009 a process to institutionalise HR planning in the public service was established. In December 2009 an Aggregated Report on Public Service (PS) HR Plans was published.
In December 2010 the HR Planning Module in IFMS would be completed. From 2012 onwards the public service would be moved to forecasting, modelling and prediction.
As to preliminary HR planning experiences in the public service, there had been a lack of common methodology and framework for HR planning; an absence of proper norms and standards across the public service; heavy reliance on service providers to conduct HR planning, and their work was often irrelevant or theoretical; insufficient knowledge, skills and competencies in HR planning; Inadequate attention to capacitating and developing employees in HR planning; non-allocation of the HR planning function responsibility in the department; confusion of the roles and responsibility for HR planning in the department; the non-existence of structures and reporting lines for HR planning; lack of compliance on HR planning; and a lack of monitoring and evaluation of departmental HR plans.
Dates for HRP submission and reporting were outlined. An Executing Authority must submit a Medium Term Expenditure Framework (MTEF) aligned approved HR plan of his or her department to the Minister of Public Service and Administration (MPSA) on or before 30 June of every year. In addition if the plan was amended an Adjusted HR Plan must be submitted on or before 30 June of the relevant year. An Executing Authority must submit a six month report on the implementation of the HR plan to the MPSA on or before 30 September of every year, and thereafter annually report on or before 31 March of every year.
Mr Pillay indicated compliance, capacity and capability challenges, which were sporadic submissions of HR Plans that ignored submission timeframes; departments requesting extensions due to poor planning or prioritisation; non Submission, among others, due to internal departmental processes or delays, poor co-ordination by Offices of the Premier (OTPs) and reorganisation and restructuring challenges; questionable validity and reliability of submitted HR planning data; organisational structures in continual flux or undergoing reorganising or restructuring; non-allocation of the HR planning function and responsibility in some departments; low HR planning skills base in PS; the high mobility of HR planners, or personnel responsible for HR planning which impacted on continuity and HRP knowledge management; and the unintended consequences of a single focus on other skills development areas that was not always informed by HR Planning.
Mr Pillay outlined mechanisms to improve compliance, which included the Governance & Administration cluster (G&A/POA) Reports on the level of compliance of departments having HR Plans; the Public Service Commission's quarterly reports; the Auditor-General’s Office's HR Compliance Audit focused on HR Plan compliance; amendments to regulations in terms of HRP - 1) the Public Service Regulations and 2) the Treasury Regulations – MTEF; and ongoing work with the Public Administration Leadership and Management Academy (PALAMA) to build capacity in HR Planning, in regard to which an experiential training programme had been developed and handed over to PALAMA. There were regular meetings of the Inter-departmental HR Planning Committee. There was monitoring and evaluation of progress, together with monthly status reports, the provision of continuous feedback and support, and the development of an Aggregated Report on HR Plans in the Public Service 2009. (Slides 9-10).
Mr Pillay illustrated the Aggregated HRP Model (chart – slide 11); the HR planning maturity model (chart – slide 12); the levels of HR planning sophistication (slide 13); the levels of HRP compliance from 2008-2009 to 2010-2011 by provincial departments (table - slide 14); the submissions of the approved HR plans by national and provincial departments 2008-2011 (chart – slide 15); the level of compliance in the current year 2010-2011 by provincial departments (table – slide 16); and departments included in the aggregated report 2008-2009 by national and provincial departments (table - slide 17-18).
First Aggregated Report on HR Plans in the Public Service
Key findings 2008-2009 of the First Aggregated Report on HR Plans in the Public Service (slides 19- 37) were given under the following headings – introduction, objectives, context, provincial environmental assessment, national environmental trends, HR challenges, organisational structure, line department organisational structure, age profile, staffing patterns, employment equity profile, employment equity targets, health and wellness, and HR priorities.
The Report recommended that as HR planning was a regulatory requirement which resided with the EA, it was imperative that EAs and Heads of Departments (Hoods) ensured the requisite HR planning capacity and compliance. Planning should be allocated at the senior management level and reflected in the performance agreements. Departments should institute regular reporting to the Executive and head of department (HOD), on the progress in terms of development and implementation of the HR plan as this responsibility resided with the EA unless delegated. Departments should ensure participation of employees responsible for the HR Planning in the available HR planning training programmes. Departments must report on the implementation of HR plans.
