Pakistan & India: briefing by Indian Delegation

FOREIGN AFFAIRS PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE
29 January 2002
PAKISTAN AND INDIA: BRIEFING BY INDIAN DELEGATIONÂ Â
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Acting Chairperson: Mr Sithole (ANC)Â
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Relevant Document:
Briefing Document provided by Indian Delegation (see Appendix)
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SUMMARY
A delegation of Indian parliamentarians, legislators, and other officials, including the High Commissioner to South Africa, briefed the Committee on the Indian position concerning tensions with Pakistan. The presentation focused on the ongoing conflict in Kashmir and the long history of terrorist acts perpetrated in and against India by groups affiliated with Pakistan, including the December attack on the Indian Parliament and this week's attack on an American facility in Calcutta. In this regard, the briefing document provided by the delegation asserts, inter alia, that Pakistan has "created a large and elaborate infrastructure" sponsoring terrorism, which "created the Taliban" movement. While welcoming recent declarations by President Musharraf indicating a policy change in no longer allowing Pakistani territory to be used for terrorist activity, the delegation stated that "rhetoric must be matched by action", and that while democratic India had been patient with the Pakistani dictatorship's support for terrorism, this patience was not unlimited. Along these lines, it was explained that the purpose of the delegation's visit was to enlist South Africa's assistance in persuading Pakistan to stop its terrorist activities and support for terrorist groups, thus clearing the way so that issues concerning the subcontinent could begin to be addressed, and resolved, with a result being that Pakistan becomes "peaceful, strong, prosperous, and democratic."
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After the presentation the media and public were asked to leave so that discussions with, and questioning of, the delegation by the Committee could be conducted in private.
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MINUTES
The Acting Chairperson, Mr Sithole (ANC), welcomed and introduced the guests (who included current parliamentarians and legislators Messrs. Shariq (GJ&K National Conference Party), Sibal (Indian National Congress Party), Prasad (Rashtriya Janata Dal Party), and Singh (Bharatiya Janata Party), Khan (former Indian ambassador to the UN), and Mr Mukherjee (High Commissioner to South Africa). He noted that members of other SA Parliamentary committees were present and welcome. The Chair added that since 1994 there had been good relations at the highest levels of government between South Africa and India, and that this meeting was part of the ongoing process.
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Individual members of the delegation elaborated on the positions articulated in the briefing document distributed. Mr Shariq, introducing himself as a Kashmiri from Srinigar, emphasized India's non-violent tradition, but noted that it was imperative that terrorism caused by Pakistan, which had ruined the "paradise" his home region had been, must be fought. He stated that Pakistani aggression had continued despite repeated Indian efforts "to extend the hand of friendship", which had been consistently rejected. Noting that India desired a "prosperous, strong, and democratic Pakistan", he cited the attack last December 13 on the Indian Parliament as a prime example of Pakistani disrespect for democracy, notwithstanding its post-11 September posturing as an opponent of terror (at least insofar as it affects the U.S., since Pakistan contradictorily continues to justify actions in Kashmir exported from its territory as "jihad"). He concluded by stating that South Africa, as a democracy and world leader, has a big role to play in helping India fight the terrorism it has been subjected to.
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Mr Sibal explained that the delegation was a multi-party cross-section of the Indian political spectrum, sent out with other delegations to present the Indian view. He stated that "for us 11 September was not a watershed, as we've suffered from Pakistani sponsored terrorism for more than two decades, which has occurred not just in Kashmir but throughout India," citing incidents in Punjab, a series of airline hijackings, and bombings in Mumbai, and noting that the 1993 World Trade Centre bomber, Ramzi Yusef, was found in Pakistan. He declared that there is ample hard evidence to demonstrate that the world "centre of terrorism was, and continues to be, Pakistan,". He continued that Indians are and have been the main victims, with the December Parliament attack, which sought to eliminate the entire Indian political leadership, being only the latest example. Regarding this incident, he stated that some of the participants were demonstrably involved in a 1999 hijacking supported by the Pakistani ISI military intelligence agency, and in various groups recently identified by the U.S. as "terrorist organizations."
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He went on to observe that because Pakistan is now dependent on UN and US financial aid, it had made a pragmatic decision to join the U.S. led post-11 September anti-terror campaign. Musharraf's 12 January declaration that Pakistan would no longer sponsor or countenance terror was a clear acknowledgement of its past involvement in such activities. In his view, however, the 12 January declaration was regrettably qualified concerning Kashmir, and as such the recent statements could not be taken at face value - particularly given Pakistan's penchant for responding to past Indian overtures by "stabbing us in the back." Continuing, he noted that "we've done what we could, but the time has come when our patience is exhausted," and indicated that unless there is "evidence on the ground" of a change in Pakistani policy, and real movement toward resolution of the Kashmir issue, India cannot proceed to deal with Pakistan. Moreover, while echoing his colleague's declaration that India wants a "strong, prosperous, and democratic" Pakistan, he stated that Musharraf is not a true democrat. In conclusion he also echoed assertions that the Indian government and people have always been for peace, and the request for South Africa's help in persuading Pakistan to stop its terrorist activities so that issues affecting the subcontinent could begin to be addressed, and resolved.
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Mr Singh hailed South Africa and former President Mandela, whom he likened to Mahatma Gandhi, and stated that as a peace-loving country India wants to enlist South Africa's voice in holding Musharraf to his 12 January rejection of terror.
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Mr Prasad briefly recounted his participation in the struggle against apartheid, and commented that Pakistan continues to be a dictatorship, never having enjoyed real democracy, unlike India, which has been a democracy since its inception in 1947. He stated that the Indian fight against Pakistani terrorism would continue, if necessary, and expressed the hope that South Africa will continue its historical and spiritual affinity with India in these efforts, adding that establishing democracy in Pakistan would benefit its people, as well as the rest of the world.
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Mr Mukherjee continued by noting that the Indian people are angry in the wake of the attack on their Parliament, and impatient with their own government to "once and for all" destroy the threat of Pakistani terrorism. While the Indian government is more patient than its people, and committed to dialogue to resolve issues, its patience is limited. The formation of this delegation, and its first visit being to South Africa, is not an accident, since it is a world leader and could be a prime participant in international efforts to "bring the Pakistanis to their senses", with actions matching the "clever rhetoric" of Musharraf's 12 January speech. He lamented that thus far actions have not matched words, as illustrated by this week's attack by a Pakistani group on a US facility in Calcutta. He concluded by noting that the situation between India and Pakistan could and should be better, but that the Pakistani "identity problem", and resentment that India is its "big neighbour", are big problems. He stated that South Africa's help in facilitating friendly relations would be valuable.
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The Chair thanked the delegation for their comments, and requested that the media and public depart the room so that further private discussions and questioning could occur.  Â