Departments should budget for implementation of HR plans as part of their human resource management and development (HRM&D) requirements.
Mr Pillay indicated challenges in data analysis, the link between HR planning and HR development,
HR planning and the development value chain.
Human Resource Development Strategy in the Public Service
Mr Pillay described the Human Resource Development Strategy in the Public Service (slides 38- 48) with reference to the South African HRD Context. The National Human Resource Development Strategy under the auspices of the DoHET addressed the supply of human capital to meet broader societal and economic needs of
The Human Resource Development Strategic Framework in the Public Service under the DPSA was a sub-system which addressed the focused demand for human resource development in the public service for employees of the Public Service.
The South African Qualifications Authority (SAQA) was responsible for the registration and quality standards of qualifications through the National Qualifications Framework Act (NQF).
The Quality Council on Trades and Occupations (QCTO) regulated the registration of occupations and quality thereof in the different occupations.
The Sector Education and Training Authorities (SETAs) facilitated the provision of skills in the different sectors while the G-SETA Forum coordinated work in the Public Sector (slide 39).
The review of the HRD Strategic Framework for the Public Service sought to promote and support the National Skills Development agenda, a process driven by the HRD Council; align all HRD strategies with sectoral and provincial economic and development growth needs; be aligned to the objectives of the NSDS ; ensure a continuous supply of specialist skills and absorption thereof into the public sector labour market; address the national skills challenges at all public sector delivery points within a developmental state; ensure that there was a steady flow of contributing and productive public servants at all spheres of Government; and enable human capital performance in public sector organizations that ensured effective service delivery in all spheres of Government and contributed to economic growth.
The core elements of the Public Service HRD Strategic Framework comprised pillar 1- capacity building initiatives; pillar 2 - organisational support initiatives; pillar 3 - governance and institutional development initiatives; and pillar 4 - government’s economic growth & development Initiatives.
Each pillar envisaged implementation tasks at the macro (national), meso (provincial) and micro (departmental) levels. The four pillars were translated into four strategic objectives supporting 12 outcomes.
Each strategic objective had sub-objectives aligned to outputs and sub-outputs. Each sub-objective had key performance indicators for monitoring and evaluation (M&E) purposes.
Progress to date comprised the conducting of workshops on the HRD Strategic Framework at all national and provincial departments. PALAMA had developed a unit standard based capacity building training programme for HRD practitioners. A monitoring tool had been developed and was used to track progress and support compliance. Departments had undertaken organizational readiness assessments and produced a report.
All departments were required to submit annual HRD implementation plans and progress reports to DPSA. Policy frameworks to support the implementation of the HRD Strategic Framework had been developed and some were being finalised or aligned to the outcomes approach by Government. The role of SETAs had been strengthened through the establishment of the Government SETA Forum (G-SETA Forum).
Progress to date was the achievement of alignment vertically and horizontally through the establishment of steering committees and forums nationally and provincially. The Sectors and Offices of the Premier were playing a more coordinating role.
140 departments had submitted their organisational readiness assessment reports to establish baseline information. In 2009/10, 68% of departments had submitted their annual HRD implementation plans and reports. For 2010/11, 61% of departments had complied with the submission and reporting requirements. The slump could be attributed to the FIFA World Cup and the recent public sector strike.
An annual consultative conference had been held.
Challenges to implementation were the need for closer alignment to the HRD-SA and NSDS; the need for strengthening collaboration with higher education institutions (HEIs), sector education and training authorities (SETAs) and further education and training colleges (FETC) to optimise the resources available; and a more defined role for PALAMA as a national training academy. There was a general lack of capacity in departments' human resource divisions; senior management lacked support at departmental level; poor compliance levels by departments; and departments had inadequate funds to drive Government priorities. If there were cuts to be made, human resource departments were the first to be sacrificed.
Mr Pillay said that the DPSA needed to continue providing assistance to departments because of their lack of capacity and capability in terms of assistance in the design, development, and implementation of their HR plans through explanation of HR planning; HR planning SF, guide and templates; a repository of HR planning best practices information and resources; providing analytical tools; helping with data reports; and guidance with developing plans.