Appendix 1

Briefing Document

Pakistan has been using terrorism as an instrument of State policy, and to wage a low-intensity conflict against India for over two decades. Its strategy has been premised on the belief that as long as it kept the level of terrorist violence below a certain threshold, it could pursue this policy without any cost to itself. It also believed that as long as the effects of Pakistan Sponsored terrorism did not spread to other Countries, the international community would be willing to tolerate such a policy indefinitely. In the I980s, Pakistan pursued this strategy of sponsoring terrorism in the Indian State of Punjab, and when terrorism was eradicated there, turned its attention to the Indian State of Jammu & Kashmir. In recent years it has also been sponsoring terrorist acts in other parts of India.

To support this policy, Pakistan created a large and elaborate infrastructure in Pakistan and Pakistan controlled territories. This included so called 'religious schools' that were misused to propagate violent and obscurantist ideologies amongst Pakistani youth, and youth from other countries; the use of these schools to recruit and indoctrinate terrorists; and, several militant training camps run by the Pakistan army and intelligence services, to impart training in the use of arms and explosives. The existence of these 'factories of terrorism' has been extensively documented and commented upon by the international press, and does not really require any further elaboration.

It was this elaborate infrastructure that created the Taliban movement, which in turn caused so much havoc, suffering and human rights violations in Afghanistan and provided a safe haven to Osama Bin Laden and the Al Qaida group.

The horrifying magnitude of the September 11 terrorist attacks in the United States brought home to the international community the stark truth that terrorism supported or tolerated anywhere in the world will threaten people everywhere in the world. Today, the widespread consensus in the international community is that there can not be any justification for terrorism, which must be eradicated wherever it exists. The series of UNSC resolutions on terrorism including resolution 1373, and the unprecedented levels of international cooperation to root out terrorism wherever it exists, testifies to the international community's strong determination to stamp out terrorism. UN Security Council Resolution 1373, which has been passed under the mandatory provisions of Chapter 7 of the UN Charter, is unambiguous about the fact that all States must refrain from providing any form of support, active or passive, to groups and individuals indulging in terrorism. States must deny safe haven, and also cooperate with other states, in taking action against those who finance, plan, support or commit terrorist acts. Pakistan must take action against terrorism being perpetrated from its territory and territories under its control. These actions must be taken in a sustained and irreversible manner.