Mr Pillay noted that the DPSA had approached Statistics South Africa (Stats SA) to provide generic statistical training for human resource practitioners. The Statistician-General was supportive of this move, but consultation was still in progress.
Furthermore, it was necessary to evaluate HR plans not only in terms of content but in terms of alignment and provide feedback. The DPSA was now currently in its second cycle of feedback reporting. It was also necessary to provide more advice and support to ensure forecasting, modelling and scenario planning took place in the public service.
Mr Pillay said that departments generally had not yet attained a satisfactory level of analysis of data. They could collect it but not analyse it. So DPSA had to do training on analysis.
The DPSA had to ensure alignment between HR planning and HRD strategy, and develop the public service strategic HR plan.
The DPSA hoped that in the next series of reports it would be able to produce a predictive plan of what the public service needed for the future.
The Chairperson thanked Mr Govender and Mr Pillay for such a detailed presentation, and asked the Deputy Minister for Higher Education and Training to contribute.
Department of Higher Education and Training (DoHET) on its collaboration with DPSA. Oral briefing
The Deputy Minister said that she was present mainly to listen and to talk briefly to a few areas of cooperation.
Mr Firoz Patel, Deputy Director-General: Systems Planning, Department of Higher Education and Training, said that his Department had been working closely with the DPSA. The DoHET had four areas of cooperation. DoHET was just one of the hundreds of departments which had to conform and comply with DPSA guidelines and directions, while also being supported and guided by the DPSA. On the other hand, the Ministry of Higher Education and Training was responsible for skills development in
Mr Patel said that it cooperated closely with the DPSA to ensure that the public sector as one of the contributory economic sectors had the capability to meet the priorities of the South African developmental state. The seventh of eight priorities of the Human Resource Development Council was to ensure that the public sector itself was responsive. So there would be monitoring and evaluation by the Council itself to ensure that all participants in the human resource development strategy – business, labour, community or Government - moved forward on the new economic trajectory.
Also in regards to cooperation with the DPSA, the DoHET sought to ensure that the Public Sector Education and Training Authority (PSETA) was able to be efficient and effective in terms of its role in the Skills Development Act and the National Skills Development Strategy, as well as in the National Skills Fund.
The Minister of Higher Education and Training, the Minister of Public Service and Administration, and the respective departments were working to refocus and turnaround the PSETA and in regards to governmental education and training generally.
As regards the use of public institutions such as FET colleges and universities, and partnerships to be developed between Government and these institutions, it was aimed to make these more responsive. The Minister was continually challenging employers to ensure that more partnerships were built to ensure that public institutions became more responsive.
So for example the initiative of DPSA in the revolving door programme where senior managers were able to obtain work experience and vice versa to keep refreshing the public service was something that the DoHET fully supported.
The public service also had to pay attention to foundation learning for low-skilled workers within the public sector. Also worker education itself was important in regards to the rights of workers and their responsibilities.
The approach in this particular area of cooperation was that the Human Resource Development Council itself would assist in removing bottlenecks in the skills pipeline.
The public service had to lead by example in providing learnerships.
Organised labour had been given the responsibility to report on the steps taken to provide education for workers and to provide work placements for young people in unions and non-governmental organisations (NGOs).
The Human Resource Development Council would monitor and evaluate the targeted areas that needed to be developed. The DPSA was working very closely with the Council itself. The Skills Levy should be used more effectively, and the DPSA should take the lead.
Discussion
The Chairperson referred to the Committee's most recent meeting (03 November 2010) at which it discussed anti-corruption initiatives with the Minister for Public Service and Administration, the Public Service Commission and the Auditor-General. This meant a huge challenge for the Committee in its oversight role. She thanked the DPSA for a comprehensive presentation.
Mr Govender said that he had tried to be comprehensive. In future he would try to compress the Department's presentations to 30 minutes, supplemented with notes, to give more time to questions.
Mr Pillay added that the DPSA had left much out of the presentation; it had not told Members about the policy framework and the road map because the DPSA believed that Members really wanted the plan.
The Chairperson said that Mr Govender had not done wrong to give such a long and comprehensive presentation. She did not see any alternative but to present comprehensively.
Mr A Williams (ANC) asked when the DPSA envisaged full compliance in submitting and implementing quality HR reports.
Mr Govender replied that he did not think it possible to say when DPSA would achieve 100% compliance, but it was moving in that direction. It would now become part of the Auditor-General's report and as soon as he started giving qualified audit opinions on the grounds of non-compliance, then an immediate improvement would be expected.
Mr Williams asked if the recommendations of the DPSA in its 2009 report had been implemented by the departments, and how the DPSA monitored implementation.
Mr Williams asked if the DPSA knew the South African public service's needs in the short, medium, and long term, and if those needs were in line with the reality on the ground.
Mr L Ramatlakane (COPE) asked if it was stated as a fact that the state had never had been an analysis to inform the integration and direction of the public service together. He thought that there had been some sort of plan to hold together the public service and to indicate its direction.
Mr Govender replied that at this point there was not a public service-wide human resources plan. The intention in DPSA's current work was to build that knowledge to enable the DPSA to predict those requirements for the future and to put strategies to reach that point. The DPSA could not do that without the full support of all of the departments. Prior to 2002 there was no consolidated plan. Each department had drawn up its own plan. The DPSA was now working towards consolidation of that work. He said that it was currently important to help departments to understand that they needed to plan.
Ms A Dreyer (DA) thanked the presenters for a comprehensive and valuable presentation. She asked (slide 28) if the preference of younger civil servants to work for national departments rather than their provincial counterparts was a demographic issue and if it really was a problem.
Mr Govender responded that the DPSA understood that unless one knew the age of one's workforce at the present time one would have a problem 15 years later. The majority of the employees in the provinces were educators. The ageing profile of educators was an area of concern. This was part of the planning.
Mr Govender said that unless age was addressed problems would remain. He noted that educators retired promptly at 60 and there was an ageing profile in the teaching profession. Departments needed to take that into account. The DPSA worked closely with the Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation (DPME). He noted that there would not be labour disputes if managers were doing their jobs of managing.
Ms Dreyer asked about the low level of compliance in the beginning. The strategy was meaningless if the departments did not implement. She asked what the Department was doing to increase compliance.
Mr Govender replied that an area of focus in Government was to improve the performance of corporate services. There were problems in the delay in filling of posts and problems in resolving labour disputes. The DPSA believed that management was not up to speed. He referred to the management assessment tools (MAT) of the Presidency’s Department of Performance Monitoring and Evaluation (DPME).
Ms F Mbikane (ANC) said that the presentation was a great deal to absorb. She observed a vacuum between what had been implemented and applied and what was needed to improve on where we had come from, and noted a gap between what had been planned and what had been done.
Ms Mbikane said that there was a need to go back to the actual problems of the employees. There were issues of systems not being in place. One of the types of problems was the salary levels in which there were inconsistencies.
Ms Mbikane asked about the serious complications of the public service strike.
Ms Mbikane asked about the problem of salaries being paid to ghost employees.
Ms Mbikane asked what turnaround strategies there were for human resource management. There were many disputes in which the department lost, and in which great expense was incurred.
Ms Mbikane asked DoHET about internships.
Ms Mbikane said about the relationship between the DPSA and the Public Service SETA (PSETA) which was still under administration; she asked what was happening to that vacuum. There was need for collaboration with PALAMA, and called for increased collaboration amongst stakeholders to reach targets. Not much more could be done without it.
Mr Govender said that the PSETA was still in operation but it was disappointing that it had been recertified for only one year and it had to prove itself before it could be recertified.
Mr L Tsenoli (ANC) asked about gender representation. Had an analysis been done?
Mr Govender replied that the DPSA did gender analysis as well as analysis of women in management, the number of persons with disabilities, and so on. Those reports were available.
Mr Tsenoli asked for the additional reasons for the incoherence or disjuncture between national policies and provincial work.
Mr Tsenoli noted that the governmental system was unitary as regards policies.
Mr Tsenoli asked what interventions there were at the level of induction of staff and as an ongoing process to deal with stress in the public service. It was a serious matter.
Mr Tsenoli asked if stress was a problem in the provincial public service alone or in the national level also.
Ms H van Schalkwyk (DA) asked about PALAMA's situation. She was aware that it was known as a facilitator rather than a service provider itself.
Mr Govender commented that PALAMA had been mandated as the ‘training arm’ of Government to professionalise, build capacity and support career advancement in the public service. He observed that members of PALAMA were present.