The terrorist attack on the Indian Parliament on 13 December (2001), by two Pakistan-based terrorist groups, sought to wipe out, at one go, the entire Indian political leadership. It was an attack against the very heart of India's democracy. The attack took place even while Taliban and Al Qaida forces were on the run in Afghanistan. It showed the world that the real epicenter of terrorism in the region continues to be in Pakistan and Pakistan controlled territories. The terrorist attacks have only strengthened India's resolve to completely defeat terrorism. For India and the world, the fight against terrorism has entered a decisive phase.

The President of Pakistan addressed the Pakistan nation on 12 January 2002. We have noted that he devoted a considerable part of his address to the urgent need for Pakistan to modernize itself, and rid itself of religious extremism that now permeates Pakistan's society and polity. India has welcomed the Pakistan President's newly declared commitment not to allow its territory to be used for any terrorist activity anywhere in the world, including in the Indian State of Jammu & Kashmir. This commitment must extend to the use of all territories under Pakistan's control today. However, mere rhetoric will not satisfy India or the international community. We will assess the effectiveness of Pakistan's declared commitment by the concrete action it takes on the ground. We expect Pakistan to cooperate with India in stopping all infiltration across the International Border and the Line of control, and in putting an end to the daily acts of terrorist violence being perpetrated by Pakistan-based groups in the Indian State of Jammu & Kashmir, as well as in other parts of India.

The ban Pakistan has imposed on the Lashkar-e-Tayyaba (LeT) and Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM), the two terrorist groups responsible for the attack against the Indian Parliament, must be effectively and fully implemented so that its members cannot continue their activities under other names. Similar action must be taken against other terrorist organizations, based in Pakistan and Pakistan controlled territories that have been targeting India. Action must also be taken against the parent organizations that have spawned these terrorist groups.

Over the last two decades, India has on several occasions provided Pakistan with detailed information on fugitives from law who have sought refuge, or have been provided safe haven in Pakistan and Pakistan occupied territories. For instance, following the Mumbai bomb blasts in 1993 detailed information on the perpetrators of this crime including passport details, photographs, flight manifests indicating the date of their arrival in Pakistan etc., were handed over to the Pakistan authorities. Demarches and additional information were also provided to Pakistan subsequently in 1994. During 2000 and 2001, India has been making demarches and providing information to Pakistan on those responsible for the hijacking of an Indian Airlines plane to Kandahar in December 1999. As recently as 31 December (2001), India has once again handed over another consolidated list of 20 fugitives from law wanted in connection with heinous crimes including the Mumbai bomb blasts and the hijacking of the Indian Airlines flight to Kandahar.

It is our expectation that the Government of Pakistan will act upon this information provided to them. The recent consolidated list of 20 fugitives from law handed over to Pakistan has 15 names against whom Interpol Red Corner notices already exist. This provides sufficient basis for Pakistan to take action. It is well known that according to Interpol norms, resolutions, decisions and procedures "red notices are documents intended for both the police and the judicial authorities and can be considered valid requests for provisional arrest, because they are only issued on the basis of valid national arrest warrants". Pakistan can also take action under a bilateral cooperative arrangement, which had been arrived at in 1989 by the Director-CBI (Central Bureau of Investigation) in India and Pakistan's Director General-FIA (Federal Investigation Agency). Under this arrangement FIA in Pakistan and CBI in India are to act as nodal agencies in their respective countries, to locate and trace out fugitives from law, and to arrange handing over of such wanted and absconding criminals to their respective counterpart without going through cumbersome and time-consuming procedures.

India remains committed to the path of peace and dialogue with Pakistan. As in the past, India's approach is in accordance with the Simla Agreement and the Lahore Declaration which are the cornerstones of our bilateral relations. Both these agreements commit both countries to settle all issues peacefully through bilateral approaches and to prevent the organization, assistance or encouragement of any act detrimental to the other's security. Should the Government of Pakistan operationalize its intention and move purposefully towards eradicating cross border terrorism, India will respond fully and would be prepared to resume the Composite Dialogue process. Issues between India and Pakistan can only be addressed bilaterally. There is no scope for any third party intervention.

In its quest to eradicate the scourge of terrorism from the world, the international community is looking towards Pakistan not for just empty words or rhetoric, but for concrete, sustained and irreversible action against terrorist groups and the organizations that have spawned them.

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