Ms Van Schalkwyk hoped that there would be a big effort to reach the target of employing people with disabilities to the extent of 2% of the staff complement of the public service.
Mr L Suka (ANC) said that there surely should be a dynamic interaction between the DPSA, the DoHET and the Department of Basic Education to improve the school curriculum and improve it quickly to avoid so much retraining and to avoid so many drop out students. There were more than four financial systems including a manual system, while we were living in a digital divide. There was a need to be stricter and faster in timeframes so that we would not have to repeat what we said today.
Mr Suka said that if departments could not implement those plans, it was no wonder that there were so many roll-overs. It was the role of the DPSA to assist with those plans, guided by the Treasury Regulations (slide 4). It was not enough to “thumb suck”.
Mr Suka wanted to name and shame those departments which had not complied with the required time frame for the submission of their HRP plans (slides 14-16). The Public Finance Management Act (PFMA) was very strict as to who must hold them accountable. If the HOD or the director-general was not compliant there was surely a problem and it was necessary to ask why.
Ms Mbikane asked if there were any sanctions against the non-compliant departments.
Mr Govender said that the Minister had taken a different route and preferred to send letters to the directors-general of non-compliant departments; Mr Govender received calls on a daily basis from directors-general; the message is getting through that they needed to comply.
Ms Rhulani Makhubela, Acting Deputy Director-General: Human Resources Management Development (HRMD), DPSA, said that the Department did give feedback to the departments. It engaged through the forums so that the departments could improve.
Mr Suka said that accurate statistics would assist the DPSA. Such statistics could be obtained from the Statistics South Africa (Stats SA), the census, and the Department of Home Affairs.
Mr Govender replied that the quality of information was still a challenge. One of the areas in which the DPSA was working was that the more one started using that information on PERSAL the more departments realised that if they did not provide quality information, the more it would reflect badly upon them because of incorrect information on the system. DPSA hoped to brief the Committee together with the State Information Technology Agency and National Treasury on that system.
Mr Suka asked DPSA to please explain its pyramid (slide 13). What was the DPSA hoping to achieve?
Mr Suka asked about implementation (slide 14). He wanted quantification. He noted a gloomy picture.
Mr Suka said that the DPSA had omitted the
Mr Suka asked for clarity on the DPSA’s findings (slides 19, 23-33).
The Chairperson said it was worrying if human resources planning was low on the priorities of a department.
The Committee would need to engage more.
The Chairperson noted that the public service was moving from PERSAL to the Integrated Financial Management Systems (IFMS). Members thought that there was not enough information about vacancies in the public service.
Mr Govender said that DPSA was currently rolling out IFMS. It was currently in a pilot phase, but the necessary skills were needed before it was instituted fully. This was long term planning in skills. He gave the example of the kind of planning carried out by Toyota South
The Chairperson noted that PALAMA did 70% of its work through outsourcing and thought that this should be turned around.
The Chairperson wanted more clarity on vacancies. If there was a change in the demands of the department concerned, this might be reflected in the figures for vacancies.
The Deputy Minister of Public Service and Administration said the issue of skills affected the country and economy at large. She requested the Committee to examine it from that aspect as well. She noted that the private sector would poach scarce skills from the public sector but not replenish them. She gave the examples of nurses and doctors poached by the mining industry, which did not offer scholarships. Moreover, the private sector did not offer scholarships.
The Deputy Minister of Public Service and Administration said that it was necessary to see if these programmes were responsive and a futuristic approach. The DPSA did not own the colleges but the approach should be holistic. The role of the National Economic Development and Labour Council (NEDLAC) was important in this regard. It was necessary to work together to find a strategy.
The Deputy Minister of Public Service and Administration said that in townships one found unemployed pharmacists and doctors, and also metallurgists and geologists – all scarce skills. The Government should employ those people or the private sector should open its doors and receive them.
Mr Williams was dissatisfied with the DPSA's answers. It did not know what human resources were needed in the short, medium and long term. He asked if the DPSA would return and say that it did not know. Planning was important.
The Deputy Minister of Higher Education and Training said that in building a developmental state there was need for collaboration. Mr Patel could make a specific presentation.
The Chairperson said that the DPSA had provided sufficient information for the Committee to continue its work.
The meeting was adjourned.
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